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bax
July 21, 2007, 04:07 PM
Yup!! It's out!! The logn awaited chapter is finally HERE (http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15701)!!! :D

Looks like the battle goes on! What will be the outcome? What will the other too? Hmm... What will happened to Rukia anyway :s

You read it! You saw it! Now it's time to predict what will happened next!!

Fortisdiablos
July 21, 2007, 09:23 PM
I was sooo hoping they wouldn't draw it out, but now that they have...I'm hoping Ichigo won't get his ass kicked and that some of what came out of him when he slashed GJ at the end of last chapter stays with him so that he can beat GJ...even if it's really close at the end. It won't matter since Ichigo isn't gonna be able to take on any more people this arc unless he fights some number 7, Apollo, or Yammi...and that would just be dumb.

lilkwarrior
July 21, 2007, 10:04 PM
That's what I was thinking as well. It's almost crazy and will be a bad choice if Ichigo fights stronger Espada this beat up this arc. Even if Orihime heals him, it's going to take a lot of time for them to reunite with Chad, Rukia, Ishida, and Renji. The only sensible "quickie" would be Ulquiorra and even that would seem like dragging this arc.

brebaz
July 21, 2007, 10:28 PM
prediction : Gj Get Owned

Ichigo I Was Waitin To See Your Full Power Ichigo Appears Behind GJ And Own Him at The End Of The Chapter We Will See Ichigo Last Resolve

: End Of Prediction

Silhouette
July 21, 2007, 11:05 PM
Let's see ch 284 starts with GJ looking down at Zangetsu and ends with him shooting what looks like a grand rey cero.....mmmm in the next chapter, Zangetsu will turn GJ into canned kitty food, yes I believe we will see that Zangetsu isn't out the game yet and he is a an awesome Zanpakuto...maybe a new attack!

Also GJ is a finished...done for...finito, he won't be joining Ichigo cuz he ain't fit for society or he will turn into a dumb gillian with no use.

Teotsura
July 21, 2007, 11:29 PM
Ichigo is going to be hit by the attack
But the black aura and force that came out of him when he first lost the fight to Ulq will guard
He will lose consciousness in some form or shape and the power of zangetsu and his hollow will merge to set loose one of ichigos final powers - he's going to go zenkai
Before that thers going to be a flash back to the part when zangetsu and hollow ichigo talk saying that ichigo was going to come over to the hollow side one day.
The king is going to be switched for a moment
The attack is going to be a complete or partially complete release of all his shinigami and hollow power with a consuminng blast from zangetsu
Thats my first wild prediction I might think of something else. tsu

lilkwarrior
July 21, 2007, 11:50 PM
Let's see ch 284 starts with GJ looking down at Zangetsu and ends with him shooting what looks like a grand rey cero.....mmmm in the next chapter, Zangetsu will turn GJ into canned kitty food, yes I believe we will see that Zangetsu isn't out the game yet and he is a an awesome Zanpakuto...maybe a new attack!

Also GJ is a finished...done for...finito, he won't be joining Ichigo cuz he ain't fit for society or he will turn into a dumb gillian with no use.
I've been noting how Ichigo hasn't been really attentive to Zangetsu and has completely ignored it, it seems for the Vizard mask. I think he even forgot to fight WITH Zangetsu and not alone.... It would be cool if has a new attack with Zangetsu, but even with that, I'm pushing my hopes up...

yowatsgood
July 22, 2007, 02:54 AM
hmmm. actually i will add zangetsu making an appearance soon into my prediction. ichigo's been trying to share power with shirosaki so much that he doesn't seem to balance his power out. zangetsu and shirosaki are one, so if he were to fight with both alongside him with an equal balance of sharing, then he would be a lot more skillfull and powerful. i can guess that zangetsu will teach ichigo a few things, and remind him that he must fight with him as well because he's putting so much more trust in shirosaki.

i conclude my prediction with ichigo definitely defeating grimmjow. grimmjow is going all out, so i can see ichigo defeating him when he figures out his final resolve again.

taimoor2
July 22, 2007, 07:09 AM
For those who haven't noticed its ZARAKI KENPACHI VS ICHIGO all over again.

Zaraki is too much for ichigo.
Ichigo gains will to fight. Zaraki in trouble.
Zaraki's history shown.
Zaraki remove eyepatch
Ichigo gets visited by his inner power.
Zaraki defeated.

I think we are at Step 4 right now.



The visit from inner power is imminent.

brebaz
July 22, 2007, 07:34 AM
i'm gonna say it again and i'm gonna say it all the time GJ get's Owned next Chapter by Ichigo's newest resolve that's all

and the chapter ends with saying the battle ends we will know who won the fight at the chapter after that

notBowen
July 22, 2007, 07:50 AM
For those who haven't noticed its ZARAKI KENPACHI VS ICHIGO all over again.

Zaraki is too much for ichigo.
Ichigo gains will to fight. Zaraki in trouble.
Zaraki's history shown.
Zaraki remove eyepatch
Ichigo gets visited by his inner power.
Zaraki defeated.

I think we are at Step 4 right now.



The visit from inner power is imminent.
You are mistaken, Ichigo got visited by his inner power before Zaraki removed his eye patch.

smlvalentine
July 22, 2007, 08:45 AM
Furthermore, IIRC, Zaraki's history was explained after the battle, not during. Besides, Kubo shows histories throughout battles; it's not uncommon and, indeed, it's appreciated.

Nafycuk
July 22, 2007, 09:14 AM
And even before Zaraki was in any trouble )

Non-Life
July 22, 2007, 10:01 AM
I'm not certain anyone has mentioned this yet, but I'm positive Grimmjaw was the Menos Ichigo beat during the Ishida arc. With the release of chapter 284, we learn more about Menos and the new Adjuncar(spelling?), which may explain Grimmjaw's scar and his bloodthirst.

defaultizzle
July 22, 2007, 10:08 AM
^ If you meant the scar on GJ's chest, it was given to him by Ichigo during their first fight. But i like the idea of that menos resurfacing as an espada. That old guy has the matching scar of the gillian, so that's a start

Non-Life
July 22, 2007, 10:19 AM
I forgot about that old espada guy, heh. But the idea sounds plausible, afterall when the Menos first appeared-the one Ichigo beat-Rukia was shocked it appeared in the first place, like it knew exactly what it was doing.

notBowen
July 22, 2007, 11:05 AM
I figure the Gillian looking guy with them was D-Roy because he was such a pushover and with that same group of arrancar.

Travis
July 22, 2007, 11:07 AM
I think its possible from previous chapter that Grimmjow will live regardless of outcome of battle and he might live long enough to become a vastalord. (sp?)

Impel Down
July 22, 2007, 11:22 AM
All it looks like that can happen now is Grimmjow kicking ass. Unless they switch over to some other random Espada or White&Red instead.

ttxdragon
July 22, 2007, 11:33 AM
ok guys,

discussing is good, one-lining ain't :p

please don't use this forum as an instant-messenger replacement ;)
a forum is made so you can bring in long texts :p

try to be a bit more resourceful and write a bit more (without spamming to fill space, of course).


thanks for your understanding :)



i still think this is for the purpose of having ichigo admit to his lust for fighting, openly admitting :)

although this fight is drawn out, what i don't like, i predict that it won't last anymore than 2 further chapters with ichigo as the broken winner.

Travis
July 22, 2007, 12:30 PM
No offense, and I'm new to the forums, but are you joking? Because after you finished off talking about the no one liners, you posted one sentence (maybe two) on your predictions for the chapter which is what some of us did. Yours was a little longer but still the same.

Great joke btw if it was :)

hasoon87
July 22, 2007, 12:44 PM
^Travis its no joke, but I guess you're off the hook since ur new...

I dont know if anyone noticed, but it seems that grimjow was showcasing some regenerative ability, since at the beginning of the chap he got sliced, lots of blood etc. but near the end when about to go all out we can clearly see his body without any scratches. This may have been some lack of attention from kubo, but i dont think so, ichigo showed high speed regen. when in his full hollow form, why not an espada?

My prediction: so I do believe we are in for the conclusion of this fight, my bet is on ichigo pulling out a new move, but not before us going to a flashback of what was going on with ichigo when he was phased out after the skirmish with uli. That, or we could be in for a surprise, help on the way? the great reatsu that noitora picked up finally revealing him/herself to rescue ichigo? I sure hope its Isshin! that would be totally awesome! If it would happen of course :P odds are against.

As much as I love kubo I just really cant wait for this arc to end. I am really curious as to how he'll conclude it too, how on earth is he gonna collect everyone (and their remains) and get em outta there without encountering anymore espada. UNLESS! SS bring the winter war to AIZEN IN HM! alright i'll stop right there :P ....

ttxdragon
July 22, 2007, 01:30 PM
haha :p the oneliner... hmmm it was more like trying to give the post a bit of direction at the end to bring it back to predictions xP
I ain't good at predicting after chapters like this so i kept it short ;)
(I don't like to only post a warning without any ontopic stuff >.>;;; )
but please no more talk about this topic, no need to have this thread go offtopic
(and yeah, i guess i really screwed that one up this time xP it happens ^^; )

but to add a longer prediction,

Next chapter will have ichigo getting sliced at the beginning, he will hear "voices" and will finally regain his will to fight, this time openly acknowledging it.

The slicing action will like split up the rest of the mask, leaving him either with only the eyes or only his bankai, but he will still be on equal footing with GJ afterwards.

The fight will end in chapter 286, i'd say. If by intervention once again or with a winner in the fight, i don't know... there are too many variables to even attempt predicting that yet ^^;
although i still love the idea of Urahara popping up to the rescue applauding ichigo for the win xD

Ruissu
July 22, 2007, 02:37 PM
actually there'll be no more ichigo ....kubo porb will make HM arc diferent...

predictions:

ichigo is defeated by GJ's and once again is left to dye, GJ takes inoe back to her cell...and we go again to renji/ishida fight...

sorryu guys but i think its the most prob thing to happen... ever since ichgios cames back from SS that he no longer has the strght or will to "evolve" or search harder for the "why or what am i" he just blindlly rushes into a fight w/o taking in consideration his own power and resources (shirosaki/zangetso)

im willing to admit this arc his an "open eyes" to ichigo...cuz of him almost everyone got injured or died (rukia ..meahahhaha) cuz he was so blind..besids that i cant see him fight with all is might (zenkai) he no longer has a reason to...

you guys might be think "well what about inoe?and all his frieinds" ... he isnt thinking... ichigo is just slicing trow a metal wall with a woden catana...gj ill defeat him... not so serioslly has ulquiorra, ichigo will prob pass out and then the inner conflict will happne... shirosaki and zangetso (or both=1) will have alot to talk with ichigo about his mask and powers...

prob this arc is close to end... only renji and ishida are fighting and zuerapollo asnt even released

lol yeh... this is moe then just a next chapo predections...

long term prediction = 10/15 more chaps

neomaster121
July 22, 2007, 04:14 PM
well from this chapter im guessing we are gonna have a chapter dedicated to ichigo allowing him to power to his full ability then chapter after will be the ending of the fight. I didn't expect this infor on how the adjuscha were created and im glad about that awnsers some of my questions abou the hollows.

Travis
July 22, 2007, 05:25 PM
I put this prediction down in another thread before, but I think to answer the question of how are they going to get out of there alive.

The vaizards may have the the negacion ability used on Aizen, Gin, and Tousen. So I think thats a really good way for them to leave heuco mundo alive. Someone suggested Orihime rejecting the whole event, which sounds kind of cool, but then it would be like the fight between Grimmjow and Ichigo never happened and they would still be at each others throats to do another fight again.

I really hope that even though Grimmjow is fighting Ichigo with all his power that Ichigo beats the crap out of Grimmjow without Grimmjow nearly killing him or anything. I also hope something else develops during the time they are in Heuco Mundo, because the whole time they've been there its felt like a filler arc. Nothing really progressed except when Rukia beat #9 which was strange. Also I guess Ichigo has learned to hold his mask on longer, but it feels like before the Grimmjow fight its been a weird arc.

vegettasaiyan
July 22, 2007, 06:45 PM
hey guys im newbie to this forum and it took me sometime hehehe. but anyhow here's my prediction for next chapter. both GJ and ichi will beat up each other to death up to the point they'll use their last strength but none will die on this arc. of course another flashback on ichigo side occur and as what others said zenpaktou will aid ichigo.

then on next chapter someone will come either to stop or rescue ichigo from GJ and get out of hueco including ishi,renji,rukia,chad but not inoue since other arrancar will stop them. this person will tell ichi to replan their rescue attempt to inoue and be ready for the upcoming attack from aizen & co.

Non-Life
July 22, 2007, 10:15 PM
SOmething new is bound to happen, we've already gone through two chapters of constant counters and assaults, plus this new chapter revealing Grimmjaw's past. My best bet is that the next chapter will show signs of Ulquiroa (spelling) breaking out sooner than expected.

Eebee
July 22, 2007, 10:51 PM
I desperately want the vizards to bust into Hueco Mundo and help Ichigo et al. out. I think there's a good chance of that happening, though I doubt it'll happen in the next chapter. ;)

What I want to happen:

GJ goes zenkai on Ichigo, forcing Ichigo to finally phase out of his Hollow transformation. Orihime cries "Kurosaki-kun~!" and Nell freaks out. Just when all seems lost, the vizards appear. (I can just see Hiyori now: "What're you doin' lying down, dumbass!?" *throws sandal*)

I agree with Travis in that we haven't seen just what the vizards are capable of. I wouldn't be surprised if at least one of them could pull off a negacion. (I mean, Mashiro could hold her Hollow form for 10+ hours from the start--she's got to have a ton of spiritual power! Either that or a lame inner Hollow. :) And Shinji was ready to take on GJ before.)

What I think will happen:

GJ goes zenkai and Ichigo counters his attacks. Ichigo finds a way to power up, likely figuring out a latent Hollow ability. Orihime cries "Kurosaki-kun~!" and Nell freaks out. The chapter ends but the battle is "to be continued..."

Lather, rinse, and repeat for a few more chapters.

Honestly, I think Ichigo should be K.O.-ed by now. I like how he's suddenly gained the ability to control his mask (due to his fighting spirit), but I can't see how he could possibly pull off a victory at this point. Especially if GJ is going to fight at full strength.

I can sort of see Orihime jumping in to protect Ichigo with her shields. That doesn't seem too out of character, given that Nell is acting practically a one-girl Ouendan squad. If Orihime shields Ichigo, then GJ will be thrown off-balance for a bit and Ichigo will have an opening. (Of course, if GJ could withstand this much Hollow!Ichigo already, a sneak attack seems a bit moot.)

Last idea: if Kubo doesn't "surprise" us with Orihime or Nell's actions, then I think The Ulq might come back to cause havoc. He'd probably go after GJ first, leaving Ichigo, Orihime, and Nell a chance to escape. Maybe.

Hm. The fight has a lot of possibilities; I just hope the Kubo gives us a crazy cliffhanger rather than an unfinished fight. I guess we'll see soon enough! If anything, this fight has the potential to transform Ichigo's character into something interesting. ;) The fact that Shirosaki's tendencies are coming through when Ichigo's fighting holds promise.

ShinobiWrath
July 23, 2007, 01:35 AM
Last idea: if Kubo doesn't "surprise" us with Orihime or Nell's actions, then I think The Ulq might come back to cause havoc. He'd probably go after GJ first, leaving Ichigo, Orihime, and Nell a chance to escape. Maybe.

I Agree he'll cause havoc but not if that means letting Orihime slip through his fingers. My personal thoughts and predictions are that GJ is going to start off with a killing. Ichigo will be forced to defend seeing as how Full Power GJ will be more than he can handle. Of course Ichigo will treat it as child's play in an effort to keep Orihime Calm. He'll then start repeating to himself how he can't let GJ win. It's then we'll see our first in a while appearance of Shirosaki asking Ichigo if he thinks he is fit to weild his power. Ichigo will then be coerced to withdraw his mask and just before GJ delivers then abolishing blow Ulquiorra grabs his hand and everyone goes into shock as Ulquiorra declares---

" Such unfair Child's play.....GrimmJow".


[Edit] This prediction could vary from GJ's actions in th next chapter.

earthforge
July 23, 2007, 02:14 AM
If the vaizard or Hollow Ichigo come to save Ichigo, it would just be cliche. What is the one thing bleach is known for: not being cliche. If Kubo has brains and knows his fans, he' will come up with something that is not ascliche. There has already been several times a rescue attempt could have been implemented in the arc, but he hasn't. Unfortunately for the fanboys, there are no saviours at this point. It would ruin the drama between Ichigo and Orihime.

Predictions:
1) Ichigo discovers a new technique that pwns Grimmjaw.
2)Orihimethrows a barrier around Ichigo, Ulqiourra comes
3)Orihime uses reversal of time on Ichigo's mask.

But it seems like Ichigo is done for. His mask is nearly destroyed, and I doubt that he can do much more. For Grimmjaw to go all out right after Ichigo went all out, the odds are definitely in favor of Grimmjaw. But now after we had a flashback with Grimmjaw, why not have a flashback with Ichigo? The stage is set for such an event, as there are so many possible outcomes.

Lorax007
July 23, 2007, 04:55 AM
I'm not sure if this is one week or two, but:

Ichigo is beaten, and his mask breaks...
Grimmjaw is pretty beaten and weak too.
Grimmjaw moves in for the kill, Ichigo can't move!
Tsubaki comes flying in, dealing the final blow to GJ.
Ichigo is stunned, and looks back at Orihime.
Orihime is shaking.
SHE found killing intent in her desire to defend Ichigo.

.
.
.

Later week, out on the limb predictions:

Ulquiorra comes out of stasis, and captures a still-trembling Orihime.
Ichigo is too weak to stop him from doing so.
Ulquiorra moves to finish Ichigo off, and Orihime saves him again.
Orihime begs for Ulquiorra to let him go if she goes along quietly.

.
.
.

Who know what happens from that point on...

Impel Down
July 23, 2007, 12:32 PM
I'm itchin' for some Stark/Noitora/Chad action at this point, I must say. I mean, the battle between Ichigo and Grimmjow has now essentially become slamming each other with generic punches and laser beams.

MercX
July 23, 2007, 04:19 PM
I'm not certain anyone has mentioned this yet, but I'm positive Grimmjaw was the Menos Ichigo beat during the Ishida arc. With the release of chapter 284, we learn more about Menos and the new Adjuncar(spelling?), which may explain Grimmjaw's scar and his bloodthirst.

It seems like in this manga everyone seems to get cut that way
its like the drawers obsession to cut across the chest
that or the shoulder
[hr]
i jsut thot of something
ok this is my prediction
itl be like the fight in yu yu
when yuske was fighting the blind guy
both gj and ichi are gonna go all out
basicaly destroy eachother
and when there falling down to hit the ground before they pass out
orihime will be kurosaki kun!!!
ichi will catch himself and stare at gj

But i think it would be badass if after this happend ichi kinda berserks and take his sword and shanks gj in the back while he's passed out
I think that would be funny and give fanboys to make pictures saying ichigowned

Ragnarokblade
July 23, 2007, 06:59 PM
grimmjow will bust out with a huge-ass kamehameha (a super cero?) and ichigo will go super saiyan 3 himself (transform more hollow, as appossed to just the mask) to power up and use spirit bomb (probably getsuga tenshou or a variation of it) to beat him from out of nowhere and once again...it is the hollow inside him that saves his sorry ass from getting wiped across planet namek ^^

Chainsaw FTW
July 23, 2007, 08:17 PM
Well, here's my two cents on what might happen.

Although I doubt it will happen, I think the fight is winding down. I think we'll see a scene similar to the Ichigo-Kenpachi fight where both combatants are going to strike at full power. I think that, like already stated, Ken-chan's eyepatch removal is comparable to what Grimmjow did at the end of 284. What we can expect from 285 would either be Ichigo's power up, ending with the strike itself, or just the powerup. As much as I know some people are clinging to the hope Grimmjow will turn good, I think this is his swan song.

earthforge
July 24, 2007, 02:04 AM
Although I doubt it will happen, I think the fight is winding down. I think we'll see a scene similar to the Ichigo-Kenpachi fight where both combatants are going to strike at full power. I think that, like already stated, Ken-chan's eyepatch removal is comparable to what Grimmjow did at the end of 284. What we can expect from 285 would either be Ichigo's power up, ending with the strike itself, or just the powerup. As much as I know some people are clinging to the hope Grimmjow will turn good, I think this is his swan song.

Ichigo has already had his big powerup. His acceptance of the mask plus the fact that he slashed Grimmjaw in the chest multiple times shows he has improved. That would be his big powerup. Yes, the fight is winding down. Whoever has the winning hand wins the fight, but whoever is the main character survives the fight(pattern in all shounen series except for a few.). But unless Kubo wants to be cliche in his usage of powerups, he will not push powerups all together. If that did happen though, it is my two cents we would have a flashback sequence before another big powerup.

supergarr
July 24, 2007, 03:38 AM
Ichigo is going to impale GJ, and use a getsuga tenshou while the sword is still inside GJ's body, which will probably blow half his body apart.

Travis
July 24, 2007, 08:54 AM
I was just thinking if the vizards had and used the Negacion ability how awesome it would be. Think about it they would have to put their masks on to use the abiltity. How awesome would that 2 pager be? With 5 or 6 of the Vizards in mask form. 5 without Orihime 6 with her.

Impel Down
July 24, 2007, 09:12 AM
I don't think they'll make a real appearence until the Winter War, or the Pre-Winter War arc. And now I'm beginning to think if maybe Grimmjow will use some sort of arrancar bankai now.

Another_Sky
July 24, 2007, 08:09 PM
Okay this is gonna be wierd but refer to my sig.

First of all I hate this arc it's like retelling the soul society arc with a different girl kidnapped and even more brutal no-brainer fighting. I miss soul society. You know Kubo should stop this girl gets kidnap and rescue her thing next it'll be Tatsuki. And there's similar roles too.

Ichigo vs... (Hueco vs. Soul Society)
Arrancar #103(was it? I forgot) = Renji
Grimmjow = Kenpachi
Ulquiorra = Byakyua

Chad vs... (Hueco vs. Soul Society)
Captain #8 = Arrancar #xxx

Ishida vs... (Hueco vs. Soul society)
Espada #8 pink hair = mayuri

See this is all dejavue but in another form.

Anyways I think the Vizards are finally going to come I mean seriously I wanna know more about them instead of espadas. Vizard enters Ulquiorra returns Vizard tells him to wait 3 days and Ichigo will reach Bankai Lv. 2. Orihime is forced to sacrifice her life to make some orb. Ichigo comes in Ulquiorra gets pissed they fight. Some serious plot twist. Then next arc Tatsuki gets kidnapped they need to go rescue..

I seriously hope Tite dosn't dissapoint me.

Travis
July 24, 2007, 09:03 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if arrancar developed a form of ban kai. They only have one release right now. Shinigami have 2.

I agree a lot with you Another_Sky. Kubo seems to be ruining Bleach with this repetitive storyline, and whats worse is it feels fillerish, while he figures out how he will do the Winter War.

Maybe he knows what he's doing but it feels like nothing is really progressing, and this is just a mindless fight to show maybe how powerful the espada are and how much stronger everyone needs to get before the Winter War. At first it felt like Orihime was going to stay in Heuco Mundo to destroy the Hougykou, but now it seems like she wants to be rescued. So its almost as if anything could happen now.

Impel Down
July 24, 2007, 09:06 PM
Well, then maybe Szayel WON'T die this arc, instead, he'll battle Mayuri in the WW and die there.

earthforge
July 24, 2007, 10:51 PM
Well, then maybe Szayel WON'T die this arc, instead, he'll battle Mayuri in the WW and die there.

That's be an interesting fight. watch the two freaks fight it out. But the good guy vs. bad guy axiom rules that Mayuri would win, despite how much we hate him. Better yet, Ishida and Mayuri could team up (I know it sounds stupid, but Ishida has to make the bridge of friendship with the shinigami for future generations)

And again on the vizard thing: they are NOT coming to save Ichigo's ass. If that were the case, then Tite would never fulfil his role in our minds as "the plot twist-er." We could have predicted it a while ago, but does Tite ever copy our predictions?

But obviously we will see vizard action in the WW. So hold onto your horses for a bit longer, fanboys. (No pun intended)

SmallTiger
July 25, 2007, 04:23 AM
I predict that the fight is indeed winding down and that GJ and Ichigo will both survive. We know that ichigo won't die, and if Kubo were going to kill GJ off I think he would've done it by now. (I stand prepared to eat my words...) This fight has been going on for quite a while, with too much talking and backstory, and NO cutaways to anything else that might be happening.

I think that the fight will get interrupted yet again before fatalities ensue, probably by the return of Ulquiorra... or worse. GJ will get dragged off to some dark corner of HM to face immediate execution, and Ichigo will try to rescue him because they're "not finished yet." Which, of couse, will piss off GJ even more. ;)

EDIT: I chanegd my avatar in support of my prediction!

Impel Down
July 25, 2007, 09:38 AM
Would Ichigo even kill him? I mean, he's yet to kill any arrancar so far, so would he just beat him and leave? I think Ulquiorra will only break out when the battle is pretty much over and Ichigo leaves, so he can punish just Grimmjow.

supergarr
July 25, 2007, 03:08 PM
anyone think that inoue isnt really inoue and that she could possibly be an illusion made by aizen? Just to see ichigos progress? or another reason?

theshizzle
July 25, 2007, 04:33 PM
When are we going to see Renji and Ishida

this is too similar to the current Naruto Manga too, just focusing on one battle for that last 5 ++ chapters

Impel Down
July 25, 2007, 07:21 PM
Wow, it's almost like *gasp* Kubo isn't creative! But I agree, it is like that in Naruto, but at least here we get looks at other characters and backstories, although those are just excuses for Kubo to make less fight. And I doubt Grimmjow will pull as fantastic attacks out of his ass.

Gulio
July 25, 2007, 07:36 PM
I think Orihime will repair his mask...

Impel Down
July 25, 2007, 08:02 PM
Well, before, he could heal his own mask, remember? And like when it took over him before, prior to his training, it wasn't completely on, and it still made him supa powerful, so even if he only has that little piece on him now, he's still as strong as if he had the full mask on.

Travis
July 25, 2007, 10:07 PM
Yeah I agree. As long as he has a little piece of the mask on he still has the same power boost. Its probably like Hitsugaya's bankai, except the timer lasts as long as Kubo needs it to for the fight. :D

lilkwarrior
July 25, 2007, 10:21 PM
anyone think that inoue isnt really inoue and that she could possibly be an illusion made by aizen? Just to see ichigos progress? or another reason?
I thought about this for quite some time, but that wouldn't make sense... Aizen's ability isn't THAT good to even copy someone's ability like Orihime's to heal... If he did, he wouldn't need Orihime anymore would he?

Also I think Aizen is simply "playing" with his underlings again by letting these events happen. (It will be his downfall, mark my words) After losing an Espada, I would've thought he would have took the invasion more seriously or more thoughtfully, but he probably knew that his bottom Espada (Number 9 & 10) are certainly beatable by probably even Shinigami one level behind a captain and was going to replace them either way (with Vastolorde moving people down,etc).

I want Ichigo to kill somebody for once. He needs to put in his thick skull that people like Espada are dangerous to mankind. After all the deaths that the lowest Espada Yammy did to his precious town, Ichigo & company would have a no mercy approach to this. If it helps, Ichigo needs to picture Espada as Hollows that he "killed" on earth that have a more human appearance. They are not really killed, they are just purified, along with the pour souls they kill. Though they look more human than regular hollows, they are actually less human, killing & merging with numerous "people". Bleach seriously need a darker tone & Ichigo needs to be more developed in character than he is now big time... In the past, Ichigo had reasonable reasons not to kill in Soul Society. But now, in a world that are full of hollows, they enemy he swore by his own mouth to "kill" as much as he can, the same enemy that has torn his family, he is too soft period.

Tallus Rip
July 27, 2007, 02:35 AM
I don't think that'll happen till Ichigo witnesses someone he cares for be killed in front of him (not just hurt or attacked, KILLED.) So far, all of their fights have been separated, or Ichigo's been unconscious when he was needed. He won't have the drive or comprehension to actually go through with killing even an Espada (probably not even Aizen) until something really f**ked up happens and pushes him over the edge. Not just "this is my resolve" either that he keeps coming around to...I doubt Ichigo ever really took Urahara's words seriously when he said Ichigo needs to be ready to kill his opponents.

Because nothing's driven him over the edge, Ichigo probably thinks he's better than to kill someone. To do so would make him "no better" than Shirosaki...whom we all know Ichigo doesn't approve of.

sephysarkon
July 27, 2007, 06:45 AM
I want Ichigo to kill somebody for once. He needs to put in his thick skull that people like Espada are dangerous to mankind. After all the deaths that the lowest Espada Yammy did to his precious town, Ichigo & company would have a no mercy approach to this. If it helps, Ichigo needs to picture Espada as Hollows that he "killed" on earth that have a more human appearance. They are not really killed, they are just purified, along with the pour souls they kill. Though they look more human than regular hollows, they are actually less human, killing & merging with numerous "people". Bleach seriously need a darker tone & Ichigo needs to be more developed in character than he is now big time... In the past, Ichigo had reasonable reasons not to kill in Soul Society. But now, in a world that are full of hollows, they enemy he swore by his own mouth to "kill" as much as he can, the same enemy that has torn his family, he is too soft period.

I like your analysis of Ichigo, and I feel that it certainly fits him. I've been dying to see him actually KILL some one's a$$, but noooooo. Not yet. Why? He's in the freaking place where Hollows live! *shakes head*

You're right--he needs to develop more as a character; I haven't seen him do so for a while, and Bleach itself needs to learn to kill people. And I'm not talkin' about crap like fish tank head.

I also agree with Tallus Rip--something REALLY messed up needs to happen to make all that needs to happen, happen. (Did I make sense?) Hopefully with the coming chapters, Kubo'll give us something of the like.

~the seph

Impel Down
July 27, 2007, 09:39 AM
Seriously, Ichigo's killed hollows before, and some of them have even had intelligence, so why would killing an arrancar, especially one he hates and is ruining his life, be any more of a strain? And even if he DOES kill them, someone needs to remind him that whoever he kills is just going to go back to SS and be cleansed of their inner torment and rage.

lilkwarrior
July 27, 2007, 05:55 PM
That is what I was applying in my perspective of Ichigo. Someone needs to remind him that in Hueco Mundo it's kill or be killed; either way, the people you "kill" are going to be cleansed and be at Soul Society. I agree with both of your points. Arrancars, Exequias, whatever, they are HOLLOWS. You don't even know how many human lives they have took in their life time. They can look like anything, but they are Hollows, which you "killed" before; they just look more human. Maybe Rukia would remind him of the fact, but it seems it's too late for that now. I agree that probably something drastic has to happen for him to understand this himself.. Like an unexpected twist...

What if Aizen is tired of all these battles because of one girl and decides & orders someone to kill Orihime? That would be devastating.. It's not out of the league though, Aizen doesn't really care and he has shown it by his track record of what he did to Momo, Kaien, and it seems Grimmjow (Grimmjow's arm incident), & the Espada Rukia defeated ("broken" promise)...

Stone
July 27, 2007, 08:05 PM
Doubt this'll be it, but perhaps hime's limit would be characters that already moved to a new life or simply characters that have been consumed.

THough i doubt well have an arrancar eating one of the known shinigami...

Silhouette
July 27, 2007, 08:25 PM
Did Ichigo really get a power up? I know he had his mask on but he had no new attack and no significant increase in his speed...maybe his body became a bit harder with the mask on but that was about it.

It appears to me that Ichigo's change of personality had nothing to do with Shirosaki...you know that by looking at Ichigo's white burning eyes and listening to his words:" To beat you, Ulquiora, Aizen and take Rukia, Chad...etc". Ichigo simply picked his realization of his true dominant self from where his inner world battle with Shirosaki ended and went on. Therefore, the final stage in this battle was simply a fight between two will powers, GJ determined to become a Vasto Lorde and Ichigo determined to be a bold winner and dominant.

I am glad that Zangetsu sliced through GJ's baddest technique after being taken lightly by GJ I also have no sympathy for GJ...call me old fashioned but someone who talks shit and threatens the weak is not a person who's gonna go on my favorite list.


I can hardly wait to see this battle animated (please make it as good as Ikakku's )


*celebrating a 1000 posts*

mrgodai
July 27, 2007, 08:43 PM
did anyone else notice that ichigo's eyes turned back to "normal" while still got parts of hte mask on right when he beats GJ? maybe he finally mastered the Hollow inside him?

Travis
July 27, 2007, 08:47 PM
This is a reply to the spoiler thread that is closed now. I think you misunderstood my whole post Drakend.


You're confusing the trainings... the "training which may kill you" thing was said by Yoruichi when she teached Ichigo bankai.

I didn't confuse the trainings. In the anime episodes, (don't have the chapters so didn't check) the vaizard girl that trains with Ichigo so he can hold his mask longer says he needs to get closer to death during his training. They get in a big argument about it.


Sheronhime is powerful enough already, so please don't add the +10 reiatsu points crap, please!

I didn't say her presence is the reason that his power is increased like an aura. It has to do with his will and resolve to protect them and defeat Grimmjow. Also you forget that after Orihime accepted him for who he was and cheered him on he blocked Grimmjow's kick with one hand and cut him down as opposed to him using 2 hands and his sword to block a kick and still being projected earlier in the fight.

I also mentioned that his ability to hold his mask on longer might have to also do with being in Heuco Mundo. Chad stated earlier that his powers were more hollow based and going crazy and he went through a huge increase in power, too. So why not Ichigo's hollow based powers?

And if you're holding on to the theory that Ichigo is excited and finally accepting of him liking to fight, you forgot when he went all crazy on Renji in their first fight where he got really excited and smiled a lot during the fight while he was beating the crap out of Renji, untill Byakuya put him down. Same with the Byakuya fight him smiling and taunting Byakuya to release Ban Kai and stuff like that. Or him saying he can see through Byakuya's attacks. He's always smiling and saying some smart ass thing to his opponents while he's fighting. I don't see why this is so different?

Majin Trunks
July 28, 2007, 02:23 AM
did anyone else notice that ichigo's eyes turned back to "normal" while still got parts of hte mask on right when he beats GJ? maybe he finally mastered the Hollow inside him?

I noticed it, although it looks like only his left eye turned to normal as his right eye still seems dark (but the angle that it is drawn could be on purpose to look like it might be still dark when it isn't anymore).

Tallus Rip
July 28, 2007, 03:21 AM
Might be the scan quality too. Or it's something Vaizard-ish...during Ichigo's 'learn how to have your mask out for more than 4 seconds' training, Hiyori would often have gray and yellow eyes when she pulled her mask half-off and then it'd go back to full black and yellow when she put it back on (in the anime at least.)

Nafycuk
July 28, 2007, 04:47 AM
This chapter is just AWESOME! It is my favourite from now on... Look at Inoue's eyes.... GJ's eyes..... I'm crying....

ShinobiWrath
July 28, 2007, 06:47 AM
GJ's eyes are what impacts me the most. Kubo did a great job of capturing the expression of deep emotion and what is possibly regret. Perhaps GJ is accepting that he also has limitations and could go no further, trying to prove to himself that he was the king but could not as he found himself the same as D-roy, Ilforte, and the others.

Impel Down
July 28, 2007, 07:58 AM
Honestly, his eyes never seem to change to me. And talk about generic "power up"! Oh well, at least the fight is pretty much over. However, why DIDN'T Grimmjow eat the Numeros?

ttxdragon
July 28, 2007, 08:38 AM
I think grimmjow didn't eat them because he himself has some sort of comradery (i hope this word exists or you get the meaning xD).


but this chapter sure is awesome....
first that hilarous episode of "Colorful Bleach", then that funny colorspread....
at least we get to see the gotei13 this time xD and now you know: kubo hasn't forgotten about them, he just wasn't able to fit them into the fray until now without going against his planning....

for the chapter itself:
I'm glad we didn't get a "zenkai"-release, but that it really reffered literally to going all out....

Then... this must've been the earliest coverpage of a chapter since like 20chaps or so xD not often that we get a coverpage this early on in the chapter... and it's even less often that it's such a sweet one... i honestly envy kubo for his art skills....

then... the flashback... i liked it, because it showed that the strength-limit for hollows is different for each individual... which suggests that it's the same for shinigami. The absolute strength limit is a personal limit, not a races limit.

but onto the rest of the chapter:
the nail-attack was fun, i thought it was really something worth having that introduction like last chapter, although i must admit that seeing so little of it was kinda sad.... ichigo shattered it too fast...

and there i already get onto the top-theme of this chapter, Ichigos resolve and objectives.
This chapter is a real milestone on that one. I really love how it developed and the chapter opens a route which would be very interesting:
Ichigo loosing sight of compassion for companions.
He didn't lose it yet, mind you, but what i am saying is that from his speech it seems like he now seems to put his friends as a second kind of "bonus"-objective. First and for all he wants to fight and defeat his enemies and then, if that worked out, he can go on and do his other side-objective, the rescue-job. It's like he admitted to going into hueco mundo and endangering his friends for the sake of satisfying his fighting-thirst.
If we look further down that road, we might get an ichigo who defeats aizen for the sake of fighting, but has to leave all of his compassion away... maybe he will then even turn on his friends or the king, because he wants to fight more. Maybe shirosaki will not merge with him but subconsciously influence him that far then. I don't think shirosaki would like to give up his own "life", but rather he'd love to give his power for ichigo to handle and then observe the fray/help more in the fray when ichigo has the mask on....


this could really turn into a interesting development...


but this chapter also showed me that i was right with one thing:
this arc wasn't made to be badass, it wasn't made to be "the awesome ichigo arc" or something...
it was made for the character development in this arc...
the arrancars gain more personality, ichigos personality changes, inoue changes, heck, even rukia changes....

i got to say, kubo did great this chapter :)

Impel Down
July 28, 2007, 09:35 AM
Yeah, he was able to show that the fight was over with Ichigo's speech, but unlike most of the speeches, this one wasn't cheesey or lame. I still think Grimmjow put up less of a fight then he truly could have.

Travis
July 28, 2007, 09:59 AM
Hehe notice how it pans to Rukia and Chad when he says their names but not Ishida and Renji. :D

I hope Renji and Ishida are grabbing Rukia and Chad and retreating with them now that Ichigo is with Orihime. (I'm sure atleast Ishida can sense this.) It would be the logical thing to do considering there is no way they can win and they need to get Chad and Rukia out of there before they die.

Txt that is a word that you were trying to say, its just spelled in a very strange way. Camaraderie

I agree you may be right about the fact that Ichigo is putting his fighting wants before his friends, but I think it could be the fact that he realizes that unless he defeats Aizen his friends will never be safe, especially Orihime. Its kind of hard to tell right now.
I mean he didn't mention defeating all the espada and the other 2 captains, just the ones he's fought so far that have been kicking his ass.

Impel Down
July 28, 2007, 10:03 AM
Hopefully, Ishida and Renji are not trying to retreat, they are getting ready for the epic Szayel fight that is coming up.

Travis
July 28, 2007, 11:30 AM
I don't know, I just don't think its smart to wait in that room that seals your powers for Sayzel to get back. Especially if your friends are on the verge of being dead.

I mean if they just wait there and are preparing for the fight, it kind of echos old warfare where you stood in a line and waited for someone to shoot at you and then shot back.

Impel Down
July 28, 2007, 11:39 AM
Well, maybe they'll move to a seperate room, as a plan, and kick his ass there. Either way, they really should, and hopefully will, fight and whoop Szayel.

Splat
July 28, 2007, 11:57 AM
Well, maybe they'll move to a seperate room, as a plan, and kick his ass there. Either way, they really should, and hopefully will, fight and whoop Szayel.

I would love to see them beat szayel, but ishida is far too smart to hang around in that room, and almost certainly realises that chad and rukia are on the verge of death. His "quincy pride" may make him hang around to finish the fight, but him and renji would definitely have to move to have a chance.

lilkwarrior
July 28, 2007, 12:29 PM
I think a good way to introduce the Szayel fight again is right when Ishida & Renji find a way out or while they are getting out, Szayel reappears.... About that room, I don't remember but, isn't Szayel powers sealed also in that room with some extent? I'm guessing no, but I need somebody to confirm that or assist explaining further.

This chapter is interesting, but I wonder is Rukia really alive still? IF she is, there better be some kind of explanation... If she is alive she probably is "stubborn" to die like Ichigo was against Kenpachi & his first encounter with Byakuya. Or have been sleeping for heck of a long time...:blink

Impel Down
July 28, 2007, 02:53 PM
She was stabbed by Grimmjow before and lived, I'm sure she can live through this. And Chad is also probably alive, since his wounds were even less severe.

And you're right, Szayel only affected that one room, although it was a huge room. Hopefully his new clothes will show his tattoo.

Travis
July 28, 2007, 04:01 PM
I just thought of something to do with this chapter. Now that we know if a hollow bites another that their powers stay the same, what happens if a non hollows tears through another hollow?

I mean Yami got his arm chopped off. Sayzel got the hell burnt out of him or whatever that was. Grimmjow got his arm cut off awhile back.

Would their powers be stopped from growing since they've been damaged in a similar way? Maybe not since it says hollow eats a piece of another hollow.

If you think about it, you also have to be significantly more powerful than your opponent in this system. Because if you're even close to the same speed or power, you can both bite each other and then both your powers are stuck.

lilkwarrior
July 28, 2007, 06:56 PM
With this new information, Now it's understandable why the Vasto Lorde is more powerful than a captain in ways; the Vasto Lorde are practically undefeated hollows that never had a serious injury for their hunt for power... This chapter practically tells you how Vastolorde are made, unless theirs another requirement...

Impel Down
July 28, 2007, 09:38 PM
I was thinking that maybe the number of hollows accumulated might effect the power level of the Menos, but that's a story of another day.

So, at this point, it seems that Sosuke didn't experiment on the menos he made arrancar, at least not the first ones. And since these menos (sans Grimmjow) were the first Numeros, does that make Girmmjow the earliest member of the Espada, or did Sosuke already have Yammy and Ulquiorra there as his close followers.

Kaemon
July 29, 2007, 01:02 AM
I just thought of something to do with this chapter. Now that we know if a hollow bites another that their powers stay the same, what happens if a non hollows tears through another hollow?

I mean Yami got his arm chopped off. Sayzel got the hell burnt out of him or whatever that was. Grimmjow got his arm cut off awhile back.

I think it would have to be another hollow actually eating and taking in and integrating part of the body for it to work... not just simply getting damaged, that would be near absurd if they couldn't get a injury.


Also, wow, the last little bit of this chapter really made a impact, mainly Grimmjow's eye in that last panel on the second to last page. In my opinion it looks like he was full of regret and rather sad or something like that... this is probably something that has been said before too many times though. Hah.

Impel Down
July 29, 2007, 11:26 AM
Well, and they were already arrancar, so they can't really level up at that point.

And I just can't see the emotions people are describing with Grimmjow's eyes in the last part of the chapter. Seems to be more like just general anger at Ichigo for his persistence.

Travis
July 29, 2007, 12:20 PM
He just kind of looks maybe relaxed or he's come to a realization that he's about to lose or something else. From the last image of his one eye.

Impel Down
July 29, 2007, 02:48 PM
To be, it's not relaxed, there's actually more stress in it, like more anger. Although I can understand if it was relaxation or guilt, but I just don't see it, and anger is more like Grimmjow's bread and butter.

Suzumushi
July 29, 2007, 03:43 PM
To be, it's not relaxed, there's actually more stress in it, like more anger. Although I can understand if it was relaxation or guilt, but I just don't see it, and anger is more like Grimmjow's bread and butter.

Don't you think his expression is too soft? He definitely looks like someone who's facing the inevitable, a mixture of surprise and sadness. I think he has given in. He doesn't even try to dodge the blow. Ichigo just countered his most powerful attack. Someone who wants to become "King" and believes he's capable enough should be quite disenchanted by this. It suddenly comes to him that his dreams aren't going to come true, just as his Fraccion couldn't achieve their goals. Back then, he called them cowards, unaware of their tragedy, but now, he gets to know the feeling all by himself. There's nothing as sad as as the moment when you realize that there is a physical limit that can't be surpassed no matter how great the effort.

Shake n' Bake
July 29, 2007, 04:07 PM
Ichigo might use a getsuga tenshou on grimmjow, or we will see a new attack suddenly awakened by ichigo's mask ('cause it's kinda boring seeing ichigo use Getsuga all the time).

Impel Down
July 29, 2007, 04:25 PM
Don't you think his expression is too soft? He definitely looks like someone who's facing the inevitable, a mixture of surprise and sadness. I think he has given in. He doesn't even try to dodge the blow. Ichigo just countered his most powerful attack. Someone who wants to become "King" and believes he's capable enough should be quite disenchanted by this. It suddenly comes to him that his dreams aren't going to come true, just as his Fraccion couldn't achieve their goals. Back then, he called them cowards, unaware of their tragedy, but now, he gets to know the feeling all by himself. There's nothing as sad as as the moment when you realize that there is a physical limit that can't be surpassed no matter how great the effort.

I think it was stressful emotions behind it, but it was also an angry surrender kind of expression. I agree that "facing the inevitable" was behind it, but also the anger that "this punk" is the one to do it, and I haven't been the strongest all along.

itachi2510
July 29, 2007, 08:23 PM
i think ichigo someday will learn a new attack, and this attack will be what will make he be at ulquiorra's level, just because in the way ichigo is now he doesnt have any chance to beat ulquiorra

Impel Down
July 29, 2007, 09:19 PM
Maybe with some more Vaizard training, he can use some ceros and whatnot, and Hiyori seemed to be able to do some crazy slam of reiatsu, so there's still some moves he could learn, seems like.

000
July 30, 2007, 01:36 AM
Well, he does not really need Cero as he has that crazy Black Getsuga attak what does pretty much the same and with equal power. Gran Rey Cero, on other hand... No, still not need.
Thing he really needs is Instantenious Regeneration his Hollow form shown. Cuz Ichigo sure likes to get trashed in combat...

Impel Down
July 30, 2007, 07:53 AM
He could probably use regeneration, that's true. But, still having ceros and balas would make him more versatile in battle too, which he could use.

Codejunky
July 30, 2007, 09:54 AM
Just something small, but after got messed up from Grimmjaw's first attack in this chapter, Ichigo stopped for a bit, and his eyes turned back to normal, not the hollow black and yellow eyes.

Impel Down
July 30, 2007, 10:07 AM
So then maybe he reverted back so he wouldn't be strong enough to kill him, just defeat him? That's interesting, but it shows that Ichigo needs to stop punking out.

earthforge
July 30, 2007, 10:43 AM
Actually, for the last two chapters, parts of his mask have been falling off. When it first started to happen in 283, Ichigo freaked. He gave up until Inoue cheered him on, and went for the kill and also pulled himself together to hold the mask. The reversion of his eyes are just more illustration of the process. Notice that his right eye still is black. Remember in manga chapter 216 that when hollow powers depart, they "depart" through the right eye. So Ichigo was only fighting on the reserve of his strength. Most likely after this fight, Ichigo is going to collapse from injuries and the stress of holding the mask for a longer time. Grimmjow, no questions asked, is definitely dead (shut up about Grimmjow being a good guy fangirls and fanboys! He's not that stupid to try and betray Aizen on the brink of death.)

Prediction:

Transition to Renji and Ishida. It is obvious, but we need to see them own Szeayapollo. Ichigo won against an espada through a long fight (all in all, brute strength. Rukia won against an espada through suprise. She hit his weak spot and used Kaien's memory of her just giving up if she was "dead". Now Renji and Ishida will probably come up with a plan, because that's what they are good for. Maybe if Ishida shoots the device that is holding Renji's bankai.

The time is also ripe for another Hueco Mundo development. Maybe after Ichigo falls down, Ulqiourra gets out of the box.

So at the beginning, it is Ichigo falling down, and at the end it is some update on Ishida. But then again, I don't think Kubo will finish Ishida since he wasted so much time with them earlier.

Lord Rae
July 30, 2007, 10:50 AM
I'm at work so I don't have a chance to read everything posted.... however now that we see Grimmjows best attack and how it works it makes sense why he was kicked out of the espada when he lost his arm. He essentially lost half his greatest attack potential while missing that arm. I was wondering about that because he didn't seem to have that much different while in his released state. I was confused about that for a few chapters... ie if his released state was all he could do he wouldn't be that much less effective with only one arm.

But now it all makes sense.

Impel Down
July 30, 2007, 12:23 PM
I think Ulquiorra just said that having your arm removed was a sign of not being an Espada anymore, since the same was/would have been true for Yammy. But, still all Ichigo did, really, was dodge his giant attack, not break it.

akatsuki27
July 30, 2007, 12:46 PM
he actually said yammi wouldve been kicked out if he had lost his arm....having any kind of defect means youre gone

Impel Down
July 30, 2007, 01:50 PM
Yet Noitora is missing an eye, and he's out, and Jarguy can't go into the light. Those are both defects, yet they both still are in the Espada.

akatsuki27
July 30, 2007, 03:49 PM
noitora couldve been missing eye before he became an espada, you dont know that he lost it afterwards (plus if he is the strongest espada as he said, there'd be no reason to kick him out, unless it was major damage)...also, Jarguy, as you call him, can go into the light...he doesnt do it so that whatever form of the many hollows or humans he has eaten doesnt disappear...if he stays in the dark he can assume any of their forms....but saying he cant go into the light is false because he can...thats not a defect
[hr]
and i forgot to mention, if im not mistaken, theres an old man looking espada that might be missing an eye...if im wrong then im wrong, i have to back and make sure but i think he is

Ukun
July 30, 2007, 05:48 PM
If Noitora did in fact loose his eye to another Hollow, then wouldn't that mean his is unable to progress into a Vastolord (speaking as if he isn't one already)? That may be why he resents all the other Espada. He could've been on the brink of evolving into a Vastolord, but due to his injury, becam unable to do so. Makes sense to me.

Lord Rae
July 30, 2007, 06:53 PM
I think Ulquiorra just said that having your arm removed was a sign of not being an Espada anymore, since the same was/would have been true for Yammy. But, still all Ichigo did, really, was dodge his giant attack, not break it.

Do you not pay attention to anything? His sword tore through one of the pillars/blades whatever TWICE in this chapter alone... didn't you notice both times the sword going through the white area? They showed a close up both times... the first time even showing one missing after Ichigo shattered it.

And really I think if an espada lost an eye or an arm but his destructive potential didn't go down because of it theres no reason Aizen would kick them out. We don't know Yammi's release but its likely a part of his release that he can use both arms... We definitely know thats the case with Grimm here...

lilkwarrior
July 30, 2007, 07:18 PM
I think Ulquiorra just said that having your arm removed was a sign of not being an Espada anymore, since the same was/would have been true for Yammy. But, still all Ichigo did, really, was dodge his giant attack, not break it.
I remember Ulquiorra saying that, but he said it in the lines & context that he's lucky he didn't lose his arm completely like Grimmjow's which practically got obliterated; Yami still had his and was able to luckily got it reattached and working.

The Noitorra eye "defect" is interesting, IF he does not have an eye, it had to be before he was an Espada most likely, it can probably mean he can't be a Vastolorde or what if he is a Vastolorde but THEN lost his eye. BUT I don't think he lost his eye, he may even be the remains of his Hollow Mask, or I know this is silly, wears an eyepatch to make prey interesting (Kenpachi:D )

yakuza
July 30, 2007, 08:41 PM
i think the whole mask thing breakin off is similar to the whole sword breaking thing. think back to Ikkaku still being able to use bankai even though his released sword had been broken.

as far as Noitora goes we really don't know anything about him. If he's resentful it has to be about his place in the espada not about the class of menos he is. plus he may still have an eye. im sure at one time we all thought Zaraki only had one eye but look how that turned out.

Ukun
July 30, 2007, 11:41 PM
No no no, that's not what I mean regarding Noitora's resentment. I was talking about him resenting all of the high espada because they are probably already of vastorlord status while he, who was so close to ascending, is still an adjuchas. Of course, this is still me standing by my opinion that he is either Treize(3rd) or Duos (or w/e 2nd is in spanish).

Impel Down
July 31, 2007, 07:35 AM
Do you not pay attention to anything? His sword tore through one of the pillars/blades whatever TWICE in this chapter alone... didn't you notice both times the sword going through the white area? They showed a close up both times... the first time even showing one missing after Ichigo shattered it.



I must not have, no. I was pretty such he just blocked and dodged. Sorry.

And if everyone's saying that Ulquiorra could heal because he was Vasto Lorde and Noitora can't because he's Adjustas is being kinda silly. It's obvious that Noitora's power level is extremely high, probably that of a Vasto Lorde. And Yammy said he wished his arm could regenerate like Ulquiorra's eyeball, so maybe it's just something special about his eye.

patrick_tambu
July 31, 2007, 03:25 PM
I really like this fight between Grimm and Jchigo and i can see it as an important "crossroad"(sorry, just can't explain ia better way!) for our characters....
But, since Ichigo's training is not complete yet and there are many other ppl in HM, i'd prefere this fight to be a little bit shorter, at least Tite could've told us more about Renji and Ishida(still waiting to fight) and those female arrancar watching the fight.
The hell! I hope Ichigo's gonna improve much more than this in order to fight next opponent, otherwise we're going to have something like a 10/12 chap each fight!!!!

Impel Down
July 31, 2007, 04:15 PM
Well, with all they did with Noitora, Halibel, and Stark, it's probably foreshadowing to them being major Espada. They did all sit next to each other at the Espada table, after all. And I do agree that this was an important place for character growth with Ichigo, because he's been able to come to (pretty much) full terms with his emotions and instincts.

I agree that the fight was kinda long, but it was only so they could show other characters, like the sudden most popular Espada, Halibel. I imagine they'll have Red&White next, but probably not much more with Halibel, unless they, like, do all the Espada.

000
July 31, 2007, 10:17 PM
It really depends on her position. If she is indeed from the top 3, then there will be no her fight in this arc. But if she is not, then she is in danger...

And this fight was not that long. It only seems that because of flashbacks, wich are really important to our understanding of Menos life and Grimm character.

Impel Down
August 01, 2007, 07:24 AM
Well, not only the flashbacks, but it also kept going to Inoue and Nell, speeches, and Halibel & Co.

And even if she wasn't in the top three, it's not like anyone is really in any position to be fighting her. Ichigo will be wasted after he beats Grimmjow, Chad and Rukia are out, and Red&White have Szayel to take care of.

000
August 01, 2007, 07:56 AM
And even if she wasn't in the top three, it's not like anyone is really in any position to be fighting her. Ichigo will be wasted after he beats Grimmjow, Chad and Rukia are out, and Red&White have Szayel to take care of.Well, Orihime and Nell? ^_^

They still need to get out of HM. I somehow doubt it would go without any troubles.

itachi2510
August 01, 2007, 08:25 PM
i really wanna see the resume of the battle between renji/ishida vs apollo!