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szhang
February 24, 2009, 10:21 PM
Okay I know this will probably never happen, but pitting the strongest espada against Aizen the master of all things. I know Aizen is incredibly strong but I feel like Stark is one of the only characters that isn't really afraid of Aizen. If indeed Stark is a vasto lorde, will he be able to take on Aizen? What if they fought? Who would win??:D

Tenacious Weezy
February 24, 2009, 11:38 PM
Aizen has got to be stronger since he ranked him. I think if Stark challenged him it'd be over fairly quick too.

kkck
February 25, 2009, 12:39 AM
Aizen has enough reiatsu to force grimmjow to his knees without any visible effort, advance kido (which apparently arrancar dont know except for a few specific abilities which are similar to it) and mastery of shunpo and hand to hand combat. Not to mention his shikai is the biggest hax in the series. I have no doubt stark is absurdly powerfull (how could I lol?), but the little things aizen has done so far lead me to believe he is stronger than any of his espada.

TheChosenOne
February 25, 2009, 12:44 AM
Aizen, for all the reasons kkck listed. I doubt Aizen would have someone in the espada that is more powerful than him. Stark should be incredibly strong, but I don't see his power surmounting the behemoth that is Aizen. :)

Deerkiller
February 25, 2009, 02:56 PM
i feel that stark is probably stronger than Aizen. Unfortunately for Stark, Aizen probably put some sort of control mechanism in the Hyogoku(spelling) So that when he transformed them into the Espada they are today it gave him a controlling power over them.

Onomatopoeia
February 25, 2009, 03:09 PM
Aizen might have to show his Bankai in this match but at the end of the day it should be an easy win. He's shown some amazing moves that Stark has yet to even compare too. Of course he hasn't done much, just saying.

But Stark did effectively allow Aizen to mark him...

Having said that their isn't even near enough to really do this match. We can probably use a fair amount of powerscaling but thats about it. Namely the fact that Stark has done jack squat.

hajialibaig
February 26, 2009, 06:47 PM
Stark hasn't done anything yet..Aizen is shown to be uber powerful. But yea, it should be close.. there is a huge gap in power between 4 & 5...imagine how high up is 1 :D

Gecko Moria
March 02, 2009, 01:57 AM
As mentioned in the posts above, it might be close but however I don't think Aizen would willingly make someone stronger than himself. In addition, his knowledge of abilities, weakness etc. as well as his own powers give me the impression that he outmatches Stark.

THM Nindo
March 02, 2009, 03:40 PM
How can you guys argue over Aizen and Stark strenght...
We haven't even see a glimpse of Stark's power yet.:blink

There are no evidence at all to use to compare them.
The only thing that can be said is that Stark is obeying Aizen's orders, so Aizen is probably stronger then Stark.

WaveBossa
March 11, 2009, 02:16 PM
This is such a stupid battle.

The only thing we know is that EVERY arrancar fears aizen's reiatsu.

Aizen wins. Stark kills him and Aizen is like, "I tricked you, you just killed your mom. STAB"

Kanzen Shinkiro
March 12, 2009, 12:37 AM
Stark could probably kill anyone weren't he so lazy. God it's cool being powerful and lazy. Ukitake and Shunsui will probably have to team up to fight against Stark later on. I still think the two together can't beat him. Aizen, on the other hand, has a broken Shikai and probably an even stronger Bankai.

Raizen
March 12, 2009, 05:24 PM
Well a VL is considered to be as strong if not stronger than some captains. So a arrancar VL should be much much stronger. If Starks is indeed a VL, I could see him giving aizen trouble even if aizen has hollow powers. But I bet aizen made precautions when he got the espadas. Most likely he performed his shikai on them in case they turn

Aikidoka
April 22, 2009, 11:54 PM
The only thing that can be said is that Stark is obeying Aizen's orders, so Aizen is probably stronger then Stark.
We don't know that. In real life almost all the medieval kings were weaker than their knights. The knights spent life since age 7 training to be able to run around in heavy steel suits and hack at enemy necks, whereas the kings did what, learn Latin?

Same with today, the top brass of the military don't do any real fighting, it's the underlings that go out in the front lines and deal with roadside bombs and the like.

I know these comparisons aren't accurate, of course Aizen is really powerful and Bleach isn't the Middle Ages. Aizen actually even trained himself to his limit, so I don't doubt his strength.

I'm just saying, you can't just assume that just because someone is ranked higher, that they're stronger. That's just manga logic.

EDIT: Oh wait, this is a manga.

Haven't voted yet, don't have a real opinion. I'm going to wait and see if someone's opinion is strong enough to convince me.

Gecko Moria
April 23, 2009, 06:02 AM
We don't know that. In real life almost all the medieval kings were weaker than their knights. The knights spent life since age 7 training to be able to run around in heavy steel suits and hack at enemy necks, whereas the kings did what, learn Latin?

Same with today, the top brass of the military don't do any real fighting, it's the underlings that go out in the front lines and deal with roadside bombs and the like.

I know these comparisons aren't accurate, of course Aizen is really powerful and Bleach isn't the Middle Ages. Aizen actually even trained himself to his limit, so I don't doubt his strength.

I'm just saying, you can't just assume that just because someone is ranked higher, that they're stronger. That's just manga logic.

EDIT: Oh wait, this is a manga.

Haven't voted yet, don't have a real opinion. I'm going to wait and see if someone's opinion is strong enough to convince me.

Bleach is one of those manga where logic does not really exist~ Wait a second, many manga share that property :s
Like you said yourself, Aizen is extremely powerful, not to mention a genius. He was able to commit so many heinous deeds right under the eyes of Soul Society. He was able to defeat Hitsugaya, Ichigo, Komamura, Renji etc. without any trouble and all of them have bankai and are captain (or near captain level). Also, someone like Gin Ichimaru would not follow a weakling. And since he created Stark and without a doubt knows how powerful he is, I don't think he would be idiotic enough
not consider a fail-safe in case Stark defects. But I doubt that is needed. Aizen is probably strong enough to defeat Stark in a fair one-on-one battle. Seriously, we have not even glimpsed Aizen's true powers yet :o

~Joshua~
April 25, 2009, 11:55 PM
This would be a good fight but Aizen wins. It would take a good amount of Stark's power to deal with Aizen's combined shikai, kidou attacks and sword-fighting. If Stark pushes him to the edge where Aizen must use his bankai, I don't think he or any of us (:amuse) will be ready for that.

Raizen
April 30, 2009, 03:49 PM
The reason the arrancar follow him is not only b/c aizen offer them a chance at being freed from HM but also b/c he is fearless. I think starks is very powerful. how powerful?? Who knows. that depends if he is a VL or not.
I think Aizen could indeed be stronger than him, but it doesn't have to be the case. Aizen is a manipulative bastard.
IMO starks could give aizen a run for hi smoney along with captains like shunsui and ukiatake

~Joshua~
April 30, 2009, 04:37 PM
The reason the arrancar follow him is not only b/c aizen offer them a chance at being freed from HM but also b/c he is fearless. I think starks is very powerful. how powerful?? Who knows. that depends if he is a VL or not.
I think Aizen could indeed be stronger than him, but it doesn't have to be the case. Aizen is a manipulative bastard.
IMO starks could give aizen a run for hi smoney along with captains like shunsui and ukiatake

Aizen is manipulative for sure. He manipulated Hinamori into believing he was a saint, work things so that she would attack Hitsugaya, stab her and have her still believe that he cared about her.

Doombot
April 30, 2009, 04:40 PM
Anyone that voted for Stark is an idiot btw.

~Joshua~
April 30, 2009, 08:20 PM
Anyone that voted for Stark is an idiot btw.

I didn't vote for Stark but you shouldn't make a statement like that. Your disrespecting people for the opinions they have.

Doombot
April 30, 2009, 11:14 PM
I didn't vote for Stark but you shouldn't make a statement like that. Your disrespecting people for the opinions they have.
I stand by my statement.

Raizen
May 01, 2009, 02:14 PM
I stand by my statement.
A statement that is wrong. ui have no idea what starks is capable of to say anything. Just b/c aizen is pulling the strings does not mean he is neccessarily the strongest. Think of kings and kinghts as someone has put it

Doombot
May 01, 2009, 02:15 PM
A statement that is wrong. ui have no idea what starks is capable of to say anything. Just b/c aizen is pulling the strings does not mean he is neccessarily the strongest. Think of kings and kinghts as someone has put it

Aizen is their GOD.

Raizen
May 01, 2009, 03:36 PM
Aizen is their GOD.
ur point??
I see aizen as someone who has the abilties and ways to allow them to escape HM. So why not follow him

~Joshua~
May 01, 2009, 03:42 PM
Aizen is their GOD.

Aaroniero followed Aizen so he could take the pain away. Nnoitra followed Aizen so he could die in battle. I don't see where out of pure fear they followed him.

choke_a_beech
May 09, 2009, 04:25 AM
Stark is loyal to Aizen cause Aizen provides him a free place to lounge around and sleep. Las Noches is a sure nicer place to nap than the deserts of Hueco Mundo.

-Ren Boy-
May 10, 2009, 02:34 PM
Hmm Imagine If The Top 4 Espada's were In a Illusion and in the illusion Aziens power was Exageratted to the point where the Top 4 Fear Azien

And It Also Makes Me Wonder That Azien restricted to top four from releasing in Fear That They Will Break Out Of The Illusion

My Vote Is On Stark

~Joshua~
May 10, 2009, 02:40 PM
Hmm Imagine If The Top 4 Espada's were In a Illusion and in the illusion Aziens power was Exageratted to the point where the Top 4 Fear Azien

And It Also Makes Me Wonder That Azien restricted to top four from releasing in Fear That They Will Break Out Of The Illusion

My Vote Is On Stark

So are you saing that if they release they will break out of the illusion? 3 of them have already released...

-Ren Boy-
May 10, 2009, 04:27 PM
So are you saing that if they release they will break out of the illusion? 3 of them have already released...

"In Fear That They Will Break Out Of The Illusion"

It Could Happen, It Couldn't

~Joshua~
May 10, 2009, 04:35 PM
"In Fear That They Will Break Out Of The Illusion"

It Could Happen, It Couldn't

That's like in Naruto, where if the victim releases enough chakra, they can break out. I don't see any reason why not especially since, IMO, the gap between the Top 3 espada and Aizen doens't appear to be that big.

-Ren Boy-
May 10, 2009, 04:42 PM
Who Knows

Weapon_X
May 10, 2009, 05:06 PM
Seriously, how can people vote Stark? Who would want someone stronger then the Captain on their team? Aizen isn't stupid and the fact that Aizen is just a BEAST. Bringing Grimmjow down to his knees with just his Rieatsu, that should just explain it. :)

LOL@ people who voted Stark. If you want to believe it or not, he is just a Hollow whilst Aizen is truely a GOD.

Raizen
May 13, 2009, 01:17 PM
Seriously, how can people vote Stark? Who would want someone stronger then the Captain on their team? Aizen isn't stupid and the fact that Aizen is just a BEAST. Bringing Grimmjow down to his knees with just his Rieatsu, that should just explain it. :)

LOL@ people who voted Stark. If you want to believe it or not, he is just a Hollow whilst Aizen is truely a GOD.
Hollow and shinigami are the same in limits and aspects.
We have no idea how powerful starks is so saying he could be stronger than aizen is not taht ludicrous. Look at kings, they rule the country but most of them can't fight for their life
Aizen is strong no doubt, but we shouldn't count starks out

Doombot
May 13, 2009, 01:34 PM
Hollow and shinigami are the same in limits and aspects.
We have no idea how powerful starks is so saying he could be stronger than aizen is not taht ludicrous. Look at kings, they rule the country but most of them can't fight for their life
Aizen is strong no doubt, but we shouldn't count starks out

Yes we should rule Stark out. He isn't stronger then Aizen. Aizen NEVER gets respect around here and always ends up fooling everyone.

Raizen
May 13, 2009, 01:58 PM
Yes we should rule Stark out. He isn't stronger then Aizen. Aizen NEVER gets respect around here and always ends up fooling everyone.
well i know for a fact u don't like starks so....

Doombot
May 13, 2009, 01:59 PM
well i know for a fact u don't like starks so....

It doesn't matter. So you're saying Yammy is stronger then Aizen? Why would Aizen make someone stronger then him? Boy that makes alot of sense. If Stark was stronger then Aizen he wouldn't be scared of him and would be out sleeping somewhere and not in battle.

Bolshoi Hui
May 13, 2009, 02:22 PM
Why does this thread even exist?
I thought it's quite obvious for everyone that Aizen is the main and strongest villain of this story.
As for Stark he is just one of Sosuke's subordinates who's probably not even a vasto lord and is confirmed not to be the strongest one.
But Aizen vs Stark would never happen in the first place.

RICKisBOSS
May 13, 2009, 02:24 PM
We really don't know the extent of either of these characters: One could argue that Aizen is "God," but that's what he's aiming for and the only times we have seen him fight he was either escaping, fighting someone half dead, or Hitsugaya.

Stark, who hasn't shown any fear of Aizen for the most part, really hasn't done anything short of capturing Inoue against his will faster than Ichigo and Kenpachi could react. Stark is fighting on par against Shunsui who has been a captain years longer than Aizen has. The fact that Aizen, Gin, and Tousen are the superiors of the Espada doesn't necessarily mean they are more powerful than the Espada themselves.

Anyway, these kind of discussions won't lead anywhere. If you were to ask if Yammy would defeat Tousen two months ago, the pro-Tousen side would be overwhelming.

But looking at what we see now, the answer would probably be the complete opposite. When I at least see Stark release or Aizen do anything for that matter, I guess I could give an opinion on this. See you in 2014 then >_>

Doombot
May 13, 2009, 02:27 PM
We really don't know the extent of either of these characters: One could argue that Aizen is "God," but that's what he's aiming for and the only times we have seen him fight he was either escaping, fighting someone half dead, or Hitsugaya.

Stark, who hasn't shown any fear of Aizen for the most part, really hasn't done anything short of capturing Inoue against his will faster than Ichigo and Kenpachi could react. Stark is fighting on par against Shunsui who has been a captain years longer than Aizen has. The fact that Aizen, Gin, and Tousen are the superiors of the Espada doesn't necessarily mean they are more powerful than the Espada themselves.

Anyway, these kind of discussions won't lead anywhere. If you were to ask if Yammy would defeat Tousen two months ago, the pro-Tousen side would be overwhelming.

But looking at what we see now, the answer would probably be the complete opposite. When I at least see Stark release or Aizen do anything for that matter, I guess I could give an opinion on this. See you in 2014 then >_>

No. Stark is scared of Aizen. OR he wouldn't be working for him.

RICKisBOSS
May 13, 2009, 02:35 PM
How do we know if Stark is really afraid of him? Wouldn't loneliness be a reflection on where he is as an Espada? Noitora for example was grateful for Aizen because he granted him more strength but he went out of his way to fight even though Aizen made it clear to the Espada not to provoke Ichigo and the others.

If he was really afraid, he wouldn't go against Aizen's orders because he'd fear the retributions. That and there was something about "Why would Aizen make something stronger than him" but look at what he's up against: The Gotei 13, the Royal Guard, and possibly the Vaizards. For what its worth, Aizen would take whatever he can get especially since he's had pathetic excuses like AA within his ranks among others.

If someone is leading an army, they can be seen as the general. It shouldn't be too much of a surprise that there would be those within the ranks that would have strength comparable to the general himself seeing how their opponents are made up of Aizen's former allies.

Doombot
May 13, 2009, 02:40 PM
How do we know if Stark is really afraid of him? Wouldn't loneliness be a reflection on where he is as an Espada? Noitora for example was grateful for Aizen because he granted him more strength but he went out of his way to fight even though Aizen made it clear to the Espada not to provoke Ichigo and the others.

If he was really afraid, he wouldn't go against Aizen's orders because he'd fear the retributions. That and there was something about "Why would Aizen make something stronger than him" but look at what he's up against: The Gotei 13, the Royal Guard, and possibly the Vaizards. For what its worth, Aizen would take whatever he can get especially since he's had pathetic excuses like AA within his ranks among others.

If someone is leading an army, they can be seen as the general. It shouldn't be too much of a surprise that there would be those within the ranks that would have strength comparable to the general himself seeing how their opponents are made up of Aizen's former allies.

Is Yammy stronger then Aizen?

GraveOne
May 13, 2009, 02:53 PM
This would be a good fight but Aizen wins. It would take a good amount of Stark's power to deal with Aizen's combined shikai, kidou attacks and sword-fighting. If Stark pushes him to the edge where Aizen must use his bankai, I don't think he or any of us (:amuse) will be ready for that.

im ready come on let me at em :P

IMO Aizen would just kill him... he would go and come lets fight using progressive skills I think from what Aizens personality looks like that he would just go ahead more EXTREMLY FAST and POW Stark's dead... BUT then again most of the characters from bleach went WTF when Aizen performed certain kidou so maybe just maybe he is WAY more strong than what it is imaginable in the manga... I'm thinking some one is going to use hax to beat/seal Aizen...

-Ren Boy-
May 13, 2009, 03:27 PM
And Thats Why I Stick With The Theory That MAYBE Aizen Has Casted An Illusion On The Top 4 Which Exagerated Aizens Power. Hence He Put A Restriction On Them From Releasing In Fear That They Will Break The Illusion And Kill Aizen Or Simply Won't Go Along With The Plan

faisfa1
May 13, 2009, 03:46 PM
Alot of people argue that the king isn't neccessarily stronger than the subordinates. That may be the case in real life, but in Bleach and other fictional narrations based one "the strongest one rule", the king is ALWAYS stronger than the subordinate. People seek strength and power so that they can get in these positions.

Imagine a Captain who is weaker than his vice captain. The vice captain would have no respect for that captain (think urahara & hayuri; although uraha's strength was only perceived to be weak). While I agree that the Espada aren't following Aizen because they are scared of him, I do think think, however, hold his power in high esteem.

Long story short, in stories like bleach, power is accumulated through strength. The person highest up is typically the strongest, even they look old and worn out like yama.

Weapon_X
May 13, 2009, 04:00 PM
As Doombot said, if Stark was stronger then he wouldn't be taking orders and he would just be sleeping somewhere, but just face the facts, STARK isn't stronger then Aizen.

And what's with all this bullshit saying that Aizen is weak if he doesn't have illusions and shit like that, that's his Zanpakuto and what would be wrong him using it? And he is stronger even without his Zanpakuto as we have seen him. He has reached all the limits of a Shinigami.

I'll say it again and again if I have to. Aizen would bring any of his Espadas down to his kness with hardly any effort.

And saying Stark isn't stronger then Aizen don't mean to say that the person hates Stark. It's called facts, why would anyone want some stronger then them in the team? And don't say the Kings and soldiers crap,this is a Shounen manga, not some reality soap opera.

RICKisBOSS
May 14, 2009, 06:30 PM
Is Yammy stronger then Aizen?Having an opinion is one thing, but it'd be appreciated it you could bring yourself to using more than five words when trying to make a point. Like I said and you've masterfully retorted to before, we really don't know enough about these characters to give a solid answer on.
We don't know the extent of Yammy's power or Stark's release...hell, we don't even know Stark's last name. To make such a declaration off of the few, see few, things we've seen from Aizen is pretty close minded.

I've posted my two cents on how plausible the match could be again this is really something that wouldn't be a cut and dry off of the little we've seen from either of the characters.

Doombot
May 14, 2009, 06:37 PM
Only idiots voted for Stark

-still 5 words.

Seriously, though. Stark has shown no powers and is Aizen's servant. If you think that Stark is stronger then Aizen then Yammy is the same since Yammy is stronger. I swear Stark fans and their denial. I wanted Barragan to be the Primera Espada but it didn't happen. But I moved on. When Yammy became the Zero Espada; NOPE STARK IS STRONGER. LALALAALA. Now people actually believe he's stronger then the MAIN VILLAIN.

I don't know how to argue this point. How can it be argued? Logic is not at home here.

RICKisBOSS
May 14, 2009, 06:55 PM
Only idiots voted for Stark

-still 5 words. :amuse

For what it's worth, it's that very reason why I didn't vote because what I've said again and again and again, this isn't something that could be called off of what we have (not) seen in the series so far.

That and I'm going off topic myself on this but while I commend you for proving your creative and mental limits, the forum has a pretty interesting stance on posts like that.

Sorry didn't see the edit. Nice try though.

http://mangahelpers.com/forums/announcement.php?f=815&a=27

Doombot
May 14, 2009, 08:11 PM
:amuse

For what it's worth, it's that very reason why I didn't vote because what I've said again and again and again, this isn't something that could be called off of what we have (not) seen in the series so far.

That and I'm going off topic myself on this but while I commend you for proving your creative and mental limits, the forum has a pretty interesting stance on posts like that.

Sorry didn't see the edit. Nice try though.

http://mangahelpers.com/forums/announcement.php?f=815&a=27

They'll delete it then and I'll still right. MAIN VILLAIN > Secondary Villain.

faisfa1
May 14, 2009, 09:07 PM
how can people even think that Stark can match up against Aizen?

Anyway, a more plausible question (I know it will get moved)... was ullquira ranked 4th based only on his first release? or was his second release taken into consideration?

Weapon_X
May 15, 2009, 11:47 AM
They'll delete it then and I'll still right. MAIN VILLAIN > Secondary Villain.

Agree, and Stark isn't even the second villain anyway. There is Gin and Tousen, Yammy. I still can't get how people can agree that Stark is stronger then Aizen. It's a dead obvious answer, NO!. Even a 10 year old would know the answer <.<

stevenash
May 15, 2009, 11:54 AM
No doubt Aizen is stronger than Stark.....but if we find out Stark's abilities....maybe he can use a loophole, tricks, to outsmart (yeah, like that'll happen..:D)...Aizen...:D

Or at least put up a fight....but we have no idea about his abilities...the only time we see a hint of his abilities is picking up Orihime...other than that...he hasn't fought...he just relax and lie down...:D...so can't really see anything...:D

I think Stark fighting Aizen will be like Shunsui fighting Yama-ji....:D....

sabret00the
May 15, 2009, 12:09 PM
Stark can't even take on a released Yami, how the fuck is he meant to deal with Aizen?

Bolshoi Hui
May 15, 2009, 12:39 PM
Oh my, 9 people for Stark. Seriously, what are you thinking about?

Ok, there are 2 shinigami whose power surpasses everything and Aizen is one of them. He is also the main villain of this story.

So If Stark is stronger than Aizen then there would definitely be no victory for the good side as Ichigo even after 5 power-ups would't be on par with such a monster who should be just immortal in that case.

I guess you understand it's simply impossible in Shounen.

faisfa1
May 15, 2009, 01:01 PM
Does anyone remember when Ichigo and co. first invaded Las Noches, and Aizen held a meeting with the Espada and told them as long as they stay with him they'd be safe?

hmmm... I wonder why he didn't say as long as they stayed with Stark, they'ed be safe.

stevenash
May 15, 2009, 01:30 PM
Actually....4 of that hollows already died...and one of them is close to dying....and all of them has enemy coming from all over (humans, SS, vaizards, royal guard, quincy)...:D...so I would say....Stark is a weakling for still following that guy...:D...and considering Hueco Mundo was probably never attacked/invaded before....Aizen just brings more problem to HM society...:D...same goes to Barragan and Halibel and all of the Espadas, Arrancar and hollows alike...:D

Bolshoi Hui
May 15, 2009, 01:41 PM
Actually....4 5 of that hollows already died

fixed cause Szael and Ulquiorra are not coming back lol.

warbandit66
May 15, 2009, 02:52 PM
I'm sorry but people who voted for Stark and are defending their position are seriously lacking in common sense. What exactly is it that you're basing this on? I don't ever recall seeing Stark engaged in any real altercation (I know he's fighting Shunsui but the two are playing at the moment), on top of that although we've seen massive displays of power from Aizen he's never broken a sweat.

Raizen
May 21, 2009, 05:14 PM
It doesn't matter. So you're saying Yammy is stronger then Aizen? Why would Aizen make someone stronger then him? Boy that makes alot of sense. If Stark was stronger then Aizen he wouldn't be scared of him and would be out sleeping somewhere and not in battle.
How am I saying that yammy is stronger than Aizen?? fo yammy's numero 0 thing, it doesn't neccesarily make him the strongest. I theorized that Yammy is a wild card. he has been shown to be able to absorb souls and hollows are souls. So teh more of his teammates fall the stronger he becomes. So no i don't think yammy is stronger than starks

As for starks not obeying, did u forget that the reason hollows follow aizen is b/c he is offering them a chance to break free of HM. That is one of teh reason.
i am not saying taht starks i stronger, but there is always a possibilty

kkck
May 21, 2009, 08:00 PM
How am I saying that yammy is stronger than Aizen?? fo yammy's numero 0 thing, it doesn't neccesarily make him the strongest. I theorized that Yammy is a wild card. he has been shown to be able to absorb souls and hollows are souls. So teh more of his teammates fall the stronger he becomes. So no i don't think yammy is stronger than starks

As for starks not obeying, did u forget that the reason hollows follow aizen is b/c he is offering them a chance to break free of HM. That is one of teh reason.
i am not saying taht starks i stronger, but there is always a possibilty

Break free of HM? When has that been said? Maybe you can elaborate on that because I can't recall it at all lol.

ryanzokuken
May 21, 2009, 11:32 PM
the only bad thing that can be said about Aizen is that he seems to have a problem with finishing people. for being so badass, he doesn't have a single kill under his belt, despite all the people he dropped back in SS.

but then again, i don't think he cared really. :p Hitsu and Momo would have died had Unohana and Kotetsu not been right there to save them.

Ichigo and Renji also received pretty immediate on-sight treatment from squad 4.

Kommamura just wasn't that messed up from the black coffin, and if i remember correctly, he got up and refused treatment.

my point in all this is just that Aizen might not be able to one-shot Stark.
but i'd still say Aizen could win without bankai.

axellover2
May 22, 2009, 03:32 AM
I dont think Aizen would keep someone stronger than him as an underling.Not saying that Stark wouldnt put up a fight,but Aizen is suppose to be the main villian and technically Stark is only the 4th.(Aizen,Gin,Tousen,then err Yammy?)

kkck
May 22, 2009, 09:27 AM
I dont think Aizen would keep someone stronger than him as an underling.Not saying that Stark wouldnt put up a fight,but Aizen is suppose to be the main villian and technically Stark is only the 4th.(Aizen,Gin,Tousen,then err Yammy?)

What makes you think tousen and gin are stronger than stark lol?

-Ren Boy-
May 22, 2009, 09:32 AM
I dont think Aizen would keep someone stronger than him as an underling.Not saying that Stark wouldnt put up a fight,but Aizen is suppose to be the main villian and technically Stark is only the 4th.(Aizen,Gin,Tousen,then err Yammy?)

Gin And Tousen Got OutClassed By The Top 4 A Long Time Ago
Thats Why They Barely Get Any Screen Time:p

They May Have A Higher Political Position But They Are Not Stronger

But Then You Could Look At The Fact That 3 Captains Are Taking On The Top 3 Espada
But Gin And Tousen Being Stronger Than Stark IMO Would Be Ludicrous

axellover2
May 22, 2009, 10:59 AM
Gin And Tousen Got OutClassed By The Top 4 A Long Time Ago
Thats Why They Barely Get Any Screen Time:p

They May Have A Higher Political Position But They Are Not Stronger

But Then You Could Look At The Fact That 3 Captains Are Taking On The Top 3 Espada
But Gin And Tousen Being Stronger Than Stark IMO Would Be Ludicrous

I think the 3 captains taking on the top 3 Espada is what influenced me about this.Yeah Stark hasnt really done anything,but imo the way it is now is making the top 3 look weak.Besides who says Tousen and Gin havent gotten more powerful?

-Ren Boy-
May 22, 2009, 11:04 AM
I think the 3 captains taking on the top 3 Espada is what influenced me about this.Yeah Stark hasnt really done anything,but imo the way it is now is making the top 3 look weak.Besides who says Tousen and Gin havent gotten more powerful?

But That Is Assumption
Ever Since They Have Left SS There Hasnt Been No Development In There
Therefore The Only Person Out Of Them 2 Who Weve Seen Fight Was Tousen Against Kenpachi And He Lost

^^^But It's Getting A Tad A Bit Off Topic :)

I Still Believe The Top 4 Are In An Illusion (I'll State After Your Comment) Hence IMO Why Stark Is Stronger

Raizen
May 26, 2009, 07:24 PM
Break free of HM? When has that been said? Maybe you can elaborate on that because I can't recall it at all lol.
From the hollows' talk about fear and how they were born from fear, well they were born in HM. SO we could see fear as HM. They said they want to break free, thus meaning break free from HM. They said they wanted to escape teh darkness and HM is always dark. Yes it is an assumption but the hollows have always been limited by the shinigamis so f course tehy want to break free

kkck
May 26, 2009, 09:20 PM
From the hollows' talk about fear and how they were born from fear, well they were born in HM. SO we could see fear as HM. They said they want to break free, thus meaning break free from HM. They said they wanted to escape teh darkness and HM is always dark. Yes it is an assumption but the hollows have always been limited by the shinigamis so f course tehy want to break free

I thought pluses became hollows in the Human world and later on they moved to HM. I don't see how a plus would actually survive by itself in HM considering the amount of hollows there(that would be a requirement for a hollow to be born in HM).

Also, given the initial explanation of how a plus turns into a hollow, it would seems as if the darkness that torments a hollow is actually inside a hollow rather than it being HM itself. HM does not seem like a place which would make things any better but I doubt it is the only problem there.

Saint Markus
May 27, 2009, 03:05 AM
this is like "nagato" challenging "madara" in a fight, it's obvious who'd win.

stark just seems to depressed to really get into a fight, besides aizen would do something unexpected and own stark in seconds.

Ozehro
July 29, 2009, 01:21 AM
*sigh*
espada vs Aizen match ups don't make sense.
they serve Aizen so doesn't that mean we can conclude that they
are weaker than Aizen... or are they allies for other reasons...

Yans86
July 29, 2009, 01:29 PM
*sigh*
espada vs Aizen match ups don't make sense.
they serve Aizen so doesn't that mean we can conclude that they
are weaker than Aizen... or are they allies for other reasons...

Totally agree,it's even possible that some of themis "using" Aizen's knowledge of the"world" to create a better "situation" for the hollows....
Barragan is the first that comes to mind......betray Aizen and attempt to kill him/overthrow his leadership...
Barragan summoning hell's gate or tons of adjuchas and VL's...that would be a huge twist :-P

Anyway,Aizen wins this even if Stark cangive him a run for his money!!!Just immagine him spinning in all direction and keep firing thousandsceros....no way to hide,not even the necessity to look/overthrow the Illussion....

Problemis Aizen's bankai and his eventually hollow power...

DARK
July 30, 2009, 01:44 PM
Definitely Aizen. Perhaps if Starrk was much more oriented in battle, instead of being a lazy bum, the gap in their power could narrow.
If anything, Aizen just casually called in Starrk (and the other two Espada) and when the battle turned to the Shinigami's favor, he called in Wonderweiss. Starrk even said himself that Aizen calling in WW means that he wants the battle to finish quickly.

Mifune_Taichou
August 01, 2009, 06:17 PM
Aizen would win. If he encountered an adjucas/VL that was stronger than him or almost as strong he'd use gin and or his espada as well as his powers to eliminate him and not you know, turn him into an arrancar and make him even stronger. If Aizen used the hogyoku on him then we must assume he is no threat to him.

BaddAzzKenpachi74
August 18, 2009, 06:23 PM
Aizen has enough reiatsu to force grimmjow to his knees without any visible effort, advance kido (which apparently arrancar dont know except for a few specific abilities which are similar to it) and mastery of shunpo and hand to hand combat. Not to mention his shikai is the biggest hax in the series. I have no doubt stark is absurdly powerfull (how could I lol?), but the little things aizen has done so far lead me to believe he is stronger than any of his espada.
i'm actually sick of seeing this example lol,
in all the other vs threads i've been to someone ALWAYS uses this example.
YES Aizen did bring down the 6th espada but the power between each espada has been proven to be BIG,
example Ulquerria and Nnoatria
so Stark is 10x stronger then grim so that example is irrelevent when discusses primiera vs Aizen.
Stark is a baddazz and is one of my favorite characters but i do know Aizen would still beat him i'm not going to deny that,
but i'm sooooo tired of people making it seem like Aizen would just completely OWN the primerira espada no problem.
i for one think that it would be a good match with Aizen coming out on top in the long run.

InnerHollow
August 18, 2009, 09:07 PM
I have this feeling that Aizen knows all the espadas weaknesses just in case they were to ever rebel against him. I also believe he is stronger than them all anyways and he has his Hacks... of course

DARK
August 18, 2009, 10:56 PM
Aizen: Has at least twice the reiatsu of a Captain. Can "crush" the 6th Espada with little effort and defeat a Shinigami's Bankai.
Stark: Presumed to be a Vasto Lorde, which as a Menos, would be stronger than a Captain. As an Arrancar, as well as him fusing with Lilynette (his sword), he would be even stronger.

Aizen is still much more powerful in my opinion. The only one that can oppose him is Yamamoto.

kitten320
December 16, 2009, 06:09 PM
Aizen... do I really need too explain?