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Ken-Oh
April 16, 2008, 10:32 AM
I have a bit of a random theory but what if Aizen is actualy the good guy?

Like it has been said before, the Shinigami wipeout anyone they perceive as a danger to the stability of the spirit and real world. Examples are of course the Quincy, Hollows and if you want to bring filler into this the Bounto.

If Aizen intention is to kill the Spirit King, he does have the capabilty to go to war with the Soul Society but chooses not to. Why? Because he does not wish to bring innocent souls into this conflict.

By creating the Arrancar, Aizen made them more Sentient then in there previous forms and therefore acountable for there actions. In theory if all Hollows were made into Arrancar then they would be capable of starting a civilized society like the Shinigami, punishing criminals and such. Soul Society's problem with this would be that it removes there position of power, the only need for the Shinigami would be to for soul burial's.

I know its a bit far out but an idea like that would explain why Gin and Tousen joined him to begin with.

Richo
April 16, 2008, 12:15 PM
I have a bit of a random theory but what if Aizen is actualy the good guy?

Like it has been said before, the Shinigami wipeout anyone they perceive as a danger to the stability of the spirit and real world. Examples are of course the Quincy, Hollows and if you want to bring filler into this the Bounto.

the quincy were a threat to the whole universal balance of souls, and they got the thing they deserved to in a way (annilhation wasnt the right thing wich is obvious however if they fail to listen to the shinigami there has to be taken action). Hollows dont get killed they get purified and sent to SS (i believe it has been explained by rukia why hollows and shinigami exist). Bounto werent a threat until they tried to destroy SS.


If Aizen intention is to kill the Spirit King, he does have the capabilty to go to war with the Soul Society but chooses not to. Why? Because he does not wish to bring innocent souls into this conflict.

By creating the Arrancar, Aizen made them more Sentient then in there previous forms and therefore acountable for there actions. In theory if all Hollows were made into Arrancar then they would be capable of starting a civilized society like the Shinigami, punishing criminals and such. Soul Society's problem with this would be that it removes there position of power, the only need for the Shinigami would be to for soul burial's.

I know its a bit far out but an idea like that would explain why Gin and Tousen joined him to begin with.

All adjuchas and vasto lodre are able to think normaly, however they are being driven by the hunger after souls (i presume its not much off a difference with arrancar). You cant change a person his nature.
Shinigami their task has always been:
1. keep order in the human world
2. keep order in SS
3. Purify sinned souls in the human world and SS (hollows should be kept in place like any criminal)
4. use soul burials on souls
My gues would be that all shinigami would be relieved if no hollows would exist, since it would get 1 thing of their job discription and their job becomes alot less dangerous. The shinigami could actualy put some attention in the poorest parts of Rukongai for example.

aizen his true intention were to kill the king of SS, and stand in heaven. we still have to find about the dimension called "heaven" and kings realm since both are unknown to us. I do believe there is a dimension wich can be reffered to as heaven where the purest of souls go to wich done nothing but good in the human life aswell as in their soul life (we have SS and HM as opposite, however we have Hell but how about heaven then?).
I do admit that SS their way of handling isnt the correct one but SS is like any other government in this world.

JioFreed666
April 16, 2008, 01:10 PM
I think he's trying to keep the balance from ever breaking reason I say that is because with soul society purfiying hollows at such a high rate and rarely any going to hell(NOT HM but actual hell we haven't heard anything about the real bad guy from hell yet) and with him as spirit king he will shift this some how

Sarmad
April 16, 2008, 01:18 PM
theory dismissed XD

No sorry, but i honestly think that Aizen's the biggest bastard of them all and that it's actually good that way.
If you forgot what happened during the SS arc i recommend that you rewatch it. Especially that scene where Hinamori is stabbed, Hitsugaya is sliced and where Aizen takes his time to explain what the hack he was doing all that time ^^

You could have considered Aizen being a good guy if Aizen had not attempted to kill those people who didn't need to being killed off by him in order to reach his goal. (HINAMORI!!! NO THREAT AT ALL???!)

JioFreed666
April 16, 2008, 01:25 PM
just because you work for the good guys dosen't mean your innocent and haven't tried to kill other people look at kenpachi.....he's on ichigo's side the "GOOD" side that we know off but there alot of unexplained elements of the bleach universe from why weren't half the hollows we've seen sent to hell after there defeat and remember Shinigami in soul soceity were the good side before they wanted to excute rukia then we all saw them as bad guys in one way or another. So Aizen's concept of good might very from the norm just like Ichigo who wants to brake all the rules just to protect those he cares fore.....so from others views ICHIGO IS ACTUALLY PROMOTING ANARCHY by saying "I'll get things done the way I know how by breaking the rules"

Richo
April 16, 2008, 03:56 PM
just because you work for the good guys dosen't mean your innocent and haven't tried to kill other people look at kenpachi.....he's on ichigo's side the "GOOD" side that we know off but there alot of unexplained elements of the bleach universe from why weren't half the hollows we've seen sent to hell after there defeat and remember Shinigami in soul soceity were the good side before they wanted to excute rukia then we all saw them as bad guys in one way or another. So Aizen's concept of good might very from the norm just like Ichigo who wants to brake all the rules just to protect those he cares fore.....so from others views ICHIGO IS ACTUALLY PROMOTING ANARCHY by saying "I'll get things done the way I know how by breaking the rules"

a shinigami purifies a hollow into a normal soul if that purified soul sinned to much in his human life he will be taken to hell (rukia explained that a zanpaktou can only purify the sins after dead)

dreamzsai
April 16, 2008, 08:11 PM
Yea, and actually Aizen is Ichigo's father....

xD Just kidding, i wont want another "StarWars" thing happening...but the theory that Aizen is actually a good guy doesnt seem to be possible at all.

JioFreed666
April 16, 2008, 11:50 PM
a shinigami purifies a hollow into a normal soul if that purified soul sinned to much in his human life he will be taken to hell (rukia explained that a zanpaktou can only purify the sins after dead)

There bodies unlike hollows who usually evaporate are still there and remain there and just like normal dead people.....so I 'm not sure what your smoking but yeah the bodies of Espada, pervious and numeros are still around if you check back on the chapters they died because they ACTUALLY DIED. Making me wonder what Aizen is doing and what the Shinigami's true intention is and making question every single side's rationality of what is good and what is wrong in their eyes

For Shingami:
Good side:They purify souls and make sure other pure souls aren't devoured
Bad Side:Rukia was going to be killed for simply allow a human to do her job for a short time(6 months which is a short time when she's over 50 years old? and shinji is well over 200 at least)

For Aizen's side:
Good Side:they are trying to change the order(for the better or worst we don't know we only assume it's the worst)
Bad side:they are willing to kill a few 100 people to change it

Ichigo's team side(during and after Soul society)
Good:They are helping each other through life or death situations
Bad:They are breaking all rules set to do it even though everything goes good on their side at the end

Vizard's Side:
Good:They are making sure to help other vizards control their power
Bad:They can turn against each other or soul society at ANYTIME

Urahara's Side
Good:they help out only the "good" guys
Bad: they some times leave the godly technology in a place that the enemy has already though of and is tracking down

Arrancar side outside of Aizen's side(Nel Tu before she joined ichigo and possibly grimmjaw if he's alive):
Good:they don't really care about going to the human world and wrecking everything and really don't wish to fight
Bad:They can change there mind at any time

there's always a good and bad side to everything anyone dose

Richo
April 17, 2008, 04:26 AM
There bodies unlike hollows who usually evaporate are still there and remain there and just like normal dead people.....so I 'm not sure what your smoking but yeah the bodies of Espada, pervious and numeros are still around if you check back on the chapters they died because they ACTUALLY DIED. Making me wonder what Aizen is doing and what the Shinigami's true intention is and making question every single side's rationality of what is good and what is wrong in their eyes

this might be because ichigo only fought against 2 arrancar in HM and he didnt kill either off them, he left them half dead and 1 got finished off out of sigh and the other one is still unknown. I might need to read up on the manga when a hollow gets killed but iirc they all vaporise and go to SS as a purified soul.

JioFreed666
April 17, 2008, 04:47 AM
.....I'm tallking about the Espada if you go and look they're bodies where still there even after they had actually died go back and look at the fight with the black espada he died but was laying there dead as a door nail

Tsukisama
April 17, 2008, 07:05 AM
.....I'm tallking about the Espada if you go and look they're bodies where still there even after they had actually died go back and look at the fight with the black espada he died but was laying there dead as a door nail

If you are referring to Zommari, then he did vaporize upon death (http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/302/17/).

patedecarne
April 17, 2008, 07:17 AM
Aizen being a good guy doesn't suit very well here; just look at the gaiden: the last panel of -108 show us the true Aizen we know; now he's going to make the OUken is SS, but that fake city was really karakura, Aizen would destroy it without any hesitation;

Indeed, his true goal still is unknown: we know he wants to kill the King, but for what purpose? that's where lies another great secret, because after kills the king, Aizen must have a great plan to put in action

gfire2
April 17, 2008, 07:26 AM
aizen is tryin to find his parents

gigantor21
April 17, 2008, 08:58 AM
^ Where did that come from? :blink

I'm in the "Aizen is a dirty psychotic bastard" camp. He's a lot cooler that way IMO--and he doesn't have to be good to want to maintain the world's balance. There's no point in being the God of a world that's falling apart. :p

Darek Khort
April 25, 2008, 07:48 PM
Yea, Aizen better not end up like Itachi in Naruto "it was his mission to annihilate his family".
I.e., it better not be something like "Aizen is good. He was told by old-man Yamma to wreck havoc on SS".

gigantor21
April 26, 2008, 09:32 AM
^ That second one would be pretty intriguing, actually--but only if Aizen AND Yama were both evil. But having to fight Aizen and Yamamoto at the same time would be insurmountable. :p

patedecarne
April 27, 2008, 12:05 AM
Well, to fight with Aizen and Yammamoto together, is better to call Tengen Toppa Gurren Laggan and just throw some galaxies in Aizen and Yammamoto, hehe

But after seeing the episode where Aizen went with the hollows, when he said" I'll be in god's throne or something like that", I'm starting to believe that Aizen wants to be the new king;

if the king is something like god, then makes sense to Aizen to kill him and just be the new god;

gigantor21
April 27, 2008, 12:05 PM
Well, to fight with Aizen and Yammamoto together, is better to call Tengen Toppa Gurren Laggan and just throw some galaxies in Aizen and Yammamoto, hehe

YES. An Infinity Big Bang Storm would be the only thing left that could work. ;)


But after seeing the episode where Aizen went with the hollows, when he said" I'll be in god's throne or something like that", I'm starting to believe that Aizen wants to be the new king;

if the king is something like god, then makes sense to Aizen to kill him and just be the new god;

Well, Yamamoto said the King doesn't have any power, and is merely a symbolic leader (much like the real emperor of Japan or the Queen of England), so Aizen would subvert the entire role of the King by doing that. Still, the idea that he's done all this just to take his Majesty's head shows that it's a very big title in SS. I'm surprised we've only heard about him once TBH.

JioFreed666
May 06, 2008, 03:50 PM
I've been asking around about this for a while but never posed the question straight up

He slaughtered Room 46....so they could have been easily corrupt in the first place and we don't know what kind of people they excatly were

He wanted Rukia dead....it's called sacrifices for a greater cause even because there was no confirmed way she was going to live through the way he was forced to end up doing it.

He sided with the Hollows....You must remember hollows aren't bad souls just souls that are driven to the point where they become monsters

He wants to slaughter K-town....again sacrifice is required for a greater cause. people have been trying to teach Ichigo that since day one from when he wanted to get his powers back he could have lost himself and became a hollow. when he wanted to gain control of his vizard he was forced to shut himself away from his friends.

He wants to kill the spirit king.......we don't know who the current king is or how he operates

so far there are no big things against Aizen that you couldn't excatly hold against ichigo

Ichigo and his team are responsible for breaking into the inner court almost fatally wounding over five members of the higher ranks of the 13 squads kind of framed for the murder of one captain. Stopping an execution and intruding on offical business at the same time.

Before we found out Aizen was the one pulling the strings from the view of soul society Ichigo's team was the evil element in soul society even thought we the reader(/viewer) knew the whole picture except for Aizen the whole time

Basically the same idea (Aizen=good?), so I merged the threads.
And please discuss any problems with, or comments on our edits via PM.

lordHokage
May 07, 2008, 05:23 PM
I don’t think Aizen is evil after all the jury is still out on his mysterious past. He must have a good reason why he wants to overthrow the king of Soul Society. :D

alias85
May 10, 2008, 04:08 PM
I actually kind of agree with you man. If Aizen was the main character of this series, it'd be 100 times better and probably make us think that the Shinigami we're corrupt and elitest pricks. It's all a matter of how you look at it. There is some justice behind Aizen's reasoning; this is supported by Tousen teaming up with him.

Muuugen
May 10, 2008, 05:44 PM
@jiofreed666
I am 99% that the "king" is old man zangetsu.
cause if you think about it, not much is known about him, all the other zanpakuto spirits are like some kind of animal. but not zangetsu..
the other BIG reason why I think it's him, is because of this "dimension" thing...the dimension that old man zangetsu resides does not look so different from a real city, k-town?? anyway zangetsu obviously knows alot and holds some secret, even at one occasion he mentioned the rank of a "usual" shinigami who wears a normal zanpaktuo (that can never be captain bla bla)...think about it?

now, let's see some response

Tsukisama
May 11, 2008, 12:14 AM
@jiofreed666
I am 99% that the "king" is old man zangetsu.
cause if you think about it, not much is known about him, all the other zanpakuto spirits are like some kind of animal. but not zangetsu..

We don't that all other zanpakutou spirits are animals, since we have seen so few. I could easily imagine Benihime and Sode no Shirayuki being humanoid spirits.

Ken-Oh
May 11, 2008, 12:55 PM
We don't that all other zanpakutou spirits are animals, since we have seen so few. I could easily imagine Benihime and Sode no Shirayuki being humanoid spirits.

Muuugen clearly had a good idea but theres not much in the way of evidence, quite a thought tho as zangetsu an ichigos hollow talk alot about bein king. Cnt see how it would work tho.

A gud twist on that would be that the royal guard wer killed in an assasination attempt on the king. The king escapes to find urahara and have himself sealed into a new dimension. Urahara contacted his fellow exile and former captain isshin and sealed him within his son ichigo. This is the reason behind ichigos great spirtual power and also his inability to control it as much of it isnt his own. When ichigo gained shinigami powers the king becomes sealed into ichigo's zanpakuto and takes on the role of zangetsu.

Bit of a far out idea but would be pretty cool.

Tsukisama
May 12, 2008, 02:21 PM
Muuugen clearly had a good idea but theres not much in the way of evidence, quite a thought tho as zangetsu an ichigos hollow talk alot about bein king. Cnt see how it would work tho.

A gud twist on that would be that the royal guard wer killed in an assasination attempt on the king. The king escapes to find urahara and have himself sealed into a new dimension. Urahara contacted his fellow exile and former captain isshin and sealed him within his son ichigo. This is the reason behind ichigos great spirtual power and also his inability to control it as much of it isnt his own. When ichigo gained shinigami powers the king becomes sealed into ichigo's zanpakuto and takes on the role of zangetsu.

Bit of a far out idea but would be pretty cool.

I also think that Muugen's theory about the Zangetsu being the King is an interesting idea, but I only had a problem on the part that I quoted. Other than the humanoid zanpakutou spirit reasoning, the logic behind his theory was fairly sound, and as you said, Zangetsu and Ichigo's inner hollow bring up talk of being "king" quite a bit. It is possible, although I don't know how Kubo would try to explain it.

gigantor21
May 12, 2008, 08:48 PM
^ +1 to that. It would be awesome, but it'd take a hell of a lot of reasoning to explain it. Kubo would have to devote a whole volume to it like he did with Aizen in Volume 20.

Personally, I've always thought Zanpakuto spirits were the souls of former Shinigami, who mixed with, and transformed the spirits of infants to create new potential Shinigami. Zangetsu knowing so much when he was (supposedly) born with Ichigo suggests that IMO. If so, then I could see him being the former king--which would explain Ichigo's crazy development--but Zangetsu being the CURRENT king is a whole different matter.

lordHokage
May 13, 2008, 09:26 AM
I actually kind of agree with you man. If Aizen was the main character of this series, it'd be 100 times better and probably make us think that the Shinigami we're corrupt and elitest pricks. It's all a matter of how you look at it. There is some justice behind Aizen's reasoning; this is supported by Tousen teaming up with him.


I agree with you. The Soul Society operates under a no free zone. If you are not on board with their ideals, you are their enemy. All the other former Soul Reapers ideals are not evil. :blink

patedecarne
May 13, 2008, 09:29 AM
The theory is interesting, but two kings? the old one, Zangetsu and the new one? Of course, could be plausible(even because in the present time, I really believe that Royal Guard is no more; I don't know why, but I always had the feeling that the King, in the actual moment, is unprotected, or at best, 1 captain class Shinigami is protecting him, but I don't know if all of RG was killed or something else) but then, the Royal Realm would be totally unprotected, and any person could become the King, and if you think about it, the mess in SS is really old;

The plot would get a hell of twist, but I'm afraid that Kubo would need about 20 to 30 chapters only to explain it, and with this, Kubo also could extends the story for more 200 chapters, but then I could predict DBZ's same direction, and we know all the bads from the latest sagas in DBZ...

But when you think carefully here, there's so many unexplained things, damn!

gigantor21
May 13, 2008, 05:12 PM
^ Well, that's just it. There's so little we know about the King right now. The way Matsumoto described him, it seemed more like he was an sacred treasure than a person--no one in the current story has any connection to him that we know of. That's why we've seen such a wide array of theories as to who he is and who's protecting him. Hell, the idea that there was more than one king, as you said, is an idea with no basis in fact right now. But I just wanted to put it out there.

JioFreed666
May 15, 2008, 11:31 PM
Just to tell you all it was originally my theory that Ichigo or part of him was something more then just the hero of the story who was breaking all the rules and the Old man Zangetsu was actually more then just a Zanpakuto

redcometfm
May 17, 2008, 06:30 PM
The plot would get a hell of twist, but I'm afraid that Kubo would need about 20 to 30 chapters only to explain it, and with this, Kubo also could extends the story for more 200 chapters, but then I could predict DBZ's same direction, and we know all the bads from the latest sagas in DBZ...


Hey man, dont rag on DBZ. The last sagas sucked in the anime version bc they were dragged out but they were great in the manga. Hell, Buu Saga (manga) was pretty incredible. The length and quality makes it equivalent to a greek mythological of Illiad proportions. The only saga that was bleh was Cell cuz it dragged a bit. Other than that, there's nothing wrong with the manga, just the anime (stare off for 30 mins!!!).

Point is: if Bleach did slightly do that, I don't think it'd turn out bad. I'd only be worried about the anime version.