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gustcafe
February 21, 2009, 01:49 AM
As One Piece Fans, we couldn't help to feel amazed by his works..for that i want to ask..

i agree if mangaka will improve their skills along drawing each chapter every week, example:
Dragon Ball (from kinda chubby character into a sturdy character, i think its after Freeza Saga)

so my question is

Could anyone find the chapter/arc where Oda drastically change the way he drew One Piece, or he just slightly gets better and better

because if u see older chapter, u can see his drawings are quite..clean, and to be compared with Oda nowadays, it's sure faraway messier than that, but somehow more dramatical and emotional.

THX

Sachsenhesse
February 21, 2009, 05:10 AM
oh oda had some dates where you can say it, an example from the german wiki:

http://de.opwiki.org/wiki/Kategorie:Namis_Ver%C3%A4nderung

in begins in alabaste to change ^^

Dice
February 21, 2009, 01:44 PM
Ohh I always thought of something like that and didn't know that it existed. I even thought of making such a change-over-time thing myself but I was to lazy, nice to see that it already exists^^
I think that compared to older chapters there are more details nowadays.

gustcafe
February 22, 2009, 05:17 AM
Ohh I always thought of something like that and didn't know that it existed. I even thought of making such a change-over-time thing myself but I was to lazy, nice to see that it already exists^^
I think that compared to older chapters there are more details nowadays.

Thx Sachsenhesse, but i cant understand GERMAN!!! =D

yes, its getting more detail, but if u see his drawing lines, it gets more...how can u say, thick and thin, and somewhat more rough..the biggest difference is in older chapter, Oda RARELY drew backgrounds and such, but after some chapter (yes, probably arabasta, it's the first One Piece longest and biggest yet somehow boring arc for some people =p) his background suddenly turns up crazy, sometimes until we cant notice where is the character, hahaha...

Sachsenhesse
February 22, 2009, 06:56 AM
Thx Sachsenhesse, but i cant understand GERMAN!!! =D

Thats your fault not mine. :D

Thats the only site i know where such a thing exists. :/

Fox666
February 22, 2009, 11:22 AM
I think there is no line separating. It gets better and better. Chopper body form completely changed. It often influencies the anime.

In Dragonball, look at the young Goku shadow over Uub to see how the drawing style changed.

k-dom
February 22, 2009, 04:38 PM
well all drawing peoples have their style which evolves. Look at the first Tintin or Asterix for the most known western BD
Plus in the case of Manga, the drawing is generally done by a team. Maybe the details increased when Oda was more famous and could hire more people :-)
By the way do we know how many people are in charge of drawing one piece ? and what does Oda do ?

Akainu
February 22, 2009, 06:00 PM
In the latest SBS (volume 52 sbs4):

Someone asks if Oda uses assistants or not since his art style is so consistant. Oda replies that he draws all moving things in the comic. Any mangaka that leaves moving things to assistants comes away looking somewhat 'different'. He specifies: crowd scenes, animals, smoke, clouds and the sea.


dunno how many assistants he has though, sry.

Imitorar
February 22, 2009, 06:23 PM
Most manga-ka use assistants only to draw backgrounds and stuff. I think Oda did mention it in an SBS somewhere, but I really don't know which one it was, and I don't feel like searching through about 40 of them to check. And the kid Goku that appears next to Uub in the redone last 3 pages of Dragon Ball was drawn in 2005 (or 2004, one or the other), so it is a far cry from Toriyama's style in 1985, around when the series started.

EDIT: And it seems that Akainu found it. Thanks alot. I thought it was an older one, though, but apparently not...

As for me, I don't notice a "progression" of Oda's artwork as much as I notice that each arc seems to have its own style. Skypiea, for instance, was one of Oda's more stylized phases, with long necks and pointy chins, but it's one of my favorite artstyles of his. In the original East Blue style, the characters were a bit stubbier, less lanky, Luffy sometimes looked much younger than he is because he was drawn as shorter. Alabasta was probably when Oda's style was at it's most realistic, things like the breast proportions, the lankiness of the characters, and Chopper didn't look as stylized or exaggerated as they did in other arcs. The CP9 Saga artstyle had the characters drawn as too clear cut shape, too square, or too circular, sort of knobby, it's hard to explain. Then the Thriller Bark style made the character's faces too round, almost circles. I really didn't like the Thriller Bark style, but then around Sabaody Oda's style became far more realistic, more like the Alabasta style, but with a clear amount of the loopy stylization that defines his style. The Sabaody, Skypiea, and East Blue artstyles are probably my favorites.

Chopper, by the way, is a mess. Oda never wanted him to become the "cutesy animal mascot", and as such did not draw him in any way resembling cutesy. Toei, however, had other plans, and has been marketing Chopper as the cutesy mascot of the series since he was introduced, even going so far as to get Ikue Otani (known for doing the voice of Pikachu) to voice Chopper. So to go with how he's marketed, Oda had been drawing Chopper in a more an more cutesy and less and less animalistic manner as time has passed. Chopper was drawn very clumsily in the Drum Island arc, he looked plain ugly, much like Usopp did when he was first introduced (I think it took the rest of East Blue until Oda was okay at drawing Usopp) but he looked like a realistic "chibi-racoon" by the end of the Alabasta. I personally think that Chopper was drawn best during Skypiea. But after Skypiea, his muzzle slowly grew less prominent, there was less fur drawn on him, and his body became a bit more childlike. The way Oda draws Chopper these days bothers me, to be honest, but I just blame Toei. I do hope that he eventually starts drawing Chopper more like a chibi-reindeer and less like a furry child with a blue nose at sometime in the future.

gustcafe
February 23, 2009, 08:39 PM
Most manga-ka use assistants only to draw backgrounds and stuff. I think Oda did mention it in an SBS somewhere, but I really don't know which one it was, and I don't feel like searching through about 40 of them to check. And the kid Goku that appears next to Uub in the redone last 3 pages of Dragon Ball was drawn in 2005 (or 2004, one or the other), so it is a far cry from Toriyama's style in 1985, around when the series started.

EDIT: And it seems that Akainu found it. Thanks alot. I thought it was an older one, though, but apparently not...

As for me, I don't notice a "progression" of Oda's artwork as much as I notice that each arc seems to have its own style. Skypiea, for instance, was one of Oda's more stylized phases, with long necks and pointy chins, but it's one of my favorite artstyles of his. In the original East Blue style, the characters were a bit stubbier, less lanky, Luffy sometimes looked much younger than he is because he was drawn as shorter. Alabasta was probably when Oda's style was at it's most realistic, things like the breast proportions, the lankiness of the characters, and Chopper didn't look as stylized or exaggerated as they did in other arcs. The CP9 Saga artstyle had the characters drawn as too clear cut shape, too square, or too circular, sort of knobby, it's hard to explain. Then the Thriller Bark style made the character's faces too round, almost circles. I really didn't like the Thriller Bark style, but then around Sabaody Oda's style became far more realistic, more like the Alabasta style, but with a clear amount of the loopy stylization that defines his style. The Sabaody, Skypiea, and East Blue artstyles are probably my favorites.

Chopper, by the way, is a mess. Oda never wanted him to become the "cutesy animal mascot", and as such did not draw him in any way resembling cutesy. Toei, however, had other plans, and has been marketing Chopper as the cutesy mascot of the series since he was introduced, even going so far as to get Ikue Otani (known for doing the voice of Pikachu) to voice Chopper. So to go with how he's marketed, Oda had been drawing Chopper in a more an more cutesy and less and less animalistic manner as time has passed. Chopper was drawn very clumsily in the Drum Island arc, he looked plain ugly, much like Usopp did when he was first introduced (I think it took the rest of East Blue until Oda was okay at drawing Usopp) but he looked like a realistic "chibi-racoon" by the end of the Alabasta. I personally think that Chopper was drawn best during Skypiea. But after Skypiea, his muzzle slowly grew less prominent, there was less fur drawn on him, and his body became a bit more childlike. The way Oda draws Chopper these days bothers me, to be honest, but I just blame Toei. I do hope that he eventually starts drawing Chopper more like a chibi-reindeer and less like a furry child with a blue nose at sometime in the future.

whew now i really want to look at the previous OnePiece chapter to find the difference =p you certainly are a huge fan of One Piece. I never thought that his style changed in every arc. THX imitorar =D

i just seen his changes in a point where i could divide it in the "used to be" Oda and "the new Oda", and yes people often realize the differences when Arabasta Arc started, and turns out that you like Arabasta the most (personally hate it, to much politics and long). For Skypiea, the reason u like it, personally i think it's because it's the first time when Oda really drew something "imposibble" in terms of the whole scene. Before Skypiea, it always happen on ground, but in Skypiea, it happens on the cloud, so he really use his imagination a lot, and if u notice, before Skypiea, the island is not too weird, but after Skypiea, the island is always "far beyond our imagination", like Thriller Bark, and the best one is Shabondy Archipelago. its just so interesting the fact that mangrove is a true in our world and he exaggerated it until the point that the mangrove can turn into a group of island, and secrets BUBBLE OIL!! COOOOLLL..... =D


from what i have here,yes i think Oda have some assistants who'd help him doing backgrounds etc, while he's occupied in drawing "moving things" (as stated by Akainu), as for older chapter (probably from book 1 to 10??) its kinda empty maybe because his assistant is only one or two teeheehee

Imitorar
February 23, 2009, 10:42 PM
Actually, my favorite arc is the Arlong Arc, closely followed by the Skypiea saga (the whole thing, including Jaya). I'm not that fond of Alabasta storywise either, and I'm perplexed by the standing it's achieved in the fandom. I mean, it was still a great story, but I don't think that it's the best that One Piece has to offer. However, Oda's style was certainly at its most realistic then, regardless of the story. And for those who like that sort of thing, the Alabasta artstyle would probably be the most pleasing.

I tend to put FAR more weight on the story of a comic than I do on the art, because in my opinion, the art is there to convey the story, as opposed to the story being there to elaborate on the art. So I wouldn't drop a manga because of an unsatisfying artstyle, and I don't usually analyze a series's art so much. But I obsess over One Piece more than I do over nearly any series except Dragon Ball, so I've made some observations about the artstyle. Besides, I may not focus on it much, but I can still notice differences and progressions. It's just that those aren't dealbreakers, or even significant factors to me.

gustcafe
February 24, 2009, 03:36 AM
if thats the case, just imagine u read One Piece in the style of "Crayon Shinchan", will it bother you? for me, a great story comes with a great style of art (or at least, decent art)

for arabasta, i myself hated this arc, for all the politics and stuffs, its kinda hard and somewhat boring..for me..from this arc i left One Piece...and u know what, i read it again from book 31-34 (flashback of shandora, enel's epic fight, and the best..FOXY BATTLE!! i read it 10x and I still laugh!! ahahaha XD)

Imitorar
February 24, 2009, 11:59 PM
Well, I don't think I'd have minded if One Piece was originally draw in a style resembling that of Crayon Shin-chan, but I must admit, the style DOES fit Oda's storytelling style very well, and it's become a bit iconic as "the One Piece style". The story and the style are tied, kind of like JoJo's Bizarre Adventure Part 3, or Kinnikuman, all classic Jump serieses with distinctive artstyles that they've become known for.

gustcafe
February 25, 2009, 01:21 AM
u can say that because u've already addicted to One Piece =) and yeah i agree..IT FITS ODA =) and a lil out of topic..i dunno why, but i get annoyed when i saw "RAVE", coz i always think that he's kinda imitate Oda, in some sort of way..hummm...

but well...One Piece indeed are the one and only manga i loved so far (along with Tetsuwan Atom, Dragon Ball & Rurouni Kenshin, and last but not least, Naruto)

this thread is closed, unless you people want to throw in some more debates, your welcome =)

k-dom
February 25, 2009, 03:28 PM
Compare to bleach, which I read now only for the drawing, I would say that I read One piece mostly for the story. When I read a Bande Dessinée, the drawing is usually quite important to me and if the author as an original style that is a very good plus.
In case of Oda, I would not say he is original, but his storytelling and his imagination are so damn good that I forget about it.

Akainu
February 25, 2009, 03:57 PM
although One Piece is compared to other manga surely not the best art wise (see Vagabond et al.) I couldn't compare it to Bleaaaah .... I mean sure the art in Bleach overweights the story at least at the moment , but that's the rather poor story... the art is still maaany speedlines and stuff, few backgrounds...

sry, doesn't belong here and I don't want to offend anyone with that.

ah, btw. I thought I remembered a french One Piece site that had all those changes like the german OP wiki, but I just can't find it anymore.. it also had some other stuff like a timeline and so on, do you perhaps know it?

k-dom
February 25, 2009, 05:19 PM
the art is still maaany speedlines and stuff, few backgrounds...

The minimalism of bleach is his signature, if you take it away what is left ?
Now it's just made me reread chapter 205 and 410, the two less talkative pages in One piece :-)

I think your talking about this one http://eastblue.net/,
that's the best one I know
for the drawing evolution it's a bit hidden (dossier/evolution graphique) so I give you a direct link
http://eastblue.net/pages/dossier/evolution%20graphique/index.php

Akainu
February 25, 2009, 05:33 PM
thx, dunno though if it's the site - they might have changed their look quite a bit since I last visited

gustcafe
February 25, 2009, 10:04 PM
every page u guys mentioned here are not in english...sigh......someone translate it!!! hahahahaah....

for Akainu, Bleaaaaah...yes i also kinda left it after read it for a couple of times, because, okay we still can take the artstyle of Tite, but up until now, the artwork gets more kinda undone and the story, well....NOT IMPROVE!!! that's why i become bored,,,

Vagabond?hell yeah it's great, the artwork's superb, but back here in Indonesia, not all people liked to read it, for the complexity of the story (flashback present flashback present analogy present and so on) and realistic character.

One Piece? okay u guys can say that he's not original (k-dom, how can u say he's not original?) but because of his constant style and wild imagination, it has become "Oda's Style" no doubt about it
[hr]
when i see the one k-dom referred site.. i notice that the one with the huge difference from time to time is Chopper

http://eastblue.net/pages/dossier/evolution%20graphique/personnage/Chopper/index.php

and i pretty much liked the present Chopper

Dice
February 26, 2009, 02:12 PM
Well it's not the right place for it but I do not want to open another thread, so I'll just ask here:
Does anybody know where these flags are shown (I only can remember Ussop's)? Was it an SBS? Or are they just merchandice article?
http://onepiece.wikia.com/wiki/Image:Zoroflag.png

Fox666
February 27, 2009, 11:43 AM
SBS, manga color covers and merchandise.

For example Chopper's: http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/507/02/

Dice
February 27, 2009, 04:20 PM
Well since many people were complaining about the non-english sites I started to translate one of them.
There might be many mistakes especially grammar-mistakes and words that might not fit very well. So I hope you'll correct me but don't be that harsh on me.




Nami’s changes (http://de.opwiki.org/wiki/Kategorie:Namis_Ver%C3%A4nderung)

Like Zoro Nami is an inherent part of One Piece since volume one. Since that time there has been many changes, changes of character and physical changes. While her look was quite naive and above all childish in the begining, she has developed into an adult and mature lady.

Face
Nami’s face has become more feminine and more slender as time past by. Her quite big eyes have grown smaller which gives her a more serious and a more adult look and her hair has become a little bit longer, softer and much stringier. Through the development of her mouth her face gets an additional erotic touch which is very uncommon for an girl of 18 years.

First picture:
Name as a child
Second picture: Name at the beginning of her journey
Third picture:
Alread more feminine traits


Body:
In general there are many changes over time of Oda’s desing of bodys especially the body of adult women. In the beginning he designed women rather well-behaved and innocent while they are showing more skin and a more feminine charm nowadays. In connection with the changes of the body dimensions this gives One Piece a breeze of fan service.
There are some things to tell about Nami’s body.In the last years she has developed from a dainty girl into a mature woman, whose figure couldn’t be any better. A decreasing waist, an increasing bust size, as well as her extreme long legs are giving Nami body dimensions of which all the other women in the world are dreaming of. According to Sanji she has a figure of 90-60-90, the perfect body.

First picture:
First encounter with Luffy
Second picture:
Already more mature figure
Third picture:
Long legs
Fourth picture:
Increasing feminine curves


Scars:
Up to date Nami’s only visible scar is the one she got when her Arlong-tattoo was removed in Kokos. But not a long time after that she got a new tattoo to cover the scar.
Picture:
Nami’s former scar.


Tattoos:
Already as a little child Nami received her first tattoo showing the sign of Arlong. After Luffy freed her from Arlong she let remove this tattoo.
To cover the ugly scar of this intervention she decided to cover it with another tattoo. That shows a fusion of the signs of an orange and of a wind mill. These should remind Nami of her love towards her family as well her home village Kokos.
First picture:
Sign of Arlong
Second picture:
Her current tattoo.



Zoro’s changes (http://de.opwiki.org/wiki/Zorros_Ver%C3%A4nderung):
Since volume of One Piece you can not imagine the straw-hat-crew without Zoro. Thus he experienced the biggest development of Oda’s artistic abilities - which took place in the first years – as a leading character.


Face:
Like Luffy’s characteristic facial features Zoro’s didn’t change very much since his first appearence. Compared to the rest of the crew Oda’s harder getting artstyle let him mature very little. The reason for this lies in the fact that he had a quite mature face from the beginning. Worth mentioning are his three ear rings which he got when he was still a kid and which give a very rebellious appearance. Additionally his neck got thicker (above all in the first two volumes) which gives him a stronger and expanded (???) look.

First picture:
Zoro as a child
Second picture:
The fight versus Buggy
Third picture:
Already a wider face and a thicker neck


Body:
There is not much to say about Zoro’s body. Like mentioned in Luffy’s changes, Oda’s art-style is noticeable with his body. Through conciously shading it give Zoro’s body a more defined and a more dangerous look.

Scars:

As a swordfighter of the crew Zoro has a low chance to survive a fight without any scars. Since shelltown he got some severe cuts. Before Chopper’s entry he had to sew them by himself; therefore big scars are decorating his body and which he will in all likelihood keep forever.
• In the first chapters Zoro had a relativly small scar on his upper arm but it doesn’t seem to be of importance since Oda doesn’t draw it any more.
• The most famous and at the same time the biggest scar is on his chest. It comes from the fight against Hawkeyes but gave him even later serious trouble.
• Two more scars are on Zoro’s legs. When he had the choice to die or to cut his legs and fight Mr.3 he choose the latter.

First picture:
Zoro’s upper arm
Second picture:
Scar on his chest
Third picture:
Zoro’s leg

Tattoos:

Up to date Zoro doesn’t have any tattoos.
It seems as Oda doesn’t want the straw-hats-crew to have many tattoos.
Exceptions are Franky and Nami, which both carry a tattoo.

Gecko Moria
March 01, 2009, 03:30 AM
Personally, I think Oda's art style is fascinating...and interesting in that it is unique. Perhaps a slight evolution in his style would be inspiring, but I wouldnt want him to change it too much because his artwork style is what makes OP what it is!

k-dom
March 01, 2009, 04:03 PM
Could you please be a bit more precise in what is fascinating and unique in his art style ?
Maybe I missed something.

Gecko Moria
March 01, 2009, 10:55 PM
Could you please be a bit more precise in what is fascinating and unique in his art style ?
Maybe I missed something.

I kind of hard to explain...its just different:blink
EDIT: To quote someone wise: "every mangaka has their own, unique style" but I just feel OP's style is the unique of the unique...

hatsuharupeace
March 01, 2009, 11:52 PM
I think what Gecko is trying to say is that in the beginning, Oda's drawing style, in a way, was quite 'childish'. His character designs were very 'full', I suppose, it's quite evident in the first few or so chapters, where Nami, for example, is drawn very child-like, and her face is very rounded, like a child. However, if you look at the current chapters, the characters are now quite lithe, and their faces are a lot more mature looking.

k-dom
March 02, 2009, 06:03 PM
well I do still not see what is unique and fascinating :-)
You see this (http://bilal.enki.free.fr/image.php3?nom_image=le_sommeil_du_monstre/extraits/le_sommeil_du_monstre_ecran_2.jpg) is someone art style I consider fascinating and unique (well I'm not very imaginative, here (http://w3.uqah.uquebec.ca/baudoin/voyage.html) is another one only known from French people :-).
You see these are artists I recognize at first glance, I'm not sure I would recognize Oda style beside from One piece.

Sephirona
March 03, 2009, 12:41 PM
I hope no one's mentioned this before :'D

I remember reading from a certain interview that Oda-sensei was actually afraid readers would be dissuaded from reading One Piece because of his art style - which really was unique and new compared to what most people expected, I suppose. After One Piece became popular, he was encouraged and that apparently allowed him to "draw more freely", or something. All artists' styles evolve, and I think One Piece's evolution is one of the most graceful and wonderful of any series I've seen.

It's extraordinary to take into account the length of One Piece (over ten years now!) and chronologically compare how Luffy looked in the beginning and how he looks now. They really do look like they've matured, but with still with such a fun atmosphere <3

gustcafe
March 03, 2009, 09:24 PM
I think what Gecko is trying to say is that in the beginning, Oda's drawing style, in a way, was quite 'childish'. His character designs were very 'full', I suppose, it's quite evident in the first few or so chapters, where Nami, for example, is drawn very child-like, and her face is very rounded, like a child. However, if you look at the current chapters, the characters are now quite lithe, and their faces are a lot more mature looking.

Thx Hatsuharupeace, Oda's was best described like that, once "full" and now more "little and freely" =D


well I do still not see what is unique and fascinating :-)
You see this (http://bilal.enki.free.fr/image.php3?nom_image=le_sommeil_du_monstre/extraits/le_sommeil_du_monstre_ecran_2.jpg) is someone art style I consider fascinating and unique (well I'm not very imaginative, here (http://w3.uqah.uquebec.ca/baudoin/voyage.html) is another one only known from French people :-).
You see these are artists I recognize at first glance, I'm not sure I would recognize Oda style beside from One piece.

if u like that kind of art, just look at Toshiro Togano's or Yoshitaka Amano's artwork


I hope no one's mentioned this before :'D

I remember reading from a certain interview that Oda-sensei was actually afraid readers would be dissuaded from reading One Piece because of his art style - which really was unique and new compared to what most people expected, I suppose. After One Piece became popular, he was encouraged and that apparently allowed him to "draw more freely", or something. All artists' styles evolve, and I think One Piece's evolution is one of the most graceful and wonderful of any series I've seen.

It's extraordinary to take into account the length of One Piece (over ten years now!) and chronologically compare how Luffy looked in the beginning and how he looks now. They really do look like they've matured, but with still with such a fun atmosphere <3

HAS IT BEEN TEN YEARS???!!!!whew...never realized that back here in Indonesia, it was just 7 years ago(the first few months came out fast, until the 20th something book, after that, getting slower =p)
definitely that 1st manga that i've watched this long and still never bored about it (except for Arabasta =p)
[hr]
one more thing, THANKS DICE, your translation really helped a lot of people, danke schoen =D

Akainu
March 13, 2009, 05:17 AM
found it by accident in an old thread:
http://www.volonte-d.com/details/evolutions.php

it's pretty good because it's almost up to date on the other hand it doesn't show more than the faces ...