PDA

View Full Version : Match Akutsu vs Kirihara



Fayte
April 21, 2009, 09:41 PM
Who would win?

http://img.7andy.jp/bks/images/i1/C0959711.jpg VS http://www.quizilla.com/user_images/S/SH/SHA/sharingantherese/1210217169_yakirihara.jpg

KuwabaraTheMan
April 21, 2009, 10:21 PM
At present Kirihara would definitely have the upper hand.

Akutsu certainly has a far higher ceiling than Kirihara, however. I could definitely see Akutsu crushing Kirihara once he's progressed a little further, but based on his level the last time we saw him, he wouldn't be ready just yet.

Fayte
April 22, 2009, 09:32 AM
We can't judge based on the present Kirihara, and the past Akutsu when he faced Echizen in Kantou. We have to assume Akutsu is now the same skill as all the other players. Otherwise he wouldn't have been invited to the U-17 camp. Zaizen wasn't invited, but Akutsu was. That has to say something.

jdw
April 22, 2009, 10:42 AM
We can't judge based on the present Kirihara, and the past Akutsu when he faced Echizen in Kantou. We have to assume Akutsu is now the same skill as all the other players. Otherwise he wouldn't have been invited to the U-17 camp. Zaizen wasn't invited, but Akutsu was. That has to say something.

Creating the present day Akutsu would be hard because we don't know anything new about his repertoire and we haven't seen any real indication of how he may have grown even if we assume he has grown. I would love to see these two have a match, but judging based on what he have seen from each, I say Kirihara would win but Akutsu looks like he has much more potential.

KuwabaraTheMan
April 22, 2009, 11:30 AM
We can't judge based on the present Kirihara, and the past Akutsu when he faced Echizen in Kantou. We have to assume Akutsu is now the same skill as all the other players. Otherwise he wouldn't have been invited to the U-17 camp. Zaizen wasn't invited, but Akutsu was. That has to say something.

Sure, he's probably gotten better now, but we don't know how much.

Until we see how Akutsu has progressed, it would be difficult to say anything conclusive about this match.

Fayte
April 22, 2009, 03:04 PM
It's all about the style of play that can be predicted.

findingkaho
April 23, 2009, 01:22 PM
Akutsu and Kirihara ??
This match will be Bloody. The Red Kirihara would win this match but may be Akutsu will comes up with Mugo no Kyuchi lol who knows

Atobe the king
April 26, 2009, 03:56 PM
Seeing as Akutsu was bested by a Ryoma who forgot how to return a serve...I'm still giving the edge to Kirihara, Almost bested Fuji, Unlocked Muga, can copy techniques as well addding various snake shots to his arsenal

Fayte
April 27, 2009, 11:20 AM
That's like saying Horio could beat Tezuka because Tezuka sucked at tennis when he was 4 years old. Therefore, Horio now, could beat a 4 year old Tezuka.

Atobe the king
April 27, 2009, 03:43 PM
That's like saying Horio could beat Tezuka

It really isn't

Fayte
April 27, 2009, 09:47 PM
It really isn't

Way to "not understand" not only what you said, but what I said as well.

Sherlock Holmes
April 28, 2009, 05:34 PM
It depends on both the rule of drama and the rule of popularity.
Who is more popular in Japan?
And it depends who starts losing.
Whoever starts losing has a 90% of chance of making a comeback.

But based on their styles, I'd say Akutsu.

The guy who can attack from any angle vs the guy who tries to hurt his opponents.

Kirihara's style is to hit his opponents in their weak spots. Akutsu has no weak spots. He seems to have an advantage, as long as we assume they are on the same level and their only difference is their style.

Atobe the king
April 28, 2009, 06:22 PM
Your confusing Anime Akaya with Manga Akaya, Manga Akaya is a damn Sadist, he doesn't hit a weak spot persay he just doesn't want you to move, which is whjy he kept attacking Ryoma's knee

All in all they are both Aggressive baseliners so it comes down to court coverage except Akaya's pretty damn fast himself

If you must know

Akaya was 27 in the last popularity poll, Akutsu was 43

Fayte
April 28, 2009, 07:04 PM
When it comes to court coverage, nobody is better than Akutsu. Not Kenya, not even Kite.

Atobe the king
April 28, 2009, 07:30 PM
When it comes to court coverage, nobody is better than Akutsu. Not Kenya, not even Kite.

Says who? when was this ever stated? hell when was the comparison ever made?

Akutsu comes from the period of the manga i like to call...the "Realistic portion", his court coverage was due to his ability to slide all over a hardcourt...which isn't impossible, just youtube Gael Monfils' Slide and see that there is an actual tennis player known for it

Kenya...idk he's just faster than Kamio, Shukuchi is a whole different ball game

If it's stated that Akutsu's court coverage surpasses a Shukuchi user then whatever, until then there's really not proof that it does

Fayte
April 28, 2009, 07:44 PM
Says who? when was this ever stated? hell when was the comparison ever made?

Akutsu comes from the period of the manga i like to call...the "Realistic portion", his court coverage was due to his ability to slide all over a hardcourt...which isn't impossible, just youtube Gael Monfils' Slide and see that there is an actual tennis player known for it

Kenya...idk he's just faster than Kamio, Shukuchi is a whole different ball game

If it's stated that Akutsu's court coverage surpasses a Shukuchi user then whatever, until then there's really not proof that it does

You don't need someone saying "Akutsu is faster than a Shukuchi user" to see that he is. The Skukuchi was just an illusion, which is why it was defeated. Akutsu is actually moving that fast around the court, which is the difference.

Dansan1
April 28, 2009, 07:55 PM
However it's important to note that part of the reason the illusion worked was the speed of the user.

The shukuchi illusion was instantaneous movement, not fast movement. The illusion was created by using the same starting and ending position of the head and the low charge to stay out of the opponents view so that they would only see the starting and ending position, hence the illusion. It still depends on tremendous court speed.

At this point we simply cannot say for certain who could cover the court better Akutsu or Kite. Stating that Akustu's movement is definitively better than Kite's is entirely subjective. That may be what you see, it isn't anywhere close to any definition of fact. These hypothetical battles are just that.

Although I find that battle particularly intriguing. Their both martial artists with tremendous physical capabilities. So I think that would be a great match.

Atobe the king
April 28, 2009, 07:56 PM
It may be an illusion but they were still fast, Hirakoba was able to go from the net to the baseline before Higuma Otoshi even had the chance to land

Eishiro got to the Zero shiki dropshot before it even landed


You don't need someone saying "Akutsu is faster than a Shukuchi user" to see that he is

And yea...you do...last i checked you weren't "Word of God" (aka Konomi Takeshi)



At this point we simply cannot say for certain who could cover the court better Akutsu or Kite

Pretty much

Dansan1
April 28, 2009, 08:11 PM
"Eishiro got to the Zero shiki dropshot before it even landed"

A much better example than that is his very next shot where he retrieved a smash that Tezuka hit to the complete opposite side of the court.

Atobe the king
April 28, 2009, 08:16 PM
"Eishiro got to the Zero shiki dropshot before it even landed"

A much better example than that is his very next shot where he retrieved a smash that Tezuka hit to the complete opposite side of the court.

Your right, i didn't even think of that, most player try to get a dropshout at least after it bounces but he got there before it landed, and he was all the way on the baseline

DeidaraGrimmjow
April 28, 2009, 09:52 PM
Zaizen wasn't invited, but Akutsu was. That has to say something.


What does that say? Zaizen was weak. He couldn't do anything...

Fayte
April 29, 2009, 09:57 AM
What does that say? Zaizen was weak. He couldn't do anything...

Zaizen was a part of Shitenhouji, which is one of the best schools. Akutsu was a part of Yamabuki, which has Sengoku and that is it. I think that explains itself.


And yea...you do...last i checked you weren't "Word of God" (aka Konomi Takeshi)

Just stop.

DavenSodan
April 29, 2009, 12:34 PM
I guess it is pretty much certain that Sanada must be the fastest one with his Rai thing... about Devil Akaya and Aktusu: we just have to wait and hope that they will play. However, if Aktusu also has a Devil inside him, then I guess he will win for sure.

Atobe the king
April 29, 2009, 03:18 PM
Just stop.

Says who? you? the Emperor of PoT information :eyeroll? because for someone parading around with that moniker you'd think you'd be right all the time.

DeidaraGrimmjow
April 29, 2009, 08:03 PM
Zaizen was a part of Shitenhouji, which is one of the best schools. Akutsu was a part of Yamabuki, which has Sengoku and that is it. I think that explains itself.


So...being part of a good team automatically makes you good? Zaizen was declared a genius, but he could not even return a shot by Tezuka. Now, I'm not saying he is a nobody, but I don't think you can complare the worth of someone being invited just because Zaizen wasn't.

Fayte
April 29, 2009, 08:46 PM
So...being part of a good team automatically makes you good? Zaizen was declared a genius, but he could not even return a shot by Tezuka. Now, I'm not saying he is a nobody, but I don't think you can complare the worth of someone being invited just because Zaizen wasn't.

You shouldn't judge a character based on one swing of the racquet.

DeidaraGrimmjow
April 29, 2009, 09:21 PM
Then what should I base it on? That's how PoT works right? That's like saying in Naruto: "Yeah his jutsu's weak but he a genius you know..." He had a chance to prove himself and he failed miserably. That's all I'm saying...

Sherlock Holmes
April 29, 2009, 09:50 PM
Your confusing Anime Akaya with Manga Akaya, Manga Akaya is a damn Sadist, he doesn't hit a weak spot persay he just doesn't want you to move, which is whjy he kept attacking Ryoma's knee

All in all they are both Aggressive baseliners so it comes down to court coverage except Akaya's pretty damn fast himself

If you must know

Akaya was 27 in the last popularity poll, Akutsu was 43

You are right, my mistake.
But my point stands. Akaya hits the person. Akutsu can attack from any angle, so as long as the ball is close enough to him he can hit it.
So he could theoretically hit the ball easily.

Popularity power says Akaya is more powerful. Canon shows him stronger than Akutsu(currently, assuming he didn't improve)

so unless he has a secret weapon/deadly upgrade/ training from hell/Rule of drama, Akutsu is probably going to lose.

But if we assume no popularity, drama or character level is involved, leaving only playing style, Akutsu is going to lose.

I'd put my money on Akutsu though, because I like to bet on the most improbable winner.

Atobe the king
April 29, 2009, 10:51 PM
Oo Sherlock..you are also a frequenter of tvtropes?

They made me rethink Yukimura...he is now officially a magnificent bastard

Sherlock Holmes
April 30, 2009, 09:43 AM
Oo Sherlock..you are also a frequenter of tvtropes?

They made me rethink Yukimura...he is now officially a magnificent bastard

TvTropes is my bible!

Yukimura is the true magnificent bastard indeed.

Also, thanks to them, every time I see this scene
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSZeHLlUtxY
I imagine Kirihara saying
"MY NAME IS....INIGO MONTOOOOOOOOOOYA!"

TvTropes also made me like Atobe a lot more, because I now see him as LargeHam incarnate.

...And I laugh at the Gratuitous English of the fake foreigners.
"I suppose you are a..."
what's after "a" is anyone's guess.
It always sounded like "I suppose you are the last assistant in the sky" to me, but a friend insists it sounds like "I suppose that you lost your Resistance game" which makes me think of Kirihara playing ps3. Which is awesome.

Also, I just gotta point out a comment on that youtube video:

Yeah, I totally remember that time Andre Agassi was knocked up against the fence in the Australian Open and went Super Saiyan...oh wait, no, that was just a dream I had after smoking too much pot!

That describes my reaction to that match. But again, RuleOfCool XD.

Atobe the king
April 30, 2009, 09:52 AM
Tvtropes made me realize what a fucked up bastard Atobe is (still love him though)

He's a draco in leather pants, his fangirls ignore the fact that he purposely tried to destroy someones arm, Yukimura is also a draco in leather pants

PoT tropes are awesome...Inui and his batman gambits, Akaya being a blood knight, all of Rikkai being knight templars, Ryoma is a god mode sue

javimgol
June 15, 2009, 04:08 PM
Akutsu. Ryoma won that match ONLY because he was the main character, Akutsu played better.
Akutsu it's absolutely great

Atobe the king
June 15, 2009, 05:14 PM
Akutsu. Ryoma won that match ONLY because he was the main character, Akutsu played better.
Akutsu it's absolutely great

Um no he didn't

You can't go writing off all of the main characters victories has plot devices, Ryoma only had one match where the plot really saved his ass and that was the final.

Akutsu does not play too smart he plays on instinct, that's good but tennis is a tactical game (see Murray, Andy) and Ryoma was more tactical because he practiced, he had the ability to win but not the tactics and this is why Ryoma won.

Fayte
June 15, 2009, 07:59 PM
Um no he didn't

You can't go writing off all of the main characters victories has plot devices, Ryoma only had one match where the plot really saved his ass and that was the final.

Akutsu does not play too smart he plays on instinct, that's good but tennis is a tactical game (see Murray, Andy) and Ryoma was more tactical because he practiced, he had the ability to win but not the tactics and this is why Ryoma won.

Maybe when Echizen loses an official and real tennis means something in PoT, you will be right. Echizen wins, that's that. There is nothing else to it.

Atobe the king
June 15, 2009, 08:23 PM
Ryoma baits Akutsu with a drive A, Akutsu does a poor lob he uses a drop volley, nothing hax about it.

T.a.c.t.i.c.s

http://media.onemanga.com/mangas/00000009/00000108/11-12.jpg

Sherlock Holmes
June 15, 2009, 11:25 PM
Let's be fair, Ryoma does have some plot hax in every single match.
But let's be more fair, every single match in the manga has plot hax. Why did Sanada beat Tezuka? Because Konomi wanted to make rikkai look threatening.

So saying that X match doesn't count because of plot hax is like saying that the entire series doesn't count. The entire series is an infinite loop of plot haxes.

So therefore, we should always ignore plot haxes when judging a character's skill.

Because if we really stop to analyze the haxes, then we'll come to the conclusion that Horio could beat Yukimura if it was all up to him and Seigaku was losing 2-0.

Atobe the king
June 15, 2009, 11:34 PM
Lol..TV tropes is also your bible right? thus i think a better term than plothax would be "Batman Gambit" .

Sherlock Holmes
June 16, 2009, 01:27 AM
Lol, good point. Also, I think we should note that people from Seigaku are the only ones allowed to gain a ThemeMusicPowerUp, and that probably counts for something.

Kirihara is the BloodyKnight, but does Akutsu have a corresponding trope?

JyAZ
June 16, 2009, 03:17 AM
Just to directly answer the topic of this thread, as far as we know, Kirihara would destroy Akutsu. Who knows? Akutsu might have gotten serious about tennis and gotten twice as good. But minus speculation and looking at cannon, Kirihara would win.

But on another note, there's no proof that Akutsu is better/faster than Kenya. Show me evidence if you want to make that argument. It seems to me that, honestly, most of the things you say are just speculation.

On the Zaizen argument, I believe he's ok, but overrated at the same time. He is considered a genius, but he was embarrassed because he wasn't even close to returning Tezuka's ball. You say that you can't judge his skill based on one swing, but you also can't judge his skill on just his title. Oshitari is called a genius. Do you think that he can stand on par with Tezuka and Chitose? Honestly, I doubt it. So far the only one that I've seen able to hold the title "genius" is Fuji. I may be biased, but I think that everyone can agree he can back that title up.

Fayte
June 16, 2009, 09:32 AM
Let's be fair, Ryoma does have some plot hax in every single match.
But let's be more fair, every single match in the manga has plot hax. Why did Sanada beat Tezuka? Because Konomi wanted to make rikkai look threatening.

So saying that X match doesn't count because of plot hax is like saying that the entire series doesn't count. The entire series is an infinite loop of plot haxes.

So therefore, we should always ignore plot haxes when judging a character's skill.

Because if we really stop to analyze the haxes, then we'll come to the conclusion that Horio could beat Yukimura if it was all up to him and Seigaku was losing 2-0.

It isn't even about the plot. It is about Echizen not being allowed to lose. Konomi wont let him. So how can you even compare the skill of anybody who played against Echizen, who beat everyone in the series? For once I will use a RL situation.

Say Roddick loses to Federer, Djokovic loses to Federer, and Nadal loses to Federer.

Does that mean you can judge a match between Roddick and Djokovic by looking at how they played against Federer? No. You can only look at the playstyle of both players. NOT what happened in the match.

You can't say "Well Federer got Roddick on this drop volley, so that means Djokovic and Nadal will beat him." You can't judge like that. You must only look at how the two playstyles will fair against one another.

javimgol
June 16, 2009, 11:04 AM
In fact, Nadal defeats them all XD
Well, I don't think we should be angry because Ryoma will always win, this is a shonen. Akutsu was other victim of that fact.
But the fact is that we have only seen 1 match of Akutsu,against Ryoma. Kirihara also played his first match VS Ryoma, but we have seen their matches against Fuji, Krauser and Kaido-Inui too. So I think we don´t have enough arguments to study the evolve of Akutsu

Fayte
June 16, 2009, 11:35 AM
But the fact is that we have only seen 1 match of Akutsu,against Ryoma. Kirihara also played his first match VS Ryoma, but we have seen their matches against Fuji, Krauser and Kaido-Inui too. So I think we don´t have enough arguments to study the evolve of Akutsu

I know, and that is my point. This is just taking the two play-styles and comparing them.

javimgol
June 16, 2009, 11:44 AM
I know, and that is my point. This is just taking the two play-styles and comparing them.
Well, if you are talking about unfair play, you shouldn´t forget about Higa.
In the court I think Kirihara it's more agressive and mad; Akutsu, in the match, was shown as an excellent player, not extremely agressive. He could reach all the balls, was powerful, with good abilities...but he didn´t want to crucify Ryoma like Kirihara did with Krauser
But outside the court, obviously Akutsu it's more dangerous

Fayte
June 16, 2009, 07:42 PM
Outside of the court, Akutsu would literally kill Kirihara. But I don't know, Akutsu is pretty flippin aggressive when he is serious and the guy flies around the court like it's easy.

Atobe the king
June 16, 2009, 08:43 PM
Akutsu would probably own the entire cast except maybe Higa and Sanada outside of the courts.

People tend to forget that he was a martial arts prodigy as well.

Sherlock Holmes
June 16, 2009, 08:59 PM
I don't know, I don't think he could own Kenya and Kamio.
It would go like this.

Akutsu: Hello. My name is Akutsu. You killed my boredom. Prepare to die.

*Kamio and Kenya run the hell away from Akutsu*

Akutsu: Damn. They are fast.

Fayte
June 16, 2009, 10:33 PM
They are no match for Akutsu's Princess Bride reference mixed with his net teleport.

javimgol
June 17, 2009, 03:02 AM
I don't know, I don't think he could own Kenya and Kamio.
It would go like this.

Akutsu: Hello. My name is Akutsu. You killed my boredom. Prepare to die.

*Kamio and Kenya run the hell away from Akutsu*

Akutsu: Damn. They are fast.
The Princess Bride ?

DavenSodan
June 17, 2009, 02:45 PM
Where does it say something about teleport?

Fayte
June 17, 2009, 04:27 PM
Akutsu's net teleport? It's only like one of the most used techniques in the series by Echizen. lol

http://media.onemanga.com/mangas/00000009/00000102/06.jpg
http://media.onemanga.com/mangas/00000009/00000102/07.jpg

javimgol
June 18, 2009, 10:25 AM
Akutsu's net teleport? It's only like one of the most used techniques in the series by Echizen. lol

http://media.onemanga.com/mangas/00000009/00000102/06.jpg
http://media.onemanga.com/mangas/00000009/00000102/07.jpg
It's maybe the same move as Higa player has, Shukuchu or sth like that? Higa players and Akutsu are masters in martial arts...

Fayte
June 18, 2009, 11:46 AM
It could be, who knows? But the Shukuchi that the Higa players did were just an illusion. Apparently they were not actually moving that fast, but taking giant leaps at certain moments or however Konomi tried to justify it.

Akutsu however, is actually running that fast.

DavenSodan
June 18, 2009, 12:18 PM
Yeah, but its not teleportation then. Only Sanada can do it, can he?

Atobe the king
June 18, 2009, 12:59 PM
Yeah, but its not teleportation then. Only Sanada can do it, can he?

Sanada and i guess Muga echizen are the only people who can literally teleport around the ring, Akutsu just has Battoujutsu god speed :amuse

Fayte
June 18, 2009, 02:15 PM
Yeah, I personally thought Sanada's teleport looked sick in the OVA.

As for Akutsu, I honestly think he is going to be a monster. Remember, it wasn't until he got beat by Echizen, when he started to like tennis. Echizen was the first person to ever beat him, so now he has something to look forward to. An Akutsu who enjoys tennis, how rare a sight it is, will definitely not go unnoticed. I'm just waiting for his 7-0 against Kawamura.

Atobe the king
June 18, 2009, 02:28 PM
Well Konomi brought him back during the nationals, a good sign that he hadn't forgotten about the original devil boy before Akaya stole the name.

He will be a force, back when the played PoT was a little more realisitc but i'd love to see what he can do during this SSj filled PoT.

JyAZ
June 18, 2009, 07:59 PM
I guess Akutsu is in the same boat as Fuji. Both of them don't really try at 100% when they play, so both of them have loads of potential. I will agree. If we see more of Akutsu, he will become crazy high tier.

Atobe the king
June 18, 2009, 08:07 PM
Fuji doesn't do that anymore imo, i think he plays his best now but like Koshimae evolves each match. He realized that holding back wasn't going to win him the nationals.

Every important character had an epiphany, for Inui it was Echizen, for Echizen it was Tezuka, for Sanada it was Echizen etc, after their Epiphony match they stopped screwing around and became much better players/grew to expand on their potential. Shiriahsi was that for Fuji.

Akutsu's one match doubled as his epiphany match, because if he didn't care about tennis...wtf was he doing at the stadium on multiple occasions?

Fayte
June 18, 2009, 10:41 PM
I think it's awesome that Akutsu had a change of heart. Seeing Akutsu curse out that Oni kid in the 2nd chapter made me remember how I felt when (In the fillers) Kirihara (The old A-hole) was verbally owning Kevin (The new A-hole). I was rooting hard for Kirihara.

Akutsu all the way!

Atobe the king
June 18, 2009, 10:46 PM
I like his change of heart as well, similar to the what happened to him in the anime.."Jerkass with a heart of gold" is the trope.

Sherlock Holmes
June 18, 2009, 11:15 PM
Yeah, I liked that as well. Now he is an antihero, which makes him cooler than everyone else, while still able to win.(Because truly evil characters never win.)

Maybe his new playstyle will involve reading his opponent's mind. I'm basing this on the fact that he and Toua from one outs look a lot like each other. And Toua reads minds to win.


http://jessi.gonein60fps.net/S1E1/2008%20Anime%20Awards/One%20Outs%20Best%20Sports.jpg
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_6rEPmczFTew/Sc7robqOXDI/AAAAAAAAADc/tLIMMCajYu0/s320/epi144_akutsu.jpg

javimgol
June 19, 2009, 02:24 AM
Akutsu didn´t have an special shot, no? He only uses "Akutsu's stances" to return every ball,no? He seemed to be more physical than technical...

Fayte
June 19, 2009, 09:23 AM
Akutsu was probably the first character to have no special shots. His flexible body allows him to do insane things. He's got dynamic vision, strength, speed and willpower.

Atobe the king
June 19, 2009, 09:40 AM
Akutsu was probably the first character to have no special shots. His flexible body allows him to do insane things. He's got dynamic vision, strength, speed and willpower.

You forgot one of his most important talents, reflexes and instinct..unfortunately it also cost him the match.

His return of the twist serve is to this day the most creative way to return it.

Fayte
June 19, 2009, 03:27 PM
I really like the fact Akutsu has his own distinct playstyle. There really isn't anybody in the entire series who plays like him. You have your clones of other characters, but nobody has cloned Akutsu yet. I like that.

Atobe the king
June 19, 2009, 03:44 PM
Can't clone natural flexibility lol. Sanada is pretty unique because he is one of the few characters that has an attack for every situation.

Bowser
June 19, 2009, 04:49 PM
Also Jirou, his soft wrist that allows him to use magic volley...but he didn't have it until he played Bunta in the newcomer tournament right?