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destinator
October 05, 2007, 12:47 PM
The latest chapter just came out. If you don't have it already be sure to grab it HERE (http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19382).

So whats going to happen next week. Will we see an epic clash of 2 titans? Be sure to predict away but please no spamming and flaming.

hitokugutsu
October 05, 2007, 01:09 PM
Hmm Jiraya seems quite relaxed while staring at Pain. My prediction: Jiraya will LIVE. On top of that he will kick Pains butt (well at least this body)

zidane
October 05, 2007, 01:23 PM
agreed!

this body of Pain will lose against Jiraiya...

but Pain will come back and fight again...BUT next time Naruto is along with Jiraiya...on their training journey...

it would be just to obvious by kishimoto...he gave us so many clues about Jiraiyas death...too many...

bigtymer32
October 05, 2007, 02:29 PM
pein and jiraiya fight and jiraiya escapes.then sasuke and itachi finally get to discuss everything and tobi reveals himself.

zidane
October 05, 2007, 03:04 PM
and all that in just one tiny chapter?

i don´t think so^^

or was it your prediction for the next few chapters...?

Uchiha Slayer
October 05, 2007, 03:07 PM
I predict Jiraya gets owned for a bit next chapter...There will be more talking about the past between Jiraya, Pain, and Konan.

Or/and

The converstation might lead into how Pain and Madara link up...Maybe also Sasuke and Itachi might finally meet in at the hide out.

bean
October 05, 2007, 03:17 PM
well, since kishi has been all about how the new generation is taking over the last....I fear for jiraiya...hopefully kishi starts showing that even though the young are taking over the old, the old still should be feared.

Slippers
October 05, 2007, 03:28 PM
I wanna see some action
I think that Jiraiya will get beat up by pain pretty badly.
Then it'll probably go over to either Naruto and the konoha team, or to Sasuke

THETRUTH.com
October 05, 2007, 03:30 PM
well, since kishi has been all about how the new generation is taking over the last....I fear for jiraiya...hopefully kishi starts showing that even though the young are taking over the old, the old still should be feared.

Yeah think back on what Shikaku (shika's father) said after he beat his son that he wasnt ready to protect the king yet even after he took out an Akatsuki member. I dont think it is time for Naruto generation to take over yet, Naruto just learned his first nature manipilation.

Littlewig
October 05, 2007, 05:47 PM
I predict the when this fight is all said and done, Pain takes over Jiraiya's body.

Now that would be interesting, Pain-Jiraiya!

Edit - The reason why I predict is because we need to see the Rissengan use it's full potential. It will be pretty weak if we don't get to see it most impressive ability, taking over someone's body. Jiraiya seems like the best candidate to show off this doujustu's full power.

Alterno
October 05, 2007, 06:03 PM
I think that Nagato and Konan are going to destroy Jiraiya, at least that Jiraiya. What I mean with that Jiraiya?... I think that Jiraiya is using a special bushin and that he already ran from the scene disgused as that shinobi, these are my reasons:

Jiraiya has something important to do with Naruto and so far he is the only one that is close to know what Minato wanted to do by sealing the Kyuubi in Naruto as he did.
Jiraiya said: To be honest interrogation is not my strenght. I'll have to keep you in here for the time being. (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/370/06/)
When Jiraiya comes out from the frog, he tells his frog: Find Ibiki he'll know how to handle that guy. (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/371/08/)
Tsunade already bet on Jiraiya's dead, whit her luck everything will be fine.The true is that Jiraiya is trying to find information about Akatsuki, his leader and the rain village. Whatever he finds out is worthless for Konoha if he dies. The next chapter is going to be more flashback or Nagato and Konan destroying that bunshin.

Mendes
October 05, 2007, 06:21 PM
I dont think the Jiraya in front of Konan and Pein is a bushin of any kind. Remember Pein noticed Jiraya's presence as soon as he step foot inside 'his' village and Konan has a powerful tracking jutsu. Its very unlikely that they are facing their former sensei without having sure he's the real one.

That said, I think the fight will actually start with some interruptions in the middle, for some informative chat supported with flashbacks of Konan Yahiko and Nagato's childhood after Jiraya left them

Karma
October 05, 2007, 06:53 PM
I think its a Bunshin of Jiraiya.. and even if its JIraiya standing in front of pain. it going to be a battle to wear Jiraiya is hurt badly..

Yondaime Uzumaki
October 05, 2007, 07:21 PM
I dont think the Jiraya in front of Konan and Pein is a bushin of any kind. Remember Pein noticed Jiraya's presence as soon as he step foot inside 'his' village and Konan has a powerful tracking jutsu. Its very unlikely that they are facing their former sensei without having sure he's the real one.

That said, I think the fight will actually start with some interruptions in the middle, for some informative chat supported with flashbacks of Konan Yahiko and Nagato's childhood after Jiraya left them

While it is true that Pein noticed Jiraya's presence, he has no idea what happened inside of the toad. Not to mention the fact that Pein stopped the rain, so he wouldn't know anything that happened after he stopped the rain. The fact that Jiraya told the toad to return to Ibiki with the shinobi shows that something is missing. There is no possible way that that weakling shinobi could possibly get out of that toad by himself. It even has a picture of the toad going back under water. I'm sure that the shinobi that Konan saw was not who she thought he was.

lordHokage
October 05, 2007, 07:40 PM
I think that Nagato and Konan are going to destroy Jiraiya, at least that Jiraiya. What I mean with that Jiraiya?... I think that Jiraiya is using a special bushin and that he already ran from the scene disgused as that shinobi, these are my reasons:

Jiraiya has something important to do with Naruto and so far he is the only one that is close to know what Minato wanted to do by sealing the Kyuubi in Naruto as he did.
Jiraiya said: To be honest interrogation is not my strenght. I'll have to keep you in here for the time being. (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/370/06/)
When Jiraiya comes out from the frog, he tells his frog: Find Ibiki he'll know how to handle that guy. (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/371/08/)
Tsunade already bet on Jiraiya's dead, whit her luck everything will be fine.The true is that Jiraiya is trying to find information about Akatsuki, his leader and the rain village. Whatever he finds out is worthless for Konoha if he dies. The next chapter is going to be more flashback or Nagato and Konan destroying that bunshin.

Alterno, I completely agree with you. :)

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/372/02/ and http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/372/03/. The Rain ninja that shouted out was actually Pervy Sage’s clone. His plans were set in motion when Konan said leave now. I predict Nagato and Konan will interrogate the Rain ninja. :blink

hashymika
October 05, 2007, 08:01 PM
wow, so in a sense, jiraiya bred his (perhaps most powerful) enemies
and if rinnegan was the most powerful dojutsu, why would pain be bossed around by a sharingan guy

well, i predict we'll see it (rinnegan) in action next week :)

Alterno
October 05, 2007, 08:53 PM
wow, so in a sense, jiraiya bred his (perhaps most powerful) enemies
and if rinnegan was the most powerful dojutsu, why would pain be bossed around by a sharingan guy

well, i predict we'll see it (rinnegan) in action next week :)

Well having the Rinnengan, Sharingan and or Byakuugan doesn't make you stronger than another Shinobi, but is clearly a good weapon. For example Rock Lee defeated Sasuke and he had the advantage or being able to see the movements of Rock lee with his two tomoe Sharingan.

gcd
October 05, 2007, 09:07 PM
I think that Nagato and Konan are going to destroy Jiraiya, at least that Jiraiya. What I mean with that Jiraiya?... I think that Jiraiya is using a special bushin and that he already ran from the scene disgused as that shinobi, these are my reasons:

Jiraiya has something important to do with Naruto and so far he is the only one that is close to know what Minato wanted to do by sealing the Kyuubi in Naruto as he did.
Jiraiya said: To be honest interrogation is not my strenght. I'll have to keep you in here for the time being. (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/370/06/)
When Jiraiya comes out from the frog, he tells his frog: Find Ibiki he'll know how to handle that guy. (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/371/08/)
Tsunade already bet on Jiraiya's dead, whit her luck everything will be fine.The true is that Jiraiya is trying to find information about Akatsuki, his leader and the rain village. Whatever he finds out is worthless for Konoha if he dies. The next chapter is going to be more flashback or Nagato and Konan destroying that bunshin.








4 - hehe, everytime tsunade won something ( lotery ), one tragedy happens, maybe this time she won.


Sorry about my english.

ITACHIWIFE
October 05, 2007, 11:03 PM
4 - hehe, everytime tsunade won something ( lotery ), one tragedy happens, maybe this time she won.


Sorry about my english.
:D YOU GOT THAT RIGHT

Zeus-Tails
October 05, 2007, 11:19 PM
I also believe it's a bunshin. I mean the real Jiraiya is the rain nin. I mean it was shown that the rain nin told the toad to take the guy inside back to Ibiki. Why would the true Rain Nin tell the toad that? Furthermore, how come we didn't see the actual Jiraiya step out of the toad if he wasn't the Rain Nin?

Also, it's funny that Konan is still getting whipped by a bunshin lol

akatsuki27
October 05, 2007, 11:21 PM
next week we'll see pein do a jutsu and jiraiya barely dodges it, having to let go of konan with his hair....then he'll be like "oh crap! this guy is serious about coming after me" then he's gunna jet outta there faster than konan got beat

if he knows what's good for him that is...

The Noobslayer
October 06, 2007, 12:20 AM
I also believe it's a bunshin. I mean the real Jiraiya is the rain nin. I mean it was shown that the rain nin told the toad to take the guy inside back to Ibiki. Why would the true Rain Nin tell the toad that? Furthermore, how come we didn't see the actual Jiraiya step out of the toad if he wasn't the Rain Nin?

Also, it's funny that Konan is still getting whipped by a bunshin lol


Exactly.

But I also fear after it is "revealed" to be a bunshin, and we are all exicted, Pein will turn around and say "we beat your Bunshin once again, Jiraiya-sensei" to a cornered/captured Jiraiya (either as the rain nin or himself).

Edit: Hopefully J-man, as the rain nin, wont run into Pein after Konan told him to leave. pein will either discover who he really is oon the spot (for a bunshin vs. Konan and a ero-sensei vs. Pein battle at the same time) or he will be obligated as a "rain nin" to go back with Pein to the fight.

kong1ming2
October 06, 2007, 12:40 AM
I think the reason for the formation of Akatsuki by Pain and Nagato was due to the death of the other friend, Yahiko. More would be told on the death, and soon, the Bunshin of Jiraiya would be defeated as Jiraiya escape with the information he had gotten via his own Bunshin.

Seta Soujirou
October 06, 2007, 01:17 AM
i can't imagine Pain losing his first fight that we're witnessing in naruto regardless of the opponent...at the very least a draw with jiraiya seriously wounded

brolly43
October 06, 2007, 01:22 AM
Is it me or does Yahiko look a lot like an Juugo? Maybe someone else already pointed that out. Anyways I think that there is going to be a lot more talking while they fight. And no i don't think that Jiraiya ran away and is fighting with a bunshin. I also don't think Jiraiya will die yet. He still has a lot to do with naruto since he is the only one that can finish Naruto's training.

macherie
October 06, 2007, 01:39 AM
i can't imagine Pain losing his first fight that we're witnessing in naruto regardless of the opponent...at the very least a draw with jiraiya seriously wounded

Yeah i don't think Pain will 'lose' but it won't be very much of a match, i think they'll have a little fight but Jiraiya will soon leave, in order to not die. Either that or someone may intervene, perhaps Tsunade may have sent out ANBU to buy time for Jiraiya to escape, i have no idea XD


Is it me or does Yahiko look a lot like an Juugo? Maybe someone else already pointed that out. Anyways I think that there is going to be a lot more talking while they fight. And no i don't think that Jiraiya ran away and is fighting with a bunshin. I also don't think Jiraiya will die yet. He still has a lot to do with naruto since he is the only one that can finish Naruto's training.

Nup, you're not the only one, trust me.. there are many of oyu that thnk so, myself included. Although none of us have the proper evidence to support why he would chang ehis name to Juugo and then run away from Nagato and Konan, which he may have - a possibility but it doesnt seem like it at the moment.
I agree with you when you say that it isn't a bunshin, it would sort of be a waste, especially when he said he was leaving and it'd be dangerous to Tsunade, and the way they talked about death i'd highly doubt it's a bunshin. I really hope he doesn't die, my thoughts on this is the fact that he's only on reconnaisance and shouldn't die ^^.

heeros_blood
October 06, 2007, 04:36 AM
I think that Nagato and Konan are going to destroy Jiraiya, at least that Jiraiya. What I mean with that Jiraiya?... I think that Jiraiya is using a special bushin and that he already ran from the scene disgused as that shinobi, these are my reasons:

Jiraiya has something important to do with Naruto and so far he is the only one that is close to know what Minato wanted to do by sealing the Kyuubi in Naruto as he did.
Jiraiya said: To be honest interrogation is not my strenght. I'll have to keep you in here for the time being. (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/370/06/)
When Jiraiya comes out from the frog, he tells his frog: Find Ibiki he'll know how to handle that guy. (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/371/08/)
Tsunade already bet on Jiraiya's dead, whit her luck everything will be fine.The true is that Jiraiya is trying to find information about Akatsuki, his leader and the rain village. Whatever he finds out is worthless for Konoha if he dies. The next chapter is going to be more flashback or Nagato and Konan destroying that bunshin.

It's possible.. just like the old days, during their training..

Paradoxicon
October 06, 2007, 04:49 AM
Exactly.

But I also fear after it is "revealed" to be a bunshin, and we are all exicted, Pein will turn around and say "we beat your Bunshin once again, Jiraiya-sensei" to a cornered/captured Jiraiya (either as the rain nin or himself).

Edit: Hopefully J-man, as the rain nin, wont run into Pein after Konan told him to leave. pein will either discover who he really is oon the spot (for a bunshin vs. Konan and a ero-sensei vs. Pein battle at the same time) or he will be obligated as a "rain nin" to go back with Pein to the fight.

! I like the first part, but how can Jiraya be the rain nin when the rain nin was the one who called Konan "God's messenger", a term Jiraya hasn't heard before?

purekorea
October 06, 2007, 05:20 AM
! I like the first part, but how can Jiraya be the rain nin when the rain nin was the one who called Konan "God's messenger", a term Jiraya hasn't heard before?

May be the rain nin did spit out something about "god" and "god's messenger":blink in the pervy's investigation :tem my suggestion :p , or jiraiya actually is still sticking with the shadow
If it's turn out that pein noes it is a bunshin and jiraiya still have to fight then my prediction is jiraiya might not be dead since he still has respect from pein ( remember he call jiraiya "sensei" ). Pein did say he took out the body to kill but he could have mercy in the last minute and release jiraiya ( buddha's stuff not to kill =)) ) just like hanzou did before :blink, suggesting jiraiya should be taken the name of " God of the three sannin" or sumthing like that :P cuz of his second survival in the rain country :eyeroll . My opinion could be wrong since I can't remember that orochimaru say "sensei" to Sarutobi in their fight :s

Rinnegan
October 06, 2007, 07:05 AM
! I like the first part, but how can Jiraya be the rain nin when the rain nin was the one who called Konan "God's messenger", a term Jiraya hasn't heard before?

Jiraya is not a dumb person. He did already know that the villagers named Pein as "God", so when he saw Konan he figured out (pretty damn fast too!) what her nickname amongst the underlings would be.


An angel (Lat. angelus, pl. angeli) is a supernatural being found in many religions. In Christianity, Islam, Judaism, and Zoroastrianism, angels, as attendants or guardians to man, typically act as messengers from God.

Wow, Jiraya does indeed research on other subjects than Women sometimes!

...


My opinion could be wrong since I can't remember that orochimaru say "sensei" to Sarutobi in their fight

I haven't read that part in the Manga, but in the Animé you hear Orochimaru clearly say "Sarutobi-sensei". Must have been in the manga too, I'm sure.

sashpimp
October 06, 2007, 07:40 AM
first off its the real jiraiya fighting! secondly ibiki is the interrogator and heas gonna do his job on the rain nin, thirdy yes pein derives from pain which is the foundation of yahiko, nagato, konan, which later grew into akatsuki.

Also i think the hermit of the 6 path can transfer his soul to use another body but only a specific body! notice how nagato has none of those wires on him and all his extra bodies do. those wires are either necessary to keep the body alive or for the migration of the soul.

konan was easily put down by jiraiya and she is akatsuki, also as soon as pein notices him the first thing he said was that by the chakra level hes considered dangerous, if hes dangerous for akatsuki then yeah i think jiraiya can hold his own.

The key will get to naruto when he will start fighting madara, exacly when he needs it, ( the best chapters in the series are coming up).

Last but not least i cant wait to see jiraiya using that big scroll on his back for other perpuses then signing people in, i cant wait to see it in action!!!

Alterno
October 06, 2007, 07:43 AM
first off its the real jiraiya fighting! secondly ibiki is the interrogator and heas gonna do his job on the rain nin, thirdy yes pein derives from pain which is the foundation of yahiko, nagato, konan, which later grew into akatsuki.


OMG, Masashi Kishimoto registered in this place?, cool.


! I like the first part, but how can Jiraya be the rain nin when the rain nin was the one who called Konan "God's messenger", a term Jiraya hasn't heard before?

Well, the rain nin was talking about a god and his proxy. If you see someone with the same of an angel is logic to say god's messanger, Jiraiya is an old man, he might be perv but don't forget that he is the man who trained a genious.


i can't imagine Pain losing his first fight that we're witnessing in naruto regardless of the opponent...at the very least a draw with jiraiya seriously wounded

Who knows, maybe he'll lose the fight or maybe not. He still can choose from five bodies. I doubt that we have seen the stronger body of Nagato, maybe he is keeping his stronger body and/or his original body for the end. I think he is like Hades in Saint Seiya, he keeps his real body in a very secure place.


I think the reason for the formation of Akatsuki by Pain and Nagato was due to the death of the other friend, Yahiko. More would be told on the death, and soon, the Bunshin of Jiraiya would be defeated as Jiraiya escape with the information he had gotten via his own Bunshin.

I think that Juugo is Yahiko, maybe Orochimaru came back after then and kinnapped Yahiko for his secret purposes. The change in Nagato and Konan's attitude doesn't need to be based on the death of Yahiko, just in his loss. Maybe they became like that because they couldn't stop Orochimaru from kinadpping Yahiko.


I also believe it's a bunshin. I mean the real Jiraiya is the rain nin. I mean it was shown that the rain nin told the toad to take the guy inside back to Ibiki. Why would the true Rain Nin tell the toad that? Furthermore, how come we didn't see the actual Jiraiya step out of the toad if he wasn't the Rain Nin?

Also, it's funny that Konan is still getting whipped by a bunshin lol

Well this can be explained easily, because he don't wanted to be noticed. However I still think that the are fighting a special kind of bunshin, maybe a toad related technique.


4 - hehe, everytime tsunade won something ( lotery ), one tragedy happens, maybe this time she won.


Sorry about my english.

Your english is fine, at least better than mine for sure. :p

sashpimp
October 06, 2007, 07:53 AM
OMG, Masashi Kishimoto registered in this place?, cool.



I think that Juugo is Yahiko, maybe Orochimaru came back after then and kinnapped Yahiko for his secret purposes. The change in Nagato and Konan's attitude doesn't need to be based on the death of Yahiko, just in his loss. Maybe they became like that because they couldn't stop Orochimaru from kinadpping Yahiko.





Your english is fine, at least better than mine for sure. :p

Lol im not kishi but i can use my logic very effectively, simply put all thing coincide therefore i can make an accurate statement

as for the juugo/yahiko theory it this is really stupid, the age difference and beliefs are completely different. Yahiko loves to fight while juugo hates to fight and dislikes violence when hes not in his curse seal therefor using the little bit of logic that you inherit from your parents :) you can answer that question yourself.

ps.. its the internet who cares about spelling!!

macherie
October 06, 2007, 08:01 AM
Lol im not kishi but i can use my logic very effectively, simply put all thing coincide therefore i can make an accurate statement

as for the juugo/yahiko theory it this is really stupid, the age difference and beliefs are completely different. Yahiko loves to fight while juugo hates to fight and dislikes violence when hes not in his curse seal therefor using the little bit of logic that you inherit from your parents :) you can answer that question yourself.

ps.. its the internet who cares about spelling!!

Looking at it logically that would seem like the right path to take. But in that same sense, we also know that things can traumatize us, especially when we're young and we're not sure what may have happened to Yahiko after Jiraiya left, as stated in this chapter "You have no idea what happened to us after you left Jiraiya sensei". For all we know, Yahiko could've been in a really compromising situation that forever changed his life, which turned his love for fighting into a hate, and his pride into cowardice.
Personally i'm not a fan of the Yahiko=Juugo theory, but i am persuaded by the striking resemblance between the two and the possibility that exists there ^^;

Rinnegan
October 06, 2007, 08:33 AM
I belived in it first, but I no longer think Juugo is Yahiko. Why? In chapter 373 we see Yahiko do a suiton, Konan with origami shuriken and Nagato with a fuuton.
By looking at Juugo we could all say he isn't really a water type fighter. And two water types in the same three man cell (Suigetsu + Juugo/Yahiko) Would just be incredibly boring don't you think?

Yahiko died, and his death is related to Konan and Nagato's stone cold faces. Hmph.

dandy65
October 06, 2007, 08:36 AM
I think that Juugo is Yahiko, maybe Orochimaru came back after then and kinnapped Yahiko for his secret purposes. The change in Nagato and Konan's attitude doesn't need to be based on the death of Yahiko, just in his loss. Maybe they became like that because they couldn't stop Orochimaru from kinadpping Yahiko.


I can agree with you on NaruXHina, but, this I can only say : WRONG

Didn't you forget? Juugo came to Orochimaru on his own will, which is why people think he's crazy. Juugo wanted Orochimaru to fix him. And if Orochimaru could capture Yahiko, Nagato would have killed him either as a child while trying to help Yahiko, or when Orochimaru joined Akatsuki, not realizing Pain/Leader is Nagato.

jodi
October 06, 2007, 10:18 AM
I belived in it first, but I no longer think Juugo is Yahiko. Why? In chapter 373 we see Yahiko do a suiton, Konan with origami shuriken and Nagato with a fuuton.
By looking at Juugo we could all say he isn't really a water type fighter. And two water types in the same three man cell (Suigetsu + Juugo/Yahiko) Would just be incredibly boring don't you think?

Yahiko died, and his death is related to Konan and Nagato's stone cold faces. Hmph.

agreed, but i think yahiko died and pain got into his body, so yahiko would see the future that they planned so much
yahiko's body is the first one that nagato was using
and he became pain when yahiko died, because that was the most pain he got in his life

heiky0711
October 06, 2007, 10:55 AM
Not a bad chapter. But is(hopefully) going to get even better for 374. As for my prediction, the battle between jiraiya and nagato + konan commences. But i'd never thought that nagato's eyes is one of the most powerful. So if i can recalled on what jiraiya said that there are 3 most powerful dojutsu (eye technique): rinningen, sharingan and byakugan. Now it kind of make sense because at one point i thought why is nagato more powerful than itachi since itachi has sharingan and after all he claims that is the most powerful dojutsu (i think) in this naruto world of shinobi. As the battle progresses hopefully we'll get to see the team hebi & leaf on pursuing itachi and i think they are almost approaching the uchiha hideout.

Helltroll
October 06, 2007, 11:11 AM
i predict that there be a little more chitchat between ero-sennin and pein (maybe konan will leave so that they can fight alone) and right at the point before the first handseals were made they will switch to either sasuke and hebi reaching the uchiha hideout/meeting kisame or to naruto/other leaf nins that are quickly heading towards the position of hebi (but will be eventually disturbed by either hebi or something other).

Youth Explodes!
October 06, 2007, 11:42 AM
Konan is going to die trying to protect her former sensei against Pein. 100% sure.

Eldanis
October 06, 2007, 01:00 PM
I don't see the Pain vs Jiraiya fight lasting more than a chapter, 2 at the max. Kishi has just spent this entire time giving us the idea that Pein is crazy, godly in power and ability and a severe force to be reckoned with. He is gonna attack and kill Jiraiya but it will be a clone to juxtapose the last chapter of them killing his clone.

May also give us a bit of insight into the abilities of Pein's second body.

Okia
October 06, 2007, 01:23 PM
Konan is going to die trying to protect her former sensei against Pein. 100% sure.


hmm i wouldnt be so sure about that.
i dont think konan will betray pein like that.

gold349
October 06, 2007, 03:24 PM
did Jaria keep rinnegan a secret from the village when he returned?, seeing something he thought was a myth with his own eye's, could have been the reason why jaria spent time away from the village apart from chasing Oro around, he kept tabs on the three and kept getting infomation on their wareabouts because of seeing nagato with rinnegan, yes he left them once they where able to fend for them selves but was still concerned enough to aquire information on them from time to time, this could have been injunction with the security of the village.

back on topic i want to predict that jaria will give Pain as good as he gets.

come on Jaria!!

Karma
October 06, 2007, 03:30 PM
I predicted Pain wounding Jariaya and at the end before he died. Pain & Konan Asked him why sensi? why after so long you came back? Its because my former student Died Protecting the Leaf Village and he sealed the Kyuubi into is son and that Son is going to Die by my former student if i didn't step in..

lol It might not go like that still.. But i expected some thing near there.. some thing heart touching if Jiriaya died..

But i feel Konan might step in and take the last attack from pain which going to kill konan just to protect her sensi that once saved there life.

GGGG-unit!!!!!!

Black/Light
October 06, 2007, 03:51 PM
I think that Nagato and Konan are going to destroy Jiraiya, at least that Jiraiya. What I mean with that Jiraiya?... I think that Jiraiya is using a special bushin and that he already ran from the scene disgused as that shinobi, these are my reasons:

Jiraiya has something important to do with Naruto and so far he is the only one that is close to know what Minato wanted to do by sealing the Kyuubi in Naruto as he did.
Jiraiya said: To be honest interrogation is not my strenght. I'll have to keep you in here for the time being. (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/370/06/)
When Jiraiya comes out from the frog, he tells his frog: Find Ibiki he'll know how to handle that guy. (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/371/08/)
Tsunade already bet on Jiraiya's dead, whit her luck everything will be fine.The true is that Jiraiya is trying to find information about Akatsuki, his leader and the rain village. Whatever he finds out is worthless for Konoha if he dies. The next chapter is going to be more flashback or Nagato and Konan destroying that bunshin.

Same here. Something seemed really fishy in that chap. . .

segarraramon
October 06, 2007, 04:31 PM
not true. tsunade does have a nack for having bad luck, and when somting bad migth hapen she gets an advance warnig. noting bad happend when she won the lottery. they won the figth. nothign bad happend when she won in the villege she beat orochimaru.
[hr]
as to predictions i like to belive that next chapter we see or get more information on the eyes and why these eyes are considered supirior to sharingan, but why is mandara in charge of atkatsuky. there has to be a flaw. like elemental chakra stronger than one weaker that the other. what is the other and what is the relationship betwen them.

Bowserfire
October 06, 2007, 04:38 PM
Konan is going to die trying to protect her former sensei against Pein. 100% sure.
maybe. she seems like shes very hesitant to fight her former sensei. i mean, oil blast and a hair bind, common..even komohamaru or someone weak could prob dodge something like that lol, i could be wrong tho. But anyways yea, i dont think she has the willpower to morally kill her old perverted teacher. Plus i dont see Kishi would have Jiraiya fight both of them at once, thats just nuts.

lordHokage
October 06, 2007, 04:39 PM
My Second Prediction: Nagato will explain why he dislikes Pervy Sage. :blink



did Jaria keep rinnegan a secret from the village when he returned?

I agree with you. What was Pervy Sage reasons for keeping Rinnegan a secret? :blink

segarraramon
October 06, 2007, 04:46 PM
in short. orochimaru!!

Paradoxicon
October 06, 2007, 05:12 PM
in short. orochimaru!!

Orochikabuto entering the stage and Tsunade coming in to rescue Jiraya would certainly be a) unexpected and b) the most epic fight we have seen so far. :D


well, in my dreams I guess :(

borgholian
October 06, 2007, 05:29 PM
damn just too good from ksihi. and there i was sitting down thinking y the sharingan was made so undefeatable and powerful and suddenly it gets thrown down the drain by the RINNEGAN.
it just explains why itachi is taking orders from pein. I have a very strong feeling (about 80%) that nagato's history is related to oro (meaning the reason why they changed) - mebe he came and killed yahiko .
prediction - pein tells konan to back off cause hes gonna show jiraya some god-like powers, fighting scenes but then jiraya shows some real mettle forcing pein to unleash some technique to amaze him plus more flashback to nagato's story at that point. i think that jiraya isnt a bunshin and if he was he would be easily disocvered by pein (no escape for jiraya:s )

puma
October 06, 2007, 05:30 PM
I predict Jiraiya also has a forbidden jutsu and it will be revealed in his fight with Pain, but most likely not in the next chapter.

For now, its safer to predict that Ero wont die in the next chapter.

asuka
October 06, 2007, 06:45 PM
my prediction:mmm i think they won't start the battle in that chapter....its probably that there will be more flahsbacks about the rinnengan,about what happend to yahiko and why those rumors about they were death what they were expecting with it and something like that i predict jiraiya and nagato gonna talk all chapter!...then in 375 will be the battle.....oohhh and maybe akatsuki is a good organization don't u think??????? like the ninja of the rain said pein is like a god for the rain he protect the people......and about the conversation between jiraiya and the toad the bijus re created with the acumulation of bad intencions of the people maybe nagato wants to seal it to finish the war or something like that.............................jejejeje sorry about my bad english, i hope u understand it^^
[hr]
i don't think so but its still probably.....konan can't move so she can't betray nagato thats easy

RoundMidnight
October 06, 2007, 07:19 PM
The real question is if that's the rin'negan.. why does Kurenai have it too? I would have it if they never resolved what that is. We all predicted they would be related somehow but if it goes back to some all powerful guy who created ninjutsu then it gets very odd.

The Noobslayer
October 06, 2007, 08:41 PM
The real question is if that's the rin'negan.. why does Kurenai have it too? I would have it if they never resolved what that is. We all predicted they would be related somehow but if it goes back to some all powerful guy who created ninjutsu then it gets very odd.

She doesn't her eyes have a red ring, while the Rinnegan has six rings and they are all gray.

I'm still curious why Pein chose to to fight in this body specifically. He chose it after he had already measured Jiraiya's chakra, so maybe it has some advantage over Jiraiya?

macherie
October 06, 2007, 08:49 PM
I'm still curious why Pein chose to to fight in this body specifically. He chose it after he had already measured Jiraiya's chakra, so maybe it has some advantage over Jiraiya?

Yup, it seems as though he specifically chose this body to 'kill' the intruder, thus implying it must be some sort of hunter body, although i think you're right about the measuring of chakra, i'd imagine he would've found out Jiraiya's level with his rain, it therefore must have some special advantage over Jiraiya. I think we'll see a sneak peek next chapt ! =D

arslan
October 06, 2007, 09:24 PM
we might get some explanation about the rin'negan and its abilities in the next chapter. perhaps a generalization. I suppose kishi might want to save the details about rin'negan for some later time.
[hr]

Yup, it seems as though he specifically chose this body to 'kill' the intruder, thus implying it must be some sort of hunter body, although i think you're right about the measuring of chakra, i'd imagine he would've found out Jiraiya's level with his rain, it therefore must have some special advantage over Jiraiya. I think we'll see a sneak peek next chapt ! =D

I also wonder if pein/nagato has kept his original body and what might be its abilities. we might see a clash between nagato's original body and naruto since they both use wind chakra ( this is all my speculation though :))

Karma
October 07, 2007, 12:01 AM
Yup, it seems as though he specifically chose this body to 'kill' the intruder, thus implying it must be some sort of hunter body, although i think you're right about the measuring of chakra, i'd imagine he would've found out Jiraiya's level with his rain, it therefore must have some special advantage over Jiraiya. I think we'll see a sneak peek next chapt ! =D

I think so too...

Audition
October 07, 2007, 12:14 AM
Jiraiya will die ..

hehe

thats teh plan of kishi i think :D

neer
October 07, 2007, 12:37 AM
I agree with a lot of predictions here... Jiraiya cannot die so soon its just too predictable besides we still do not know of his other two pupils... the team mates of the fourth .....

macherie
October 07, 2007, 02:30 AM
Yeah on top of that i'd have to hand it to Kishi once again ^^ He tends to bring a lot of surprises to us, with the late foreshadowing of Jiraiya's death and now revealing that the Rinnegan was once possessed by the Hermit of six paths, i think Kishi knows that we are all predicting Jiraiya's death which is exactly why i hope he does the opposite =D

milmoe
October 07, 2007, 02:56 AM
i predict kishi pissing us off by having one page of jiraiya vs pain, then the rest dedicated to sasuke and itachi, or naruto and crew, or uchiha madara, just to shift our focus as he usually does.

aaaand if he wants to take it to the extreme, he'll go back to jiraiya and pain after 5 chapters and show us the end of fight. This way we won't learn too much about pain until the critical fight between pain and naruto. But since pain has so many bodies, kishi will probably give us one or two techniques to impress us.

jiraiya probably won't die. kishi is hinting too much at his death. He'll throw us off by revealing jiraiya whilst naruto is doing some deep thoughts. He'll appear in a weakened state with only one arm left. The end

Alucardxdemon
October 07, 2007, 03:30 AM
honestly this whole jiraiya thing is quite boring, I was hoping that the leader would turn out to be someone from the past in Naruto. To me it seems like kish keeps pulls new tricks out of his magical hat, but hes pulling out too many at once. Whatever happened to the black book kabuto left for the group. Enough venting on my part, but I predict a jir/pain battle start with a quick flashback from pain. Jiraiya will most likely get beaten early on but will have a trick or two up his sleeve.

hashymika
October 07, 2007, 04:06 AM
Yup, it seems as though he specifically chose this body to 'kill' the intruder, thus implying it must be some sort of hunter body, although i think you're right about the measuring of chakra, i'd imagine he would've found out Jiraiya's level with his rain, it therefore must have some special advantage over Jiraiya. I think we'll see a sneak peek next chapt ! =D

Ooh, I also noticed (if people recall) there are 6 bodies in that secret room of pein's and also his doujutsu is only possessed by the sage of 6 paths. so perhaps each body has a different purpose (path as it were), e.g. killing. But the kanji on the ends of each "bed" (pg 16-17 ch 369) doesn't seem to represent any of this (one says "6", the other looks like the character on Tobi's ring o.O - middle bed on the left)

any thoughts?

Also for the person who replied earlier to my post (i apologise for forgetting your name), Rock Lee and Sasuke were at genin levels, at the moment we know that pein as never lost a fight and possesses some crazy doujutsu - which is why i find it strange that he'd be a pawn of someone else.

macherie
October 07, 2007, 04:10 AM
Ooh, I also noticed (if people recall) there are 6 bodies in that secret room of pein's and also his doujutsu is only possessed by the sage of 6 paths. so perhaps each body has a different purpose (path as it were), e.g. killing. But the kanji on the ends of each "bed" (pg 16-17 ch 369) doesn't seem to represent any of this (one says "6", the other looks like the character on Tobi's ring o.O - middle bed on the left)

any thoughts?


Yup all those are numbers on each bed, you'd be righ tin saying that each body may possess a certain 'path' as the myth goes. I think that's what most of us are speculating at the moment =]
(For clarification of the beds)

壱 1
弐 2
参 3
四 4
五 5
六 6

Now you'll recognise 4, 5 and 6 although 1, 2 and 3 are using the traditional characters which come from a very very long time ago, during the Edo period i believe. Reason: We dont know xD

wooticus
October 07, 2007, 06:50 AM
damn just too good from ksihi. and there i was sitting down thinking y the sharingan was made so undefeatable and powerful and suddenly it gets thrown down the drain by the RINNEGAN.
it just explains why itachi is taking orders from pein. I have a very strong feeling (about 80%) that nagato's history is related to oro (meaning the reason why they changed) - mebe he came and killed yahiko .
prediction - pein tells konan to back off cause hes gonna show jiraya some god-like powers, fighting scenes but then jiraya shows some real mettle forcing pein to unleash some technique to amaze him plus more flashback to nagato's story at that point. i think that jiraya isnt a bunshin and if he was he would be easily disocvered by pein (no escape for jiraya )

well, but pain is taking orders from madara it seems...

so much for the prove that rinnegan > sharingan

kishi loves sharingan, finally it will become superior to rinnegan..

ichimatsu
October 07, 2007, 06:57 AM
we gona see the same batle as between the tird and orochimaru, or maybe a quik fight with pein wining, what ever in all case the winner is pein coz naruto gona kik his ass.

Imperium
October 07, 2007, 07:40 AM
well, all i am going to hope for predict is jiraiya and pein having one hell of a battle and when things start to get mildly interesting, kishimoto is going to do one over us and cut to sasuke and naruto :darn

oh, and i also want to see what this fabled rinnegan can do, hopefully they will show it in the next chapter, i personally think it is the ability to control bodies (living or dead). 0_0

Namikaze Minatosan
October 07, 2007, 07:46 AM
jiraya will die and pain will use his body against naruto

Naruto vs Ero-Sennin!!!!!! :o

ShadowStrike
October 07, 2007, 07:50 AM
Naruto vs Ero-Sennin!!!!!! :o

That would be very sad. And why wouldn't Pain just continue using that body that pwns Jiraiya?

Imperium
October 07, 2007, 07:58 AM
Naruto vs Ero-Sennin!!!!!! :o

Hmm.... that might work naruto surpassing his sensei, its sadly makes sense :oh


And why wouldn't Pain just continue using that body that pwns Jiraiya?

Probably to mentally disturb naruto, or just because he is a sadist....

Alterno
October 07, 2007, 09:53 AM
well, but pain is taking orders from madara it seems...

so much for the prove that rinnegan > sharingan

kishi loves sharingan, finally it will become superior to rinnegan..

Don't get me wrong, but aren't you giving everybody with the Sharingan the status of a deity?. Don't forget that the Sharingan and the Byakuugan are Kekkai Genkai (advanced bloodline limit). Even with the abilities of the Sharingan of being able to read the movements of the oponents it doesn't that you will be able to avoid them. Sasuke vs Lee is a good example. Maito gai was able to avoid the gen-jutsus of the Sharingan by not watching Itachi directly to his face. Even if Itachi can cast the gen-jutsu using a finger, it was worthless because Gai developed a technique to fight that effect of Sharingan, reading the movements of the opponents by watching his feets.

Or the Byakuugan for example, it doesn't matter if you can see the chakra points if your opponent is fast enough to avoid your attacks.

I agree that we still have to see what makes the rinnengan the stronger of the three dou-jutsus, especially since is been introduced as myth/legend, but we can't assume that becuase you are a Sharingan, Byakuugan or Rinnengan user you are unbateable. Remember that Shodaime Hokage defeated Uchiha Madara, and he just have the ability to merge his element abilties.

Audition
October 07, 2007, 03:44 PM
It will have sort of flashbacks regarding why Konan and Nagato join the

akatsuki and how Nagato killed Yashiko (just a prediction) also my wild guess is after

Jiraiya defeat the 1st body of Pain.. Pain will release Salamander Hanzou's Body..

or maybe im too farfetched -_-

GPZrag
October 07, 2007, 04:06 PM
Don't get me wrong, but aren't you giving everybody with the Sharingan the status of a deity?. Don't forget that the Sharingan and the Byakuugan are Kekkai Genkai (advanced bloodline limit). Even with the abilities of the Sharingan of being able to read the movements of the oponents it doesn't that you will be able to avoid them. Sasuke vs Lee is a good example. Maito gai was able to avoid the gen-jutsus of the Sharingan by not watching Itachi directly to his face. Even if Itachi can cast the gen-jutsu using a finger, it was worthless because Gai developed a technique to fight that effect of Sharingan, reading the movements of the opponents by watching his feets.

Or the Byakuugan for example, it doesn't matter if you can see the chakra points if your opponent is fast enough to avoid your attacks.

I agree that we still have to see what makes the rinnengan the stronger of the three dou-jutsus, especially since is been introduced as myth/legend, but we can't assume that becuase you are a Sharingan, Byakuugan or Rinnengan user you are unbateable. Remember that Shodaime Hokage defeated Uchiha Madara, and he just have the ability to merge his element abilties.

But Shodaime was the man the Ended a WAR ERA and he was also the one who created Konoha so he must had been around the top if he wasnt the top...

Tias
October 07, 2007, 05:01 PM
Well IF the rinnegan is the strongest of all of them....i wonder to what degree pein can use it, cause i still think about how it seems like he took direct orders from tobi/madara....

NastyM
October 07, 2007, 05:29 PM
Well, kishi is the master of surprise. Remember when we learned about the Bijuu and Jinchuuriki, we all thought that the rest of the manga would mainly be about finding the rest of the jinchuuriki and all that. Also maby someone in leaf was also a jinchuriiki like naruto. Then everything turned around and elementtraining kicked in. Now Pain has the most powerful dojutsu and everything seems to be about that.

My point being, the story is top class, and Jirayia...well I would be sad if he died...he's like a favorite to me, but to show the power of Pain we might have to let him go.

My prediction will be:

More talk with Pain and Ero Sennin
Fight will commence
Konan will not interfere in combat
Maby we will see more hesitating from Konan

Hockeychaoz
October 07, 2007, 06:18 PM
Hmm, interesting that with this Rinnegan, he still takes orders from Tobi with sharingan. I think the general consensus is that "Rinnegan = Supreme pwnage", but maybe not.

Btw has anyone else heard of the 3 Mangekyou Sharingan users story about each of em using one of the sharingan skills, and unlocking something or other.
Well, anyone else think that since we now have 3 eyes, (Sharingan, Rinnegan, Byakugan) that maybe we need one of each? Gooo Neji.

Mirwan
October 07, 2007, 06:21 PM
i think that Shodaime Hokage had the Byakuugan... he looks like a member of the Hyuga Clan..

QMark
October 07, 2007, 07:09 PM
Well let's take what we know from the current doujutsu and see if we can predict Rinnegan's abilities.

Sharingan - Allows unique foresight. Predicts movement and can see through most jutsus. This allows for special decomposing of the jutsu itself in order for the Sharingan holder to learn the jutsu with merely just witnessing it.

Byakugan - Also allows unique foresight. Can see all the chakra points in one's body. Can see 360 degrees around the user with a minor blind spot. Can search a certain radius in order to locate anything. All of this allows for the Byakugan user to react quickly and strike promptly.

Now for the Rinnegan to be the best of all of these doujutsu, it has to have abilities that surpass that of the Byakugan and Sharingan. So lets take what we know about it so far.

The founder of the whole ninja world had these eyes and created most modern ninjutsu. They also seem to have levels as shown when it gained another "ripple" around the pupil after Nagato killed the Chuunin.

So here are some possible abilities of these eyes.

Jutsu Composition - Allows the user to create ninjutsu in which fits a purpose. (Could be the sole reason why the eyes were viewed as Godsend. The beginning and the end. Can also be the reason why "Pein" has never lost a battle. As overpowered as this seems, it doesn't fall out of the realm of possibility were it to come with drawbacks.)

Soul Searching - Just upon one glance of a person, can gain all knowledge of the individual's jutsu. In turn he can move more efficiently to evade all jutsus and use them against his opponent. This also can explain why he uses multiple bodies. If those bodies specifically can only be used for their own jutsu. (Again, overpowered technique. But since I've been given no limit as to what the technique can be compared to the other doujutsu, anything is possible at this point. Especially since I keep in the back of my mind that he has never lost a battle.)

Jutsu Reversal - Can reverse any and all jutsus onto the caster(s). This isn't too likely though considering he wouldn't need to switch bodies in order to use a technique like this.

Sub-Abilities - (Allows use of all 5 Elements | Can see the color of chakra)

Thats all I can come up with at the moment. Feel free to add more to what his abilities could be.

Hockeychaoz
October 07, 2007, 07:20 PM
@ Qmark

How about this, building on your theory about being able to learn someone's jutsu just by looking at them. How about this?

6 bodies, 5 elements.

One body for each element, plus his original body.


Okay, right after I posted that, I found something that sorta supports the theory. When Jiriyah says that he will teach the kids Jutsu, Nagato has a look on his face that doesn't really show excitement. Maybe he already knew the jutsu? No excitement for it then. I don't know. Just trying to back the theory. Sounds kinda dumb now =p.

QMark
October 07, 2007, 07:25 PM
We already had that with Kakuzu. It wouldn't really be that much greater of an ability since I'm assuming he already knows all 5 elements. Maybe I should add that to the list of abilities?

Hockeychaoz
October 07, 2007, 07:43 PM
Rinnegan has to be less than sharingan. That's the kicker in all this.
Otherwise Pein wouldn't be taking orders from Tobi. Unless Pein is in some sort of genjutsu from Tobi. Which would explain the big change from good old Nagato into Pein. But that'd be a little too plain of a explanation.

Gah, will Thursday ever come?

The Noobslayer
October 07, 2007, 07:47 PM
Okay, right after I posted that, I found something that sorta supports the theory. When Jiriyah says that he will teach the kids Jutsu, Nagato has a look on his face that doesn't really show excitement. Maybe he already knew the jutsu? No excitement for it then. I don't know. Just trying to back the theory. Sounds kinda dumb now =p.


I think the kid is just emo as hell.

sashpimp
October 07, 2007, 07:58 PM
Don't get me wrong, but aren't you giving everybody with the Sharingan the status of a deity?. Don't forget that the Sharingan and the Byakuugan are Kekkai Genkai (advanced bloodline limit). Even with the abilities of the Sharingan of being able to read the movements of the oponents it doesn't that you will be able to avoid them. Sasuke vs Lee is a good example. Maito gai was able to avoid the gen-jutsus of the Sharingan by not watching Itachi directly to his face. Even if Itachi can cast the gen-jutsu using a finger, it was worthless because Gai developed a technique to fight that effect of Sharingan, reading the movements of the opponents by watching his feets.

Or the Byakuugan for example, it doesn't matter if you can see the chakra points if your opponent is fast enough to avoid your attacks.

I agree that we still have to see what makes the rinnengan the stronger of the three dou-jutsus, especially since is been introduced as myth/legend, but we can't assume that becuase you are a Sharingan, Byakuugan or Rinnengan user you are unbateable. Remember that Shodaime Hokage defeated Uchiha Madara, and he just have the ability to merge his element abilties.

very true i completely agree.
[hr]
About peins 6 bodies, i think they all basically have a different ability. if anyone can find out about the hermit/sage fox-like ears id like to hear it.

CheckMate
October 07, 2007, 08:17 PM
Guys, Iwanin said Rinnegan is not the strongest/greatest. It is only said that Rinnegan is one of the THREE GREAT DOUJUTSU. Nowhere he said it as the GREATEST of the three. Correct me if I am wrong.

Karma
October 07, 2007, 08:26 PM
Rinnegan has to be less than sharingan. That's the kicker in all this.
Otherwise Pein wouldn't be taking orders from Tobi. Unless Pein is in some sort of genjutsu from Tobi. Which would explain the big change from good old Nagato into Pein. But that'd be a little too plain of a explanation.

Gah, will Thursday ever come?

It don't have to be like that...

Because thus far Tobi hasn't said any thing to show that he was giving orders to Pain. he was only saying that has a leader he shouldn't come up short..

Remember there was 9 beasts... and ten people in AK.. All of them has to catch there own Bijuu.. the Nine tail become Pain target since Itachi fail to Capture it thus far.

Itachi might catch another Bijjuu by now to replace the one he was after...


Tobi went with Deidara to catch is own. since Deidara Catches Garra.

But Tobi got is own motive and so is Pain...

Pain & Tobi never fight before.. that mean its proven that Tobi isn't pain boss. its more like to say Tobi Join with pain to see what he can accomplish..

Konan even stop pain from trying to make Naruto look so extra Dangerous. Its some thing with tobi Character. he did the same thing with Diedara just to let him go kill is self..

But please everyone. It didn't written on stone that Tobi is pain Boss.

sashpimp
October 07, 2007, 08:30 PM
Jutsu Composition - Allows the user to create ninjutsu in which fits a purpose. (Could be the sole reason why the eyes were viewed as Godsend. The beginning and the end. Can also be the reason why "Pein" has never lost a battle. As overpowered as this seems, it doesn't fall out of the realm of possibility were it to come with drawbacks.)

Soul Searching - Just upon one glance of a person, can gain all knowledge of the individual's jutsu. In turn he can move more efficiently to evade all jutsus and use them against his opponent. This also can explain why he uses multiple bodies. If those bodies specifically can only be used for their own jutsu. (Again, overpowered technique. But since I've been given no limit as to what the technique can be compared to the other doujutsu, anything is possible at this point. Especially since I keep in the back of my mind that he has never lost a battle.)

Jutsu Reversal - Can reverse any and all jutsus onto the caster(s). This isn't too likely though considering he wouldn't need to switch bodies in order to use a technique like this.

Sub-Abilities - (Allows use of all 5 Elements | Can see the color of chakra)

Thats all I can come up with at the moment. Feel free to add more to what his abilities could be.

soul searching seems like the most plausible one, your very perceptive to come up with that and i also think thats how he wins his battles. the bodies in the other hand, what intrigues me about them is the question, are they acquired by defeating someone or where they always in that room of his?? and whats are those black plugs all over the bodies, also the hermit of the six path has a very intriguing necklace on with 6 "teeth" like symbols on it.

About jiraiya fight its at least gonna lat 5 chapters, out of respect lol.
[hr]

It don't have to be like that...

Because thus far Tobi hasn't said any thing to show that he was giving orders to Pain. he was only saying that has a leader he shouldn't come up short..



if anyone can talk to you like that then he is your boss nuff said.

Karma
October 07, 2007, 08:42 PM
soul searching seems like the most plausible one, your very perceptive to come up with that and i also think thats how he wins his battles. the bodies in the other hand, what intrigues me about them is the question, are they acquired by defeating someone or where they always in that room of his?? and whats are those black plugs all over the bodies, also the hermit of the six path has a very intriguing necklace on with 6 "teeth" like symbols on it.

About jiraiya fight its at least gonna lat 5 chapters, out of respect lol.
<hr noshade size="1">


if anyone can talk to you like that then he is your boss nuff said.

so you saying that Konan telling Tobi not to describe there target like that.. that mean Konan is pain boss too?..

From what i get from that story; i can see that tobi is smart and he's either working side by side with pain. or pain is the leader..

Tobi not Bossing him at all.. they both boss each other up. and the both playing a role. sooner or later.. you'll finded out why Pain doesn't say much. but in action he can back is talk up..

From what i'm seeing from AK.. they all are grown men & female.. They all of there own Motives other from Pain Ideals... Sooner or later you might realized that zetsu is the real boss for everyone just as you could stated that tobi is the real boss....

you forget Zetsu said tobi is a good boy.. as if he know tobi really good and who he is and it sound like tobi was above him when he talks?

macherie
October 07, 2007, 08:52 PM
@Qmark great prediction and good analysis, although i'd have to agree with hockey in saying that the Rinnegan must be weaker than the sharingan in some perspective, i'm sure we'll find out why, but that'll the be the main catch of the Rinnegan.

QMark
October 07, 2007, 09:00 PM
Guys, Iwanin said Rinnegan is not the strongest/greatest. It is only said that Rinnegan is one of the THREE GREAT DOUJUTSU. Nowhere he said it as the GREATEST of the three. Correct me if I am wrong.

Lets see.

Has its own myth in which not alot of people have seen it.
Precursor to all shinobi had the eye and it was he who created most modern ninjutsu.
Jiraiya said and I quote
These eyes...they correspond to the most illustrious of the Three Great Doujutsu...It is also said to appear when the world is in turmoil, as a god of creation sent by the heavens, or a god of destruction who returns all to nothingness.

You would say that would not be greater than Sharingan or Byakugan?

EDIT: I want to point out and note that Pein is not being manipulated by Madara. Since it seems that Madara has never beaten Pein, implied by Konan's comment, it would seem that they have a partnership rather than a leader/follower relationship. This also indicated by Pein's snide reply to Madara's order to take out Naruto and failure not being an option as their leader.

toniCHRYSA
October 07, 2007, 09:12 PM
eh? noone is the boss of anyone. geez! it's like tsunade and jiraiya. tsunade always talks to jiraiya like she's bossing him around.. but in the end who is the stronger one? same goes for tobi and pain. since we don't know if they met when they were still young. since we haven't seen them fight. since konan says that pain hasn't lost a battle. and from that sentence it clearly say that tobi and pain haven't fought yet. What if tobi came to pain and told him his plans? and then pain's plans are somehow almost the same as tobi's? Or iefh helps tobi his plans will also be achieved. ever think of that? so until we see both of them fight, or until we see them fight anyone we can't say who is stronger. even if they have Rin'negan,sharingan, or byakugan.

Alterno
October 07, 2007, 09:41 PM
eh? noone is the boss of anyone. geez! it's like tsunade and jiraiya. tsunade always talks to jiraiya like she's bossing him around.. but in the end who is the stronger one? same goes for tobi and pain.

How can you assume that Jiraiya is stronger... the one of the three sannin who couldn't get the bells from Sarutobi during their training, However getting the bell or not doesn't say anything at this point, but I think that until it be proven Jiraiya is not stronger, but neither weaker than Tsunade.

The relation between Tsunade and Jiraiya is different they have long term friendship and they are close to each other which allows them to talk each other with some level of trust, that other's characters can't use. Nagato asked to Tobi what about the Kyuubi and Tobi gave him an order "You get him, I won't tolerate a failure".



since we don't know if they met when they were still young. since we haven't seen them fight. since konan says that pain hasn't lost a battle. and from that sentence it clearly say that tobi and pain haven't fought yet. What if tobi came to pain and told him his plans? and then pain's plans are somehow almost the same as tobi's? Or iefh helps tobi his plans will also be achieved. ever think of that? so until we see both of them fight, or until we see them fight anyone we can't say who is stronger. even if they have Rin'negan,sharingan, or byakugan.

Maybe Pein hasn't lost a battle because he actually fought weak opponents... you say and what about Hanzou? well so far everything said about him sounds like myths and legends, even the last chapter. The rain shinobi who doesn't enough if Pein exist or not. Even when Jiraiya talks about the rinnengan he does it like if were a legend or something (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/373/03/). Is supposed that those who created the Ninjustu (no genjutsu or taejutsu), used to have this doujutsu. I believe that it was Uchiha Madara who killed Hanzou and not Pein.

QMark
October 07, 2007, 10:03 PM
I don't know how to not sound rude Alterno by replying to your post but I'll try my best.

So your saying Jiraiya is not stronger compared to something that happened when they were Genin against a Jounin and future Hokage. May I remind you that Naruto, Sasuke, or Sakura did not get a bell from Kakashi when they were Genin. Sasuke whom is now able to defeat an Akatsuki member. Naruto whom Kakashi thinks has surpassed him and will surpass the 4th hokage. Sakura who is as brilliant and strong as Tsunade.
Point being nothing is set in stone when your a kid. Its about what you learn and how you grow up. Just like Jiraiya said.

Also, clarification on what Tobi told Pein to do. He briefed him on Naruto and said, "You will capture the 9-Tails. As their leader, failure will not be accepted."

Right there in bold indicates what was said in what tone. If Tobi were actually the leader telling Pein what to do, he would have said, "You will capture the 9-Tails. Failure will not be accepted."

That would be a narrative from Madara himself giving Pein a direct order. In the previous statement he said was indicated as a supported order using logic. The support being "as their leader."

Pein not losing a battle because of fighting only weak people? How would that make any sense if they were making a name for themselves? Jiraiya said he kept hearing their names come up now and again. Then he heard they just died. People do not get reputations by beating weak people. Nor are their deaths acknowledged if that was the case.

Madara would have no purpose in killing Hanzou. It was Nagato, Konan, and Yahiko who wished to change the rain country. Not Madara. I'm not saying Madara is incapable of doing so, its just irrational to the story itself.

NOTE: It would seem all three Doujutsus have connections to each type of jutsu.

Sharingan - Genjutsu
Byakugan - Taijutsu
Rinnegan - Ninjutsu

Just thought I would point that out.

Karma
October 07, 2007, 10:11 PM
I don't know how to not sound rude Alterno by replying to your post but I'll try my best.

So your saying Jiraiya is not stronger compared to something that happened when they were Genin against a Jounin and future Hokage. May I remind you that Naruto, Sasuke, or Sakura did not get a bell from Kakashi when they were Genin. Sasuke whom is now able to defeat an Akatsuki member. Naruto whom Kakashi thinks has surpassed him and will surpass the 4th hokage. Sakura who is as brilliant and strong as Tsunade.
Point being nothing is set in stone when your a kid. Its about what you learn and how you grow up. Just like Jiraiya said.

Also, clarification on what Tobi told Pein to do. He briefed him on Naruto and said, "You will capture the 9-Tails. As their leader, failure will not be accepted."

Right there in bold indicates what was said in what tone. If Tobi were actually the leader telling Pein what to do, he would have said, "You will capture the 9-Tails. Failure will not be accepted."

That would be a narrative from Madara himself giving Pein a direct order. In the previous statement he said was indicated as a supported order using logic. The support being "as their leader."

Pein not losing a battle because of fighting only weak people? How would that make any sense if they were making a name for themselves? Jiraiya said he kept hearing their names come up now and again. Then he heard they just died. People do not get reputations by beating weak people. Nor are their deaths acknowledged if that was the case.

Madara would have no purpose in killing Hanzou. It was Nagato, Konan, and Yahiko who wished to change the rain country. Not Madara. I'm not saying Madara is incapable of doing so, its just irrational to the story itself.

NOTE: It would seem all three Doujutsus have connections to each type of jutsu.

Sharingan - Genjutsu
Byakugan - Taijutsu
Rinnegan - Ninjutsu

Just thought I would point that out.

Very good stated here.. i liked it alot..

The Noobslayer
October 07, 2007, 10:35 PM
NOTE: It would seem all three Doujutsus have connections to each type of jutsu.

Sharingan - Genjutsu
Byakugan - Taijutsu
Rinnegan - Ninjutsu

Just thought I would point that out.


I'll offer a slightly modified observation:

Sharingan:: Mind (genjutsu, ninjutsu copy ability)
Byakugan: Body/Physical (chakra points, 360 view/zoom/x-ray)
Rinnegan: Spirit (?)

Following this pattern (mind/body/spirit) we can explain why the Rinnegan is the most "illustrous" and not neccesarilly the strongest of the three. In training for anything, the spirit aspect is said to be the hardest to change/control/obtain, thus the Rinnegan (spirit) is not neccesarily the strongest, just the most revered because it deals with the spirit, not the mind or body aspects.

Okia
October 07, 2007, 10:55 PM
I'll offer a slightly modified observation:

Sharingan:: Mind (genjutsu, ninjutsu copy ability)
Byakugan: Body/Physical (chakra points, 360 view/zoom/x-ray)
Rinnegan: Spirit (?)

Following this pattern (mind/body/spirit) we can explain why the Rinnegan is the most "illustrous" and not neccesarilly the strongest of the three. In training for anything, the spirit aspect is said to be the hardest to change/control/obtain, thus the Rinnegan (spirit) is not neccesarily the strongest, just the most revered because it deals with the spirit, not the mind or body aspects.

good point.

Karma
October 07, 2007, 11:03 PM
I'll offer a slightly modified observation:

Sharingan:: Mind (genjutsu, ninjutsu copy ability)
Byakugan: Body/Physical (chakra points, 360 view/zoom/x-ray)
Rinnegan: Spirit (?)

Following this pattern (mind/body/spirit) we can explain why the Rinnegan is the most "illustrous" and not neccesarilly the strongest of the three. In training for anything, the spirit aspect is said to be the hardest to change/control/obtain, thus the Rinnegan (spirit) is not neccesarily the strongest, just the most revered because it deals with the spirit, not the mind or body aspects.
Yes.. you guys getting better at it.. let us creat a thread for this tips.. and include the guy above theory as well.

QMark
October 07, 2007, 11:06 PM
I'll offer a slightly modified observation:

Sharingan:: Mind (genjutsu, ninjutsu copy ability)
Byakugan: Body/Physical (chakra points, 360 view/zoom/x-ray)
Rinnegan: Spirit (?)

Following this pattern (mind/body/spirit) we can explain why the Rinnegan is the most "illustrous" and not neccesarilly the strongest of the three. In training for anything, the spirit aspect is said to be the hardest to change/control/obtain, thus the Rinnegan (spirit) is not neccesarily the strongest, just the most revered because it deals with the spirit, not the mind or body aspects.

Nice observation. I just tried to use the easiest connections seeing as how jutsus are a big part of Naruto and determine how the battles will go. IE Taijutsu vs Ninjutsu vs Genjutsu.

In other words, each doujutsu has been shown effectively using a certain jutsu type except Rinnegan. The best conclusion we can come to is what Jiraiya said about the founder of the ninja world. Which is, "He created most modern ninjutsu." Ninjutsu obviously being the keyword that sticks out here.

Although still, I like your observation about mind, body, and spirit.

Karma
October 07, 2007, 11:13 PM
What i want people to understand this..

Taijutsu >Genjutsu
Genjutsu >ninjutsu
ninjutsu > Taijutsu

Its just like the elements..



So far people that good at Taijutsu & Ninjutsu need to know away to despel Genjutsu. since they weren't born a Genjutsu type. you try to make sure your weak point isn't figure out..

Sasuke look fast to you guys because he trying to cover is weak points... But fighting someone that is actually fast going to cause trouble for him and he'll have to use that sharigan to assists him..

I'm looking forward to pain and Jiraiya fight on the next chapter to come..

QMark
October 07, 2007, 11:19 PM
Not entirely true. Its all about the skill level of that person's jutsu. Look at Lee. He has exceptional taijutsu but could not probably win against someone like Itachi who has exceptional genjutsu. I think it works by skill level. I mean would someone who knew 20 C-Rank genjutsu's win against someone who knew 1 S-Rank ninjutsu?

Karma
October 07, 2007, 11:34 PM
Not entirely true. Its all about the skill level of that person's jutsu. Look at Lee. He has exceptional taijutsu but could not probably win against someone like Itachi who has exceptional genjutsu. I think it works by skill level. I mean would someone who knew 20 C-Rank genjutsu's win against someone who knew 1 S-Rank ninjutsu?

But we all know that Lee is different from other Ninjas... And have to make sure he work on is weak points. Working on your weak point is to cover your self.. because we all know that Itachi & sasuke isn't good at all G,T,N-Jutsu's..

they normally weak on only one area.. and if they meet up on someone that know how to fight that sharigan they only going to keep attacking there weak points...

people with Advance Bloodline normally know how to hide there weak points more than the normal ninja's.. and its not really they know how to hide it.. the normal Ninja's they get confuse with there special abilities..

Having one S-rank Jutsu doesn't mean you can win someone with alot of B or A ranked Jutsu..

its how the Jutsu is used...

QMark
October 07, 2007, 11:50 PM
I think you missed my point. I was trying to say that the ninja's skill is all that matters, not what jutsu type they use.

True, knowing how to use your jutsus efficiently would definitely be a plus in a battle. And here comes the but in this post. Rank of jutsu does matter in most cases. The one exception I have seen is Shikamaru. That was only because he had everything setup before the battle actually took place. Meaning that his opponent didn't stand a chance. Other than that, I still stand by what I said. IE, 1 Tsukyomi defeated Kakashi, a ninja who has alot of great jutsus. Its all about quality, not what type* of jutsus you know or how many you know of them.


*Types: Ninjutsu, Genjutsu, Taijutsu

ornis
October 08, 2007, 12:01 AM
I don't mind the direction of the conversation: it aims to help clarify things. I hope I'm not interrupting "the flow," ^^; But let's remain aware that this is a Predictions thread. As long as they are made through your clarifications, please continue :amuse

And if anyone believes this discussion might not stay on track for long, I would be glad to provide a thread for it in the Toshokan.

toniCHRYSA
October 08, 2007, 12:05 AM
How can you assume that Jiraiya is stronger... the one of the three sannin who couldn't get the bells from Sarutobi during their training, However getting the bell or not doesn't say anything at this point, but I think that until it be proven Jiraiya is not stronger, but neither weaker than Tsunade.

Ahahahaha are u serious? ur comparing the genin crap to the present? ur a long way off.. since they are like 50+ yrs old now and have gotten much wiser and stronger than their genin past.. And if those 3genins were already able to summon some snakes,toads,slug? xD wouldn't they all be able to get the bell in like a short matter of time? That's right the past is soooooo different from the present. all of them got better and strong and smarter. Oh and Naruto,Sasuke,Sakura didn't get the bell from kakashi.. and look at them now. they are able to defeat an akatsuki member.


The relation between Tsunade and Jiraiya is different they have long term friendship and they are close to each other which allows them to talk each other with some level of trust, that other's characters can't use. Nagato asked to Tobi what about the Kyuubi and Tobi gave him an order "You get him, I won't tolerate a failure".

And what's ur proof that after Jiraiya left those 3 meaning(yahiko,konan,nagato) they met a young tobi and became friends with them? I don't have any proof. Do you?
And tobi didn't boss pain around. I don't know where u get the "I won't tolerate a failure" thing but in all mangas i've read tobi said "You capture him, As the/their leader failure will not be accepted". Well since i've learned english since i was born hehe. That's not a command, Or an order. If he was ordering him it would sound like this or it would look like this: "You go Capture him! As the leader i will not accept any failure!". well it looks almost the same though hahaaha :D



Maybe Pein hasn't lost a battle because he actually fought weak opponents... you say and what about Hanzou? well so far everything said about him sounds like myths and legends, even the last chapter. The rain shinobi who doesn't enough if Pein exist or not. Even when Jiraiya talks about the rinnengan he does it like if were a legend or something (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/373/03/). Is supposed that those who created the Ninjustu (no genjutsu or taejutsu), used to have this doujutsu. I believe that it was Uchiha Madara who killed Hanzou and not Pein.

How can you be a legend/god in your own country if you have only defeated weak opponents? how can u make a name for urself if you only beat weak opponents? How can anyone call you a god if you only beat weak ppl? And how can you tell that he fought only weak opponents? Jiraiya also said that whenever someone opposes the 3 they wind up dead. their names always come up.. why? coz they are strong. why would ppl care about some weak ninja?

Jiraiya talks about the rin'negan like that coz it's the 1st time he saw one.. unlike the sharingan, and the byakugan.. u get it? it's like saying "you have to see it to believe it".
And what's the point of tobi killing hanzou? None.. Hanzou was from amegakure. Pain,nagato,konan are also from amegakure. tobi? idk since he has sharingan i'm assuming that he's from konoha. And what's the point of pain killing hanzou? idk maybe pain konan and yahiko always wanted to change amegakure since they were kids..

And that's all i have to say.

Oh and yeah my prediction. No fight yet. Jiraiya will start to talk to Pain and ask them maybe what happened to yahiko? We might see Hebi getting very very close to the hideout! yeah! fight fight fight! hhehehe :D
And i guess at the end both Pain and Jman will probably start the most awaited fight of the whole akatsuke arc. hehehe for me it's the most awaited xD coz i really want to see Jman's abilities :D

ornis
October 08, 2007, 12:30 AM
Oh, additionally, keep the discussion mellow. Refrain from using terminology that intends to hammer a point down in stone. On someone's forehead. Please be well-composed ;)

segua
October 08, 2007, 01:56 AM
I say the next chapter will be composed of more flashbacks with maybe a little more fighting. But I sure wish Kishi would change the perspective towards Team Konoha's pursuit of Sasuke, Team Hebi's pursuit of Itachi, and Itachi's continued conversation with Naruto. Though I am now, very interested, in Pain's development and Jiraiya's fate atm.

binks
October 08, 2007, 03:35 AM
qmark/tonichrysa it is you who is incorrect, alterno said "but I think that until it be proven Jiraiya is not stronger, but neither weaker than Tsunade."
it is a very valid point although i think jiraiya is stronger myself
he did not say tsunade was stronger because she got a bell
he/she said that there has not been any evidence to prove jiraiya is stronger
plz read further b4 you imply someone is foolish

woefdram
October 08, 2007, 06:32 AM
@toniCHRYSA: Tobi is from konoha...read Kakashi gaiden

As for the 3-gan's...I think it is a very good theory. It would make sense as well with Naruto having a very strong spirit...and the predicition that he has to fight pein in the end.

piscesking
October 08, 2007, 07:20 AM
Jiraiya is strongest of 3 & kindiest as well................so stop arguing........
[hr]
abt Tobi i think he is the second teacher of Pain..........He might be the 1 who told pain abt his eye power

rajuchacha
October 08, 2007, 08:40 AM
jiraiya is the strongest, he was the obvious choice for Hokage though it can also be attributed to ignorance of tsunade's wherebouts, but we have seen tsunade's capabilities when she fought orochimaru, brute force, yeah she did beat orochimaru to pulp but there is more required to be the best, and we dont know what jiraiya can do. but what we have seen is the expression on tsunade's face when jiraiya said he will kill her if she went against konoha, and now we'll know what is he capable of.
[hr]
and one more thing what if tobi is yahiko, he said he will surpass nagato and save him one day, nagato fighting against jiraiya, this could be the day.

shachi
October 08, 2007, 08:47 AM
I think Konan may end up betraying Pein so Jiraiya can escape. Of course, it may mean her death.

rajuchacha
October 08, 2007, 08:57 AM
thats possible,
well any idea how's pain in deidara's body, that body should have been destroyed when deidara exploded

ichimatsu
October 08, 2007, 09:29 AM
pein use a sex body that are in his inner word, like naruto can access his inner to see kyubi, pein in his inner he got a room with six body, so he can swich bady.
and his power. he master all ninjutsu so powerfull he is

toniCHRYSA
October 08, 2007, 10:05 AM
qmark/tonichrysa it is you who is incorrect, alterno said "but I think that until it be proven Jiraiya is not stronger, but neither weaker than Tsunade."
it is a very valid point although i think jiraiya is stronger myself
he did not say tsunade was stronger because she got a bell
he/she said that there has not been any evidence to prove jiraiya is stronger
plz read further b4 you imply someone is foolish

hmmm.. He was stating that jiraiya is weaker than the two sannins by comparing the "getting the bell" from sarutobi to the present. Now is that fair? I'm really not saying that tsunade is weaker than Jiraiya.. But for him to say that Jiraiya is weak coz he didn't get the bell from his sensei doesn't mean he is weaker than the othe two does it? Coz it was from their genin years.. Even hanzou was impressed with their strength. And from what itachi said about Jiraiya when they were going to take naruto from part1. it's really clear that he is the strongest out of the 3.why would kishimoto let tsunade drug jiraiya in the sannin fight? he could've chose not to.. why? coz he doesn't want to show jiraiya's true power.
He has a bigger part than tsunade. we all have seen tsunade's capablilities. brute strenght and healing powers. we all have seen orochimaru's capabilities against 3rd. have we seen Jiraiya's? all i've seen him do is summon a frog,that belly of the frog thing against itachi and kisame, and he does something with his hair :darn. and that's it. i didn't say that alterno was foolish. he compared the genin years to the present situation of jiraiya. now is that fair? hehe :D

Hockeychaoz
October 08, 2007, 11:15 AM
hmmm.. He was stating that jiraiya is weaker than the two sannins by comparing the "getting the bell" from sarutobi to the present. Now is that fair? I'm really not saying that tsunade is weaker than Jiraiya.. But for him to say that Jiraiya is weak coz he didn't get the bell from his sensei doesn't mean he is weaker than the othe two does it? Coz it was from their genin years.. Even hanzou was impressed with their strength. And from what itachi said about Jiraiya when they were going to take naruto from part1. it's really clear that he is the strongest out of the 3.why would kishimoto let tsunade drug jiraiya in the sannin fight? he could've chose not to.. why? coz he doesn't want to show jiraiya's true power.
He has a bigger part than tsunade. we all have seen tsunade's capablilities. brute strenght and healing powers. we all have seen orochimaru's capabilities against 3rd. have we seen Jiraiya's? all i've seen him do is summon a frog,that belly of the frog thing against itachi and kisame, and he does something with his hair :darn. and that's it. i didn't say that alterno was foolish. he compared the genin years to the present situation of jiraiya. now is that fair? hehe :D

Lol Hey, Jiraiya's hair rocks.
And I feel I have to agree that he is the strongest out of the 3 sannin.
Jiraiya was offered Hokage before Tsunade was. (But that might have been because she kinda exiled herself.) I'm hoping that we see a nice big fight from Jiraiya if he is going to die. He has a very large fanbase and it would be an awful shame to see him die quick.
Btw, is anyone else curious if we will ever see the OrochiXJiria fight whereas Jiriaya failed to bring back orochi like Naruto and Sasuke.
There's so much left to do Jiriaya =(.

SoulFury
October 08, 2007, 11:29 AM
Maybe....Orochimaru joined cause he thought that a rinnegan user could be interesting for his investigation about soul transfer...and so maybe Orochimaru left Akatsuki when he knew that Pein and Konan were looking for Yahiko/Juugo and so, they were going to kick his snake ass...this is another idea.

In the other hand, I don't think about Jiraiya Bunshin, I think is the real one. My predictions is that Jiraiya kicks Konan's pretty ass(OMG she is so cute) and Pein starts kicking Jiraiya's ass.

As you can see, my very low level of english makes me use the same expressions always XDDDDD.

The Noobslayer
October 08, 2007, 11:37 AM
I still say Jiraiyas going to die against Pein so it will be Naruto and Sakura and Sasuke against Pein, in a battle that mirros Hanzou's fight, making them the new sannin. But in order for them to be the new sannin, the old sannin have to die....

Oh yea I forgot to add for the rinnegan earlier:

Sharingan: Mind( genjutsu, copy ability, able to enter others' minds)
Byakugan: Body/physical (360 view, chakra points, zoom/x-ray)
Rinnegan: Spirit (spirit transfer obviously, 6 paths of stuff, ?)

Mind, body, and spirit.

--------------------
Sidenote: Maybe the "full-power" Madara was refering to in the combination of these three?

Hockeychaoz
October 08, 2007, 11:40 AM
Maybe....Orochimaru joined cause he thought that a rinnegan user could be interesting for his investigation about soul transfer...and so maybe Orochimaru left Akatsuki when he knew that Pein and Konan were looking for Yahiko/Juugo and so, they were going to kick his snake ass...this is another idea.

In the other hand, I don't think about Jiraiya Bunshin, I think is the real one. My predictions is that Jiraiya kicks Konan's pretty ass(OMG she is so cute) and Pein starts kicking Jiraiya's ass.

As you can see, my very low level of english makes me use the same expressions always XDDDDD.

Actually, that read very well.
Your English is excellent. Very few mistakes, and small ones at that.

Anyways, I have to agree that I am against the Kage Bunshin idea. It would seem so plain. I guess until Jiriaya gets hit with something, we can't rule it out as a possibility.

Btw, I thought of something else for Rinnegan. Maybe the first kekkai genkai? (Just throwing it out there.)

ornis
October 08, 2007, 11:50 AM
But all the eyes are Kekkei Genkai... >.>

Are you thinking about Rin'negan being the original Kekkei Genkai...? *Not saying that's my opinion though*

...Just digging to know exactly what you imply.

shachi
October 08, 2007, 11:50 AM
Since the rinnegan is associated with creation and destruction i think its powers have to do with extremely precise chakra control and form manipulation on the one hand, and chakra disruption/jutsu neutralization on the other hand.

I think whatever its powers are we will get a clearer picture in the next chapter.

Hockeychaoz
October 08, 2007, 11:54 AM
But all the eyes are Kekkei Genkai... >.>

Are you thinking about Rin'negan being the original Kekkei Genkai...? *Not saying that's my opinion though*

...Just digging to know exactly what you imply.

Wow, yea, I meant first Kekkei Genkai. Lol, I'm dumb.

The Noobslayer
October 08, 2007, 11:54 AM
Since the rinnegan is associated with creation and destruction i think its powers have to do with extremely precise chakra control and form manipulation on the one hand, and chakra disruption/jutsu neutralization on the other hand.

I think whatever its powers are we will get a clearer picture in the next chapter.

Exactly, one could say our chakra = spirit.

For example, if you are evil or have bad intentions, your chakra is some color like purple or orange/red to symbolize hatred/rage/impurity. Whereas if you are a "good guy" your chakra is a lighter hue. Also note the reference to major villains' and even Naruto's demon fox chakra as being some time of malfeasance.

Also, he is the creator of modern ninjutsu, which arguably requires the most chakra (spirit) control.

besiphilous
October 08, 2007, 01:20 PM
I have a feeling that Tobi got control of Nagato and the crew while they were still young, which is why a ninja possesing the Rinnegan is being controlled by a Sharingan user.
[hr]
That body that pein is in is NOT Deidara. Deidara's bang covers his left eye, remember? This character has his bang to his right and it doesn't cover any of his eyes. Plus, the lips are different then Deidara. Also notice how Pein's new body has an Amagakure headband scratched off, not the stone ninja symbol.

Pain
October 08, 2007, 01:29 PM
if ur trying to say its not deidara i think that the most important part is that they have different eyes

rayywang
October 08, 2007, 02:10 PM
Theory:

Rinnegan allows Nagato to use the body of a person who he knows, and has died.

Rationale:

There are 6 sleeping pods, all with Akatsuki-robe wearing bodies

Who has died, within akatsuki?

- oro (*)
- kakuzu (**)
- deidara (***)
- sasori
- hidan (****)

Remember he lay down in one pod (the sixth body is his own, original body) and right away woke up as "deidara-pein" - as if he transferred his consciousness into another body. Makes sense with the whole metempsychosis thread.

Problems with theory:

* = where is his body, after Sasuke pwned him?
** = his body is in Konoha
*** = his body was vaporized
**** = is he technically dead?

Or perhaps the other bodies aren't those of akatsuki but of powerful people he had defeated in the past, and took for his own. Much like Sasori.

Apologies if this has been suggested already, don't have time to scan the entirety of the theory forums.

Helltroll
October 08, 2007, 02:26 PM
well..at least kabuto absorbed the part of oro's body that wa sleft behind in the material world and hidan is of course dead. i mean...his head lays borrowed under 10 metres of mud,sand and stones. this will take A LOT of time to dug him out......

viat0r
October 08, 2007, 02:59 PM
Or the akatsuki bodies used were not their real bodies but ones they were switched into by pain???? and pain kept their real bodies??

bean
October 08, 2007, 03:15 PM
Or the akatsuki bodies used were not their real bodies but ones they were switched into by pain???? and pain kept their real bodies??

nah, I would find it hard to believe that the akatsuki members would willingly give up their bodies. If the bodies that have been killed so far were clones, that would have been revealed when they got kakuzu's body. The only reason I would say that they are the akatsuki's body is that it's simple and would fit in a chapter. Kishi doesn't come up with crazy complex plots unless they can be explained in one or two chapters.

Pein
October 08, 2007, 03:22 PM
I'm thinking about "the sage of the six paths" theory that jiraiya was talking about. I think the bodies in the six pods has something to do with the six paths. Like one body for a certain path, what do you guys think?

Frey
October 08, 2007, 03:35 PM
I don't really know, but that 6 bodies 6 paths theory, is a bit far sought in my opinion.

But I can't wait to see how Tobi fits in, you know in the whole Pein Theory.

lavdrim
October 08, 2007, 04:04 PM
While it is true that Pein noticed Jiraya's presence, he has no idea what happened inside of the toad. Not to mention the fact that Pein stopped the rain, so he wouldn't know anything that happened after he stopped the rain. The fact that Jiraya told the toad to return to Ibiki with the shinobi shows that something is missing. There is no possible way that that weakling shinobi could possibly get out of that toad by himself. It even has a picture of the toad going back under water. I'm sure that the shinobi that Konan saw was not who she thought he was.i think that was jariaya leaving disguised as that man.

UchihaMadara
October 08, 2007, 04:24 PM
Its quite possible that the Rings Akatsuki members wear is tied into the body possesion theory. IE when you die if you were wearing one of those rings Pain has some method of recovering your body, like an improved version of Orochimaru's jutsu were he summons the previous Hokage.

arslan
October 08, 2007, 04:34 PM
i think pein keeping bodies of people he defeated or thought were useful for his purposes is a plausible theory. Sasori did this too. We should, however, wait for details about Rin'negan to be revealed before making too many conjectures.

MrTeatime
October 08, 2007, 06:22 PM
Since the rinnegan is associated with creation and destruction i think its powers have to do with extremely precise chakra control and form manipulation on the one hand, and chakra disruption/jutsu neutralization on the other hand.

I think whatever its powers are we will get a clearer picture in the next chapter.

hmm. now i must have missed something. Rinnegan, if you look at the links to the buddist 6 roads have something to do with revival of dead material (reincarnation) and the different levels of existing.
But creation and destruction? Where did that come from?:blink

prediction:
Its too much tension and character development going on for a fullfleged battle between Perv and Pain. Maybe flashbacks and a little fighting but i feel that the focus
have been away from Naruto and Sauske quite a while now. (Not to forget Sakura whom I hope will play a more central role in the remaining part of the manga....)

Is it only me who feel that the manga is building up tension for The final Cresendo?

Okia
October 08, 2007, 06:41 PM
Not to forget Sakura whom I hope will play a more central role in the remaining part of the manga



yeah i hope she does something worthy for a change...
less talk, more action :sakura lol brute strength

tobi9
October 08, 2007, 06:48 PM
what if it allows the rinnegan user to remember all jutsu with perfection no matter what diffulicty

radical3113
October 08, 2007, 06:55 PM
yeah i hope she does something worthy for a change...
less talk, more action lol brute strength

face it when does she ever do anything worthy.

i dont think peins rinnegan has anything to do with those bodies. i think thats a completley different jutsu. true rinnegan powers probably have sumfin more meaningful than body switchin

Leos~
October 08, 2007, 07:02 PM
I expect this chapter probably won't reveal too much story-wise. It will probably have Pain pushing Jiraiya back until the very end of the chapter, where Jiraiya will reveal some ace in the hole he has. I doubt that this fight will end untill at least 3 or 4 chapters pass, hopefully more.

radical3113
October 08, 2007, 07:09 PM
I expect this chapter probably won't reveal too much story-wise. It will probably have Pain pushing Jiraiya back until the very end of the chapter, where Jiraiya will reveal some ace in the hole he has. I doubt that this fight will end untill at least 3 or 4 chapters pass, hopefully more.

thst pretty much on point im gonna have second the motion. i am itchin to see pein fight but i know that he's definitely not gonna use any super strong jutsu. i wouldnt want the fight to go on for too many chapters not when itachi, sasuke and naruto are all in close proximity to each other.

AngryChubbs
October 08, 2007, 08:11 PM
Not entirely true. Its all about the skill level of that person's jutsu. Look at Lee. He has exceptional taijutsu but could not probably win against someone like Itachi who has exceptional genjutsu. I think it works by skill level. I mean would someone who knew 20 C-Rank genjutsu's win against someone who knew 1 S-Rank ninjutsu?

well naruto's kage bunshin isn't an s-rank at all and im pretty sure it is pretty low and we all know that it is probably what will allow him to beat itachi and sasuke. so yes, 20 c-rank jutus could very well beat 1 s-rank

brainwiz
October 08, 2007, 08:38 PM
well naruto's kage bunshin isn't an s-rank at all and im pretty sure it is pretty low and we all know that it is probably what will allow him to beat itachi and sasuke. so yes, 20 c-rank jutus could very well beat 1 s-rank

Nope, it's a forbidden jutsu...
I seriously doubt it's a low rank.

I mean come on, that was practically the first manga chapter, if not the first.
I'd have to look but I'm lazy.

QMark
October 08, 2007, 08:43 PM
Actually, Kage Bunshin no Jutsu is a forbidden A-Rank jutsu. It can be used to create S-Rank jutsus though according to the data books since Mass Kage Bunshin no Jutsu is deemed as S-Rank.

People are taking what I'm saying completely out of context. Maybe I can sum it up in 1 sentence?

Skill Level is what matters. Not knowing lots of jutsus

Karma
October 08, 2007, 09:42 PM
Skill Level is what matters. Not knowing lots of jutsus
correctly....

But stay on topic everyone...


I expect to see a battle with Pain & Jiraiya.. then a shift to Sasuke & Naruto..

NNGirl
October 08, 2007, 11:04 PM
I think that the next chapter will be about Akatsuki foundation

shamoo
October 09, 2007, 12:12 AM
I second the idea that the Rinnegan embodies spirit jutsu, whereas Sharingan is mind jutsu and Byakugan is Taijutsu.

Evidence for this fact has already been given by Pain himself when he activated it as a child. He said he went berserk and couldn't remember what happened, and the enemy ended up dead. This is very different from Sharingan which requires tremendous mental prowess, or Byakugan which relies on physical prowess and dexterity.

This jutsu is based on raw power/spirit... that is probably why it is considered the most formidable doujutsu because it does not necessarily require skill or thoughtfulness, just raw power/spirit. It might even simply have the effect of magnifying the power of any jutsu the user carries out. The only missing piece of the puzzle is the clone business... the only connection I can see is that this doujutsu allows soul conquering/capture, and basically the user can destroy the other person's mind and take their body for their own.

Recalcitrant
October 09, 2007, 01:40 AM
I predict Jariaya and Pein will fight for a bit, with limited interruption from Konan, Jariaya will push Pein a bit until he starts to use his big weapons and i predict it'll kinda be like Itachi vs Kakashi where even though it looked like Kakashi was doing alright against him Itachi always REALLY had the upper hand and Kakashi knew it.

The fight until the end when... dun dun dun... BIG STUNNER Jariaya is a kage bunshiin (ala the flashback) and actually escaped as that supposed "rain-nin". Konan still keeps a butterfly on him however and they track him down but not before he BARELY manages to escape the rain village where Pein calls off the supposed hunt either on his own or because Tobi/Madra says not to worry for now and leaves it for another day. Keep in mind this isnt one chapter but just a thought of will happen.

Agito Makashima
October 09, 2007, 01:41 AM
I concur, about the Rinnegan embodies spirit jutus shamoo.

I prediect a great fight this chapter.

Recalcitrant
October 09, 2007, 01:48 AM
Oh yea to add to the supposed possible Kage Bunshiin I mentioned. Pein decides to end it and draws upon the power of his Rinnegan (or taps into a bit atleast, kinda showing Jariaya how much hes changed yada yada yada) and somehow enters Jariayas mind/soul/spirit. Another dimension of sorts similar to what Ouro had with his soul transfer jutsu, but Pein has control in there much as Itachi has control of the mind when using MS. While there he forces himself over Jariaya and then comments (much as Itachi did to Kakashi's Bunshiin when they fought in the rescue Gaara Arc) that this isnt his real body and then back in the real world his bunshiin goes poof. Pein orders Konan about his location, she reluctantly says she knows where hes at and they give chase.

And i agree with other posters on the supposed rinnegan is to spirit as sharingan is to mind and bayukun is to taijutsu (in general terms) and the rinnegan is the all dominating side of the 3 GREAT doujin techniques.

ornis
October 09, 2007, 02:01 AM
That can't just occur, in my opinion, spirit without conditioning, without a channel that molds it well, cannot be the all dominating side to me. Even though it seems to dominate, it also weakens.

As the Rin'negan hints to the Six Paths of Suffering... the user of the Rin'negan may be as good as an instinctive animal if there is no control.

nocor
October 09, 2007, 04:02 AM
Jiraiya can't fight them seriously,because they were his little helpless orphans.However Nagato strikes straight at him and Jiraiya kills his first body off and forces new information about akatsuki and madara out of this little paper girl

C.O.R
October 09, 2007, 04:45 AM
flashbacks .................... :-)

SoulFury
October 09, 2007, 05:29 AM
A very interesting idea:

The chamber we view with the six bodies of deidara is a medical chamber. If we remember, kimimaro was conected to a medical machine to still alive. Surely the six bodies are tecnically dead , but they still with a correct vital constants with this machines, allowing Nagato to posses them(maybe I'm wrong thinking about possesing a dead man is...a very very big fucking stupid idea?:p ).

For now, we can count with Deidara's body, "pein's" body and 4 more bodies.the question is...who are they?:blink :blink :blink

allendsup23
October 09, 2007, 05:44 AM
It looks like there could be more flashbacks. May be what happened to Yahiko.
We could also see some of the fighting between Pain and Jiraiya ..just to show the power....Konan would not interfere in this fight....this is gonna be awesome unless kishi turns it like Oro/Sasuke fight...
I wonder what is happening with Hebi and Konoha Nins. We just see them a bit here and there...there should be more involvment from them...would be good to see Kakashi fight again... :-)

Its been long time since Naruto had a decent fight....there is none in Shippudden.....would love to see Naruto in action.

zet
October 09, 2007, 09:05 AM
i think we are going to see some more prelude to the jiraya vs pein fight and when its about to start we are going to shift to team Hebi and Narutos team and take it from there

garaa89
October 09, 2007, 12:46 PM
where the hell is sai did he even go with team naruto i dont even remember

petrifcus_totalus
October 09, 2007, 12:51 PM
i guesss jiraiya's time is up ^_^

Imperium
October 09, 2007, 02:55 PM
what i really want to know is, what happened to yahiko, but i dont really think this chapter will give us the information, maybe we will find out when the fight is about to reach its climax.

ShadowStrike
October 09, 2007, 03:03 PM
NO! NO! NO!

Jiraiya can't die like Orochimaru. He has to put up a good fight. Come on THUNDER!

Imperium
October 09, 2007, 03:07 PM
NO! NO! NO!

Jiraiya can't die like Orochimaru. He has to put up a good fight. Come on THUNDER!

if he doesnt put up a good fight *cracks knuckles* .......

but its been a long time since we seen a well written fight that doesnt seem rushed (ie sasuke fight, i felt that it was too rushed!) and hopefully this wont happen in kishimoto's haste to wrap it up and begin sasuke vs naruto....

MrTeatime
October 09, 2007, 03:57 PM
it sure feels like Perv will have to repay for the sin of leaving his orphans to themself and face their(Pains) wrath.

It seems unlikely that they will not fight each other. Pain is the leader of akatsuki and obviously have a huge power. Perv is one of the sannin and so on and so forth but...Perv defeating the leader of aktsuki at this monent seems unlikely and so do the prospect of Perv running away(he never gives up, see the sceen with the former waterninja who named then sannin).
Conclusion; the fight ends with either a distraction that hinders Pain from killing Perv, or Pervs death. (Of course, the fight will last several hapters and be splitt up by flashbacks and such.)

jatt_american
October 09, 2007, 04:17 PM
i think jiraiya might die... it won't be happy but sometimes crazy things happen in naruto too...

zet
October 09, 2007, 05:40 PM
I cant see Jiraiya coming out of this alive mainly because Pein is supose to have the most powerful eye jutsu (from the creator of ninjutsu none the less) either that or he will be badly injured and get to Konoha or Naruto so that he can warn and pass the torch to the new generation. maybe then we get to know what the hell did naruto learn during his trainin with ero sennin.

garaa89
October 09, 2007, 05:55 PM
naruto dos not need good justus wend he has all the power of the nine tail fox also i think
kakashi will end up fightinh tobi and die

The Noobslayer
October 09, 2007, 05:57 PM
naruto dos not need good justus wend he has all the power of the nine tail fox also i think
kakashi will end up fightinh tobi and die

Naruto is already losing one sensei, no Kakashi will fight tobi/obito and become the 6th hokage.

Agito Makashima
October 09, 2007, 05:59 PM
flashbacks .................... :-)


I hope we get a lil flashbacks IMO, I want to see what Pein can do.

garaa89
October 09, 2007, 06:07 PM
this is the end of naruto

naruto dies fighting some strong villan to protect konahoa after the both die naruto is named the 6th hokage and everything is a story told by the 7th hokage konohamaru

Okia
October 10, 2007, 05:38 PM
this is the end of naruto

naruto dies fighting some strong villan to protect konahoa after the both die naruto is named the 6th hokage and everything is a story told by the 7th hokage konohamaru

so basically, ur saying that Naruto will end up just like the 4th hokage...
:blink

garaa89
October 10, 2007, 05:56 PM
yes i think that is going to be the end of naruto
what do you think

Karma
October 10, 2007, 06:03 PM
yes i think that is going to be the end of naruto
what do you think

It still got some time to go... Naruto still not on Hokage level as yet. unless Jiriaya death going to bring some thing new to the table when it comes to Naruto maturity.

garaa89
October 10, 2007, 06:13 PM
i guesse your eight but he is not even not chinnin yet so is he going to be the first hokage to be a genin

radical3113
October 10, 2007, 06:48 PM
just coz NARUTO sez he'll be hogake dosent mean he will be. besides dosent that mean tsunade will have to step down or be killed or sumfin?

garaa89
October 10, 2007, 06:58 PM
thats the whole point of the manga his dream to become hokage

Okia
October 10, 2007, 08:41 PM
thats the whole point of the manga his dream to become hokage

he will be, but the story is not going to end with him dying so quickly
protecting his village...

sabuk-demon
October 11, 2007, 09:32 AM
It still got some time to go... Naruto still not on Hokage level as yet. unless Jiriaya death going to bring some thing new to the table when it comes to Naruto maturity.
yeah,cuz if j die's naruto wont take that lightly at all.
you saw what he did to dedaria when he mess
with gaara...not nice:darn

ShadowStrike
October 11, 2007, 09:37 AM
Naruto's death now? I don't know what to say. That's the reason why some people just can't write good scripts or stories. Too impatient, if you ask me.

sabuk-demon
October 11, 2007, 11:59 AM
Naruto's death now? I don't know what to say. That's the reason why some people just can't write good scripts or stories. Too impatient, if you ask me.

yeah.but naruto dead...no time soon.because
how an why would kishi plot an create a manga
with sasuke killn itachi,an naruto becomeing the hokage
in just shut it off on like two or one more manga from
what is happening now.think about how his fan an people
would feel about naruto an him.so i think we should not
even think about the key word Naruto dieing.sounds
like that is something to dream about at this momment
of time.

MARKADOT
October 12, 2007, 12:08 AM
I'm thinking Pain became so sadistic and dangerous because, something happened to yahiko. That'll probably be explained like in chapter 375 after a fighting chapter 374 maybe.

Also, on the Naruto dying thing, i don't think that'll happen at all or soon, Naruto will never end im thinking its just to popular to end it with Naruto dying for some reason. And if Naruto dies whats the point of watching that'll lose like almost every fan. Whats the point of Naruto being called "Naruto" when their isnt even a Naruto in the story get what im saying :P

AgentSmith
October 12, 2007, 06:34 AM
This is a very long term prediction (more a theory actually) : Jiraiya dies, Naruto is shocked and wants revenge at that time Sasuke finds out from a dying Itachi that Madara/Tobi/Obito killed the uchia clan. Naruto full of hatred battles Pain and goes Kyubi 5 tails resulting in the destruction of a large part of the hidden rain village and goes missing (presumed dead). Sasuke beats Madara but is not satisfied and learns that its not worth living for revenge. There is a big funeral for Naruto everyone is shocked etc. We get a time skip of 3-4 years. The other hidden villages are invading what is left of the hidden rain but they are stopped by an unknown force. Hidden Leaf goes to investigate and finds out that the force occupying Hidden Rain are the shinobis of the former Whirlpool Village (where Narutos mother comes from) and the one leading them is Naruto who wants to end the constant wars between the nations by uniting them in a single nation.

I know its a little out there and there are a lot of loose ends but this is just a general idea. Why i find this theory interesting is that it allows Naruto (the manga) to continue after beating the akatsuki and not using just another more powerful but totaly unknown group for naruto to keep fighting (as this is the most common shonen formula). And it switches the positions of Naruto and Sasuke and now Sasuke needs to save Naruto from his blind ambition.

Sorry for the bad english :)

macherie
October 12, 2007, 06:36 AM
Great theory AgentSmith, nothing bad about your english, i'd say Naruto going missing would be a real plot twister, it owuld be nice to see that. It happens in a lot of anime's where the main character goes missing and comes back stronger than ever, it would be nice to see, but i guess we've sorta already seen that with Sasuke.. LOL

samsiufan
October 12, 2007, 06:53 AM
just coz NARUTO sez he'll be hogake dosent mean he will be. besides dosent that mean tsunade will have to step down or be killed or sumfin?

The third was still alive when Minato became the 4th...wasn't he? Or was Minato just and honourary hokage? I don't think so but might be wrong.

Just re-read your email..I think Tsunade will quite easily step down. May be I am wrong but Trunade did not really want to become hokage. It was not really her dream. And she is already looking at who could succeed her...I think in one of the chapters, she mentioned Kakashi as being ready for hokage..

AgentSmith
October 12, 2007, 07:09 AM
Great theory AgentSmith, nothing bad about your english, i'd say Naruto going missing would be a real plot twister, it owuld be nice to see that. It happens in a lot of anime's where the main character goes missing and comes back stronger than ever, it would be nice to see, but i guess we've sorta already seen that with Sasuke.. LOL

I agree with you but when sasuke went missing everybody knew where he was. And i think we need to see the shinobies from the other countries which are just shown on the map but we dont get any info on them. This would make the story a lot more complex and not just another underdog fights progressively stronger enemies who just appear out of nowhere. And i think a real ninja war would be extremely cool.

And sorry if this just looks like i am just replying to get my post count up :). I am excited about the fast development of the plot at this point and i dont think this is a sign of the mangas fast end.

sabuk-demon
October 12, 2007, 09:21 AM
The third was still alive when Minato became the 4th...wasn't he? Or was Minato just and honourary hokage? I don't think so but might be wrong.

Just re-read your email..I think Tsunade will quite easily step down. May be I am wrong but Trunade did not really want to become hokage. It was not really her dream. And she is already looking at who could succeed her...I think in one of the chapters, she mentioned Kakashi as being ready for hokage..

kakashi is good but he already said naruto was stronger
thein him after the fight with kakuzu.in + kakashi stamina
is low.his moves take way too much charka.i think she said naruto as
well after she said kakashi can be the hokage.from what i know...

Karma
October 12, 2007, 09:40 AM
Great theory AgentSmith, nothing bad about your english, i'd say Naruto going missing would be a real plot twister, it owuld be nice to see that. It happens in a lot of anime's where the main character goes missing and comes back stronger than ever, it would be nice to see, but i guess we've sorta already seen that with Sasuke.. LOL

that would be so kool...

I hope after they beat up Jiraiya or killed him.. Naruto learn about it and go off to train by is self. return when he's the only beast left to be catch. When he return in one year. everyone could hardly recognized him.. But they'll realized how serious he is to a the little time he went missing. and even Ino will comment to sakura how naruto gotten so sexy.. lol lol

C.O.R
October 12, 2007, 11:45 AM
ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh I love Jiraiya so much I hope he kicks nagato's assssss

sabuk-demon
October 12, 2007, 11:52 AM
that would be so kool...

I hope after they beat up Jiraiya or killed him.. Naruto learn about it and go off to train by is self. return when he's the only beast left to be catch. When he return in one year. everyone could hardly recognized him.. But they'll realized how serious he is to a the little time he went missing. and even Ino will comment to sakura how naruto gotten so sexy.. lol lol

okay but the fact is naruto shippuden was to show how much he grown
from 2yrs from the last we seen when he was just a kid kid.so why would
kishi waste the shippuden on makeing him leave another year?that would
be way to much time to twist a fight from pein vs j-man and naruto about
to almost catch up with sasuke and in sasuke geting the chance to fight itachi
just for naruto to get serious.we should just wate to see the results after the
mess that is all about to happen with this "every body geting a shot to prove
how strong they have got"from lets just skip to naruto being serious for another
year...but that would be so kool :p

AgentSmith
October 12, 2007, 12:43 PM
Well i am not for a time-skip right now, but after the current akatsuki arc. Then we could see Narutos childhood, his teenage years, and finally Naruto as an adult. Because i dont think naruto can achieve his Hokage dream ih he is 16-17 (how old he is he now?).

ShadowStrike
October 12, 2007, 12:46 PM
Why did I learn French instead of Japanese or Chinese in high school? Dammit.

Frey
October 12, 2007, 02:55 PM
Why did I learn French instead of Japanese or Chinese in high school? Dammit.

You're not alone thinking that, I had a chance of choosing, another language Than French (advanced).....But no........ I just thought. CBA

Decorus
October 12, 2007, 03:02 PM
Sigh they don't usually teach Chinese or Japanese in high school, usually its just french, german, spanish and sign language.

Okia
October 12, 2007, 03:04 PM
kakashi is good but he already said naruto was stronger
thein him after the fight with kakuzu.in + kakashi stamina
is low.his moves take way too much charka.i think she said naruto as
well after she said kakashi can be the hokage.from what i know...

yeah Kakashi did say that Naruto might be stronger than him,.
but if they do a serious fight againts each other, Kakashi will still win.
Naruto just has a lot of chakra within him, I remember Kakashi mentioning
that Naruto's chakra is twice as strong as his chakra, and thats not including
the kyuubi's chakra.
So i guess wat Kakashi meant was that Naruto is much poweful [in terms of chakra]
than him now, but Kakashi still has more experience, therefore that still makes him
superior than naruto.




Why did I learn French instead of Japanese or Chinese in high school? Dammit.

they didnt offer japanese in my high school, so i took spanish instead..
but now ima take it in college xD

Frey
October 12, 2007, 03:16 PM
Sigh they don't usually teach Chinese or Japanese in high school, usually its just french, german, spanish and sign language.

Well in Sweden, At least where I live, you've got about 15 different languages to chose between, the only thing that might stop you is that not enough ppl wants to learn that languague.

garaa89
October 12, 2007, 03:21 PM
i thimk that is kakashis turn to take naruto away for a couple of year to teach him some new justus

Okia
October 12, 2007, 03:26 PM
i thimk that is kakashis turn to take naruto away for a couple of year to teach him some new justus

i dont think naruto can learn any useful jutsu from kakashi..
unless kakashi know about the body flicker or the thunder [forgot wat its called] jutsu,.
then thatd be cool since kakashi is known for his incredible speed

destinator
October 12, 2007, 05:42 PM
Chapter is out, happy discussing.

Zaraky696
October 12, 2007, 06:08 PM
yeah Kakashi did say that Naruto might be stronger than him,.
but if they do a serious fight againts each other, Kakashi will still win.
Naruto just has a lot of chakra within him, I remember Kakashi mentioning
that Naruto's chakra is twice as strong as his chakra, and thats not including
the kyuubi's chakra.
So i guess wat Kakashi meant was that Naruto is much poweful [in terms of chakra]
than him now, but Kakashi still has more experience, therefore that still makes him
superior than naruto.

they didnt offer japanese in my high school, so i took spanish instead..
but now ima take it in college xD

Kakashi would only kill Naruto with a full thrust chidori to the heart, and yet I don't think it would be enough seeing the will of the kyuubi to live. As soon as Naruto would go 4tail+, it would be over for Kakashi.

Pain
October 12, 2007, 06:14 PM
can some1 post a link to the correct translation?

macherie
October 12, 2007, 06:45 PM
Here you go Pain
http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19767

Next time you're unsure of where to get the translation, go here
http://mangahelpers.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&f=446&page=1&pp=20&sort=lastpost&order=desc&daysprune=-1&threadprefix=Naruto

Enjoy the explosive chapter, still d/ling for me since i just got capped ;_;

lordHokage
October 12, 2007, 06:46 PM
Pervy Sage: A kid like you telling ME to grow up? That’s rich! For insulting his former sensei, Pervy Sage is going to beat the crap out of Pein. :spank

QMark
October 12, 2007, 06:50 PM
Wow, Pein really is a demented character. I know the whole destroying the world is such a cliche thing for villains but somehow the story still seems good to me. A few questions ran through my mind while reading this chapter though. My thoughts about the questions are in bold.

1.) Why is Yahiko merely but a distant memory? Perhaps along the way of fighting enemy after enemy, Nagato's pain began to separate him from his first purpose. Which was to protect Yahiko and Konan no matter what. Guess he didn't follow his nindo then eh?

2.) If Nagato was as cold to disregard Yahiko's death would he be also quick to dismiss Konan's as well if she were to die? I'm not entirely sure about this one. I mean, if he didn't really care he wouldn't have told Konan to get out of there. Maybe he just wants her alive until the purpose of Akatsuki is fulfilled?

IMO, Nagato thinks he is a god likely from not losing a battle and his strong will to protect everything. The only conclusion a person like him could come to would be to eradicate everyone. Its the only 100% way to protect ourselves from ourselves. Of course that seems to be his take on the situation.
This seems like flawed logic most will say because of the fact that afterwards there would be nothing to protect. Personally, I want to hold out for a better master plan. I'm sure Madara's is more interesting. *crosses fingers*

Also, about Nagato viewing himself as a god. A higher entity. I'm thinking this is because of his abilities. The eyes were of legend and were said to be able to bring destruction or creation. It seems Nagato chose destruction.

sharingan_kakashi
October 12, 2007, 06:57 PM
This is kinda like I. robot HAHA. Except the the army of robot is going to be replaced by Pain and his tailed-beast-powered Nuclear Weapons..

Gamaken!! awesome from. he has a samurai prong (??!) or a two headed staff? and a big saucer (shield) haha. I cant wait to see how his frog fights. I bet the chamelion vanishes or mimics things or both.

MrTeatime
October 12, 2007, 07:24 PM
Well in Sweden, At least where I live, you've got about 15 different languages to chose between, the only thing that might stop you is that not enough ppl wants to learn that languague.

depends on witch school you attendt to, I for one would gladly have read japanese but did not have that option.
[hr]


Also, about Nagato viewing himself as a god. A higher entity. I'm thinking this is because of his abilities. The eyes were of legend and were said to be able to bring destruction or creation. It seems Nagato chose destruction.

Were have you read that they have anything to do with destruction and creation?

Was it not Reincarnation? As the six paths probably reffered to the buddisth six realms (witch fits perfectely because the last and highest(most developed) level were inhabited by Gods.)

Sentou Ryoku
October 12, 2007, 07:32 PM
Jiraiya's last ditch effort before he dies...The upcoming chapters should prove interesting.

Hemostrat
October 12, 2007, 07:38 PM
Freakin amazing chapters. Loved the back story of Pein expanded even more and some more insight on how he wants to use the Bijuus. This next fight should be one of the best in the manga.

Decorus
October 12, 2007, 08:00 PM
So The third member of thier trio is long dead and forgotten. Sweet!!!
Pein doesn't want to destroy the world its more like Gundam Wing where the main "Villian" wanted to create the war to end all wars and bring peace by making a war so terrible people would never wish for another one.

renrutal
October 12, 2007, 08:15 PM
Pain is batshit villain cliché crazy.

He wants a... nuclear weapon? I suppose we used two to end a world war... but that's extreme nor the future is garanteed to be peaceful.

Sasha
October 12, 2007, 08:22 PM
Jiraiya is...a moron...!! (in a good way) lolz. And I think Yahiko died on Nagato... That's why he lived in suffering and all maybe? Nagato killing Yahiko is too... easy to guess, I guess!

wing_gundam
October 12, 2007, 08:31 PM
Does anybody else think that Pein using a replacement tech is pretty lame?

I mean he's supposed to be the nin with the best jutsu in the universe and he uses an f-ing log to escape???


Plus I hate the log idea... there are no logs in (a) a rainy city; (b) a room built out of steel; (c) j-man wouldn't fall for that

I think the writing for that part was incredibly lame....

dylec
October 12, 2007, 08:33 PM
This chapter is a unique one. A mix of comedy, action & background story all in one, how rare is that? ;]

wing_gundam
October 12, 2007, 08:35 PM
and it came out looking too much like a Pokemon episode...

richtoyz
October 12, 2007, 08:51 PM
should b a good fight
pein needs a good beating to realize that his reasoning is flawed
hopefully jiraiya is the man for the job

akatsuki27
October 12, 2007, 09:07 PM
a good chapter, even the way pein talks makes me fear for j-man's life.....im sure jiraiya will put up a good fight but in the end pein will be on top....and then he'll say, "a human could never stand up to a god"

DMNKLOL
October 12, 2007, 09:25 PM
and it came out looking too much like a Pokemon episode...

gotta catch 'em all >.>

gcd
October 12, 2007, 09:44 PM
Nice chapter, pain fight using kuchyosem just like jyraia, its gonna be a great fight, probably one of the best.

~Lilium~
October 12, 2007, 09:47 PM
mmm.... so there are 2 people with the ringed-eyes? cuz the one that jiraya calls nagato doesn't look like the one kanon was with before... *the one who controlled the rain* there attitudes aren't the same either....

so confused now... :confused

viat0r
October 12, 2007, 09:53 PM
lillium pain/nagato has 6 different bodies he can use/control its still him just in another of his bodies.

wing_gundam
October 12, 2007, 10:22 PM
we still haven't got the official word on how nagato became Pein

akatsuki27
October 12, 2007, 10:27 PM
im gunna spoil it for you guys right now.....pein probably killed yahiko, that's when he started referring to himself as a god.

p.s.
hooray 200 posts :party

garaa89
October 12, 2007, 10:38 PM
i think jiraiya will live because naruto still needs him to tell him about his father

TrieuDL
October 12, 2007, 11:22 PM
Damn I'm kinda disappointed by Pein's character actually. I thought he was bad-ass at first but after this chapter we've found out he's just a crazy nut. I wanted him to be evil but not like... insane. His techniques are cool at least.

bean
October 12, 2007, 11:26 PM
how are bubbles j man's weakness?

fremeer
October 13, 2007, 12:58 AM
not bubbles, water. they wash away the oil that he uses. he is a fire type user so water beats fire.
Any1 else think that the ultimate weapon thing has something to do with japan getting bombed during ww2? also jiraiya i think has a chance to live now, either that or some how have a way to tell konoha the real reason behind akatsuki.
Pain is obivously crazy. i can kind of see how as well. what happened is that yahiko died, nagato felt "pain" and decided the only thing he could do was bury his pain and get revenge. after a while that revenge festered and he starting thinking it was a way to stop wars by killing every1(very common manga thing, bad guys always have good motives but have a twisted outlook to achieve it, ie no people on planet=no war) . Now add in tobi and pain pretty much thinks he is doing the right thing.

Malica27
October 13, 2007, 01:21 AM
what did he mean by "But I'm no longer a human, either?"

The Noobslayer
October 13, 2007, 01:24 AM
what did he mean by "But I'm no longer a human, either?"

He is just saying he is no push over either, he is strong n such.

Alexis
October 13, 2007, 02:00 AM
Well the more I read the chapter, the more convinced I became that Pain is Yahiko. I'm definitely leaning towards that a lot more than Nagato, but either way is possible at this point.
But his speach about taking revenge on the world to make them understand the pain he went through was a carbon copy of Yahiko's speach. Just like I said in the previous chapter. His personality and ideals seem the same as Yahiko's and polar opposite to Nagato. Jiraya not believing that it's him and that he has change so much I can only agree with.
That and the manga still refers to him as Pain when he does his attack, and not Nagato for some reason.

Anyway, Jiraya's posing in the end not going quite as smoothly as he planned was hillarious. Now I really hope he doesnt die after all. His comical take on the whole thing makes me think there's hope for him yet.

Alexis
October 13, 2007, 02:31 AM
Yeah I agree. I also see it as a sign that he won't die. Even if that's typical of Jiraya, you'd think the mood leading up to his death would be a bit more serious than that, so I'm glad to see what I'd like to believe is a sign of him possibly surviving this encounter after all.

Frey
October 13, 2007, 02:34 AM
The last comment Jiraiya gives on The last Page of Chapter 374 is just great and it really strengthens my confident for him. I don't think he would be that confident if he wasn't sure he had some advantage or something. ( i hope he'll win ^^)

Alexis
October 13, 2007, 02:42 AM
And besides, I'd hate to see him go down against someone like Pain. I don't know about the rest of you, but that god complex of his realy turned me off. I have nothing against strong villains, but his dellusional "I have an answer to everything" attitude really bugs me.

Alexis
October 13, 2007, 02:55 AM
Yep, I think that this could be confirmed with the mood Jiraiya had in chapters 366 and 367. In that moment he only knew that it was the Akatsuki leader, but not exactly who he was... and he had only heard rumors, am I right? Therefore he might be a little bit scared (and then the mood that he was going to die), but now he knows who the Akatsuki leader is and so he is more confident... don't you think?
Yeah I'd say that Jiraya seems more confident now than he did before. Hopefully Jiraya knows how the Rinnegan works. You'd think so after spending three years training the kids.


Also: "I suppose since you're going to die, I can tell you my plans." So much arrogance, I'd say...
Apparently Pain has never watched a James Bond movie.

guesswho
October 13, 2007, 03:37 AM
I think Pain is Nagato and he turned into what he is when Yahiko died. He was sorrowing for a while and then he became a robot with no emotions at all.

And for Jiraya to act so confidently, and striking a pose, he's more himself than ever :P And since he's not even a bit worried, I think he can manage to fight Pain equally.

kadoman
October 13, 2007, 03:45 AM
Well the more I read the chapter, the more convinced I became that Pain is Yahiko. I'm definitely leaning towards that a lot more than Nagato, but either way is possible at this point.
But his speach about taking revenge on the world to make them understand the pain he went through was a carbon copy of Yahiko's speach. Just like I said in the previous chapter. His personality and ideals seem the same as Yahiko's and polar opposite to Nagato. Jiraya not believing that it's him and that he has change so much I can only agree with.
That and the manga still refers to him as Pain when he does his attack, and not Nagato for some reason.

Anyway, Jiraya's posing in the end not going quite as smoothly as he planned was hillarious. Now I really hope he doesnt die after all. His comical take on the whole thing makes me think there's hope for him yet.

Yeah, very interesting thought actually - I quite like your idea about Pain being Yahiko and, given the amount of evidence for it, I think it's entirely plausible.

I also agree with you about Jiraiya's comic moment! It was a nice little touch there and does make me wonder if Kishi really is going to do away with him - I'm beginning to think he'll survive! Let's hope so anyway!

As for the chapter itself, I thought it was interesting but Kishi's writing doesn't seem to be as fresh and thoughtful as it used to be. The whole 'I'll tell you my plans [Mr Bond]' thing made me cringe. Very amateur Kishi! :XD

Pain's 'new forbidden technique' seems to me a metaphor for the A-bomb that destroyed Hiroshima at the end of WWII - Kishi is making some kind of statement here. I'm not against the principle, but the idea of nuclear warfare seems a little dated now in our new age of terrorism (although I suppose when Kishi thought of this idea it was nearly 10 years ago). Still, it didn't grab me and I was kind of hoping that Pain's grand plans might be a little different.

Interestingly, Pain's motive - creating a weapon so terrifying that it will put a stop to all wars - does mirror real life to an extent. Since Truman's catastrophic decision in 1945, the world is afraid of repeating such an action and hasn't (although that doesn't stop the world's nations from stockpiling nuclear weapons all the same).

But on the other hand that bomb certainly did not stop all wars and, arguably, did make things worse - for a time anyway (think Cold War). There are other, more prolonged ways to inflict pain than a single terrifying weapon. I don't think Pain has thought that aspect through very carefully, whereas Jiraiya clearly has, and tried to point this out to him, but he's too arrogant to listen.

guesswho
October 13, 2007, 04:02 AM
It's completely irrelevant, but Cold War would've started anyway, with the nuclear bomb or without. It was just that USA wanted to show to another rising supernation (USSR) that they are still on the top, that and the fact the Japan didn't want to surrender although they'd technically lost already. Sorry about this post, it doesn't belong anywhere (certainly not here :P) but I just wanted to sort things out :D

Konkun
October 13, 2007, 05:02 AM
I have a feeling that Konan is holding back something, she didnt even responded to Jiraiya's question about Yahiko. When they were kids they were very close friends, but now turned bad. Nagato might be a 'god' but Konan is still human. I think she will help Jiraiya or even sacrifice herself to save him IF Jiraiya needs it.

Jiraiya still a badass, with the striking a pose in the face of danger. Nice hair too, beating a summoning with it, that sure beats Oro's tongue. I bet he's going to teach Nagato a thing or two in the next chapters, clearly they still haven't grown up. Jiraiya will show them that they are merely pawns.

ornis
October 13, 2007, 05:11 AM
So, does Pain really have to be a deep character on his own? Anyone wondering how else Pain could serve a purpose... besides by being a "well-composed" character (if "well-composed" only sums up to no clichéd role-playing)?

If he appears to already be well-composed regardless, what purpose could he serve...?

kadoman
October 13, 2007, 05:48 AM
It's completely irrelevant, but Cold War would've started anyway, with the nuclear bomb or without. It was just that USA wanted to show to another rising supernation (USSR) that they are still on the top, that and the fact the Japan didn't want to surrender although they'd technically lost already. Sorry about this post, it doesn't belong anywhere (certainly not here :P) but I just wanted to sort things out :D

Haha, I'd love to have a friendly debate with you over it, but the Cold War is really too off topic, especially when I mentioned it only in passing. Still, you're right and I didn't mean to make it sound so simplistic - that the Cold War began solely because of the presence of nuclear weapons -though I still think we can't discount their enormous influence.

I only meant to make the point that Pain's idea of creating this new-fangled technique that'd wipe out a country in seconds [= nuclear bomb] to stop all wars and bring peace doesn't ring true, just as it hasn't in our own world. Even Jiraiya knows that. He told Pain it won't bring peace and it certainly won't stop all wars. It'd just make things worse.

Pain is simply deluded and incredibly short sighted. Human nature is much more complex than even he can comprehend and, giant scary weapon or not, we'll find ways to inflict pain on each other.

Ornis, I think the purpose Pain serves is simply to be a vehicle for Kishi's message - for whatever statement he is going to make about war/life. He doesn't need to be a well developed character for that, he just has to be there to carry Kishi's message.

Still, I was hoping for a bit more originality on Kishi's part, though maybe I'm being unreasonable. War is, after all, a part of our world - always has been, always will be. It might not be original, but it's certainly relevant.

kn14
October 13, 2007, 07:07 AM
hey there,

new here. sorry to break up the flow but the spoiler discussion page is locked. someone posted this *kick ass* spoiler picture of pein and his six bodies which i guess turned out to be a fake because they didn't make an appearance in this week's chapter. Does anyone know where this went? I tried looking for it in the spoiler archive but couldn't find it.

Thanks.

AgentSmith
October 13, 2007, 07:31 AM
A nice chapter, so now we know Pains agenda but we still dont know why Madara wants the tailed beasts, or why he is at the valley of the end.
And Pains idea has logic behind it, i think its called the M.A.D. doctrine or Mutually Assured Destruction. The idea of M.A.D. is that if a country would perform a preemptive strike on another country with nuclear weapons the country thats under attack could also destroy the attacking country with their nuclear weapons. So in a sense it would bring peace between the larger countries but wars would still be fought in smaller countries.

Paradoxicon
October 13, 2007, 07:35 AM
I didn't like that chapter that much. Pain's motives are so cliche-like and like somebody else that, he's more insane than evil. But there's got to be another motive behind Pain's actions anyway cause of the Tobi issue.
But nothx to that "Mr Bond, you will die in a few minutes, so I will outline my genius plan to destroy the world."

Jiraya's techniques are awesome. The Frog Demon himself :D Pain was rather disappointing. A chameleon? A log replacement???

toniCHRYSA
October 13, 2007, 08:15 AM
I'm pretty sure that nagato really broke down when yahiko died.

I mean that's yahiko's idea, that's yahiko's way, making them feel the pain and suffering that he feels.

And that's why konan said to Jman on chapter 372 that they act to make his plans reality.

And then flashback came and shows yahiko's face :)

I kinda expected his ideals to be like that. that's why his name is pain. :D

They already gave it away on chapter 372. what yahiko said right?

"make them suffer the way we did"...

OH! And just because he used a log replacement doesn't mean his weak. I mean Jiraiya didn't even see him summon a chameleon. and to be able to summon a crab and chameleon almost at the same time? And maybe that's the power of his 2nd body.. hmmmmmm to be able to summon many animals hehe.. :D

puma
October 13, 2007, 08:50 AM
I have a feeling that Konan is holding back something, she didnt even responded to Jiraiya's question about Yahiko. When they were kids they were very close friends, but now turned bad. Nagato might be a 'god' but Konan is still human. I think she will help Jiraiya or even sacrifice herself to save him IF Jiraiya needs it.



I am very tempted to agree with you. Her non-commital attitude to the fight makes me wonder if she can be swayed into betraying Pain.
[hr]
Now that pain's ambition has been clearified, I really hope that Tobi's ambition is VERY different from his to make things more interesting.

gdupninja
October 13, 2007, 08:56 AM
This is turning out to be an interesting fight. A battle of the summons. I got to admit pain got some weird onez. I think Tobi is trying to gain the true power of the Uchiha. Yeah I dont know about Konan. Im not sure that she really had much of a choice in becoming a member of akatsuki. Maybe Yahiko tyried to stop Pain and he got killed. I dont know.

AngryChubbs
October 13, 2007, 09:58 AM
im liking the idea that yahiko is actually pain and he has somehow aquired nagato's eyes kinda like kakashi and his sharingan.
some reasons for this thought are that konan never said anything when jirayia asked her a question which leads me to think she is hiding something
and pain also said that "he remembers someone by that name, but he died a long time ago" dont you think its possible that he was referring to himself before he became a god. i mean, if i somehow aquired the "best eyes" i would think i was a pimp also.

so yahiko is actually pein...or at least thats what im betting on

ANBU4U
October 13, 2007, 10:04 AM
O, nuclear deterrents, how misguided are thee?

Still, one must admit its been the most effective way to stage off war (on a global scale) ever.

Now for smaller nations under the sphere of influence of the larger ones well.........The Village Hidden by the Rain is a fairly decent example.

Interesting Kishi.

lordHokage
October 13, 2007, 10:04 AM
This chapter was awesome. :jir_thumb :yourock Pein is a crazy :kukuku



This chapter is a unique one. A mix of comedy, action & background story all in one, how rare is that? ;]

Pervy Sage falling (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/374/15/ ) off Gamaken (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/374/17/ ) and body slamming (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/374/04/ ) Pein’s lobster (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/374/05/ ) was the best. :Haha

Who is this reliable ally appears in the form of Ken-san? :blink

Bowserfire
October 13, 2007, 10:13 AM
good chapter i think. the summon ken-san looks strong with that cactis-looking sword & that shield that looks like a dinner plate lol. i like how j-man is comic relief even in a serious battle.

also, after this chapter it seems alot less likely that Jiraiya will die. I mean, the information pain revealed to Jiraiya so far is quite alot. If Jiraiya dies all this information will be lost & kishi would have to waste more time & manga chapters explaining this all again somehow:). I dont think he'd want to do that.. lol.

kaylee
October 13, 2007, 10:33 AM
Pain is simply deluded and incredibly short sighted. Human nature is much more complex than even he can comprehend and, giant scary weapon or not, we'll find ways to inflict pain on each other.

Still, I was hoping for a bit more originality on Kishi's part, though maybe I'm being unreasonable. War is, after all, a part of our world - always has been, always will be. It might not be original, but it's certainly relevant.

I agree with this. When we first learned about Akatsuki's plan to use the tailed beasts to control wars, I was pretty disappointed with how cliched and pointless it seemed. But then we found out about Madara, and I thought that that must've been only Akatsuki's plan on the surface, while Madara, Pain, and Konan had some secret plan in mind.

Now we find out that Pain, at least, believes this plan to be true. So where does Madara come in? How does he benefit from this? I'm still holding out hope that he has a somewhat less cliched master plan in mind.

In this chapter, Pain comes across like an arrogant emo brat. More self-aggrandizing and more emo than Sasuke ever was. (Does his speech to Jiraiya remind anyone else of Sasuke's speech to Orochimaru, right before he killed him?)

And yet, I'm still interested in Pain's character, mostly because I find the link to the buddhist six realms of suffering intriguing. The sixth realm is characterized by intense suffering, godlike powers, and pride. Sound familiar? So, do I think Pain's current body represents the 6th realm? Well, not exactly. I think that every time Pain added a body, he descended to a lower realm of suffering. So now Pain, collectively, is in the lowest realm of "hell", and I guess he wants to bring the rest of the world with him.

samsiufan
October 13, 2007, 11:27 AM
IMO, Nagato thinks he is a god likely from not losing a battle and his strong will to protect everything. The only conclusion a person like him could come to would be to eradicate everyone. Its the only 100% way to protect ourselves from ourselves. Of course that seems to be his take on the situation.
This seems like flawed logic most will say because of the fact that afterwards there would be nothing to protect. Personally, I want to hold out for a better master plan. I'm sure Madara's is more interesting. *crosses fingers*

Also, about Nagato viewing himself as a god. A higher entity. I'm thinking this is because of his abilities. The eyes were of legend and were said to be able to bring destruction or creation. It seems Nagato chose destruction.

Here's what i think about Pain:

I think Pain is a psychopath imprisoned by his destiny due to the possesion of the Rin'negan. Remember what Ero Sennin said in his flashback (CH 373) about those eyes..a tool of god for salvation when the world is in chaos or a weapon that would destroy all creation....

http://groups.msn.com/NarutoMangaReturns/chapter373english.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=45193

I think Pain is crazy but not necessarily through his own fault but maybe due to what he possesses...It is his destiny and you can't really split both! Pain is both the criminal and the victim in this life of his!

Pain probably thinks he his bringing salvation to the world...he is just using other Akatsuki members to further his goals....

Saifi
October 13, 2007, 11:41 AM
to me jiraya striking a pose etc , just shows that he is completely comfortable with the idea of his death, he already took care of what he needs to do and because of this he can fight at his maximum regardless of the outcome of this battle.

Besides you are only cocky in 2 situations , 1 - when you know that the person in front of you is insignificant (pain's attitude) and 2- When you know that there is no hope of victory/escape so why not ? (jiraya's attitude)

So ya i think jiraya will die but pain will probably use konan as a shield or whatever to block jiraya's jutsu , or use j man's humanity against him to finish him off , for some reason i dont see konan surviving the fight (even tho she is out of it ATM) .

Also i don see why people are so annoyed at pain's reiteration of the plan to rule over the world AND to make war sooo gruesome that no one would do it.Granted that it will not end war , but it is an ideal that was practiced in real life, and as far as world conquest goes ... What would YOU do if you had the kind of superpowers pain has or believed that you are a god?

I seriously doubt that i would have the self discipline to do anything other than try to take over the world

C.O.R
October 13, 2007, 12:20 PM
great chapter :-))

samsiufan
October 13, 2007, 12:31 PM
I am beginning to think now that those eyes...Rin'negan are a blessing and a curse.....I think through those eyes you can wield great power but at the same time you are subject to its purpose whatever that purpose is in your generation. When the sage of the six paths had those eyes, the purpose was for creation. Now that Pain has those eyes, the purpose is for distruction and the host has no control over that purpose and must attempt to fulfill it.

It is quite interesting that since the founder of the whole ninja world, no one else has played host to those eyes until now...it has been many generations. Well there have been no other reported apperances of the Rin'negan since the Sage of the Six paths.

I think the Rin'negan is not a Kekkai Genkai per se...because it is not inherited by bloodline etc but the host is selected...the question is by whom?

Hemostrat
October 13, 2007, 12:53 PM
Going back to the end of the last page here with where people were talking about how nukes haven't ended war just made everything even worse. But you have to understand something, in Naruto, there is not a single power in the world (that we know of) that can fight equally against the Kyuubi, LET ALONE the other eight bijuus. Pain's theory is that the people that basically hired him will be too afraid to use the jutsu again because its so frighteningly strong. Whether or not that will work... we can only wait and see.