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Gold Knight
April 20, 2007, 06:34 PM
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Always knew Sasuke had something up his sleeves...!

Hey guys! Long time we've gone without a full GK review huh? Five weeks, yikes! I had planned to do one with Chapter 350 last week, but that one didn't quite meet my expectations of having much to talk about. This one did, so huzzah and here goes. Unfortunately I might have to return to shorter reviews again for a while after this, but we'll see how it goes. Hope ya guys enjoy in the meanwhile!

Thanks to Grrblt for the RAW, Hisshouburaiken for the cool translation, and Des for the scan that I'm using for this (unusually early) review. Be sure to remember to support your favorite translators and scanlators by thanking them. We seem to be getting some new ones lately, and you can keep 'em around that way. Okay, I'm sure you don't want too much of a prelude to this thing, so we'll get right with it.

Looking forward to reading your replies, but keep in mind I might not have the time to answer everything, but I'll try. You should still get your thoughts out there anyway, since there are thousands of us Naruto fans out there who I'm sure will also want to know what YOU think about the chapter! What can it hurt, it's the internet! So don't be shy ;)


* * * Gold Knight's Ten Comments on Naruto Chapter 351: A Man to Man Talk...! * * *

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You were staring at my butt, weren't you?

Cover Comments. Well, Karin's almost like a female bunshin of Sasuke here in the way she seemingly carries herself. Too bad her personality is pretty crummy so far... There have been plenty of comments about how she looks too much like Sasuke to be thought to be a suitable romantic interest for him. I actually don't have a problem with that. Although I do think the adage, "opposites attract" ring more true most of the time (and have seen it happen firsthand), it's true that people still fall in love with others who remind them of themselves. It's called narcissism. So I don't see it as a bad thing, but as I said, I'm not too fond of the character at all right now. But I'm not of Sasuke, either, so maybe it shouldn't come as any surprise...

She does still have some promise, though. At least from what Kishimoto wrote on the side - that because she was chosen by Sasuke, that she must have been one of the strongest kunoichi around. Note that it said "strongest," not most "useful." That seems to imply that she DOES have extensive combat experience, and she's not just some hollow "librarian fantasy" Kishimoto just conjured up right on the spot. Wonder if we'll see her in action any time soon, though...

Anyway, not a particularly great cover of Karin, bland composition and an uninspiring pose. I do expect better things of Kishimoto. He must have been feeling lazy, or maybe he doesn't like the character all that much himself - and he only created her because he felt that she was a necessary ingredient to Sasuke's story...?


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Yeah, what's a little more blood on my sword...?

1. No Mercy For You, Fool! So Suigetsu obviously isn't a boy scout like Sasuke (never thought I'd say that) in killing an injured, helpless prisoner just because he annoyed him. If he's from the Mist like most of us readers think, this shouldn't really come as any surprise, though.

I mean, if you think about it, eyebrow-less wonder Momochi Zabuza, also of the Mist, was pretty much the same way as a result of his bloody childhood... killing all the graduate Academy students in his class must have been pretty intense, right? So he went on to become a professional assassin.

Granted, that little horrifying local custom was put out of practice later on, but they probably only stopped it because they were losing too many shinobi and the whole idea became rather counterproductive for them (duh, no wonder they weren't the strongest of the Five Lands, they obviously weren't very bright, huh?)

But, anyway, since these islanders even approved of such a gruesome ritual before, the Mist probably don't have any qualms about killing. So far, out of all the Mist we've met, only Haku wasn't that fond of murder, but he was probably the exception to the rule. Suigetsu looks to be much the same as Kisame and Zabuza at this point. In fact, he's pretty damn similar to Kisame, except he's more of a pretty boy.

What interests me is that Suigetsu here is obviously not afraid to defy Sasuke, and this may end up making Sasuke regret taking him along later on. Could make for some interesting drama, to say the least.

I mean, personality conflicts? Dissension within the ranks? Fun, fun.... especially to see how Sasuke manages to keep them all together. I mean, it's not as though Suigetsu HAS to be with Sasuke particularly to accomplish his objectives, right?

Given what we just saw here, he might bail out on Team Sasuke sooner or later if he doesn't feel like working with them will help him meet his goals. In fact, he might be the trickiest one for Sasuke to handle compared to the other two - Karin obviously doesn't need much manipulation to do whatever he tells him to do, and Juugo looks to be likely hanging all his hopes for a cure to his problem on the dark-haired avenger.

So does Suigetsu have such a tough opponent that he can't hope to beat him without anybody else? Hmm.. maybe only if he's seeking to attempt a coup and assassinate the Mizukage, to do the exact same thing Zabuza once tried... now there's a thought to chew on, huhn...? Okay, moving on, now.


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Neat! He can do self massages!

2. Lethal Body Parts!? Interesting paradox we've got here with Juugo - he's emotionally out of control right now, and yet he seems to have complete control over his physical body at the same time. We see here that in his "cursed" condition he obviously possesses the ability to shift and alter his body parts into weapons.

Kinda reminiscent of Kimimaro in a way, except he was only able to change his bone structure (though he was able to "bring out" his bones through his flesh).

With Juugo, though, he seems to be more of an all-around metamorph... he must be a real monster when fully activated. Makes you wanna see what he looks like in his CS2 stage, doesn't it! I get the feeling Kishimoto probably has something very cool in mind for his design.

A lot cooler than these rejects we saw Sasuke and Suigetsu mop up the floor with last chapter, anyway. ;)


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Now I know what a TV dinner feels like.

3. Fighting Fire with Fire...! Y'know, I think I got my wish, although not in the way I expected.

Last week I said that I hoped that Juugo would put a scare in Sasuke. Now, I don't think Sasuke would do partial CS2 on just anybody - he certainly didn't seem like he needed to against any of the CS2 rejects we saw last chapter - so I think he WAS a little bit caught off guard here.

I hope that was the case anyway. I don't want to see Sasuke rely on his CS2 every time he's in a fight with a tough opponent. In a way, that would be just like how Naruto used to ask the Kyuubi for help every time he was in trouble. Actually, that would be an interesting juxtaposition, though, if it was the case. After all, Naruto's obviously trying to cope without his inner demon these days. Would be ironic if Sasuke was beginning to embrace his own.


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Well, the Uchihas ARE known for being copycats..

4. Oh No! Oh Yes! I think Juugo here was disgusted at first at the prospect of facing another "copy" of his cursed self, but then he immediately lit up after he realized Sasuke was tougher than most.

I guess even though he wants to kill somebody in his cursed condition, he's just as eager to be in a battle that promised to be fun. I think most likely he didn't consider many "copies" of himself to be actually strong at all - or maybe he took pity on them for not having as much control over their seals. Goes a long way in saying how powerful he must be, huh?

I actually wouldn't have even considered partial transformation to imply better control over the cursed seal if Juugo hadn't brought it up here. He obviously knows more about the "curse" than anybody else does, though, having been the apparent "father" of the condition.

Another thing that interested me here was also that Juugo had a previous experience, likely a fight, with Kimimaro. Maybe Orochimaru tested his Sound Five by pitting them all against Juugo.

In any case, Juugo didn't seem too displeased at thinking about a previous opponent, so that must mean that either that battle ended in a tie, or he was actually the victor. Or maybe neither, considering his true intentions. Hmm.


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Dermatologists would love these guys...!

5. Lookin' Sexy...! Just a quick comment here on Juugo's look, now that we've finally got a clear look at him. I like that he's not such a pretty boy as he first appeared to be in the shadows - we already have enough pretty boys in Sasuke (and Suigetsu to a lesser extent). We need more variety, after all. His hair definitely looks fun to draw. I guess we won't know the fullness of his design until he puts on some clothes that doesn't make him look like a denizen of Alcatraz, though, but I like him so far. I like them all so far in terms of design, actually.

And it was cool as heck, I might add, to see Sasuke and Juugo staring at each other with their faces half-covered with their curse marks, too. Even though Sasuke was trying to be a peacemaker here, you could somewhat tell that he's trying to hold down his own burning desire to rip out Juugo's intensines. At least, that was how I imagined it, anyway.

Geez, that cursed seal might be even more trouble than the Kyuubi! Oh, another thing that popped to mind was what Kabuto said while observing Naruto's battle with his master - that it was more of a battle of monsters than ninja. Same thing here. Is this REALLY a manga about ninjas...? Not that I'm complaining, mind you. I think I prefer it this way, anyway, as I like monsters better in the first place, heh.


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Look who decided to be a party pooper.

6. Sudden Interference...! Okay, I suppose it was too good to be true at this stage of the story. I can deal with the fact we didn't get to see an extended Sasuke-Juugo battle after all. At least we did get some sword-on-sword action this week, I suppose, so I won't complain. Looks like Kishimoto DID have a good reason to save that stuff after all. And now we know why Suigetsu felt like Zabuza's sword would come in handy against Juugo.

Although Suigetsu, when he fought Juugo before, apparently hadn't encountered him in that cursed state. (So how did he even know? Umm.) Also, I wonder how long back they fought - they both seem so young! Saifi brought up a good point last week; how come Juugo IS so young? I mean, Orochimaru had placed the cursed seal on Anko before he left Konohagakure - and that was quite a while ago. I wouldn't have thought Juugo would even have been born.

I hope that wasn't a continuity blooper by Kishimoto. I'd like to believe that the curse did keep his body young. So maybe he's much older than he looks, like Kakuzu. Anyway, I hope we're due for some flashbacks soon. Hope you don't think it too strange for me to say that, but I want to learn more about these guys' history with each other, that's for sure.


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What a lout! Doesn't he know ladies come first?

7. Why Can't We all Just Be Friends...! Wow, just as 'Team Sasuke' is on the verge of becoming a four-man cell, we're already seeing them at each other's throats. Well, no wonder Suigetsu was so loath to be with these two in the first place.

I do like that Kishimoto didn't forget to have Suigetsu say a little something to Karin about the way she tricked him, though. And also, "words don't register with Juugo, you have to use force..." A pretty good way to explain why Juugo didn't even seem to hear what Sasuke was saying and was just lunging at him every second!

Pretty funny in a way to see Sasuke trying to be a "babysitter" of sorts. Well, peacemaker anyway. Unusual situation for him. I'm sure he didn't relish the idea of being with these three if that was the case, so he MUST have supreme confidence in all their abilities to put up with it.


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Hilarious, aren't they?

8. Battle Crazed...! Wow, I can't help but think of Kenpachi and Ikkaku from Bleach when I see these guys delightedly laughing as they try to kill each other. If you don't read Bleach, let's just say these guys are enthusiasts when it comes to a little blood-splattering.

I also took some humor out of Sasuke and Karin's different reactions. Sasuke almost seemed distraught while Karin was cheering them on to kill each other.


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Guess he didn't find them funny.

9. A Different Approach...! And now we come to the "big scene" of the chapter, Sasuke turning deadly serious and deciding, "well, if asking nicely won't work, I'll just have to scare the crap out of 'em instead." Quite a startling change of tone here, huh? This is where I think Sasuke might be a little messed up - he might want to avoid killing as many people as he likes, but he won't hesitate to outright murder his own comrades. (Maybe that's why he didn't mind working with these guys - he probably already thought that they were all deserving to die in the first place, for past crimes and so on.)

Not saying I didn't like this scene. It was bad-ass - and Sasuke's sudden threat definitely had it desired dramatic effect, not just on Suigetsu and Juugo here - which was believable - but also on the readers, too. I literally felt chilled when I read these words. Since I thought that Kishimoto was trying to completely redeem Sasuke so that we would think that he's completely on the side of good again, this was especially unexpected to see. Very nicely done, even if it was just a bluff.

For the first time in the series, also, we see Sasuke finally do one of Orochimaru's snake no jutsus (whatever you want to call them). Will we be soon seeing Sasuke summon Manda and standing atop his head, now? Also, I guess I stand corrected - I suppose it wasn't Orochimaru's serpentine body after all that allowed him be able to sprout these snakes at will. 'Cause, boy, these snakes here were HUGE. What kind of freaky jutsu is this though, anyway, to be able to conjure snakes out of, I guess, chakra? Weird, in a way. You'd think they'd need rods or staffs, like the "magicians" of ancient Egypt used. I sure hope these snakes aren't coming out of his armpits, 'cause man...

Some people are also comparing Sasuke's face here to Orochimaru's here. Well, initially when I saw the spoiler pics, I have to admit that I thought that it might have been a bit of an overreaction. But now after seeing the double-spread - especially with Sasuke and the snakes, and Suigetsu commenting on his "monstrous killing intent" - I can't help but feel like Kishimoto definitely meant for Sasuke to resemble Orochimaru here... at least a little. (See for yourself. (http://img463.imageshack.us/img463/6176/orozo0.png))

Well, having Orochimaru apparently trapped in his soul coupled with the cursed seal might be having an influence on him, after all. Hmm. We'll have to see where this leads to.

P.S. Karin's reaction made me sick, on the other hand. Bleh, enough is enough when it comes to fangirlism. It's pretty obvious now that she IS plumb crazy about Sasuke, which in my opinion just makes her seem less interesting.

Sorry if I sound harsh, but I was probably expecting too much there - if there's one serious weakness Kishimoto has in writing at times, it's young female characters. He seems to be better at writing older women (Tsunade and Chiyo-baasma) though, for some reason. He's getting better with Sakura, but he doesn't really do much with Ino, Ten-Ten, Hinata, Temari and the rest anymore. Already he's made Suigetsu and Juugo much more interesting than Karin. That's a shame.


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Lock me up and throw away the key!

10. Unwilling Aggressor..!! Found it kinda funny at first that Sasuke and Suigetsu thought at first that the reason Juugo fled was largely due to Sasuke's "killing intent."

Anyway, I was right in guessing Juugo'd be pretty gentle when his mind's back to normal. Cool to be right every now and then, heh. Although we already had hints of that when Karin explained his situation to Suigetsu in a recent chapter, so it really wasn't that hard to figure out, I suppose...

In a way, Juugo's not that far removed from, you know, a werewolf - guy might be a saint and all during the day, but at night, he turns into a foaming killer! Though I guess in this case, the moon won't cause the transformation, so there's the added danger of not knowing when he'll suddenly crack. That's going to be pretty interesting, and force Sasuke, Karin, and Suigetsu to all watch their backs, if they take him along with them. I also wonder if Sasuke will actually end up liking Juugo too, because he wasn't as much of a psycho as his reputation made him out to be. When he's not under the influence of the curse, anyway...

On the other hand, might be Suigetsu instead trying to convince Juugo to enjoy the killing... since he obviously doesn't seem to have a conscience himself.

I suppose I can understand why he came to Orochimaru for a cure, since as one of the three Sennin, he was obviously able to keep him under control and keep him from killing anybody. Even if Orochimaru mistreated him or experimented on him, at least he wouldn't be slaughtering somebody. I'm sort of surprised a kid in his situation didn't just commit suicide though (or maybe he couldn't.)

I bet he had some horrible experiences - probably killed his family, a best friend, a girlfriend or something...? What do you think?

RATING: 5 of 5 - I did enjoy this chapter very much. Had a very good dramatic moment that pretty much made the entire chapter work. I liked the idea of Juugo having a split personality, as well. A few more insights into Suigetsu's persona as well. We were already given hints that this team would have some rocky times, but to see it right off the bat just made reading about them more interesting. How will they actually work with each other, after all? Sasuke's got quite a challenge ahead of him - this is one situation he can't resolve with just his strength.

PREDICTIONS: Probably just Sasuke convincing Juugo that he'd help him find a cure as a trade for his assistance next chapter. The sneak preview of this chapter: "Itachi's Whereabouts" makes me think we could see the Akatsuki as well.

Let's hope so, I want to find out what they thought about losing Hidan and Kakuzu, especially. But we might just be getting Jiraiya's scouting reports on their activity, instead.

Hope next week will be fun again ;)


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To sum it up - Sasuke is a scary mofo, huh?
Got any comments of your own to add? Go ahead! ;)

lordHokage
April 20, 2007, 08:05 PM
GK, It so good to have all of you back in action. I'm too lazy to review your excellent comments at this moment, but hopefully very soon :eyeroll.

conan
April 20, 2007, 08:50 PM
good to have the old ten comments style back, the details were really good, you described sasuke and his team as well, just one comment about juugo's condition, he seems to me more and more like a jinchuriki every time we see him, I mean you mentioned the werewolf thing, but why not compare him to good old kazekage sama, yup, dont you remember gara's transformations at every full moon, I don't know but there is too much resemblance between juugo and other jinchuriki we've seen, compare his cursed seal state with naruto's four tail experience and gara's full moon experience and he's just the same, thats I am thinking there is potential for a friendship here between naruto and juugo, just like there was between naruto and garaa, hope that made sence

bax
April 20, 2007, 09:36 PM
It's been a while since I commented anything in your review. Real life and other stuffs here are taking they're toll on me. But never the less, I'm glad the RAW day is practically over and I have some time to spare :amuse

Ooohh How I miss commenting on reviews :wtf



She does still have some promise, though. At least from what Kishimoto wrote on the side - that because she was chosen by Sasuke, that she must have been one of the strongest kunoichi around. Note that it said "strongest," not most "useful." That seems to imply that she DOES have extensive combat experience, and she's not just some hollow "librarian fantasy" Kishimoto just conjured up right on the spot. Wonder if we'll see her in action any time soon, though...

To be honest, my passion for Karin died a bit i nthis chapter. Last chapter it was promising. She seems to have shown us a bit of insight of her powers by easily detecting Juugo was not in the massive group of CS users. But in this chapter, somehow she shown herself nothing more than just a cheerleader for Sasuke. Honestly, that what I thought when I was reading this chapter.

There might be a lot of Karin fans out there, I'm sorry. This is just a personal opinion. Despite all that, I still have high hopes for her though. Well, I can see Sakura pitting against her one day. Hopefully that will become the grand kunoichi battle :)




But, anyway, since these islanders even approved of such a gruesome ritual before, the Mist probably don't have any qualms about killing. So far, out of all the Mist we've met, only Haku wasn't that fond of murder, but he was probably the exception to the rule. Suigetsu looks to be much the same as Kisame and Zabuza at this point. In fact, he's pretty damn similar to Kisame, except he's more of a pretty boy.

I guess the original teachings of the swordsmen still run wild inside him I guess. I mean, as far as age goes, I bet he was as old as Haku when he knows Zabuza (remember Kimimaro's encounter with Zabuza in the anime?). And since he looks up to be his idol, I believe he inherited the attitude Zabuza had.



2. Lethal Body Parts!? Interesting paradox we've got here with Juugo - he's emotionally out of control right now, and yet he seems to have complete control over his physical body at the same time. We see here that in his "cursed" condition he obviously possesses the ability to shift and alter his body parts into weapons.

Juugo definitely the core of CS thingies. What I'm curious about, how long did Oro kept him? I mean, if Kimimaro been with Oro since a little boy, and has became a full grown man during Part 1, then how old is Juugo? :blink Although, he seems to be a bit older than Sasuke, but not that much.



I hope that was the case anyway. I don't want to see Sasuke rely on his CS2 every time he's in a fight with a tough opponent. In a way, that would be just like how Naruto used to ask the Kyuubi for help every time he was in trouble. Actually, that would be an interesting juxtaposition, though, if it was the case. After all, Naruto's obviously trying to cope without his inner demon these days. Would be ironic if Sasuke was beginning to embrace his own.

Sadly enough GK, I don't think that will happen. Well, as opposed to Naruto who tries to surpress the Kyuubi, Sasuke is shown to use his CS freely without "remorse". Although I admit, that time, he may have to use it because Juugo suddenly lose a screw and go madly charging towards him.



Geez, that cursed seal might be even more trouble than the Kyuubi! Oh, another thing that popped to mind was what Kabuto said while observing Naruto's battle with his master - that it was more of a battle of monsters than ninja. Same thing here. Is this REALLY a manga about ninjas...? Not that I'm complaining, mind you. I think I prefer it this way, anyway, as I like monsters better in the first place, heh.

But we know that CS has its downfall too. Although not shown yet, and we only know the effect of not perfected seal will results in death (as explained by the Sound Four when they went to Knoha to retrieve him), but we still are clueless about the negative effect of the perfected seal.

Well, chakra consuming is not a problem, judging for how long Sasuke was fighting Naruto long ago (he even just got that seal that time :o) There must be a downfall of the CS, if not, Oro might wanna use it for himself!



7. Why Can't We all Just Be Friends...! Wow, just as 'Team Sasuke' is on the verge of becoming a four-man cell, we're already seeing them at each other's throats. Well, no wonder Suigetsu was so loath to be with these two in the first place.

I expected this from the start. This is a group consisting of nuts :notrust An avenger, a naked man in a tank, an obsessed girl and then come the dual personality guy >.> For me what kept this team together is either fear/love towards Sasuke or using each other to complete own's goals. I bet on the latter.



P.S. Karin's reaction made me sick, on the other hand. Bleh, enough is enough when it comes to fangirlism. It's pretty obvious now that she IS plumb crazy about Sasuke, which in my opinion just makes her seem less interesting.

No more to say here ^^



PREDICTIONS: Probably just Sasuke convincing Juugo that he'd help him find a cure as a trade for his assistance next chapter. The sneak preview of this chapter: "Itachi's Whereabouts" makes me think we could see the Akatsuki as well.

Yeah, I am expecting a few pages of Akatsuki as well. Well, the big topic would be the loss of Hidan/Kakuzu and also Oro.

Somehow, Akatsuki is now living up to it's name :s I mean S-Rank nins, they are down 4 now (Oro defection aand death of Sasori/Hidan/Kakuzu). Ok, Kakuzu's death might be "noble" because he was up against perhaps the greatest jutsu ever created.

DarkManSharingan32
April 20, 2007, 09:45 PM
Another great batch of comments here... as I've come to expect. But I'll just make a few comments of my own upon numbers 6 and 7.

Comment 6:

I wrote up a pretty decent explanation of the ages/timeline in which Juugo could have approached Orochimaru (i'll re-post it here too. lol). But I believe Juugo to be slightly older than Anko, which would put him in his mid-twenties.

His stature is alot bigger when you compare them to both Sasuke and Suigetsu... so that aspect follows my theory, and another clue from this chapter is the way Juugo talks. While in his CS mode he really seemed to be talking down to them, from the point of a superior or older individual... (which is in stark contrast to the almost childish persona he has when his killing intent isn't raging out of control). Anyways, heres the explanation:


You guys have to remember a few important things...
Anko is only about three years younger than Kakashi... (she is about 23) and ... she graduated academy at the age of 10 (which means she was placed under Orochimaru at this time). She passed her Chuunin exams at the age of 12... which tells me that she was at least given the cursed seal at about this time.

Since there is no record of anyone older than Anko having the Cursed seal... it is entirely possible that Orochimaru happened to find Juugo when his age was around that of Anko's... (maybe even younger).

At the end of it all... that would make Juugo anywhere from 19-22 years old... and from there his appearance can be tweaked to fit the age... so thats nothing to worry about.

This all goes to say that Kishi has not created a plot hole... at least not an unsolvable one anyways. It all starts with Anko being the one of the first people given the CS though. (Maybe the first to survive it's mini-trial).

I found out that the databooks don't include the timeskip... so you can place his age from 25-30 years old with this mindset. And with the way Juugo is looking to me... it all still fits.
---

As for Comment 7:
I think Sasuke has gone out of his way to find teammates with characteristics that are almost identical to Team 7. Juugo replaces Kakashi, Suigetsu replaces Naruto, and Karin for Sakura. It's almost comical that Sasuke has painted himself into a grown-up replica of the life he would have back in Konoha... minus all the new cool abilities.

Sasuke has always been babysitting Naruto and Sakura... always been getting them out of tough situations, and the same is true for his rag-tag band of mini-misfits now. lol

Suigetsu holds the team back, physically... which is something Naruto used to be a master at when Team 7 was just getting started.

Karin replaces Sakura for obvious reasons... her smarts and infatuation. It's comical really... Sasuke must really miss that little pink-haired fireball.

And Juugo.. I really think this is going to end up being an influencing force on sasuke later on in the manga. maybe Juugo will get through... where Kakashi couldn't.
---

Anyways, great comments man... I just HAD to say something now that they're back in full force. lol

arslan
April 20, 2007, 10:24 PM
nice review GK. about sasuke helping Juugo, could it be that sasuke uses evil sealing method on Juugo just like Kakashi used it on him or something. what does everyone think?

kiddo7
April 20, 2007, 10:35 PM
Ok Ok Ok,
I will admit it, openly and before everyone present:

I WAS WRONG!
It seems Karin truly is "interested" in Sasuke, no tricks and no hidden intentions, what a bummer.


Anyway, what in impressive chapter, I am beginning to actually like Suigetsu more and more Something about him is just done right. Karin on the other hand...
Juugo, Juugo is really an interesting character like many have said before me I believe he will become a favorite. only question is; will he die a tragic death like Hakku or will he become a friend like Gaara.


Now about Sasuke's Great moment in this chapter. I think it actually Sorta confirms his previous statements and actions. Here are some that i am referring to:

At the valley of the end, he made a decision to not become like his brother. I guess for him this meant that he would not become a known for killing great amounts of people and he would kill Itachi without fulfilling whatever purpose his bro had for him.

He told Naruto, that he left him alive on a whim and that in the same way, he could kill him now on a whim. I do not think this was necessarily a bluff to throw of old snake eyes. After reading today's chapter I feel more like Sasuke reached a point in his development where he is confident enough of his power so that he does not need to kill to reaffirm himself. Even to the point where any unnecessary kill is beneath him. during that confrontation he would have killed Naruto because it was not out of a need to gain power but rather he knew Naruto well enough that he understood as long as either of them are alive, naruto would keep coming after him. Either that or it would have been a way to send a message to naruto that he could understand: He is wasting Sasuke's time and he should rather work on accomplishing his own goals.

Finally, like he told Oro himself, and i actually covered part of this in my last point, These where not people he wants to kill. In other words they do not merit enough attention from him for him to actually "do them the honor" of ending their lives. But just like he killed Orochimaru and how he is planing to kill Itachi, if you directly stand in his way or knowingly hamper his progress he will not show you any mercy.


One way or another he will have the time of his life just trying to keep his new team from tarnishing this reputation he is trying to build for himself. It seems obvious to me that the driving motivation behind Sasuke is his pride. Think of him like you would of Ulquiorra, if you will, ( since we are already comparing characters from that manga) Every time he fights ichigo he leaves him alive because he is "Just thrash" and "not worth killing". Also if Sasuke kills a bunch of people working his way up to Sasuke that might divert to much attention from him main kill. No doubt he wants to go down in history as the one who killed Itachi, in doing so, avenging his clan. He can't let his followers take that reward from him by senselessly slaughtering everyone they encounter.


I realize that this post did not actually have very much to do with the many topics you covered in your review, but... Actually I cannot think of a good excuse so I hope you do not mind too much. I did very much enjoy reading your comments And I hope you can find some enjoyment from reading my thoughts. Well this is my crazy theory for this week but who knows i might just come up with some more as i read the responses.

MadDog
April 21, 2007, 12:05 AM
Nice review GK.

It seems like Suigetsu has no problems defying Sasuke...as long as he's not around to see him do it. The combination of his resentment (of being Sasuke's subordinate) and mischief will definetly have some consequences.

As for the "tough opponent" Suigetsu can't beat without the help of someone else, maybe he's looking to avenge Zabuza by killing the shinobi most responsible for taking him down: Kakashi. This would be a resonable explanation for why he's sticking with Sasuke (as it is inevitable that they would encounter one another) and would make for an interesting plot twist. (I doubt this is likely, however)

In my opinion, Juugo looks like a full grown adult, but with a younger looking face. DarkManSharingan32's estimate of his being 25-30 years old seems about right to me (and would work with the continuity of the storyline).

Besides the snake up the sleeve trick, I definetly agree with you that Sasuke's "peacekeeper" moment had a serious Orochimaru-style vibe to it. The mention of the "unbeleivable murderous intent" reminded me of when we first met Orochimaru in the forest of death and Sasuke's threat harked back to the Sandaime flashback scene (ch. 121) where Orochimaru drops a similar threat to the ANBU who helped uncover his hidden lab. Who knows? It just seemed like he chaneled him there for a second, but in an understated Sasuke sort of a way.

We'll see if Sasuke has much use for the "soft" Juugo. I can definetly see Suigetsu having fun by trying to bring out the other side of Juugo's personality.

As for next week's chapter, I wouldn't mind seeing at least a few pages of Akatsuki mixed in there.

eni
April 21, 2007, 03:43 AM
Great review, a nice read again, Phil :hug
But sorry, just a very very short comment from me:


Just a quick comment here on Juugo's look, now that we've finally got a clear look at him. I like that he's not such a pretty boy as he first appeared to be in the shadows - we already have enough pretty boys in Sasuke (and Suigetsu to a lesser extent).
Thankfully, tastes are different :smile-big
I don't feel that Suigetsu looks pretty at all. But Juugo is a sympathic cutie. Funny hair and sweet eyes and a smexy berserker-like personality <333

:XD

Gold Knight
April 21, 2007, 05:36 AM
Great review, a nice read again, Phil :hug
But sorry, just a very very short comment from me:


Thankfully, tastes are different :smile-big
I don't feel that Suigetsu looks pretty at all. But Juugo is a sympathic cutie. Funny hair and sweet eyes and a smexy berserker-like personality <333

:XD

You're in luck then, eni - I've decided on Juugo as being my next drawing piece :D And I think Kishimoto did intend to draw Suigetsu as a pretty boy - he's thin, has long hair and a fair face after all. Juugo seems to me more ordinary in his facial structure but that doesn't mean I like him any less.

I'm gonna try to reply to everybody now while waiting for my Shippuden 08-09 to finish downloading, lol.

@ Lord Hokage - thanks, awaiting your thoughts ;)

@ conan - yes, I also thought that Juugo might be a potential convert to the Church of Naruto, as well. He does have many resemblances to Gaara. Nobody please kill me for saying this, though, but I'd like a twist, though, in that his story turns out to be a bit more tragic in its ending than Gaara's - but that probably won't be the case.

@ bax - hey dude - glad to see you still being able to discuss Naruto here at least despite your busy schedule, both IRL and as a mod ;) Yeah, looks like we share the same disappointments about Karin... Good thought on Suigetsu being as old as Haku when he first met Zabuza. Hmm. Maybe Zabuza passed over Suigetsu on the same street he was crossing and chose Haku instead, heh...

Hmm, I don't think Juugo will experience any kind of negative effects from CS2 besides losing his normal state of mind. Orochimaru might simply not have wanted to take the risk of using the seal on himself after seeing its effects on others, he might have still considered it an experiment in progress, hence why he was using it on so many people. It's evident that he WAS greatly interested in it, though, so that can only mean he was trying to figure out if it became "safe" to inflict it on himself...

"The greatest jutsu ever created?" Nah, I think ol' Yondy still had a cooler jutsu... ;)

But I think all three Akatsuki went down fighting very hard (not to mention Kakuzu and Hidan actually killed Asuma and probably would have killed the others the first time around if not for Aoba and Raidou's interference, Deidara DID have a large hand in killing Gaara, and Sasori killed Chiyo - she was poisoned and losing her life force even before she resurrected Gaara with the help of Naruto - and nearly killed both Sakura and Kankurou).

Let's not forget, too, they still have Kisame, who did pretty well against Team Gai with only a third of his chakra, and Itachi, who did severely beat Kakashi and Sasuke once before.

So.. with all that, I wouldn't say that they're losing their rep as very tough customers.

@ DMS32 - Hey there =)

The problem with that timeline is that Juugo still wouldn't have been old enough to realize that he needed help and Orochimaru couldn't have known about his condition THAT early, could he?

Way I see it, it would be more feasible if Juugo was in his mid-thirties. It may be that his "condition" preserves his youth all the same, though...


Interesting thoughts on Sasuke picking people that seemed to resemble his old team - I'm not sure that he actually had a full idea of what all their personalities were like before he selected them, though - especially since he had never apparently met Juugo before. He also seemed to be very taken aback by Karin's attention, and I don't think he expected Suigetsu to be so belligerent. In any case, I'd say it's one of life's ironies, not Sasuke's own subconscious, that put him into this type of situation again. xD

@ arslan_tariqch - that would be interesting but the problem with that is I think Sasuke needs Juugo to be in touch with his "psycho side" in order to help him. But maybe he can do a sort of sealing method that he can release at will...

@ kiddo7 - Great thoughts on Sasuke though and I'm beginning to agree with you now after reading this chapter. He might be a boy scout when it comes to fighting these weaker than him, but as far as fighting people who he considers to be strong or on an equal level, they'd better all say their prayers, I guess! Sasuke certainly acted as though Suigetsu and Juugo were powerless against him in that double spread though...

@ MadDog - I like your theory of Suigetsu seeking out Zabuza's killer. That may very well be the case. Well, I hope it is, truthfully - since it means more Kakashi action, heh.

Good way of putting it that Sasuke was "channelling" Orochimaru a bit there. Who knows, that might happen more and more from here on. Well, we all kinda expected him to turn into the next ol' Snake Sennin, anyways.

Thanks all for the comments! Now I'm off to watch Shippuden, then draw Juugo.. lol.

ibra87
April 21, 2007, 06:32 AM
Nice to see your reviews again. I won't bother you with long comments, so here we go:

Even though Suigestsu killed that person and disobeyed Sasuke I still think he's more trustworthy than Karin. At least he admits that he isn't Sasuke follower and just using him for his own ambitions (killing the Mizukage wouldn't be bad possibility). I wonder what Sasuke would do when he notices the dead prisoner? I'm sure he will because Kishi loves to make him the best...

Sasuke was pretty strong here, ne? I don't think he actually summoned snakes, it's much more like Orochimaru - his death intent is so strong it feels like a snake is going to bite you anytime. I very much doubt that he would actually summon snakes to kill them. After all, he did have the Sharingan so it could pretty much be a genjutsu. And I was pretty dissapointed in Sugietsus' and Juugo's weakness too :S Let's at least hope CS2 Juugo can give Sasuke a challenge.
I like your idea about Sasuke choosing his team mates because he thinks they deserve to die. He will probably trash them after killing Itachi, so I'm sure it was just a bluff.

Good point about Juugo probably killing his family as a young boy. Could be pretty much the reason for him to be so scared - much like how Haku started hating himself after he killed the people he loved.

Also, I think Kishimoto is just trying to trick us all by saying that Karin is just another one of those female ninja who are Sasuke Fangirls. I think (or hope) that she got somethign up her sleeves and that she is using them for a reason.

Just for your information GK, Kishi loves ot trick us with his "NEXT: something something". The Itachi's whereabouts are probably after 5 chapters or so, but I do hope as hell we do see Itachi. Would love to se his reaction after knowing Oro got killed by Sasuke. He might want to at last challenge him or maybe he would just give a "..."

Also, youve forgotten a picture in your comments, the one one "self massages" :p

fatboy812000
April 21, 2007, 11:51 AM
nice reviews as usual, theres not much to say so here goes.

we were wondering how sasuke would keep three pple who dont like each other at all together well wrapping them up in snakes seems to work fine ,he really has his work cut out if he has to keep suigetsu and karin from killing each other and juugo well, from killing everybody but hes showing hes stronger than them all so lets see how that pans out,im a pessimist so i never expected sasuke to reform, after gutting itachi maybe but now no chance and as for suigetsu i automatically assumed he was mist since he once called zabuza "sempai"and i thought zabuza killed the students in the year above him anyway it seems that all of team sasuke apart from maybe juugo have alterior motives for joining sasuke and however you look at it u know this cant end well ,i think ur right about the promise for a cure so juugo joins but bear in mind that there are 2 sides to juugo he could likewise promise the psycho personality an "all u can kill buffet" and probably get the same result but thats just me thinking .cant wait to see akatsuki and i totally agree with bax when he said for s-rank nins theyve been getting their asses kicked abit too often though ive enjoyed watching i well thought they would be harder to kill.
Anyway i cant wait for next week too and keep up the reviews ,l8r.

ANBU4U
April 21, 2007, 01:27 PM
Sauskes Image in comparison to Oro's seemed alot more regretfull to me. Almost reluctant.

Oro looked like he was furious ready to strike. While Sauske looked annoyed and prepared to strike....despite his words you didnt sense any imminant attack....

Like the difference between a guy claiming he's gonna kick ur ass while walking out of a bar and a guy yelling it in your face with his fist balled.

Which is all the more confusing/impressive seeing as how Sauske was indeed halfway through an attack at the time.

lordHokage
April 21, 2007, 01:57 PM
Now that CS2 flashy boy aka Sasuke is an unofficial jinchuuriki, what are his side effects and how would it influence his personality also I think in time Sasuke would be a lot more sympathetic to Naruto :comfort

It wouldn’t surprise be if Juugo background were similar to Naruto and Gaara :amuse

As for Suigetsu, Karin and Juugo it remains to be seen just how far they are willing to help Sasuke before war breaks out within the group :pwned

Next chapter should be interesting. I enjoy your comments, it was very entertaining, and you did really well :thumbs

Gold Knight
April 21, 2007, 01:57 PM
Just for your information GK, Kishi loves ot trick us with his "NEXT: something something". The Itachi's whereabouts are probably after 5 chapters or so, but I do hope as hell we do see Itachi. Would love to se his reaction after knowing Oro got killed by Sasuke. He might want to at last challenge him or maybe he would just give a "..."

I know all too well about that, but lately he's been kind of better on that.



Also, youve forgotten a picture in your comments, the one one "self massages" :p

I didn't forget, it was just Imageshack screwing around with me again. Added, though.

I'll come back and reply more, was just stopping by here for a moment to fix the pic.

juUnior
April 21, 2007, 03:43 PM
Yeah GK, finally you did normal your way comments :D If I knew for sure that you will do, I wouldn even consider posting my stuff ;p

I defiently agree with everything, except the cover ;p Overall I like it. And yes, we defiently want to know more about Juugo. Actually i wonder, if that interest comes from that he is CS source user, and that keeps him intresting, or just his plit personality.. with Gaara's thing, it was first strengh (forest of death), next reavling that he also, like Naruto, has "monster" inside him (hospital thing) and later on reavling all about shukaku stuff. That's why I think that we will wait for reavling more about Juugo. But I would like to be wrong thehehe xDxD

kadoman
April 21, 2007, 05:46 PM
Great review GK. Even though your shorter reviews are a pleasure to read, it has to be said that I prefer you in this mode! Don’t worry, I fully understand that lengthy reviews can’t be done each week. I’m grateful to get the special occasion ones! :amuse

I’ve already ranted and raved about how disappointed I am in Karin’s character in the Discussion threads. I just think that Kishi had an opportunity to show us a female ninja who is every bit as worthy - intellectually and physically (in terms of skills) as the boys - and he blew it. I wouldn’t be so pissed off if as many boys melted into puddles of drool over the girls, but they don’t. OK, so we had Rock Lee going ga-ga over Sakura, but at least he proved his worth in the area of ninjutsu. Sakura had to wait a couple of hundred chapters before she could prove her worth in that area (against Sasori and even then, it was unconvincing [I never believed the likes of her could beat the likes of Sasori, with or without Chio’s help). And we’ve had Naruto going ga-ga over Sakura, but for crying out loud, not in the middle of battle! I was just hoping that Karin would be a tough girl who’d keep Sasuke in check, you know, keep him on his toes, not be his squealing little fangirl.

About Suigetsu, I’ve decided I like him now. It took a while for him to grow on me and I think that’s because he is so much like Kisame (who I don’t particularly like) so thanks for pointing out their resemblance. The difference between Suigetsu and Kisame is that Suigetsu has a sense of humour and doesn’t take Sasuke too seriously (except when Sasuke’s about to murder him of course). He is actually taking on the role that I’d hoped Karin would. Another yaoi opportunity for me then? :amuse But can you blame me when Kishi makes it so? All the appropriate romantic interests for boys in this manga are...other boys!

As for Juugo, I hope he refuses Sasuke’s offer to join them. I don’t want everything to come so easily to Sasuke. I want to see how Sasuke manages to persuade a reluctant Juugo to join them; would he use force? How would he deal with someone not bowing down to his every whim, but outright refusing to cooperate?

Somebody brought this up in the discussion thread, but I also want to know how Sasuke thinks he is going to control Juugo and his killing urge if he does end up joining them. That will certainly be interesting.

Great review GK! It was a pleasure to read! :hug

conan
April 21, 2007, 09:50 PM
Somebody brought this up in the discussion thread, but I also want to know how Sasuke thinks he is going to control Juugo and his killing urge if he does end up joining them. That will certainly be interesting.

I already mentioned in this thread how much juugo is like a inchuriki, somehow I think sasuke has enough power to mess with the cursed seal and control it, just like we saw him do to kyubi's bubbling chakra inside naruto's mental world, he also seems to control his own cursed seal extremely well, so I think thats what he has to offer for exchange for juugo's powers.

he might be able to go inside juugos mental world with his sharingan and seal up his killing urges or make them more controllable, similar to how kakashi sealed the cursed seal for him.

ornis
April 22, 2007, 01:54 AM
@ ANBU4U

I saw the same look in Sasuke's eyes... like "This can't be me/Is this the real me, am I prepared to kill you two?"

Even, "Do I really have to kill you two?"

It was to me... as if Sasuke was questioning himself while he was restraining those tag-alongs... While he was relaxing so much more than the "war" between Suigetsu and Juugo... He was fighting a mental battle too and I understand how it could've been a genjutsu :amuse props to ibra87

Again this helps reinforce my view of the current arc: It is going to be a self-reflective arc and not a team-absorbed search for Sasu's long-lost love... er hate...

Actually, when he really discovers what ever he hates, to me, it will probably be himself... but then, in that moment he realizes, he'll be far too late to help himself. He may have to fade away in a very... hero-meets-villian-within-self way...

@GK

Above is reason why I like your comment on the Narcissitic love Sasuke would have---if he loved Karin.

She's exactly a picture of his analytical eye, in my opinion, and yet she's got gusto, attitude, and "emotions" to share... great!

Sasuke's looking at that man in the mirror pretty hard and probably enjoying every bit of it. J/K lol

*IT'S PSYCHOANALYSIS!*

Id=Juugo
Superego=Karin
Ego=Suigetsu

Sasuke's just on the outside looking in >.>


I already mentioned in this thread how much juugo is like a inchuriki, somehow I think sasuke has enough power to mess with the cursed seal and control it, just like we saw him do to kyubi's bubbling chakra inside naruto's mental world, he also seems to control his own cursed seal extremely well, so I think thats what he has to offer for exchange for juugo's powers.

he might be able to go inside juugos mental world with his sharingan and seal up his killing urges or make them more controllable, similar to how kakashi sealed the cursed seal for him.



Sasu wants a complete team? Sasu needs CS' source for that? Well, Sasuke needs to do some desperate things right now, I really don't want him win too easily... and the suppressing Juugo's urges with sharingan idea would make him pretty powerful...

But the cost of Sasuke dominating others would be too cheap to me.

And he hasn't said, "If you don't join me Juugo, I'll just find another person." He didn't fight the other members either. He still wants Juugo bad and he's not letting up ...what costly thing(s) could he do to get him... <all said is in agreement with kadoman>

Gold Knight
April 22, 2007, 10:45 AM
@ ibra87: Again, thanks for pointing out that pic that didn't load, I can never really be sure that Imageshack does it job sometimes.

Suigetsu more trustworthy than Karin? Right now I'd take you up on that bet, if you have a couple of bucks, heh.

Nice theory on the snakes actually being genjutsu and just a materialization of his killer intent. That could be and would explain a lot of things. Though Orochimaru and Anko HAS been shown as being able to conjure real snakes out of their sleeves, why not Sasuke too, I guess.

I thought that about Karin early on in my short reviews, but it's getting to the point where I don't think that's the case anymore. Karin is way too quick to blush whenever Sasuke does something cool.

fatboy812000: Sasuke may be able to keep them under control with his intimidation factor, but what about KEEPING them with him on the journey? What's to stop Suigetsu from just saying, "Screw this, I don't need you Sasuke, you're not the boss of me, I'm leaving."

Good point on Sasuke most likely having to promise two very different things to Juugo if he ends up having to convince BOTH personalities. That'd be crazy. I'd be willing to bet he'd reenge on whatever he says though...

ANBU4U: Heh, yeah; Sasuke did look kind of like: "Don't make me spank you two" in a way... kinda like a mother who just pulled down the pants of her two kids and she's about to give 'em a good lickin'. Yeah, I wasn't saying that Oro and Sasuke were perfectly similar there, that's why I said "at least a little."

Lord Hokage: Yeah, I wonder if Sasuke will have a different perspective on Naruto after this. Well, one thing's for sure, Kishimoto has made it so that Naruto no longer has an unfair advantage over Sasuke anymore with the Kyuubi inside himself. That's probably why Kishimoto came up with the Cursed Seal in the first place.

juUnior: You liked the cover huh? Hmm... well, I just thought it wasn't up to Kishimoto's usual standards, I guess... But yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if it takes a while for us to fully learn about Juugo's background. (I wonder how early Naruto readers were so patient xD - I'm glad I got to read the first 200 chapters right away.)

kadoman: Well, depending on what happens in May, I may have time to do more reviews of this sort again at least throughout the summer. Can't make any guarantees of course, though. ;)

TOTALLY agreed with you on Karin though. I think Kishimoto had a pretty good female character to work with it and he just didn't capitalize. I wonder if he needs more women assistants to get a clue about how to write female kunoichi =/

"All the appropriate romantic interests in this manga for boys are other boys," though... gah! I totally disagree! SHIKAMARU AND TEMARI! NARUTO AND HINATA! Or Sakura! Anybody but Sasuke... sorry! Haha. And we had Asuma and Kurenai! Hayate had a girlfriend! Hell, I'll even say Chouji and Ino!

But I agree though, Suigetsu is at this moment having a more dynamic relationship with Sasuke than Karin (gah).

I like your idea that not everything should come easily for Sasuke, and I agree there too. I'm thinking that Sasuke will have to say two things to the two Juugos though. That could be an interesting dilemma in itself.

conan: Yeah, I agree with you, I think Sasuke has the means to control Juugo's psycho side, though. He certainly proved it here that he could drive his rage back down - "suppressing the killing intent with his own killing intent," I think the ending sidenotes said. I should have said something about that in my review, I just forgot to.

ornis: gotta love analyzing these characters! ;) But yeah, you're right - Sasuke has no interest in Karin at this point as far as we know, I'm just saying it's a romance I don't mind.

sahugani
April 22, 2007, 10:51 AM
i'll probably get around to posting my usual comment here later. I've had a hard enough time just sitting down and getting my own reviews done (too many seperate little things accumulating this weekend). i am delighted to see the full version return though

kadoman
April 22, 2007, 12:28 PM
"All the appropriate romantic interests in this manga for boys are other boys," though... gah! I totally disagree! SHIKAMARU AND TEMARI! NARUTO AND HINATA! Or Sakura! Anybody but Sasuke... sorry! Haha. And we had Asuma and Kurenai! Hayate had a girlfriend! Hell, I'll even say Chouji and Ino!

But I agree though, Suigetsu is at this moment having a more dynamic relationship with Sasuke than Karin (gah).

Spoiler tagging my very long, very off-topic response. :amuse It's just for your amusement when you have a spare moment, GK.


But GK, that's what I mean by all the other appropriate romantic interests for boys are other boys - the dynamic status of their relationships. The boys have no dynamic relatinships with the girls.

Shika and Temari was merely hinted at by a single scene (where she tells him off for being such a cry baby) and their relationship has since been nurtured by the fandom - not by Kishi himself. In reality, Shika and Temari have barely had 'screentime' together, as it were (fillers don't count - not even the filler-within-canon). Based on quality of time spent together, Shika has had more potential romance with Naruto than with Temari! I'm not even joking, no.

Naruto and Hinata was always one sided - he barely paid attention to her except for that one shining moment when he inspired her and she let him know. Based on their interaction so far, the possibility of Naruto falling in love with Hinata is practically zero. Based on depth of feeling and devotion to maintaining a relationship - Naruto has at least a 90% chance of falling for Sasuke than he has of falling for her! :XD

Granted, I'll say that there is a good possibillty of Naruto and Sakura getting together (and personally, I believe that Kishi will do this), but again, for all his comic ga-gaing over her, Kishi has invested so much more time, effort, emotion and committment to Naruto's devotion to Sasuke - and not for comic relief - for scenes that matter. Naruto and Sakura have had a few serious scenes together, but over the course of 351 chapters, it's not very much.

OK, you win on Asuma and Kurenai (though it was a bit 'token gesture-ish' for me).:tem

I wish he would pay more attention to boy/girl romance in the manga. Over the years, he's had plenty of opportunity to.

All I'm saying is that Kishi is a bit like Tolkein in that he values and devlops the boys relationships with each other so much more than with the girls and that's why there is so much Naruto yaoi out there. Us girls have pretty much got no real choice. :XD

Gold Knight
April 22, 2007, 03:20 PM
Bleh, don't worry about off-topicness in MY thread xD If it's Naruto it's not off-topic to me, even if it might not be related to the latest chapter. Though, if you think about it, EVERYTHING's related to the latest chapter XD

Shikamaru and Temari's romance was more strongly hinted at than that, btw, IMO. For one thing, Shikamaru's dad always advised him about girls, and Shikamaru and Temari both seemed confused about the other sex. They've been seen in scenes where Shikamaru was at his most vulnerable. Also, Temari, I suppose, when she was nearly defeated by Shikamaru. (Heh, despite Shikamaru's personality, I still wonder if he just decided to let the "cute girl" win.) Shikamaru was also seen almost blushing when Temari smiled at him after rescuing him from Tayuya.

And then, they were seen walking together at the beginning of Part 2, and Naruto thought they were together on a date at first. You'll recall also that Kakashi said Asuma and Kurenai looked cute together, and sure enough, they ended up having a baby. ;) Not saying I think Naruto's powers of observation are as good as Kakashi's, but...

lordHokage
April 22, 2007, 04:28 PM
Lord Hokage: Yeah, I wonder if Sasuke will have a different perspective on Naruto after this. Well, one thing's for sure, Kishimoto has made it so that Naruto no longer has an unfair advantage over Sasuke anymore with the Kyuubi inside himself. That's probably why Kishimoto came up with the Cursed Seal in the first place.


Naruto would always have an unfair advantage over Sasuke. Sasuke and Vegeta are like peas in a pod, no matter what Vegeta does, Goku always beat common sense into him. The future is looking bright for Sasuke. :XD

ANBU4U
April 22, 2007, 06:16 PM
Naruto would always have an unfair advantage over Sasuke. Sasuke and Vegeta are like peas in a pod, no matter what Vegeta does, Goku always beat common sense into him. The future is looking bright for Sasuke. :XD


Not really. Goku was a idiot, but a genuine fighting prodigy. After their first fight which Goku won...Vegeta spent the rest of his life chasing him. Working his tail off, to the brink of death even, but never really catching up. He was further infuriated because it seemed to come so naturally to Goku, when he was supposed to be the elite.

The opposites almost true for Naruto. Sauske "won" the first bout and spared Naruto's life. And to date is still arguably the better ninja, as by pedigree he was meant to be. He's not chasing naruto like Vegeta was chasing Goku. Naruto is chasing Sauske, and Sauske...well he's got seperate goals entirely.

lordHokage
April 22, 2007, 09:37 PM
Not really. Goku was a idiot, but a genuine fighting prodigy. After their first fight which Goku won...Vegeta spent the rest of his life chasing him. Working his tail off, to the brink of death even, but never really catching up. He was further infuriated because it seemed to come so naturally to Goku, when he was supposed to be the elite.

The opposites almost true for Naruto. Sauske "won" the first bout and spared Naruto's life. And to date is still arguably the better ninja, as by pedigree he was meant to be. He's not chasing naruto like Vegeta was chasing Goku. Naruto is chasing Sauske, and Sauske...well he's got seperate goals entirely.

Name me one manga where the main character is not an idiot. :nuts

Naruto never wanted to kill Sasuke even though he could if he wanted too, so he deliberately misses to see whether Sasuke would actually kill him. As for Naruto chasing Sasuke, he always think highly of him and refuses to accept the path he has chosen, where as Sasuke hated Naruto to the point where he wanted to kill him, but instead decided to chase after Orochimaru. At this present time, it remains to be seen who would chase who. :hug

The correlation of Goku/Naruto vs. Vegeta/Sasuke are almost identical. Are you aware that Kishimoto is a huge Dragon Ball fan. :amuse

ornis
April 22, 2007, 10:03 PM
Ah your point reminds me of Akira---it's a brilliant thought provoker
Thanks ANBU4U

On that goal: I believe Sasuke wants "power" over his blood so he can shame Itachi to me, so he can improve on the spectacular, "genius of geniuses" bloodline.

I just remembered how great Naruto is... by that one statement. Damn this feels so crazy man! I mean it.

@ Lord Hokage

Kishi adores Akira, too, so this can't be a one-trip finish. <not saying you're focused on DB only>

The viewpoints he gets from DB and Akira are views he said had influenced him... there has to be more, even if those two are the most influential...

<gosh I want more. And I think your idea about Team Sasuke needing therapy says you want more too>

Heck... I'd love to see some Eva pop up suddenly >.> ... '-' (straight face) really

La_Muerte
April 22, 2007, 10:42 PM
great comments, i think kisame and suigetsu might be related i mean they are the only ones in the whole manga that have shark teeth and i think they are both from the mist and suigetsu wanted to be one of the seven mist swordsmen

sahugani
April 23, 2007, 12:21 AM
OK done with OP review and just giving a bit of time to see if FH/Ichiban will give me a scan before posting it. in the meantime, i have returned with opinions (they're a bit short due to lack of brain power atm)

Cover - I'm also hoping to see a bit more out of Karin as she still has yet to stand out. also, on the subject of SasuKarin, i am in full support of excessive narcissism. Before, his admirers sought him out and he was forced to deal with it. i find it amusing that he now has one that he personally invited to join him.

Comment 1 - i am really loving Suigetsu. He sounds like a kid who finds an unattended plate of cookies. He's accepting Sasuke's command for the time being, but he might as well have some fun while the boss has his back turned. I agree that we very well may see some group issues regarding Suigetsu later on as he indulges himself more and more to Sasuke's distaste

Comment 2 - Juugo's CS2 definately seems cool. as you said, he seems to have full shapeshifting power as he changes from a piston to a blade over the course of the chapter. I'm willing to assume that his full CS2 form has a much more human shape to it in it's unaltered form, but really want to see his potential in morphing ability

Comment 3 - while i do applaud the use of partial transformation, i would have much preferred to see Sasuke deal with this in CS1 and draw it out a bit more. I just don't really like the look of his CS2

Comment 4 - I'm looking forward to see more secrets of the curse seal revealed as Juugo is the one who knows it best. I'd actually like an exlanation on how it works from him. also, i'd like to see a bit of flashback with Kimimaro as i miss the guy

Comment 5 - not really much to say except that i agree that the design is absolutely fantastic and i wonder what look Juugo will go for after his wardrobe change

Comment 6 - that is a good point with Juugo's age and Anko's curse seal. either Juugo looks alot younger than he is or he was mature enough as a little kid to go to Orochimaru on his own. in any case, i was kinda disappointed that Sasuke's fight was ended, but i guess he needed to be replaced so that he could be the peacemaker instead of remaining on the defensive

Comment 7 - It has already been established that both Suigetsu and Karin hate both eachother and Juugo, so it was kinda good to get that hostility out in the open. What would have been better is if we got to see Karin's combat ability and made it a 3 person free for all

Comment 8 - it would have been fun to see a little bit more combat between the two, but that could apply to almost any fight in almost any series

Comment 9 - i must admit, Sasuke looks pretty badass here. i mean Suigetsu was just as willing to kill Orochimaru and Juugo is in a battle craze, but both shivered in fear at Sasuke's threat. i personally don't really see it as a referance to Oro. In Oro's case it was "if you cross me, i'll kill you" while Sasuke is just getting fed up with their attitudes

Comment 10 - Juugo is exactly as i expected him to be. i definately think that he killed someone (or many someones) very close to him at a very young age and thus instilled this fear. I really love Juugo and really want to see him heal his soul over the course of his journey with Sasuke

ornis
April 23, 2007, 12:01 PM
Not really. Goku was a idiot, but a genuine fighting prodigy. After their first fight which Goku won...Vegeta spent the rest of his life chasing him. Working his tail off, to the brink of death even, but never really catching up. He was further infuriated because it seemed to come so naturally to Goku, when he was supposed to be the elite.

The opposites almost true for Naruto. Sauske "won" the first bout and spared Naruto's life. And to date is still arguably the better ninja, as by pedigree he was meant to be. He's not chasing naruto like Vegeta was chasing Goku. Naruto is chasing Sauske, and Sauske...well he's got seperate goals entirely.

What if Sasuke was leading Naruto along because he never wanted to humbly search for Naruto... sounds like a repressed, needy impulse unless he needs Kyuubi and not Naruto... I believe he needs the fox

But leading Naruto along---in a needy way---is a mirror of Karin's misleading... desire: "We only need each other, Sasuke"

And it is a great mirror of Karin's foolishness... she is... hiding something
"I'm just going in the same direction as Sasuke" With Sasuke... symbiosis anyone...

Okay, I may be a nutcase for this one:

Pt 1:

Karin is like the Sharingan to me; she can find a real opponent while searching a group of nobodies

The Sharingan is a very costly gift if you attain MS and if you nearly kill yourself in battle just to advance it...

It supposedly evolved from Byakugan... and the Hyuuga branch/main family pact protected the origin of the Sharingan from ever being stolen...

If the Sharingan's from a pact between a demon and a Hyuuga <a blood/soul selling pact> Sasuke has a reason to clean up more than his name and get over Itachi...

I believe the Curse Seal lies on the surface of his genes <epigenetics> There is a gene switch that has been activated.. and it works with his entire body... while disrupting his ying/yang balance...

So, genetically... that means it affects his blood.

Pt 2:

The power struggle between Sasuke's ego and Naruto's good-natured resolve has pushed Sasuke below his own blood's power

He is trying to work with his own devilish nature instead of leading it and avoiding bad influences...

Drugs... CS... a group of people that mirror his id, ego, and superego... fighting Naruto while ignoring Sasuke's unnatural growth... real friendship is more of a growing experience than the goal to ruthlessly challenge your brother---just because you believe everything he says...

Meaning:

Sasuke has no reason to chase Itachi for the clan massacre because he's in on a bigger plot... I think the defection was a sham and Itachi is a scapegoat for the heaviest plot twist ever...

Sasuke is not the anti-hero to me; Sasuke is the true villian but won't be revealed as such yet

And he is helping Konoha by challenging Akatsuki... notice how only Team Kakashi were after Sasuke---no ANBU team...no hunter nin Just two ANBU members (ex-ANBU/somewhat still affiliated), a ROOT member, the apprentice of the Hokage and Konoha's only jinchuriki... why would Tsunade not know what's up if she had faith in sending those valuable villagers out to find Sasuke... especially when three of them are closely involved with Sasuke

Friends often lead to a conflict of interest (e.g., when a mission's purpose is abandoned so that the friendship can continue or comrades can be more important) Kakashi's dad killed himself over that...

So now... seems Team K isn't searching for Sasuke just staying tuned... to the spy news Jiraiya gets along the way... why are they still interested they have Akatsuki to worry about....

Does anybody else question Tsunade's agenda

<what if the Oro/Sasuke bout was encouraged by someone other than Sasuke. Even though his feelings were very compelling>

lordHokage
April 23, 2007, 12:51 PM
What if sasuke was leading Naruto along because he never wanted to humbling search for Naruto... sounds needy

Is an exact mirror of Karin's misleading invitations "We only need each other"

And it is a great mirror of Karin's foolishness
"I'm just going in the same direction as Sasuke"

Point: sasuke has no reason to chase Itachi because he's in on a bigger plot... I think the defection was a sham and Itachi is a scapegoat for the heaviest plot twist ever... sasuke is not the anti-hero sasuke is the true villian and he is helping Konoha by challenging akatsuki... notice how only Team Kakashi is after Sasuke---no anbu...no hunter nin Just two ANBU members (ex-ANBU/somewhat still affiliated), a ROOT member, the apprentice of the Hokage and Konoha's only jinchuriki... why would Tsunade not know what's up if she has faith in sending those valuable villagers out to find Sasuke...

I like the way you think. Sasuke the true villain, the jury is still out. :eyeroll

ornis
April 23, 2007, 01:55 PM
@ Lord Hokage

I think Sasuke is going to have to face his split-personality... in his mind---or in another person... even other persons

I think Karin, Suigetsu, and Juugo will force him to curse the team he made... to regret ever making it...

Because he won't be able to handle how it reflects his weaknesses...

He'll go berserk and try to erase his inferior consciousness... you know the one he see's in them all... the undirected "id," the sneaky ego, and the impulsive superego.

Juugo is the id; Sui is the ego; and Karin is the superego

He will try to redeem himself... but become a worse monster than he ever was... I can see him killing them all and then excusing the act as necessary... "...something that was done so I could grow..."

Then he'll seek out Itachi, for blood---to evaluate Sasuke's existence

For Sasuke will hate himself... after "becoming like" his brother...

//

Well, I often fool myself. How surprising:

When I stated he could kill them all, I was indeed referring to his team, but Sasuke wouldn't lay a finger on them.

He'd provoke a situation, within which... three-fourths of "Team Sasuke" will perish.

The boy's very tricky to me... in that sense, for one.

Really. For when he allots the opportunity for the innocent to be killed, he will.... when he can allow the situation to get the best of a self-proclaimed friend... he has and will.

He won't consciously kill; he can play a mean game of character-puppetry though.

Naruto is still seeking Sasuke. No Akatsuki, ANBU or hunter-nin are after Sasuke, but when time comes, he'd have the best murderous tools beside him---they'd oppose him of course.

But with the Akatsuki and ANBU units he should attract, while leading Naruto astray...

Let's just say he wouldn't have to kill Suigetsu, Juugo, or Karin.

They could all die because of "Sasuke's mistake" Sasuke's foolish "abduction" of Naruto.

//

lordHokage
April 23, 2007, 03:31 PM
@ Lord Hokage

I think Sasuke is going to have to face his split-personality... in his mind---or in another person... even other persons

Because he won't be able to handle how it reflects his weaknesses...

For Sasuke will hate himself... after "becoming like" his brother...

Once again I like way think. Sasuke was always too proud to admit he has issues, but now he has no other choice. In order to be in charge of Sasuke, Orochimaru will discredit him. I do think he will hate himself as a result of his bad choices, therefore, Itachi would be the one who produce offspring’s. :eyeroll

The Flash
April 23, 2007, 03:58 PM
I always liked your reading your reviews for the chapters GK. Good job, and thanks for the review!

manu
April 23, 2007, 10:20 PM
For your comment on how Kishimoto doesn't write very good young women its quite a common occurence in society in general. Notice that its always the woman that needs rescuing. In order to make men seem powerful (Naruto, Sasuke) Kishimoto makes the women weaker. Same in Ino's case since Shikimarut was the "star." Its a big problem with society in general, not just Kishimoto. Remember the amish shooting a while back? The guy let all the boys go yet shot 5 girls. Coincidence? No, men feel stronger making women seem weaker.

SilveryShadows
April 23, 2007, 11:39 PM
6. Considering how none of the timelines make sense; I wouldn't be surprised if it is the same case here.

Team Sasuke is indeed interesting. It brings humour to this arc (something that every arc need and have). But it'll get serious soon. Team Kakashi vs Team Sasuke vs Akatsuki? The big battle would be interesting if it wouldn't end up being focused on few characters.

Ah. No additional comments on your special review. Sorry. Can't think of anything to write. Great comments as always. I enjoyed read them. (Read it just now because I have been busy. )

Gold Knight
April 24, 2007, 08:10 PM
Regarding the Goku/Vegeta v. Naruto/Sasuke comparisons, I think I have to side with ANBU4U on that one... it IS kind of the opposite with Naruto being more of the one chasing Sasuke (usually). Though I like that Kishimoto sort of have them switch roles at times, because Sasuke was definitely envious and frustrated at one time. Maybe that's why Kishimoto decided to do it that way, take the whole Goku-Vegeta relationship, and make it even more dynamic. You guys may be onto something there...

But, Lord Hokage, I can name a manga where the main character ISN'T an idiot.. Death Note.. ;)

ornis, you said something pretty interesting. Sasuke wants "more power" - maybe that's what his current mission is? Not finding Itachi right now, but just becoming more powerful, and to do that he has to bring three companions with him in order to study them, in order to better understand himself? In that case, Juugo would make sense as he could help Sasuke understand his own cursed seal better.

La_Muerte, yup... I would guess so too... at least from a related clan, at any rate.

sahugani... excellent thoughts.. and agreed with each point, I really don't have much to add ;)

ornis - It would be fascinating if Sasuke went against himself like that.

Thanks, Flash =)

manu - Yes, I know.. it's a shame. American Comics writer Chris Claremont is probably the only one I've seen who's been able to handle female characters very well in "shounen-like" comics (which is probably part of the reason X-Men became so popular, other than the themes.) For the rest, look to shoujo manga like Nana.

Silvery Shadows, I'd like to know which timeline paradox frustrate you the most, after hearing you say that =)

No problem, I really appreciate hearing from you each week either way. Glad you were able to stop by even when you were busy :glomp

SilveryShadows
April 24, 2007, 08:30 PM
All of them?
I personally have yet to look deep into it (not sure if I want to :S), but from other people's gathered information I've seen, there are problems that makes the entire time line, and other major timelines (Uchiha's, Akatsuki member joining time) disordered in places. It seemed that from the given information, dates doesn't match up right. (For example, the Orochimaru leaving Akatsuki time and Itachi joining time doesn't make sense. It'd make Itachi really young or something.)
Thus, I tend to overlook the timeline. Too confusing to try to figure it out.

:hug :)

Gold Knight
April 24, 2007, 08:35 PM
Mm.. well, I guess it's one of these deals where if you enjoy the story enough, you can kinda ignore the little pesky details that don't make sense ( sorta like how we can ignore the fact that if Spider-Man REALLY developed organic web shooters in the movies, he'd be shooting them out of his ass. )

So I don't blame you =)

SilveryShadows
April 24, 2007, 08:40 PM
XD

I ignore it because it'd be too troublesome to find ways to explain (to myself) how it makes sense when it doesn't.
Hopefully, in the future, we can get some kind of timeline from the databook. However, that might make it more confusing than before.

ornis
April 24, 2007, 08:52 PM
Yeah that would be like OCD on paper.

I don't want Kishi to clean up those lose ends, if they are insignificant to the plot's progression.

And I like that the young are so involved in this story.

Paints a humbling picture of youth burdened with a believable task to survive and honor more than fads or cultural phenoms...

:p Guess its just a story but I like the responsible premise... makes me want to do more than work for a paycheck.

@ GK

Thank you for the view. I'm glad it would kick your pants off, too! :nuts

Gold Knight
April 24, 2007, 08:54 PM
XD

I ignore it because it'd be too troublesome to find ways to explain (to myself) how it makes sense when it doesn't.
Hopefully, in the future, we can get some kind of timeline from the databook. However, that might make it more confusing than before.



Probably! But all comics sort of suffer from little plot holes like that. If you follow X-Men at all, you probably know about their Canadian wonder, Wolverine... well, there was a miniseries called Origin that explained his background, and he was born in 19th century Alberta, Canada.

However, a previous series seemed to imply Wolverine was much older, by showing pictures of him in feudal Japan xD


ornis, yeah, sometimes cleaning up the loose ends can make things even worse. I personally don't care THAT much, as long as the story still feels human and there's plenty of drama to go around. Except when I'm doing my Comments, of course... >_> It gives me something to talk about :D


EDIT: I should say though, if it is a plot hole that distracts me from enjoying the chapter, I'll probably be more upset about it (like why Naruto and his team still was sent to Team 10's rescue even after apparently not meeting Tsunade's deadline.)

ornis
April 24, 2007, 10:26 PM
EDIT: I should say though, if it is a plot hole that distracts me from enjoying the chapter, I'll probably be more upset about it (like why Naruto and his team still was sent to Team 10's rescue even after apparently not meeting Tsunade's deadline.)

Do you think it let the hero cheaply win? I do :notrust

Does it upset you otherwise?

Gold Knight
April 24, 2007, 10:43 PM
Well, simply put Kishimoto COULD have very, very easily avoided it by NOT mentioning a deadline in the first place. I hate being misled to think a point is important when it ends up being irrelevant in the end.

ornis
April 24, 2007, 11:03 PM
Ah! Deceptive tid bits flip me over too! I hated it when Kakashi got the MS! But it helped me view the eye differently.

I can see it as a gift.

Kakashi selflessly knocks himself out and saves his comrades with an otherwise twisted curse.

Itachi has probably perverted the real MS from the start.

Gold Knight
April 24, 2007, 11:36 PM
Kakashi's MS bothered me, too. But I figured there had to be a reason how he achieved it, and that it would be revealed in all good time. And anyway, it wasn't so much that Kishimoto misled us into thinking there was only one way to gain MS, but really Itachi. For all we know, Itachi could have been lying through his teeth, and he knew all along there was a different way to get the MS, too. He just wanted Sasuke to get it the worst way.

Granted, he was surprised as heck to see Kakashi have it, but that could just be because he didn't expect Kakashi to even figure it out.

ornis
April 25, 2007, 12:10 AM
Itachi... *shakes fist*

All I can say is:

"Clever girl." ~Muldoon

*JP owns! The Lost World rocks!*

Ryoma_Echizen
April 25, 2007, 04:15 AM
I believe the only reason Sasuke goes CS is to attempt to communicate with Juugo. He believes that Juugo might stop when he shows the power of his seal and his control of it. However that was not the case. When it was shown that didn't work he deactivated the seal and then overpowered both Suigetsu and Juugo simultaneously. It was clear he didn't need the seal for the power boost.

As for the weakness of the Curse Seal, I'd bet it erodes your soul or some such. Orochimaru who's goal is to live forever wouldn't really like relying on a technique that stripped a part of him with each use, tiny as it may be. Sakon I believe said that continued use "enslaves" yourself to it. Perhaps continued use of the seal leads to a condition like Juugo's. Whatever the "cost" it is clear that happens later on.

-Ryoma Echizen

lordHokage
April 25, 2007, 10:56 AM
@ Ornis

You blow my mind but I still like the way you think. :o :blink :eyeroll

ornis
April 25, 2007, 03:16 PM
And the "buzz" goes on :D

You are sooo welcome---thanks!
-

@ Ornis

You blow my mind ... :o :blink :eyeroll

Wait a minute >.> Do you think I'm high?

lordHokage
April 25, 2007, 03:57 PM
Wait a minute >.> Do you think I'm high?

No you’re just deep in thought more or less a Naruto specialist. :eyeroll

Saifi
April 25, 2007, 06:52 PM
great komments GK and everyone else too , this week i was bz and decided just to be an observer , anywhoo , congrats on your full komments

tc

lordHokage
April 26, 2007, 07:53 PM
You guys may be onto something there...

But, Lord Hokage, I can name a manga where the main character ISN'T an idiot.. Death Note.. ;)

It remains to be seen. The Death Note is okay but I prefer any manga series similar to Naruto any day. :amuse

Gold Knight
April 27, 2007, 02:37 PM
Thanks guys.

Ryoma, I'm going to have to concede that point. It does seem as though Sasuke did not need the curse seal to stop Juugo, did he? Just seemed like Sasuke didn't have the time to do anything but CS1 at that point, when Juugo lunged at him, though.

And good thinking about the "costs" becoming more evident later on.

BTW guys...

Just read this week's chapter, and I'll probably do another full review. But it probably won't be until Monday, because I'll be gone all weekend, sorry to say... so if there are more reviewers out there, feel free to get ahead of me this time ;)

kadoman
April 27, 2007, 02:49 PM
Yay! Full review!! How could you not though, hey, with this chapter? It's a helluva chapter and it's been a while since I've felt this excited. :smile-big Can't wait to read your thoughts!

arslan
April 27, 2007, 03:34 PM
Yay! Full review!! How could you not though, hey, with this chapter? It's a helluva chapter and it's been a while since I've felt this excited. :smile-big Can't wait to read your thoughts!

i agree, the word 'beautiful' comes to mind reading chapter 352. i expected it to be wonderful but this is beyond wonderful:D