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drakend
May 16, 2009, 01:20 AM
Firs things first: for those who don't know Ichigonator is the form Ichigo shown in the fight against Ulquiorra... his hollow form with only primal istincts in control.
Now I would like to know your opinions about a fight between Ichigonator and Halibel.
I personally think that, if Halibel powers are water based only, and she can't perform much better than what she's doing against Hitsugaya, she would be screwed.

Doombot
May 16, 2009, 01:24 AM
Still don't think there is enough information. Do the Top 3 (4?) all have 2 forms? What's all of her powers? What's her ultimate attack? We have NO clue. I'll vote at a later date.

First Supervillain
May 16, 2009, 01:52 AM
Ichigonator IF ISHIDA Didn't screw him over!
that sucked harsh. But Kubo needed a Deus Ex Machina to transform him back into regular sucky Ichigo. Ichigo is strong and impressive I know, but I hate his personality - I only envy his power;)

Halibel vs Ichigonator = Halibel getting Bleached.
[hr]

Firs things first: for those who don't know Ichigonator is the form Ichigo shown in the fight against Ulquiorra... his hollow form with only primal istincts in control.
Now I would like to know your opinions about a fight between Ichigonator and Halibel.
I personally think that, if Halibel powers are water based only, and she can't perform much better than what she's doing against Hitsugaya, she would be screwed.

FIXED

Starzen
May 16, 2009, 02:18 AM
Halibaby better turn it into a sexual battle if she wants to win or else she'll get torn apart for the fun of it. For as impressive as Ichigo was, I think halibel stands a chance as they both seem to be sword fighters.

drakend
May 16, 2009, 04:59 AM
that sucked harsh. But Kubo needed a Deus Ex Machina to transform him back into regular sucky Ichigo. Ichigo is strong and impressive I know, but I hate his personality - I only envy his power;)

Halibel vs Ichigonator = Halibel getting Bleached.

Ichigo's problem is that he's retarded beyond the believable, because of his "I fight to protect my nakama" bullshit and the "To win in I have to stand in equal grounds" crap. He even went to the extent of asking Ulquiorra to be cut down in order to continue their fights on equal grounds. Ichigo has only one big flaw: he's BORING! :D
For this reason many people, me included, like Shirosaki's and Ichigonator's madness!!!
You can't predict what he will do, what he will attack, what the consequences will be and so on. I was so thrilled when Ichigonator was around: Ichigo came back and the boredom started again! :D


Halibaby better turn it into a sexual battle if she wants to win or else she'll get torn apart for the fun of it. For as impressive as Ichigo was, I think halibel stands a chance as they both seem to be sword fighters.
Do you mean Ichigo or Ichigonator?
Normal vaizard gundam Ichigo (getsugaaaaa tenshoooo!) won't stand a chance, that's a given! :D

choke_a_beech
May 16, 2009, 05:52 AM
ichigo does have a crappy mentality. "i will protect my friends!" can't you do that whilst administering an ass whooping?

drakend
May 16, 2009, 06:00 AM
ichigo does have a crappy mentality. "i will protect my friends!" can't you do that whilst administering an ass whooping?
NO! Because the fight must be "fair"! :D

choke_a_beech
May 16, 2009, 06:07 AM
nnoitora should have split that ginger head in half when he had the chance

Starzen
May 16, 2009, 07:13 AM
I meant ichigonator based on the skills that both ichigo and shiro have shown so far, as lets face it, the only skill we saw was a cero. Ichigo needs to be the way he is because he is a protector.

poobert
May 16, 2009, 08:11 AM
Can't say for sure because Halibel's power is unknown. If the step of power between Uli and Halibel is the same as Nnoi and Uli, then it would be a very close fight.

If the step of power between Halibel and Uli is like Nnoi and Grimjaw, then Ichi will wipe the floor with her.

drakend
May 16, 2009, 10:09 AM
I meant ichigonator based on the skills that both ichigo and shiro have shown so far, as lets face it, the only skill we saw was a cero. Ichigo needs to be the way he is because he is a protector.
Sonido and fast regeneration too... ;)

Onomatopoeia
May 16, 2009, 10:13 AM
Ichigonater should take it comfortably based on how easily he was raping Ulqui and since we have yet to see a huge difference in power between the two(yet) I don't see any reason to assume that the same won't happen.

Though Halibel still has more to show(probably).

mestizo311
May 16, 2009, 10:38 AM
Well, seeing how Ichigonator just man handled Ulquiorra, I'd say that Halibel would get the same treatment. Even though we haven't seen the full extent of her power, we can say the same for Ichigonator. But given how easy Ichigonator made Ulquiorra's ass whipping look, I don't see him having any trouble getting past her. If he can regenerate himself like he did recently, even more reason to fear Ichigonator.

Doombot
May 16, 2009, 10:41 AM
Well, seeing how Ichigonator just man handled Ulquiorra, I'd say that Halibel would get the same treatment. Even though we haven't seen the full extent of her power, we can say the same for Ichigonator. But given how easy Ichigonator made Ulquiorra's ass whipping look, I don't see him having any trouble getting past her. If he can regenerate himself like he did recently, even more reason to fear Ichigonator.

I don't see how this can be debated yet. Just because Ulq got beat up (and still beat Ichigo) means that Halibel would do the same thing. The jumps have been pretty large with the Espada with each rank. I'm going to say it would be a close battle. I'm going to say Halibel? Why? I like her rack. People might cry but no one has any proof as to why Hollow Ichigo would win since we haven't seen either of their full strengths.

Have I said how bad a term 'Ichigonator' is? It actually lessens the form. If you want to call him something special.. get a better term.

drakend
May 16, 2009, 11:01 AM
Have I said how bad a term 'Ichigonator' is? It actually lessens the form. If you want to call him something special.. get a better term.
Yeah you've already told me you don't like the term. Well I think it fits Hollow Ichigo with primal istincts: people love it because it reflects how well that thing terminated Ulquiorra!
If you don't like it don't use it! ;)

Regarding Halibel... there is something strange happening in her fight against Hitsugaya. They're much closer in strength than Ulquiorra stage 1 vs vaizard Ichigo: the latter fight was an utter ownage, while Halibel vs Hitsugaya is not.
I think this shows two things:
1) Hitsugaya is far stronger than we thought
2) The gap between Ulquiorra stage 1 and Halibel released is very tiny.

Doombot
May 16, 2009, 11:09 AM
Yeah you've already told me you don't like the term. Well I think it fits Hollow Ichigo with primal istincts: people love it because it reflects how well that thing terminated Ulquiorra!
If you don't like it don't use it! ;)

Regarding Halibel... there is something strange happening in her fight against Hitsugaya. They're much closer in strength than Ulquiorra stage 1 vs vaizard Ichigo: the latter fight was an utter ownage, while Halibel vs Hitsugaya is not.
I think this shows two things:
1) Hitsugaya is far stronger than we thought
2) The gap between Ulquiorra stage 1 and Halibel released is very tiny.

No. You're using logic when a fight with Hitsu is taking place. There is your first problem.

drakend
May 16, 2009, 11:28 AM
No. You're using logic when a fight with Hitsu is taking place. There is your first problem.
Uhm no I'm using eyes... and I see the power gap between Halibel and Hitsugaya isn't there, while between Ulquiorra stage 1 and Ichigo was immediately visible.
I'm referring to what we've read so far, of course: next chapter Halibel may one-shot-kill Hitsugaya and all of these considerations would go to hell. Anyway at present released Halibel and Hitsugaya are pretty even, imho. Of course there could be another alternative to the two options I posted above: Ulquiorra was the strongest Espada and for some reason was put 4th... his double release resembles the shikai/bankai captains' theme, so it could be possible. If it's like that then Halibel would suffer an even uglier fate than Ulquiorra.

Doombot
May 16, 2009, 11:32 AM
Uhm no I'm using eyes... and I see the power gap between Halibel and Hitsugaya isn't there, while between Ulquiorra stage 1 and Ichigo was immediately visible.
I'm referring to what we've read so far, of course: next chapter Halibel may one-shot-kill Hitsugaya and all of these considerations would go to hell. Anyway at present released Halibel and Hitsugaya are pretty even, imho. Of course there could be another alternative to the two options I posted above: Ulquiorra was the strongest Espada and for some reason was put 4th... his double release resembles the shikai/bankai captains' theme, so it could be possible. If it's like that then Halibel would suffer an even uglier fate than Ulquiorra.

I doubt it. Ulq wasn't the strongest Espada. Actually he wasn't all that strong after all. I'm saying you can't use logic in a Hitsu fight because his "Star" power allows him to defeat people miles ahead of him. I don't really see how Halibel and Hitsu are even. She isn't remotely trying. Like I said. Hollow Ichigo had all his chapters and time to shine against Ulq and still got his horn cut (yeah yeah interference I know but if he was SO miles ahead of Ulq he would have still reacted faster.)

Give Halibel time to show what she can do before making judgments.

drakend
May 16, 2009, 12:12 PM
I doubt it. Ulq wasn't the strongest Espada. Actually he wasn't all that strong after all. I'm saying you can't use logic in a Hitsu fight because his "Star" power allows him to defeat people miles ahead of him. I don't really see how Halibel and Hitsu are even. She isn't remotely trying. Like I said. Hollow Ichigo had all his chapters and time to shine against Ulq and still got his horn cut (yeah yeah interference I know but if he was SO miles ahead of Ulq he would have still reacted faster.)

Give Halibel time to show what she can do before making judgments.
Hitsugaya almost sliced her... I wouldn't say she isn't even remotely trying!
Anyway don't misundersand me: I hope Hitsugaya get cut in half next chapter! I can't stand that character and he's way too hyped imho.
Anyway even if Hitsugaya will lose it won't change much, because Ichigonator was totally superior to Ulquiorra. You wrote he could have reacted faster but you're unfair... in that state Ichigo was in a kind of coma so he didn't understand well what was happening around him. He even tried to evade Ulquiorra, because he was absorbed by Ishida and his primal istincts to protect Inoue.

Doombot
May 16, 2009, 12:19 PM
Hitsugaya almost sliced her... I wouldn't say she isn't even remotely trying!
Anyway don't misundersand me: I hope Hitsugaya get cut in half next chapter! I can't stand that character and he's way too hyped imho.
Anyway even if Hitsugaya will lose it won't change much, because Ichigonator was totally superior to Ulquiorra. You wrote he could have reacted faster but you're unfair... in that state Ichigo was in a kind of coma so he didn't understand well what was happening around him. He even tried to evade Ulquiorra, because he was absorbed by Ishida and his primal istincts to protect Inoue.

Lol. The case for Hitsu MISSING Halible but making her dodge is the same case for Ichigo getting hit by Ulq and removing his horn. EXACTA the same.

poobert
May 16, 2009, 12:33 PM
Hitsugaya almost sliced her... I wouldn't say she isn't even remotely trying!

Halibel DID slice Hitsu. It was just his cheap icy trick that saved his life.

Halibel has done what? Waved her arm and chopped (fake) hitsu in half. Dodged an attack that would have killed most people and pushed hitsu back without doing anything. She chucked water at hitsu almost nonchalantly and now hitsu is so scared he refuses to get in to close combat.

All I see is hitsu trying hard and halibel pissing around.

ganjabuss
May 16, 2009, 01:36 PM
halibel loses...no questions asked...now if halibel has another release to go then it might be a fight[still ichigo wins]...otherwise...ichigonator will wipe the floor with her...

ichigo's powers are condenced in small form...hollow powers in mask...shinigami powers in a single long blade.....even if opponent's shinigami powers are on the same lvl as him...ichigo has advantage of speed...
and for hollow powers...arrancars have to maintain hollow forms...which i believe is more power consuming than the vaizards...so vaizards have advantage automatically...

drakend
May 16, 2009, 02:03 PM
Lol. The case for Hitsu MISSING Halible but making her dodge is the same case for Ichigo getting hit by Ulq and removing his horn. EXACTA the same.
Uhm I wrote wrong: I meant Ichigonator didn't even try to evade Ulquiorra. So this can't be the same: Halibel sliced Hitsugaya, too bad she didn't even realize it was a replica! :D
So Hitsugaya is strong, it has already been proven. If he's strong enough to defeat Halibel is another story.
Don't keep mentioning Ulquiorra cutting Ichigonator's horn trying to nerf him: he was in a comatose state and he didn't even try avoiding the hit. What broke Ichigonator's mask wasn't the sliced horn, but the cero exploding point blank on his face!


Halibel DID slice Hitsu. It was just his cheap icy trick that saved his life.

Cheap or not Halibel didn't even realize that... so Hitsugaya cannot be that weak. Not to mention that she barely evaded Hitsugaya's attack.

Doombot
May 16, 2009, 02:15 PM
Uhm I wrote wrong: I meant Ichigonator didn't even try to evade Ulquiorra. So this can't be the same: Halibel sliced Hitsugaya, too bad she didn't even realize it was a replica! :D
So Hitsugaya is strong, it has already been proven. If he's strong enough to defeat Halibel is another story.
Don't keep mentioning Ulquiorra cutting Ichigonator's horn trying to nerf him: he was in a comatose state and he didn't even try avoiding the hit. What broke Ichigonator's mask wasn't the sliced horn, but the cero exploding point blank on his face!


Cheap or not Halibel didn't even realize that... so Hitsugaya cannot be that weak. Not to mention that she barely evaded Hitsugaya's attack.

Exacta. Halibel dodged Hitsu's attack AND Ichigo didn't dodge Ulq's. Ulq was torn in half and at the moment I think were would agree in that state probably wouldn't be affective as a full powered Hitsu. We are comparing the state Ichigo was in to Halibel are we not? You say well he was in a trance? Yes he was but that is THE ONLY account we have of that form. So in my logic.

Instinct Trance Ichigo vs. Released Halibel

Halibel screwed up but then was smart enough to melt his ice with heated water. I will give her credit for a brilliant move. This allows me to believe that she isn't just the giant boob idiot that I was thinking she was. This will all be told on how her battle plays out with Hitsu and she might have even ended it with her last attack.

To make outrageous claims like Ichigo moping the floor with her... those are based in nothing. So if people think that this will be a lopsided victory for Ichigo I think that Halibel would smack him around with little effort. After all... you can't prove me wrong.

drakend
May 16, 2009, 02:58 PM
@DoomBot
If Ichigonator wouldn't have been distracted by Ishida's crap he would have behaded Ulquiorra with his sword. After Ichigonator appeared it wasn't a fight anymore... it was a royal ownage on Ichigonator's part. I don't see Halibel vs Hitsugaya with a wide power gap... Ulquiorra stage 1 dominated Ichigo much better. Setting aside Ulquiorra being a vastroode or not, I think Halibel isn't that much stronger of Ulquiorra, like Ulquiorra was with Nnoitra.

Doombot
May 16, 2009, 03:01 PM
@DoomBot
If Ichigonator wouldn't have been distracted by Ishida's crap he would have behaded Ulquiorra with his sword. After Ichigonator appeared it wasn't a fight anymore... it was a royal ownage on Ichigonator's part. I don't see Halibel vs Hitsugaya with a wide power gap... Ulquiorra stage 1 dominated Ichigo much better. Setting aside Ulquiorra being a vastroode or not, I think Halibel isn't that much stronger of Ulquiorra, like Ulquiorra was with Nnoitra.

You're taking Ulq at his full strength where Halibel is NO WHERE shown at her limit yet. Like I said. You should have made this post after more information on her. Right now it's like comparing a completed painting with one half finished.

drakend
May 16, 2009, 03:26 PM
You're taking Ulq at his full strength where Halibel is NO WHERE shown at her limit yet. Like I said. You should have made this post after more information on her. Right now it's like comparing a completed painting with one half finished.
Read my previous posts Doombot... I only said the power gap isn't that huge, between Halibel and Hitsugaya. I even wrote that I'm referring to what has been written so far: it's obivous btw, isn't it? :)

Chaoswind
May 16, 2009, 05:03 PM
The Power Gap is not wide because we are talking about Hitsu shit -_-

If Kubo wants to live (and sell a lot!!!) Hitsu needs to either WIN or get OWNED slowly.

Financially it would be a mistake to make Halibel OWN hitsugay the same way Ulqui owned Ichigo.

And even if it is a PAIN in the ass, I do understand this.

So really I agree with Doombot, this match is stupid -_-

I mean, for all we know Ichigonator may confuse Halibel with Orihime and don't even attack her >_>


KEYWORD: BOOBS

Doombot
May 16, 2009, 05:27 PM
The Power Gap is not wide because we are talking about Hitsu shit -_-

If Kubo wants to live (and sell a lot!!!) Hitsu needs to either WIN or get OWNED slowly.

Financially it would be a mistake to make Halibel OWN hitsugay the same way Ulqui owned Ichigo.

And even if it is a PAIN in the ass, I do understand this.

So really I agree with Doombot, this match is stupid -_-

I mean, for all we know Ichigonator may confuse Halibel with Orihime and don't even attack her >_>


KEYWORD: BOOBS

True. Hitsu can't get owned because he'll DIE and be gone for good. If Ichigo dies... his hollow just takes over and heals him. So he can be killed (and has been twice by Ulq)

Chaoswind
May 16, 2009, 05:48 PM
So true

Ichigo is about to die? Hollow Ichigo saves the day, or Haxhime for that matter.

Hitsugay is about to die? is just a mirror image, BUT don't worry he still SUCKS.

LordZet
May 16, 2009, 05:59 PM
Considering he curb stomped ulq I'd say he wins. Halibel may be stronger but not by that much.

kkck
May 16, 2009, 06:34 PM
The sheer amount of destructive power and speed ichigo's hollow form showed would seem to be much more than what halibel can handle. IMO what halibel has shown so far in terms of speed and power don't even come close to compare to what ichigo pulled off in hollow form.

Seriously, ichigo's hollow form sheer destructive power proved to be capable of causing damage comparable in size to las noches and we all know las noches is big enough to hold several gargantuan structures. Not to mention ichigo's hollow form actually also held back ulquiorras best attack with just one hand and did not suffer a single scratch from it.

I know halibel is 1 rank above ulquiorra(although as some of you know I have my own reasons to question whether halibel was actually stronger than ulquiorra) but ichigo's hollow form showed to be more than a few levels above ulquiorra. Seriously, for hollow ichigo ulquiorra was easier than a walk in the park. I honestly don't think halibel (or any other espada for that matter) could actually win against ichigo's hollow form.

Chaoswind
May 16, 2009, 07:10 PM
and YET you miss the point again...

This is JUST like that Stark vs Aizen thread...

Aizen can MIND FUCK YOU, and handle lvl 90 hados with ease, but we know NOTHING of Stark other than his rank and Ultra speed... Halibel hasn't show much not because she is weak, but because she is fighting Hitsugay... If Kubo doesn't handle the fight "well" and I mean well in the eyes of the Hitsu fans then he may end dead, and his manga UNFINISHED foreva!!

I am well aware that Hollow Ichigo COULD very well RAPE Halibel (in more than a way), but the opposite can be said because we don't know many of her abillities... what if she can sing like a mermaid and MIND RAPE YOU!!! then Hollow Ichigo loses... end of threat...

kkck
May 16, 2009, 07:26 PM
and YET you miss the point again...

This is JUST like that Stark vs Aizen thread...

Aizen can MIND FUCK YOU, and handle lvl 90 hados with ease, but we know NOTHING of Stark other than his rank and Ultra speed... Halibel hasn't show much not because she is weak, but because she is fighting Hitsugay... If Kubo doesn't handle the fight "well" and I mean well in the eyes of the Hitsu fans then he may end dead, and his manga UNFINISHED foreva!!

I am well aware that Hollow Ichigo COULD very well RAPE Halibel (in more than a way), but the opposite can be said because we don't know many of her abillities... what if she can sing like a mermaid and MIND RAPE YOU!!! then Hollow Ichigo loses... end of thread...

Whats your point? I am well aware that we have yet to see what halibel is capable of, I merely go with what we have ATM. What you wrote tells me one out of two things:

1.- You do not what people to go against halibel
2.- You do not want people to post here altogether considering we don't know all that much about ichigo's hollow form or halibel. Technically speaking, with your logic you should respond to everyone who takes a side with a post like that.

Chaoswind
May 16, 2009, 08:16 PM
LOL :P

Typed end of Thread, when I meant Threat >_>

anyway, yeah I know, but I don't like to bet unless I know I will win, in with case is no longer a bet, you can keep saying Hollow Ichigo can rape Halibel, but you should be aware that the opposite can be true as well :P

drakend
May 16, 2009, 11:46 PM
I mean, for all we know Ichigonator may confuse Halibel with Orihime and don't even attack her >_>


KEYWORD: BOOBS
You should read the manga better: Ichigonator thrown away Inoue and stabbed Ishida, so he doesn't know who his friends or foes are... the name Ichigonator came from this too, after all! :D

As a general note...
Anyway we're going off-topic, so what about talking about the hypotetical match only?

PS If you think it's stupid you can always ignore the thread... :D

kkck
May 17, 2009, 03:53 AM
LOL :P

Typed end of Thread, when I meant Threat >_>

anyway, yeah I know, but I don't like to bet unless I know I will win, in with case is no longer a bet, you can keep saying Hollow Ichigo can rape Halibel, but you should be aware that the opposite can be true as well :P

I did not say I was flawless in my statement, I am well aware I could be wrong. I have never said I otherwise. I simply posted my opinion based on how I interpreted what little we know.

Chaoswind
May 17, 2009, 08:58 AM
Ishida doesn't have boobs

and he didn't stab Orihime :P

anyway, based on what we know, I do agree Hollow Ichigo, could beat Halibel, but I am not going to bet on it

Xanathos
May 25, 2009, 11:03 AM
Suggestion: Why don't we call him Ichigo H2 (hollow form 2)

I think Ichigonator would take this. He was leagues ahead of Ulquiorra! He could literally baby shake Ulquiorra if he wanted to. I doubt the strength gap between espada 3 and 4 is that big.

drakend
May 25, 2009, 11:17 AM
Suggestion: Why don't we call him Ichigo H2 (hollow form 2)

I think Ichigonator would take this. He was leagues ahead of Ulquiorra! He could literally baby shake Ulquiorra if he wanted to. I doubt the strength gap between espada 3 and 4 is that big.
I'm surprised there is so much resistance in using Ichigonator as name... I think it's very adequate to the situation: it gives out the idea of something appearing and terminating evreything which stands in the way! :D

Raizen
June 03, 2009, 12:45 AM
Ichigo hollow is crazy strong without a doubt. His ownage of ulqui was almost too hard to watch. I say he would win against halibel. But I wouldn't go so far as to say he could beat any espada. Stark is number 1 for a reason. Moreover, if u want to compare feat, ichi needed mask and bankai to deal with unreleased ulqui, while shunsui is handling unreleased stark who is 3 level higher than ulqui without releasing his sword.

Doombot
June 03, 2009, 01:09 AM
I'm surprised there is so much resistance in using Ichigonator as name... I think it's very adequate to the situation: it gives out the idea of something appearing and terminating evreything which stands in the way! :D

It's a pretty horrible name. Ichigo would win because he's the main character and Harribel is an Espada and isn't allowed to win. The End.

Chaoswind
June 03, 2009, 07:01 AM
Actually

Hollow Ichigo would RAPE her in a fight (if that is everything halibel had to offer), and Halibel would fall in love with him.

Ichigo has the Harem lead factor, just analyze his personality O.O

So YEAH, Hollow Ichigo kills/assimilates Ichigo and gets himself a big boobed Harem (Orihime, Nel, and Halibel)

jaymizzo
June 03, 2009, 07:40 AM
Exacta. Halibel dodged Hitsu's attack AND Ichigo didn't dodge Ulq's. Ulq was torn in half and at the moment I think were would agree in that state probably wouldn't be affective as a full powered Hitsu. We are comparing the state Ichigo was in to Halibel are we not? You say well he was in a trance? Yes he was but that is THE ONLY account we have of that form. So in my logic.

Instinct Trance Ichigo vs. Released Halibel

Halibel screwed up but then was smart enough to melt his ice with heated water. I will give her credit for a brilliant move. This allows me to believe that she isn't just the giant boob idiot that I was thinking she was. This will all be told on how her battle plays out with Hitsu and she might have even ended it with her last attack.

To make outrageous claims like Ichigo moping the floor with her... those are based in nothing. So if people think that this will be a lopsided victory for Ichigo I think that Halibel would smack him around with little effort. After all... you can't prove me wrong.

are u stupid or is it just me? (sorry for calling u stupid)
ichigonator was charging a cero to blow away ishida, and a corpse from nowhere suprise attacks him... he was really ment to dodge tht..
fact is.. ichigonator wil pwn Halibel.. no argument, i can only see him on par with stark releases. but and other espada will get pwned... for all we know ichigonator has only displayed a cero and sonido and halibel has spammed some attacks and still hasnt killed hitsugaya

so if ichigonator was spamming loads of attacks, i dont think even stark would stand a chance in t
he long run
i also think ulquiorra could hav been the strongest espada.. the numbering system is fuked up

Xanathos
June 03, 2009, 09:17 AM
are u stupid or is it just me? (sorry for calling u stupid)
ichigonator was charging a cero to blow away ishida, and a corpse from nowhere suprise attacks him... he was really ment to dodge tht..
fact is.. ichigonator wil pwn Halibel.. no argument, i can only see him on par with stark releases. but and other espada will get pwned... for all we know ichigonator has only displayed a cero and sonido and halibel has spammed some attacks and still hasnt killed hitsugaya

so if ichigonator was spamming loads of attacks, i dont think even stark would stand a chance in t
he long run
i also think ulquiorra could hav been the strongest espada.. the numbering system is fuked up

I think ulqs second release made him stronger than hali, but most prolly not stronger than barragan and definitely not stronger than stark. I agree with the rest of your post about ichigonator, except for the bit in which you called the other guy stupid.:P

Raizen
June 03, 2009, 08:37 PM
are u stupid or is it just me? (sorry for calling u stupid)
ichigonator was charging a cero to blow away ishida, and a corpse from nowhere suprise attacks him... he was really ment to dodge tht..
fact is.. ichigonator wil pwn Halibel.. no argument, i can only see him on par with stark releases. but and other espada will get pwned... for all we know ichigonator has only displayed a cero and sonido and halibel has spammed some attacks and still hasnt killed hitsugaya

so if ichigonator was spamming loads of attacks, i dont think even stark would stand a chance in t
he long run
i also think ulquiorra could hav been the strongest espada.. the numbering system is fuked up
1- I don't think ulqui is the strongest. As he stated, his second form makes it so that he focuses on regeneration.
2- Yes hollow ichi is strong, but don't go saying he could beat starks or anyone w/o us seeing exactly what they can do. Halibel is strong physically when she slashed hitsu in half in a second, but in long combat, she is not that good.
Also, we really shouldn't say halibel is pathetic b/c she can't beat hitsu. the thing is her powers are completely negated by hitsu.

jaymizzo
June 03, 2009, 09:00 PM
1- I don't think ulqui is the strongest. As he stated, his second form makes it so that he focuses on regeneration.
2- Yes hollow ichi is strong, but don't go saying he could beat starks or anyone w/o us seeing exactly what they can do. Halibel is strong physically when she slashed hitsu in half in a second, but in long combat, she is not that good.
Also, we really shouldn't say halibel is pathetic b/c she can't beat hitsu. the thing is her powers are completely negated by hitsu.

if ichigonator can easily wipe the flour with a second released espada, without a sweat.. i dont think the second and third would stand a chance either..
dude the power differennce btn ulqi's 2nd form and ichigonator, was like comparing the earths heat (ulqi) to the Suns (ichigonator) even mercury (halibel or baragan.. (stark will loose toooo xD.. but will put up a gooood fight) cnt compare) *tht was a bad example..lol.

u get wat im saying anyway.. the power difference based on what we've seen is like heaven and earth
if u argue tht halibel hasnt shown her full potential.. Wtf.. and ichigonator has? :blink :s his jus displayed two attacks.. cero and sonido, and regeneration.. and halibel has spammed some attacks while fighting hitsugaya.. so based on the one physical attack ichigonator vs the spamming no-kill halibel.. i think its clear who wuld win in a fight if they all go all out

Raizen
June 03, 2009, 09:08 PM
if ichigonator can easily wipe the flour with a second released espada, without a sweat.. i dont think the second and third would stand a chance either..
dude the power differennce btn ulqi's 2nd form and ichigonator, was like comparing the earths heat (ulqi) to the Suns (ichigonator) even mercury (halibel or baragan.. (stark will loose toooo xD.. but will put up a gooood fight) cnt compare) *tht was a bad example..lol.

u get wat im saying anyway.. the power difference based on what we've seen is like heaven and earth
if u argue tht halibel hasnt shown her full potential.. Wtf.. and ichigonator has? :blink :s his jus displayed two attacks.. cero and sonido, and regeneration.. and halibel has spammed some attacks while fighting hitsugaya.. so based on the one physical attack ichigonator vs the spamming no-kill halibel.. i think its clear who wuld win in a fight if they all go all out
1- i like ur planet analogy
2- Ichi is strong, in brute force, but so has halibel. However, I am not saying that halibel would win. THe thing is, ulqui is not a combat person, he uses cero and powers, not strength
3- And waht has halibel shown exactly?? Her projectile won't work on ichi, but the strength she displayed on hitsu definitely would

Eddy01741
June 03, 2009, 10:20 PM
1- I don't think ulqui is the strongest. As he stated, his second form makes it so that he focuses on regeneration.

Just being nitpicky, he never said that. He said that he as a whole concentrated on regeneration over sheer power, unlike other hollows. He never said anything about his second release concentrating on regen>power, he jjust says that regen is his greatest asset where other Espada rely only on their power.

That's why I'm still not sure if Ulqui in 2nd resurrecion form is stronger or weaker than Halibel in 1st form.

Raizen
June 03, 2009, 10:39 PM
Just being nitpicky, he never said that. He said that he as a whole concentrated on regeneration over sheer power, unlike other hollows. He never said anything about his second release concentrating on regen>power, he jjust says that regen is his greatest asset where other Espada rely only on their power.

That's why I'm still not sure if Ulqui in 2nd resurrecion form is stronger or weaker than Halibel in 1st form.
Oh, my bad on the regeneration part.
However, my opinion still stands. He stated that there are 3 stronger than him, the 3 top espadas. I doubt he counted yammi since he treated yammi like trash, remember when he punched him during their invasion on earth

kkck
June 04, 2009, 12:43 AM
When ulquiorra said there were 3 espada above him, yami was still number 10, not cero. Rather than not counting him, kubo simply took advantage of a technicality. Also, ulquiorra still hadn't shown resurreccion segunda etapa to aizen so it is very possible such a thing was not even considered when the rankings were made and ulquiorra simple said his own rank as it was. Also:
http://mangahelpers.com/s/maximum7/readonline/19158/10?t=1244093786
No espada, shinigami or vizard other than hollow ichigo has even been close to something of that magnitude even once in the series. The sheer destructive power and reiatsu ulquiorra showed there was more than anything seen from any espada so far. At the moment I honestly believe ulquiorra could overwhelm the top espada, hollow ichigo should also too...

jaymizzo
June 04, 2009, 05:54 AM
1- i like ur planet analogy
2- Ichi is strong, in brute force, but so has halibel. However, I am not saying that halibel would win. THe thing is, ulqui is not a combat person, he uses cero and powers, not strength
3- And waht has halibel shown exactly?? Her projectile won't work on ichi, but the strength she displayed on hitsu definitely would


Oh, my bad on the regeneration part.
However, my opinion still stands. He stated that there are 3 stronger than him, the 3 top espadas. I doubt he counted yammi since he treated yammi like trash, remember when he punched him during their invasion on earth

thank you :)
but
ichigonator hasnt really shown what he can really do.. i mean ulquiorras second release could be compared to proly stark released.. (thts my opinion) or even baragan released..
in a fight btn ulquiorra and halibel, ulquiorra would win, if they both went all out, and if what ulquiorra said was true, whiping out segunda etapa s surely his ticket to winning..
yes he will struggle against baragan or stark.. but considering the speed ichigonator took him out.. im sure you would agree with me if.. ichigonator showd his full str at tht time he would almost definetly beat stark..
unless the segunda etapa thing abt only being unique to him is BS, then, i could see ichigonator going on par with segunda baragan or released stark.. but halibel.. noo.. i dont think he brute force is enough to work against ichigonator

Raizen
June 04, 2009, 02:43 PM
When ulquiorra said there were 3 espada above him, yami was still number 10, not cero. Rather than not counting him, kubo simply took advantage of a technicality. Also, ulquiorra still hadn't shown resurreccion segunda etapa to aizen so it is very possible such a thing was not even considered when the rankings were made and ulquiorra simple said his own rank as it was. Also:
http://mangahelpers.com/s/maximum7/readonline/19158/10?t=1244093786
No espada, shinigami or vizard other than hollow ichigo has even been close to something of that magnitude even once in the series. The sheer destructive power and reiatsu ulquiorra showed there was more than anything seen from any espada so far. At the moment I honestly believe ulquiorra could overwhelm the top espada, hollow ichigo should also too...
This post also refers to jaymizzo too

1- I doubt that yammi and aizen are the only one who knows that yammi becomes 0 after he releases. I bet all the espadas know. If that is the case, then it seems ulqui doesn;t care much about him. He relentlessly criticize him, and even punched him. Would ulqui do that to someone who is stronger than him?? No. That is why I think he included halibel when he said 3 are stronger than him. SO that means 2nd release or not, ulqui is still inferior to him

2- I am not denying that hollow ichi is powerful. Hell he pwned ulqui. I just wouldn't say that he could beat stark or even barragan for that matter until we see what they can do

kkck
June 04, 2009, 03:15 PM
This post also refers to jaymizzo too

1- I doubt that yammi and aizen are the only one who knows that yammi becomes 0 after he releases. I bet all the espadas know. If that is the case, then it seems ulqui doesn;t care much about him. He relentlessly criticize him, and even punched him. Would ulqui do that to someone who is stronger than him?? No. That is why I think he included halibel when he said 3 are stronger than him. SO that means 2nd release or not, ulqui is still inferior to him

2- I am not denying that hollow ichi is powerful. Hell he pwned ulqui. I just wouldn't say that he could beat stark or even barragan for that matter until we see what they can do


1.- It is not about knowing, it is about the technicality behind it. No matter how you look at it, when yammi is arrancar 10, he is the weakest espada and when he releases he becomes espada cero AKA top espada. So basically when ulquiorra talked about his rank, there was no cero espada, just a two digit arrancar 10. As I said, it is just a technicality.... I do not even think that the other espada were actually unaware that yami is cero espada when he releases...

2.- Fair enough. Although I do think it is very that harribel, barragan and stark will match ulquiorras power. If they do, then a single attack would be enough to blast away all of karakura considering how ulquiorra had the power to blast away las noches(much bigger than karakura) several times with just one hit.

Raizen
June 04, 2009, 03:23 PM
1.- It is not about knowing, it is about the technicality behind it. No matter how you look at it, when yammi is arrancar 10, he is the weakest espada and when he releases he becomes espada cero AKA top espada. So basically when ulquiorra talked about his rank, there was no cero espada, just a two digit arrancar 10. As I said, it is just a technicality.... I do not even think that the other espada were actually unaware that yami is cero espada when he releases...

2.- Fair enough. Although I do think it is very that harribel, barragan and stark will match ulquiorras power. If they do, then a single attack would be enough to blast away all of karakura considering how ulquiorra had the power to blast away las noches(much bigger than karakura) several times with just one hit.
1- But it still begs the question of ulqu's statement. First off, if yammi knows that the espadas are numbered 0-9, then I am sure the others do too. If so then his statement is ambiguous. ALso, I have stated this in several posts, maybe u read it, but just b.c yammi is number 0 does not mean he is the strongest. I think of him as a wild card

2- Being stronger does not mean u have to have stronger techniques. Ulqui may have a more destructive technique but still be weaker. There are other aspects, like strength, intelligence, wits, etc

kkck
June 04, 2009, 03:51 PM
1- But it still begs the question of ulqu's statement. First off, if yammi knows that the espadas are numbered 0-9, then I am sure the others do too. If so then his statement is ambiguous. ALso, I have stated this in several posts, maybe u read it, but just b.c yammi is number 0 does not mean he is the strongest. I think of him as a wild card

2- Being stronger does not mean u have to have stronger techniques. Ulqui may have a more destructive technique but still be weaker. There are other aspects, like strength, intelligence, wits, etc

1.- Even if yammi is a wild card, when he is at full power he should be the strongest. Whether this isn't the case at all times is of no importance IMO.

2.-Didn't ulquiorra showed to be vastly profficient in the aspects you mentioned? Nothing harribel or barragan have done so far actually suggests ulquiorra was inferior to them(actually it seems quite the oposite so far). I guess we have to wait and see.

jaymizzo
June 04, 2009, 04:05 PM
This post also refers to jaymizzo too

1- I doubt that yammi and aizen are the only one who knows that yammi becomes 0 after he releases. I bet all the espadas know. If that is the case, then it seems ulqui doesn;t care much about him. He relentlessly criticize him, and even punched him. Would ulqui do that to someone who is stronger than him?? No. That is why I think he included halibel when he said 3 are stronger than him. SO that means 2nd release or not, ulqui is still inferior to him

2- I am not denying that hollow ichi is powerful. Hell he pwned ulqui. I just wouldn't say that he could beat stark or even barragan for that matter until we see what they can do

Ok.. i agree tht we hav to wait..
but.. consider the time ichigonator took to finish off segunda etapa ulquiorra..
looking at how ichigonator was fightin, i would say he used even an ounce of his strength..
imagine him full powered!!
i know ur gna say, we havnt seen released stark, but currently if those two fought, they would be on parr, (as in ichigonator using the same power he used against ulqi) until they both go full force

Evil3ye
June 04, 2009, 04:16 PM
We have yet to see what Harribel really can do. Her fight is not over yet. Also it's hard to judge, because Kubo seems to spit on all ranking systems he build up before.

SO... we should better ignore all Hitsugaya done and will do, because this is not Bleach, but fanservice at that part.

As for the topic: I think Harribel and Ulquiorra were kinda same type of fighter. They do not underestimate their opponent and take it very serious.
Harribels Resurrection remindes me of Ulquiorra's 2nd Release, since they both released while dominating the fight.

Still I believe that Harribel is hiding sth so powerful that could even make her win against Ichigonator. So I've voted for her.

Onomatopoeia
June 04, 2009, 04:25 PM
3- And waht has halibel shown exactly?? Her projectile won't work on ichi, but the strength she displayed on hitsu definitely would

What strength?

Unreleased Ulqui split a boulder in half.

jaymizzo
June 05, 2009, 12:54 PM
We have yet to see what Harribel really can do. Her fight is not over yet. Also it's hard to judge, because Kubo seems to spit on all ranking systems he build up before.

SO... we should better ignore all Hitsugaya done and will do, because this is not Bleach, but fanservice at that part.

As for the topic: I think Harribel and Ulquiorra were kinda same type of fighter. They do not underestimate their opponent and take it very serious.
Harribels Resurrection remindes me of Ulquiorra's 2nd Release, since they both released while dominating the fight.

Still I believe that Harribel is hiding sth so powerful that could even make her win against Ichigonator. So I've voted for her.

have u ever considered that hitsugay is really strong?.. or hav u been underestimating him the whole time?
his zanpaktou is the strongest of its kind.. i remeber gin sayin stuff about the heavens..

i personally think halibel would loose against ulquiorra.. :L

Eddy01741
June 05, 2009, 03:03 PM
Well, maybe all the evidence we've seen before this fight points to Hitsugaya being weak, not really strong, but just weak. Struggling against a fellow captain, and getting completely played (y'know, so then Aizen could blame Hitsu for the death of Hinamori instead of himself or Gin). Getting owned by Aizen (not saying much, but it's still a defeat, it still proves that Aizen, who is proven to be really strong, is stronger than Hitsugaya). Needing bankai while limited just to hold off SHawlong (let's face it, if the limit release came 2 minutes later, Shawlong could have owned his ass, in fact, if Shawlong didn't spend some of that time discussing with Hitsu his immature bankai and all, he would have owned his ass). Failing to injure Yammi (unreleased) with his shikai (while not limited). And beating Luppi, who was only a makeshift espada, on a stroke of luck.

The only reason that I see Hitsu doing so well in this fight is that he has the mirror, and that Halibel has only been using water attacks after the mirror (I have no idea why though, if she just used her overwhelming physical force, Hitsu can't turn her attacks against her). All I've seen Hitsu do is turn Halibel's water attacks into ice, then attack halibel, then Halibel melts the ice, and attacks Hitsu, and so on and so forth until Hitsu decides to use his ice from the heavens. This will be the decisionmaker for me. If his ice from the heavens does kill Halibel, I'd move Hitsu from my personal ranking of the captains from near the bottom if not the bottom captain right now, to mid-upper captain. However, we are yet to see the results of Hitsu's ice from the heavens, so I am left with what concrete evidence I have. Said concrete evidence was stated above (getting played by gin, losing to Shawlong, etc.), and that concrete evidence points to him being weak, so for the time being, I will keep my opinion based on the concrete evidence.

Anyhow, from what we have seen now, I have to give Ichigo, especially in his super hollow form the edge. We havn't seen any particularly impressive attacks by Halibel. In fact, her most impressive attacks so far have been her physical ones, like the one she used to destroy the mirror image of Hitsugaya (I don't understand why she didn't just do that again to destroy Hitsu, rather than using water attacks that could be turned against her). Meanwhile, Super Hollow Ichigo took a lanza de relampagos, Ulqui's most powerful attack, at point blank, with the bare palm of his hand, let me show you how powerful the lanza de relampagos is:

http://image.onemanga.com/005/mangas/00000003/000156272/08.jpg

He took that in the palm of his hand, and sustained no injuries. Halibel better show us something better than just her water attacks or her odds of winning are looking grim.

Evil3ye
June 05, 2009, 03:48 PM
have u ever considered that hitsugay is really strong?.. or hav u been underestimating him the whole time?
his zanpaktou is the strongest of its kind.. i remeber gin sayin stuff about the heavens..

i personally think halibel would loose against ulquiorra.. :L

Hitsugaya 20% almost died against Released Shawlong that time.
Do you really think Harribel with 1/5 of her power would also be < Shawlong? Me not :notrust

kkck
June 05, 2009, 03:51 PM
Hitsugaya 20% almost died against Released Shawlong that time.
Do you really think Harribel with 1/5 of her power would also be < Shawlong? Me not :notrust

hey, for all we know yama with a limiter cannot fight with VC lol...

drakend
June 05, 2009, 05:11 PM
Why the fuck was the thread renamed Ichigo vs Halibel?
I meant Ichigonator vs Halibel, not Ichigo vs Halibel. :rolleyes:

TheCracker
June 05, 2009, 05:12 PM
Hitsugaya defeated Halibel
There is no way that Halibel would stand against Ichigos Bankai WITHOUT hollowmask, because Ichigo owned 2 of the middle-strong captains and Hitsugaya is weak-middle
Oh damn sorry, I'm using logic and theres no place for something trivial like that in Bleach, I forgot

-Ren Boy-
June 05, 2009, 05:45 PM
Why the fuck was the thread renamed Ichigo vs Halibel?
I meant Ichigonator vs Halibel, not Ichigo vs Halibel. :rolleyes:

The Mod, may have thought it was a spelling mistake and was trying to neaten it up

Evil3ye
June 05, 2009, 07:24 PM
hey, for all we know yama with a limiter cannot fight with VC lol...

Did you just compare Toushiro to Captain Yamamoto? :darn

Chaoswind
June 05, 2009, 08:28 PM
have u ever considered that hitsugay is really strong?.. or hav u been underestimating him the whole time?
his zanpaktou is the strongest of its kind.. i remeber gin sayin stuff about the heavens..

i personally think halibel would loose against ulquiorra.. :L

*Comes out from the deeps of HELL

IT WAS KIRA, KIRA WAS THE ONE TALKING ABOUT HITSUGAYA ZANPAKTO!!! Gin compliments NO ONE only Aizen, and he does it in a mocking sense.

Being the strongest Ice zanpakto MEANS NOTHING!!! if the only thing we can compare it to is Rukia zanpakto -_-

drakend
June 06, 2009, 02:03 AM
The Mod, may have thought it was a spelling mistake and was trying to neaten it up
Yeah, but I explained it in the very first sentence of the opening post what I meant for Ichigonator... :rolleyes:

jaymizzo
June 06, 2009, 11:25 AM
*Comes out from the deeps of HELL

IT WAS KIRA, KIRA WAS THE ONE TALKING ABOUT HITSUGAYA ZANPAKTO!!! Gin compliments NO ONE only Aizen, and he does it in a mocking sense.

Being the strongest Ice zanpakto MEANS NOTHING!!! if the only thing we can compare it to is Rukia zanpakto -_-

Gin did compliment abt hitsugaya's zanpaktou..

Franckie
June 06, 2009, 12:29 PM
Ichigo made short work of Ulq., and there's no reason to believe a large gap in power exists between #3 and #4, especially with #4 possessing two releases. Ichigo will also quickly regenerate from any wound Halibel inflicts, yet Halibel can't tank Ichigo's attacks. Ichigo wins.

Chaoswind
June 06, 2009, 04:53 PM
Gin did compliment abt hitsugaya's zanpaktou..

ANIME NON CANON SHIT doesn't count!!!

Anime makes Aizen create Illusions out of thin air, does that mean he can? NO

so Gin didn't even say:

Gin: Yo Hitsugaya
Hitsu: What?
Gin: Yar Zanpakto is shiny.

clear enough? it was that piece of SHIT called Kira the one that was almost shitting himself when Hitsugaya went Shikai.

jaymizzo
June 08, 2009, 04:08 AM
ANIME NON CANON SHIT doesn't count!!!

Anime makes Aizen create Illusions out of thin air, does that mean he can? NO

so Gin didn't even say:

Gin: Yo Hitsugaya
Hitsu: What?
Gin: Yar Zanpakto is shiny.

clear enough? it was that piece of SHIT called Kira the one that was almost shitting himself when Hitsugaya went Shikai.

erghhhh!!! dont eat me!!
damn chillout!!
if hitsugaya is soo weak as people say!! FTW his pwning halibel! :notrust WoW so much for a weakling to fight with a released espada and not die!!

kkck
June 08, 2009, 09:29 AM
Did you just compare Toushiro to Captain Yamamoto? :darn

Not really, hitsugaya with limiter was bellow VC level, the same could be true for yama while being a lot stronger than hitsu with a limiter.

neoleonhart
June 09, 2009, 04:18 PM
i like haliboob a lot. a whole lot. but after what i saw against ulqui, i do not want to c this matchup. shirosaki would massacre her. i know this statement is very far-fetched but shirosaki is an entity without fear or mercy. i think he is the definition of cruelty and i would not want want to subject haliboob to ..... him.

jaymizzo
June 09, 2009, 06:57 PM
i like haliboob a lot. a whole lot. but after what i saw against ulqui, i do not want to c this matchup. shirosaki would massacre her. i know this statement is very far-fetched but shirosaki is an entity without fear or mercy. i think he is the definition of cruelty and i would not want want to subject haliboob to ..... him.

haah! atleast someone made a clear point
Ichigonator would massacre halliboob :D .. "he is the definition of cruelty"
basicly he is a destroyer!! he kills anything in a matter of seconds :L
--------------------------------------------------------------------

All im gonna say is, if u compare brute strength ichigonator will RAPE halibel.. if u compare sheer power!! ichigonator will RAPE her even more.. if u compare heartlessnes! Ichigonator will make her look like i dunoo!! :p

Ozehro
June 10, 2009, 04:53 AM
to put it simply, I think ichigonator would be capable of challenging AIzen himself!!
so hallibel has no chance. her attacks involve water. where as ichigonator
has a cero that's pretty much an oscureas cero. no a little stronger than that.
so no chance for harribel sama...

Bolshoi Hui
June 10, 2009, 05:07 AM
to put it simply, I think ichigonator would be capable of challenging AIzen himself!!
so hallibel has no chance. her attacks involve water. where as ichigonator
has a cero that's pretty much an oscureas cero. no a little stronger than that.
so no chance for harribel sama...


In case Harribel is done already you're right though don't know about Aizen. And if she is coming back more powerful it's still uncertain who would've been the winner.

jaymizzo
June 18, 2009, 08:12 PM
In case Harribel is done already you're right though don't know about Aizen. And if she is coming back more powerful it's still uncertain who would've been the winner.

if the espada come back.. tht wud be EPIC BULL S**T

Darth Executor
June 18, 2009, 08:47 PM
Hitsugaya defeated Halibel
There is no way that Halibel would stand against Ichigos Bankai WITHOUT hollowmask, because Ichigo owned 2 of the middle-strong captains and Hitsugaya is weak-middle
Oh damn sorry, I'm using logic and theres no place for something trivial like that in Bleach, I forgot

Please. You're not using any logic whatsoever. Hitsu is stronger than byakuya (who, by the way, was kicking ichigo's ass until shirosaki came out) and kenpachi lost a fight against shikai ichigo so don't even bring up the shawlong fight. ichigo didn't "own" either one anyway. He barely won. Hitsu took out the 6th espada in one shot. ichigo barely beat the other 6th espada. Ichigo got his ass kicked by the 4th espada. even if hallibel is still alive, hitsu still performed better in his fight against the 3rd than ichigo did in the fight against the 4th. and no, you don't get to downgrade hallibel's power just because you irrationally think hitsugaya's weak. hallibel is stronger than ulquiorra. it's canon.

En Yang Ji
June 18, 2009, 09:08 PM
Please. You're not using any logic whatsoever. Hitsu is stronger than byakuya (who, by the way, was kicking ichigo's ass until shirosaki came out) and kenpachi lost a fight against shikai ichigo so don't even bring up the shawlong fight. ichigo didn't "own" either one anyway. He barely won. Hitsu took out the 6th espada in one shot. ichigo barely beat the other 6th espada. Ichigo got his ass kicked by the 4th espada. even if hallibel is still alive, hitsu still performed better in his fight against the 3rd than ichigo did in the fight against the 4th. and no, you don't get to downgrade hallibel's power just because you irrationally think hitsugaya's weak. hallibel is stronger than ulquiorra. it's canon.

- Kenpachi strength probably just grew after the fight with Ichigo.

- Luppi was a lot weaker than Grimmjaw. Grimmjaw easily took out Luppi with a cero. Also Luppi could have possibly beat Hitsugaya if he kept attacking him. If Hitsu fought Grimmjaw the outcome would have been a lot different from his battle with Luppi.

- Ichigo may have lost badly against Ulquiorra in his first release, but that doesn't mean Hitsu is stronger than Ichigo. Ulquiorra overwhelmed Ichigo with his speed and power. Halibel on the other hand is fighting Hitsu long range. Also because of the match up Hitsu can nullify her attacks. So far Halibel hasn't taken any visible damage from Hitsu.

- What makes you think Hitsu is stronger than Byakuya?

Ozehro
June 18, 2009, 09:11 PM
Please. You're not using any logic whatsoever. Hitsu is stronger than byakuya (who, by the way, was kicking ichigo's ass until shirosaki came out) and kenpachi lost a fight against shikai ichigo so don't even bring up the shawlong fight. ichigo didn't "own" either one anyway. He barely won. Hitsu took out the 6th espada in one shot. ichigo barely beat the other 6th espada. Ichigo got his ass kicked by the 4th espada. even if hallibel is still alive, hitsu still performed better in his fight against the 3rd than ichigo did in the fight against the 4th. and no, you don't get to downgrade hallibel's power just because you irrationally think hitsugaya's weak. hallibel is stronger than ulquiorra. it's canon.

you are ignoring the difference between luppi and grimmjow.
grimmjow killed luppi effortlessly! and Hitsu actually struggled against
Luppi since he had to rely on such an elaborate move to disable luppi.
had hitsu been a few seconds late then Rangiku would have been
pierced to death! so had hitsu fought grimmjow, it would have been much more difficult for him.

however it's clear that Ulq's R1 and Harribels R1 aren't that far apart
in terms of power since Hitsu manage to be on top using elemental advantage.

Revolation
June 18, 2009, 10:07 PM
Not really, hitsugaya with limiter was bellow VC level, the same could be true for yama while being a lot stronger than hitsu with a limiter.

oh please :eyeroll


yamma's bankai might as well be a freakin supernova :D

how can aizen beat him if he can't touch him? hypnosis or not.

wait with hypnosis, all aizen has to do is make yama have alzheimer's
[hr]

you are ignoring the difference between luppi and grimmjow.
grimmjow killed luppi effortlessly! and Hitsu actually struggled against
Luppi since he had to rely on such an elaborate move to disable luppi.
had hitsu been a few seconds late then Rangiku would have been
pierced to death! so had hitsu fought grimmjow, it would have been much more difficult for him.

however it's clear that Ulq's R1 and Harribels R1 aren't that far apart
in terms of power since Hitsu manage to be on top using elemental advantage.


everything you just said.

finnaly somebody realises this

As for the hitsu-luppi fight, I don't think we should take it so seriously. So hitsu had to use a new move for luupi? Maybe kubo wanted to show a new move.
We all know that almost anybody can beat almost anybody under the right circumstances. Any fight in bleach is just showing the circumstance of one fight, not that they or ichigo for example is inherently superior to byakuya. I mean its not as if beating byakuya means ichigo will never be caught off guard or beaten again. He was caught off guard and beaten a number of time by basiccaly everyone after all, and that was with substantial help.

drakend
June 19, 2009, 05:35 AM
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
Why have I to read the name Hitsugaya in this thread?
When in the hell is he mentioned? Why do you talk about the icy kiddo even here?!? Please don't make the mods closing the thread because you made it becoming a flaming war between Hitsugaya's worshippers and evreyone else: THANKS!

Eddy01741
June 19, 2009, 06:42 AM
Please. Hitsu is stronger than byakuya
:gigglebunny:gigglebunny:gigglebunny:gigglebunny:gigglebunny:gigglebunny:gigglebunny:gigglebunny:gigglebunny

Your not serious, are you? Oh wait, you are. Which makes it even funnier :rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl

Please, show us one piece of evidence pointing towards Hitsu> Byakuya, then I'll stop rofling and start loling (which ain't as bad).

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Anyhow, Ichigonator defeated Segunda Etapa Ulquiorra effortlessly. His speed was faster, his cero was stronger, his reiatsu was stronger (he stopped a lanza point blank), I mean, it was David vs. Goliath (except Goliath won of course), I don't see Ichigonator falling to the water attacks that Halibel had, nor her weakass cero, nor her physical attacks (which whilst strong, I don't think can compare to Ichigonator).

jaymizzo
June 19, 2009, 11:20 AM
:gigglebunny:gigglebunny:gigglebunny:gigglebunny:gigglebunny:gigglebunny:gigglebunny:gigglebunny:gigglebunny

Your not serious, are you? Oh wait, you are. Which makes it even funnier :rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl

Please, show us one piece of evidence pointing towards Hitsu> Byakuya, then I'll stop rofling and start loling (which ain't as bad).

_________________________________________________

Anyhow, Ichigonator defeated Segunda Etapa Ulquiorra effortlessly. His speed was faster, his cero was stronger, his reiatsu was stronger (he stopped a lanza point blank), I mean, it was David vs. Goliath (except Goliath won of course), I don't see Ichigonator falling to the water attacks that Halibel had, nor her weakass cero, nor her physical attacks (which whilst strong, I don't think can compare to Ichigonator).

please show us a piece of evidence that says otherwise :notrust
dont rofl while u dont hav evidence either!!

i like the fact tht u say tht ichigonator will assrape halibel

Eddy01741
June 19, 2009, 11:27 AM
Funny thing is, I don't claim Byakuya is stronger than Hitsu, I'm just saying that you can't claim that Hitsu is stronger than Byakuya. Which instantly makes your argument void.

You can't make a case for me being wrong if I don't take side.

We have NOTHING to suggest that Hitsu>Byakuya, and there is some considerable evidence to suggest Hitsu<Byakuya (well, let's see, his shikai couldn't harm Yammi whatsoever (when Yammi was still #10, unreleased and all), oh, and he won his fight vs. Luppi, who can't be considered espada level, on a stroke of luck (well, Luppi's stupidity).

I'm not saying that Byakuya>Hitsu. Byakuya has had far greater feats than Hitsu up until the Halibel fight though, assuming Halibel is dead and all.

jaymizzo
June 20, 2009, 09:23 AM
Funny thing is, I don't claim Byakuya is stronger than Hitsu, I'm just saying that you can't claim that Hitsu is stronger than Byakuya. Which instantly makes your argument void.

You can't make a case for me being wrong if I don't take side.

We have NOTHING to suggest that Hitsu>Byakuya, and there is some considerable evidence to suggest Hitsu<Byakuya (well, let's see, his shikai couldn't harm Yammi whatsoever (when Yammi was still #10, unreleased and all), oh, and he won his fight vs. Luppi, who can't be considered espada level, on a stroke of luck (well, Luppi's stupidity).

I'm not saying that Byakuya>Hitsu. Byakuya has had far greater feats than Hitsu up until the Halibel fight though, assuming Halibel is dead and all.

what feats does he have over Hitsugaya?
HITSUGAYA!!
1) fought 3 espada and one arrancar! (well 2 espada )
2) ass raped shawlong and currently (assuming) killed the 3rd espada
3) his powers suprised even the 1st espada, making him question whose bankai is stronger!!

BYAKUYA!
1) fought one espada!!

im not sayin tht hitsugaya > byakuya, or tht byakuya > hitsugaya.. im jus saying, if we count feats, then hitsugaya would win!!

all im saying is
ICHIGONATOR IS GOD
ICHIGONATOR > EVERYONE IN BLEACH!!

Eddy01741
June 20, 2009, 09:37 AM
You can't compare quantity of feats though. Like his "fight" vs. Yammi, he used one shikai ice attack,and Yammi just brushed it off like it was nothing.

All I'm saying, is that the only impressive feat that Hitsu has is beating Halibel. I don't consider the following impressive feats: Getting toyed by Gin, getting destroyed by Aizen, defeating Shawlong, defeating Luppi (which I may add, was semi-conditional), and having his attack brushed off by Yammi.

If Hitsu does indeed end up beating Halibel (myself and many others around here don't believe that Halibel and Barragan are done for yet, because those would be more half-assed espada fights than those of Aaroniero and Zommari), then yes, that would be a very impressive feat indeed.

Byakuya has beating bankai ichigo (pre-shirosaki intervention of course) and effortlessly defeating Zommari on his side.

So let's sum up what we know:

Shawlong/Luppi/Possibly Halibel<Hitsu<Aizen
Bankai Ichigo/Zommari<Byakuya<Shirosaki (who I might add, is not the same as vizard Ichigo, maybe in the strength of attacks, but not fighting style and whatnot).

That's our very general knowledge of Byakuya and Hitsu's powers. And since Aizen>Zommari+Bankai Ichigo, and since Shirosaki (not to mention just Bankai Ichigo)>Shawlong/Luppi, we have no idea which the two are stronger. Their possible power range overlaps obviously, as indicated.

I'm just saying, Darth Executor shouldn't assert that Hitsu>Byakuya, when we have no evidence to approve of that claim.