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MangaHelpers
September 23, 2009, 02:53 PM
This is a continuation thread, the old thread is 32466

Gold Knight
September 23, 2009, 02:53 PM
Ahoy!

Think of this as the 'Hang Out' version of an One Piece discussion thread. In here you can randomly talk about practically anything involving the One Piece universe. Anything that comes to mind that you don't really feel like starting a thread about in the Tree of Knowledge.

We have similar threads for the Naruto and Bleach forums so I thought it'd be a good time to have one here as well. Enjoy!

Just a little set of rules to help us keep the place tidy:

No current week's spoilers! Spoiler rules and the weekend's rule are also valid in here. Discussion on the latest week's spoilers and chapters are not allowed until Monday of the following week.

No heated arguments! This is supposed to be a place where you can have a casual conversation. For in-depth, serious discussions, please head to the Tree of Knowledge (http://mangahelpers.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=61).

No spam! This is obvious, isn't it? No one-liners, no useless posts, yadda yadda. :p

No agonizing! Don't keep on asking for spoilers/raws/scans/translations, just be patient.

Akainu
September 23, 2009, 05:46 PM
So how do you think this New Era will look like? will there still be Yonkou and Shichibukai? I mean the whole saga since TB was heavily Shichibukai infested and to me rather seems like a farewell :tem
Also, what happens to the Yonkou IF one should fall? will there just be a new one? or will there be only three left? I think that's leading nowhere, because that's all Old Era rhethoric :oh

NoLimit89
September 23, 2009, 06:10 PM
here's an interesting idea. what if we meet the 4 yonkous of the old era, AND THEY ALL FALL somehow, leaving the world to the 4 yonkous of the new era

Blackbeard? Luffy? Someone else?

and another thing, Marco and Joze are definitely admiral level or close to admiral level. And Marco, Ace, Joze are pretty much directly below WB in command.

I'm guessing that first mate guy with a scar and black ponytail, Usopp's father and the fat guy is kinda like that except to Shanks. So that leads me to believe they're at least shichibukai level or maybe even admiral level.

And since Usopp wants to be a great warrior of the sea, and it would make a romantic story if the son eventually surpasses the father ... how would Usopp ever get to that level?

kilm
September 23, 2009, 06:22 PM
here's an interesting idea. what if we meet the 4 yonkous of the old era, AND THEY ALL FALL somehow, leaving the world to the 4 yonkous of the

Blackbeard? Luffy? Someone else?

Ace? Buggy? Has to be related to Luffy somehow. I chose Buggy just because it would be ironic.


And since Usopp wants to be a great warrior of the sea, and it would make a romantic story if the son eventually surpasses the father ... how would Usopp ever get to that level?

By being a part of the same crew as the main protagonist of a shounen manga! On a plot level, probably going through so many death-defying adventures he'll stop being a pussy at least.

chess4
September 23, 2009, 06:29 PM
i think blackbeard wil become the new yonkou after he kills WB.

OdaForPresident
September 23, 2009, 06:31 PM
We'll probably see a new Usopp after he gets back. Hopefully he'll loose some pounds along with his fears.

chess4
September 23, 2009, 06:45 PM
We'll probably see a new Usopp after he gets back. Hopefully he'll loose some pounds along with his fears.

im sure hercules will teach him a thing or 2.

bittman
September 23, 2009, 07:26 PM
The moment I read Hercules, I thought of Hercule from DBZ...

....now I can't get Ussop with an afro out of my head...

zerocooldx
September 23, 2009, 08:21 PM
I can't wait until we get to Zoro's covers.

Poneglyph420
September 23, 2009, 08:52 PM
So how do you think this New Era will look like? will there still be Yonkou and Shichibukai? I mean the whole saga since TB was heavily Shichibukai infested and to me rather seems like a farewell :tem
Also, what happens to the Yonkou IF one should fall? will there just be a new one? or will there be only three left? I think that's leading nowhere, because that's all Old Era rhethoric :oh

Hmm.. New Era.. I suspect that Whatever.. Happens all of the 3 powers will be shaken to their core.

The Marines and WG have been embarrassed and challenged head on. The Shichibukai have revolt and betrayal throughout and could possibly shatter...
Garp seems in question, and I'm sure other high rank Marines will fall as well.
Jimbei, BB, maybe Hancock and Kuma all have either quit or have mysterious motives...?
But I suspect that while these two powers will be shattered to the core, they will survive and emerge anew..with new members..
I'd love a Supernova Shichibukai..!

The Yonkou, I think will devolve into scattered warfare in the NW. Maybe the NW will become a war zone, more of a nightmare than before...
I think it will be a race to the top of the pirate world. A major power shift is also possible..

Honestly I Hope Luffy, BB, some of the Supernovae, all become bigger players in the "war at the pirate's summit". Of course we need to see what the NW holds...

All in all I hope it's a world where pirates have more sway and the Marines are hard pressed to sustain any form of "justice".

k-dom
September 24, 2009, 12:58 AM
Rather than the Yonkou, I had the feeling it would be about the tenryubito, if one piece world shall get rid off something, they perfectly match
but I understand that some fights against the yonkou is more promising

c0nflikt
September 24, 2009, 03:21 AM
I think Buggy could have a big future, also i believe usopp will have the most impressive power up, look at the odds all the straw hats are in places with potential for growth but usopp is on an island or something with danger everywhere for a person like usopp you either adapt or he dies i think he may be impressively buff next time we see him and chopper will definately be able to control monster point, what choice does he have? humans who want to eat him and giant birds, somehow in there i see potential to control monster point.

Adrizsnk
September 24, 2009, 03:59 AM
I think Chopper can have a huge powerup! Namy, Luffy, Zorro, Sanji, and Usop already got one! But Chopper is going to use 3 rumble ball in each fight if he doesn't improve!
I think this wild environement will have good effects on him.

OdaForPresident
September 24, 2009, 07:10 AM
How do you think that the crew will get back to shabondy, marine HQ or where ever there going to end up?

My guess for chopper is that he will be riding one of those big birds
Nami will float down from sky island with some sort of air fish thingy
Robin will get a ride from the revolutionaries
Franky might be teleported
Brook, maybe some dark ritual?
I can't think of anything for the other guys, your thoughts?

nerothos
September 24, 2009, 01:42 PM
I have been thinking about the BB recently and I started to think: what if the Sengoku who is supposed to be a great tactician sent BB into the Impel Down to make head gaoler shiryuu (and maybe magelan) join the fight against WB? I know BB isnt the kind of guy who would listen to others, but on the other hand it is the perfect chance for him to get rid of WB for sure (since it would be a sneak attack) and he wouldnt lose protection that WG and his Schichibukai title provide him.

It is just a crazy thought, but I would appreciate some good conversation about this matter.

Kuranzyan
September 24, 2009, 01:44 PM
Brook can run on water, remember? I think he can "hop" from island to island this way.

Razh
September 24, 2009, 01:58 PM
I have been thinking about the BB recently and I started to think: what if the Sengoku who is supposed to be a great tactician sent BB into the Impel Down to make head gaoler shiryuu (and maybe magelan) join the fight against WB? I know BB isnt the kind of guy who would listen to others, but on the other hand it is the perfect chance for him to get rid of WB for sure (since it would be a sneak attack) and he wouldnt lose protection that WG and his Schichibukai title provide him.

It is just a crazy thought, but I would appreciate some good conversation about this matter.

Well, if you really think about it, if Sengoku wanted for Magellan and Shiryuu to fight Whitebeard he could have just ordered them directly, since he is the Fleet Admiral, after all.

nerothos
September 24, 2009, 02:14 PM
Well, if you really think about it, if Sengoku wanted for Magellan and Shiryuu to fight Whitebeard he could have just ordered them directly, since he is the Fleet Admiral, after all.

but then it wouldnt be a surprise attack. BB could make a tunnel right beneath WB...

Lord Rayleigh
September 24, 2009, 02:24 PM
but then it wouldnt be a surprise attack. BB could make a tunnel right beneath WB...
I don't think he can. His power allows him to absorb the matter. If he did that and made suddenly disappear the substratum, the surface would collapse.

MeramEranomi
September 24, 2009, 07:07 PM
Brook can run on water, remember? I think he can "hop" from island to island this way.

no he can't. remember when he was fighting the fish riders? he ran on top of the water but sank shortly. he cannot do long distances.

Fox666
September 25, 2009, 02:40 AM
I have been thinking about the BB recently and I started to think: what if the Sengoku who is supposed to be a great tactician sent BB into the Impel Down to make head gaoler shiryuu (and maybe magelan) join the fight against WB? I know BB isnt the kind of guy who would listen to others, but on the other hand it is the perfect chance for him to get rid of WB for sure (since it would be a sneak attack) and he wouldnt lose protection that WG and his Schichibukai title provide him.

It is just a crazy thought, but I would appreciate some good conversation about this matter.For Sengoku face it was obvious he didn't knew nothing about Blackbeard going to Impel Down.

Superman
September 25, 2009, 09:05 AM
Does Hina have a logia fruit???? Because she said "Everything that goes """through""" my body gets locked down"!!Just look how her fruit works.
Look here http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/217/02/ http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/217/03/
Is it a mistranslation which cant be taken seriously, or is it fact, that she can let things and stuff slip through her??? Is it the weirdest logia ever or is it paracemea??

Seleno
September 25, 2009, 10:17 AM
BB wil come and join the war together with Shiryuu but not 'cause of an order of Sengoku. I believe that Sengoku woulnd't rely on someone who has joined the Shichis short time ago and nevertheless he wouldn't rely on BB because he's a pirate after all and why should the marine trust an pirate?


How do you think that the crew will get back to shabondy, marine HQ or where ever there going to end up?

My guess for chopper is that he will be riding one of those big birds
Nami will float down from sky island with some sort of air fish thingy
Robin will get a ride from the revolutionaries
Franky might be teleported
Brook, maybe some dark ritual?
I can't think of anything for the other guys, your thoughts?

Nami - maybe with something like a zeppelin or a flying little boat which is powered by the Wind Knot or this strange little flame of the covers
Robin - she will find her way back to it with the help of the revolutionaries (I think Robin will possibly join the war as one of the first ones because the revolutionaries could take a role in this war, too)
Franky - after watching the episode I'm not quite sure. But he is very creative (remember how fast he builds up this bridge on the Thriller Bark? Perhaps he will find some useful plans in Vegapunks Lab in order to build an motor-boat
Brook - sorry... no ideas here xD' It could be possible that the villagers will summon sme real demons or a befriended sea-king who can take Brook to there
Zoro - he will travel together with Perona otherwise he won't meet the SHs ever again xD Maybe Perone is able to use her ghosts for travelling?
Chopper - the easiest of all I think xD In my eyes he will ride one of the birds
Sanji - he should get help of the Okamas but it will be a normal (pink) boat
Usopp - fat is swimming xD'' (otherwise I don'T have ideas)

Poneglyph420
September 25, 2009, 08:42 PM
IF BB is to show up in this war, it would really be only at the end. It would take him far more time to depart from ID and make it to Marineford. I'd just love to see him steal and modify a Warship into his new ship..
Still there's too much going on and a new secret attack from the Marines..
His only purpose there would be to take out WB and other vital members of WB's crew.

As far as the "missing" SH. Who knows how they will get back but for sure that's what Duval and Rayleigh are there for. Perhaps they will meet in small 3 person groups which then finally come together....
This won't be until 2010 however......

Some of the previous predictions are interesting..
Looking forward to the Zoro covers..

Maybe just cuz I love Perona...

k-dom
September 26, 2009, 09:54 AM
What do you think will be the title ?
Zoro wants to be reborn as a cucumber ?

MeramEranomi
September 26, 2009, 10:02 AM
Does Hina have a logia fruit???? Because she said "Everything that goes """through""" my body gets locked down"!!Just look how her fruit works.
Look here http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/217/02/ http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/217/03/
Is it a mistranslation which cant be taken seriously, or is it fact, that she can let things and stuff slip through her??? Is it the weirdest logia ever or is it paracemea??

i think it's just a paramecia. although she said "goes through my body", she meant that everything she touches gets locked down, not that she can let things pass through her like logia.

deffkryz
September 26, 2009, 12:18 PM
Does Hina have a logia fruit???? Because she said "Everything that goes """through""" my body gets locked down"!!Just look how her fruit works.
Look here http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/217/02/ http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/217/03/
Is it a mistranslation which cant be taken seriously, or is it fact, that she can let things and stuff slip through her??? Is it the weirdest logia ever or is it paracemea??

One Piece Yellow Grand Elements classifies Hina's Ori Ori no Mi as Paramecia. (Japanese version (http://mangahelpers.com/downloads/read-online/10970/215) #021)

There's a German Edition of OPYGE available - even if it uses bad translated names, it's still worth to buy it for a quick lookup. ;)

mugiwara84
September 26, 2009, 12:42 PM
Looking forward to the Zoro covers..

Maybe just cuz I love Perona...

What do you think will be the title ?
Zoro wants to be reborn as a cucumber ?

Same here, due to Perona probably most of us. And I hope we'll see Zoro in a bearsy costume serving as a slave due to her spirits. And I wonder and kind of expect they'll get 3 cover stories like they got 3 pages when the others had 2 pages when we saw them landing.
Title: I want to be reborn as a marimo. Would be perfect.

Though I wonder if we'll have a color spread next week. Last colorspread 553 and the one before 547 so doesn't seem impossible for me with next weeks beeing 559 especially cause I'm sure Oda would love to pull one the audience who are so anxious to see Zoro and Perona. Not that I (or anyone) would mind if it's a cool one of Whitebeard and his men. I'd especially love to see Marco and to a more little degree Ace standing next to each other showing their flames with Jozu showing his diamant body partly like against Mihawk.

Lord Rayleigh
September 26, 2009, 12:49 PM
I must say that her DF is still not explained and that lacks because it seems a bit strange.
Indeed, she can transform his body into jail : here (http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/558/07/). That looks exactly like Bellamy's with the spring. But the problem is that she can also create jail (http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/217/03/) like Mr 3's candie.
If Mr 3 could also transform his body into candie, his power would be a logia. And Bellamy does not seem to be able to create springs.
So, she can transform into something and also create it. That is the first time we see a paremecia with such similarities with the logias.
Oda should explain clearly what her powers are and why her DF is said to be a paramecia.

MeramEranomi
September 26, 2009, 12:50 PM
i don't think there'll be a 3 page zoro story. cuz right now for the anime they're making 2 straw-hat pirates side stories per episode. if Oda makes zoro's 3 week the anime won't make it on time. i'm sure they talked it over w/ Oda before making the filler side arcs. so zoro's story would be 2 weeks like everyone else.

mugiwara84
September 26, 2009, 01:47 PM
i don't think there'll be a 3 page zoro story. cuz right now for the anime they're making 2 straw-hat pirates side stories per episode. if Oda makes zoro's 3 week the anime won't make it on time. i'm sure they talked it over w/ Oda before making the filler side arcs. so zoro's story would be 2 weeks like everyone else.

The anime hasn't even touched the coverstories so far... Nami and Franky's part was solely their two pages of the ones during chapter 523 so there's plenty of time to have a colorspread and 3 Zoro's coverstories like he did 3 pages of Zoro's landing while the others had only 2...

k-dom
September 26, 2009, 02:48 PM
I don't think zoro will have a special treatment that would be quite unfair. And indeed we will probably have a color spread soon, either next chapter or before the next cover series

senewe
September 27, 2009, 08:23 AM
guys...
which type gura-gura belongs to, logia or paramecia??
what do you think??

misterchaos
September 27, 2009, 08:27 AM
guys...
which type gura-gura belongs to, logia or paramecia??
what do you think??

gura gura no mi is 100% paramecia.... an earthquake isnt a element...

senewe
September 27, 2009, 10:18 AM
gura gura no mi is 100% paramecia.... an earthquake isnt a element...

so logia is not the strongest, right...

the fact is, the strongest man is gura-gura man..
hoho

BlackHair
September 27, 2009, 10:28 AM
There is no such thing as strongest fruit! Logia are said to be the most powerful ones, since u will gain tricky ability's through that.

But in general it is like rock-scissor-paper. So far most of the fruits have a weakness/natural enemy. So while WB is said to be the strongest, his fruit certainly isn't. It all comes down to the user. It semms WB was succesfull with his fruit and the use of it. But many other aren't.. (Buggy xD) ..

misterchaos
September 27, 2009, 10:56 AM
There is no such thing as strongest fruit! Logia are said to be the most powerful ones, since u will gain tricky ability's through that.

But in general it is like rock-scissor-paper. So far most of the fruits have a weakness/natural enemy. So while WB is said to be the strongest, his fruit certainly isn't. It all comes down to the user. It semms WB was succesfull with his fruit and the use of it. But many other aren't.. (Buggy xD) ..

exacta!! every fruit is dangerous if the user can mastered it ....there no uch has the strongest...

senewe
September 27, 2009, 10:59 AM
so how about akainu's fruit??

misterchaos
September 27, 2009, 11:01 AM
so how about akainu's fruit??

lol, what about it, you think is the strongest or you are going to throw deviul fruit users??

ScorpionGR
September 27, 2009, 11:22 AM
the strongest thing from all is haki .. without haki you can't beat a logia devil fruit

BlackHair
September 27, 2009, 11:25 AM
so how about akainu's fruit??Did u read my post?


the strongest thing from all is haki .. without haki you can't beat a logia devil fruitNo it is not the strongest. But yes, it is neeed to fight Logia.

ScorpionGR
September 27, 2009, 11:43 AM
why not .... all the things now are getting around haki like in the first part of the story when we learned about devils fruits .. i think haki now is the second level and devils fruit was the first level of the story so from now we gonna see who has the most powerfull haki and maybe third level will be the mix of devil fruits with haki... :P

BlackHair
September 27, 2009, 11:55 AM
Well the thing about haki, it is will power (ambition). So everyone has it. It is just the matter of control and successful use. U r sepearting haki and devil fruit. But in the end both are necessary to be at the top. Also just cause' DF were introduced early one, doesn't make it less worth. No tot mention that Oda didn't planned at the beginning for OP to run this long.

Haki and devil fruits are weapons. It comes down to the user. So let me ask u, who is stronger a axe user or a sword user? Obviouly u can't say who is in general stronger. Since both have their ad- and disadvantages. If u every played rpg games, u know what Im talking about. Same with haki and DF. U can't say a haki user are stronger than any df user. Not to mention there should be many who are capable of both.

misterchaos
September 27, 2009, 12:13 PM
the strongest thing from all is haki .. without haki you can't beat a logia devil fruit

luffy beat crocodile and enel without haki, luffy had elements that negate their powers, water and rubber...

OunknownO
September 27, 2009, 01:53 PM
I'm reading these latest chapter again and I think to myself that in one point in future of manga the strawhats will be in the similar positions but then all of them will be a force to be reckon with, Even Usopp will be famous and feard(XD)

misterchaos
September 27, 2009, 02:11 PM
I'm reading these latest chapter again and I think to myself that in one point in future of manga the strawhats will be in the similar positions but then all of them will be a force to be reckon with, Even Usopp will be famous and feard(XD)

of course they will be the piarte crew that found one piece, what im really looking forward is usopp saying " i and my 8000 men" and every character of one piece helping the straw hats... pure pwnage

chess4
September 27, 2009, 04:36 PM
of course they will be the piarte crew that found one piece, what im really looking forward is usopp saying " i and my 8000 men" and every character of one piece helping the straw hats... pure pwnage

i sure the one piece isnt just treasure. it has something to do with the will of d and the void century. i guessing roges knew since his time was almost over he would put his trust in another person witht the will of D to finish what he couldnt. thus is why he told garp that he trusted him like a friend and he knew garp would raise his son, and he could die in peace.


the rio ponyglymph, the void century, one piece, and will of d will all be connected some way or anoter

elitefox
September 28, 2009, 01:13 AM
i sure the one piece isnt just treasure. it has something to do with the will of d and the void century. i guessing roges knew since his time was almost over he would put his trust in another person witht the will of D to finish what he couldnt. thus is why he told garp that he trusted him like a friend and he knew garp would raise his son, and he could die in peace.


the rio ponyglymph, the void century, one piece, and will of d will all be connected some way or anoter

yeah I agree that its all connected with each other and how the WG(with the tenrybuto) now be totally shattered I think
[hr]

I think Chopper can have a huge powerup! Namy, Luffy, Zorro, Sanji, and Usop already got one! But Chopper is going to use 3 rumble ball in each fight if he doesn't improve!
I think this wild environement will have good effects on him.

yeah, I think so since he is so human like that is why he cannot control his animal form so much but if he can understand more of being an animal, it would be a gain :D

SilversDKRayleigh
September 28, 2009, 02:20 AM
Anyone agree that the best place for Moria to gather shadows would be ID.

k-dom
September 28, 2009, 02:49 AM
I've just thought about something. How Kuma could know where to send Brook ? He should not even know who it is. I'm not sure we saw his music abilities during their fight in thriller bark.

Akainu
September 28, 2009, 02:52 AM
Maybe that's where his Pacifista ability comes into play... at least they did have a display of some sort that automatically recognized pirates and bounties as far as I remember. That maybe was a little filler-ish, but the part about recognizing is true nonetheless.

elitefox
September 28, 2009, 04:12 AM
Maybe that's where his Pacifista ability comes into play... at least they did have a display of some sort that automatically recognized pirates and bounties as far as I remember. That maybe was a little filler-ish, but the part about recognizing is true nonetheless.

something like satellite broadcasting :D

he might even have a snail in his body lol

Akainu
September 28, 2009, 04:35 AM
it would be sufficient if he had a harddrive additionally to his brain where all information about pirates, their abilities and their bounties is stored, maybe even their ships, affiliates and whatnot. he isn't just telling pirates and marines apart, but he knows them by name. and well satelite uplink? there aren't that many pirates that it has to be updated that fast. going to Vegapunks once a month or so would imo be enough to keep him updated

k-dom
September 28, 2009, 06:01 AM
Well I know Enel went on the moon, but I do not believe Satellite technology is really possible in One Piece world current status

rajin
September 28, 2009, 06:33 AM
oda is taking too much breaks these day's

i'm thinking about kuma

why he hasn't any bible in his hands

why he betray dragon

why he joined wg

is he loyal to dragon yet

is he double agent

is he on a mission assigned by dragon

is his objectives did collide with dragon's objective that's why he left revolutionary army

Mixu
September 28, 2009, 07:07 AM
oda is taking too much breaks these day's
Link (http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53366) <- That topic tells probable cause for all these breaks. As long as he keeps up this amazing epicness i don't really mind if he takes few breaks.

gesgift
September 28, 2009, 07:29 AM
Link (http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53366) <- That topic tells probable cause for all these breaks. As long as he keeps up this amazing epicness i don't really mind if he takes few breaks.

I don't mind that either, but I'm wondering how old we'll be when this manga ends... And how old Oda will be :D

But each chapter seems to become epic and more epic, I loved the way Sengoku announced he was dragon's kid, and how smoker-mihawk-jimbei looked like 'doesn't seem strange, go figure' :)

sarutobi_sensei
September 28, 2009, 08:22 AM
I do mind about the breaks, it's them that give me heart attacks, not the chapter xD

I wonder if I'll have another 10 years when One Piece ends, but I don't mind it, it can go on until I'm 100, I don't care xD

gold349
September 28, 2009, 10:05 AM
can't find it at moment but I recall/read water 7 arc was half way for One piece manga...i'll try dig it up.

@raijin kuma did have his bible HERE (www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/550/08-09/), granted it can't be seen now but to show his hands with 'paw paw' LAST PANEL (www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/555/10-11/) and fire laser from his mouth like he has before its the real deal shishubukai for me not a pacifista.

k-dom
September 28, 2009, 05:07 PM
It doesn't really contradict my theory. Ace looks a lot younger in that flashback.
I can't say I know much about logia learning curve, but I really doubt that they master their power and the use of it the moment they eat the fruit.

It does a little since your theory is that Logia have to train to be in their element, whereas I think the flashback said that they have to train not to be in their element

Razh
September 28, 2009, 05:15 PM
It does a little since your theory is that Logia have to train to be in their element whereas I think the flashback said that they have to train not to be in their element

No, I claim that the flashback says that Ace wasn't fully in control of his power.
Look, I discussed this for like dozen times, including once in the old convo, and it's just a pain.

Ace tackled Smoker, who tackled Ace, and they both flew through the wall. How's that?
Yes, a lot of times, we see logias letting bullets through them. I claim that they are prepared and in expectance of the attack they become the element even though they look normal on the outside. Such as ace letting bullets through him on Banaro. On the opposite side we have the case when Luffy blasted both Ace and Smoker away.
What is the difference between the 2? In 1. case, Ace was looking straight into his enemies, and probably saw the attack coming. In the 2. case, Ace was caught totally by surprise and subsequently, flew through the wall.
There is no logia mechanism that activates on it's own when the bullets are coming. That would mean that df ability has a mind of it's own, and we know that's not the case.

k-dom
September 28, 2009, 05:42 PM
No, I claim that the flashback says that Ace wasn't fully in control of his power..
you said in your first post that logia have to pay attention to be in their element mode, that they are not constantly in their element mode and that the logia power don't work on their own. That's what I call "Logia have to train to be in their element" or I don't understand anything. I know about the old discussion but this was before Oars flashback where it is clearly said that Ace has problem to make the hat because of his logia power.
Why would it be a problem of Ace controlling his logia power when, according to you, he just have not to control them and stay in a human mode to make the hat.
I know about Luffy hitting smoker and Ace but I'm really suspicious about this part since it happen only one time in all the manga and I'm not sure it shall be taken as the rule for Logia mechanism.

NoLimit89
September 28, 2009, 05:45 PM
Or maybe, when you first get a logia, you can't control when you're in element and when you're not. It makes sense doesn't it? You turn into (let's say) fire when you don't want to and then you can't turn into fire when you want to.

Razh
September 28, 2009, 06:41 PM
Or maybe, when you first get a logia, you can't control when you're in element and when you're not. It makes sense doesn't it? You turn into (let's say) fire when you don't want to and then you can't turn into fire when you want to.

That's what I had in mind.



I know about Luffy hitting smoker and Ace but I'm really suspicious about this part since it happen only one time in all the manga and I'm not sure it shall be taken as the rule for Logia mechanism.

It still happened in manga and explaining it with comic relief is plain silly.
Also, there was that time when Luffy kicked Aokiji in the air. Also, the sea didn't start freezing the moment Aokiji touched it. He declared "Ice Age" first.
There are really tons of examples, all of which I probably mentioned before.

Also, Oda himself stated in SBS that logias turn their bodies into an element. Gave example of how Ace does his fire fist attack (the one that destroyed Baroque ships). Ace turns his fist into a fire, then makes the fire bigger. He wouldn't be able to do it without training.

Next time, I'm just gonna go find those posts of mine from before and copy...
I think we've seen clearly how logias work. They would suck if the users couldn't control them, including choose not to use them.

Wowzers
September 28, 2009, 07:05 PM
I've been thinking about an un-answered question about Kuma... (What!! Another one??)
Whatever happened to PX-1 (http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/513/06/)?

Kuma made PX-1 vanish like the Strawhats, but where did he make it go?
1. Sent it to Dr Vegapunk's lab.
2. Sent it to a safe location so it will find it's way back.
3. Sent it to a dangerous location so it will be destroyed.
4. Sent it to a location where it can be reprogrammed.
5. Sent it to a location where it can be disassembled for spare parts.
6. Sent it to a Revolutionary Army base where it will be analyzed.
7. Simply dropped it in the ocean.

Personally, I think that if Kuma is a spy for the Revolution it will be 4,5 or 6. PX-1 might be running around doing jobs for Kuma right now while Kuma keeps showing his face at the war... no one the wiser.

MeramEranomi
September 28, 2009, 07:12 PM
I've been thinking about an un-answered question about Kuma... (What!! Another one??)
Whatever happened to PX-1 (http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/513/06/)?

Kuma made PX-1 vanish like the Strawhats, but where did he make it go?
1. Sent it to Dr Vegapunk's lab.
2. Sent it to a safe location so it will find it's way back.
3. Sent it to a dangerous location so it will be destroyed.
4. Sent it to a location where it can be reprogrammed.
5. Sent it to a location where it can be disassembled for spare parts.
6. Sent it to a Revolutionary Army base where it will be analyzed.
7. Simply dropped it in the ocean.

Personally, I think that if Kuma is a spy for the Revolution it will be 4,5 or 6. PX-1 might be running around doing jobs for Kuma right now while Kuma keeps showing his face at the war... no one the wiser.

i root out 1,2,3. it's too much trouble for him. he doesn't give a crap about his clone (not that much anyway). 5 is unlikely. 4 is the same as 6. so it's really 6 or 7. personally i think he just dropped it. b/c if he wants to let revolutionaries check it that means he planned the whole thing for strawhats to get in trouble (unlikely).

elitefox
September 28, 2009, 07:49 PM
can't find it at moment but I recall/read water 7 arc was half way for One piece manga...i'll try dig it up.

@raijin kuma did have his bible HERE (www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/550/08-09/), granted it can't be seen now but to show his hands with 'paw paw' LAST PANEL (www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/555/10-11/) and fire laser from his mouth like he has before its the real deal shishubukai for me not a pacifista.

its a book, and with his big body, he can hide it anywhere, since he is a cyborg then likely he hid it in his stomach like franky :D

k-dom
September 29, 2009, 01:57 AM
That's what I had in mind.

This episode occurs after Ace visited Wano country which is in the new world... Are you telling me that Ace only starts to master his devil fruit at that time ?



It still happened in manga and explaining it with comic relief is plain silly.
When the manga is in comic mode, it's dangourous to take thing seriously, otherwise, Nami has already mastered haki...
http://media.onemanga.com/mangas/00000002/000128892/07.jpg



I think we've seen clearly how logias work. They would suck if the users couldn't control them, including choose not to use them.
well that's your position and I understand you are tired of this topic so I won't argue more. Personally, everything is not very clear, and things like the hat making doesn't help.

BetaRuler
September 29, 2009, 03:16 AM
Perhaps its because those bullets are objects, not people that this happened.

We've seen tons of objects go through these logias when they arent looking, but rarely do we see people pass through them, Croc is one of the few people that i have seen some one pass through and that might be the skill only he has which he bragged about when he fought Luffy.

Edit: proof points
Bullets and Brookes sword - go through Kizaru
Rayleigh and Marco's kicks - Hit Kizaru (im not sure what Apoos attack was exactly tho, probably that explosions aren't something Kizaru's element can pass through)
I might have hit a stumbling block in this theory here because Rayleigh then swiped Kizaru with a sword, but we don't know what kind of sword that is, it might have had sea stone in it for all we know, something was strange.

And for Ace
Gets grabbed by Black Beard, why couldn't he just "phase himself" through BB eh? Haki?
But bullets go through him
Gets hit by Smoker flying into him, also got chucked into a river by village people.

Enel, phased through plenty of attacks made by weapons but no one really touched him did they? Something seemed different by that tribe guys reject attack that stopped Enels heart.

After all that, I think this logia theory definately has something to do with people vs objects.

Although Smoker managed to phase through alot of humans in his introduction... Arghhh this logia mystery is unfair ;_;

Zehahaha
September 29, 2009, 04:04 PM
And for Ace
Gets grabbed by Black Beard, why couldn't he just "phase himself" through BB eh? Haki?
But bullets go through him
Gets hit by Smoker flying into him, also got chucked into a river by village people.

Enel, phased through plenty of attacks made by weapons but no one really touched him did they? Something seemed different by that tribe guys reject attack that stopped Enels heart.



For Enel, Waipa used seastone, that's why he was able to touch him ;)
For Ace, well nah, BB with his ability is able to touch Logia users, so there's no haki here i believe ^^

pirateninjahunter
September 30, 2009, 10:43 AM
Was it stated somewhere, that crocodile is better than Ace at controlling his logia?

BlackHair
September 30, 2009, 10:44 AM
Was it stated somewhere, that crocodile is better than Ace at controlling his logia?No. But Croco is probably longer in posses of his fruit than Ace.

goldb
September 30, 2009, 12:01 PM
I'd say in terms of mastery or control of their logia abilities; I'd place the admirals up top then Crocodile and Enel, then Ace, then Smoker and BB who despite his strength hasn't had his fruit for as long as the others.

Jus because I put Crocodile before Ace doesn't mean I think he's stronger, it just means I think he's has a better control over his fruit than Ace. Physically Ace is stronger imo, since he lost to Luffy.

We know Aokiji's had his logia powers for at least 20 years, he's probably mastered it, the same can be said of the other admirals, but I think ultimately there's mroe to them than jus their DF abilities.

For me the whole haki vs logia is simple; a character able to use haki means they are able to make physical contact to an otherwise physically untouchable elements. there's many different uses of haki, the above is just one example. we saw the Boa sisters could perdict movements with theirs as well as stop Luffy's rubber.

pirateninjahunter
September 30, 2009, 12:58 PM
I'd say in terms of mastery or control of their logia abilities; I'd place the admirals up top then Crocodile and Enel, then Ace, then Smoker and BB who despite his strength hasn't had his fruit for as long as the others.

Jus because I put Crocodile before Ace doesn't mean I think he's stronger, it just means I think he's has a better control over his fruit than Ace. Physically Ace is stronger imo, since he lost to Luffy.

We know Aokiji's had his logia powers for at least 20 years, he's probably mastered it, the same can be said of the other admirals, but I think ultimately there's mroe to them than jus their DF abilities.

For me the whole haki vs logia is simple; a character able to use haki means they are able to make physical contact to an otherwise physically untouchable elements. there's many different uses of haki, the above is just one example. we saw the Boa sisters could perdict movements with theirs as well as stop Luffy's rubber.

You post made things a lot clear to me!

I understand now: Luffy was able to defeat croc because:
1- he found out how to hit crocodile
2- he happens to be stronger than crocodile

It is clear now. But it is at the same time not fair. Because Luffy was able to use his DF while crocodile could not do that... Luffy was able to strech his body to give croc really powerfull punches.


Being able to beat crocodile seems to mean that crocodile is not strong. He could have at least a little bit more vigor and stamina... Look, Magellan was able to absorb all of luffy's punches!

Luffy didn't even have gear 2 or 3, and he still was able to defeat croc with his punches... I thought that croc was strong, but now....

BetaRuler
September 30, 2009, 01:56 PM
Luffy's strong point has always been to give people strong punches, even Magellan felt alot of pain from taking Luffy's punches.

Luffy's punches aren't things that anyone seem able to take on, y'kno it started with him punching as hard as a pistol, the ammount of power that must have had was immense. Even if your a powerful like Crocodile or Magellan, I don't think anyone would feel too great taking a large bullet to the face.

And I still reckon the logia has something to do with people vs inanimate objects, rather than the haki when it comes to why people hit eachother without Haki.

deffkryz
October 01, 2009, 03:59 AM
Hm, somehow I wonder why WB showed up with four almost identical ships that don't have cannons in their bows. Could it be that those ships have some awesome super-pwnage like the Gaon Cannon but way bigger and much more devastating?

BlackHair
October 01, 2009, 05:29 AM
They have cannons (http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/7190/1011ui.jpg). In fact they are having a sea battle with their ships.

deffkryz
October 01, 2009, 07:03 AM
They have cannons (http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/7190/1011ui.jpg). In fact they are having a sea battle with their ships.

On those pictures there are still no cannons on or inside the bow (Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bow_%28ship%29)), that's the port/starboard side of the ship's hull.

I meant something like this (http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/495/12/), maybe hidden inside that figurehead WB is standing upon.

BlackHair
October 01, 2009, 07:19 AM
ah', learned sth new here. I personally don't believe WB's ship has some kind of Franky like weapon. The Sunny-go is unique. And I guess WB himself is a much more frightening weapon than the Goan weapon, so is no real need for a weapon like that. ^^

goldb
October 01, 2009, 07:36 AM
I think there's something more to the Moby Dick than just the awesome figurehead but like blackhair said, every ship is unique and looking at Icey Bay's ship I'm guessing there's more to come in the NW with more awesome ships to compare to the Sunny-go.

toxun
October 02, 2009, 02:52 AM
Well, I think Sunny itself still need a lot more improvement. At first I imagine it will be just like an Ironclad, and it turn to be customized Sloop. Franky surely will do something from Barjimoa.

gesgift
October 02, 2009, 03:08 AM
ah', learned sth new here. I personally don't believe WB's ship has some kind of Franky like weapon. The Sunny-go is unique. And I guess WB himself is a much more frightening weapon than the Goan weapon, so is no real need for a weapon like that. ^^

Ofcoars WB could use a weapon like that, just to back him up. We should either under-or overestimate WB, But for now I think he and Sengoku ar just keeping an eye on each other, waiting for the next move (by Sengoku).

ANBU4U
October 03, 2009, 01:21 AM
I think there's something more to the Moby Dick than just the awesome figurehead but like blackhair said, every ship is unique and looking at Icey Bay's ship I'm guessing there's more to come in the NW with more awesome ships to compare to the Sunny-go.

I feel like Icy Bay was referring to her Devil Fruit powers more than her ship when she said "My ship can go anywhere". I think she has a paramecia ability that allows her to control ice.

Gecko Moria
October 03, 2009, 05:10 AM
I feel like Icy Bay was referring to her Devil Fruit powers more than her ship when she said "My ship can go anywhere". I think she has a paramecia ability that allows her to control ice.

That ability is too close to Aokiji's ice logia. Aokiji's Devil Fruit not only allows him to turn himself into ice but also grants the power to control ice and to freeze things so a paramecia that allows someone to control ice is unnecessary. Icy Bay probably just has an extremely powerful ship that can crash through all sorts of obstacles.

ANBU4U
October 03, 2009, 05:28 AM
That ability is too close to Aokiji's ice logia. Aokiji's Devil Fruit not only allows him to turn himself into ice but also grants the power to control ice and to freeze things so a paramecia that allows someone to control ice is unnecessary. Icy Bay probably just has an extremely powerful ship that can crash through all sorts of obstacles.

I dont see why their wouldn't be paramecia that allow contol over an element. In fact im sure there are.

Ace is fire. That doesn't mean there isn't a guy out there than can shoot fireballs from his mouth.

Same for Whitey Bay and Akoiji. Maybe she can manipulate ice, but not create it, or create ice but not control it. Any number of possible paramecia combinations are out there.

Furthermore her Epitaph is "Ice Witch" just kinda seems like a bit much for someone whos only ice related ability is a ship with a hard pointed hull (Icebreaker)

$$EDIT$$

No I was wrong, sorry. She does use an Ice Breaker. She must spend a lot of time around ice to earn a nickname like Ice Witch.....I'd say she hangs around the north, but isn't the grandline on the equator??? At any rate, she probably doesn't have an Ice DF, my apologies.

Razh
October 03, 2009, 11:29 AM
I say she hangs around the north, but inst the grandline on the equator???

One Piece has a little different planet than ours. The closeness to the equator doesn't seem to determine the temperature of an island. Each island has it's own meteorological regime.

ANBU4U
October 03, 2009, 12:20 PM
One Piece has a little different planet than ours. The closeness to the equator doesn't seem to determine the temperature of an island. Each island has it's own meteorological regime.

Right, but those conditions change drastically from island to island. It just seems strange that she would spend so much time at a specific winter island when in the grandline you are forced to move linearly....especially during the times when you would be making a name for yourself.

Then again, I suppose its likely that she got the epithet before she entered the grandline. Maybe North Blue?

MeramEranomi
October 03, 2009, 08:55 PM
well i think it's possible that white bay has some sort of water related abilities. after all, ace has the fire power, but akainu still had the magma power, and those two are so DAMN similar. the case is probably similar here. white bay doesn't have a ice power, but maybe some aqua DF that with the combination of something else allows her to freeze things.

Poneglyph420
October 03, 2009, 11:25 PM
From what we have seen of Whitey, I think she has a massive Ice Breaker.. She could be from North Blue...or a bad ass NW Winter Isle. She seems confident in the ability of her ship. But has only said little as of yet....

I'd like to know what happened to Mr. 1.. ??

Black Lagoon
October 04, 2009, 05:58 AM
from AP


According to Oda the Portrait of Pirates artist has passed away.

The news of modeler Mr. Kuroiwa passing was leaked early last week due to Hobby Japan magazine issue.
POP Kuma is apparantly his last work.
It's too bad, he was one of the best sculptor for One Piece figures.

Oda's comments


P・O・Pシリーズの造形師の1
人黒岩さんが亡くなられた。
最期に深い感謝を。(栄一郎)
He's not the only one doing POP series, but still.

Lord Rayleigh
October 04, 2009, 05:13 PM
The best One Piece Time-Lapse Theory I've ever read was over at AP forums....it was based on the phases of the moon as we see it in the sky every once in a while in the manga. Based on how many times we had seen it full, we could tell how many months had passed.....

The best analysis I have seen was a french one, based on the days they spent on the different islands, the days of boating (that Oda said), and speculation about some time that was not directly said but who uses distances, streams, remarks about some SHs/narrator etc ...
And the conclusion is that from the beginning of the manga to MHQ, 3 months have gone.
You can read it there (http://www.volonte-d.com/details/temps.php) but it is in french.

Bugzee
October 04, 2009, 05:18 PM
The best analysis I have seen was a french one, based on the days they spent on the different islands, the days of boating (that Oda said), and speculation about some time that was not directly said but who uses distances, streams, remarks about some SHs/narrator etc ...
And the conclusion is that from the beginning of the manga to MHQ, 3 months have gone.
You can read it there (http://www.volonte-d.com/details/temps.php) but it is in french.

WTF 3 months!!!!!! No! I personally think its been much longer! I think its been at least a year in the OP world!

BTW: Dim - you've posted the same post twice lol!

Black Lagoon
October 04, 2009, 05:34 PM
The best analysis I have seen was a french one, based on the days they spent on the different islands, the days of boating (that Oda said), and speculation about some time that was not directly said but who uses distances, streams, remarks about some SHs/narrator etc ...
And the conclusion is that from the beginning of the manga to MHQ, 3 months have gone.
You can read it there (http://www.volonte-d.com/details/temps.php) but it is in french.

It seems logical and very likely, but I think they spend more time in water (not water seven, but the sea in general :p).
IMO it's a bit more ... I dunno ... maybe 5 month

MeramEranomi
October 04, 2009, 05:37 PM
i'm guessing somewhere around 7/8 months. it's definitely less than a year, but 3 months is really pushing it in my opinion...

OdaisaGod
October 04, 2009, 07:04 PM
Personally I tend to judge that there has been somewhere between 3 and 6 months since Luffy first started sailing.

I am sure it seems longer but if you pay attention during Jaya/Sky Island you will notice that no more than a week at most passed by from the time the ship fell out of the sky until the SHs floated down on the octopus. Thriller Bark on the other hand could not have lasted more than about 8 to 10 hours from when they landed on TB until Zoro took Kuma's shot.

I make special note of those two specifically because both of them lasted around a year (TB) to almost 2 years (Jaya/SI) in terms of real world publishing time.

Another point to consider is that if it had been over a year since they started sailing then Luffy probably would have beaten Crocodile at least 6 months ago. If that was the case the WG would have surely found a replacement Shichibukai in less than 5+ months time.

The final and most decisive pointer to how long since Luffy started sailing is that in chapter 234 Rockstar meets with Whitebeard on behalf of Shanks. After Rockstar is rejected by Whitebeard Shanks decides he needs to meet WB personally. Whereas in chapter 434 Shanks meets with Whitebeard. I have to say that I truly doubt that it would have taken Shanks much longer than a month at the absolute most to travel from where he was until he got to Whitebeard.

Lord Rayleigh
October 05, 2009, 02:56 AM
It seems logical and very likely, but I think they spend more time in water (not water seven, but the sea in general :p).
IMO it's a bit more ... I dunno ... maybe 5 month
The time of the travel between the different islands is calculated too. For me, it seems fine.

Just some examples of the analysis about the time on the sea :
- Travel to the Baratie : 2 days (said that the flag has been put two days ago)
- Travel to Arlong Park : 4 days (the Blue Data Files shows that the distance between Baratie/Arlong Park is twice the distance between Syrup/Baratie)
- Travel to Logue Town : 6 days (Blue Data Files distances)
- Travel to Drum : 2 days (Dr Kureha said that the illness lasts 5 days and that she still have 2 days : that means she was on his third day)
- Travel to Alabasta : 5 days (said in the manga)
- Travel to Water Seven : 3 days (said in the manga)
- Travel to Thriller Back : 5 days (distances)
- Travel to Shabondy Islands : 4 days (it is said a few days in the manga)
- Travel to Amazon Lily : 1 day - a daytime and a night - (Nyon said that the tenryubito incident happened two days ago)
- Travel to Impel Down : 4,5 days (said in the manga)

Black Lagoon
October 05, 2009, 03:41 AM
The time of the travel between the different islands is calculated too. For me, it seems fine.

Just some examples of the analysis about the time on the sea :
- Travel to the Baratie : 2 days (said that the flag has been put two days ago)
- Travel to Arlong Park : 4 days (the Blue Data Files shows that the distance between Baratie/Arlong Park is twice the distance between Syrup/Baratie)
- Travel to Logue Town : 6 days (Blue Data Files distances)
- Travel to Drum : 2 days (Dr Kureha said that the illness lasts 5 days and that she still have 2 days : that means she was on his third day)
- Travel to Alabasta : 5 days (said in the manga)
- Travel to Water Seven : 3 days (said in the manga)
- Travel to Thriller Back : 5 days (distances)
- Travel to Shabondy Islands : 4 days (it is said a few days in the manga)
- Travel to Amazon Lily : 1 day - a daytime and a night - (Nyon said that the tenryubito incident happened two days ago)
- Travel to Impel Down : 4,5 days (said in the manga)

Agree, it's just hard to believe that's since August 4, 1997 till now ... only been three or four months :tem

elitefox
October 05, 2009, 04:42 AM
Agree, it's just hard to believe that's since August 4, 1997 till now ... only been three or four months :tem

how bout the sea travel, seems to me its don't take just hours but days to get from on island to another:tem

Black Lagoon
October 05, 2009, 05:34 AM
how bout the sea travel, seems to me its don't take just hours but days to get from on island to another:tem

I know, that's what I said above, @ Lord Rayleigh's analysis says it's been 90,5 days (3 month) and I find it very likely, although IMO some days are missing, so 4 month is may last answer. :)

MeramEranomi
October 05, 2009, 06:00 AM
how bout the sea travel, seems to me its don't take just hours but days to get from on island to another:tem

well actually, in the real world, if you travel around the world, it'll take around maybe 5 months, i'm talking about using ships like in the manga. so it kinda makes sense.

ZeroChrome
October 06, 2009, 01:41 AM
I know, that's what I said above, @ Lord Rayleigh's analysis says it's been 90,5 days (3 month) and I find it very likely, although IMO some days are missing, so 4 month is may last answer. :)

here's (http://apforums.net/showthread.php?t=17121) the link to the discussion in Arlong Park. definitely a good read and well brought up i gotta tell ya.

it's not complete but judging from the calculations, I agree with you that their journey until the recent event probably has been at most 3 to 4 months top.

just speculation from my side


EDIT: some more links regarding on world timeline in OP that I've saved. here (http://www.thegrandline.com/optimeline.html), here (http://onepiece.wikia.com/wiki/World_Timeline) and also the lunar timeline theory here (http://www.apforums.net/showthread.php?t=11069)

like people always say, sharing is caring :amuse

Razh
October 06, 2009, 02:49 AM
it's not complete but judging from the calculations, I agree with you that their journey until the recent event probably has been at most 3 to 4 months top.

Problem is that those calculations mean nothing without the time that wasn't shown on the pages. Without it, it's just guessing.

k-dom
October 07, 2009, 04:13 PM
yes but I think that with a margin of 1 month we are not far from the reality, after all most of the arcs are very shorts beside Alabasta and Water seven

elitefox
October 08, 2009, 01:37 AM
wow SH in 4 months top assumnig mad a bounty of 300M for their leader luffy

and after this, assuming again that this is just a month and luffy's bounty will like be double about 600 m in 5 months lols

OunknownO
October 09, 2009, 03:48 PM
people are you crazy ????!!!!!

would you give up your life for a person that you know for 3 month... it's been over the 3-5 years since they met(zoro and luffy)... It's just not possible to travel with such an old ship in that short amount of time and the planet is not that small..... and the travel betwen kuja island and id means that kuja island is close. and why don't then just build bridges if islands are so close.... Magellan needed the to travel around the world took him three years but he didn't explore he just sail not staying anywhere, and count that there weren't many island on the ocean on which he could stop

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/64/Magellan%27s_voyage_EN.svg/800px-Magellan%27s_voyage_EN.svg.png

zerocooldx
October 09, 2009, 03:51 PM
But this is fiction and a purely fictional world. Where anything is possible.

Akainu
October 09, 2009, 05:31 PM
that and it's a totally diffrent geology. the One Piece planet could be many times smaller and also probably has multiple moons. so earth standart doesn't even remotely work.
that aside, 3-5 years? Luffy would be 20-22 by now then, that's far less believable for me than a journey just under/about one year, largely depending on how much stuff happens off screen, that Oda doesn't show.
the time the SH needed to "conquer" GL isn't that abnormal btw., since other rookies like Ace also did it within that short amount of time, which makes me wonder if the WG is slowly but steadily loosing control over the first half too :o

zerocooldx
October 09, 2009, 05:37 PM
This is the OP "universe" but again it's all fiction so time in not an obstinate.

http://z1.zod.fr/z/op-globe-anime-cPR.jpg

pirateninjahunter
October 10, 2009, 07:20 AM
Maybe, just maybe, Oda did not think about how time is passing by.

But at the same time I believe that Oda has already drawn a map of OP. And from that map of the world of OP he draws luffy's adventures.

bittman
October 10, 2009, 07:57 AM
I just have to say I don't believe Oda would draw a map.

Why not? Well maps are restrictive. Let's say you draw a map at the start of a story, and then 10 years later you realise "shit, I'd really like to put a jail in the calm belt, but I did this map...."

I always find maps in books (like Eragon for example) strange. I can look at the map of Eragon and go "ok, well he'll definitely be going there there and there with a possible detour to there" whilst the author still hasn't finished the last book.

Akainu
October 10, 2009, 09:57 AM
but that's only the case if he had published a full fledged map of the whole one piece world. as long as he only has it in his mind and maybe a sketch on his desk or bedroom or where ever, it's imo no problem as he can still alter it at will.
I for one don't believe that someone who planned out things like Brook/Labbon from the start to implement it after 10 years did NOT have a plan of the world how he wants it to be, at least roughly.

goldb
October 10, 2009, 10:37 AM
I agree with Akainu, Oda has planned OP down to the tinniest details. When I found out that characters like Brook and Hancock were already thought of back when OP started I was in awe. So it's not farfetched to say that he has a rough idea of how the OP world looks. What I would want is in the end for him to publish a book of locations and map of OP to detail out the places which the SHs have been as well as the other islands on the routes the other Supernovas took.

Wowzers
October 10, 2009, 04:11 PM
Oda probably does have a map. At first it would be general layout of the major features of the One Piece world. As he goes along he would add details and the picture becomes less fuzzy and more detailed... after all, if you were asked to sketch out a map of the world, you draw the continents first and do progressively smaller details. Rest assured, Oda can make this map as detailed as he likes. :)
[hr]
I just remembered something... "Here there be Dragons". That is what cartographers would write on a map when there was an unknown, unexplored area on it. I can just see Nami trying to fill in some details on a map in the future and guess who they find there. :)

k-dom
October 10, 2009, 05:13 PM
I agree with Akainu, Oda has planned OP down to the tinniest details. When I found out that characters like Brook and Hancock were already thought of back when OP started I was in awe. So it's not farfetched to say that he has a rough idea of how the OP world looks. What I would want is in the end for him to publish a book of locations and map of OP to detail out the places which the SHs have been as well as the other islands on the routes the other Supernovas took.

Brook and Hancock are not tiny things, they are a crew member and a shichibukay. That's the first characters Oda should have think about when he made the scenario of one piece.

deffkryz
October 10, 2009, 10:27 PM
people are you crazy ????!!!!!

No.


would you give up your life for a person that you know for 3 month...

There are people in the world that would give up there life for a pet they only have about for some weeks - some even care about running down frogs with a car. Luffy is a reliable friend, a rare and special type of character that give his life for his friends, his own dream and unites people with similar targets. So: Hell, yes! Having such a friend is only excelled by finding the true love[TM].


it's been over the 3-5 years since they met(zoro and luffy)...

No. All three Databooks deny this statement, and One Piece Yellow was published with the time frame up to the end of the Enies Lobby arc. There would have been definitely an update to the character pages about their ages.


It's just not possible to travel with such an old ship in that short amount of time and the planet is not that small.....

And your theory is based on what?


and the travel betwen kuja island and id means that kuja island is close. and why don't then just build bridges if islands are so close....

Because then, they wouldn't have to use ships to go on an adventure.


Magellan needed the to travel around the world took him three years but he didn't explore he just sail not staying anywhere, and count that there weren't many island on the ocean on which he could stop

Magellan's journey is a pretty bad example, since Magellan died in 1521 and he drove around whole continents - and only one out of five ships returned home. Luffy's route is more or less a straight line from Fushia to the Baratié, then a "backstep" to Coconut, then again a more or less straight line to Loguetown to Reverse Mountain - and from there they had as well a more or less straight equatorial route to the other side of the world.

If you want to compare, please take one of Columbus' four journeys from Spain to the Bahamas/Carribean. In his first journey Columbus took three months from Spain to the first island.

So - saying Luffy took three/four months from Fushia to Amazon Lily is assuming he's rather slow taking that route in comparison to real journeys.

OunknownO
October 11, 2009, 07:02 AM
No.



There are people in the world that would give up there life for a pet they only have about for some weeks - some even care about running down frogs with a car. Luffy is a reliable friend, a rare and special type of character that give his life for his friends, his own dream and unites people with similar targets. So: Hell, yes! Having such a friend is only excelled by finding the true love[TM].



No. All three Databooks deny this statement, and One Piece Yellow was published with the time frame up to the end of the Enies Lobby arc. There would have been definitely an update to the character pages about their ages.



And your theory is based on what?



Because then, they wouldn't have to use ships to go on an adventure.



Magellan's journey is a pretty bad example, since Magellan died in 1521 and he drove around whole continents - and only one out of five ships returned home. Luffy's route is more or less a straight line from Fushia to the Baratié, then a "backstep" to Coconut, then again a more or less straight line to Loguetown to Reverse Mountain - and from there they had as well a more or less straight equatorial route to the other side of the world.

If you want to compare, please take one of Columbus' four journeys from Spain to the Bahamas/Carribean. In his first journey Columbus took three months from Spain to the first island.

So - saying Luffy took three/four months from Fushia to Amazon Lily is assuming he's rather slow taking that route in comparison to real journeys.


how are you sure that oda showed the whole trip betwen island... maybe he showed just most interesting parts of the travel

deffkryz
October 11, 2009, 08:38 AM
how are you sure that oda showed the whole trip betwen island... maybe he showed just most interesting parts of the travel

Even if he did: Your own example from our own real history proves you wrong since your underestimating how fast a sailing ship can be once in hits the right sea current. :eyeroll

OunknownO
October 11, 2009, 09:53 AM
Even if he did: Your own example from our own real history proves you wrong since your underestimating how fast a sailing ship can be once in hits the right sea current. :eyeroll

If, if, if.... and it's a grand line hitting the right tide is like winning a jackpot... Why is there a brigde that should connect just two island the building is lasted 700 years

deffkryz
October 11, 2009, 05:56 PM
If, if, if.... and it's a grand line hitting the right tide is like winning a jackpot... Why is there a brigde that should connect just two island the building is lasted 700 years

Well... *sigh* What's your point? You doubted that the World of One Piece is smaller than Earth and came up with a curious theory to prove your statement that 3-5 years have passed since Luffy left Fushia Village - that's your big "if" and a wrong one. On the other hand there is a map of about on fourth of the World in OP. Here you are. (http://mangahelpers.com/downloads/read-online/10969/56) and here's a sketch of the globe (http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/392/03/).

Oh... and btw: We can't answer why there's a bridge built for the last 700 years in the East Blue - because Oda just threw that as little fact itself without giving a reason (http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/524/07/). You really think they built it for the last 700 years just to connect two islands? Isn't it more obvious that they're connecting Western coast of the Red Line to the Easter one?

And from where did you get that "fact" about "hitting the right tide on the GL would be a jackpot"? That's a Navigator's job to get the ship into the best current... You don't think Nami did well?

beastboy
October 11, 2009, 05:58 PM
If, if, if.... and it's a grand line hitting the right tide is like winning a jackpot... Why is there a brigde that should connect just two island the building is lasted 700 years

Its in east blue not in GL!!
And look at the map that showed up when shaki was talking (I think) and count the islands!!
Following the log pose and with a navigator like nami who can always find the fastest route.. they'll make it ther in no time!!


And who says that ships in OP aren't faster.. a simple thing in the ship disign would make it travel 5 times faster!!

Bugzee
October 11, 2009, 08:59 PM
I wonder whether East Blue is located near a 'secret' path into the grand line?

I cant see how it would take 700+ years to construct a bridge to connect various islands in the same region! Its a bit excessive, therefore im wondering whether this bridge is meant to connect to a specific island in the grand line?

The Great Bridge of OP! lol Maybe its been created by the command of the Gorousei or World Nobles??

OdaisaGod
October 11, 2009, 09:13 PM
I wonder whether East Blue is located near a 'secret' path into the grand line?

I cant see how it would take 700+ years to construct a bridge to connect various islands in the same region! Its a bit excessive, therefore im wondering whether this bridge is meant to connect to a specific island in the grand line?

The Great Bridge of OP! lol Maybe its been created by the command of the Gorousei or World Nobles??

This is exactly what my thought has always been since we first heard about this bridge. In point of fact if it was the right sea I often thought that maybe the bridge was supposed to be trying to reach Raftel. In other words the WG was trying to force a cheat way into getting to Raftel but the Calm Belt monsters kept destroying the bridge as they made it a which would quit easily account for why 700 years of construction has occurred for a single bridge.

On a mildly related note to that ever since we heard about this (http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/433/04/) I have wondered why the WG doesn't just sail over the Calm Belt to Raftel. Any thoughts?

Fox666
October 12, 2009, 12:19 AM
I think that it's because the World is enormous. The "width" of the Grand Line may be that of a medium sized country. It won't make such different to travel through from outside of the Grand Line to Raftel than from inside.

And, after all, they can't just send marine ships all through the Yonkou territory, they will just loose them.

bittman
October 13, 2009, 01:52 AM
It would have to be because Raftel is surrounded by whatever the force is that has Roger being the only man in (known) history to reach it. It's not just some calm belts and Yonkou territory, else all the Yonkous would be pirate kings by now.

There's something mysterious and thus far unexplained that stops people getting to Raftel. Sure you can say "Well Whitebeard just doesn't want to go there" or something, but that's a bit lame. If you're a pirate and there's an ultimate treasure, why would you not want to at least see it? I've never gotten the "Shanks and Whitebeard aren't interested in the One Piece" rule, they're pirates of course they're interested.

The reason they aren't pirate kings is probably not because they have no desire, but rather they are unable to fill whatever criteria it is that allows you to enter Raftel.

I mean, it's not like every passing pirate looking for Skypeia can visit it. If you think about it and subtract Oda's obvious plot power, imagine how incredibly lucky the Strawhat's were in the first place to reach Skypeia and imagine a criteria 10x harder for Raftel.

Well, destiny not luck for the Strawhat's I guess...

toxun
October 13, 2009, 07:53 AM
It would have to be because Raftel is surrounded by whatever the force is that has Roger being the only man in (known) history to reach it. It's not just some calm belts and Yonkou territory, else all the Yonkous would be pirate kings by now.

There's something mysterious and thus far unexplained that stops people getting to Raftel. Sure you can say "Well Whitebeard just doesn't want to go there" or something, but that's a bit lame. If you're a pirate and there's an ultimate treasure, why would you not want to at least see it? I've never gotten the "Shanks and Whitebeard aren't interested in the One Piece" rule, they're pirates of course they're interested.

The reason they aren't pirate kings is probably not because they have no desire, but rather they are unable to fill whatever criteria it is that allows you to enter Raftel.

I mean, it's not like every passing pirate looking for Skypeia can visit it. If you think about it and subtract Oda's obvious plot power, imagine how incredibly lucky the Strawhat's were in the first place to reach Skypeia and imagine a criteria 10x harder for Raftel.

Well, destiny not luck for the Strawhat's I guess...

Shank reach Raftel when he's still Roger underling since the crew only disperse after they conquered the Grand Line. Talking about luck & fate, it's all One Piece all about, the struggle to reach your dream

Diablos
October 13, 2009, 06:01 PM
I seriously support the idea of Buggy becoming yonkou.. also matches what everyone says about a yonkou is not really all about their power but who they got with them, and Buggy sure has alot of though guys with him now XD..
Dont know about BlackBeard but I'm not seeing him taking part in this war..
WB will surelly die either in this war or shortly after it... Which brings me doubt... Ace is to most likely be the one replacing WB that's what I think but then Buggy would not become Yonkou so Im not quite sure about that, unless Shanks ends up killing the Yonkou he's fighting..
All I gotta say for now xD

goldb
October 14, 2009, 05:54 AM
Brook and Hancock are not tiny things, they are a crew member and a shichibukay. That's the first characters Oda should have think about when he made the scenario of one piece.

I was referring to character detail, not importance. It would be ignorant of me to say that Brook and Hancock are "small" characters.

@bittman: I agree with your comments. I for one thought that with WB's power he should be Pirate King and the fact that Shanks has been to Raftel before means he could possibly know the way there, but as you've rightly said there's something bigger than power at play here.

BlackHair
October 14, 2009, 07:32 AM
Shank reach Raftel when he's still Roger underling since the crew only disperse after they conquered the Grand Line. Talking about luck & fate, it's all One Piece all about, the struggle to reach your dreamIt was said that Roger was the only man on Raftet. Whether the crew was included or not is unclear I guess. But I think it was only Roger.

Fox666
October 14, 2009, 08:06 AM
It would have to be because Raftel is surrounded by whatever the force is that has Roger being the only man in (known) history to reach it. It's not just some calm belts and Yonkou territory, else all the Yonkous would be pirate kings by now.

There's something mysterious and thus far unexplained that stops people getting to Raftel. Sure you can say "Well Whitebeard just doesn't want to go there" or something, but that's a bit lame. If you're a pirate and there's an ultimate treasure, why would you not want to at least see it? I've never gotten the "Shanks and Whitebeard aren't interested in the One Piece" rule, they're pirates of course they're interested.

The reason they aren't pirate kings is probably not because they have no desire, but rather they are unable to fill whatever criteria it is that allows you to enter Raftel.

I mean, it's not like every passing pirate looking for Skypeia can visit it. If you think about it and subtract Oda's obvious plot power, imagine how incredibly lucky the Strawhat's were in the first place to reach Skypeia and imagine a criteria 10x harder for Raftel.

Well, destiny not luck for the Strawhat's I guess...But that somehow would mean everybody knows Raftel location.

I seriously support the idea of Buggy becoming yonkou.. also matches what everyone says about a yonkou is not really all about their power but who they got with them, and Buggy sure has alot of though guys with him now XD..Yeah, I never though about that seriously, but now that you said it...

Oni Giri
October 14, 2009, 08:55 AM
i don't know how but Roger being the only one reach Raftel may be related to his mysterious ability to hear everything's voice.

Blooper
October 14, 2009, 09:21 AM
A lot of people keep wondering what will happen after the war, the world power will become unbalanced, either if the shichibukai break, or marineford... I wonder: what will happen if the Yonkous no longer exist? I mean, it's quite possible that either Shanks (less likely) or Kaidou (more likely) will fall in their battle, while the one who survives will be greatly weakened, WB might die or somehow not be as strong as before after the war... Which means only 1 of the Yonkous (the one who was never mentioned) will stand untouched... What could happen then? I'm asking this because i think Yonkous > than shichis and marines, so if they're disrupted, things'll get serious.

beastboy
October 14, 2009, 05:39 PM
Well I'm a supporter from the theory "Raftel is a sky Island" but I think it isn't just it..
Maybe its a special Island that is only there 20 sec to 20 sec.. So you need absolute right timing to jumo to it.. otherwise you lose.. And that was why Roger was alone.. to let is nakamas safe!!

OdaisaGod
October 14, 2009, 06:48 PM
Where was it ever said that Roger was the only one to ever reach Raftel? Yes it has been said numerous times that only Roger and his crew were able to complete the Grand Line trip but nothing has ever been said that Roger alone went to Raftel without his crew. In fact based on what Rayleigh said here (http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/507/05/) and Robin's belief that the true history is located on Raftel I tend to think that everyone on Roger's crew was on Raftel.

To those that are wondering what might be so special about Raftel that none of the Yonkous seem to go there I have this idea. Only the D's are able to find the route to Raftel but if there are others on the crew they can come along also. Either that or all of the Yonkou have already been to Raftel and what they found there doesn't interest them anymore. In other words reaching Raftel does not necessarily mean that you are the Pirate King.

NoLimit89
October 14, 2009, 07:34 PM
It's very simple how Roger's crew reached Raftel but none of the other pirate crews (including Whitebeard) were able to. There's obviously something that Roger knew that the others didn't. What can it be??

THE POWER TO READ THE POLYGLYPHS!!!

I suspect that the way to reach Raftel is probably a dead end unless you can decifer the polyglyphs and find a secret way through. Maybe whitebeard wanted to make Ace PK because he thought that Ace might have inherited this ability to hear all things from Roger and hence be able to find the secret way to Raftel.

And of course, Luffy can become the PK because he has Robin!!!

deffkryz
October 14, 2009, 08:29 PM
Where was it ever said that Roger was the only one to ever reach Raftel? Yes it has been said numerous times that only Roger and his crew were able to complete the Grand Line trip but nothing has ever been said that Roger alone went to Raftel without his crew. In fact based on what Rayleigh said here (http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/507/05/) and Robin's belief that the true history is located on Raftel I tend to think that everyone on Roger's crew was on Raftel.


--> Chapter 105, p.8 (http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/105/08/) - Crocus said so. And he became part of Roger's crew twenty-five years ago. So he needs to know, doesn't he? :P


To those that are wondering what might be so special about Raftel that none of the Yonkous seem to go there I have this idea. Only the D's are able to find the route to Raftel but if there are others on the crew they can come along also. Either that or all of the Yonkou have already been to Raftel and what they found there doesn't interest them anymore. In other words reaching Raftel does not necessarily mean that you are the Pirate King.

Why should only the D.s be able to get to Raftel? That would already exclude all supernovae crews from Sabaody unless Oda hid a "D" in their names. Wouldn't that make the manga itself quite boring?

That island is simply special because it's the island wherein all magnetic routes of the Grand Line merge. That is all we know about that island: Oda didn't tell us where exactly that island is located. He never said why only Roger and his crew were able to get there - but apparently it's because most pirates die eventually on the Grand Line like Yohki, Brook and their mates.

OdaisaGod
October 15, 2009, 12:25 AM
--> Chapter 105, p.8 (http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/105/08/) - Crocus said so. And he became part of Roger's crew twenty-five years ago. So he needs to know, doesn't he? :P

Thank you for proving my point for me. I was responding to several earlier posts that suggested that only Roger and NOT his crew ever went to Raftel. The page you gave actually proves the point I was making so thanks I was just too lazy to find it.

And no I don't necessarily think that if only D's can make it to Raftel that the manga would somehow become boring as a result. I also don't necessarily think that only D's can make it to Raftel but was rather offering a hypothesis that might explain why neither Whitebeard or Shanks has seemingly ever gone to Raftel.

Lord Rayleigh
October 15, 2009, 02:22 AM
And he became part of Roger's crew twenty-five years ago.
Where was it said ? Knowing they conquered the GL in 3-4 years, that they met Crocus at the Twin Caps and that Roger has been executed one year after he has been named PK and it was 22 years ago : it should have been 26-27 years ago, no ?


That island is simply special because it's the island wherein all magnetic routes of the Grand Line merge. That is all we know about that island: Oda didn't tell us where exactly that island is located. He never said why only Roger and his crew were able to get there - but apparently it's because most pirates die eventually on the Grand Line like Yohki, Brook and their mates.
Fishman Island is the first island in the GL road wherein all magnetic roads merge and Rough Tale is the second one. So, Rough Tale is not special or legendary because of that : it is rather because this is the last island on the GL journey.
According to the map (http://img200.imageshack.us/i/82808181.jpg/) when Crocus talked about it, Rough Tale is before the Reverse Mountain.

Akainu
October 15, 2009, 03:08 AM
yh, those maps are quite some interesting stuff. I accidently stumbled upon some pretty exact maps Oda drew, in the 10th treasure special, which shows all of their journey up to W7. I wouldn't take that for granted though, as the place where AL should be and ID too is somehow covered by a huge island connecting GL and one of the blues.

k-dom
October 15, 2009, 03:02 PM
After Vivi joined the crew, she said that the climat just after reverse mountain was harsh because of all the magnetic fields put together, maybe it is similar (or worse) in the end of grand line. That would explain what it is difficult to reach it.

bittman
October 15, 2009, 11:43 PM
I like that idea k-dom, that the magnetic fields coming together centres on Raftel meaning that no ship can possibly approach it.

Remember how Nami suddenly had to have the ship do a 180 out of nowhere? Imagine if that happened a lot around Raftel and you never actually got closer?

Perhaps also it has something to do with the Lock-Post. What if, just because you're close to Raftel, none of the islands will memorise the location of Raftel and so people just take a blind guess trying to sail towards it?

Lots of possibilities...

Lord Rayleigh
October 16, 2009, 04:32 PM
What you've just said seems very likely because Raftel is a legendary island which means there are no scientist proofs of its existence. The only people that transformed this legend into reality was the Pirate King's crew according to the story.
So, it is likely that the logposts cannot work there, that it is impossible to sail at the end of the GL, that you cannot see very well in this part of the sea, otherwise some people would have found ways to proove definitely its existence.

Bugzee
October 18, 2009, 12:50 PM
I like the idea k-dom pointed out!

It was always going to be extremely difficult to get to the last island, Raftel, even when Crocus said it i got the feeling that the SH crew would struggle on a whole another level to reach the island once they're near the end of the GL.

To think unpredictable tornadoes, sudden storms, serpent waves and other crazy weather-related occurences have already been witnessed on the GL - i wonder what kinda chaotic conditions there'll be near the end of the GL and surrounding Raftel! I wonder what kind of creatures lol live near there as well!!!


The Thousand Sunny will make it!!!!!!

beastboy
October 18, 2009, 05:47 PM
What about the penultimate island of the grind line be just like Little garden, you have to wait one hundred years to get there!
And Roger Crew make just like luffy would do if he hasn't found an eternal pose to Alabasta, Sail without one!!

Poneglyph420
October 18, 2009, 06:07 PM
I like the idea k-dom pointed out!

It was always going to be extremely difficult to get to the last island, Raftel, even when Crocus said it i got the feeling that the SH crew would struggle on a whole another level to reach the island once they're near the end of the GL.

To think unpredictable tornadoes, sudden storms, serpent waves and other crazy weather-related occurences have already been witnessed on the GL - i wonder what kinda chaotic conditions there'll be near the end of the GL and surrounding Raftel! I wonder what kind of creatures lol live near there as well!!!


The Thousand Sunny will make it!!!!!!

I think ONLY ships made of the eternal Adam wood can handle the route that leads to Raftel. It must be the most dangerous seas there are!

It might also be another Island where you have to sail blindly to find it.
I'm equally excited to see the New World and the dead lock warfare that could be. Maybe only one of the routes through the NW can actually lead to Raftel....

Bugzee
October 18, 2009, 06:30 PM
I think ONLY ships made of the eternal Adam wood can handle the route that leads to Raftel. It must be the most dangerous seas there are!

It might also be another Island where you have to sail blindly to find it.
I'm equally excited to see the New World and the dead lock warfare that could be. Maybe only one of the routes through the NW can actually lead to Raftel....

You got some gd points! I cant wait for the battles in the NW as well! I like the idea of one route through the NW can actually make it to Raftel maybe dependent on particular currents towards the end of the GL?

Since Raftel is a legendary island and it obvioulsy must have a great history, i think that it might be the island that has the hard evidence of what was going on in the void years. Maybe the last remains/evidence that the WG couldnt reach or obtain is on Raftel? Raftel could also be the place where the super weapons like the pluton might have originated from?

Poneglyph420
October 19, 2009, 05:08 AM
You got some gd points! I cant wait for the battles in the NW as well! I like the idea of one route through the NW can actually make it to Raftel maybe dependent on particular currents towards the end of the GL?

Since Raftel is a legendary island and it obvioulsy must have a great history, i think that it might be the island that has the hard evidence of what was going on in the void years. Maybe the last remains/evidence that the WG couldnt reach or obtain is on Raftel? Raftel could also be the place where the super weapons like the pluton might have originated from?

I see the recurrent theme of Fate and Will playing a part of getting to Raftel..
It's pure speculation but I think Raftel has some ruin or relic of the Void Century.. Maybe even proof the D's once were royalty??..

No doubt we will find Poseidon.

elitefox
October 19, 2009, 08:25 AM
What you've just said seems very likely because Raftel is a legendary island which means there are no scientist proofs of its existence. The only people that transformed this legend into reality was the Pirate King's crew according to the story.
So, it is likely that the logposts cannot work there, that it is impossible to sail at the end of the GL, that you cannot see very well in this part of the sea, otherwise some people would have found ways to proove definitely its existence.

then shanks and buggy may have know the existence of this ?

why haven't shanks go to that island, can't he do it? or he doesn't just want to become pk?
[hr]

I see the recurrent theme of Fate and Will playing a part of getting to Raftel..
It's pure speculation but I think Raftel has some ruin or relic of the Void Century.. Maybe even proof the D's once were royalty??..

No doubt we will find Poseidon.

or the devil that created the devil fruit:darn

Bugzee
October 19, 2009, 09:58 AM
Anyone going to see the One Piece 10 movie in Japan?? Dammit i want one of those One Piece Volume Zero books!!!!!!

Lord Rayleigh
October 19, 2009, 02:50 PM
then shanks and buggy may have know the existence of this ?

why haven't shanks go to that island, can't he do it? or he doesn't just want to become pk?

It seems likely that Shanks and Buggy know Raftel because Crocus said that according to history, the PK's crew went there.
About your question, I cannot answer expect by speculations :
- Shanks doesn't want to get back there
- Shanks can't get back there with his crew and boat

bittman
October 19, 2009, 05:35 PM
I was just thinking about the One Piece 0th Volume:

It's said it takes place 20 years before the current timeline, and wasn't Roger's death 22 years before current timeline?

Meaning what we're probably going to see is the aftermath. I'd place a good bet on Shanks gathering his crew, but Dragon, Whitebeard and baby Ace might all make an appearance. Any other ideas of what it might be about?

Razh
October 19, 2009, 06:25 PM
Dadan is bound to appear. She (yeah, I think it's a woman) was probably raising Ace not long after his birth. Maybe she's Garp's daughter. That would be funny.
I also think that it could show Dragon.

One more thing came to my mind. We don't know shit about Blackbeard's origin. We might find out something about that too. And also, I'd like to see Shanks and Blackbeard fighting.

blackking187
October 19, 2009, 07:27 PM
Prediction

10th member will be introduced in the fisherman's ark will probably a fishermen and will be 4th in strength.

Black beard is not the final enemy of luffy, I predict that he and luffy will be friends in the future

WB is gonna sacrifice himself in this war and die.

Luffy's bounty 1.000.000.000 it would be right after all the shit he did

Don't think that every sh member will use haki

How is hancock going to do without luffy after the war will she be sick and die, or is luffy going to acknowledge his love and with that she can manage, or will she become a sh member

bittman
October 19, 2009, 10:36 PM
One more thing came to my mind. We don't know shit about Blackbeard's origin. We might find out something about that too. And also, I'd like to see Shanks and Blackbeard fighting.

This x10.

Also, how long ago was Ohara's destruction? Isn't Robin 28?

And how long ago was Tom's Worker's established? Probably also around 20 years.

I don't know, this Volume 0 is way more exciting to me than the WB war. I mean, Bleach is terrible but then it did a major flashback with negative numbered chapters and that turned it really good again...then it got bad, but the point is:

What does a manga that's already awesome do in a flashback to make it more awesome?

OdaisaGod
October 19, 2009, 10:53 PM
I suspect that all that Oth volume will be about is Kinjishi. Who he was, how he got captured and how he finally broke out of Impel Down. In that we would likely see something about Shanks, Whitebeard and Garp but don't expect some fully focused on them volume. Seeing Dragon or any of the other big names than those mentioned seems highly unlikely to me but who knows.

elitefox
October 19, 2009, 11:44 PM
I hope the real spoiler comes out soon...


yeah I don't think boa will survive if she is far away from luffy except a promise from luffy that he will come back for her and she has to be alive like the whale.

OunknownO
October 20, 2009, 06:37 AM
Does anyone share my opinion, that 10th character will look similar to this guy?

http://mangahelpers.com/photoplog/images/2/1_4-1.jpg

Razh
October 20, 2009, 06:43 AM
Sure, Strawhats are in a desperate need for an accountant. Someone needs to cut those expenses and keep Nami in line.

OunknownO
October 20, 2009, 06:49 AM
Sure, Strawhats are in a desperate need for an accountant. Someone needs to cut those expenses and keep Nami in line.

sanji is dressed in a similar fasion...

misterchaos
October 20, 2009, 09:54 AM
Does anyone share my opinion, that 10th character will look similar to this guy?

http://mangahelpers.com/photoplog/images/2/1_4-1.jpg

Does he appear in the movie ?!? who is he ??

chess4
October 20, 2009, 10:16 AM
Does anyone share my opinion, that 10th character will look similar to this guy?

http://mangahelpers.com/photoplog/images/2/1_4-1.jpg

this guy could be the strawhats next nakama. he looks like a fishman or merean. more than likely though he is a part of the new movie, but i would love for him to be the next crewmate. he looks tough

Razh
October 20, 2009, 12:46 PM
That guy won't be the next SH. He's a movie character. How do you guys suppose he's going to join the crew in manga time line? I wouldn't get my hopes up for him being the next SH.
Also, the guy's name is Kitajima and he's voiced by a swimer and olimpic gold medal winner, Kitajima (what were the odds). I think he swims breast stroke.

misterchaos
October 20, 2009, 03:33 PM
That guy won't be the next SH. He's a movie character. How do you guys suppose he's going to join the crew in manga time line? I wouldn't get my hopes up for him being the next SH.
Also, the guy's name is Kitajima and he's voiced by a swimer and olimpic gold medal winner, Kitajima (what were the odds). I think he swims breast stroke.

we said that will look something like that not him... :darn

elitefox
October 20, 2009, 05:09 PM
Jimbei? haha if this old shibu joins sh,

I don't know what will happen to the bounty of all SH crew. The world will hunt them down for sure like dragon :D

Razh
October 20, 2009, 05:29 PM
we said that will look something like that not him... :darn

What's that we stuff?

This is what you wrote.

Does he appear in the movie ?!? who is he ??

He thinks that the next crewman will look simmilar to Kitajima.

Does anyone share my opinion, that 10th character will look similar to this guy?

http://mangahelpers.com/photoplog/images/2/1_4-1.jpg

Notice the "this guy could be the strawhats next nakama" sentence.

this guy could be the strawhats next nakama. he looks like a fishman or merean. more than likely though he is a part of the new movie, but i would love for him to be the next crewmate. he looks tough

Are we satisfied now?

Bugzee
October 21, 2009, 09:44 AM
Its pretty much certain that the next SH member will come from Fishmen Islands! Unless Boa joins the SH crew, but i still dont think it'll happen.

Jinbei would be awesome lol but it wouldnt suit the balance of the whole crew, besides he got his own pirate crew which im still dying for Oda to reveal!

Sherlock Holmes
October 21, 2009, 09:10 PM
You know, I was thinking...
Who would win in a fight? Popeye or Luffy?
http://fc05.deviantart.com/fs8/i/2005/353/e/1/Luffy_vs__Popeye_v2_by_bugonisx2.jpg
(from http://bugonisx2.deviantart.com/art/Luffy-vs-Popeye-v2-26604862?)

I'd bet on Popeye.

llmcduff
October 21, 2009, 09:32 PM
Prediction
How is hancock going to do without luffy after the war will she be sick and die, or is luffy going to acknowledge his love and with that she can manage, or will she become a sh member
Very interesting. Maybe she will vow to wait for him, out of respect of his quest to be private king. Or she and her crew will ally themselves w/ SH to help him out in the NW. Anyway you look at it, can't see she join SH or Luffy marrying her. Hmm.. maybe marry then go on his quest and make her wait?? Nahhhhh..

Which one of you, if you are Luffy, would leave everything and marry her fine derrière?

Sherlock Holmes
October 21, 2009, 09:47 PM
Very interesting. Maybe she will vow to wait for him, out of respect of his quest to be private king. Or she and her crew will ally themselves w/ SH to help him out in the NW. Anyway you look at it, can't see she join SH or Luffy marrying her. Hmm.. maybe marry then go on his quest and make her wait?? Nahhhhh..

Which one of you, if you are Luffy, would leave everything and marry her fine derrière?
....Luffy having limited lifespan...One girl waiting for him...
...WAIT. Is One Piece turning into The Princess Bride?
AWESOME. If I were Luffy, I would go with that choice if only to make it more Princess Bride-like.

BlackHair
October 22, 2009, 06:20 AM
If Pell can survive a giant explosion, then she can survive love sickness. For Gods sake, can we drop that already?

Bugzee
October 22, 2009, 06:36 AM
^ LOL :XD that was so funny when Pell survived that explosion. Yea, its true Hancock can survive. Wonder whats gonna happen to Amazon Lily after the war - will her sisters takeover and will they get protection from WB or somebody else against the WG??

On another note - cant wait for OP movie 10 :D

Poneglyph420
October 22, 2009, 09:54 PM
Amazon lily should be just fine after the war. My only concern would be those pesky PX's we saw back at Shabondy. If the Marines/WG sent a wack of them to attack it would be a bloodbath. But We don't know if Boa would join Luffy or not yet. She's in love sure...BUT we don't know if it's so powerful that she can't function anymore. Nyon made it back to AL after falling in love, so so should Boa via that logic.

I'd love to see her with the SH like Vivi was....

or at my house waiting for me....

Bugzee
October 23, 2009, 06:23 PM
Amazon lily should be just fine after the war. My only concern would be those pesky PX's we saw back at Shabondy. If the Marines/WG sent a wack of them to attack it would be a bloodbath. But We don't know if Boa would join Luffy or not yet. She's in love sure...BUT we don't know if it's so powerful that she can't function anymore. Nyon made it back to AL after falling in love, so so should Boa via that logic.

I'd love to see her with the SH like Vivi was....

or at my house waiting for me....

Good point! It should work i guess!

I wonder whether Dragon will come up with something to counter those PX's, i mean not robot-like but i mean something as fierce and powerful as the PX's. It would be really cool if did!!

Bling
October 24, 2009, 07:24 PM
Its pretty much certain that the next SH member will come from Fishmen Islands! Unless Boa joins the SH crew, but i still dont think it'll happen.

Jinbei would be awesome lol but it wouldnt suit the balance of the whole crew, besides he got his own pirate crew which im still dying for Oda to reveal!

I was so sure after the Impel Down "arc" that it would be Bon-chan who would join the SH crew (and i would be SO happy about it, he is one of my faves, along with panty-peeper-lover Brooke). But now I'm at a loss.

I really wonder if Shanks or Dragon will show up. Also I'm REALLY intrigued into seeing what went on with Kuma turning him-self in a robot. Pretty sure there is a huge reason behind ( I'm kind of getting the hint that he is still under Dragon's command for some reason, something like a spy...)

Bugzee
October 24, 2009, 07:36 PM
I still feel that Kuma is a spy for Dragon. If Vegapunk has no relation to Dragon, im sure Dragon has his own vegapunk-like character or member in the revolutionary army! Maybe not on the same level, but i still feel he has scientists/hackers or what not.

Katz
October 25, 2009, 01:44 AM
Maybe Vegapunk himself is a loyal follower of Dragon, we really haven't had much if any interaction with him.

Bugzee
October 25, 2009, 09:45 AM
Well, hopefully Oda will soon introduce Vegapunk to us! Maybe during the Fishmen Island Arc or just after! or even b4! :cool:

Zehahaha
October 25, 2009, 12:44 PM
Well, hopefully Oda will soon introduce Vegapunk to us! Maybe during the Fishmen Island Arc or just after! or even b4! :cool:

I think before, he will show hum eating some pop corn while watching the war, that would be cool :p

Black Lagoon
October 25, 2009, 01:07 PM
AGREE XD, I'm sure he's there contemplating the efficiency oof his manufacture/product (PX) :kukuku

Bugzee
October 25, 2009, 02:10 PM
I think before, he will show hum eating some pop corn while watching the war, that would be cool :p

LOL a tall green-like vegapunk eating popcorn while sitting back watching the war just sounds so funny!! lol

I guess its kinda due for Oda to reveal and introduce Vegapunk sooner this war is over!

Poneglyph420
October 25, 2009, 03:19 PM
It's for sure that Vegapunk is watching the war.. Prob from cameras in the PX league.
But doubtful he will be involved til after the war. I know in a past SBS Oda said we will learn more and meet him..but not when..

IMO we will see Vegapunk and other major players (BB, Dragon, remaining Yonkou)
in the aftermath of the war..

Bugzee
October 25, 2009, 06:47 PM
Hey does anyone think that Vegapunk is the same creature/being like Moria and that Impel Down officer/guard?

zerocooldx
October 25, 2009, 06:52 PM
Hey does anyone think that Vegapunk is the same creature/being like Moria and that Impel Down officer/guard?

I honestly see him as being somewhat of a loud-mouth, arrogant, pint-sized point-dexter. But whether or not he is human or something else, i don't know. I would guess he is human though.

Bugzee
October 25, 2009, 07:00 PM
I honestly see him as being somewhat of a loud-mouth, arrogant, pint-sized point-dexter. But whether or not he is human or something else, i don't know. I would guess he is human though.

Yea i can see him being loud and arrogant as well!

LOL i cant wait to see his subordinates lol

Poneglyph420
October 25, 2009, 07:02 PM
Back in Thriller Bark we saw this image:
http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/485/10/

While we don't see the face, it seems like Vegapunk would be a normal guy, except for his genius. Though it's undetermined if he's a collected Di Vinci type or a "Mad Scientist" type. I guess we will find out eventually...

OdaForPresident
October 25, 2009, 07:07 PM
My guess, Vegapunk is human and he's a kid. Maybe not a really young kid but like 15, 16. I think he's working for the WG just so that he can play around with all kinds of cool machines and stuff and that he either doesn't care what the government does with his invention, he's being kept in the dark or he's being forced. I think he's going to become a SH ally in the end.

sarutobi_sensei
October 25, 2009, 08:02 PM
My guess, Vegapunk is human and he's a kid. Maybe not a really young kid but like 15, 16. I think he's working for the WG just so that he can play around with all kinds of cool machines and stuff and that he either doesn't care what the government does with his invention, he's being kept in the dark or he's being forced. I think he's going to become a SH ally in the end.

I can actually see that.

Imo Vegapunk's a kind of Franken Stein (from Soul Eater) kinda guy. I actually don't see him as a "Hahahaha I can do all this because I'm a genius so yeah shut up bitches", kind of guy. I dunno, maybe he's even being "forced" to do all this.

Gcat88
October 25, 2009, 09:29 PM
i can actually see Dr.Vegapunk being some genius kid or a kid that didnt want to die and became a robot, i imagine something like sasori from naruto. (not that naruto and OP have anything in common AT ALL!!!!!!!!!!!) i highly doubt he will became anything like an ally to the SH, maybe his subordinates, but not him.
Poneglyph420 AWESOME SIGN!!!

Fox666
October 25, 2009, 09:33 PM
If Vegapunk can create a Pacifista, it's way overpower.

Bugzee
October 25, 2009, 10:31 PM
Wonder what else his created other then the Pacifista, if he has hes own ship i wanna see it!!!

Poneglyph420
October 26, 2009, 01:06 AM
i can actually see Dr.Vegapunk being some genius kid or a kid that didnt want to die and became a robot, i imagine something like sasori from naruto. (not that naruto and OP have anything in common AT ALL!!!!!!!!!!!) i highly doubt he will became anything like an ally to the SH, maybe his subordinates, but not him.
Poneglyph420 AWESOME SIGN!!!

Thanks, one of the many pics i found on the interweb.....
I'm hoping that he is a mystery a bit longer.

It's nice not having a clue about some things..

Shisu
October 26, 2009, 07:21 AM
Wonder what else his created other then the Pacifista, if he has hes own ship i wanna see it!!!

UFO. lol


Thanks, one of the many pics i found on the interweb.....
I'm hoping that he is a mystery a bit longer.

It's nice not having a clue about some things..

remember when chopper was talking about hogback and we saw a silhouette of him?
well, it was just in choppers mind and yeah hogback looked pretty far away of what he used to be.

all l want to say is, that those arent any proofs of how he will look like or something else.

beastboy
October 26, 2009, 07:48 AM
I think of Vegapunk as Verde from Reborn!.. or like Stein..
But I can picture him like Einstein with that crazy loock and that air!!

A teenager would be good for the Lulz.. a teenager who like apple and as the time time no mi!! I can see that (don't ask me why I added the apple!!)

ps: I think Vega Punk is a revolutionary and we will see something like all does PX exploding!
Or just turn off.. and kuma will have is memory back!

Bugzee
October 26, 2009, 09:20 AM
LOL Vegapunk in a UFO - that would be funny!!!

But seriously he must have some crazy out of this world creations that are just lying around in his lab!

toxun
October 28, 2009, 03:06 AM
LOL Vegapunk in a UFO - that would be funny!!!

But seriously he must have some crazy out of this world creations that are just lying around in his lab!

So we must see more of Franky I guess to see some of those :)

NoLimit89
October 28, 2009, 04:22 AM
vegapunk ate the brain brain fruit

>.>

Bugzee
October 28, 2009, 08:58 AM
lol brain brain fruit u know! that would kinda be awkward! lol

I wonder if has very strange habits/hobbies putting aside his day to day work LOL :XD

Black Lagoon
October 28, 2009, 06:57 PM
I really hope that Ussop is fat when the strawhats meet again ... so he can't run and must become brave, stay and fight as a man :shakefist

Gcat88
October 29, 2009, 09:05 AM
both of those are cool. vegapunk ate brain brain fruit is interesting. plus it could be something like he has the brain of everyone he has ever met together. fat usopp XD!!! thats all i gotta say to that

◆ T.D.A ◆
October 29, 2009, 11:08 AM
do you think Oda could do more to show more people of different skin colour?

goldb
October 29, 2009, 11:22 AM
You know what TDA, I've been meaning to mention this for a while but it had completely slipped my mind.

Well as of right now, we have a few black characters, others of questionable colours and then there are other races that have been gradually introduced.

I hope that Oda DOES show more coloured people as well as generally people of different ethnicity instead of just different races all together.

Black Lagoon
October 29, 2009, 11:53 AM
do you think Oda could do more to show more people of different skin colour?


take a look at what they've done here
(the last one)

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/3710/onepiececensuraao1.jpg

Schabrak
October 29, 2009, 12:15 PM
Well coloring him white was the right choice... Just look how racist was drawn with his whole look and those lips.-_- All pictures are just bleached up a bit, so it's no wonder, that Zorros skin is lighter on the censored pictures. Can't do anything about the truth, if you put more into something that is not there. And well it's the world of One Piece. There don't have to be "any" black people in it.

OunknownO
October 29, 2009, 01:51 PM
japan=>WW2=>atomic bomb=>american occupation after the war for 7 years=>influence of the white people:=>japanese are having complexes as a nation=>after couple generations boom of anime and manga=> majority of characters are white

Akainu
October 29, 2009, 02:42 PM
that's a rather simple way to explain this. oyu should then take into account, that japanese are asians and that the population is very homogeneous.
I would even go as far as to say, that there is hardly any real black character in OP as in of a supposed african origin.
On the contrary, there are rather "white" people and those that were exposed to the sun a little more. Other races are covered by fantasy creatures like fishmen etc. so Oda doesn't even positively discriminate any races that exist in the real world as that's totally unimportant for One Piece.
Dunno what the issue here is, if it was a french or american comic I'd expect it, but here...

Razh
October 29, 2009, 02:50 PM
I would even go as far as to say, that there is hardly any real black character in OP as in of a supposed african origin.


I can't recall anyone but Mr.1, that Buggy's crewman and Usopp.
Not that Usopp is a real black man because his father obviously had mixed parents.
Oh that's right, I almost forgot. Marco and Aokiji also look like they have mixed origin.

Lord Rayleigh
October 29, 2009, 02:54 PM
I can't recall anyone but Mr.1, that Buggy's crewman and Usopp.
Not that Usopp is a real black man because his father obviously had mixed parents.
Oh that's right, I almost forgot. Marco and Aokiji also look like they have mixed origin.
We have Mr 5 that is definitely a black person.

Razh
October 29, 2009, 03:03 PM
We have Mr 5 that is definitely a black person.

Yeah, forgot about him completely.

And remembered one more. Kuromarimo, the guy with king Wapol.

EDIT:Also, what's up with Brooke? He doesn't look like a black man and yet he has an afro.
And also Hamburger or what's his name, from Foxy pirates.

Lord Rayleigh
October 29, 2009, 05:34 PM
Yeah, forgot about him completely.

And remembered one more. Kuromarimo, the guy with king Wapol.

EDIT:Also, what's up with Brooke? He doesn't look like a black man and yet he has an afro.
And also Hamburger or what's his name, from Foxy pirates.
Yeah, some people of OP have some black aspects.
About Hamburger, he is a Monkeyman, like the ones we've seen in Shabondy Archipelago and who were in the slave business and like the ones of Java we've seen with Montblanc and who were in the wreck business.

◆ T.D.A ◆
October 29, 2009, 05:42 PM
Mr.5 was black?

Lord Rayleigh
October 29, 2009, 05:44 PM
Mr.5 was black?
It is obvious.

◆ T.D.A ◆
October 29, 2009, 05:49 PM
It is obvious.

Is it, he's light coloured. If he was black, he would be darker IMO, I just think he's like Aokiji, dark tanned japanese.

Razh
October 29, 2009, 05:56 PM
About Hamburger, he is a Monkeyman,

I never thought that I'll see such a level of racism on this forum.:p

Seriously though, I don't recall seeing a monkeyman on the slave auction listing.

But thanks, I just remembered that Masira and Shoujou were also black. At least partly.

Regarding Mr.5, his hair man, his hair!
Since we're with Baroque, I think Miss Monday (hulking nun) could also be black.

When you think about it, they aren't that rare. There's certainly more of them than in most manga.

◆ T.D.A ◆
October 29, 2009, 06:00 PM
The hair doesn't make him black, Aokiji has hair that might be associated with black people and we know he isn't black.

I guess ethnicity doesn't really exist in OP like how we know it in RL.

beastboy
October 29, 2009, 06:03 PM
What about the big reinforcement in this war be the missing baroque works...
Miss golden week would be a huge turn out... taint yellow (i think) and everybody targets there!!
And she would be teaming up with mr3..
mr4 and mr 5 would team up croc, and so would the animals..
the ones that were owned in whiskey peak would be with WB...
But the ones I miss more is miss wednesday and mr8 T_T!!
MR9 would be a good add tough!

Razh
October 29, 2009, 06:30 PM
The hair doesn't make him black, Aokiji has hair that might be associated with black people and we know he isn't black.


We don't know that. Aokiji looks like he has mixed origin to me. He's drawn with lips and his tan is dark.
If you want to consider Mr.5 white boy, that's your thing, but white boys don't have hair like that. To me, he looks like Warrick from CSI: Las Vegas.

EDIT: Gedatsu too.

Poneglyph420
October 29, 2009, 07:22 PM
Coming from a guy who lived in Japan for years.. You can see every possible look and stereotype, but on a Japanese person...Dudes who pay to get dreads or nappy hair (Which would be common at sea..) and girls tan until they look latin Also someone from Hokkaido compared to someone from Okinawa.

It's a fantasy world we can't expect the same "laws" to apply from the real world to a manga.

Razh
October 29, 2009, 07:27 PM
It's a fantasy world we can't expect the same "laws" to apply from the real world to a manga.

What laws? We were discussing about black guys in One Piece and I numbered most of them probably.
It's not really hard to recognize them. They have emphasized lips, darker tan and thicker hair.

Fox666
October 29, 2009, 11:34 PM
Someone to be black doesn't necessarly need to be colored darker. Since it's a black and white manga it is much more expressive to make these big lips and thicker hair.

If you think about it, being limited to black white it's better to make all characters lighter so that you can always use white tint.

Poneglyph420
October 30, 2009, 02:27 AM
What laws? We were discussing about black guys in One Piece and I numbered most of them probably.
It's not really hard to recognize them. They have emphasized lips, darker tan and thicker hair.

Maybe since there are no continents OP doesn't have ethnicity like we do.
Based on what we have seen sure there are elements of all the ethnicities on earth in OP. But because Mr.5 had nappy like hair he was black.
I've seen japanese guys that look just like him.

I however won't disturb your discussion.

Razh
October 30, 2009, 02:31 AM
I've seen japanese guys that look just like him.


I've seen white guys everywhere that have hair like that. It's not naturally like that.
Oda made it simple enough. He gave Mr.5 and others some features which make them look black, and they have darker tan in anime. I don't think anime staff was guessing who could be black, like we do here.

◆ T.D.A ◆
October 30, 2009, 06:59 AM
Aokiji is based on a japanese actor. Know your stuff.

Razh
October 30, 2009, 07:21 AM
Aokiji is based on a japanese actor. Know your stuff.

Lol, it's not exactly a secret.
But that doesn't change the fact that Aokiji has some african traits. He may have been based on a japanese actor but Oda has added some different features. It's not like he made a carbon copy of him. He copied the general appearance, manners and gestures. Unless I'm mistaken, Matsuda wasn't taller than most of the NBA players. That alone shows that Oda made changes to the original.

Damn, now that I think about it, Sengoku had afro when he was younger. Could he also have mixed origins? :p

Schabrak
October 30, 2009, 08:20 AM
Why did I have to press Esc yesterday... XD All my text was gone and I was to lazy to rewrite it.

Can't white or tanned people in One Piece have such type of hair only "black" people have in real world? Racial traits may not be asscociated/belong to some race like we have in the RL. Just remember those bushman from the isle Chopper fell onto. They are clearly white and tanned. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBf38d3pxmM 8:30 Hm I'm working against my Anime!=Manga point right now. ^^

Here's the Cover with Miss Monday? and Mr.5. http://i675.photobucket.com/albums/vv118/yabekiriko/mini13.jpg (http://img170.imagevenue.com/aAfkjfp01fo1i-20098/loc954/08354_One_Piece_v13_122_954lo.jpg)
I don't know if Oda intended to let them look black or just tanned, but both have those characteristic lips. No racism here. :) At least not as african as in the Anime... And if they are of the offpring of some racial mixture we are definitly missing some clearly black people in OP.

On the japanese isle in Rocket Girls, there was a dark tanned population too.

Razh
October 30, 2009, 09:18 AM
Seems to me that Daz Bones is the only real black guy. Others have mixed origins.
Why is it so hard to think that the african traits are a result of having black ancestors? Why is it easy to think that white men in One Piece have african characteristics?

I think it's rather simple. One Piece world probably has a long history and races have intermixed through that history.
I think Oda didn't think about it as much though. We could end up finding out that there are a lot of black people in some region. Right now, it's open to guessing.

I don't think the animators decided to darken them on their own though, Mr.5 and Monday.

Schabrak
October 30, 2009, 09:46 AM
We have seen people from all over the OP world(every Blue) and in none of them I have seen a pair or group of people looking different from the usual "white" man. While on the real world people from different lines of latitude have clearly different traits. Those "different" in OP must come from secluded isles. And most likey as you have pointed out, races must have mixed up pretty much with all those pretty "little" isles and ship and trading connections without constrictions to travel around the world.

goldb
October 30, 2009, 11:30 AM
Alrighty, I'm just gonna make a list of characters I consider to be of black or mixed origins, so we can discuss this and mattes or race properly.

PS. This is my list and from my own conclusion...

-Sengoku- I used to think he was white, but after seeing the flashback and the afro I think like Razh said he could be of mixed origins.

-Aokiji- I have always seen him as black
-Mr.1
-Mr.5
-Miss Monday
-Gedatsu
-Ussop- mixed
-Brook-
-Yassop
-Masira
-Shoujo
-Vice Admiral Yamakaji
-Commander Ripper
-Lieutenant Junior Rokakku
-John Giant
-Ohm
-Doberman- he could just be dark skinned
-Onigumo
-Rockstar

There's definetly more but my head hurts, so if anyone can add to it or whatever...

SenninSage
October 30, 2009, 11:48 AM
Alrighty, I'm just gonna make a list of characters I consider to be of black or mixed origins, so we can discuss this and mattes or race properly.

PS. This is my list and from my own conclusion...

-Sengoku- I used to think he was white, but after seeing the flashback and the afro I think like Razh said he could be of mixed origins.

-Aokiji- I have always seen him as black
-Mr.1
-Mr.5
-Miss Monday
-Gedatsu
-Ussop- mixed
-Brook-
-Yassop
-Masira
-Shoujo
-Vice Admiral Yamakaji
-Commander Ripper
-Lieutenant Junior Rokakku
-John Giant
-Ohm
-Doberman- he could just be dark skinned
-Onigumo
-Rockstar

There's definetly more but my head hurts, so if anyone can add to it or whatever...

You forgot Afro Thunder Luffy!

Akainu
October 30, 2009, 12:49 PM
and that's exactly it. an "afro" doesn't make you of african origin in any kind of way.
especially for characters like Aokiji for whom we got definite models, in this case Yusaku Matsuda (http://www.jfast.net/%7Eaisuru/tanteigazo.htm) (even from a single role he played), we can tell it's just a little more tan and no racial issue. here it even includes the hair, which despite being curly, also is formed after the actors example.

as for some others of your list, I wouldn't put Masira and Shoujo on there. they are likely apes or ape mixes. I know about the stereotype, so it would be unappropriate for that reason alone.

◆ T.D.A ◆
October 30, 2009, 01:00 PM
If Oda really did created a black character he wouldn't given them dark skin, like Killer Bee, Raikage, Tousen have.

Razh
October 30, 2009, 02:13 PM
If Oda really did created a black character he wouldn't given them dark skin, like Killer Bee, Raikage, Tousen have.

You're talking about different mangas from different authors with different styles. If there were black people in One Piece Oda would have drawn them like Kishimoto and Kubo did. That's what you're saying?

Yeah, who gives a shit about anime. It's not like Oda instructed the animators how to color people's skin. They just decided on their own.

And I believe you meant "would have".
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and that's exactly it. an "afro" doesn't make you of african origin in any kind of way.

HINT: Luffy had a wig.:p

We don't know that. Afro is a typical black people trait. Maybe Oda did decide that he's going to extend afros to other races too. Who knows.
There really isn't any way to know, and that question will pop out in SBS like never.

deffkryz
October 30, 2009, 02:56 PM
If Oda really did created a black character he wouldn't given them dark skin, like Killer Bee, Raikage, Tousen have.

Right, he created a black character and didn't give him a dark skin. You guys remember that 4kids censorship because of some "blackface (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackface)" argument (ANN news (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2005-08-26/white-pirates-black-pirates))? That guy is also in the manga, in chapter 11 (http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/11/17/). Black without having a dark skin - his face might be masked, but his arms aren't, I think.

I don't think Oda wants to rely on that scheme because it would only provoke certain people to interpret racism into his work. That's why he creates real "other human races" like fishman, mermaids, long-armed humans, skypieans etc. which have some real differences unlike some color of their skins.

Lord Rayleigh
October 30, 2009, 03:08 PM
Seriously though, I don't recall seeing a monkeyman on the slave auction listing.
That's because there was not the word monkeyman on the slave auction listing. Actually, the monkeymen we've seen in the Shabondy Archipelago were slave hunters in the " Coffee Monkeys " : see here (http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/501/08/)

Razh
October 30, 2009, 03:50 PM
That's because there was not the word monkeyman on the slave auction listing. Actually, the monkeymen we've seen in the Shabondy Archipelago were slave hunters in the " Coffee Monkeys " : see here (http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/501/08/)

Don't take me for an imbecile. I thought it was strange that there are no ape-men (sounds better than monkeymen don't you think) on the slave auction list since all of the races should be included.
See, I forgot that Masira and Shoujo actually had tails too. It happens I guess.

We've only seen about 8 ape-men. Does it mean that there aren't others on some island? No it doesn't. So why believe that there is no black race except those few guys?

Bugzee
October 30, 2009, 09:42 PM
Anyone think that Pandaman will eventually become a character in OP and will be introduced formally? It would be cool! lol

I get the feeling tho Oda won't!

Poneglyph420
October 30, 2009, 11:35 PM
Anyone think that Pandaman will eventually become a character in OP and will be introduced formally? It would be cool! lol

I get the feeling tho Oda won't!


yeah man I think he will remain an "Easter egg" character..
It's too fun to play where's Pandaman!

But I do hope to see more of him.

Bugzee
October 31, 2009, 01:29 PM
hehehe me 2, Pandaman is awesome!!!!!

sarutobi_sensei
November 01, 2009, 04:27 PM
I've just remembered something, wasn't Rayleigh supposed to coat Sunny? If so isn't it possible that he arrives @ the war, with the Strawhats (or some of them) via underwater like WB did? I'd love that x)

Maybe it's chopper who tends to WB's and everyone else's wounds :D

Black Lagoon
November 01, 2009, 04:49 PM
Luffy was lucky enough to cross the sea in a Marine ship ... :)

sarutobi_sensei
November 01, 2009, 05:09 PM
But we don't know the mechanics behind coating and how fast it can travel.

bittman
November 01, 2009, 05:20 PM
If Chopper is the only doctor in this entire war Whitebeard isn't nearly as good at making a crew as he thinks he is. Surely amongst 1600 crew and countless allies there are doctors...well at least there are pretty nurses in short skirts!

And Rayleigh could coat sunny and arrive, sure...but he's only one man. Doesn't matter who you are, one man cannot sail a vessel of that size by themselves. Would need to be like Rayleigh + Rosy Life Riders + Hacchi/Camie + Shakky at the very least.

I'm not keen about Rayleigh turning up anyway, at most he'll only do it to save Luffy. Even Rayleigh knows his best years are behind him, he struggled holding off Kizaru.

Black Lagoon
November 01, 2009, 06:06 PM
But we don't know the mechanics behind coating and how fast it can travel.

yes, but what I mean is how much time it will take them to get from where the are to the Sabaody Archipelago? :blink

Razh
November 01, 2009, 06:31 PM
I'm not keen about Rayleigh turning up anyway, at most he'll only do it to save Luffy. Even Rayleigh knows his best years are behind him, he struggled holding off Kizaru.

There's still some life in him. His best days are behind him sure, but while he was struggling against Kizaru, all of the younger guys who were fighting Kizaru got one hit KOd. None of them had any chance of killing him while Rayleigh could actually do it.

I can easily imagine Rayleigh arriving like you said, with Rosy Life riders (or whatever they will call themselves) and Shakky. Chances are she can probably fight too.

If Whitebeard is to die, I can imagine Rayleigh being the one to lead the pirates in this battle. He is a legend after all.

Gecko Moria
November 01, 2009, 07:43 PM
If Whitebeard is to die, I can imagine Rayleigh being the one to lead the pirates in this battle. He is a legend after all.

Only problem being whether or not Rayleigh actually appears in the battle or if he is still trying to live a normal life. I know about the theory that Rayleigh might have been the one that opened the gates, but I think it's pretty unlikely he's going to suddenly appear and lead an army of pirates against the World Government. If Whitebeard was to die, leadership would be handed down to one of his division commanders (Marco, most likely).

Razh
November 01, 2009, 08:33 PM
Only problem being whether or not Rayleigh actually appears in the battle or if he is still trying to live a normal life. I know about the theory that Rayleigh might have been the one that opened the gates, but I think it's pretty unlikely he's going to suddenly appear and lead an army of pirates against the World Government. If Whitebeard was to die, leadership would be handed down to one of his division commanders (Marco, most likely).

He's not the type of guy to lead a normal life while WG and pirates are waging war and balance is crumbling like a dry cookie.
I don't think Rayleigh had anything to do with the Gate. I'm suggesting that he could arrive during the battle, not just suddenly appear. And you couldn't actually call Rayleigh, Shakky and Rosy Life Riders an army of pirates.:amuse

Thanks for explaining how the chain of command works but I was suggesting that pirates, Marco included, would gladly accept the leadership of the legendary Dark King.

I always thought that Whitebeard and Rayleigh would meet eventually. This could be the last opportunity.

bittman
November 01, 2009, 11:44 PM
I don't think Rayleigh could take over. Heck, even if Gol D Roger rose from his grave, Whitebeard dying would basically ruin the rest of the push except for Luffy and some miscreants here and there. What would ensue would be a mixture of rage and fear by the pirates, whilst the marines gain hope. Morales are everything in a war like this.

Sure someone could step up and "lead" this group of pirates with their status, but these people are here for two people: Whitebeard and Ace. I mean, Robin was taken from Luffy, so the Strawhat's gave chase. If Luffy had died, it wouldn't matter if Shanks himself appeared, the fight lost it's meaning and a lot of the driving force.

Point is: Whitebeard is a clear key to victory for the marines here. His demise is the equivalent to winning the war. Same as Sengoku, except on a larger scale. If Sengoku goes down, well marines lose a lot of face, morale and a lot of their tactical ingenuity. Someone could pick up the pieces, but it won't be the same.

Unfortunately for the pirates, Whitebeard's name means a lot more than Sengoku's.

Gol.D.Roger
November 02, 2009, 02:44 AM
I know at this point, everyone is looking for a way out (for the WB crew, Luffy and Ace), but I still think that all the pieces are there. We still have not seen the limits of the Division commanders, all of them combined might be enough to pull this through, even without WB; I don't think anyone could have guessed that Vista the fifth division commander could hold his own against Mihawk (the greatest swordsman in the world) and much much more. Even the tenth division commander seems to be giving Moria some trouble (although we have to see how that plays out)

I agree with the people that say even if Rayleigh shows up... command will not pass to him. Even if Gol.d.Roger rose from the dead, Marco would not hand over command to him. It is clear that Marco would take over (being perfecty capable) and do a fine of job of leading the crew out of this situation. We still have not seen what would happen if Marco goes nuts.

This of course is assuming WB dies with one stab... for all we know.. WB might go nuts and destroy half the island before he dies...

Razh
November 02, 2009, 03:13 AM
Nobody is saying that Rayleigh will take over. Well, not me anyway. I'm hinting at something that I believe is possible.

Whitbeard won't die from one stab.

deffkryz
November 02, 2009, 04:30 AM
Right now, the Decalvan Bros. already are in command, and Whitebeard was about to dash into the fight. I guess Marco and he just made up the final plan and didn't expect Squawd (<- yeah another spelling. :p) to show up.

I wouldn't wonder about if Squawd was a indeed a WG agent, maybe from one of the cipher pols, though not from the dismembered Nr. 9, of course. He could also be allied with Kaidou or the yet unknown fourth yonkou or one of the shichibukai - or even by a yet unknown force. But that's just mere speculation - we have to see how badass his face looks like one the next pages. If he's against WB (or this attack) I guess he'll explain his actions in one of the next chapters.

IMHO this attack should be taken straight by fans. Oda has created some wicked plots and turnout of events, but I don't think Squawd would attack WB either to boost his power nor for a sophisticated plan to infiltrate the Marines or even the WG (because both would be gigantic plotholes!).

We may not forget, WB already had a bad feeling about Ace's chase for BB. I guess WB already knew that his reign was about to crumble right after BB murdered Thatch and fled.

bittman
November 02, 2009, 07:07 AM
We may not forget, WB already had a bad feeling about Ace's chase for BB. I guess WB already knew that his reign was about to crumble right after BB murdered Thatch and fled.

Actually it was Shanks who had a bad feeling, Whitebeard's was too proud to admit there was anything wrong with sending out Ace, let alone take advice from someone he would still basically deem a rookie.

I didn't think much about Squadro perhaps having alliances other than the WG. I still think a marine-alliance is top of the cards, but I can't rule out one of the remaining Yonkou or even a Shichibukai (though Oda seems to keep most of them without a recurring crew for some reason).

Heck, on that note: Do some of the Shichibukai have a crew relative to their strength? Compare Luffy -> Strawhat's with Shicbukai's -> crews.

Mihawk and Kuma probably don't even have a crew...
Whereas Doflamingo is plenty strong by himself, but probably doesn't have any "nakama", but rather "pawns".