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Tsukisama
September 04, 2008, 11:18 PM
Chapter 325 is out! Get it HERE (http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38829).

Discuss and predict, but remember not to spam!

Have fun :)

Yannnnnnnnn
September 10, 2008, 08:48 AM
No surprise... ikkaku is beaten...
before he wins
like all other 4 fantastic
it could have been more inventive this time....

by the way
1st !

Starky-08
September 10, 2008, 08:52 AM
So does this mean Hisagi's fight is over? if so, I can't wait for next chapter, to see his abilities.
This also seems interesting, as to whether or not Ikkaku will win, but he most like will.

patedecarne
September 10, 2008, 08:56 AM
More from the same, unfortunately...
Ikkaku is badly beaten, just like Eldorado fights, and he'll stand up and use Bankai, where everyone will be impressed.. you know the drill, that's what most likely will happen...

Wish Kubo could be a little more creative with these fights, in the end Ikkaku will win will Bankai...

yAkiMuRA
September 10, 2008, 09:42 AM
More from the same, unfortunately...
Ikkaku is badly beaten, just like Eldorado fights, and he'll stand up and use Bankai, where everyone will be impressed.. you know the drill, that's what most likely will happen...

Wish Kubo could be a little more creative with these fights, in the end Ikkaku will win will Bankai...

i agree with that. Tite Kubo always do that, like in Ichigo's fight vs Byakuya...

No surprise for me, Ikkaku is the strongest shinigami of the 4 defender of the pillar, he can't lose like that and he has bankai, and a strong one... No way for me, Ikkaku can't be beaten like a ****

EDIT : Infact, it would seem that Ikkaku is beaten and the piliar is destroyed ! Oh my god, finally Tite Kudo is more creative than we thought ^^

cpi56
September 10, 2008, 11:05 AM
Oh my...

I had no problems with the "ugly ugly" fight
I even enjoyed kira's fight
I had no problems with hisagi's

But that's too much. I mean, Ikkaku half dead, beaten up, owned when using his shikai... What next, he'll scream bankai and beat his opponent badly, 'till he kills him? Anyone else havig a deja vu? At least I hope Kubo doesn't go cheap like in the Yumichika battle and creates a convenient space, so Ikkaku can go bankai at ease without anyone else noticing...

Well, I cling onto a slight hope (which will not come true, btw): The pillars were scatteret around karakura town, so, as we see in the picture, someone is screamig Ikkaku's name, it may mean someone has gone there to help after seeing the pillar destroyed...

Anyone surprised Ikkaku's shikai was badly beaten? I mean: Yumichika's? It can drain your reiatsu 'till you die... Kira's? Can make your movement stop or make your wapon useless so you can't fight back... Hisagi's? It seems to have quite a bit of range and two blades, so it can make som combo attacks and set up some traps using different range of attacks (close and mid-long)... Ikkaku's? Yeah, it can slash!! And it even has a smaller blade than when using his sword when it isn't even in shikai!!

Well let's hope I'm wrong and the chapter turns out to be great...

Streifen
September 10, 2008, 11:18 AM
i cant accept it if ever ikkaku loses this one.... its unfair -.-; the other three owning their opponents and ikkaku is the only one who loses? no way

Aizen Sama
September 10, 2008, 11:30 AM
I hope the next group of fraccion do a better job than these guys. At least one of the pillars got destroyed.

SoldaT
September 10, 2008, 11:33 AM
Don't be sad "Streifen" Ikkaku will use bankai ;)

nicobarten
September 10, 2008, 11:38 AM
well most people here thought already something like: "ikkaku will be beaten up, and then he'll use bankai and then own the fraccion".

The first reactions on the spoilers scream something like: "we are right! Ikkaku will use bankai, Kubo is an idiot!".

..... But the pillar is destroyed, which nobody thought of.

So, does that mean that the real town is there again? or must all pillars be destroyed?

Starky-08
September 10, 2008, 11:40 AM
well most people here thought already something like: "ikkaku will be beaten up, and then he'll use bankai and then own the fraccion".

The first reactions on the spoilers scream something like: "we are right! Ikkaku will use bankai, Kubo is an idiot!".

..... But the pillar is destroyed, which nobody thought of.

So, does that mean that the real town is there again? or must all pillars be destroyed?

All the pillars need to be destroyed.

Quetz
September 10, 2008, 11:50 AM
Waiting to the fourth pillar to do this has ruined any and all surprise involved in it for me. If he had been the second or third one, we would have been like 'ohhhhh shittttt', and it would have made the fourth pillar fight more interesting.

Ikkaku doesn't seem to be as strong as his personality would have us believe. Even his bankai, something that should put him at captain-level, seems lacking. (granted, having only seen it once, I can't say that for sure)

natli
September 10, 2008, 11:51 AM
It would be interesting if Ikkaku actually lost this fight. It would be the first time we saw consequences of his resolution to not show anyone his bankai. Every time we heard in Bleach 'I won't do it even if it kills me', the idiot in question was miraculously saved by circumstances and emerged with his hide intact (vide Yumichika). But if Ikkaku lost this fight he didn't only put his life on the line, he also endangered the lives of people in Karakura. This doesn't look so heroic.

yAkiMuRA
September 10, 2008, 11:54 AM
Well, who said that's Ikkaku is going to lose his fight ?

I think he gonna beat this fraccion but anyway now the pilar is destroyed. I think that Ikkaku had under estimate his opponent...:eyeroll

But he's going to beat the fraccion , i think ^^ Well it would be strange if Hisaghi, Yumichika, Kira have beaten their opponent and Ikkaku who he is supposed to be strongest of them lose again a fraccion !?

Alexis
September 10, 2008, 11:57 AM
Does anyone actually believe that Ikkaku is going to lose? Kubo is so straight forward with his paths most of the time that it loses excitement due to how predictable it is.

I was hoping that Soul Society would actually lose for once, but that doesn't seem to be the case. I hope the Espada fight will be different.
I've lost much interest in Bleach and it's story that's going nowhere, and main character who doesn't grow. But I'm still interested in Ulquiorra, Halibel, Yoruchi, Soi Fon, and Aizen, so I'll keep reading.

yAkiMuRA
September 10, 2008, 12:02 PM
I was hoping that Soul Society would actually lose for once, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

If Soul Society lose it's going to be the end of the manga ^^



I've lost much interest in Bleach and it's story that's going nowhere

Maybe because Tite Kubo doesn't know himself if he's going to finish the manga sooner or later... I've read that this battle could be the last before the end.:o

Starky-08
September 10, 2008, 12:31 PM
Everyone kinda needs a final fight, so maybe the fraccion fights where these guys last battle, it'd dumb if the characters didn't have a final battle.
I'm actually getting more interested in Bleach as it goes on, yeah Ikkaku has like a 95% chance of winning but he still has alot more skills to show, and he might have an element like others.

Sentou Ryoku
September 10, 2008, 12:32 PM
Oh snap, Ikkaku got his ass handed to him. I totally thought he was gonna win his fight too. But 3 out 4 isn't a bad ration for Soul Society's guys. I wonder if Yumichika's gonna come and save the day?

patedecarne
September 10, 2008, 12:35 PM
You know, could be just a dream, but Ikkaku losing here would be the best thing to fuel Bleach at this point: a defeat by Soul Society side now would turn the things way more interesting;

Aizen and his friend would be much more confident right now, and they'll attack with full power the remaining pillars,not to tell that just now, there's nor reason to Ikkaku fights for, then his fight will be pretty much useless: I mean, why would he fight if the pillar is already destroyed?

At least such twist could give a better direction for Kubo follows from now, instead of just writing senseless plot like this mini arc...

You know, could be just a dream, but Ikkaku losing here would be the best thing to fuel Bleach at this point: a defeat by Soul Society side now would turn the things way more interesting;

Aizen and his friend would be much more confident right now, and they'll attack with full power the remaining pillars,not to tell that just now, there's nor reason to Ikkaku fights for, then his fight will be pretty much useless: I mean, why would he fight if the pillar is already destroyed?

At least such twist could give a better direction for Kubo follows from now, instead of just writing senseless plot like this mini arc...

Well, Findor was defeated after using captain power; no, please, I don't want to see another Noitora vs Kenpachi fight. seems Kubo isn't even caring about how the arancars are being defeated...

no_regretsYSL
September 10, 2008, 01:03 PM
First let me say, took me friggin long enough to actually get an account, but I've been looking at the Bleach section for a good minute.

Anyway on topic, only a few people have said this so far, but I definately think Ikkaku has lost this match, maybe he's not dead, but definately beaten.

My reasoning is because of the fact that its obvious everyone would think that he would go Bankai and defeat his oppent etc. So if you were going to have a notion of change it would have to stem from somewhere. This notion of change stems from the 11th squad top seats always saying they wouldnt dare use bankai publically...well thats a load of bull if you never see it go down. So now we finally see what happens if there isn't a way to go "incognito bankai"

But even with that said theres still two possibilities, the said fact of ikkaku losing etc, or him finding some schemin way of beating the arrancar with his shikai...as help is out of the question unless he is in fact knocked out (Dragonball Z, a Kubo role model, Trunks not aiding Vegeta till he was unconcious, yes i used to watch that show:oh)

kkck
September 10, 2008, 01:23 PM
Cant believe ikkaku is the only one who allowed his pillar to be destroyed. I think he will be ashamed of this and will use his bankai in public.

ryanzokuken
September 10, 2008, 01:23 PM
that fight can't be done. the pillar may be broken, but Ikkaku will still kill Po.

Po isn't even released into hollow form in that picture. they both still have their powerups to use. Ikkaku will get up next chapter. for sure.

cero_tenshou
September 10, 2008, 01:32 PM
i would like to point out that people can actually die without using their full power. in other words, a strong enough attack can kill ikkaku before he has the chance to use bankai. i know some people are thinking that a bankai user cannot lose before bankai is lost, or something to that effect.

sharingan_kakashi
September 10, 2008, 01:47 PM
All these fights feel like fillers to me. They do not really do anything for the story. its only showing these guys release forms.

Starky-08
September 10, 2008, 01:49 PM
Well of course they can killed without using Bankai, but what would have been the point in showing Ikkaku's if it was shown once, and didn't show many skills.
Also since there is one pillar destroyed maybe the three espada will destroy the other three.

nicobarten
September 10, 2008, 02:04 PM
Well of course they can killed without using Bankai, but what would have been the point in showing Ikkaku's if it was shown once, and didn't show many skills.
Also since there is one pillar destroyed maybe the three espada will destroy the other three.

well... then they first must beat SS captains...

5sealing
September 10, 2008, 02:13 PM
Members of the 11th are a little kooky. Remember if it weren't for a technicality Yumi's pillar would have been destroyed as well, but his opponent was the best match up for him. If Ikkaku does not want to show his bankai then he just might be stubborn enough to die.

Yans86
September 10, 2008, 02:23 PM
Finally something good....one pillar down,I hope isa enough to brake the balance of the curse and take Karakura back....

hossice
September 10, 2008, 02:36 PM
how do we know hes not in bankai? the pic. doesn't show his sword that he is using/shikai/bankai. prolly shikai but who knows? that lazy bum! laying there like he has nothing left!....i would have done the same thing. would of liked to see a special move from hisagi though.

wooticus
September 10, 2008, 02:56 PM
wasn't this the only logical consequence?

i mean. the fraccions seem to be doomed. there are 3 pillars left and so are three espada, makes one for each pillar, huh? so they will split up and so there will three captains to split, well lets think of it, ukitake, soi fon and shunsui, the top 3 captains after yama, yama will stay at aizen and the rest of the guys will decimate a few fraccions.

Revan46
September 10, 2008, 03:00 PM
I don't think the pillar is destroyed. They're battling in Karakura town, it's possible its a home or something else destroyed. But it still could be the pillar...I'm just trying to be optimistic.

Akihito
September 10, 2008, 03:05 PM
i hope the next chapter has all the fantastic 4 on the ground with halibel's fraccion standing over them. Ikkaku losing was to predictable and another chapter with him going bankai and winning would be useless in my opinion.

no_regretsYSL
September 10, 2008, 03:12 PM
Finally something good....one pillar down,I hope isa enough to brake the balance of the curse and take Karakura back....



I think hisagi's shikai has somehting to do with fear.....

ShaunMati1
September 10, 2008, 04:01 PM
Well i actually did not expect a pillar to be down. It seems logical though that you must destroy all 4 pillars before seeing real karakura town. With one pillar gone does that mean that 25% of karakura is there or none of it?

Raizen
September 10, 2008, 04:01 PM
Wait the pillar is destroyed? WTF? That means out of all of them the pillar destroyed was guarded by the most powerful

ryanzokuken
September 10, 2008, 04:05 PM
if the F4 were beat down by three lame ass chicks, i'd be pissed. i don't care if they are tired and injured from their initial fights.

besides, if any more people from Aizen's side went to jump into the fight and interfere against the F4, don't you think the other VC's would help?

if the other fraccion were sent to finish the job on the pillars, the remaining VC's would probably pull some badass *appear in front of opponent casually and say something tough*

if the espada make a move, the captains will also move to stop them.

this isn't a picnic. nobody gets to just do whatever they want. SS won't just let the F4 and their respective pillars be finished off.


the numbers all match up perfectly now. as do the plot-driven relationship/conflicts.

Yama will probably fight Aizen. and he'll probably die.
Shunsui, Ukitake, and Soifon will probably fight the top 3 espada.
Hitsu will probably have a rematch with Gin.
Komamura vs Tousen.
remaining VC's each get a one on one with the remaining fraccion.

Eddy01741
September 10, 2008, 04:06 PM
Either po is really powerful, or ikkaku just sucks against him, or his shikai is a bad matchup. I have to admit, ikkaku's shikai is one of the least useful, he has like a mini blade on the end of a stick, so it's like a spear that can also slash. It can seperate into 3 pieces, but honestly, Renji's can do that and better, like when he wrapped himself around syazel to kido suicide (well, not really suicide, but he tried).

Anyways, the way I see it, Ikkaku will later beat po with his bankai, and then the 3 espadas will go after the pillars, possibly the remaining fraccion will fight the F4 or other VCs.

yAkiMuRA
September 10, 2008, 04:31 PM
I think hisagi's shikai has somehting to do with fear.....

Indeed yes...



He asks the crab who seems overwhelmed if he is scared by it, he yells "who me!?" Hisagi says that he himself is scared of it.

The crab says "if you are scared of your own huge power you will become intoxicated by it." Hisagi then tells ebichili (Chile Prawns) that he has learnt "a sword in the hand can not be weilded by one who does not fear it."

There is the TRUE SPOIL ( part of it^^)

Starzen
September 10, 2008, 04:31 PM
finally I can start reading the manga again, I was getting tired of having the good guys always win.

hossice
September 10, 2008, 04:41 PM
this was so random and wierd. nothing to do with this but something. ok so i was talking to my mom and she said, "thier the pillars of society". i was like 0_0 and cont. to dry dishes in silence. it was ment to say that certain people should act good to set an example for others. i automatically thought of this and was shocked.


y do u guys think he is in shikai? i do to but a possibility is he is already in bankai. like 2% but you never know right? seems unlikly since po is unreleased. iba might be the one yellin his name....or yumi. and then yumi goes, "bankai!!!!!!!!!!!!!" the end. lol kidding about "the end" not about yumi going bankai.

yAkiMuRA
September 10, 2008, 04:45 PM
I really don't think that Ikaku is in bankai...

I think he's in shikai and he has under-estimate his opponent, and remember that he doesn't want to show his bankai in front of everyone...

From my point of view, that's why he's beaten by a Fraccion. There is a possibility that Ikaku is died, and i would say GREAT ! For once, good side (shinigamis) aren't going to win, PERFECT !

Onomatopoeia
September 10, 2008, 05:16 PM
Well this is turning out to be pretty predictable. Hisagi is losing so he uses Lawlz! Shikai!. And wins:notrust

Not only that but he just brought in a ton of inconsitency with him. Look at it like this "Exacta" gives Findor exactly Captain level which means Hisagi is stronger then captain level in Shikai we can guess from the fact that Yumi beat Hisagi that Yumi is even stronger then Hisagi and thus stronger then Captain level which means that either of them with Bankai(based off the fact that Bankai makes you stronger in some way shape or form) that either of them could wipe the floor of anyone but the elite's and even then I could see them taking out one of them alone. I'm not buying that for a second.

And then it brings up questions about the Espada. I mean where does that put Yammi up! I mean I think we can all agree that Ulqui destroys Yammi which means that he's what 3-4 times stronger then Captain Level???

I call Plotkai on this chapter. Hopefully Ikkaku losing(I hope) will make up for it because I really want some ingenuity and a more interesting plot from KUbo.

Eddy01741
September 10, 2008, 05:24 PM
Well this is turning out to be pretty predictable. Hisagi is losing so he uses Lawlz! Shikai!. And wins:notrust

Not only that but he just brought in a ton of inconsitency with him. Look at it like this "Exacta" gives Findor exactly Captain level which means Hisagi is stronger then captain level in Shikai we can guess from the fact that Yumi beat Hisagi that Yumi is even stronger then Hisagi and thus stronger then Captain level which means that either of them with Bankai(based off the fact that Bankai makes you stronger in some way shape or form) that either of them could wipe the floor of anyone but the elite's and even then I could see them taking out one of them alone. I'm not buying that for a second.

And then it brings up questions about the Espada. I mean where does that put Yammi up! I mean I think we can all agree that Ulqui destroys Yammi which means that he's what 3-4 times stronger then Captain Level???

I call Plotkai on this chapter. Hopefully Ikkaku losing(I hope) will make up for it because I really want some ingenuity and a more interesting plot from KUbo.
Please, don't be stupid with this...

First off, exacta is just spanish for "correct", it has nothing to do with breaking off pieces of his mask.

My guess for how findor got beaten, as he is basking in the glory of showing off himself in captain elvel, hisagi hits him, not too hard eh?

And eh, Yumichika's shikai would beat anybody who didn't notice that their reiatsu was slowly being drained subconciously, mmmkay? Just like how if you had no idea of Kira's ability, you'd be so shitted up.

runyan
September 10, 2008, 06:05 PM
If the pillar is destroyed as the spoilers indicate then Ikaku lost; even if he does get up and kill his opponent, his mission was to protect the pillar at all costs.

ryanzokuken
September 10, 2008, 06:21 PM
Well this is turning out to be pretty predictable. Hisagi is losing so he uses Lawlz! Shikai!. And wins:notrust

Not only that but he just brought in a ton of inconsitency with him. Look at it like this "Exacta" gives Findor exactly Captain level which means Hisagi is stronger then captain level in Shikai we can guess from the fact that Yumi beat Hisagi that Yumi is even stronger then Hisagi and thus stronger then Captain level which means that either of them with Bankai(based off the fact that Bankai makes you stronger in some way shape or form) that either of them could wipe the floor of anyone but the elite's and even then I could see them taking out one of them alone. I'm not buying that for a second.

And then it brings up questions about the Espada. I mean where does that put Yammi up! I mean I think we can all agree that Ulqui destroys Yammi which means that he's what 3-4 times stronger then Captain Level???

I call Plotkai on this chapter. Hopefully Ikkaku losing(I hope) will make up for it because I really want some ingenuity and a more interesting plot from KUbo.


just having power on the level of a captain doesn't mean you could fight equally with or beat a captain. it takes more than power in a fight. skill, technique, experience, etc, they all come into play. if Hisagi beats captain-powered Findor, it doesn't automatically say Hisagi is at captain level. he may have just been a better fighter. which seems to be the case. the spoilers say he managed to lob the big claw arm off Findor, after which Findor flees and gets stuck in the back.

Revan46
September 10, 2008, 06:23 PM
Does ANYONE remember something common about Ikkaku? The whole matter that he's always saying "Don't tell anyone about my bankai!" and since he's only slightly far from a collection of Captains, he's not going to release it hence his defeat. I think though he'll realize he's going to have to no matter how much he doesn't want to. Just gotta wait till next week now guys :P

hossice
September 10, 2008, 06:31 PM
^ which i cant


i say ikkaku somehow either talks to kenpachi or remembers talking to him and ken says," if ur losing, dont be afraid to go all out and die. its better to give it your all....then to die with your head down, knowing what is going to happen. aren't fights supposed to be about having fun, and getting mixed up in the unexpected moments and trying to overcome them with power, pride, dignity, honor, and most of all.......fun."

Onomatopoeia
September 10, 2008, 07:09 PM
Please, don't be stupid with this...

First off, exacta is just spanish for "correct", it has nothing to do with breaking off pieces of his mask.

My guess for how findor got beaten, as he is basking in the glory of showing off himself in captain elvel, hisagi hits him, not too hard eh?

And eh, Yumichika's shikai would beat anybody who didn't notice that their reiatsu was slowly being drained subconciously, mmmkay? Just like how if you had no idea of Kira's ability, you'd be so shitted up.

Meh got his release form name wrong, doesn't change my arguement.

As for Yumichikai's Shikai I think it's rather obvious when Yumi has activated his real Shikai when you start seeing flowers popping up all over the place. At that point you know it's best to just kill him off. But that doesn't change your arguement one bit the main part is the part that I bolded.

Whether your right or not will be seen by the chapter.

And if Spoilers are to be believed Hisagi's Shikai doesn't seem to have any powers which means that it becomes even more problematic.

@Rya whether Findor became exactly the power level of a Captain is debatable but Hisagi said that his power was 5th seat once. Which means that Findor was getting at least in the ballpark of the powerlevel's of each one, I see no reason for Findor's power to suddenly change just because he went up to Captain.

akatsuki27
September 10, 2008, 08:54 PM
so that's why ikkaku's fight was left for last, even though hisagi was never shown in a fight....he got whooped!!!

hossice
September 10, 2008, 09:44 PM
like some of us said, there has to be importance to ikkaku being last. (i was one of them) most were like, aww its just gonna be ikkaku gets pwnd, bankai, po releases, ikkaku owns, the end. i wonder if the pages before that show any battle? (thats the end of the ch. pic right?) prolly not. :( that will just keep me impatient till next wed. for the spoilers. watch its a whole nother battle: friends vs. exq. id be pissed but lolng cuz i want rukia to fight but want to know the out come of ikkaku!!!


oh and if its someone yelling ikkaku in that pic. who is it? yumi? iba???

Streifen
September 11, 2008, 02:15 AM
Hitsu will probably have a rematch with Gin.

yeah, hitsu with rangiku would also be cool....

and about ikkaku, i thought he was left for last because he is the only one who has bankai and his match would be epic.... LOL.....

maybe the pillar will be destroyed but ikkaku would still own the fraccion

natli
September 11, 2008, 06:06 AM
Now we know that Hisagi is afraid of his powers and that he can easily defeat someone even on captain's level...but at the same time it's still a mystery why Hisagi was so tired when Findor fought with him at lieutenant level. He may be similar to Yumichika, not so good when it comes to direct combat but with an awesome shikai.

Bigfish
September 11, 2008, 02:01 PM
3 Pillars left for 3 Espada makes sense enough. I imagine Ikkaku is going to go Bankai once he realizes his failure at protecting the pillar has more or less ensured that revealing his Bankai to everyone isn't going to promote him to captain candidacy.

Aizen Sama
September 11, 2008, 02:18 PM
Ikkaku would make a horrible captain. Hisagi should be promoted after this winter war if he has bankai.

kweci
September 11, 2008, 03:02 PM
i am sooooo confused. first off, why can hisagi's shikai cut findor so easily? ikkaku had to go bankai to be able to semi-cut that guy (volcanica... forgot his name), grimm can fight ichigo's sword with his resurrected body, nnoitra could block kenpachi's sword with his bare hands, etc, etc... how can hisagi just cut findor's big ass claw in half? secondly, how are the blades rotating? i can't imagine a way that can be, unless THAT is his shikai's power... i feel like this is a badly wrapped up fight...

i guess i should be glad ikkaku's tower came down and broke the monotony of the F4 fights, but again, many people including myself suspected something like this when ikkaku's fight was saved for last, so kubo's not doing much to curb the predictability there, but as always, i will continue to hold out in the hopes that something awesome is going on that is going to catch us all completely by surprise.

ryanzokuken
September 11, 2008, 03:30 PM
maybe Findor just doesn't have that hard of skin. all arrancar have reiatsu-tempered, iron skin, but some are tougher than others. Noitora is supposed to have the hardest that we've seen so far. he claims it's the toughest of all the espada, but he also claims to be the strongest espada, which obviously he isn't if he's number 5. and dead. lol


but yea, perhaps Findor just doesn't have skin all that tough.

LoS
September 11, 2008, 03:36 PM
why can hisagi's shikai cut findor so easily?

Inconsistencies. Kubo is just making stuff at this point, just drawing out the fights nearly as long as he can.

Reliic
September 11, 2008, 04:49 PM
This has been the week for idiot plot shockers...........
No way in hell Ikkaku could lose out of all the Shinagami, he's the only one other then Kenpachi who lives to fight............

I wonder how Kubo plans to explain why Ikkaku out of all people could have been possibly defeated, it better be good.

nordicbattlesigns
September 11, 2008, 05:22 PM
3 Pillars left for 3 Espada makes sense enough. I imagine Ikkaku is going to go Bankai once he realizes his failure at protecting the pillar has more or less ensured that revealing his Bankai to everyone isn't going to promote him to captain candidacy.



Ikkaku would make a horrible captain. Hisagi should be promoted after this winter war if he has bankai.


Concerning the above, why should Ikkaku even care about such a candidacy? One large point in hiding his bankai is that he does NOT want to be a captain! Once Aizen's treachery was revealed and gaps opened up in the captain ranks, Renji was urging Ikkaku to help him fill in those gaps, the two of them having attained bankai and by that measure being to some degree qualified - but Ikkaku was not interested. His only concern is in serving under Kenpachi in the 11th Division, and he is as resolute in this as Renji was in getting stronger to match his own captain's power.

Hockeychaoz
September 11, 2008, 05:24 PM
Inconsistencies. Kubo is just making stuff at this point, just drawing out the fights nearly as long as he can.

Drawing out the fights as long as he can?
...319-324, we've seen 3 fights start and finish.
2 Chapters for Hisagi
2 Chapters for Yumi
1 Chapter for Kira

Yeah, he's realllllyyyy drawing these fights out. -.-'

Sounds like you just want to complain about the fantastic 4 fights. If he would have wrapped up the fights any faster it would have been stupid.

People hate the fantastic 4 because they don't really have too much background. (Ikkaku has a bit.) But now when Kubo tries to give them a fight and some background, everyone tears them apart.
[hr]

This has been the week for idiot plot shockers...........
No way in hell Ikkaku could lose out of all the Shinagami, he's the only one other then Kenpachi who lives to fight............

I wonder how Kubo plans to explain why Ikkaku out of all people could have been possibly defeated, it better be good.

idiot plot shockers?

you say no way that Ikkaku could lose, but his pillar is broken... seems like he lost... he may not have totally lost the battle, like he might (and probably will come back and kill the arrancar) but he lost the important part. His pillar is gone.

and what other explanation does Kubo need to give other than, Ikkaku's opponent was stronger than the previous ones.

Doombot
September 11, 2008, 05:27 PM
Ikkaku's bankai is where alot of this strength comes from. He will be forced to bankai and will kill the guy. His Shikai is so weak that I don't understand how no one saw this coming. He gets the shit kicked out of him then forces a bankai.

C4animax
September 11, 2008, 06:14 PM
I guess the most exiting thing this week is the pilar being destroyed...but that's kind of stupid to let this happen, i too, believe that he'll go bankai anyway, so why wouldn't he just release it now...

It's not like aizen was going to take over the world is it? Is he? Crap...then what kubo was thinking then...is ikkaku as stupid as that?...

igotthegoods
September 12, 2008, 12:58 AM
Chapter 325 is out! Get it HERE (http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38829).

Discuss and predict, but remember not to spam!

Have fun :)

gfire2
September 12, 2008, 01:43 AM
wow, i reckon ikkaku will b forced to use his bankai now that the pillar is destroyed

AnimeLoverX
September 12, 2008, 01:59 AM
wow, i reckon ikkaku will b forced to use his bankai now that the pillar is destroyed

hopefully not...
i rather it be that he released his bankai and was defeated than the typical "BANKAI-'o sht i got pwned'-smirk" routine

I think this chapter is better good but bleach is kinda getting inconsistent now..
logic doesnt add up sometimes
how a 1st release can defeat a enemy w/ Captain power lvl etc. etc.

my 2cents

Revan46
September 12, 2008, 02:05 AM
Umm ya AnimeLover, not really. There isn't a chance Findor could reach Captain level. he's a fraccion, meaning a Numero, meaning not as powerful. The only reason Shuuhei struggled was because he wasn't ready to show Kaze Shini yet. I'm sorry but put him against Hitsu, or Soi Fon or such, he'd be killed instantly. Simple as that.

As for this next chapter, even though it's predictable, I'm just surprised that of all the pillars to be destroyed, it was Ikkaku's. That's what shocks me. I hope he kills Po.

Hockeychaoz
September 12, 2008, 02:10 AM
Read it twice now and I still like the idea of Ikkaku failing :).

Good twist.

gold349
September 12, 2008, 02:34 AM
Umm ya AnimeLover, not really. There isn't a chance Findor could reach Captain level. he's a fraccion, meaning a Numero, meaning not as powerful. The only reason Shuuhei struggled was because he wasn't ready to show Kaze Shini yet. I'm sorry but put him against Hitsu, or Soi Fon or such, he'd be killed instantly. Simple as that.

As for this next chapter, even though it's predictable, I'm just surprised that of all the pillars to be destroyed, it was Ikkaku's. That's what shocks me. I hope he kills Po.


agreed, it was even cleared in the chapter, Shuuhi said how wrong he was to think he was at captain level. If he were captain level then he would vastro or aducha, there is no chance he was espada level.

Hockeychaoz
September 12, 2008, 02:41 AM
agreed, it was even cleared in the chapter, Shuuhi said how wrong he was to think he was at captain level. If he were captain level then he would vastro or aducha, there is no chance he was espada level.

2 ways to look at this:
http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/325/17/

"Equal to a captain? You couldn't be more wrong."

He is either saying:

"If you were captain level then I, a lieutenant, could not have beaten you."

or

"I am captain level, and you were not at my level."


:O maybe a little premonition of Hisagi becoming a captain in the future.
I'm still favoring the outcome of Kensei coming back and Hisagi being his vice.

s c i p i o 7
September 12, 2008, 02:53 AM
Ikkaku fail ...no way
I thought and still think he's the strongest one of these four
and maybe Kubo Tite is leaving the last battle for him to let us
see the true Ikkaku...u cant be defeated Ikkaku you're my best char

about Ikkaku's Bankai , I dont know if he will reveal his bankai out of the secrecy
since only Renji,Yumichika know of it,...so he was trying to depend only on his shikai
but if happen to release it now and won I think he will be considered as a new captain
and this time yamaji will order that..

another captain issue...

:O maybe a little premonition of Hisagi becoming a captain in the future.
I'm still favoring the outcome of Kensei coming back and Hisagi being his vice.
I thought also that this is premonition of Hisagi becoming a captain ,and i would love to see that
he would be on of the coolest captains lol xP..so we have to see the bankai first..

hyn_pride93
September 12, 2008, 03:19 AM
Chapter was ok. I was devistated though when we came to the last panels. I couldn't believe that Ikkaku was defeated by that guy. But I guess that it was needed to get some plot development in.

Aww... I feel tremendously terrible for him. I wanted to cry when I saw that he was in the ground like that.

Toby_Temple
September 12, 2008, 03:33 AM
DAMN! Of all four it was Ikkaku who lost to his opponent. 0_0
Maybe he could still fight but he failed to protect the Pillar he was assigned to.... T_T

kluzman
September 12, 2008, 03:48 AM
Ha perhaps for once in a manga the bad guy just shot his special attack without first explaining how he was going to slowly improve his strengh and how exactly his ability worked and how you could nullify it...
Maybe Po just used his mega last blast to pawn Ikkaku while he was still in early shikai?

Scion
September 12, 2008, 04:10 AM
Ha perhaps for once in a manga the bad guy just shot his special attack without first explaining how he was going to slowly improve his strengh and how exactly his ability worked and how you could nullify it...
Maybe Po just used his mega last blast to pawn Ikkaku while he was still in early shikai?

Sooooo true :p

Now what i want to see is the expressions of the captains when they will see that the pillar is destroyed.

s c i p i o 7
September 12, 2008, 04:48 AM
well it's certain that Ikkaku is still in shikai ....no bankai was released yet
but to reach the point of destroying that pillar ...I dont know,..I cant wait to see what'll happen

Toby_Temple
September 12, 2008, 04:56 AM
I have a theory! :p

I think Po fooled Ikkaku. Po decided to hit Ikkaku with his most powerful Cero blast and Ikkaku jumped to dodge it. He forgot that behind him was the pillar he was suppose to protect. When he found out his mistake he had that expression while lying on the ground :D

hossice
September 12, 2008, 05:29 AM
http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/325/16/

"you are finally my equal" does that mean in strenght? cuz findor was in captain level then and shuhei said that. suspicious.


reactions, then ikkaku "oh what have i done?" get back up blah blah

kunai-knight
September 12, 2008, 05:54 AM
Was findor actually killed in this chapter? I mean we saw the blade moving to his head but it wasn't actually shown to hit. Just wondering about that cuz it wasn't totally clear.

s c i p i o 7
September 12, 2008, 05:56 AM
I feel next week's 'll be Ikkaku's rage chapter


Was findor actually killed in this chapter? I mean we saw the blade moving to his head but it wasn't actually shown to hit. Just wondering about that cuz it wasn't totally clear.

findor didnt get killed ,but his zanpakuto was cut really good xD http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/325/15/

chrisb3
September 12, 2008, 06:24 AM
As predicted Hisagi fought by swinging the weapons by the chain, making the loooong chain a coherant part of the weapon and so less like the duel swords of ukitake/shunsi.

poobert
September 12, 2008, 06:28 AM
So what have the captains been doing all this time? Spectating?

Also something does feel odd about Ikkaku's loosing. Po is weaker than Yami and Yami is useless.

Looking back to http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/321/005/ I dread what will happen next. Turns out strength was enough for Po, so Ikkaku goes bankai, waits a bit, then POW! more strength, he wins and all the captains berate him because they all already knew about his bankai so he could have used it earlier.

It will be a total waste of a chapter.

*Edit* Hisagi just gets cooler and cooler

Rotten The Wizard
September 12, 2008, 06:33 AM
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Ikaku is my favourite char after Kenpachi....he cant...be beat
I wonder what the hell happened cause that guy doesnt even have a scratch on him. Could he be espada level?

even so, Ikaku shouldnt have gotten owned like that

Toby_Temple
September 12, 2008, 06:38 AM
As predicted Hisagi fought by swinging the weapons by the chain, making the loooong chain a coherant part of the weapon and so less like the duel swords of ukitake/shunsi.

hmmmm....i think by the looks of Hisagi's shikai its basically not a sword(s). It looks similar to the one Basara uses in Samurai Showdown... :blink

ukitake and shunsui's are both two swords as seen on the drawings
http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/156/12/
http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/156/14/
http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/156/15/

kluzman
September 12, 2008, 06:53 AM
"you are finally my equal" does that mean in strenght? cuz findor was in captain level then and shuhei said that. suspicious.

I believe he means he's his equal since he became afraid of the zanpakuto ^^
There is no way findor actually reached a captain's lvl, that'd mean he's as strong as the top espadas (GJ, Nnoitra, etc..) who got killed during real captain-lvl fights. It would be very inconsistant from kubo to have some crappy fraccion as strong as one of the espada...

Antillio
September 12, 2008, 06:58 AM
There is no real clear info on Po being weaker then Yami even tough he is a fraccion he is 1 of Barraga's Fraccion ! the top elite espada. That should count for something and of all the fraccion he did remain pretty calm and aware of his own abilities. I for 1 am curious what makes Po so good of a fighter next to his strenght, there must be some catch =).

I tought it was a nice twist seeing ikaku fall, but i hope he won't go Bankai.

kluzman
September 12, 2008, 08:09 AM
There is no real clear info on Po being weaker then Yami even tough he is a fraccion he is 1 of Barraga's Fraccion ! the top elite espada. That should count for something and of all the fraccion he did remain pretty calm and aware of his own abilities. I for 1 am curious what makes Po so good of a fighter next to his strenght, there must be some catch =).

I tought it was a nice twist seeing ikaku fall, but i hope he won't go Bankai.

Well theoretically if he was stronger than yami he would be an espada instead of a fraccion. But I guess there are such things as respecting someone enough to be his fraccion instead of attaining a higher rank (just like Ikkaku). I'd be surprised though if Aizen didn't just give him what rank he deserves so his espada force would be the strongest possible.
SS is all about respect, HM is all about Aizen's will..

hajialibaig
September 12, 2008, 08:14 AM
Ikkaku will just get up and go Bankai, and win. That's what 90% of the people say here. And I agree. Lame Kubo.

EDIT:

And yea, just to add, this mini-arc has pretty much ruined an epic SS vs. Aizen battle that we have been waiting for months now.. what a shame...even the posts have dropped down by 90%

gold349
September 12, 2008, 08:14 AM
I don't want ikkaku dead/defeated, things don't look good, he was sent to protect the pillar, I don't think he would have allowed it to be destroyed, he would have tried everything to protect the pillar, seeing the pillar broken and him lying there you dread the worst.

Darek Khort
September 12, 2008, 08:18 AM
Well theoretically if he was stronger than yami he would be an espada instead of a fraccion. But I guess there are such things as respecting someone enough to be his fraccion instead of attaining a higher rank (just like Ikkaku). I'd be surprised though if Aizen didn't just give him what rank he deserves so his espada force would be the strongest possible.
SS is all about respect, HM is all about Aizen's will..

True.
But remember that Aizen finds the Espada insignificant. His play-things. I doubt he'd worry too much about making them as strong as possible.

ryanzokuken
September 12, 2008, 08:40 AM
of course Po is weaker than Yammy. if he was stronger, he would be the 10th espada instead.

the espada are the top ten strongest arrancar. when one becomes stronger, they can become an espada, or move up in rank. weaker, the are demoted or become a privarion espada.



also, before everyone gets going with the "Findor was at captain level, and Hisagi won. that means HE is captain level. ZOMG he secretly has a bankai!"

Findor wasn't really at captain level, obviously. not only did he get killed, rather easily, by a lieutenant using only a weapon-type shikai, but Hisagi even said towards the end that Findor "couldn't be more wrong" in thinking he was at captain level.

kkck
September 12, 2008, 09:38 AM
I have a theory! :p

I think Po fooled Ikkaku. Po decided to hit Ikkaku with his most powerful Cero blast and Ikkaku jumped to dodge it. He forgot that behind him was the pillar he was suppose to protect. When he found out his mistake he had that expression while lying on the ground :D

I was thinking the same thing! ALthout not nesesarily with a cero blast. Ikkaku isnt particularly bright so he could have really got into the battle and forget about the pillar.
[hr]
I am hoping that kishi reveals a new shikai technique for ikkaku instead of just bankai otherwise the fight would be remarkably similar to the one with edorad. I would also be satisfied if ikkaku´s bankai is like his shikai and it has to diferent shapes.

Tsukisama
September 12, 2008, 09:52 AM
Ikkaku's zanpakutou is a melee-type, meaning that it shouldn't have any kidou-based abilities. Thus, I think his shikai is fine as it is. It is based around pure fighting technique and should stay that way IMO. I am also glad that Shuuhei's zanpakutou seems to also be a melee-type. Up until now, there have seemed to be very many melee-type zanpakutou among the named (semi-important) characters.

The Adamant Dragon
September 12, 2008, 10:38 AM
Such an awsom chapter, the first of the Pillars-Chapters that I actually enjoyed in its entirely. Hisagi's Release was better than anticipated. And up until now, none of the Vice-Captains recquired the used of Ban-kai to defeat Barragan's Fraccions, wich is quite awsom... Instead of putting Down Barragan's fraccions and saying how much they're weak compared to Grimmjow's, I think we should be praising the Vice-Captains powers.... 'cuzz I beleive that they defeated these Fraccions easily, not because the fraccions were weak, but Because the VC chosen to protect the Pillars were simply Stronger.

I Really didn't expect what happened to Ikkaku, that's too bad since he can't use his Bankai in fear of being Noticed by the Captains . Next chapter should prouve itself to be entertening. Maybe he'll decide to use his Bankai anyway and Shock everyone.

gold349
September 12, 2008, 10:46 AM
I second ikkaku using bankai, it just wired Ikkkaku was already in shikai and still couldn't protect pillar, bankai is his only choice now anyway, that's if he hasn't been killed/defeated for real.

Alexis
September 12, 2008, 10:47 AM
If Soul Society lose it's going to be the end of the manga ^^
Well I didn't mean that everyone would die. Just that they'd lose and the battle could escalate to the Royal realm perhaps.

But I didn't notice that a pillar was destroyed until someone pointed it out. I'm glad that happened, because it's all the more challenging for a writer to make battles entertaining if they're also very predictable.

Though you'd have to question Barragan's judgement regarding these "dragons" who get defeated by vice captains Shikai.


Well, Findor was defeated after using captain power; no, please, I don't want to see another Noitora vs Kenpachi fight. seems Kubo isn't even caring about how the arancars are being defeated...
That was a bit disappointing, yes. Although there's no secret that there are non-Captain Shinigami who are stronger than they appear. But still, it was done with a shikai, so yeah... =/

defaultizzle
September 12, 2008, 10:55 AM
I tought it was a nice twist seeing ikaku fall, but i hope he won't go Bankai.

hear hear! if the other vice captains could protect their pillars against the fraccion without bankai, ikkaku should too! to create a contrived plot involving an unusual opponent just so kubo can show off ikkaku's bankai just because he has it is ridiculous. so unless there's a very very very very good reason why po is exponentially stronger than the other fraccion (since bankai is pretty much exponentially stronger than shikai) PLEASE kubo don't make ikkaku go bankai :(

drakend
September 12, 2008, 11:00 AM
Hey dudes do you remember, during the beginning of August, I wrote a post in which I listed all the fights which will occur and their lenght? We're in the middle of September and we haven't finished to deal with the vice-captains and the pillars thing... then there are the captains!!! I'm starting to fear that we'll eat the Christmas cake reading maked Ichigo getting trashed by Ulquiorra... ruining even the Christmas cake!!! :D

KyanWan
September 12, 2008, 11:34 AM
I was thinking the same thing! ALthout not nesesarily with a cero blast. Ikkaku isnt particularly bright so he could have really got into the battle and forget about the pillar.
<hr noshade size="1">
I am hoping that kishi reveals a new shikai technique for ikkaku instead of just bankai otherwise the fight would be remarkably similar to the one with edorad. I would also be satisfied if ikkaku´s bankai is like his shikai and it has to diferent shapes.

You know ... I really don't think you know Ikkaku yet.

He went into battle not giving a crap for the pillar. He wants to fight someone strong - that's it.

He's going to get up, say "That's it? Pff" ... and take ugly-ccion's face off.

OR

He could have refused to fight that guy - calling him a weakling - then got smashed while the dude blew up the pillar.


Well I didn't mean that everyone would die. Just that they'd lose and the battle could escalate to the Royal realm perhaps.

But I didn't notice that a pillar was destroyed until someone pointed it out. I'm glad that happened, because it's all the more challenging for a writer to make battles entertaining if they're also very predictable.

Though you'd have to question Barragan's judgement regarding these "dragons" who get defeated by vice captains Shikai.


That was a bit disappointing, yes. Although there's no secret that there are non-Captain Shinigami who are stronger than they appear. But still, it was done with a shikai, so yeah... =/

Don't forget so quickly.

Of these vice captains, who can kill Yammy? Any of them? All of them?

*cough*

The Espada are ranked by strength. The strongest 10 Arrancar are Espada. So if the strongest 10 Arrancar are the only Espada, all of the Fraccion MUST be weaker than the weakest Espada.

Fraccion are pretty lame, huh. ;)


so unless there's a very very very very good reason why po is exponentially stronger than the other fraccion (since bankai is pretty much exponentially stronger than shikai) PLEASE kubo don't make ikkaku go bankai :(

WOOT?

Po pimpin cuz Tinky Winky got his back. Dam, he got roids in that pocketbook, an ya don mess wit da tutu.

kkck
September 12, 2008, 11:48 AM
Ikkaku's zanpakutou is a melee-type, meaning that it shouldn't have any kidou-based abilities. Thus, I think his shikai is fine as it is. It is based around pure fighting technique and should stay that way IMO. I am also glad that Shuuhei's zanpakutou seems to also be a melee-type. Up until now, there have seemed to be very many melee-type zanpakutou among the named (semi-important) characters.

Ichigo´s zanpakutou is also melee type and he has got getsuga tenshou. Or maybe I am confused about when a sword is kido type and when it is a melee type. If every sword that has an ability is a kido type then most swords (if not all to some degree) would be kido type.

Yans86
September 12, 2008, 12:37 PM
of course Po is weaker than Yammy. if he was stronger, he would be the 10th espada instead.

the espada are the top ten strongest arrancar. when one becomes stronger, they can become an espada, or move up in rank. weaker, the are demoted or become a privarion espada.

I'm sorry to say that, but is false.....actually there are fraccion at espada's level......don't u remember Luppi,the one arrancar that substituded Grimmjow like the 6th espada???He wasn't number 7th or 8th or 9th or 10th.....but he became suddenly number 6!!!!!!so we can be pretty sure that there are fraccion at espada's level!!!

Hockeychaoz
September 12, 2008, 01:15 PM
@ Yans86

I always thought Luppi was just made my Aizen recently. He was never a Fraccion I figured.

@ kkck

Ichigo's shikai is a Kudo type. He may slash around with it and such, but it still has a Kudo ability.

@ drakend

These fights can't really progress any faster.
If each guy was getting owned in 1 chapter, it'd be boring. No climax to the fight.

lordHokage
September 12, 2008, 01:46 PM
I second ikkaku using bankai, it just wired Ikkkaku was already in shikai and still couldn't protect pillar, bankai is his only choice now anyway, that's if he hasn't been killed/defeated for real.


Although one of the pillars was destroyed, General Yamamoto is not worried and Ikkaku is not dead yet, he's using his bankai. :D

gold349
September 12, 2008, 02:01 PM
Although one of the pillars was destroyed, General Yamamoto is not worried and Ikkaku is not dead yet, he's using his bankai. :D


IMO that makes him much lamer than the other vc, I mean he has gained bankai he is at a different level to the other vc possible captain, both in strength/rietsu and and power, the others have managed to defeat their opponents with shikai and protected the pillars. Here he has lost his fight with shikai basically and also hasn't managed to protect the pillar he too should like the other vc gone as far as shikai and just done it with that, kubo hasn't really showed major difference in the fraccion strength/power all the fights have been the same its not like one was said to be stronger more powerful than the next fraacion were it would make sense now as far as I'm concerned Po is same as the other fraccion and ikkaku has just lost points in my book for not also finishing his opponent with shikai.

BrettHartt
September 12, 2008, 02:08 PM
hear hear! if the other vice captains could protect their pillars against the fraccion without bankai, ikkaku should too! to create a contrived plot involving an unusual opponent just so kubo can show off ikkaku's bankai just because he has it is ridiculous. so unless there's a very very very very good reason why po is exponentially stronger than the other fraccion (since bankai is pretty much exponentially stronger than shikai) PLEASE kubo don't make ikkaku go bankai :(

On top of all that i think that it would've been corny to let all of em when.... Ikkaku's job wasnt to just defeat the fraccion but it was also to protect the pillar. Since he got his a** handed to him its hard to tell where the fight is going to go, but its a great twist. Now the reasons he fell could go on for a minute and the one at the top of my list is that he probably is fighting the toughest one of all and he's trying everything in his power to continue to hide his bankai. Keep in mind his regular skills were pretty garbage because a novice swordsman ichigo was his equal.

teknique521
September 12, 2008, 02:19 PM
I like how each VC has some sort of take on war-

Yumi- War is UGLY
Kira- War brings DESPAIR
Hisagi- War embraces FEAR
Ikkaku- ?

Ikkaku's obviously not in bankai... the top of his robe is still on.

Theory1- I think Ikkaku got a little overzealous and destroyed the pillar himself on accident since he seems more of the meatheaded brawns over brain type.

Theory2- Ikkaku was legitly defeated in shikai form due to a severe mismatch (me trying to beat ironman in a fistfight, aint gonna happen). Po will then move on to destroy another pillar and somehow Ikkaku makes a surprise "resurrection" and takes his revenge.

And another thing... Hisagi's fight isnt over, he was distracted by the pillar falling and never finished the final blow. It would suck if that also causes him to lose his pillar too.

Didnt Yumi use bankai to beat fairyguy? If that was his true shikai that would be way too strong. Funny how the 3rd and 4th seat in the 11th division can use bankai (but wont show it) but the captain cant. Where's Yachiru? She should be kicking some ass too

hossice
September 12, 2008, 02:33 PM
^ no it wasn't bankai. and ikkaku is 3rd seat and yumi is 5th seat.

i dont want ikkaku 2 go bankai. im like 50/50. it would be cool 2 see it again. but his shikai is awesome. it needs a new blade move to go with it other than pole extends. 1 move=pole 1 move=blade pole + blade= shikai

BrettHartt
September 12, 2008, 02:38 PM
[B]
Didnt Yumi use bankai to beat fairyguy? If that was his true shikai that would be way too strong. Funny how the 3rd and 4th seat in the 11th division can use bankai (but wont show it) but the captain cant. Where's Yachiru? She should be kicking some ass too

He only fully release his shikai, that makes baldy the only one who wasnt able to hold his own

ryanzokuken
September 12, 2008, 02:51 PM
I like how each VC has some sort of take on war-

Yumi- War is UGLY
Kira- War brings DESPAIR
Hisagi- War embraces FEAR
Ikkaku- ?

Ikkaku's obviously not in bankai... the top of his robe is still on.

Theory1- I think Ikkaku got a little overzealous and destroyed the pillar himself on accident since he seems more of the meatheaded brawns over brain type.

Theory2- Ikkaku was legitly defeated in shikai form due to a severe mismatch (me trying to beat ironman in a fistfight, aint gonna happen). Po will then move on to destroy another pillar and somehow Ikkaku makes a surprise "resurrection" and takes his revenge.

And another thing... Hisagi's fight isnt over, he was distracted by the pillar falling and never finished the final blow. It would suck if that also causes him to lose his pillar too.

Didnt Yumi use bankai to beat fairyguy? If that was his true shikai that would be way too strong. Funny how the 3rd and 4th seat in the 11th division can use bankai (but wont show it) but the captain cant. Where's Yachiru? She should be kicking some ass too


Yumi is 5th seat.
and it was his shikai. he doesn't have bankai. as far as we know. but it's highly doubtful and would be lame if he did.

Yachiru is in HM with Kenpachi. most likely perched on his shoulder :p

hossice
September 12, 2008, 07:53 PM
i expect wind elements 2 come into play here since it is a wind element based type. his shikai should have a wind based type like a funnel cloud/lightning vortex that comes from the blade and can spin it etc.

Alexis
September 12, 2008, 08:30 PM
Of these vice captains, who can kill Yammy? Any of them? All of them?
Hitsugaya said that he couldn't even harm Yammi without Bankai, so I don't know which one of these Vice Captains could take him on. Ikkaku maybe.

Holland
September 12, 2008, 08:50 PM
Remember that when we saw Ikkaku's bankai, he was being held back by the soul society power governing, so technically he should be much much stronger in bankai.

http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/205/04-05/

four chapters before the "lift the limit"

ryanzokuken
September 12, 2008, 09:01 PM
Ikkaku didn't have a limiter on him, though.

SS only places the limiters on captains and vice captains. Ikkaku's power is at a level where he should have a limiter placed on him, as he's stronger than any of the vc's, but SS doesn't know that.

hajialibaig
September 12, 2008, 09:44 PM
When it comes down to making sense of power levels and such, Bleach is the wrong manga.

Example # 1:

Ichigo in shikai beat Kenpachi without eye patch
Same kenpachi who lost to Ichigo beat released Nnoitra
Nnoitra > Grimmjow (Released Grimmjow on equal terms with Bankai + Masked Ichigo)
which leads to think: shikai > Bankai + Mask (Jokes)

There are like many more examples...

Now, now, to try and make sense of the above events:

Kubo makes mistakes, many mistakes.

And so, this chapter, and many other chapters in the future will no doubt contain more inconstencies, logic-loop-holes, and such. This isn't a godly-written-work.

gtbanuh
September 12, 2008, 09:55 PM
based on ryanzokuken's premise, it would be safe to say that the grim's arrancars were not as strong as they appeared. if you think about it, the captains and VC's lost a lot of energy before the limiters were lifted. if the limiters were lifted right away, the captain and vc probably would have owned them right away.

weixiaobao
September 12, 2008, 11:13 PM
Ichigo in shikai beat Kenpachi without eye patch
Same kenpachi who lost to Ichigo beat released Nnoitra
Nnoitra > Grimmjow (Released Grimmjow on equal terms with Bankai + Masked Ichigo)
which leads to think: shikai > Bankai + Mask (Jokes)

well, these points are quite clear to any one that read bleach regularly. (eventhough i am not trying to defense kubo) But, another explaination could be that there wasn't much going on in soul society during the period of time between kaien's death and ichigo's arrival, so kenpachi pretty much doing nothing (other weaklings fighting hollows). So kenpachi could have been rusty during the fight with ichigo. But Kenpachi upcourse could have kick ichigo's ass since day one.

As for the fight with Nnoitra, it happen after the ichigo arrive and since then kenpachi had been training, or retraining (since now he got more purpose: kicking ichigo's ass). plus Nnoitra wasn't in his top condition when fighting kenpachi, since he had couple of fights before then.

As for this new chapter, well it break away from the norm, hopefully the story will be better and not as shallow as it has been for the previous of couple of chapters

ryanzokuken
September 13, 2008, 12:15 AM
regarding Kenpachi and Ichigo's fight...


first of all, Ichigo basically got KILLED. Kenpachi broke Zangetsu, stabbed right through it into Ichigo's chest. he pretty much stuck Ichigo in the heart.

but Ichigo got a second life. through some miracle, he made contact with Zangetsu and had a breakthrough in power, as well as came back to life and his bleeding even stopped. then, Kenpachi was so thrilled that he basically took a bunch of free hits from Ichigo, putting unnecessary wounds all over her body. that fight was a freak occurance.

Askia32
September 13, 2008, 02:16 AM
Man, why did Ikkaku have to be the one to lose. This was just a really depressing sight to see.

http://img46.onemanga.com/mangas/00000003/000078022/19.jpg

It was really well done though. After the fight, I'm amped that he won, than all of a sudden a pillar was destroyed.

Cymru Na Alethaira
September 13, 2008, 02:24 AM
Just another addendum:

I suppose since Zaraki enjoys weakening himself to fight, he wouldn't have gone all out against Ichigo, and so it ended the way it did. But for Nnoitra's fight, we did see an increase in stuff, including his kendo :clap

Which doesn't mean those inequalities necessarily follows- it just means there was a huge difference in Zaraki's standard in both fights. (Although it's quite cool when you think of it- LOL. Ichigo doesn't need the mask and bankai anymore!)

Well, it made more sense for Ikkaku to be the one to lose, I suppose. It doesn't hit so hard if Hisagi lost, because we haven't really seen him kick ass. Since we have for Ikkaku...

I'm still hoping he goes bankai, although it might be unlikely. Would be cool if he got squashed EVEN THOUGH he was in bankai.

@ ryanzokuken: Ikkaku- "War is fun."

P.S. Who do you think Yamamoto got to teach Zaraki kendo? Maybe Unohana...:blink

Askia32
September 13, 2008, 02:47 AM
Just another addendum:

I suppose since Zaraki enjoys weakening himself to fight, he wouldn't have gone all out against Ichigo, and so it ended the way it did. But for Nnoitra's fight, we did see an increase in stuff, including his kendo :clap

Which doesn't mean those inequalities necessarily follows- it just means there was a huge difference in Zaraki's standard in both fights. (Although it's quite cool when you think of it- LOL. Ichigo doesn't need the mask and bankai anymore!)

Well, it made more sense for Ikkaku to be the one to lose, I suppose. It doesn't hit so hard if Hisagi lost, because we haven't really seen him kick ass. Since we have for Ikkaku...

I'm still hoping he goes bankai, although it might be unlikely. Would be cool if he got squashed EVEN THOUGH he was in bankai.

@ ryanzokuken: Ikkaku- "War is fun."

P.S. Who do you think Yamamoto got to teach Zaraki kendo? Maybe Unohana...:blink

Why would it be "cool" for him to be crushed using Bankai?

Ikkaku pobably refused to go bankai because he didn't want to be seen using it.
http://img46.onemanga.com/mangas/00000003/00000206/13.jpg

Kenpatchi was enjoying the fight with Ichigo, but he was fighting to kill against Nnoitra.

Cymru Na Alethaira
September 13, 2008, 04:49 AM
Why would it be "cool" for him to be crushed using Bankai?

Ikkaku pobably refused to go bankai because he didn't want to be seen using it.

Um, I'm not sure if you've misunderstood, but what I meant was that although it would be unlikely that Ikkaku used bankai, it would be cool from a viewer's standpoint if he did use it and get crushed, partly because the "oh i have no choice- BANKAI! HAHAHA I PWNED j00" routine is getting stale. And it would really put a header on things to have bankai beaten by a fraccion.

Yans86
September 13, 2008, 09:11 AM
Bankai or not bankai,the important thing is that Ikkaku is beaten and the pillar is down!!!!u can do all the theory about Ikkaku getting up,shouting bankai and fight again because it would be meaningless at the purpose of the story!!!!so what happened now is an important turning point,now is going to be good to see how the tekkai is going to react with a pillar down......I hope they won't show Ichi-Ulqui cause the new situation is cooler!!!!
About the situation in HM,do u think Wonderweiss is going to fight(Matsumoto tough that maybe it wasn't right to attack him cause he act like a baby)?isn't strange that between the arrancars and the espada,WOnderweiss is the only one with a huge sword???what is going to happen to Neliel and GJ,they were former espada but we can't categorize them like evil but sure SS is going ot attack them....so what their future?

Archit
September 13, 2008, 09:16 AM
Good chapter! My only question is directed towards the pillars. I remember Barragan talking about them earlier in the chapters of his entrance and he said if they knock them down them KK town will pretty much be warped back into it's original state. Does all four pillars need to be destroyed to warp it back? Or by just by effecting one just make things a little more tense. Cause if that's the case they should have knocked two down instead of one lol. Anywho.....Po looks to me like me may be a little more high in strength then the other Faccion' cause Ikkaku is stronger than any of the other LT. Elites. But as for my prediction and what I'm hoping......the Espada turn the tables now and get into the fight cause I'm done watching the Fraccion fight.... -_- lol

DanteSonOfSparda
September 13, 2008, 09:33 AM
Good chapter! My only question is directed towards the pillars. I remember Barragan talking about them earlier in the chapters of his entrance and he said if they knock them down them KK town will pretty much be warped back into it's original state. Does all four pillars need to be destroyed to warp it back? Or by just by effecting one just make things a little more tense. Cause if that's the case they should have knocked two down instead of one lol. Anywho.....Po looks to me like me may be a little more high in strength then the other Faccion' cause Ikkaku is stronger than any of the other LT. Elites. But as for my prediction and what I'm hoping......the Espada turn the tables now and get into the fight cause I'm done watching the Fraccion fight.... -_- lol

Po definately is the strongest among Barragan's fraccion. Not only was he matched with Ikkaku (as you said the strongest among the 4 Pillar-protecting-Shinigami), but also was he the one who entered the real world right behind Barragan (which tells a lot about his rank among the fraccion).

I really think Ikkaku will turn this around, since him receiving help wouldn't match with his attitude as a fighter (always fighting alone and stuff).
I doubt he'll use his bankai since his pillar already collapsed and the other's attention will be on him now.
It'll probably turn out that Ikkaku was always fighting with some sort of handicap (like his Idol Kenpachi's bells and eye-patch), which he will remove in the fight against Po.

Yans86
September 13, 2008, 09:35 AM
Yea,give us the espada!!!!PO can be stronger than the others fraccion as he can be also espada level,like Luppi who become no6 when Gj got his arm cutted........I don't think Aizen done it in a second,for the conversation between GIn and Ulqui,and also because if he could do a lvl6 espada that easily,SS would be already pwned!!!I think that simply Luppy like others arrancar\fraccion was espada level,but probably to reach that position u need also some esperience,the ambition and not only power,like in SS.
If the Espada lvl of power was really like most of us supposed,then when Gj was kicked out,we would have Yammi at 9th,to other promoted until 6th,and a new 10th!but Aizen substituted only 6th...

gold349
September 13, 2008, 09:50 AM
I agree power levels are all over the place, all I can add, is that when hitsugia, ikkaku, matsamoto etc fought Grimmjow and fraccion that was the first real showing of aizens new forces, even though they new about different levels of arrancar I doubt any was prepared to fight one back then. since then a lot of training has been done especially/particularly for this battle and I'm not surprised at all that they are finding it easier to deal with these fraccionm from the first time hitsugia and co encountered arrancar. Still aizen can introduce new arrancar to espada but they have to be above gillian level, only no 9 espada was gillian as far as I remember but that was due to his ability, fraccion/numbero's can take espada ranks only if they are powerful enough but not any fraccion can become espada, its just like shinigami a seated officer can become captain if he/she is strong enough, if he/she passes test then there is nothing stopping them but not all have that potential/capability.

Cymru Na Alethaira
September 13, 2008, 10:18 AM
Well, maybe Wonderweiss won't fight if someone bribes him with Urahara's hat LOL.

It'd be nice for Ichigo to get a move on there in Las Noches- my guess about Grimmjow and Neliel is that they might just be Ichigo and Co's ticket out of HM and back to the real world- or a miracle happens and Ichigo learns how to open a garganta.

Sadly, we might just see another pillar go down, what with Hisagi getting shocked and distracted without pressing his advantage on Findor (at least that's what it looked like).

I'd like to see some Captain action, say from Aizen. I mean, Kyoka Suigetsu is a tricky thing. One glance, and nothing is real anymore. You can't tell if he's within the fire circle still or escaped, if it has complete hypnosis over the senses. But I'll be contented with Espada action (which will hopefully come about xD)

I'm not sure if Po is stronger- it could be the best match thing all over again. Like how Yumichika might have been in deep trouble against another fraccion, while his best match was Cuulhorn and he got him. Strongest among the fraccion, yes, but that strong? Maybe not.

Onomatopoeia
September 13, 2008, 10:41 AM
Oh hell yeah powerlevels are all over the place. Hisagi can beat Captain Leveled people, the 10th espada is automaticlly stronger then a captain, Numero's are stronger then all the Fraccions we've seen so far, etc.

I mean I like Hisagi as much as the next guy but having him beat a captain level opponent is not the way to go. And whats really starting to get at me is that the Espada and Captains don't seem to exist anymore. I mean come on aren't we gonna get a reaction from them?

Yans86
September 13, 2008, 10:59 AM
It's a fact that Hisagi told to Findor that there's no way that he is at captain level.....another question can be,how stronger are the vaizard in comparison to the various captains...Shinji played with GJ without even releasing his shikai,Kenpachi won on Noitora only with Kendo....but Ichigo who has a reiatsu at captain level is going to need bankai+mask more another big improvement just to beat Ulquiorra which is no4...

ryanzokuken
September 13, 2008, 11:56 AM
yes, Findor was not at captain level. despite what he thought.





P.S. Who do you think Yamamoto got to teach Zaraki kendo? Maybe Unohana...:blink

probably Yama himself. it showed that flashback of Kenpachi and Yama standing indoors, Yama telling him he had to learn kendo, Kenpachi whining about it. they could have been in the dojo right there.

Kusachu
September 13, 2008, 12:52 PM
Well, I'm not a Bleachtard or anything, so I can only offer superficial commentary. Like, OH NOES!! IKKAKU!!! NOOOOES!!! Of the four of them, I didn't expect him to be the one to get beaten. I'm glad Hisage's having a good fight though.

BlackHair
September 13, 2008, 02:12 PM
Actually I don't like the current fights right now. But this page (http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/325/04/) gave me chills, just awesome. xD

Onomatopoeia
September 13, 2008, 04:12 PM
yes, Findor was not at captain level. despite what he thought.



probably Yama himself. it showed that flashback of Kenpachi and Yama standing indoors, Yama telling him he had to learn kendo, Kenpachi whining about it. they could have been in the dojo right there.

Findor's entire philosophy stands around being exact. He's not going to be that far off especially after the 5th seat fiasco. It also sticks to what we know of his mask. At the very least that should have doubled his power and put him way out of Hisagi's range of power. Yet he beat him and easily I might add, I also feel that Hisagi might have been a bit insulted with the comparison of Findor to a Captain level person. Hisagi hero worships Kensei/Tousen and might have felt insulted.

Hell I'd like to believe, and I would if this was something like Fairy Tail/D. Gray Man/OP where plothole's don't happen much but this is Bleach. Inconsistency isn't exactly new.

I defintely doubt it was Yama that taught Kenpachi. It was probablly Unohana, her specialty in the databooks is put as Kendo and she's offensive type, it would be so hilarious for Unohana to be Kenpachi's teacher.

Bigfish
September 13, 2008, 05:16 PM
The thing to keep in mind is that it isn't just raw powerlevels that go in to being a captain. There's also skill and experience. Some of the arrancar may actually be on captain level, but without the skill and experience to go with that power, they just end up getting killed because they are so sure they can just muscle their way through a fight.

Devil-buster
September 13, 2008, 11:27 PM
I think a lot of people are reading too much into findor's words....just because he thinks he is at a certain level doesnt mean he is....its just as hisago said, he was no where near a captains level,,he was hardly even at hisagi's level...if u look at it hisagi probably had the least trouble dispatching his opponent.....

Also I dont think po is the strongest....just thee cleverest....unlike the other fraccion who were focused on defeating their opponents...po probably went directly after the pillar....and ikkaku is someone who get easily side tracked in fights or get too much involved in it that he forgets the true goal....

hossice
September 14, 2008, 12:36 AM
probably Yama himself. it showed that flashback of Kenpachi and Yama standing indoors, Yama telling him he had to learn kendo, Kenpachi whining about it. they could have been in the dojo right there.


there was no flashback. just kenpachi talking about how he hated it.



well it had to of been like 10 min. then into the fights in bleach time. so hopefully reactions. beginning of this ch.

zangetsu685
September 14, 2008, 03:19 AM
ikkaku gonna go bankai, people noticing, omg...he can use bankai?? wtf?
probably defeats his opponent...then possibly the beginning of ichigo's fight or the captains VS 1,2,3 espada.

THE ONLY THING I WANNA SEE IS THE FUCKING VAIZARDS!!!!! WE KNOW THEY LEFT THEIR WAREHOUSE, WHERE DID THEY GO????

also i want to know how ichigo's dad fits into this whole thing? was he a captain? if so probably 10th squad cuz they said in TBTP that the 10th squad captain retired...but urahaha said shinigami don't retire...hmmm...

was he a royal guard? or possibly even the KING in disguise? lol

and if ichigo's mom was a shinigami too? anyone say she was the former 12th squad captain that got promoted?

Onomatopoeia
September 14, 2008, 11:03 AM
The VZs are in SS where they're planning to lay waste. It's the only way I don't see a complete rape for whatever side the VZs fight against.

King Mordred
September 14, 2008, 12:46 PM
I have no clue to what the vaizards are going to do? Uruhara will err on the side of good or guilt.

Xerte
September 14, 2008, 01:13 PM
vaizard were obviously going to do a picnic all toghetar,..
or maybe shopping all toghetar...
sure they weren't going to aizen xD

btw.. they will interfere now to save the pillars or during the last parts of espada fights to save all..
not in the mid ..
or maybe just to fight aizen alone

Archit
September 14, 2008, 04:15 PM
Vaizards needs to hurry up also and make their entrance, cause I've been waiting patiently for them since they walked out there hang out area. Interrupting the pillars seems like a suitable entrance.....either that for show up in SS lol.

Eddy01741
September 14, 2008, 08:36 PM
Um, you guys forgot one thing, real karakura town is currently in SS, so they are already in SS.... the problem is that they have to get to the fake karakura town, which is probably why they are taking so damn long.

Anyways, in all likelihood, ikkaku will release bankai and beat Po, and then the three espada will go for the three remaining pillars, and respective captains will defend (and fraccions will fight VCs).

bittman
September 14, 2008, 10:10 PM
The VZs are in SS where they're planning to lay waste. It's the only way I don't see a complete rape for whatever side the VZs fight against.

What I've said for months/years.

Bleach continuity was always going to struggle with the winter war, and now the war has been moved up and scaled down a bit we notice just how much of a struggle it is.

Now that one pillar is down, I expect the remaining battles to devastate at least 2 of the remaining 3 if not all 3 for plot purposes. If none had fallen, I would assume they would have all remained.

Also, I don't care whether Ikakku bankai's or not nor will I predict whether he will or not. He had his 4 chapters long ago and was awesome then. His reason is utter bullshit nowdays anyway: If he doesn't care about his own life he should at least put some effort in for the sake of the entire world.

slc459
September 15, 2008, 03:26 AM
Ikkaku being taken down is the most unexpected of things to happen. I mean he was probably the only guy among those 4 who had a lot of screen time so far starting with his fight with Ichigo and stuff. So Ikkaku being taken down should bring so much of other thigns to fore. Probably he did not go bankai and hence was taken down.

kluzman
September 15, 2008, 03:42 AM
His reason is utter bullshit nowdays anyway: If he doesn't care about his own life he should at least put some effort in for the sake of the entire world.

That's totally true. There should be no good reason to not go at full strengh right away. So it has to mean that Po is either much stronger than Ikkaku or he has some ability that stops Ikkaku from releasing (like zaeruapollo grantz)...

patedecarne
September 15, 2008, 09:45 AM
OK, some people here really know how I'm optimist with Kubo and Bleach, even with the letdowns, but unfortunately, I'll make a prediction not too good for the next chapter;

After Ikkaku's defeat, Kubo will skip all the captain's fight, and we won't see any of these fights. Let me explain why: Now one of the pillars are destroyed, and I'm sure the balance is broken now. So, the captains cannot afford to fight against Aizen and the espadas, otherwise, Karakura will return to its original place and everything will be lost; then the captains will help Ikkaku while Aizen will make his way through SS...

God, let me be wrong about it, but I have the strong feeling the next chapter we won't see any more fight left...

ShaunMati1
September 15, 2008, 10:34 AM
OK, some people here really know how I'm optimist with Kubo and Bleach, even with the letdowns, but unfortunately, I'll make a prediction not too good for the next chapter;

After Ikkaku's defeat, Kubo will skip all the captain's fight, and we won't see any of these fights. Let me explain why: Now one of the pillars are destroyed, and I'm sure the balance is broken now. So, the captains cannot afford to fight against Aizen and the espadas, otherwise, Karakura will return to its original place and everything will be lost; then the captains will help Ikkaku while Aizen will make his way through SS...

God, let me be wrong about it, but I have the strong feeling the next chapter we won't see any more fight left...

That seem likely....but i believe we will see a fight. This is vintage kubo have something tragic happen and skip to something else. For example we finally see ulquiorra pull out his sword and what happens? We go straight to pillar fights. I believe the same thing will happen here. We see a pillar go down..."Holy Crap" then we go back to ichigo, which IMO is the main event fight. Somehow ichigo has to find a way to win and im really really interested in what it is.

kweci
September 15, 2008, 10:56 AM
OK, some people here really know how I'm optimist with Kubo and Bleach, even with the letdowns, but unfortunately, I'll make a prediction not too good for the next chapter;

After Ikkaku's defeat, Kubo will skip all the captain's fight, and we won't see any of these fights. Let me explain why: Now one of the pillars are destroyed, and I'm sure the balance is broken now. So, the captains cannot afford to fight against Aizen and the espadas, otherwise, Karakura will return to its original place and everything will be lost; then the captains will help Ikkaku while Aizen will make his way through SS...

God, let me be wrong about it, but I have the strong feeling the next chapter we won't see any more fight left...

I disagree.. i think the pillar going down is the perfect transition to captain/espada fights. ikkaku f-ed up, but he will own in the end, then barragan (or one of the other 2) will be like, "this is taking too long" and as they try to go to the pillars, you'll get 1 or 2 captains getting in their ways and going, "i'm sorry, but i cannot let you proceed" or something quintessentially bleach... and since it is bleach, kubo will probably think THAT the perfect time to transition to ichigo and ulq, lol...

Tsukisama
September 15, 2008, 11:22 AM
OK, some people here really know how I'm optimist with Kubo and Bleach, even with the letdowns, but unfortunately, I'll make a prediction not too good for the next chapter;

After Ikkaku's defeat, Kubo will skip all the captain's fight, and we won't see any of these fights. Let me explain why: Now one of the pillars are destroyed, and I'm sure the balance is broken now. So, the captains cannot afford to fight against Aizen and the espadas, otherwise, Karakura will return to its original place and everything will be lost; then the captains will help Ikkaku while Aizen will make his way through SS...

God, let me be wrong about it, but I have the strong feeling the next chapter we won't see any more fight left...

There is no logical way that the captains would just let Aizen have his way. Whether they are fighting him in fake KK or real KK, they know that they need to fight him. If the fake KK remains intact, then the captains will proceed as the current situation will not have changed. If KK Town is returned, the captains will still need to fight Aizen to prevent his forces from creating an Ouken.

At this point, Kubo write himself into a situation where the captains do nothing. He has set them up so that they must fight (unless Aizen's forces retreat for some reason, but I find that unlikely).

Now the question becomes when will we actually see the captains fight, and if things continue at the current pace, I am doubtful. Even after these fraccion vs. vice battles end, we still need to return to events in HM, which I would expect to come before watching the captains fight. Plus, there are so many loose plot points like the vizards, Yammi & Wonderweiss (they have to be doing something), Urahara's group, and even Isshin & Ryuuken that should be addressed as well. (Isshin & Ryuuken may not show up in the arc, but it is still a possibilty. ;))

hossice
September 15, 2008, 04:09 PM
and where uryu is. what was in the warehouse. whats w/ grimmjow. just some things left off from before.


no....this is where TTPF (turn the pendulum forward) starts and we see SS defeated. ;)

or TBTP.

eddy26
September 15, 2008, 05:17 PM
I don't understand why make Ikkaku lose I would have been happier if Kira or Hisagi would have had their pillars crushed. Ikkaku is the strongest non captain so why would you make him lose. He achieved bankai before Renji so he most likely has better control of his zanpaktou. What I could picture next chapter we see Baragan bragging my strongest dragon has crushed your ant. Soi Fon's vice captain with a shocked face and Yumichika with his head down impossible Ikkaku lost. The other three won't run to his rescue because they still have to protect their pillars in case someone else goes to destroy them. Ikkaku will slowly get up and say this fight isn't over yet. In the 11th squad a fight isn't over until you are dead. You forced me to do this in front of everyone prepare to die bankai.

Doombot
September 15, 2008, 06:38 PM
If Ikkaku does not get up and goes bankai... I'm pretty much done with Bleach.

BlackHair
September 15, 2008, 07:45 PM
I don't think Ikkaku will go Bankai, for a stupid reason imo. Same with the shikai of the hentai dude in the same squad.

redhairSH
September 16, 2008, 12:44 AM
WTF?!?!??!? ikkaku is probably the STRONGEST of the 4 guarding the towers, he's prolly the strongest non-captain in soul society, he could be a captain if he wanted to, and he lost, once again, WT?!?!?!

Oni Shinigami
September 16, 2008, 01:59 AM
If Ikkaku does not get up and goes bankai... I'm pretty much done with Bleach.

What a liar.

and if Ikkaku doesn't go Bankai it's no big deal. Good guys shouldn't always win and Ikkaku has expressed his need to not show his Bankai to the Gotei 13 several times.

Umbra Wolf
September 16, 2008, 05:22 AM
Ikakku doesn't pull out his bankai because he would show them to the other captains nd he did everything to avaoid to let too many people know it. So why should he show it now? Yumi admitted he wouldn't have shown his second release if he was to be seen and would've rather died. Since Yumi's and Ikkaku's attitude is somewhat similar. I guess Ikkaku won't go bankai and this is the reason why he apparently lost.

kluzman
September 16, 2008, 06:46 AM
Ikakku doesn't pull out his bankai because he would show them to the other captains nd he did everything to avaoid to let too many people know it. So why should he show it now? Yumi admitted he wouldn't have shown his second release if he was to be seen and would've rather died. Since Yumi's and Ikkaku's attitude is somewhat similar. I guess Ikkaku won't go bankai and this is the reason why he apparently lost.

That's probably the reason why he didn't go bankai but it's a lame reason if you ask me. Come on the fate of the world (i mean if aizen wins here he will probably conquer/destroy the world) is at stake here and he won't go all out just because he's soooo respectful to zaraki?

Predictions for next chap : Well im starting to think Ikkaku will wake up - go bankai - win the fight and im not very pleased about it.. Hopefully we will get some captain action, either that or Ichigo's fight.

slc459
September 16, 2008, 08:21 AM
What a liar.

and if Ikkaku doesn't go Bankai it's no big deal. Good guys shouldn't always win and Ikkaku has expressed his need to not show his Bankai to the Gotei 13 several times.

But since he lost and fucked up so badly i think he would definitely go bankai and say.. well i fucked up but will not allow you to trifle with the balance so easily

notBowen
September 16, 2008, 08:27 AM
But since he lost and fucked up so badly i think he would definitely go bankai and say.. well i fucked up but will not allow you to trifle with the balance so easily If he cared about that he would have gone Bankai before the pillar was destroyed.

Yans86
September 16, 2008, 08:53 AM
I can't understand how almost evryone here is interested to see Ikkaku getting up,scream Bankai and fight again!!!!Ikkaku is down....perfect like this!!!balance broken,new reactions from SS,new more interesting fight ecc ecc....finally the story is going to progress a little bit....
Now,the fact that he used or he didn't used bankai.....is not important!!!u r questioning about this,only for the power level scale,but in the end is not important for the progress of the story,is important only for the ones that support more Ikkaku than others characters..!!!

Cymru Na Alethaira
September 16, 2008, 09:28 AM
Well: That's because I wanna see Ikkaku bankai and get thrashed anyway. It'll put a real header on things, and probably scare Ikkaku. Maybe we'll get character death? Maybe not...

It would be absolutely strange, by the way, if Urahara pulled a curveball on us and we find those four pillars aren't the actual anchoring pillars but decoys. o.O

(Is hoping Urahara will enter the fight, OR we get to some other action besides the Lieutenant fights.)

eddy26
September 16, 2008, 11:16 AM
I don't know why people don't want Ikkaku to win. If he really lost then I hope Po goes to the other three and beats them all. It wouldn't make sense to take out the strongest of the Elite and have Po lose to someone else. I don't get it why do people want Karakura to go back. The whole reason the captains are going to fight is because it is a fake town so no one will get hurt. If you bring the real town back the captains are not going to fight the espada. You are trying to save the town not go bankai in the middle of it and kill everyone. If they wanted to do that then why remove the town in the first place. So to everyone who wants the town to come back well prepare to wait even longer for the captains to fight. I'd rather see the Ichigo vs. Ulquiorra even the Rukia and friends vs. Exequias if Kubo makes the town return.

Yans86
September 16, 2008, 01:26 PM
More damage to the pillars and SS faction = more trouble to KK = more possibility to see the vaizard.............and also,if hopefully Aizen is going to win and take the Ou Ken,new characters r going to rise,We r goping to see the king's dimension and the RG too........so the equation it's easy!!!if u allow the SS to win all the fights,we can close BLEACH now!!!!

Xerte
September 16, 2008, 01:26 PM
i really hope captain vs espada start...
i hope something like :
captain watching the scene of the pillar...espada screaming : where are you looking?..
and then 1 fight start...
then we won't see anythihng frmo that fight ...but we will know at least that it started...
maybe then yamamoto will explain the situation and what captain have to do...

vaizard pillars protectors? i don't think ...
vaizard vs espada? no they already have opponents ...
vaizard vs aizen? no he is trapped ...
vaizard vs Soul Society vs Espada? ye maybe...

drakend
September 16, 2008, 02:18 PM
You guys are lost talking about the secondary characters but they aren't important to the plot: what I was thinking is Aizen's apparent confidence he'll win. I know his character is supposed to be like that, but this doesn't change the fact there has to be some base for his confidence. As of now the three Espada have all the attention of gotei 13: there are six captains for three arrancars. Even supposing the top 3 Espada are vastrood arrancars, I don't think they can beat two captain at the same time, unless Kubo-sensei wants to make them appearing as dreadnaughts. Anyway there are still Yoruichi and Urahara, not to mention Isshin: the "bad guys" are outnumbered no matter how you view things. Aizen's confidence may only come from the Vaizards being on his side. I know he tried to kill them and such, but we don't know what happened afterwards: perhaps they have the common purpose of taking down the SS King and so formed a temporary alliance or something like that. If that's the case Gotei 13 is done for.

ryanzokuken
September 16, 2008, 02:26 PM
i seriously doubt Aizen is actually trapped.

i'm sure if he really wanted to, or it was important or necessary for him to be out, he could get out. he's probably just feeling like "meh, why go through the effort, when there's no need for us three to take part right now?"

because, as he said, them being trapped doesn't harm their goals at all. he has supreme confidence in his top 3 espada.

Cymru Na Alethaira
September 16, 2008, 02:56 PM
Or because he's really elsewhere, being sneaky and making the shinigami think they've nailed the most dangerous enemy down.

I wonder if Aizen will have imparted techniques to the Espada- if we will see any shinigami from the Gotei 13 in the ensuing battle removed because they were Hollowified. It may not seem to be something he would do because it increases their strength, but the most important thing is it makes them uncontrolled Hollows striking out randomly in the fight. And they may not even become Vaizard unless they have help- perfect to disrupt enemy forces.

Onomatopoeia
September 16, 2008, 03:12 PM
I really hope that Ikkaku won't get up, it's not really because of how predictable be when he screams Bankai afterwards and then wins against Po(which would suck). Heck I'd rather Ikkaku got beaten in Bankai the first time because if he does and showcases his Bankai after this, what does that tell about him? Simple it tells you that he'd rather put millions of lives in danger then stop being under Zaraki. I like Ikkaku but thats not cool thats cold(see what I did their).

Also I agree with Rya, if everybody reads the the chapter where Tousen and Gin have a nice chat you'll notice Aizen isn't their. It's possible that Aizen wouldn't get into the conversation but it's not like we wouldn't see him their it's not like the jail is really big or anything.

ShaunMati1
September 16, 2008, 04:28 PM
You guys are lost talking about the secondary characters but they aren't important to the plot: what I was thinking is Aizen's apparent confidence he'll win. I know his character is supposed to be like that, but this doesn't change the fact there has to be some base for his confidence. As of now the three Espada have all the attention of gotei 13: there are six captains for three arrancars. Even supposing the top 3 Espada are vastrood arrancars, I don't think they can beat two captain at the same time, unless Kubo-sensei wants to make them appearing as dreadnaughts. Anyway there are still Yoruichi and Urahara, not to mention Isshin: the "bad guys" are outnumbered no matter how you view things. Aizen's confidence may only come from the Vaizards being on his side. I know he tried to kill them and such, but we don't know what happened afterwards: perhaps they have the common purpose of taking down the SS King and so formed a temporary alliance or something like that. If that's the case Gotei 13 is done for.

I agree with u on part that aizen's confidence here is a bit shady. For a battle this important knowing full well you are outnumbered and trapped (yes i still believe hes trapped lets not under estimate yama) and aizen still can say "this battle will be won without us having to lift a finger" To me that says prepare for another one of those 'aizen already knew this was going to happen thing, always one step ahead of everyone'. The moment i read that i assumed right away that the vizards wouldnt be so forgiving to SS for what they did. But logically i cant see them join aizen even if it is against SS.

I just cant wait till the focus of bleach shifts somewhere else....like ichigo [right not my fight of choice]. I dont think we will get an update on the vizards or urahara for a long time. Im dieing to see what they are doing, but it might be too early.

Boagrious
September 16, 2008, 06:27 PM
I would say that the captains will notice one of the pillars has fallen. Provoking finally a captain/espada confrontation.

bloodrage
September 16, 2008, 07:01 PM
aizen's over confidence will be his downfall he may have plans for the ss but i doubt he will have the vizard in his plans im guessing he will escape and find some other way to get the key or maybe he has someone somewhere else going to attack ss and make another key there because no one is protecting it now

Yannnnnnnnn
September 18, 2008, 04:07 PM
aizen's over confidence will be his downfall he may have plans for the ss but i doubt he will have the vizard in his plans im guessing he will escape and find some other way to get the key or maybe he has someone somewhere else going to attack ss and make another key there because no one is protecting it now

for sure he is aware that vizard will come
i mean he create them... he know they want revenge
so he should have a plan for them
and i think he is smart enough to know that they will try to do something, i mean it is THE opportunity to take him down, so he should be prepared ;-)

Lynkobi17
September 18, 2008, 07:07 PM
Azien is unpredictable, that alone makes him fearful...