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crono
May 10, 2008, 11:01 PM
There are currently 7 characters who can be considered the "bad guys" in Bleach. They are the 3 traitorous captains, and the 4 remaining espada (yes, there are some others, but they are very weak/defeated).

On the other side, you have 23 captains & lieutenants, ichigo and his high school gang, urahara and his shop gang, yoruichi, isshin and ryuuken. There are also the Vaizards who seem to be on Ichigo's side.

Judging from this major imbalance of numbers, there has to be some traitors on the "good guy" side. I'm not sure what direction Kubo is going to go. The easy bet would be the vaizards, but I'm not sure if Kubo would make the obvious choice. What do you all think?

Tsukisama
May 10, 2008, 11:31 PM
It depends on how long Kubo is planning to go with the manga. If Kubo is only planning about two more arcs, then he is fine with the characters he has. If he wants a longer run for Bleach, then he will need to introduce more villains.

I like Bleach, but I don't want it it to be dragged out too much. Aizen is already tremendously powerful and to introduce more villains, they would need to be as powerful as (if not more powerful than) Aizen.

None of the current good guys seem like they would turn traitor. The only wild card current is the vizard group, and their position is being defined with this gaiden. They could turn out to be a threat, lengthening the plot, but I don't think that they will at this point.

Silhouette
May 11, 2008, 01:50 AM
You forgot that there are characters that have not been introduced yet like the King and the royal family.Nothing is known about their identity, capability and their views and so I think they make a good choice for new opponents. For example, what if Aizen is defeated and then one of the Royal family or the King himself goes crazy for letting Aizen get too close to him? What if the King decides to take things into his hands instead of leaving them to the 13 divisions?
I am thinking things like conflicts, schemes, mysteries...you know the good stuff.

Tsukisama
May 12, 2008, 02:11 PM
You forgot that there are characters that have not been introduced yet like the King and the royal family.Nothing is known about their identity, capability and their views and so I think they make a good choice for new opponents. For example, what if Aizen is defeated and then one of the Royal family or the King himself goes crazy for letting Aizen get too close to him? What if the King decides to take things into his hands instead of leaving them to the 13 divisions?
I am thinking things like conflicts, schemes, mysteries...you know the good stuff.

If this comment is in response to mine, then I was only discussing characters that have been introduced into the story thus far. A new character (including characters who have only been mentioned and not yet appeared in the story) is a blank slate and can be written to be anything including being a traitor. That would go without saying. I believe that the person who created this topic was focusing on currently introduced characters becoming traitors and not new characters being introduced to be antagonists.

crono
May 12, 2008, 05:12 PM
If this comment is in response to mine, then I was only discussing characters that have been introduced into the story thus far. A new character (including characters who have only been mentioned and not yet appeared in the story) is a blank slate and can be written to be anything including being a traitor. That would go without saying. I believe that the person who created this topic was focusing on currently introduced characters becoming traitors and not new characters being introduced to be antagonists.

Yes, I was talking about the current characters. I just feel like there are too many good guys and not enough bad guys. I don't imagine that the royal guard will be bad guys either, but who knows.

I am excited to see some new Shikai's/bankai's of the vaizards though. I think that is why Bleach was so addicting in the SS arc. Everyone was waiting to see what kind of powers the various shinigami had.

I also thought about if aizen replaces the current espada with a new set that are all vastolorde, but that would also just be introducting new characters. That sounds somewhat boring though. Kind of like if Naruto introduced a new set of Akakstuki.

gigantor21
May 12, 2008, 09:43 PM
Tsuki, I'm gonna have to disagree with you here.

I think things are way imbalanced, too. The captains on Earth are the best ones around, so they should be able to take on the remaining HM forces, and the Vaizards could get involved if they get overwhelmed. I don't see why they'd need anyone else unless more villains are introduced--especially if Ichigo and Co. manage to leave HM before the fighting ends.

We still have viable options for more enemies IMO. The King being evil is a bit much, but the VL issue going under the radar leaves room for them to emerge at some point. Also, Aizen never said there weren't more traitors in SS; given how the Aizen thing came out of nowhere, I could imagine seeing more spies among the Gotei 13. But those are just random ideas.

Without new villains, Ulquiorra would be the strongest opponent not on Earth right now, and he's bound to lose to Ichigo this time. That just leaves Wonderweiss and Yammi in HM and no enemies in SS at all. How Kubo spins something worthy of being called a war out of that is anyone's guess.

Razh
May 13, 2008, 05:45 AM
Now that I think about it... Do you guys think that Hinamori could be working for Aizen all this time? After all, she was his lieutenant for some time. There was plenty of time for him to manipulate her or convince her to join him. And I don't think anyone is suspicious of her after she had "died". I don't think that would be the case if she was left alive.
I can't remeber every moment with her in the time before and just after Aizen's death, and I don't feel like reading it again now, so I can't really say if this is really possible.
Maybe one of you remembers more clearly.

gigantor21
May 13, 2008, 08:10 AM
^ I highly doubt that.

For one, she's just a Vice Captain. Unless she was a Vaizard like Hiyori or Lisa, she'd have no use to Aizen as a fighter. What's more, she went ape shit after seeing his "corpse", tried to kill her best friend because of a fake will, and looked genuinely horrified when Aizen stabbed her. Nothing in the story suggests that she's a co-conspirator, or that she'd even have the strength to help him if she was (since she's still recovering from the hole in her chest).

patedecarne
May 13, 2008, 09:15 AM
New traitors, from what I can see, only if they're from the 3 people introduced in chapter -104; and to remain a traitor until the present days is a great task, even when Aizen already proved to be the great menace, and such person wouldn't fit so well in the present plot;

I wouldn't call Vaizard traitors, though, because they won't betray any side, they're in their own after the gaiden, but something else must happen in the series, because the forces are too unbalanced now: Ichigo vs Ulquiorra in HM and the remaining captains in fake Karakura vs Aizen and the top 3 espadas, so Aizen and co. are terrible outnumbered right now

I don't think that new traitors will show up, but instead, I would risk to say that Vaizards could be a new threat: They aren't with SS, they aren't with Aizen, then they must have another reason to fight for, and ths reason will guide the plot after Aizen, I believe;

Razh
May 13, 2008, 09:33 AM
^ I highly doubt that.

For one, she's just a Vice Captain. Unless she was a Vaizard like Hiyori or Lisa, she'd have no use to Aizen as a fighter. What's more, she went ape shit after seeing his "corpse", tried to kill her best friend because of a fake will, and looked genuinely horrified when Aizen stabbed her. Nothing in the story suggests that she's a co-conspirator, or that she'd even have the strength to help him if she was (since she's still recovering from the hole in her chest).

It all stands. But it could just as well all be an act. You have to remeber that we thought that Aizen is dead and it turned out he wasn't.
I'm not saying that he needs her strenght or something like it. Maybe she needs to do something inside SS.
I just have a feeling that Aizen's plot in SS had more layers, which we aren't even aware of.

gigantor21
May 13, 2008, 05:07 PM
It all stands. But it could just as well all be an act. You have to remeber that we thought that Aizen is dead and it turned out he wasn't.
I'm not saying that he needs her strenght or something like it. Maybe she needs to do something inside SS.
I just have a feeling that Aizen's plot in SS had more layers, which we aren't even aware of.

Not only do I agree, but I think deeper layers to the conspiracy are desperately needed to make the next arc work. As it stands, the "War" will just be a succession of Espada-Captain fights, followed by a treck to the Royal Palace for a final showdown with Aizen. That alone won't amount to very much, given how mixed the last fights were in terms of quality, and because it'll be so shallow. The story needs more depth than what we have.

Tsukisama
May 13, 2008, 09:37 PM
Tsuki, I'm gonna have to disagree with you here.

I think things are way imbalanced, too. The captains on Earth are the best ones around, so they should be able to take on the remaining HM forces, and the Vaizards could get involved if they get overwhelmed. I don't see why they'd need anyone else unless more villains are introduced--especially if Ichigo and Co. manage to leave HM before the fighting ends.

We still have viable options for more enemies IMO. The King being evil is a bit much, but the VL issue going under the radar leaves room for them to emerge at some point. Also, Aizen never said there weren't more traitors in SS; given how the Aizen thing came out of nowhere, I could imagine seeing more spies among the Gotei 13. But those are just random ideas.

Without new villains, Ulquiorra would be the strongest opponent not on Earth right now, and he's bound to lose to Ichigo this time. That just leaves Wonderweiss and Yammi in HM and no enemies in SS at all. How Kubo spins something worthy of being called a war out of that is anyone's guess.

I don't exactly see how you are disagreeing with me. :confused I am only saying that none of the current good guys seem like they would become evil. I am not saying that no new villains can appear on the scene.

I also think that the balance of power is heavily stacked on the side of good right now, and more villains are needed to ensure the longevity of Bleach, but I don't think those villains will come from one of the current good guys turning evil. Spies among the ranks of SS are not included in my statement, but characters that have been previously named and identified as good characters (Ichigo's friends/family, Urahara's group, SS captains/lieutenants, the named other SS shinigami like Hanatarou, the Shiba Clan & associates, etc.) are not likely to be made villains at this point.

gigantor21
May 13, 2008, 09:54 PM
^ LOL I thought you meant we wouldn't be seeing any new villains AT ALL. Sorry about that. :p

So where do you think the new villains would come from?

Tsukisama
May 13, 2008, 10:09 PM
I have no clue. :hbunny

It would have to be either from HM (like the emergence of a VL faction or something like that) or the King's dimension (since it is filled with powerful beings and nothing about them is known). I honestly have no idea where Kubo is going to find new villains.

The most logical idea would be if there were extremely powerful VL arrancar that had formed their own group in seclusion from Aizen's forces that could appear later.

patedecarne
May 14, 2008, 12:23 PM
IMO, from Hell itself!

Ok, then let's take a look in the situation after Aizen:(I'm considering that Ichigo will be the one responsible for defeat Aizen) Ichigo will be the stronger, not even Vastolordes won't be able to touch him; Let's suppose that Hougyoku will be destroyed, or retrieved, then now arrancars won't be a option; then let's take off HM from the list;


Earth as well, because I cannot believe that someone even stronger than Aizen could be raised in earth, then only two options left: SS and Hell;

A possibility could be what Gig said, the King going crazy and so the RG( if they still exist), but at this point, Ichigo would be more than enough to take them down;

So, the only one remaining is Hell; We don't know anything about hell nor what kind of humans(?) live there, and a new type of enemy would be a good thing right now;

crono
May 15, 2008, 01:41 AM
I really hope Kubo can pull off a great plot twist with the existing characters. That would be a lot more fulfilling then just introducing new bad ass characters that were never referenced before.

Maybe the #1 bad guy is actually Urahara! Why, I don't know but if Kubo could make it somehow happen logically, that would be interesting :)

2xMachina
May 15, 2008, 08:12 AM
The SS are EVIL!

And Ichigo and Co. will have to fight them. :)

Long story then.

OhDearMoshe
May 15, 2008, 04:27 PM
Hold on. 5 Remaining Espada.

I alawys figured Soul Society would be the final villains of the series. After all their ethic's are murky at best.

gigantor21
May 15, 2008, 05:07 PM
^ I could see Nell being used as a harbinger for that.

Yama, in his overzealous "kill and isolate everything that might hurt us" mentality, could find out about Nell during or after the war and order her killed. Ichigo wouldn't let that happen--he knows she doesn't want to hurt anyone, and could easily argue that she's better than some of the Shinigami (Mayuri, Zaraki, the Exiles, etc.). It's not something that could be fought out, though, since Ichigo and Co. would be severely outnumbered, and I doubt he'd be willing to run away for Nell's sake. So he'd have to fight for her diplomatically.

It'd be a nice way of putting Ichigo back in the fore, since his role has shrunken over the past 2 years. Something like that would have deep reverberations across all 3 realms.

OhDearMoshe
May 16, 2008, 01:58 PM
^ I could see Nell being used as a harbinger for that.

Yama, in his overzealous "kill and isolate everything that might hurt us" mentality, could find out about Nell during or after the war and order her killed. Ichigo wouldn't let that happen--he knows she doesn't want to hurt anyone, and could easily argue that she's better than some of the Shinigami (Mayuri, Zaraki, the Exiles, etc.). It's not something that could be fought out, though, since Ichigo and Co. would be severely outnumbered, and I doubt he'd be willing to run away for Nell's sake. So he'd have to fight for her diplomatically.

It'd be a nice way of putting Ichigo back in the fore, since his role has shrunken over the past 2 years. Something like that would have deep reverberations across all 3 realms.

If you think about it though. He's made a lot of friend in soul society some captains and shinigami will probably fight on his side. On the whole though I really hope Kubo Tackles the murky situation about Soul Society. Its something good that I really think needs to be expanded upon.

patedecarne
May 16, 2008, 02:24 PM
But then, probably another war would begin; even if some captains and Vc fight at Ichigo's side,I think Yamma-jii wouldn't aceept this: probably he could say things like" all of them can be replaced";

I don't know if someday Yammamoto will open his eyes and change some convictions, but unti this day, if Nell escapes with Ichigo, probably she'll be at Ichigo's home (Isshin will go crazy after seeing Nell, will be hilarious!)!

gigantor21
May 16, 2008, 03:47 PM
If you think about it though. He's made a lot of friend in soul society some captains and shinigami will probably fight on his side. On the whole though I really hope Kubo Tackles the murky situation about Soul Society. Its something good that I really think needs to be expanded upon.

That's what I'd want to see, actually.

I KNOW he could get support from Ukitake, as Rukia and Orihime were with Nell too. That'd be a big leg up with Yama. There are several other Shinigami that could help, as most of them aren't as hardassed as Yama is. IAnd Zaraki wouldn't have gotten there in time had Nell not fought with Nori, so she's a variable asset in the war effort.

Thankfully, Yama is running things so they'd just have to appeal to him. It'd be harder if the Central 46 was still around.

redcometfm
August 11, 2008, 09:06 PM
This really applies when he gets his memory back, but it seems like Kubo has this potential set up from all the foreshadowing he's done.

Initial fight --> start of a rivalry?
*Ichigo wins because of synchronization with zanpakuto, unlike Kenpachi.*

Both have spewing, overabundance of reiatsu. Both expell the skull-like auras.

Kenpachi heals, demands re-match with Ichigo, who refuses ("Im never fighting you again!" as he jumps out the window)

Ichigo's loss to Nnoitra signals he's not ready to stop a foe that crazy, blood-thirsty and powerful. Kenpachi comes in and takes over, beating the doppleganger.

There's a motif with Kenpachi removing his eyepatch more often/willingly and his acceptance of foreign methods, (such as the desire to synchronize with his zanpakuto, and acceptance in utilizing Yamamoto's kendo lessons) as more of a symbolism to Kenpachi accepting his world more than before. When the revelation comes of his true origins with returned memories and the name of his zanpakuto, he could potentially become a different person and be in a position to become a future opponent/rival to Ichigo.

Plus Kubo confirmed in an interview he has several more stories/plots to tell in Bleach (implying post-Aizen). Thoughts?

mestizo311
August 12, 2008, 03:32 AM
I've been stuck with the idea for a while now that old man Yama, would turn out to be a traitor. I guess his whole "beat the crap out of them, ask questions later" attitude bugs me. Then again, for someone in his kind of position he does have to be assertive. I'm not quite sure if he's necessarily on Aizen's side or if he's the next villain after the Aizen storyline.

nordicbattlesigns
August 12, 2008, 04:18 AM
I just have a feeling that Aizen's plot in SS had more layers, which we aren't even aware of.



Not only do I agree, but I think deeper layers to the conspiracy are desperately needed to make the next arc work. As it stands, the "War" will just be a succession of Espada-Captain fights, followed by a treck to the Royal Palace for a final showdown with Aizen. That alone won't amount to very much, given how mixed the last fights were in terms of quality, and because it'll be so shallow. The story needs more depth than what we have.


Agreed. Something more is needed, even if this current round of combat with the four-on-four at the pillars was just Kubo earning some quick breathing space so he could head abroad for a while. Moreso since these are merely preludes to the main event! Full powered fights, while they are impressive, can swiftly pall when it is nothing but.

This said, I don't believe a new traitor angle is one to pull this late in the game. Nor a new adversary, even one of Royal status.

Surely enough can be made with what we already have?

Aizen has such an awful confidence -- this has to have some basis. For all the strength of his highest Espada, which I believe to be real, he has laid his plans well to get where he is. He plans extensively, but once the conditions are ripe he acts swift and decisively. First divide the Captains, reduce their strength with defections; divide them again, trap some away in his own sphere of influence. He appears to honestly believe those left can be overmatched with his remaining Espada -- or that the sacrifice of Halibel, Barragan and Stark serves his purpose well enough, either way. Either he has the ultimate confidence in their strength or something up his sleeve.

Then we have Kyouka Suigetsu. Is Aizen really trapped with Tousen and Gin behind Yamamoto's flaming citadel?


I really hope Kubo can pull off a great plot twist with the existing characters. That would be a lot more fulfilling then just introducing new bad ass characters that were never referenced before.

Maybe the #1 bad guy is actually Urahara! Why, I don't know but if Kubo could make it somehow happen logically, that would be interesting :)


I do like this particular line of thought. Or a variant on it, rather. Not Urahara the villain, as such, but Urahara as the pivot on which an apparent one-sided balance of power is suddenly inverted.

Urahara has already proven critical to the current situation. His was the creation of the four garganta/portals that allowed the Captains to cross through to Hueco Mundo at full power. His was the massive task to devise those world-linking pillars to set up the current battleground where the Espada and the Captains will play. But now the garganta have closed -- Aizen's doing? -- and trapped some Captains; what is the full consequence if the pillars should falter? Barragan seems to grasp it, and Yamamoto deemed it important enough to defend them. And is it in fact all Urahara? I have speculated on the contents of Szayel's secret closet elsewhere, and even if completely wrong on that count, still the significance of those contents have to also come into play, somewhere.

All that told, Aizen and Urahara are still between them the two most mysterious individuals in the Bleach universe. We THINK we understand their motivations, and some of these we do, but sometimes there appear subtler reasonings that drive them which are yet to be grasped or revealed.

Starky-08
August 12, 2008, 05:06 AM
I dont think Urahara woul be working with Aizen, you saw how Urahara attacked Aizen in the Gaiden, theirs obviously a reason for that, but what I dont get is, why Urahara didn't tell Ichigo and Co. about Aizen when they went to SS.

Richo
August 16, 2008, 09:18 AM
Hold on. 5 Remaining Espada.

I alawys figured Soul Society would be the final villains of the series. After all their ethic's are murky at best.

Thats how most governments run their affairs though...
Kill and/or isolate the possible threat to the current plans off the government.
Ontopic i believe somewhere in the end ichigo and the vaizards will "sweep" SS, for the obvious reason they dont care for living beings if they can "justify" their decision with: "its for the greater good off SS". The vaizards already were orderd to death because off they are a possible threat (better said no one knows about the vaizards), the thing is that every shinigami has a limit to its powers however vaizards dont have those limits wich makes them a threat to the shinigami.
Many of these "mistakes" have been made as they were for example unethic or they might become a threat to SS so they get rid off them even if it costs thousands of lives.
In my eyes the final arc should be a total sweep and correction off the corrupted way SS handles matters.


^ I could see Nell being used as a harbinger for that.

Yama, in his overzealous "kill and isolate everything that might hurt us" mentality, could find out about Nell during or after the war and order her killed. Ichigo wouldn't let that happen--he knows she doesn't want to hurt anyone, and could easily argue that she's better than some of the Shinigami (Mayuri, Zaraki, the Exiles, etc.). It's not something that could be fought out, though, since Ichigo and Co. would be severely outnumbered, and I doubt he'd be willing to run away for Nell's sake. So he'd have to fight for her diplomatically.

there are 2 options at this moment about that subject:
1. Nell stays in SS
2. Nell joins ichigo at home (or urahara for that matter) helping him in killing other hollows
3. Yama finds out about nell and starts a conflict

if the first 2 will happen nothing will happen and lives goes on and nell will eventualy be left out off the picture until needed again.
if yama finds out we gonna get a total new arc about this resulting in the deaths of several captains and ichigo being orderd to death for being a vaizard (ichigo will need his hollow mask against atleast 3 captains), this option will also fit nicely as a closing chapter to bleach where SS will be "purged" of certain captains and ideas about handling things.

Darek Khort
September 20, 2008, 10:33 PM
Quick question; is Chojiro blind? In the manga he has no pupils (although in the Anime he seems to have eyes....er...can we trust the Anime?)
If he is blind then I'm assuming he would be a traitor? He is in the current fake Karakura Town too.

nordicbattlesigns
September 21, 2008, 03:18 AM
Quick question; is Chojiro blind? In the manga he has no pupils (although in the Anime he seems to have eyes....er...can we trust the Anime?)
If he is blind then I'm assuming he would be a traitor? He is in the current fake Karakura Town too.


Assumptions, assumptions, assumptions!

No evidence points to Chojiro being blind, and inferring blindness just from a lack of eye detail is more than a stretch. He certainly shows no evidence of blindness.

But to assume every blind shinigami is Aizen's is an equally absurd stretch. Tousen was in Aizen's division and therefore closer to him than most in the Gotei 13, and hence it was probably needful to either recruit or deal with him. Even going that stretch assuming Chojiro to be blind, how would that make him a traitor?

Darek Khort
September 21, 2008, 04:36 AM
Well given that he is blind (bear with me) then he would HAVE to be a traitor. Afterall he would be aware of the fact that Aizen is in fact not dead, or that the Aizen seen dead is in fact just his sword (since if Chojiro couldn't see, then, like Tousen, he wouldn't see a dead Aizen there on the wall).

Give that he is the lieutenant of the 1st division, of Captain Yamamoto you would think he would tell his Captain and Commander of the Gotei 13 about this. If he was indeed blind and he does not do so, one would assume that he is a traitor.

But yes, definately having a lack of a pupil when he is shown does not make him blind. Just a question I wanted to know cause that would point to a possible traitor if he was indeed blind.

Oh, and anyone have a larger version of this page:
http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/315/02-03/
Just want to know if he has any pupils or if he's eyes are still blank.
You don't usually have a character who is ALWAYS shown without eyes. Sure sometimes they won't have any as is the manga style, but to have it always showing no eyes? I mean, come on, I'd call blind right there.

nordicbattlesigns
September 21, 2008, 05:50 PM
Well given that he is blind (bear with me) then he would HAVE to be a traitor. Afterall he would be aware of the fact that Aizen is in fact not dead, or that the Aizen seen dead is in fact just his sword (since if Chojiro couldn't see, then, like Tousen, he wouldn't see a dead Aizen there on the wall).

Give that he is the lieutenant of the 1st division, of Captain Yamamoto you would think he would tell his Captain and Commander of the Gotei 13 about this. If he was indeed blind and he does not do so, one would assume that he is a traitor.


Again, that's an awful lot to be basing on the way his eyes are drawn.

But, let's go with a blind Chojiro for a moment. He wouldn't have seen the hypnosis ceremony, and like Tousen would therefore be immune to Kyoka Suigetsu's effects. That's it. He has no firm knowledge of Aizen being dead or alive; he was not on the scene when Aizen was pinned up on the wall - several other vice captains were, and two captains, and so far as that goes their collective word should be enough. Afterward? Aizen was keeping to the Central 46 chambers, so it's not like Chojiro has had much opportunity to spot him, let alone anybody else. So, even blindness would hardly imply treachery.

Tousen, being close to Aizen, was a matter of use and necessity. But let's not paint all blind shinigami with the same brush.

hyn_pride93
November 08, 2008, 04:28 PM
Do you think that Urahara and his gang will turn against SS after they've defeated Aizen?

Razh
November 10, 2008, 01:00 PM
Do you think that Urahara and his gang will turn against SS after they've defeated Aizen?

What, all 3 of them?

hyn_pride93
November 11, 2008, 02:51 AM
What, all 3 of them?
Yes. I would imagine that He'll be the ring leader and then when it came down to it, Yoruichi would betray him. Just a thought. I'll go more into detail later on.

hollowdemon
November 11, 2008, 04:21 PM
here's a different plot twist actually ...
everybody has ideas about the probability of yamamoto being the evil one after or perhaps urahara maybe even the whole Royal Guard side.

Well an idea i had in mind was actually ichigo himself (bear with me) the idea came up when i was reading one of the threads and they mentioned when ulquiorra actually said "one day he might come to our side" (i forgot which chapter but it was when ulquiorra and grimmjow was having a verbal fight) which triggered an idea in my head.

i would say that aizen would still be alive throughout bleach until the end and what triggered ichigo to go evil perhaps maybe aizen himself (u kno talking him down into being evil, not sure how though) then results to maybe only him OR the whole gang (ishida, chad and maybe orihime (i wouldnt count on orihime) ) going against soul society.
the only way to resolve that would be isshin and ryuuken along with the vaizards (if they still have a good bone in their body meaning not working together with soul society but still doing good deeds)
then results into isshin and ryuuken dying perhaps?

maybe even vice versa (isshin and ryuuken are the ones who are evil)
hehe random thought but please comment on it thank you :D

Flight-47
November 12, 2008, 12:39 AM
Well...

The Vaizard haven't stayed with Urahara for a reason of course, we just don't know that reason. If there is any group which may cause a problem for our 'good guys' it's the Vaizard. There is a chance they'd be on Aizen's side, it's not impossible. But I think they'll be on a side of their own, and Aizen as smart as he is, will use that to his advantage.

hyn_pride93
November 12, 2008, 05:08 AM
The Vizards will most likely want to take revenge on Central 46. Or I should say wanted to do so, but since Aizen killed all of them off, there's no point. All they would need to do is take down Aizen for taking away their lives. Then follow Urahara for giving them a new life, because if it wasn't for him, then they would've died as hollow.

hollowdemon
November 13, 2008, 02:53 PM
well new traitor in my mind actually comes across in Kira.
some people would probably wonder why i said that but most likely because he still have deep respect and admiration for gin that he would definitely do something once the chance is given. In one of the chapters when kira started his fight with barragan's fraccion and gin was shown.
Tousen asked him if he was worried since he abandoned him and he replied "im glad hes doing well" could only mean that he might have an idea to what kira might do later on in the future.

Now to come think of it, i have a feeling both Kira AND momo would be the one to defect the gotei 13 since thye both have close relationship with each other but then again kira has always been with the whole abiding by the law and respect type of attitude. So thats pretty much up in the air

to mention my previous statement about a new traitor, ICHIGO HIMSELF !!!
DUN DUN DUNNNNNNNNN

VeshWolfe
November 17, 2008, 09:53 PM
my thoughts, they may or may not go together:

-Aizen has an ace up his sleeve. Im thinking VastoLorde Arrancar. That would make sense since he basiclly allowed the majority of his current espada to get thrown away.

-The vizards might not be on either side. They might be in it for themselves. Theoretically, the vizards might be in SS since K town and SS were swapped, as we do see them leaving the warehouse that was originally in SS.

-There is one "relm" we have yet to see, Hell. All we know is "bad" hollows go there when killed. Other than that we have no idea.

hyn_pride93
November 19, 2008, 03:20 AM
I now believe that Hinamori will be the next shinigami to betray SS. She seems to still be mentally unstable and still calls Aizen "captain". I think that she would do anything to be next to him forever.

Razh
November 22, 2008, 07:14 PM
I now believe that Hinamori will be the next shinigami to betray SS. She seems to still be mentally unstable and still calls Aizen "captain". I think that she would do anything to be next to him forever.

I had doubts about Hinamori for a while now. Aizen isn't a fool. And nobody would suspect of Hinamori after her "death".
Especially now, when she surprised Rangiku with her abilities. Maybe she was hiding her real strenght all along. And being Aizen's lieutenant makes her all the more suspicious.

glvdtr
May 21, 2009, 05:55 PM
It's all speculated, but if you look at the image, what you can see is the young Jushiro Ukitake and a figure behind him which frighteningly resembles to that of Aizen.

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/bleach/en/images/5/59/E055_-_33.jpg


What helped me with the conclusion were the similarities between the figure in the picture above and that of Aizen such as the the split in the hair and the glasses frame which as you can see below looks almost identical to the one above.
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/bleach/en/images/c/cf/Pre-Defection_Aizen.jpg

I know that Ukitake is one of the nicest and most respected captains in Soul Society , but lets not forget how nice was Aizen before he stabbed his vice captain...

Also the fact he always knew what the other side was planning ( like how he was perfectly aware that they were not in the real Karakura Town ) made me to believe that Aizen may have had an inside man.

So what are your thoughts about this theory of Ukitake being the real bad guy ? :D

P.S. I expect a lot of bashing, since it's my first time posting a theory so I'll see it as a good way for me to understand more of the Bleach universe. :p

Forever_Melody
May 21, 2009, 06:44 PM
Well it's a bit of a stretch to build an entire theory based on one image, specifically if you're basing it on resemblance.

I mean, Ukitake HAS been in SS as long as Aizen(he's been there longer actually since he and Kyouraku are the first captains that came from the Academy) so I suppose it makes some sense.

However, your picture suggests Aizen was one of Ukitake's classmates so I suppose they would've graduated at similar times, yet Aizen didn't become captain until recently(in the last 100 years since he was Shinji's VC) while Ukitake was part of the Gotei 13 since its beginnings.

So it seems Aizen was of a different generation than Ukitake. If not, that means he lagged behind a great deal if he became VC a few hundred years after Ukitake became captain :s.

ryanzokuken
May 22, 2009, 01:22 AM
i don't even think that looks enough like Aizen to say so. plus i really doubt Aizen is old enough to have been in the academy with Ukitake. in the Pendulum arc, Ukitake was said to have been a captain for a hundred years at least already.
Aizen was still visibly young in the pendulum arc, smaller and more youthful than he is now.

Doombot
May 22, 2009, 01:48 AM
i don't even think that looks enough like Aizen to say so. plus i really doubt Aizen is old enough to have been in the academy with Ukitake. in the Pendulum arc, Ukitake was said to have been a captain for a hundred years at least already.
Aizen was still visibly young in the pendulum arc, smaller and more youthful than he is now.

Illusions. Everything in Bleach will turn out to be Aizen's illusion.

kkck
May 22, 2009, 01:56 AM
Illusions. Everything in Bleach will turn out to be Aizen's illusion.

Even worsts, the entire story will be a dream hitsu had.

Doombot
May 22, 2009, 02:21 AM
Even worsts, the entire story will be a dream hitsu had.

Makes sense why he never loses.

axellover2
May 22, 2009, 03:17 AM
Makes sense why he never loses.

lol,But dosent explain the pwnage he got before he won.

I dont think that guy looks like Aizen.If it was him,then he must be really weak to take that long to become a captain.

ryanzokuken
May 22, 2009, 03:49 AM
even if it was Aizen behind him, why does that make Ukitake a bad guy with him?

plenty of people have stood near Aizen. are they all plotting with him as well?

glvdtr
May 22, 2009, 06:23 AM
Didn't they mention that he's often absent from meeting because he's sick? and having others fill his role under his guidance? This gives him plenty of spare time to work on his evil scheme. ( whatever it is... )

Aonsaithya
May 22, 2009, 07:49 AM
People are overanalyzing the series.

Soifon not telling Omaeda about Ikkaku&Co defending the pillars does not make
her a traitor (like someone suggested), it makes her absent-minded at most.

Josear XIII
May 22, 2009, 10:36 AM
Forget about all that, ITS THE ANIME XD it makes me crack myself up, you cant trust anime, now if you show me the exact same image in manga, i would have second thoughts, remember that anime is being drawn by other people who get paid to fill seconds so the half hour can be completed, they add whatever in a scene, its not kubo tite, Thats why i dont even think into this theory, i dont remember seeing this into the manga

kkck
May 22, 2009, 11:28 AM
lol,But dosent explain the pwnage he got before he won.

I dont think that guy looks like Aizen.If it was him,then he must be really weak to take that long to become a captain.

That was just a nightmare, everyone has them every now and then....

-Ren Boy-
May 22, 2009, 11:48 AM
This Thread Is Totally Far-Fetched

And The Reason Why You Believe It Is Ludicrous
But Opinion Is Opinion And Who Am I To Deny You Of That

glvdtr
May 22, 2009, 11:57 AM
found it! http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/155/09/
the drawing in the manga looks different than the one in the anime. The guy's expression behind Ukitake looks more happy and admired by his presence ( not cunning at all... ).
You are right about not to assume stuff solely on anime :(

Darth Executor
May 22, 2009, 12:01 PM
Funniest thing I ever read. I think that if one of the good guys is gonna backstab SS, it's Urahara (& his visored army). I don't see why he'd join up with Aizen though.

Razh
May 22, 2009, 12:39 PM
The guy has light hair in the manga. That about sums it up.
http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/155/09/

EDIT: Oh right, I missed the post where it was already shown.

But there's an interesting question here. Just how long has Aizen been in SS?
You can't learn how to cast high level demon arts without incantations over one night.
And the guy is probably as strong as the strongest captain, maybe even on par with Yamamoto. Than again, maybe even stronger, even though I doubt that.
He must have been around for almost as long as Shunsui or Ukitake. Hiding and holding back while he was constantly training to become better.

Forever_Melody
May 22, 2009, 01:46 PM
Yeah I don't really get why Ukitake of all people who hung around Aizen would be any more guilty than the rest of them >.>

-Ren Boy-
May 22, 2009, 02:19 PM
Close This Thread Before Over People See It And Give A Serious Bashing

ryanzokuken
May 22, 2009, 02:53 PM
People are overanalyzing the series.

Soifon not telling Omaeda about Ikkaku&Co defending the pillars does not make
her a traitor (like someone suggested), it makes her absent-minded at most.

i think it more just implies that Omaeda is unimportant and doesn't need to know these things in the first place. :p

Aonsaithya
May 22, 2009, 03:13 PM
i think it more just implies that Omaeda is unimportant and doesn't need to know these things in the first place. :p

Hey hey, he has had a single cool moment already! You never know what he's going to pull off in the next chapter. He might be a good decoy too, as evidenced by Barragan seemingly chasing after him now.

The topic of the thread might be changed to something like "Who is the real mastermind if not Aizen?", but IIRC there might be one already.
Or "Aizen speculation"?

Chaoswind
May 22, 2009, 09:23 PM
Wth is this?

So I can be Aizen? I mean I wear glasses after all -_-

Remember the guy doesn't wear glasses any more, so we can guess Aizen disguised a la Superman, Placid looking glasses are the ULTIMATE disguise!!!

Now this is FAR fetched... I mean I can believe Shunsui could be a traitor, (there are actually SMALL pieces of information to support this), But UKITAKE? Seriously?

If Ukitake ends up as the true Villain, The Adminds will have to change your title from beginner to Oracle Member.

THM Nindo
May 23, 2009, 09:43 AM
... Okay, this theory is a lot more than far-fetched, especially that it's only due to a picture taken from the anime (the guy as light hair in the manga, as it was said earlier).

Anyway, I think we already saw the "good guy" that was the traitor.
I know Kubo is not a so great writer and like to use the same pattern (Release... Bankai... etc), but I doubt he would be so bad that he repeat himself in the plot like that... :tem

Anyway, for sure, if this theory became true (Hell, a theory saying that Yammi was Espada 0 did come true, afte all!!), you will be the first to have brought it up! :tem

Onomatopoeia
May 23, 2009, 03:06 PM
Szayel is basicly Aizen with pink hair and glasses.

Does that mean it's likely that Szayel is Aizen's illegitimate child or that Szayel is actually Aizen in disguise? No I think not.

Razh
May 23, 2009, 03:48 PM
What's the problem guys? The thread starter already saw that his assumption is too much. No need to waste your time disproving it.


found it! http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/155/09/
the drawing in the manga looks different than the one in the anime. The guy's expression behind Ukitake looks more happy and admired by his presence ( not cunning at all... ).
You are right about not to assume stuff solely on anime :(

Onomatopoeia
May 23, 2009, 04:03 PM
What's the problem guys? The thread starter already saw that his assumption is too much. No need to waste your time disproving it.Oh okay.Sorry then. I just felt like pointing out that Szayel does look a LOT like Aizen.

Darek Khort
May 23, 2009, 10:55 PM
Meh, I wouldn't rule it out.
Ukitake is always sick. Could all be an illusion to enhance his innocence to others. The whole idea that a 'weak', sick person is automatically a good guy.

However given his actions in saving Rukia...hmmmmm. He seems like a good guy.

peinsensei
May 24, 2009, 12:48 AM
Aizen did say that no one has seen the real him. which means may be aizen looks are different from what we see.

axellover2
May 24, 2009, 12:58 AM
When Aizen said no ones seen the real him, I thought he was speaking about his personality?Oh and goals.

peinsensei
May 24, 2009, 01:05 AM
When Aizen said no ones seen the real him, I thought he was speaking about his personality?Oh and goals.
it could be either way. since he can create illusions he can change the way he looks.
for personalities and goals aizen said no one really tried to understand me.

And the thing that really surprised me the way he counters tessai kidou attack there was no way a vice-captain could counter kidou of captain of kidou corp. and as his reitsu is just too much compare to average captains stated that twice of average captain which also means he is really as strong as yama, ukitake or shunsui.

Tonguen_yomom
May 25, 2009, 09:15 PM
Okay, new crazy theory/observation: the real enemy of Bleach will turn out to be ..........wait for it...........The Soul Society!!

:blinkWhat's this you say? How can the Soul Society be it's own enemy? Well, think back to all the previous arcs and stories that we've seen. In each case, those who were seen as enemies have had something horrible happen to them as a result of the Soul Society and its laws.

Seriously, almost EVERYBODY that we've seen has been screwed over by the Soul Society one way or another: Rukia's near-execution, the Bount's extermination, the Mod Souls' extermination, Quincys' extermination (though I agreed with that one), the poor conditions of those in the Rukongai, the princess in the newest filler arc, the Captain from the newest filler arc, the 11th squad guy from the Bount arc, Ishida's grampa, the enemy from the second movie, Urahara's banishment, Tessai's banishment, Mayuri's imprisonment, the Vizards...The list goes on!

It can't be just coincidence that Kubo had revealed all of these atrocities committed by the Soul Society. From the very first arc this has been a story of one man/boy (he's still like 15-16, right?) struggling against the unjust laws of a society. So maybe Bleach isn't just pretty fights and power-ups. Maybe..it's a political manga...:o

Some people are now predicting that Aizen may have some good intentions for his actions. I don't know if I'd go that far but I think that he probably has his reasons. Furthermore, I think that the Soul Society created the Hollows. And when the story moves on to deal with the King and Royal Guards, that's when I'm betting it'll all be revealed. And maybe, instead of fighting with Aizen, Ichigo and his group are gonna have to face the Royal Guard and maybe even the captains again. And when they finally defeat them, that would bring about real change to the Soul Society and make it a little more like what it should be...heaven. :)

...just a little thought:eyeroll

kkck
May 25, 2009, 09:18 PM
You should erase half the people of your list considering they are filler....

I doubt aizen has good intentions but I wouldn't be surprised if there is more stuff going on in the background.

Tonguen_yomom
May 25, 2009, 09:21 PM
Fine... that still leaves Rukia, Urahara, Tessai, Mayuri, the Vizards, the Mod Souls, Quincys, the Rukongai people, and Ishida's grampa.

kkck
May 25, 2009, 09:25 PM
Rukia was not screwed up by SS though. That was all aizen. Ishida's grandpa was also not the fault of SS itself but rather a few corrupt shinigami and mayuri. And what did SS ever did to rukonkai people? I get they are not precisely nice but I don't think you could compare that with other events.

The only thing you could actually blaime SS off when considering tessai, urahara and the vizards, is being intolerant, but other than that, it was also all aizen.

Tonguen_yomom
May 25, 2009, 09:32 PM
I don't know...the Rukongai looked pretty messed up in the flashbacks. Kids having to steal water to survive and things like that.

And even though the other events were also Aizen's doing, it was the Soul Society's stubbornness and refusal to listen to reason that allowed those things to happen. Plus, the way remember it, Rukia would have been killed anyway, just not with the flaming-bird/halberd thing.

street_san
May 25, 2009, 09:32 PM
...Well SS is not really heaven. It's like a little world when your dead. Meaning that, just like the real world, poor country does exist, and rich country does exist. Sometimes they are at wars and they need to fight (Quincy part, etc.) soo it isnt an Utopia Island.

Soo I don't think that SS is going to be his own enemy. I still think Aizen his the final villain...and I really like the way Kubo is showing up Aizen xD.

Chaoswind
May 25, 2009, 10:53 PM
SS sucks

Aizen should just steal a couple of Human nukes and erase that place... after all Aizen is the good guy
http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/169/18/

we don't have a lot of information, but yeah, I agree SS is not the best place to live... but neither is HELL and that is a fact :P

Josear XIII
May 28, 2009, 12:08 PM
And you can definetly count out, Urahara, tessai & Co. that was aizen's doing.

Tonguen_yomom
May 28, 2009, 02:45 PM
And you can definetly count out, Urahara, tessai & Co. that was aizen's doing.

Yes, but it exposed one of the fundamental flaws of the Soul Society: over-reliance on tradition and resistance to change, even if it is for the better. The foremost culprits of this are Central 46. But now that they're dead, the only people left who embody the old traditions of the Soul Society are Yamamoto and probably the king.

That's why I agree with people that say Yamamoto should die. Even though he's really strong and is made of awesomness and all that, his death would allow Shunsui to take over and I have a feeling that guy's gonna be a lot more open to voices of change. Shunsui=Obama, anybody?! :D A guy can dream, can't he? :)

Josear XIII
May 28, 2009, 02:55 PM
BTW i counted mayuri as one of the aizen victims, he is clarely not, HE IS THE ONLY VICTIM OF THE DAMN CRUEL CENTRAL 46 DAMN THOSE BASTARDS

and by the way, i likeand support your idea of Shunsui taking over it would be an awesome turn of the table in bleach plot. Never stopped to think what if the old man Yama dies, he is too damn old he was old 1000 years ago when the academy was found, people doesnt realize it but he is senile, he talks nonsense XD even if he is strong and made of awesomness(not particulary a great character for me is just a regular)

kkck
May 28, 2009, 03:20 PM
Yes, but it exposed one of the fundamental flaws of the Soul Society: over-reliance on tradition and resistance to change, even if it is for the better. The foremost culprits of this are Central 46. But now that they're dead, the only people left who embody the old traditions of the Soul Society are Yamamoto and probably the king.

That's why I agree with people that say Yamamoto should die. Even though he's really strong and is made of awesomness and all that, his death would allow Shunsui to take over and I have a feeling that guy's gonna be a lot more open to voices of change. Shunsui=Obama, anybody?! :D A guy can dream, can't he? :)

When did SS refuse change for the better? They were against hollowification but there could be more than good enough reason for such a thing, specially when it involves captain level dudes who are about to get a lot stronger. Considering hollowification comes with the chance of being taken over by your own power, the risk of allowing someone to do it are great. I could understand the chamber 46 not wanting a bunch of SSJ captains laying waste in SS. Maybe they could have been a little more helpfull to them but considering what we know about the drawbacks of hollow powers there was some sense in what they did. Also, turning into a hybrid is not nesesarily change for the better.

If shunsui = obama, I would not vote for him:p:o. Actually I never even thought he was an even adequate substitute to yama, ukitake would be 10 times the commander shunsui can be. He is not lazy(at any time, unlike shunsui) and he was also implied by yama to have better social and leadership skills.

I don´t think bleach is ready to see yamamoto die. He isn´t just made of awesomeness and pawnage, he IS awesomeness and pawnage. Not to mention he has not been developed in any way in his personality aspect(outside the professional aspect). His death should be something memorable(like that of sandaime), so I doubt kubo would do such a thing just yet.

Tonguen_yomom
May 28, 2009, 04:31 PM
When did SS refuse change for the better? They were against hollowification but there could be more than good enough reason for such a thing, specially when it involves captain level dudes who are about to get a lot stronger. Considering hollowification comes with the chance of being taken over by your own power, the risk of allowing someone to do it are great. I could understand the chamber 46 not wanting a bunch of SSJ captains laying waste in SS. Maybe they could have been a little more helpfull to them but considering what we know about the drawbacks of hollow powers there was some sense in what they did. Also, turning into a hybrid is not nesesarily change for the better.

Well, I meant before. That whole thing with Rukia where even though people had a feeling something was wrong, they all went with it anyways just because some old guys a room somewhere said so. Same with Urahara's "trial." Each time, somebody outside of the rules did something and it was for the better. My feeling is that if Yamamoto were to remain captain, he wouldn't push for change in this system and will just establish a new Central 46.


I don´t think bleach is ready to see yamamoto die. He isn´t just made of awesomeness and pawnage, he IS awesomeness and pawnage. Not to mention he has not been developed in any way in his personality aspect(outside the professional aspect). His death should be something memorable(like that of sandaime), so I doubt kubo would do such a thing just yet.

Yamamoto's death will be memorable because, well, it'll be Bleach's first. I imagine that he'll go all out against Aizen only to be screwed over when Aizen goes Hollow or pulls some cheap trick using his Bankai or something. It'll be glorious and upsetting and everything a character's death should be...provided it happens in the first place...this is just what I imagine.


If shunsui = obama, I would not vote for him. Actually I never even thought he was an even adequate substitute to yama, ukitake would be 10 times the commander shunsui can be. He is not lazy(at any time, unlike shunsui) and he was also implied by yama to have better social and leadership skills.

And as for Shunsui, he might be lazy but he's shown that he's willing to step up when something needs to be done (beginning of battle with Stark). Ukitake would be good but he's just too goddam sick. You don't wanna have two captains dying one after another. :p Shunsui will get over his laziness once his old mentor dies. I doubt Ukitake could do the same. Plus, Shunsui was like the only one who was suspicious of Aizen back in the old days, even if that suspicion didn't lead him anywhere. Who knows though. Maybe they'll even run it together! They were the ones that stood up for Rukia and saved her at her execution. And they showed that, combined, they were enough to stand up to Yamamoto. Just imagine:

Shunsui/Ukitake '09!!! :D:D:D

HELL THE F*CK YEAH!!!

Darth Executor
May 28, 2009, 10:17 PM
Unless Shunsui is running a ponzi scheme with Soul Society's federal budget he's no obama. :p

Ukitake can't even run his squad, how's he gonna run SS? He's like a better looking version of mccain. his bankai is probably an uber fast wheelchair.

Anyway, back to the OP, I think Urahara is the most likely to be a villain. I wouldn't be surprised if he ends up being behind the visored and launches an attack on SS.

peinsensei
May 31, 2009, 04:14 AM
Okay, new crazy theory/observation: the real enemy of Bleach will turn out to be ..........wait for it...........The Soul Society!!

:blinkWhat's this you say? How can the Soul Society be it's own enemy? Well, think back to all the previous arcs and stories that we've seen. In each case, those who were seen as enemies have had something horrible happen to them as a result of the Soul Society and its laws.

Seriously, almost EVERYBODY that we've seen has been screwed over by the Soul Society one way or another: Rukia's near-execution, the Bount's extermination, the Mod Souls' extermination, Quincys' extermination (though I agreed with that one), the poor conditions of those in the Rukongai, the princess in the newest filler arc, the Captain from the newest filler arc, the 11th squad guy from the Bount arc, Ishida's grampa, the enemy from the second movie, Urahara's banishment, Tessai's banishment, Mayuri's imprisonment, the Vizards...The list goes on!

It can't be just coincidence that Kubo had revealed all of these atrocities committed by the Soul Society. From the very first arc this has been a story of one man/boy (he's still like 15-16, right?) struggling against the unjust laws of a society. So maybe Bleach isn't just pretty fights and power-ups. Maybe..it's a political manga...:o

Some people are now predicting that Aizen may have some good intentions for his actions. I don't know if I'd go that far but I think that he probably has his reasons. Furthermore, I think that the Soul Society created the Hollows. And when the story moves on to deal with the King and Royal Guards, that's when I'm betting it'll all be revealed. And maybe, instead of fighting with Aizen, Ichigo and his group are gonna have to face the Royal Guard and maybe even the captains again. And when they finally defeat them, that would bring about real change to the Soul Society and make it a little more like what it should be...heaven. :)

...just a little thought:eyeroll

I also think so if we exclude hitsugaya, soi-fon, byakuya and vizzards. other than them i am suspecious about all the captains and x-captains in SS. and i'm expecting that later espadas would turn to ichigo side when they know that SS just used them.

Onomatopoeia
May 31, 2009, 11:43 AM
SS in the past was a very communist like country in the way it dealt with "possible" criminials.

It's like freaking thought crimes in 1984.

But the central 46 is dead so it's no longer like that.

kkck
May 31, 2009, 11:55 AM
SS in the past was a very communist like country in the way it dealt with "possible" criminials.

It's like freaking thought crimes in 1984.

But the central 46 is dead so it's no longer like that.

There is no guarantee the overall structure of SS will be changed though. For all we know they will simply select another 46 old men and be done with it.

c420smokey
May 31, 2009, 12:08 PM
I think the commanders lieutenant is a spy and much stronger than he lets on, plus where has he gone since the battle has begun

ninjaman
May 31, 2009, 02:08 PM
I think the commanders lieutenant is a spy and much stronger than he lets on, plus where has he gone since the battle has begun

i dont think he came to fake town if he did and just disappeared then thats fishy.

Forever_Melody
May 31, 2009, 04:58 PM
Idk about being a traitor, but Yamamoto's lieutenant DID go to the fake Karakura town as seen by this panel (http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/315/02-03/).

I mean, he never had much importance in the first place so I don't think it's a big deal he didn't appear so far.

axellover2
May 31, 2009, 06:00 PM
Yeah Yamamotos lieutenant dosent seem important story wise ( for now)so it isnt a surprise he hasnt been shown.Btw what was his name again?

Forever_Melody
May 31, 2009, 06:31 PM
I don't even recall his name. That's how important he is. I mean, I even remember Omaeda before this arc yet I can't recall this guy >.>

I mean, is he even any good? lol I mean, he got stomped by Ichigo(but that's Ichigo for you), but idk, he hasn't been hinted at being very strong other than being Yamamoto's lieutenant.

Judau Ashta
June 01, 2009, 04:10 PM
Unohana is gonna be the traitor. She never wants to fights the enemies, even the Exequias just left her alone. There's also the part where Mayuri alone is enough to heal the others injuries in HM, and the ones stuck on earth have no one.

There's also Ishida's dad. Not really a traitor since he never was friends with actual shinigami (for all we know, Ichigo's dad could've gotten his powers the same way Ichigo did), but nothing stopping him from sniping Yamamoto.

Forever_Melody
June 01, 2009, 09:19 PM
Ryuuken has no love for shinigami, but then again, he has no interest in the spirit world as a whole. He basically doesn't really care about being a Quincy because he says "it's not profitable" >.> I doubt he'd become a full fledged bad guy if anything but a "I don't care" character.

peinsensei
June 02, 2009, 03:27 AM
Ryuuken has no love for shinigami, but then again, he has no interest in the spirit world as a whole. He basically doesn't really care about being a Quincy because he says "it's not profitable" >.> I doubt he'd become a full fledged bad guy if anything but a "I don't care" character.

if Karakura Town go down by aizen plans then i am sure he would go against aizen because that guy care for his money and family. if karakura would go down that means he loss his hospital, house etc. which would make him go against aizen. but what if aizen offers him even more money.

magicp7
June 02, 2009, 06:57 AM
if Karakura Town go down by aizen plans then i am sure he would go against aizen because that guy care for his money and family. if karakura would go down that means he loss his hospital, house etc. which would make him go against aizen. but what if aizen offers him even more money.

That won't do. The money Aizen could give him would be Soul Society money, which is worthless in the real world.
Anyways I don't see the use of another traitor, unless he is as hax as Aizen himself. I mean, there are like 40+ good guys against 10 bad guys at max. So I see only 4 options:

1. The Vizard team up with Aizen.
2. A new set of Espada will be revealed.
3. The old Espada return as Vasto Lorde.
4. Aizen loses.

Raizen
June 03, 2009, 08:26 PM
I say later, maybe after the war, aizen will get injured fighting against someone, maybe ichi if he escapes, and then a VL shows up (one that may be in aizen's army) and kill him. taking over. Then it will be Hell on SS

deathgod6664820
June 06, 2009, 08:04 PM
i think if theres a new traitor/enemy all finger's point to Ukitake why, well i look at it like this. ukitake seems to do things that azien wants him to do but to us it looks like he's a good guy let me explain,

-well first he's always sick and missing, and thats why i always kept my eye on him and his movement's

-when karien was turned hollow by azien, ukitake was the one to let karen go to face the hollow alone and we all know that was one of azien experment and ukitake could have somthing to do with that.

-ukitake plan to save rukia by destroying that firebird zanpaktou, which pissed the old man off got him to chase him, and thats what give azien the time he needed with rukia, i just fine that funny.

-the libary with all the files that azien was studying, when he readed all of kisuke's work, ukitake 3rd seat and 4th seat was the ones to find what azien was studying by azien reitsu and thats a huge libary lol. and thats how ss figure out azien's plans.

-azien wanted inoune so that he could get ichigo and co with some captain's to hm, who was the person to let inoune go threw the gate to get back to k-town ukitake.

-i know how smart azien is but how did he know that fake k-town was fake before he got there, look at ukitake now he's fighting the weakess arrancar ive seen so far which gives him a chance to kill the old man when his back is turned.

not saying that he will kill the old man but if there is a traitor i think it will be ukitake in theory everything i said can be over ruled but its just a little bit of what i saw. (please bear with me i was typeing really fast because i got things to do my bad if you dont understand)

anxdiety
June 15, 2009, 01:42 AM
I think what we're going to see is old man Yama get turned into a Vizard. He's going to nuke his VC by cracking out a bankai during the transition. All the other captains will run for cover due to the pile of flame everywhere. The Vizards will show up and all break out their masks trying to stop the enraged Hollow-Yama. The fire prison will of course drop. A small civil war breaks out since the leader of the 13 squads is gone. I could see Kisage attacking Kensei while he's hollowed out trying to save the old man. We would have Soul Society against its own system that is now outdated with the advent of the hybrids on both sides. We'd also then have the entire conflict regarding Soul Societies side finding the original copy of the King's Key as well as stopping Aizen from creating one right in SS itself.