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Tsukisama
September 04, 2008, 11:15 PM
The latest raw is out. You may view it here (http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38278).

Please use this thread to discuss the latest chapter and your predictions for next week's chapter. Hisagi's fight looking pretty interesting, ne?

No spam

Now, discuss! :cheerbunny

coungpow
September 05, 2008, 12:02 AM
So much for Ukitake and Kyouraku Shunsuig having the "only two soul cutters in soul society that are in pairs" (chapter 156) But cool looking chapter

LoS
September 05, 2008, 12:20 AM
Yep, something makes me think Kubo just made this up recently(well at least after that line was dropped).

His Shikai's look pretty dumb in my opinion.

Also, how many chapters do you think this fight will go on for?

Mecca83
September 05, 2008, 12:25 AM
I would guess it still only counts as on Zanpakutou since they are connected.

GOOMOONRYONG
September 05, 2008, 12:36 AM
findor looks like oro with half of his mask broken :p cool chapter though

assalane
September 05, 2008, 12:36 AM
ukitake's too are connected by a chain. well shinigami are quite secretive when it comes to their releases. the old man couldn't know all of them.

coungpow
September 05, 2008, 01:03 AM
I like that explanation also kubo is human... As for the fight another chapter and a half or that seems to be the speed with they've been going at, which if fine by me as the fights are just gonna get bigger and better.

The exploding chains Hisagi keeps on his arms are pretty cool i had always though they were just more of his tattoos. I Guess the one on his neck will be the same thing too.

Yannnnnnnnn
September 05, 2008, 01:16 AM
I am a bit disapointing by hisagi's released....
I think i wait too much for that and now I think that it doesn't look that great...

The Last Uchiha
September 05, 2008, 01:20 AM
All right! the fact that a Luitenant is realesing a new shikai menas we may see the Captains realease their Bankai. I been wondering for a while what's Soifon's bankai.

LoS
September 05, 2008, 01:42 AM
+1 to Yannn I also dont like his release.

Also nice sig Uchiha, u came up with that one pretty quick.

patz
September 05, 2008, 02:04 AM
I believe what Kubo meant for Shunsui and Ukitake was pairs of swords since Hisaki's wasn't a pair of sword.

natli
September 05, 2008, 03:00 AM
Hisagi's shikai looks great.
Kira's last line sounds pretty depressing. 3rd and 11th divisions are polar opposites when it comes to philosophy.

notBowen
September 05, 2008, 04:05 AM
Kira is a bad motherfucker. Whole lot of blood there.

Hisagi's fight is okay, will withhold judgment on his shikai until I see what it can actually do.

Kusachu
September 05, 2008, 04:36 AM
I'm just glad to finally see Hisage get down. I hope he turns out to be super badass like they made him out to be as a kid. >:}

hossice
September 05, 2008, 05:44 AM
his shikai is awesome!

and since kiras sword was still in the same place doesn't that mean it was the "tap tap fall and cut ur own head off" manuever?

in the middle section 1st pic. on the right
http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/324/01/

i misjuged the spoilers. it sounded as if findor had one claw. now i think its awesome. his water prison reminds me of byakuyas senbon sakura attack w/ ichigo.

weixiaobao
September 05, 2008, 07:21 AM
wow, this bleach trend is getting annoying..

first an opponent show up and kicking @ss
shinigami's ability revealed and get laugh at..
then shinigami kick @ss..

Devil-buster
September 05, 2008, 08:56 AM
his shikai is awesome!

and since kiras sword was still in the same place doesn't that mean it was the "tap tap fall and cut ur own head off" manuever?

in the middle section 1st pic. on the right
http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/324/01/

i misjuged the spoilers. it sounded as if findor had one claw. now i think its awesome. his water prison reminds me of byakuyas senbon sakura attack w/ ichigo.

You could see blood flying all over the place and also you can see kira's swored makinn an arc with blood flyin off, blood around abirama's neck.......blood dripin off the sword.....also the fact that abirama's head and body are shown in two separate panels.....this is all done to indicate his head has been severed.....this is not berserk...I dont think kubo is gruesome enough to actually show a beheading...but hee pointed in the right direction.

iketaurus
September 05, 2008, 10:47 AM
So much for Ukitake and Kyouraku Shunsuig having the "only two soul cutters in soul society that are in pairs" (chapter 156) But cool looking chapter

I dont know if you would consider that weapon a combination swords

ryanzokuken
September 05, 2008, 11:09 AM
Hisagi's isn't a pair like Ukitake and Shunsui's. they are still the only two with a pair.

Hisagi's are connected together by a chain. all one piece. not a dual wielder, so calm down.

i wonder what they do. will they be just a weapo-type or will they have some cool abiltity? :D

either way, that's all i wanted out of his fight, to see his shikai.

out of the four the only ones i was pumped for were Yumichika and Ikkaku. so now i'm ready to see Ikkaku. i don't care if it's any different from the last time. it'll still be sick. he and his bankai are badass.

lazybear
September 05, 2008, 11:09 AM
i agree w/ the other posts w/ how bad ass kira's shikai is. in the end, the opponent ended up beheading him self on the hooked blade b/c of his own weight, and not thru the efforts of kira. of course its b/c kira did what he does, but its awesome how his finishing blow is you falling down to your own death. =) go kubo.

hajialibaig
September 05, 2008, 11:44 AM
...these fights have become rather tiresome..where is everybody else? Dead? Show some reactions from the 20 people standing around for a change

If only people had more imagination..

TheChosenOne
September 05, 2008, 12:41 PM
Hisagi's isn't a pair like Ukitake and Shunsui's. they are still the only two with a pair.

Hisagi's are connected together by a chain. all one piece. not a dual wielder, so calm down.

Ain't Uki's sword connected (http://read.mangashare.com/Bleach/chapter-156/page011.html) by a thick rope, which would make in one piece as well. So reckoning Uki's release is similar to Hisagi's, having a pair release could be applied with Hisagi as well. :)

Archit
September 05, 2008, 12:42 PM
lol @ most of the comments. I thought it was a great chapter :D Hisagi's shikai was cool, I'm ready to see exactly what it can do. (It better live up to it's looks) But anywho...Kira is a cold mothafu*ka.....his kill was so clean we could eat off it. But I hope Hisagi's and Ikkaku's fight go quickly....I'm still waiting for Aizen, Gin, Tousen, and the other three Espada to start..... =/

Josear XIII
September 05, 2008, 01:22 PM
i cant say, hisagi's release was what i expected, i though it would be something less troublesome to handle, but am not disappointed and i have to agree with Assalane's comment about shinigami being discrete about their releases, Old Yama-jii cant go around asking to every shinigami, if their release is a double zampakutoh.

As for kira, he ended nicely, old samurai style, even if his fight wasn't one that i liked but he ended juts nice. AND YAY FOR SHOWING SOME KIDO in this chapter

hossice
September 05, 2008, 01:46 PM
i agree w/ the other posts w/ how bad ass kira's shikai is. in the end, the opponent ended up beheading him self on the hooked blade b/c of his own weight, and not thru the efforts of kira. of course its b/c kira did what he does, but its awesome how his finishing blow is you falling down to your own death. =) go kubo.




You could see blood flying all over the place and also you can see kira's swored makinn an arc with blood flyin off, blood around abirama's neck.......blood dripin off the sword.....also the fact that abirama's head and body are shown in two separate panels.....this is all done to indicate his head has been severed.....this is not berserk...I dont think kubo is gruesome enough to actually show a beheading...but hee pointed in the right direction.


are you saying what he is saying? if not then im still confused.


well if yama doesn't know and if this is a dual weapon i expect to see some reactions!!! if this is his 1st time releasing and if it is a dual weapon....even more reactions.

BlackHair
September 05, 2008, 01:53 PM
As it was said, there gonna be war.. I was expecting an epic fight with a whole seated gotei squads vs aizen and his pets. but well.. was too much apparently. Now we gonna fed with useless crap. Since the beginning of hieco mundo arc, Im just reading bleach to kill time. SS was epic, everything after was shit.

hueco mondo = soul society. expect for different characters, there was no change in the story.


regards

Raizen
September 05, 2008, 02:08 PM
Interesting chapter, not as good as last one. Anyways, kira is a bad little mofo, his shikai is actually very cool. Any opponent that has no clue about its abilities would be f-ed.

AS for hisagi, how did he get so tired so quickly? Also this page confused me: http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/324/12/
First panel, what was the weird number 8 in the nice speech box and in the top left what was the black piece in the middle of the two fighters. Also where did the chain come from?

As for the two pair of swords, I don't think that hisagi's release can be considered swords, but rather a sickle or some sort.

Onomatopoeia
September 05, 2008, 02:10 PM
Ukitake's swords are a pair of swords held together by a chain so if Hisagi's sword doesn't count then neither does Ukitake. Quick note Yamma said they were the only two soul cutters in SS" thats an extremely ambiguous statement.

It would be only to easy for me to argue that soul cutter means Zanpaktou which means no matter the release form as long as their are two of it then Yama's statement is false. And as for those saying that Yamma not knowing. I kinda suspect that he would know the Captains/VC's shikais/bankai's at least. Though I could be wrong, anyways this proves that no matter who says it they can still be proven wrong later.

Anyway's Findor is awesome without his mask and is probablly among the top 3 most badass released forms. And Findor's personality is awesome, Kubo better not screw with this guy's personality so that the arrancar's seem to badass. Findor made this chapter good along with Kira to a smaller scale.

gold349
September 05, 2008, 03:24 PM
...these fights have become rather tiresome..where is everybody else? Dead? Show some reactions from the 20 people standing around for a change

If only people had more imagination..

my thoughts exactly, there is no reaction from anyone, I would have thought at least one would have come from Braggan as to how shite his dragons are and they are getting squished by ants, now that's effin funny.

Kubo may be doing this on purpose as I'm giving him the benefit of doubt but its making real bore of a story/battle so far. Heck I was one of those that was saying that these VC have place in this battle, Kira Hisagi they have connections to certain people but its all going the other way for me, the excitement for the other fights is fading for me, like I said I'm giving him the benefit of doubt and will have patients and believe kubo will deliver.

ryanzokuken
September 05, 2008, 03:34 PM
Ain't Uki's sword connected (http://read.mangashare.com/Bleach/chapter-156/page011.html) by a thick rope, which would make in one piece as well. So reckoning Uki's release is similar to Hisagi's, having a pair release could be applied with Hisagi as well. :)


lol, wow, i'm an idiot. my bad. x_x i guess i blanked out there and forgot about Ukitake having the rope with the charms connecting his swords. :p thanks for correcting me.


as for the black chain thing, i think it's the black band thing from his right arm. he normally has one around his neck, and both upper arms. it looks like he snapped one off and flung it out between himself and Findor and it's actually some kind of device and it exploded. like a tricky little item he can use in a fight.
in later pages, it appears the one from his right arm is no longer there.

akatsuki27
September 05, 2008, 03:45 PM
Interesting chapter, not as good as last one. Anyways, kira is a bad little mofo, his shikai is actually very cool. Any opponent that has no clue about its abilities would be f-ed.

AS for hisagi, how did he get so tired so quickly? Also this page confused me: http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/324/12/
First panel, what was the weird number 8 in the nice speech box and in the top left what was the black piece in the middle of the two fighters. Also where did the chain come from?

As for the two pair of swords, I don't think that hisagi's release can be considered swords, but rather a sickle or some sort.

that black chain thing that blew up was a band that shuuhei wears around his arms....he snapped it off so that it would blow up and he'd get an opening to use the bakudou spell

Raizen
September 05, 2008, 03:48 PM
I actually thought they were tatoos

akatsuki27
September 05, 2008, 03:52 PM
^ they were pretty f-ing tight around his arm so i could see that....however that stripe on his face, is that a tatoo or eye-black and he plays nose tackle for the SS shinis

SquallLeonheart
September 05, 2008, 05:39 PM
i wonder what they'll show of shuuhei's abilities, we haven't seen much of what he can do, and hes been a character that was introduced a long time ago. I'm kinda disappointed with these arrancar fights, there have been so many casualties on Aizen's side and even the number 1 arrancar's fraccion are getting owned like nothing. Seemingly everytime an enemy is cocky the good guys respond in turn. This war right now is one sided at the moment and i cant wait for these fights to be over and see the top 4 arrancars fight it out.

PredakingD78
September 05, 2008, 06:32 PM
While I maybe mistaken, wasn't his release shown in Bleach: 2nd/Dark Souls for DS? While yo never saw Hisagi wielding i, he had several moves that envoled similar shaped blades that could spin, multiply and be remotely controlled.

Anyone who has the game can correct me if I'm wrong.

goodie
September 05, 2008, 07:21 PM
As for no reactions from the captains ect about their moves ect... remember that this is all happening at the same time... and they aren't exactly sitting there just watching, they are about to have some serious fights go down.

Oh, and if the fights took to much longer everyone would complain saying they are taking to long and they want to see the captians/ichigos fight ect, to short and people complain about that.

You can't please everyone. :p

hossice
September 05, 2008, 08:24 PM
Interesting chapter, not as good as last one. Anyways, kira is a bad little mofo, his shikai is actually very cool. Any opponent that has no clue about its abilities would be f-ed.

AS for hisagi, how did he get so tired so quickly? Also this page confused me: http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/324/12/
First panel, what was the weird number 8 in the nice speech box and in the top left what was the black piece in the middle of the two fighters. Also where did the chain come from?

As for the two pair of swords, I don't think that hisagi's release can be considered swords, but rather a sickle or some sort.

i know many have answered this but they left something out! yes it was his band. which i thought he only had one on his arm. but he isn't wearing his lieutenant badge for some reason which must of covered it up before. anyways, he snaped it by flexing his muscles which means he put it on tight and hes buff!! jk i checked and he snapped it off. but the one pic on that page, top row to the right, made it look like it was his left. so it flew towards findors face. (this is where no one has explained yet) shuhei then spat at it which made it expload. unless it was something else flung at it? like findors water? prolly not.

Devil-buster
September 06, 2008, 12:28 AM
I dont think yama's statement of ukitake and shunsui having the only two pair zanpaktou's in SS is not false.....Hisagi's shikai reminds me more of ikkaku's shikai it is three pieces connected by a chain but it is still one weapon.....I think hisagi's shikai is basically one weapon with two edges, so to speak......also judging by their release command, ukitake's and shunsui's zanpaktou's seem to have two separate powers or attacks....ukitake(lightning and waves) shunsui(wind and thunder).....may be for them...each zanpaktou have a separate power......that would also explain why their release commands are so long.....but watever the case we will know more abt hisagi's shiai next chapter....and If we count that yama was wrong in this case....we should also doubt a lot of such statement...including the one that states, ryujinjakka has the strongest attack power....

Onomatopoeia
September 06, 2008, 12:30 AM
Is it to much to ask for Hisagi not following the order of operations that is the F4 fight? In OP we got the plot twist of the century, I know it's not very important to the plot but even one Arrancar victory would really shake things up and not make the battles stale. I mean all the fights so far have been, Arrancar trashtalks SHinigami in some way-> fight equally for a little while-> Arrancar Releases->Arrancar owns Shinigami-> Shinigami release's Shikai-> Shinigami shows special power-> The End.

redhairSH
September 06, 2008, 01:30 AM
ok, i know that right now its all about Hisagi and his fight, and then its prolly gonna go to ikkaku, but i just have 1 question, WHAT EVER HAPPEND TO THE VIZARD!!!!????? we read like 6 chapters showing us how they became vizard, and when we finally see them heading to the battle, they havent been seen since!!! wtf? i bet soul society feels dumb for not believing urahara about aizen now huh

Darek Khort
September 06, 2008, 03:09 AM
I think it has more to do with timing. Sure it's been months in terms of chapter releases but in actual Bleach time I think it's only been a few seconds. Why do I say that? Well, I'm assuming that as soon as the fraccion started attacking the F4 they are being defeated at the same time more or less. It's not like one fight begins and everyone else is sightseeing until that fight ends; then another fight begins. Doesn't work like that.

The reason why nobody else is helping the F4 fight is because it's all happening really quickly. After Ikkaku's fight I can so see Barragan's mouth wide open just finishing his sentence about dragons vs ants.

Hisagi's shikai doesn't look that good but seeing as though Hisagi is supposed to be a genius I'm hoping it'll do some amazing stuff.

I can see a twist happening with Ikkaku's fight, not Hisagi's. Ikkaku is the only one (that we know of) with bankai in the F4. He should have been the first fight; real quick and easy but instead he is the last. That has to mean something.

Starky-08
September 06, 2008, 04:57 AM
I also think something is gunna happen in Ikkakus fight, like show some more of his past?
Or he might die, as we know Po had a look on his face that said "I have a plan" he will probably try not to release until needed.
Ikkaku will probably show us some new Bankai moves.
I also think that Po is the strongest out of the 4 fraccion, and probably has some cool release like an Ashura since Po is religious.
I like Ikkaku but I hope he dies to change a few things like, Ikkaku dies, everyone is shocked, Barragan mentions Po is his strongest fraccion, Yumi see's what happened he rushes over Barragan send that other fraccion he has(If it wasn't a mistake) to Yumi's pillar and destroyes it, everyone is shocked, now that there is only 3 pillars left.

xZerapHx
September 06, 2008, 06:40 AM
think if ikkaku dies & the other 3 will really pulverize Po..... then there's the captains fights

lazybear
September 06, 2008, 08:57 AM
another thing i'm wondering about the upcoming ikkaku fightis the debate of whether or not he's going to go bankai or not. there are plenty arguments for both sides i supposed, but i was just re-reading the chapters and when the 4 hollows first show up at the pillars, everyone's swords are in their normal forms, except for ikkaku's. he's already in shikai mode. after the hisagi fight, unless ikkaku can just beat him w/ ease in shikai, i think a bankai is going to be called for. that is unless kubo wants to get dramatic and kill off a character

gold349
September 06, 2008, 09:35 AM
as the others have won the fights with shikai, ikkaku should win by it too, unless kubo make this fraccion different to the others in strength and status that ikkaku has to use bankai then I see another technique used by the fraccion to cover others view so he is able to use bankai or we could just be thinking to hard and ikkaku uses bankai anyway as his captain isn't going to see it plus he could refuse being captain and staying under Zarakai anyway..

xZerapHx
September 06, 2008, 09:52 AM
after all is over inoue could as well just revive ikkaku -.- she is the dragonballs of bleach so that would be a possabilit for killing him off for this fight.... or he'll win & then start attacking the espadas

ryanzokuken
September 06, 2008, 10:01 AM
i realize it would change things up a bit, but i don't understand why anyone would want one of these arrancar to win their particular pillar battle.

if the arrancar won, then it would just create complications that would lead to more boring, useless chapters. then we would have the "O_O omg, he's been defeated! quickly, before the pillar is destroyed!!" end of the chapter.

next chapter, arrancar destroys pillar, some other good guy (or multiple?) show up JUST too late, looking pissed.

next chapter, the good guys waste the arrancar.

so we had a boring overkill and a single pillar destroyed, which does nothing. it would all just waste time.

Starky-08
September 06, 2008, 10:05 AM
Okay then, maybe if they killed a Captain instead, out of the Captains who do you think would have most chance of dying?

Fortisdiablos
September 06, 2008, 10:51 AM
Okay then, maybe if they killed a Captain instead, out of the Captains who do you think would have most chance of dying?

Komamura?

I don't think Tousen would do it, but maybe Tousen will "see" another espada do it, and go into a fit of rage.

Onomatopoeia
September 06, 2008, 11:28 AM
@Rya

Actually it would make the plot much better. What we would have is a possible death of a character and see how the other react to this and Bleach would finally show something that actually make's it actiony. One Piece has killed off more good guy's then Bleach easy, yet people argue that it's a darker action manga.

If an Arrancar killed off a good guy so many things could happen. Off of the top of my head we could find out if 25% of the town that is KT comes back from SS because of this. We would get reactions from the Shingami, the plot become's much less predictable and more interesting. If a good guy wins? Nothing happens, all that happened was one of the F4 won that's great we didn't see that twice already.

Beside's who says the good guy's will beat down the Fraccion that won? Barragan has his fifth fraccion who would help the one that won. Also if their are two losse's on the F4 side then it'll accumalate into an all out fight between them. And since Yumi isn't very useful if he isn't alone then I could see the Arrancar taking it. Of course I realize this won't happen because this is Bleach. And that's the problem...

As for the time arguement it's easily been 5-10 minutes.

Devil-buster
September 06, 2008, 12:54 PM
Actually you r right it would make the plot more interesting....but I dont think ikkaku would loose to these weaklings.....also I'm sure aizen has some plan to bring back karakura...or barragan may go after the pillars himself.....but making the royal key is only a matter of time....and it will happen but I dont think it will by ikkaku's pillar....especially since everybody else won and their fights were favorable to their abilities, I think ikkaku's fight will be too....

ryanzokuken
September 06, 2008, 01:37 PM
Barragan does not have a fifth fraccion. how many times does this have to be discussed and settled?

when Aizen called the top 3 Espada and they each entered fake Karakura, you could see them and their fraccion entering through their holes. Baragan has four with him. i know, i know, "wtf happened to that little saber-tooth chick looking fraccion that it showed when he formed his throne?"

well, who knows. but unless she was hiding somewhere when they arrived, and is hiding again now, watching her comrades get owned because they SUCK, she never actually existed and it was just a little paradox/error on Kubo's part.



member of the F4 dies and pillar is destroyed = nothing but more boring and useless complications. i would think someone who bitches about these "boring" chapters that do nothing to advance the plot would want to avoid MORE of the same. if we want these fights to be over and the good stuff to be shown, then everything needs to go according to plan and these pillars need to be protected. the more weakling enemies that remain to fight, the more boringness we have to continue enduring.

on the other hand, if the F4 quickly dispense their enemies and get this stuff over with, the plot can continue.

besides, none of the F4 characters are big/important enough for their death to really make an impact on Bleach as a whole. we'd get a few pages of dialogue regarding their death, and that would be it.


if a captain, however, died in their big, important battle, that would be good.

most likely to die, based on plot or disposability = Komamura, Soifon (:(but i like her, so i hope that doesn't happen...), or Yamamoto. the old, powerful leader figure always dies and makes way for the next generation.

most likely to die based on power and getting owned = Hitsugaya.

Starky-08
September 06, 2008, 03:12 PM
Well Rya think of this, if Ikkaku dies, this could also lead to a yumi death to, because those two are best friends so if Ikkaku was to be killed, Yumi would be pissed and try fighting Po, but if he is really angry he will pwn Po because of his Shikai, but if he wishes not to be hated among the 11th division, he will not use it, but it also could be possible like someone said above, Ikkaku wins and Barragan comes to destroy the pillars killing maybe one or two of the F4, and destroying the pillars, this could lead to Ukitake(Or someone else) fight Barragan, there would still be some pillars left, so it wont be totally gone, and also if you remember before Urahara sent Ichigo, Sado and Uryu to HM Ichigo's friends where their to and Urahara said something like "It's time to begin" or something, it could mean they get powers(Prob not tho) so if all pillars where broken, they could be prepared to fight and it would also make sense on how Urahara, Tessai, Yourichi and the Vizards could begin there fights to.

Fortisdiablos
September 06, 2008, 05:05 PM
Didn't Yamamoto say that Ukitake and Shisui had the only Zanpakutou of their kind (the dual weapons). How come Hisagi has dual scythes? And before people start mentioning that they're connected by chain, let me mention that Ukitake's are also connected.

gtbanuh
September 06, 2008, 05:20 PM
maybe when one of the pillars protector is about to move the vizards will show up.

Starky-08
September 06, 2008, 06:00 PM
Didn't Yamamoto say that Ukitake and Shisui had the only Zanpakutou of their kind (the dual weapons). How come Hisagi has dual scythes? And before people start mentioning that they're connected by chain, let me mention that Ukitake's are also connected.

I wonder that myself, maybe Yamamoto didn't know.

hossice
September 06, 2008, 07:59 PM
this is late and a little off topic. but i found a chapter title for 323. its titled: despair,darkness. its from wiki though not reliable the only title i have found.

at the bottom of unreleased chapters.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Bleach_chapters

Krisel
September 06, 2008, 08:06 PM
Just one thing for these chaps:Tch! :P
I want to see more Ichigo or what are the 3 Espadas goin to do or maybe more of Halibel boobs.

Onomatopoeia
September 06, 2008, 08:47 PM
@Ryo, you don't know whether that 5th Fraccion was a mistake or not, personally I don't think he would make that big of a mistake. And actually it's very likely that he's just watching his compadres get killed, lot's of shounen villains watch their weaker counterparts die and then suddenly blitz the good guy's once the last one has fallen.

The fact that you'd rather get the F4 fights over before a plot twist actually shows how boring you find these battles. I don't like predictable battles besides the F4 fights actually have potential to be interesting and exciting. Also all the Fraccion have been awesome, Coolhorn is Mr. 2 who follows the Okama way, Abirama(not counting the BS 180 degree personality that happened at the end of the fight) was the equivalent of Ikkaku but with a more awesome ritual, and Findor's personality/looks/release is looking to be very awesome. Honestly I find the Fraccions to be good characters.

As for what can happen in this arc just read the post below yours by Starky-08. He made some really good points ^^

ashame
September 06, 2008, 09:52 PM
in my opinion as far as Soul Cutters they all have a name and spirit inside.
Hisagi's sword ( scythe ) has one name doesn't madder how many there are one name one Soul Cutter while the other guys had separate names and separate release calls ( their poems ).


as for everyone complaining about this being boring, cut it out, if a story is all high and no low I would be bored sometimes taking the time and doing more char development is better than mindless battle and only developing the main char. on that note I like these chapters Kira is so F'ing dark and evil and it explains his sword which was something I always wondered about.
Yumi was as I expected could have been done better but it was good comic relief.

Ikkaku will kick ass because he has to because he is Ikkaku and he will fight to the death.that brings me to my next point they cant die a captain dying is so much better for plot development ( I am so tired of (Hitsugaya) and plus he got alot of airtime (the movie) and chars like that are so much easier to kill because they have been developed to "death", but the more likelly char they will kill will be the big fox ( can't remember name to lazy to look for it) since he might make Tousen react a certain way or Touse might be the one to kill him, either way most likely to die if the don't get rid of Hitsugaya.


the one thing I am dying to see is a second betrail.
I love gin he is one of thos chars who is out of his F'ing mind but still in control of everything he does.that link makes me thing he might cross back.
well this and a butch of hints through out the whole series
http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/320/02/


Ps: as a final note stop complaining about boring, everything has his high and low points, change is better than a monotone series.

Andonan
September 06, 2008, 10:13 PM
No I just get the feeling that no one has ever known of Hisagi's release, APART from perhaps Tousen..... I thought his release was epic and I'm sure we will now see the power of duel sword releases, but it was sorta predictable, his zanpaktou is a reflection of the 69 tatoo

Archit
September 06, 2008, 11:03 PM
I just hope he gets the fight over with "A-fookin S.A.P!".....I'm not pushing or complaining about these pillar fights but come on.......we all pretty much know how they're going to turn out. The "real fights" and true wheel that will put motion in Bleach needs to hurry the fook up cause although Yumi, Ikkaku, Hisagi, and Kira are getting limelight right now....it doesn't MOVE the PLOT in BLEACH! Need I say it again....bring on Aizen, Tousen, Gin and the 3 Espada....lol

xZerapHx
September 07, 2008, 09:53 AM
well it seems that no one seems to know what kind of releases all zanpaktous have so not even yamamoto seems to know the full extent of gin-zen's full power (what will gins bankai be?!) so ii am really curious of how many shinigami that will be dragged to the ground & the 4 pillar VC's will probably try with some help & get defeated easily

chrisb3
September 07, 2008, 12:58 PM
About the weapons. The captains have TWO swords, linked by a chain/rope. They have TWO weapons each. They are dual weilding TWO swords. The chain/rope is not part of the weapons in any meaningful way, it's just a symbolic link which serves no purpose other than to link them.

Hisagi's weapon is ONE weapon. The chain and two blades are all part of the weapon. I fully expect him to start whirling it around his head and throwing them around using the chain as part of the technique.

Not a very clear distiction between the two types I know, but we will see it when he starts fighting. If he fights like he is duel weilding all the time then I am wrong (but they still arn't swords which is a big difference), but if he starts spining them around (you can actually see him doing this when he releases) then the chain is a meaningful part of the weapon making it one coherant weapon.

hossice
September 07, 2008, 02:46 PM
^ yes like ikkakus chain and ichigos rope and chain for zangetsu.


i hope we get 2 more chapters. so then maybe there is a chance that hisagi will be on the cover of the volume he is in.

Fortisdiablos
September 07, 2008, 05:01 PM
About the weapons. The captains have TWO swords, linked by a chain/rope. They have TWO weapons each. They are dual weilding TWO swords. The chain/rope is not part of the weapons in any meaningful way, it's just a symbolic link which serves no purpose other than to link them.

Hisagi's weapon is ONE weapon. The chain and two blades are all part of the weapon. I fully expect him to start whirling it around his head and throwing them around using the chain as part of the technique.

Not a very clear distiction between the two types I know, but we will see it when he starts fighting. If he fights like he is duel weilding all the time then I am wrong (but they still arn't swords which is a big difference), but if he starts spining them around (you can actually see him doing this when he releases) then the chain is a meaningful part of the weapon making it one coherant weapon.

Shinsui's isn't connected by a chain or rope.

ryanzokuken
September 07, 2008, 07:33 PM
Ukitake's rope seems to serve a specific purpose with his zanpakuto.

we know it is supposed to have water and electricity abilities.
well, logic would dictate that the metal charms on the rope probably serve as conductors and/or points to attract and charge the lightning.

chrisb3
September 07, 2008, 07:55 PM
Shinsui's isn't connected by a chain or rope.

Oh. And..?

Just further proves my point.

hossice
September 07, 2008, 08:19 PM
the rope may also allow him to combine the attacks in to one shot/blast.

Eddy01741
September 07, 2008, 08:25 PM
The way I see it is that Yama-jii wouldn't know that Shuhei had a dual zanpakuto since he has never seen it. He has seen shunsui and ukitake's because they were his pupils in the past and some of the oldest shinigamis we know of. Hisagi on the other hand was just a boy a hundred years ago and was graduating the academy when Renji, Kira, and Momo were in their first year. So my guess is that he simply never knew of Shuhei's release. It's not common for shinigami's to share info about their releases.

pirate-hitman:L
September 07, 2008, 09:23 PM
This will cause problems in the anime, right?
The movie showed his sword becoming some kind of explosion.

Tsukisama
September 07, 2008, 09:33 PM
This will cause problems in the anime, right?
The movie showed his sword becoming some kind of explosion.

Hisagi's zanpakutou was not featured in the latest movie: Diamond Dust Rebellion. In DDR, Hisagi uses a binding spell (bakudou) that resembles a flurry of spears, which he also uses in this chapter. I am not sure what explosion you are referencing, but it is likely the result of some sort of confusion.

hyn_pride93
September 08, 2008, 01:21 AM
Hisagi's zanpakutou was not featured in the latest movie: Diamond Dust Rebellion. In DDR, Hisagi uses a binding spell (bakudou) that resembles a flurry of spears, which he also uses in this chapter. I am not sure what explosion you are referencing, but it is likely the result of some sort of confusion.

Exactly. I was thinking the same thing too. Why are some thinking that Hisagi's zanpkatou is a big explosion. It was a bakudou in the 60s and it's name was 100 step railings. I just watched the movie and that's how I remember. Hisagi used that against Hitsugaya and ended up piercing him with one of them which then caused Hitsugaya to get angry and then, I guess, cause a huge explosion with his release.

Back to the chapter. I found it to be semi off the rictor. Hisagi's release in the last panels were perfectly executed. Kazeshini is a perfect symbol for Hisagi's 69 tatoo. Plus, I didn't know that Hisagi's chain tatoo on his right arm could come off 0_o? That's what really confused me.

Loki Kimblee
September 08, 2008, 12:37 PM
findor looks like oro with half of his mask broken :p cool chapter though

I was thinking the exact same thing. haha


I really like Kubo-sensei's ideas and he always surprises me on what the arrancar resurrection will look like. But he did contradict the double blade idea. Maybe that was for 'The only two known in Soul Society' but that would be another contradiction to the lieutenant rank....

chrisb3
September 08, 2008, 01:50 PM
I was thinking the exact same thing. haha


I really like Kubo-sensei's ideas and he always surprises me on what the arrancar resurrection will look like. But he did contradict the double blade idea. Maybe that was for 'The only two known in Soul Society' but that would be another contradiction to the lieutenant rank....

Read my post, he doesn't have two weapons. He has one weapon which he will start swinging around by the chain.

lostrmntic
September 08, 2008, 02:31 PM
I thought the Captains duel soul cutters were the only swords that were always in duel form, with or without release. Hisagi's may have released into a duel form, but prior to it was only a single soul cutter.

As far as I know, no one really dies in Bleach. I can't even think of a main character that's been killed off yet that wasn't a hollow. There's many flashbacks to deaths that occured before the main story but non that have come in present bleach timeline.

kweci
September 08, 2008, 02:41 PM
Barragan does not have a fifth fraccion. how many times does this have to be discussed and settled?

when Aizen called the top 3 Espada and they each entered fake Karakura, you could see them and their fraccion entering through their holes. Baragan has four with him. i know, i know, "wtf happened to that little saber-tooth chick looking fraccion that it showed when he formed his throne?"

well, who knows. but unless she was hiding somewhere when they arrived, and is hiding again now, watching her comrades get owned because they SUCK, she never actually existed and it was just a little paradox/error on Kubo's part.



member of the F4 dies and pillar is destroyed = nothing but more boring and useless complications. i would think someone who bitches about these "boring" chapters that do nothing to advance the plot would want to avoid MORE of the same. if we want these fights to be over and the good stuff to be shown, then everything needs to go according to plan and these pillars need to be protected. the more weakling enemies that remain to fight, the more boringness we have to continue enduring.

on the other hand, if the F4 quickly dispense their enemies and get this stuff over with, the plot can continue.

besides, none of the F4 characters are big/important enough for their death to really make an impact on Bleach as a whole. we'd get a few pages of dialogue regarding their death, and that would be it.


if a captain, however, died in their big, important battle, that would be good.

most likely to die, based on plot or disposability = Komamura, Soifon (:(but i like her, so i hope that doesn't happen...), or Yamamoto. the old, powerful leader figure always dies and makes way for the next generation.

most likely to die based on power and getting owned = Hitsugaya.

i don't see why people think certain captains (namely soifon, komamura and hitsugaya) are much weaker than the rest, or should die for plot advancement. They may have not pnwed in the past, but that is a function of the plot development. komamura fought equally with kenpachi before he got owned by aizen and his crazy shikai. hitsugaya also got owned by aizen, but he was actually pretty badass in the ss arc (like his fight with gin), plus i cant take filler/movie material against him. soifon's speed rivals yoruichi's. she hasn't even revealed her bankai yet, nor shown other powers of her shikai, nor shown her mastery of spells... as far as i am concerned, there's yama-ji, ukitake, shunsui and possibly unohana who are 'elite' captains, and then there's the rest of them, that are more or less equally skilled. if anyone should die, it should be ukitake (bad health) or a leutenant getting overwhelmed, or yama-ji as a sacrificial/passing the torch gesture.

i think ikkaku's number's up. why would you save a character that has revealed all his moves for last?

ryanzokuken
September 08, 2008, 03:19 PM
i don't think Soifon is weak. personally, i think she's probably the 4th best current captain. like, Yama, Shunsui, Ukitake, then her.

Hitsugaya has sucked it up several times.

he got all pissed and fought hard against Gin, who was having play time basically, and he couldn't touch him until he went shikai.

he couldn't touch Shawlong, a fraccion, until he went bankai and had his limiter released.

he's like the only character to fight Yammy and NOT kick his ass.

he had a loooong ass time to set up his big ice pillar attack, then TALKED about how much time he had for it and build it up, and still failed to kill Luppi.

i'm not saying he's weak. he's a captain, so of course he's strong. i'm just saying he's probably the weakest of the captains.

Komamura, i don't judge him yet, as we haven't seen him do anything yet really.

Onomatopoeia
September 08, 2008, 04:04 PM
About the weapons. The captains have TWO swords, linked by a chain/rope. They have TWO weapons each. They are dual weilding TWO swords. The chain/rope is not part of the weapons in any meaningful way, it's just a symbolic link which serves no purpose other than to link them.

Hisagi's weapon is ONE weapon. The chain and two blades are all part of the weapon. I fully expect him to start whirling it around his head and throwing them around using the chain as part of the technique.

Not a very clear distiction between the two types I know, but we will see it when he starts fighting. If he fights like he is duel weilding all the time then I am wrong (but they still arn't swords which is a big difference), but if he starts spining them around (you can actually see him doing this when he releases) then the chain is a meaningful part of the weapon making it one coherant weapon.
Their are a few major flaws with your arguement.

First of all Yama said that their are only Soul Cutters in SS that can be dual weilded. Which means that Hisagi's Shikai still go's under that definition because a SC does not have to be a sword under any circumstance's.

Secondly where are your scans proving that Hisagi's Shikai uses the chain to fight, and where did you get the scans that show Ukitake showing scans that he doesn't use that Chain not to fight? Besides Ukitake's chain's actually have something on them which has always made me think they'res more to that.

Finally whether you like it or not Yama's definition of a dual weilded Shikai is two identical soul cutters and as an optional choice they can also have a chain in between, the last part is optional. Yama has yet to give any other definition or requirement.

Guy's it's called inconsistency we all know quite well that Kubo does it a lot.

And I personally can't stand Soifon she's only a little smarter then Kenpachi. Yet she controls the division thats supposed to weed out any traitors. Wonder how Aizen became a captain... Not only that but she's got one of the most haxxed Shikai's out their and what does she do with this knowledge? She explains it before she can fully activate it. Kira didn't even do that!!

Hitsugaya is awesome. His age is extremely unrelative to his strength. If his age to power ratio continue's then only Multipling his age by 3 and we have a near Yama Captain. And Yamma still beat up Chad, Orihime, Tatsuki, and Ichigo had his but saved by Urahara. Don't try to argue with this a handicap win is still a handicap win(and I personally think that he wouldn't have beaten Yammi with his Bankai). I don't see people arguing over the Byakuya vs Ichigo fight about how Byakuya won.

Eddy01741
September 08, 2008, 06:10 PM
i don't see why people think certain captains (namely soifon, komamura and hitsugaya) are much weaker than the rest, or should die for plot advancement. They may have not pnwed in the past, but that is a function of the plot development. komamura fought equally with kenpachi before he got owned by aizen and his crazy shikai. hitsugaya also got owned by aizen, but he was actually pretty badass in the ss arc (like his fight with gin), plus i cant take filler/movie material against him. soifon's speed rivals yoruichi's. she hasn't even revealed her bankai yet, nor shown other powers of her shikai, nor shown her mastery of spells... as far as i am concerned, there's yama-ji, ukitake, shunsui and possibly unohana who are 'elite' captains, and then there's the rest of them, that are more or less equally skilled. if anyone should die, it should be ukitake (bad health) or a leutenant getting overwhelmed, or yama-ji as a sacrificial/passing the torch gesture.

i think ikkaku's number's up. why would you save a character that has revealed all his moves for last?
Okay.... lets see:
-Komamura fought in a 2 on 1 against a Kenpachi that wasn't even fighting, he just stood there as he sucked up hits from Komamura and Tousen, it barely even hurt him
-Komamura got pwned by Aizen bad, no denying that, I'm not saying that Komamura is weak here, just Aizen owns so damn much with his cheapass (hypnosis is both cheap and not flashy, way to be boring kubo...)
-Hitsugaya got pwned in ONE HIT by Aizen's shikai, and this is while Hitsugaya is in bankai.... yeah....
-Hitsugaya was going all out in shikai against gin with basically a short sword or a dagger and they were equally matched the whole time, once Gin broke out his shikai ability once, Hitsugaya had to back off and momo would have died had it not been for Matsumoto (who's sword cracked under teh pressure of Gin's shikai ability)
-Soifon has equal speed with Yoruichi in pure flash steps, but she can't do all the fancy flash tricks, her in shikai couldn't beat Yoruichi without a zanpakuto, and her shunko abilities just pale in comparison to Yoruichi's, it's just that big a difference.

I jjust wanna see the "elite" captains shikai abilities (not including Yama-jii, unless he has even more of them to show us), i mean, Ukitake's zanpakuto's look absolutely badass.

chrisb3
September 08, 2008, 07:00 PM
Their are a few major flaws with your arguement.

First of all Yama said that their are only Soul Cutters in SS that can be dual weilded. Which means that Hisagi's Shikai still go's under that definition because a SC does not have to be a sword under any circumstance's.

My argument is that his fighting style is not going to be duel weilding, his is going to throw the spinning blades at people using the chain to move them around and return them to himself. Like when Hollow Ichico throws his Shikai, exept there's another blade at the end of the rope. It will be one coherant weapon (two spinning blades on a chain) opposed to the captains distinctly seperate swords.



Secondly where are your scans proving that Hisagi's Shikai uses the chain to fight, and where did you get the scans that show Ukitake showing scans that he doesn't use that Chain not to fight? Besides Ukitake's chain's actually have something on them which has always made me think they'res more to that.

When he releases you can see the blade spinning at the top of the page. I am assuming he will have both spinning at once while perhaps holding the chain.
I very much doubt that Ukitake's chain is going to be part of the physical fighting style, it could channel a special ability like a current though it I guess but it doesn't change that fact that he has two swords.



Finally whether you like it or not Yama's definition of a dual weilded Shikai is two identical soul cutters and as an optional choice they can also have a chain in between, the last part is optional. Yama has yet to give any other definition or requirement.

As I have said, this is just a theory at the moment. We will see next week when the ablities of the weapon are revealed.

ArmsDealer70
September 08, 2008, 07:49 PM
who cares about the fact that whos gonna die i just hope that the 3 top espadas are tough as they think they are cause so far the other espadas kinda sucked and their releases a re totally stupid as hell so i hope that everyone goes bankai and all releases get released in a all out war against everyone then vaiazrds come in and killes arrancars and aizen and shinigamis and tehn take over sould society to make a new arc and then before u know it the vasto lordes will come into play and then anothr all out war arc will comtinue OMFG that would B nice. JUST END THIS SILLY GAME AND KILL KILL KILL KILL

pjboom
September 08, 2008, 08:23 PM
Fantastic, now the arrancar get pwned by the VC, I'm tired of this, I trully expect that the Top3 are stronger than any captain.
The fan-dictatorship that has become this manga is booooring, the "cool" characters get more powerups than metalslug.

Loki Kimblee
September 08, 2008, 09:26 PM
Read my post, he doesn't have two weapons. He has one weapon which he will start swinging around by the chain.

Yes, I did see the very obvious chain running from the end of each blade. I said double blade not double weapon, dude. You had a misunderstanding reading my post. But I have to say if he is going to swing it around by the chain don't you think he would be holding just the chain not the chain and the weapon?

Devil-buster
September 08, 2008, 09:41 PM
Their are a few major flaws with your arguement.

First of all Yama said that their are only Soul Cutters in SS that can be dual weilded. Which means that Hisagi's Shikai still go's under that definition because a SC does not have to be a sword under any circumstance's.

Secondly where are your scans proving that Hisagi's Shikai uses the chain to fight, and where did you get the scans that show Ukitake showing scans that he doesn't use that Chain not to fight? Besides Ukitake's chain's actually have something on them which has always made me think they'res more to that.

Finally whether you like it or not Yama's definition of a dual weilded Shikai is two identical soul cutters and as an optional choice they can also have a chain in between, the last part is optional. Yama has yet to give any other definition or requirement.

Guy's it's called inconsistency we all know quite well that Kubo does it a lot.


Hitsugaya is awesome. His age is extremely unrelative to his strength. If his age to power ratio continue's then only Multipling his age by 3 and we have a near Yama Captain. And Yamma still beat up Chad, Orihime, Tatsuki, and Ichigo had his but saved by Urahara. Don't try to argue with this a handicap win is still a handicap win(and I personally think that he wouldn't have beaten Yammi with his Bankai). I don't see people arguing over the Byakuya vs Ichigo fight about how Byakuya won.

Actually yama said that ukitake's and shunsui's zanpaktou are the only two zanpaktou that exist as a pair...he didnt say that they were the only twi that can be dual wielded......
http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/156/15/

and I think u mean yammi beat up ichi, tat, orihime, etc.....I really dont think yammi can beat the new and improved chad.....also Ichigo vs byakuya fight....Ichigo won byakuya didnt.....senbonzokura was destroyed in the fight.....and byakuya conceded ichigo won.......

I really think even if kubo made a mistake with hisagi's shikai....I think he still has time to fix it...no explanation was given on how it works....I think it is a single weapon...something like this kusari gama except it has a sickle it both ends instead of weight at one....
http://www.yorkjitsu.org/jitsu/weapons/chain/index.html

Pointlessness413
September 08, 2008, 11:01 PM
I think a recurring theme here is going to be secrecy.

Yumichika won because his Zanpakuto's true ability and name were kept secret from the entirety of Soul Society.
Kira I can't be sure of, but given how Matsumoto appeared to have no clue what Kira's shikai does (back during their brief fight, a long time ago) and the reaction to it of Kira's shikai being "an odd-shaped sword", it's not out of the realm of possibility.
Hisagi clearly had a secret of his zanpakuto given that it's a twin-blade sword but Yama-jii knows nothing about it (evidenced by his comments earlier about Shusei/Ukitake during the Soul Society arc).
Ikkaku will probably win with bankai, which has been kept a secret from Soul Society.

End story? Aizen's plans won't go perfectly. He didn't have perfect information because secrets were kept from Soul Society.

hyn_pride93
September 08, 2008, 11:21 PM
^So true. There are so many secrets that are being kept in SS that there really is no way that one person can know everything that goes on unless they can read their mind or what not. Aizen has some real trouble

assalane
September 09, 2008, 12:45 AM
@chrisb3

I can't beleive how you guys argue this much about the dual zampacto ? I mean even if he swing them around with the chain does that change the fact that there are TWO scythe not one but TWO. If Ukitake start swinging his blades, will his zampacto suddenly become a "coherent" weapon ? Or do you think that if shuhei use his weapon how you *think* a dual weapon should be used, you will actually have proof that it is indeed a dual weapon ?

That doesn't make sence to me anyway... :)

Yans86
September 09, 2008, 01:13 AM
Are u really interested in Hisagi character???come on.........

redhairSH
September 09, 2008, 01:25 AM
if the captains lose to the espada and aizen, then will aizen fight the zero division?
[hr]
btw random thought, but i wanna see uohana fight someone!

Revan46
September 09, 2008, 10:10 AM
I think a possible attack is send both blades of the shikai and using the chain it wraps around the enemy until it swings around and around and then both blades stab into the enemy :P. Just my thought anyway.

As for what will happen next, I think he'll probably just be like own Findor and over to Ikkaku again where he unleashes Bankai and gets owned. Or he'll own Po. Who knows :S. I still say there is a 5th fraccion who stands behind Barragon hence why we don't see her. Kubo has YET to actually introduce a character by mistake, even after like 7 years, I'm sure he has reason. I just can't wait to get back to the main event finally, and if they cut to Ichigo vs. Ulquiorra I'll shoot someone because I want to see the Captains, NOT ICHIGO!!! We've had Ichi for like 300 chapters pretty much :P, it's time for the Captains turn.

gold349
September 09, 2008, 10:48 AM
I checked and Braggan came out with 4 fraccion, it may have slipped his mind and fluffed it with cool horn. I'ts an understatement to say he fluffed it but I can not see another fraccion, the one that takes of Braggons robe/coat/jacket coming in from out of nowhere now that he replaced her with cool horn,

ShaunMati1
September 09, 2008, 11:44 AM
Well i hope and think that hisagis fight ends this chapter. I bet we get to see his shikais power and watch him win easy. Then kubo will introduce ikkaku's fight which will go by fast. Then after i hope we see ichigo vs ulquiorra 2

Onomatopoeia
September 09, 2008, 02:09 PM
Okay.... lets see:
-Komamura fought in a 2 on 1 against a Kenpachi that wasn't even fighting, he just stood there as he sucked up hits from Komamura and Tousen, it barely even hurt him
-Komamura got pwned by Aizen bad, no denying that, I'm not saying that Komamura is weak here, just Aizen owns so damn much with his cheapass (hypnosis is both cheap and not flashy, way to be boring kubo...)
-Hitsugaya got pwned in ONE HIT by Aizen's shikai, and this is while Hitsugaya is in bankai.... yeah....
-Hitsugaya was going all out in shikai against gin with basically a short sword or a dagger and they were equally matched the whole time, once Gin broke out his shikai ability once, Hitsugaya had to back off and momo would have died had it not been for Matsumoto (who's sword cracked under teh pressure of Gin's shikai ability)
-Soifon has equal speed with Yoruichi in pure flash steps, but she can't do all the fancy flash tricks, her in shikai couldn't beat Yoruichi without a zanpakuto, and her shunko abilities just pale in comparison to Yoruichi's, it's just that big a difference.

I jjust wanna see the "elite" captains shikai abilities (not including Yama-jii, unless he has even more of them to show us), i mean, Ukitake's zanpakuto's look absolutely badass.

Thats a terrible way to rate Hitsugaya. Why? Let's break it down like this, Aizen used his Shikai too fool Hitsugaya in Bankai mode, he then actually uses his sword on Hitsugaya.

In comparison Aizen has never used both his sword and Shikai at the same time in battle. Which means that if Aizen is forced to use his Shikai and his sword on Hitsugaya then Hitsugaya could take on GJ pretty easily.

Problem seems pretty apparent. And why are you using the Gin fight, if we go by pure knowledge of the fight Gin was losing. I like Gin more then Hitsugaya but unless you can prove to me that Gin was holding back I don't see where your going with this...

Really whats the reason for all the Hitsuhate? Because he took on the first group of arrancars who happened to be extremely inconsistent with other arrancar?

Tsukisama
September 09, 2008, 07:08 PM
Please keep posts in this thread to being related to the topic of the thread. For discussion on other Bleach-related topics, use the Hangout Thread or Biblioteca.

VeshWolfe
September 09, 2008, 09:33 PM
nothing i can really say.....the current fight will end, we will move on to ikkaku, he will start to get owned, he will go bankai, his bankai will take a while to "wake up", and the fire barrier around Aizen will disapate and cut to ichigo. there thats about the next 6 to 7 chapters, and should do us to about mid october.

i think it is quite evident that a few captains/main characters WILL die by the END of the series. most likely will be byakuya (protecting rukia), the fox head guy (just plain weak and unimpressive), and of course Aizen.

Raizen
September 09, 2008, 11:52 PM
nothing i can really say.....the current fight will end, we will move on to ikkaku, he will start to get owned, he will go bankai, his bankai will take a while to "wake up", and the fire barrier around Aizen will disapate and cut to ichigo. there thats about the next 6 to 7 chapters, and should do us to about mid october.

i think it is quite evident that a few captains/main characters WILL die by the END of the series. most likely will be byakuya (protecting rukia), the fox head guy (just plain weak and unimpressive), and of course Aizen.
Hell no byakuya can't die. He is too bad ass. If anyone is dying it is the fox dude. Hopefully soifon's VC will follow. That idiot is annoying as hell.

I wish this chapter is half hiasgi winning and the other half w/ ikkaku fighting then releasing

wooticus
September 10, 2008, 04:14 AM
I understand the Dual Soul Cutter problem in a different way. Ikkaku also has a Shikai to wield in two hands.


I Actually think that Ukitakes and Shunsuis Soul Cutters have TWO SOULS, there is not one person like zangetsu, that represents the sould of the blade, there are two ones. So these two captains are that strong because they maybe have two elements to control, each ohne with one of their blades, they could also have two bankais ore some sort of that. just like a kekkai genkai in naruto, that can combine two elements

Yans86
September 10, 2008, 05:01 AM
How is it possible that there r still person that think Gin was fighting seriously with Hitsugaya???come on,this is ridicoulus,,,,Hitsugaya was in rage,he was all out.....Gin was playing around waitin for the execution and to be summoned by Aizen to take the Hougyoku and go in HM......u cannot even compare Gin with characters like Hitsu,Hisagi,Kaien even if they r called genius....
Kaien,was a genius but he lost to that low level arrancar...even if helost the sword he could use Kidou and other technique if he was such a genious or he has such a reiatsu....
Hisagi....not really a genius,just enough strong to take a seated position before finishing the academy which take 6 years to him....
Hitsu is the only real talent we have seen so far from my point of view and in different way,with Gin,Aizen,Urahara and Ichigo I think the other r just strong or really strong but not supertalented/genious.....to state that he can match with Gin it's silly....really silly!!!!!!probably they both achieved the academy in one year and this make both genius even if for Hitsu this is not stated...
from what we have seen,Hitsu joined the academy 5 years after Hinamorii,and even if we assume that he graduated in one year,he took some year to become captain that means that even if he is the youngest captain so far,he wasn't really a kid,is just that we know that he doesn't grow up physically....on the contrary when he graduated Gin was really a kid,and he killed a third seat like nothing making assume us that he was already at lieutenant level or even captain level....why didn't he became captain or vice captain immediately?cause probably it wsan't his ambition e moreover he was already Aizen's VC in a certain way from that moment...
Now,even if we say that they were potentially the same genius,u can't compare them cause at a level of experience,Histu has I think something like 10 years of shinigami experience against 100 years of Gin...and also even if u assume that at the same age,they had the same potential,the same power,after 10 years Gin is for sure far beyond Hitsu level.....why?because Hitsu's experience are that of a normal Shinigami while Gin experience is with Aizen(I think they both experienced beyond the normal activity of captains).....so HM,fooling all the Gotei 13...captains and room46 included(even if is with the help of Aizen),experiment on Vizards,recruit and develop arrancar,fight strong hollows in heuco mundo probably to settle the actual scenario of ESPADAS which probably take a lot of years and he couldn't be made by Aizen lonely.....so,if he was Aizen VC,is not only for bloodthirst and talent,but also because he was already ready to handle all these things...
Also I want to remember that even when he removed the reiatsu limit and he used bankai,he didn't kill the arrancar......
(only one thing about that arrancar....how he became 6th espada?we know what happened to GJ,but even without that,if he was that strong he could have been number 7th.....)Didn't u ever think about that??????this,for me,open the scenario to the possibility that the fraccion of the first two espada,if Barragan is going to be shown number 3,can still be espada level,which is also the reason to Aizen to be so self-confident,and maybe give us also the possibility to see SS defeated,and then the Vizards fight against the fraccion and the Top3 espada......because if it don't go in a certain way like this,like others stated,the faction against Aizen is surely overpowere and overnumbered.....

wooticus
September 10, 2008, 06:19 AM
the point really is: If Barragan actually is noumber one, not three, and his fraccion are getting owned by 4 non captains, then usually the fraccions of the other captains couldn't be any better --> no sense in showing them fight.

Yans86
September 10, 2008, 06:34 AM
the point really is: If Barragan actually is noumber one, not three, and his fraccion are getting owned by 4 non captains, then usually the fraccions of the other captains couldn't be any better --> no sense in showing them fight.

Exactly,this would make the war a trash so at this point we can put him on number 2 or 3....

Starky-08
September 10, 2008, 06:47 AM
I hate the fact that people are calling Komamura, Hitsugaya and Soifon weak, it's annoying.

Komamura lost to Kenpachi because, he is one of the more powerful captains and would prob fight on par with Byakuya, and he lost to Aizen who is probably the strongest character right now.

Hitsugaya didn't exactly lose to Gin(Who of course is stronger than hitsu) Gin went to kill Momo Hitsu dodged and Matusmoto saved Momo, then Gin left.

Soifon hasn't really had any fights, her only fight was with Yourichi(One of the more powerful characters) I'm sure she is alot more powerful than you all think.

Any now about the next chapter and stuff:
I think Hisagi will pwn Findor, it will themn skip to Ikkaku who will start off losing then use Bankai, he will beat Po, Barragan will be shocked, maybe one Captain fight will begin, all this will last atleast 3-5 chapters.