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Akainu
September 24, 2009, 03:19 AM
If you haven't seen the goodies yet, you can check them out in the Spoiler Pics & Summaries (http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1589491#post1589491) thread. This is where you can discuss all about them. But remember no spamming.

But remember: NO SPOILERS OUTSIDE THE SPOILER THREADS. This rule will be strictly enforced. Please respect those that don't want to be spoiled. Thanks.

The raw is out! Get it HERE (http://mangahelpers.com/m/one-piece/chapters/559/) :amuse

kaizoku king
September 29, 2009, 06:02 AM
well from the looks of the spoilers looks like the government lost another shichibukai (officially) this time

Dim
September 29, 2009, 06:03 AM
I LOVE HANCOK :D
looks like luffy still can't do much against logia's!

Ace is in dispair and hoping :(
I wonder what whitebeard has realised???
Jimbei is the KING lol

and with KUMA i wonder if kuma used to look different- and now that he is half pacifista form his body was changed form originally!

Adrizsnk
September 29, 2009, 06:10 AM
I think it's a fake... I find it strange that 70% of it is what we expected. And this week Luffy will end up in Chibi state, so would he fight smoker?

My guess is that it's a fake!

metronome
September 29, 2009, 06:13 AM
if it is true
luffy cant even fight smoker yet
he's gotta be VA level now
morever
too much happening in one chapter
i think its fake

Izaon
September 29, 2009, 06:16 AM
it's been 'confirmed already' though
plus its from nja

cygnus
September 29, 2009, 06:17 AM
Maybe Hancock will finally teach Luffy how to deal with his Haki and he'll start blowing bitches away left and right.

gfire2
September 29, 2009, 06:21 AM
finalli confirmation that haki nulls logia, but i never thought jimbei is this strong

ameya730
September 29, 2009, 06:23 AM
man love the hancock luffy exchange it never fails to crack me up

Hancock's face turns back to lovey dovey
(Oh... he called my name again.... he said Hancock....):wtf

Cruewk
September 29, 2009, 06:24 AM
Yay, I predicted right! All the 1v1 battles are starting, dialog is disintegrating.

THIS is where the war starts.

beastboy
September 29, 2009, 06:30 AM
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA got to love hancock
<3 he called my name again..

HAHA... and hancock will smash smoker to smithreens (I know that smoke is basically very tiny smithreens :D)

charzelo1
September 29, 2009, 06:33 AM
Kuma is just a double agent, he's waiting for dragon to appear before he makes his move

sarutobi_sensei
September 29, 2009, 06:33 AM
OMGOMGOMGOMG And people said that Hancock wouldn't help Luffy? LOL She does it!

So that Kuma is probably reprogramed or not Kuma.

Jinbei pwns Moria xD Moria really is useless xD

beastboy
September 29, 2009, 06:38 AM
Hehehe.. jinbei 1hko moria is cool.. but if there is sun shouldn't the marines burn and the shadows disappear..

Jayden_kropp
September 29, 2009, 06:43 AM
Kuma is just a double agent, he's waiting for dragon to appear before he makes his move

Your wrong, didn't you hear what flamingo said. "The kuma you once knew is dead". Obviously its clear now that what we all assumed is true.

Kuma WAS a double agent working for DRAGON! (Why else did he save Dragons son [luffy and co]).

Even kuma said himself, we will never meet again (he knew fromt he begining by doing this he was going to be reprogrammed).

Dispite what any of you guys say if this spoiler is true it seems that even a cyborg can be re programed after all it seemed kuma was more machine than man, his fate was decided from the moment that he helped luffy and revealed to kizaru he was a spy. I mean kizaru is dumb but hes not stupid enough to not realise that kuma was protecting straw hat.

Black Lagoon
September 29, 2009, 06:44 AM
Holy S**t!! she kicked Smoker's ass. :XD

@ sarutobi_sensei - YEAH!! She helps at the first chance

OunknownO
September 29, 2009, 06:44 AM
hehe, hancock

PS. let's see,, wg is already lost Hancock and moria(i presume that kuma will be defeated, then the only threat will be admirals(Donquixote Doflamingo will be defeated fast))... The only question is, will those old guys interfire and are they strong(the few of them is carrying weapons)))

http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/233/16-17/

sarutobi_sensei
September 29, 2009, 06:48 AM
Portuguese translation:
Hancock: Não te atrevas a bater no meu querido Luffy com esse bastão
Nunca estive tão enfurecida na minha vida! Desfaço-te em bocados e dou-os às bestas! (Animais ferozes, como a pantera que ela tem)

A cara dela parece um Demónio da Raiva.

Smoker: Consegues-me atingir? Deve ser o Haki das Kuja.
Luffy: Hancock!!

A cara da Hancokc fica derretida por ele lhe ter dito o nome dela
(Oh.... ele disse o meu nome outra vez.... ele disse Hancock

Whitebeard decide trabalhar com o buggy, já que ele não o considera perigoso mas os prisioneiros escapados podem ser problemáticos.


Capítulo 559: Um enviado do céu!
História da capa Zoro.

Luffy vs Smoker, mas os ataques do Luffy não o atingem.

Hancock enfurecida mete-se na luta e manda um pontapé ao Smoker.
Ivankov vs Kuma.
Ivankov tenta falar para ele mas não obtém resposta.
Ao ver isso DoFlamingo comenta:
Não sei qual é a tua relação com o Kuma... mas o Kuma que conhecias já está morto

Buggy luta ao lado do Whitebeard
Whitebeard apercebe-se de qual é o plano do Sengoku e dá ordens aos capitães do Novo Mundo.
Ace decide-se. Se a sua tripulação chegar até ele ele agarrará as suas mãos (tipo, quer ser salvo por eles). Mas se a execução for primeiro, ele aceita o castigo e não tentará fugir.
Hancock apressa-se em ajudar o Luffy e junta-se a ele.

Jinbei vs Moria
Moria engole as sombras dos marines e torna-se gigante.
Ele ataca o Jinbei mas este simplesmente contra ataca com um murro e manda o Moria para outro lado XD

Black Lagoon
September 29, 2009, 06:48 AM
and that's when Blackbeard enters the scene. (I guess) :tem

beastboy
September 29, 2009, 06:49 AM
the name of the chapter makes me wonder... isn't it nami in the chapter.. cause heavens.. nami is in a sky island.. it makes sense..

deffkryz
September 29, 2009, 06:54 AM
Yet just a continuation of the arc, yet already awesome. (<- Yes I said so!)

I don't expect Doflamingo to go down that easy unless Inazuma isn't the one with Doflamingo's counter power - somehow.


OMGOMGOMGOMG

Exaclty my thoughts on reading the spoilers. :)

sarutobi_sensei
September 29, 2009, 06:58 AM
Your wrong, didn't you hear what flamingo said. "The kuma you once knew is dead". Obviously its clear now that what we all assumed is true.

Kuma WAS a double agent working for DRAGON! (Why else did he save Dragons son [luffy and co]).

Even kuma said himself, we will never meet again (he knew fromt he begining by doing this he was going to be reprogrammed).

Dispite what any of you guys say if this spoiler is true it seems that even a cyborg can be re programed after all it seemed kuma was more machine than man, his fate was decided from the moment that he helped luffy and revealed to kizaru he was a spy. I mean kizaru is dumb but hes not stupid enough to not realise that kuma was protecting straw hat.

But I still think that there will be something that will make the current Kuma turn back to normal.


Holy S**t!! she kicked Smoker's ass. :XD

@ sarutobi_sensei - YEAH!! She helps at the first chance

Hell yeah, Haki's the counter to Logias x)


Yet just a continuation of the arc, yet already awesome. (<- Yes I said so!)

I don't expect Doflamingo to go down that easy unless Inazuma isn't the one with Doflamingo's counter power - somehow.

Exaclty my thoughts on reading the spoilers. :)

He could co down with either Buggy or Inazuma xD

It would really be epic to see Buggy, Buggy, yes Buggy to take down a shichibukai xD

Raijū
September 29, 2009, 06:59 AM
Yet just a continuation of the arc, yet already awesome. (<- Yes I said so!)

I don't expect Doflamingo to go down that easy unless Inazuma isn't the one with Doflamingo's counter power - somehow.



Exaclty my thoughts on reading the spoilers. :)

i wonder where he is (we didn't saw him/her in the last chapters...)

Gats
September 29, 2009, 07:01 AM
"Love is a hurricane"

She really doesn't care about the Kuja's Island. :p

Jayden_kropp
September 29, 2009, 07:02 AM
This chapter has answered a lot of our questions. Like kuma, hancocks roll, haki countering logias.

Im just keen to see a bit more of doflamingo and his abilities and maybe see luffy control haki against smoker. It would be awesome if he saved hancock = ] then she joined his crew haha. Put an end to sanji's ways once and for all haha.

dogfood911
September 29, 2009, 07:05 AM
What was the word Rotten liked to use concerning theories that the real Kuma is not fighting in the war?...Oh yeah I remember now, he liked to use the word: "baseless".

While the theory has not been proven to be 100% true, they're not so baseless anymore are they? :)

Jayden_kropp
September 29, 2009, 07:08 AM
What was the word Rotten liked to use concerning theories that the real Kuma is not fighting in the war?...Oh yeah I remember now, he liked to use the word: "baseless".

While the theory has not been proven to be 100% true, they're not so baseless anymore are they? :)

Well i dont agree with you about one thing why he was not fighting in the war. I still reakon he got reprogramed and that he was a spy of dragon but now he isnt what he used 2 be, but anywayz this is for all them people who didnt believe our theory :facepalm, Look who gets the last laugh :D

Yans86
September 29, 2009, 07:10 AM
Yo ho ho!!!Yo ho ho ho ho!!!!!
Now as predicted there are only 3 shichi on the WG side.....Moria(pwned night and day),Mihawk(sleepin over),DoFlamingo(ready to pwnage)....

Kuma is a big question???????in reality I think that he is imbarassed to talk at someone like Ivankov........."Kuma never talks and now he is chitchatting with a tranny...what a sweety tranny bear"....I think he doesn't want this shame on him ihihih

Haki....I knew it all time :-D!Finally people won't come here with crappy theory about hitting Logia!(Such as mirrors,the heat of gear 2nd ecc...ecc...ecc.....lol)

Zoro cover story....will be another gem in this epicness!
Buggy helping WB.....for the lolz :-D


Kizaru will try to attack.......
Boa step in: You can't mess with my man.......INSTANT PWNAGE!!!!
Kizaru:doh....

Everyone: Don't mess with Zoan....Boan......Boa,Sorry :-P

Close call....just change Kizaru with smoker :-P

Auger and Burgess(BB crew),doesn't know how to use Haki...http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/440/13/



From the assumption we all know that both spirit/body are inseparable,and that usually we consider the spirit as a spiritual body we can make different consideration:
To say "have a strong spirit" and "have strong will" makes no difference right???!so to not faint against a burst of a strong spirit/will u need a spirit/will enough strong to withstand a burst....if not,ur spirit/spiritual body will be overwhelmed/"punched" and your body will be "crushed"/fainting people...(if the spirit doesn't sustain the body,the body will crumble...)

Considering a DF user,a human with a body of a different material,what will happen?it happen that u have 2 modality to harm it: physically(and that's why is difficult to harm Logia's),and spiritually.
As the way a spirit can crush another spirit and it's reflected on the body,every attack with haki/spirit can weaken/hurm the other spiritual body/power,and this is reflected on the body too(indipendently from the material/element).


Step by step,everything is wrapping up to my old theory ihihih

Akainu
September 29, 2009, 07:10 AM
not exactly dogfood. it techincally is the "real kuma" just that his memories seem to have been erased. i.e. the pacifistafication process was finished.
now why is it still kuma? the paws! yet he'S also pacifista...
well maybe we could stop debating this since it leads nowhere and each of you was right to some degree :D

plex
September 29, 2009, 07:18 AM
I wonder If Ace is able to use Haki, back in Arabasta he said "a fight between fire and smoke is pointless", but with Haki he should be able to hit a Logia (Smoker)?, sure he didn't intend to kill him and tried to distract Smoker from the Strawhats in the first place, but still..:oh

"Hancock's face turns back to lovey dovey
(Oh... he called my name again.... he said Hancock....)"

Haha great, a combo-haki-attack with Luffy would be cool:D

blizzard_zer0
September 29, 2009, 07:36 AM
it's look like buggy will be a key in this chapter.

i predicted buggy will help WB saved ace,and cause WB death too.
he like mr.satan in DBZ

deffkryz
September 29, 2009, 07:37 AM
"Love is a hurricane"

She really doesn't care about the Kuja's Island. :p

Well... Actually she keeps her word - fight against Whitebeard's troops at Marineford. That order did never include fighting against Luffy. ;)

NoLimit89
September 29, 2009, 07:42 AM
"The Kuma you know is dead" - Doflamingo.

KNEW IT!!! That's why Kuma said "we'll never meet again" to Luffy on SA. The moment he said that I knew:

http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1593116#post1593116

PaLLl
September 29, 2009, 07:56 AM
"The Kuma you know is dead" - Doflamingo.

KNEW IT!!! That's why Kuma said "we'll never meet again" to Luffy on SA. The moment he said that I knew:

http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1593116#post1593116

Well I think I must tell what I think about this.
I think Donflamingo was trying to say was - That Kuma isn't Human like he was when he and Ivankov were friends. What I'm trying to say is that maybe actually Ivankov doesn't know about the Pacifista part ?

+ even if he knew it . There is a part when you have to be sneaky like a Fox. Attacking your old friend by showing you are royal to WG not to a Friend , but having a plan to convince overs to believe that you are Loyal .

Well Well Well....So Luffy tries to kick SMoker , but it failed....How about it "Luffy Kicking with Haki everybody's ass" fans ? Forget about you stupid disires....it's time for Luffy to think with Brains not Fists and Rage.

Unusual chapter again...the more you see , the more you know...

ScratchmenApoo
September 29, 2009, 07:57 AM
^ A very nice Kuma theory, I thought that he was a Pacifista, but because of the Ursus Shock I didn't even want to speak about it, because I'm always wrong.

And Hancock joins Luffy, oh yeah <3

Hancock, Kuma, Moria and Jinbei are fighting.... this means in the next chapter we will get to see Mihawk & Doflamingo fight as well, because cmon, they shouldn't be left out of this epic battle for too long.

hhv94
September 29, 2009, 07:57 AM
Wow interesting spoilers thus far. Hehehe.....no shock about Hancock coming to Luffy's aid. I am VERY curious about Kuma though, I've been suspecting that he must have known Luffy's father in some way. I think he used to be a revolutionary but decided to join the Shibukai for some reason! I am looking forward to this chapter once its scanlated!

Yans86
September 29, 2009, 08:08 AM
"The Kuma you know is dead" - Doflamingo.
[/url]

Bah.....it doesn't add anything IMO.....

1)Why should Kuma have his memory/mind erased?
2)Why should Kuma decide to have his memory/mind erased?
3)Why should Kuma accept to have his mind erased (assuming that he IS a revolutionary)?
4)Why couldn't Kuma "ESCAPE" if he knew that something like that would happen??
5)Why should Kuma free the SH and then go suicide instead of fleeing himself.......Kizaru couldn't follow the SH flying away,he wouldn't follow him too,overall cause the war is coming...

A part...

DoFlamingo is not like Kuma's friend,so why would he know about his secrets motives and doings?
Why should he know about the whole Pacifista doin?(TOP SECRET ISSUE,overall for pirates)
Why DoFlamingo should know that Kuma IS/WAS a revolutionary double agent and now he isn't anymore "for differents reason"?
Why did Ivankov said "I know u have to mantain your position as a shichi"?

Kums is probably the biggest shot(DOUBLE AGENT) inside the WG.He is in a position where playing the LOYAL DOG,let him have infos that even marines at VA lvls doesn't have.........why screwing his position just because Ivankov shows up????
Is not like Ivankov is there on Dragon's order....

Other question:
Who called the revolutionaries to "SAVE" Robin?
And I repeat....they were summoned to go there.Just a casualty in 700 years for them to go and free the slaves??

I can keep on going with thousands question like these......


I would be less surprised if VEGAPUNK is a revolutionary too and at the right moment he will turn the PACIFISTA's against the WG....
I won't be surprised if the 2 guys joined the WG at the same time with some Dragon plan...

chess4
September 29, 2009, 08:09 AM
its official...............the shichibukai are done as a unit. hancock has just put her island at serious risk. seems like kuma is no longer himself. maybe what he told rayliegh will be revealed sooner or later.


jinbei is fighting moria and my main man buggy is getting some shine time alongside WB

Yans86
September 29, 2009, 08:15 AM
Hancock: Don't you dare swing that stick of yours or hit my love Luffy!
I've never been this angered in my life! I'll tear you to shreads, and
feed you to the beasts!!

Sweetie as always........
Waiting for Mihawk comment: Oh my my.....lol
And I can just hear SenGoku saying: Garp,another shichibukai is on your grandson's side....WTF.....again!!!
Garp:lol lol lol

Anyway,Marine needed all the shichi with the 3 admirals....and now they have 2+idiot shichi(Moria),against all WB crews,Jinbei-Crocodile-Ivankov-Hancock(Shichi lvls)+Luffy,Buggy and the ID crew,Captains of the NW that didn't even start to fight...............mmmmmmm..............scary scary......

NoLimit89
September 29, 2009, 08:15 AM
Seriously, Luffy better start kicking some logia ass with Haki now. I am so fricken disappointed in him right now.

Mr. Crocodile
September 29, 2009, 08:15 AM
I wonder If Ace is able to use Haki, back in Arabasta he said "a fight between fire and smoke is pointless", but with Haki he should be able to hit a Logia (Smoker)?, sure he didn't intend to kill him and tried to distract Smoker from the Strawhats in the first place, but still..:oh

"Hancock's face turns back to lovey dovey
(Oh... he called my name again.... he said Hancock....)"

Haha great, a combo-haki-attack with Luffy would be cool:D

IMO logias can't use haki.

fallou
September 29, 2009, 08:17 AM
What he told Rayleigh? Probably"entrust the sh's safety to me" or sthg...Looks like Ace is whining again...I'm getting sick of this. Where's the real Ace, and who's this crybaby on the execution platform?

OunknownO
September 29, 2009, 08:23 AM
Well I think I must tell what I think about this.
I think Donflamingo was trying to say was - That Kuma isn't Human like he was when he and Ivankov were friends. What I'm trying to say is that maybe actually Ivankov doesn't know about the Pacifista part ?

+ even if he knew it . There is a part when you have to be sneaky like a Fox. Attacking your old friend by showing you are royal to WG not to a Friend , but having a plan to convince overs to believe that you are Loyal .

Well Well Well....So Luffy tries to kick SMoker , but it failed....How about it "Luffy Kicking with Haki everybody's ass" fans ? Forget about you stupid disires....it's time for Luffy to think with Brains not Fists and Rage.

Unusual chapter again...the more you see , the more you know...


That's not going to happen Luffy dosen't have mental abilities for that... He is too simple minded

Black Lagoon
September 29, 2009, 08:25 AM
Seriously, Luffy better start kicking some logia ass with Haki now. I am so fricken disappointed in him right now.

Hancock might give him a clue, now that he's near her. XD

ScratchmenApoo
September 29, 2009, 08:28 AM
"Hancock: Don't you dare swing that stick of yours or hit my love Luffy!"

Am I the only one who sees a sexual comment in that ? Must be me...

Back on-topic : If Kuma is turned into just into a mindless cyborg, does that mean that killing him, is not as troublesome as it would for say, Doflamingo (meaning that Oda might actually show that)

Akainu
September 29, 2009, 08:30 AM
Bah.....it doesn't add anything IMO.....

1)Why should Kuma have his memory/mind erased?
2)Why should Kuma decide to have his memory/mind erased?
3)Why should Kuma accept to have his mind erased (assuming that he IS a revolutionary)?
4)Why couldn't Kuma "ESCAPE" if he knew that something like that would happen??
5)Why should Kuma free the SH and then go suicide instead of fleeing himself.......Kizaru couldn't follow the SH flying away,he wouldn't follow him too,overall cause the war is coming...


Well not to answer all the questions and possibilities you raised, but one scenario I could imagine is that the process of turning him into a complete pacifista just wasn't finished. He seems to have known before that the process will be finished and thus told Luffy he will never meet him again and also talked to Ray about something else, maybe the WG calling in the Shichibukai to end their part of the era and to introduce the Pacifista as fighting force.
Why he didn't escape...? Well I don't think Vegapunk is as dumb as to let someone with a free will that maybe even is known to sypathize with the revolutionaries run around without having an emergency-stop-switch that can paralyze him or sth. similar.
Fact is Kuma seemed to be in need for cyborg parts to survive otherwise why should he have agreed to THAT in the beginning?

exacta
September 29, 2009, 08:42 AM
The comment Doflamingo made on Kuma is interesting.....and I really wish Hancock didn't interfere with Smokers battle. Whitebeard and Buggy working together is interesting......ugh I don't like Moria. I wish Oda didn't make us have to watch him grow big again......especially just for Jinbei to blow him away with a falcon punch. At least show us something different.

By the way last chapter he made some marines into zombies. But I thought Dr. Hogback could only do that????? Or do I have that mixed up??? And if said zombies don't have shadows, shouldn't they have instantly disintegrated since this battle is taking place in the daylight IMO? Maybe I just forgot how Moria's abilities work...

Black Lagoon
September 29, 2009, 08:53 AM
Well not to answer all the questions and possibilities you raised, but one scenario I could imagine is that the process of turning him into a complete pacifista just wasn't finished. He seems to have known before that the process will be finished and thus told Luffy he will never meet him again and also talked to Ray about something else, maybe the WG calling in the Shichibukai to end their part of the era and to introduce the Pacifista as fighting force.

Yeah, same as Wolverine XD (good points)

Kuma may have been forced to get an update and a new program after Kirazu and Sentoumaru saw him saving Luffy from an inevitable death.

Ero-Sanji
September 29, 2009, 09:04 AM
Well then it's confirmed the power of Haki can even hurt Logia, sweet!
Oh no old Kuma is dead, how sad he knew they were going to do something to him so he saved Luffy and his crew as a last task to help his former colleague.

Someone mentioned that Kumas part would be emotional and now I think it could even defeat Robins, Choppers and brooks.

Rotten The Wizard
September 29, 2009, 09:10 AM
Well then it's confirmed the power of Haki can even hurt Logia, sweet!
Oh no Kuma is dead, how sad he knew they were going to do something to him so he saved Luffy and his crew as a last task to help his former colleague.

Some one mentioned that Kumas part would be emotional and now I think it could even defeat Robins, Choppers and brooks.

.....thats been "confirmed" since Rayleigh Kicked kizaru and then cut him

Im actually really surprised with Hancock. Now im almost certain she's the next Sh

Buggy!! is it me or is this foreshadowing? Will buggy actually be the one to land the killing blow on whitebeard? Cause we all know at this point buggy is only helping him to get an opening

Gats
September 29, 2009, 09:11 AM
Hancock: Don't you dare swing that stick of yours or hit my love Luffy!
I've never been this angered in my life! I'll tear you to shreads, and
feed you to the beasts!!

Sweetie as always........
Waiting for Mihawk comment: Oh my my.....lol
And I can just hear SenGoku saying: Garp,another shichibukai is on your grandson's side....WTF.....again!!!
Garp:lol lol lol

Anyway,Marine needed all the shichi with the 3 admirals....and now they have 2+idiot shichi(Moria),against all WB crews,Jinbei-Crocodile-Ivankov-Hancock(Shichi lvls)+Luffy,Buggy and the ID crew,Captains of the NW that didn't even start to fight...............mmmmmmm..............scary scary......

You know what ? It's possible that Sengoku's plan is to kill WB and his pirates but also the Shichibukai (they are pirates after all) at the same time.

Natsu Dragonil
September 29, 2009, 09:14 AM
Well Luffy pretty much fails like the last 4 fights or so he had.I mean its not the first time he met Smoker so he should have known that he cant hit him with normal punches.
Luffy always seems to need the help of others to win a fight in the last few chapters i mean what happened to him and his resolve.

Jinbei is confirmed to be a beast in raw strengh i mean not even luffy in gear 2nd+3rd could send Moria flying with his shadows.

Buggy seems to have a brilliant brain casue now he has the best protetion out of all with WB.Way to go captain buggy.I mean he sure should have learnt something on rogers ship like shanks.

soDeq05
September 29, 2009, 09:15 AM
Minihistoria de Zoro
Luffy vs Smoker, pero luffy no puede tocarle
Hanckock se enfada y salta a defender a luffy, le mete una patada a smoker.
Ivankov vs Kuma.
Ivankov intenta hablar con kuma pero no le responde
Viendo el combate doflamingo comenta:
“No se que relacion tenias con kuma pero el kuma que tu conocias ha muerto”
Buggy intenta atacar a BB
BB va dando ordenes a los Capitanes del Nuevo mundo.
No estoy del todo seguro de como traducir esto:
(Ace makes up his mind. If his crew gets to him and reaches out to him, he’ll grab their hands.
But if the blade gets to him first, he’ll accept the punishment, and won’t try to struggle. )
EDIT: Ace piensa, Si su tripulacion consigue rescatarlo cogera su mano(ira con ellos) pero si llega primero la sentencia (ejecucion i tal)aceptara el castigo sin intentar resistirse.
Jinbei vs Moria
Moria usa sus sombran en el para atacar a Jinbei
Jinbei contrataca y manda volar a Moria
Hancock: Como te atreves a atacar a Luffy mi amor!!! te echaré a las bestias (mas o menos) Parece un demonio.
Smoker: Puedes tocarme? Esto es el estilo de lucha Kuja Luffy: Hancock!!
Hancock se pone colorada pensando: HA DICHO MI NOMBRE OTRA VEZ…
BB decide acabar con buggy porque sino los piratas fugados podrian ser problematicos

deffkryz
September 29, 2009, 09:15 AM
Buggy!! is it me or is this foreshadowing? Will buggy actually be the one to land the killing blow on whitebeard? Cause we all know at this point buggy is only helping him to get an opening

Be sure - if Buggy killed WB, there'd be way too many too dangerous characters around him to take on him all at once. My guess is, that some other pirate kills WB, and Buggy's going to take the blame.

Rotten The Wizard
September 29, 2009, 09:21 AM
Be sure - if Buggy killed WB, there'd be way too many too dangerous characters around him to take on him all at once. My guess is, that some other pirate kills WB, and Buggy's going to take the blame.

That would be epic Lulz for the rest of the manga
I never liked buggy's character before this war but since he pledged to slay Whitebeard Buggy has been one of my favourites

RichardMNixon
September 29, 2009, 09:21 AM
.....thats been "confirmed" since Rayleigh Kicked kizaru and then cut him

Im actually really surprised with Hancock. Now im almost certain she's the next Sh

Buggy!! is it me or is this foreshadowing? Will buggy actually be the one to land the killing blow on whitebeard? Cause we all know at this point buggy is only helping him to get an opening

That didn't confirm it, it opened the possibility, there were still a lot of people claiming he had a light-scattering devil fruit or some other such nonsense.

Buggy stabbing WB in the back at the end of the war would be pretty intense though. Buggy for Gokou?

fallou
September 29, 2009, 09:23 AM
Eliminating the shichibukai is a possibility, as Gatsuga said...If he(goat lovin sengoku)'s the famed strategist he is supposed to be, he could have foreseen the shichibukai situation (jinbei n hancock on wb's/Luffy's side, BB unpredictable, Moria too weak, Doflamingo could switch sides for all we know, Mihawk ?, Kuma ?). They might become a hindrance rather than a help imo...I guess with this world the so called balance is about to be shifted either in favor of Pirates or WG, so the disbandment of the shichibukai could happen...

k-dom
September 29, 2009, 09:23 AM
I hope that we'll see some Smoker and Luffy scene soon. Since Alabasta it's been a long time
my whish realised, that's nice to hear, also it seems that hancock turn side quickly. I wonder how long it will take to Sengoku realising she is the reason behind impel down evasion. Maybe we will have a comment on this chapter already. Also now the fact that haki disable devil fruit is now officially confirmed, it is strange however that smoker speaks about Kuja Haki and not just Haki.

It's nice too that we have the answer to Kuma behaviour, now the debate will end.

Another interesting thing is that it seems that whitebeard has guess what the marine plan is. I suppose it is because he and Sengoku know eachother pretty well

plex
September 29, 2009, 09:23 AM
IMO logias can't use haki.

I see no reason why they shouldn't be able to use it (apart from the fact that they would become even more powerful) especially big shots like Kizaru, AoKiji or even Ace, even Rookie (Kuja-) pirates can use it lol ,ofc to a lesser degree.. .

Yans86
September 29, 2009, 09:29 AM
You know what ? It's possible that Sengoku's plan is to kill WB and his pirates but also the Shichibukai (they are pirates after all) at the same time.

You know what???That would be the most epic prediction in the history of OP if u catch that!That would be a huge WTF.....just see a couple of end to this....The Rise Of either BB and Luffy ihihih

rajin
September 29, 2009, 10:10 AM
AS I SAID BEFORE

MAYBE KUMA IS A DOUBLE AGENT

vicbear
September 29, 2009, 10:22 AM
Here's a thought... maybe Haki originated from Kuja?

So the Kuja inhabitants invented the concept of using Haki in combat, and slowly this knowledge spread to the outside world, but since it is such an obscure knowledge only a small fraction of the best pirates/marines know about it (similar to how a small fraction of dials have made it out of the sky islands to the world below). This is why Smoker calls it "Kuja Haki", because that's where it originated from and for someone who knows of its existence/history but doesn't encounter it often it isn't surprising for him to call it by that name.

Natsu Dragonil
September 29, 2009, 10:23 AM
If luffy continues like this he will be dead sooner than meetin shanks.

I liked the Luffy from the past way more at least that one never wanted the help of others and fought one vs.one.but in the last few chapters he is always being protected by others as if he is a weakling and cant do anything alone.Did he lost all faith in his abilitys that he is now relying on others to help him.

k-dom
September 29, 2009, 10:26 AM
MAYBE KUMA IS A DOUBLE AGENT

not anymore apparently.
I believe that Kuma modification has happen before the shichibukai meeting otherwise Don Flamingo would not be informed of it


Here's a thought... maybe Haki originated from Kuja?

So the Kuja inhabitants invented the concept of using Haki in combat, and slowly this knowledge spread to the outside world, but since it is such an obscure knowledge only a small fraction of the best pirates/marines know about it (similar to how a small fraction of dials have made it out of the sky islands to the world below). This is why Smoker calls it "Kuja Haki", because that's where it originated from and for someone who knows of its existence/history but doesn't encounter it often it isn't surprising for him to call it by that name.
Maybe, also one of the former empress who died from lovesickeness might have been in love with Gold D. Roger or a member of his crew and that is how they learned how to use it. That would explain why shanks as a strong one. But it would also mean that Buggy should know about it too.

Bugzee
September 29, 2009, 10:37 AM
My Man!!! Jinbei is that dude!!! hahaha moria got screwed! Hancock is in trouble now, dont think luffy will be able to protect her completely after this!

Doflamingo vs Iva?
I want it to be Doflamingo vs Hancock!

fallou
September 29, 2009, 10:41 AM
If luffy continues like this he will be dead sooner than meetin shanks.

I liked the Luffy from the past way more at least that one never wanted the help of others and fought one vs.one.but in the last few chapters he is always being protected by others as if he is a weakling and cant do anything alone.Did he lost all faith in his abilitys that he is now relying on others to help him.
I don't like that either, but Luffy stated during the fight against Arlong "I don't know how to use a sword, navigate, cook or even lie, that's why I need others to help me", or smthg like this...But yeah, I hope Luffy will soon learn how to defend himself (not win, it's still too early) against logias and other strong dudes, because I also have had enough of "loser Luffy"...

Razh
September 29, 2009, 10:45 AM
My Man!!! Jinbei is that dude!!! hahaha moria got screwed! Hancock is in trouble now, dont think luffy will be able to protect her completely after this!


As far as things are now, she'll be the one protecting.
Also, this would be a good time for Luffy to pick up on that Haki whic allows hitting logias.
Well, I'm just hoping he's going to get an idea about it, just like when he saw CP9 use Soru.

He has to come up with something new, after seeing both Kuja women and Jinbei and who knows who else in this battle.
I predict he's going to beat at least one important enemy here. Anything else at this point would be a downgrade for him.

chitgoks
September 29, 2009, 11:05 AM
My Man!!! Jinbei is that dude!!! hahaha moria got screwed! Hancock is in trouble now, dont think luffy will be able to protect her completely after this!

Doflamingo vs Iva?
I want it to be Doflamingo vs Hancock!

if hancock's going to be in trouble, the more reason luffy will be able to burst out his haki in case she's a goner. same thing to what happened when the kuja girls stone statues almost got shattered.

man ... moria now looks more like a stinker. even with all those shadows, jinbei zapped him
[hr]

.....thats been "confirmed" since Rayleigh Kicked kizaru and then cut him

Im actually really surprised with Hancock. Now im almost certain she's the next Sh

Buggy!! is it me or is this foreshadowing? Will buggy actually be the one to land the killing blow on whitebeard? Cause we all know at this point buggy is only helping him to get an opening

man if buggy gets to kill WB because of an opening or whatever, that would make WB lame

dogfood911
September 29, 2009, 11:08 AM
Sounds like an awesome chapter is coming up...can't wait to see Zoro's cover pic.

Been noticing that a few predictions about Boa becoming a nakama have been popping up. Frankly, I couldn't disagree more.

First of all, I think that the story of Luffy's crew in One Piece would be much less enjoyable if there was a romantic relationship on The Sunny. (Sanji always hitting on the ladies is enough)

Also, the manga goes out of its way to say that Luffy and Boa both possess a special type of haki (Haoushoku), "the disposition of a ruler".Can there be two "rulers" in one crew? I think there is only enough room for one person with this type of haki on one ship...and I have a feeling that the one person is probably the main character of the manga and not some snake-charming hottie.;)

k-dom
September 29, 2009, 11:12 AM
I'm not sure it will be that easy to learn haki. it's not as it is something that you can see. But even his burst are powerfull, so I think he will destabilise enough his opponents with just that and be able to win some fight.

dogfood911
September 29, 2009, 11:12 AM
man if buggy gets to kill WB because of an opening or whatever, that would make WB lame

Agree. I think Buggy is going to end up being like Mr. Satan in Dragonball. A semi-important character that is worshipped by many people in the story. But in reality, his fame is based on lies and lucky coincidences. He will never do anything significantly real like killing WB.

I am a Buggy fan though. Love his ability!

SenninSage
September 29, 2009, 11:15 AM
Yes!!! Go Hancock! You defend your man!

In the process, especially if she ends up in any form of trouble Luffy's haki is going to come out. It also appears confirmed, Haki allows you to hit Logia types :D

This chapter sounds crazy. What the hell does Doflamingo mean by the Kuma you know is long dead? Buffy is fighting alongside Whitebeard.. the epic continues!!

digitaldude
September 29, 2009, 11:24 AM
Kuma was an OKAMA?!? Jk I think maybe Doflamingo said it because kuma was a human, and then turned into a cyborg, thus becoming a completely new person, totally separate from his old life.

Razh
September 29, 2009, 11:30 AM
This chapter sounds crazy. What the hell does Doflamingo mean by the Kuma you know is long dead? Buffy is fighting alongside Whitebeard.. the epic continues!!

It's epic alright, but I still hope that Angel is going to show up, or if not him, Spike at least. :p
[hr]

Kuma was an OKAMA?!? Jk I think maybe Doflamingo said it because kuma was a human, and then turned into a cyborg, thus becoming a completely new person, totally separate from his old life.

I don't think Doflamingo knows Kuma that well. So, far, in every Shichibukai meeting, he never spoke a word. Maybe it's just how he plays around others. I don't think he was supposed to retain much of him former self after becoming a cyborg. I'd bet that he keeps it a secret.

BlkHorus
September 29, 2009, 11:33 AM
This chapter sounds like it will be another epic chapter with some matchups we have been waiting to see.

As for Luffy here, it has been stated many times by different people that the scale of this war is far above luffy. I respect that Oda is keeping it that way and not making luffy appear to be so much stronger than he is. I mean after the CP9 events, Luffy was pretty strong and showing that he was definitely upgraded since he had an ability to fight at the best of his ability with his rubber. And taking on Moria showed that he had to combine his abilities in order to take on others that are stronger since they can manipulate their abilities to be stronger too. Then from the SA to AL and then ID, Luffy has been getting shown that he is strong, but still has a ways to go to be stronger and such. In this war, he is fighting with all he has to get to his brother and is determined, and that is what he is being respected for by WB and others. He is completely outmatched here but refuses to give up. So in this war, he is being protected at bit because you don't see any other supernova's getting mixed up in battles of this scale...most wanted to avoid teh admirals and weren't shown to actually handle the pacifista with their crew (so what happened to them all is speculation). But anyway, its not like Luffy is being handled, he just took out a VA and now is fighting a logia.... that would be hard for anyone that doesn't know how to use Haki and doesn't know the logia's weakness. So Luffy is still up there, just smoker is a logia. Anyways, I already can't wait for the next chapter after this.

Ero-Sanji
September 29, 2009, 11:49 AM
.....thats been "confirmed" since Rayleigh Kicked kizaru and then cut him

Sigh... So Rayleigh actually said "ohh with my Haki I can cut you..."
No, he did not! So please don't correct me with stupid arguments.
I understood as well that Haki was the solution by then but some people here did question that so I just made a comment that now it's actually confirmed...!

Right know it stands between Hancock and Jimbei to be Luffy's next Nakama imo, and as you know I think it's Jimbei. And this war is actually the answer why. WB's death will mark the end of his supposedly vast territory and as we know Fishman Island is a part of his territory. So according to my theory Fishman Island will get taken over by some strong dude in NW and Luffy will be hailed as the liberator and that's were Luffy will ask Jimbei to join him as a helmsman and it will be the first Island to be under Luffy's protection.

k-dom
September 29, 2009, 11:57 AM
Kuma was an OKAMA?!? Jk I think maybe Doflamingo said it because kuma was a human, and then turned into a cyborg, thus becoming a completely new person, totally separate from his old life.

I agree pretty much with NoLimit89 theory (http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1598874#post1598874). That what came to my mind when I read the spoiler

PaLLl
September 29, 2009, 12:05 PM
that's a bit stupid...but who knows....

If there is an 1 model or original model , they never change it or destroy it....so basically I think there must be smth else !

misterchaos
September 29, 2009, 12:18 PM
IMO logias can't use haki.

yeah the fight between ace and blackbeard was nothing...:facepalm

donatelo
September 29, 2009, 12:33 PM
i for one want both jimbei and hancock to join luffys crew .....and if it messes up da power levels F that ...

if this happens their crew with all their nakama coming back with upgrades mind u [probably] will be da bomb :D

anyways ....
about kings disposition haki and im just speculating here ...could it be that kings disposition is just a property of haki that very very few ppl could have .......i mean reading peoples moves and stuff was a type that one sister had rite


what im trying to say is that anyone can learn haki [noob kuja pirates] but only one in a million can use da kings disposition property of haki

lemme no if it makes any sense :P

Lee-tyme7
September 29, 2009, 12:37 PM
Right know it stands between Hancock and Jimbei to be Luffy's next Nakama imo, and as you know I think it's Jimbei. And this war is actually the answer why. WB's death will mark the end of his supposedly vast territory and as we know Fishman Island is a part of his territory. So according to my theory Fishman Island will get taken over by some strong dude in NW and Luffy will be hailed as the liberator and that's were Luffy will ask Jimbei to join him as a helmsman and it will be the first Island to be under Luffy's protection.

That's a good theory but there are tons of stronger people in the New World than Luffy(Shanks). Many of them won't be intimidated by Luffy and what's keeping them from trying to take over Fishman Island? Jembei is his own Captain and he got his pride so I don't think he won't join Luffy maybe he'll stay behind to protect Fishman Island. Hancock on the other hand might join Luffy only because she will die if Luffy leaves her. LOL!!

Razh
September 29, 2009, 12:39 PM
yeah the fight between ace and blackbeard was nothing...:facepalm

No Haki usage was shown in that fight as far as I've seen. Blackbeard could land hits on Ace because of his devil fruit, Ace could land hits on Blackbeard because of Blackbeard's devil fruit.
Most of the battle was off screen so there might have been some Haki too, but we don't know that.

Your sarcasm and facepalm aren't justified. :(

And also, there's no reason why logia user couldn't use Haki. That claim almost deserves a facepalm.

Mr. Crocodile
September 29, 2009, 01:00 PM
Hancock is gonna go medieval on smoker's a$$ lol.. I can't wait to see that!
[hr]

And also, there's no reason why logia user couldn't use Haki. That claim almost deserves a facepalm.

And may i ask how do u know that? Maybe that's one of the pitfalls of being.near invincible.. u have no proof whatsoever to refute my comment. If u do please let me know why neither ace nor smoker used haki to neutralize each other? why didn't enel use haki to beat luffy? or why didn't kizaru use it either against marco?
This is all speculation as well of course but hey that's what this thread is for rite

sh4dx
September 29, 2009, 01:02 PM
Right know it stands between Hancock and Jimbei to be Luffy's next Nakama imo, and as you know I think it's Jimbei. And this war is actually the answer why. WB's death will mark the end of his supposedly vast territory .

i am tired from many of you who says that wb will die for sure etc..do you have any personal infomation from Oda or something? ok i know about the new era and all this s**t but please stop being so sure that wb will die.

misterchaos
September 29, 2009, 01:05 PM
No Haki usage was shown in that fight as far as I've seen. Blackbeard could land hits on Ace because of his devil fruit, Ace could land hits on Blackbeard because of Blackbeard's devil fruit.
Most of the battle was off screen so there might have been some Haki too, but we don't know that.

Your sarcasm and facepalm aren't justified. :(

And also, there's no reason why logia user couldn't use Haki. That claim almost deserves a facepalm.

why couldnt a logia use haki,they are people like the ones with paramecia they have emotion too...do you have proofs?!?

bantoukam
September 29, 2009, 01:13 PM
And may i ask how do u know that? Maybe that's one of the pitfalls of being.near invincible.. u have no proof whatsoever to refute my comment. If u do please let me know why neither ace nor smoker used haki to neutralize each other? why didn't enel use haki to beat luffy? or why didn't kizaru use it either against marco?
This is all speculation as well of course but hey that's what this thread is for rite

Hi every body, this is my first post on the forum, and my english can become very, so sorry for the inconvenience.

I just want to say something about logia user who could use or not haki.
You pin point something in your question about enel. We know that one of the sister who use haki to predict movment is the same that the mantra of the priest in skyland, and enel could effectively use it as a logia user. so we can assume logia user can use haki too, like othe devil fruit user.

that could be a logical theory.

Razh
September 29, 2009, 01:19 PM
You guys really crack me up. Proof is the word of the day...



And may i ask how do u know that? Maybe that's one of the pitfalls of being.near invincible.. u have no proof whatsoever to refute my comment. If u do please let me know why neither ace nor smoker used haki to neutralize each other? why didn't enel use haki to beat luffy? or why didn't kizaru use it either against marco?
This is all speculation as well of course but hey that's what this thread is for rite

Just how many characters so far have we seen using Haki? (Amazons not included)
Every person has a willpower, whether he can stretch his arms real far, or transform into a bird or control fire.

I don't need any proof to refute your comment. Common sense is all that I need.


why couldnt a logia use haki,they are people like the ones with paramecia they have emotion too...do you have proofs?!?

You probably misread parts of my post. I never said they can't use it. Just that we haven't seen any of them use it. Which doesn't mean that we won't, eventually.
You clearly said that there was Haki in Ace vs. Blackbeard, and there wasn't. Not that we have seen. Simple as that.

Mr. Crocodile
September 29, 2009, 01:20 PM
Hi every body, this is my first post on the forum, and my english can become very, so sorry for the inconvenience.

I just want to say something about logia user who could use or not haki.
You pin point something in your question about enel. We know that one of the sister who use haki to predict movment is the same that the mantra of the priest in skyland, and enel could effectively use it as a logia user. so we can assume logia user can use haki too, like othe devil fruit user.

that could be a logical theory.

Nice..thanks for remind me about that..i guess myargument is pretty much destroyed lol

ajj216011
September 29, 2009, 01:36 PM
I just remember the filler arc after Water-7 about the pirate hunters.
Seems the Admiral akainu have similar power that the head of the pirate hunter was having.

Luffy is still not able to use haki and fight against logia users ( even if they are of low ranks like smoker). but Luffy will fight with one of the important characters in this fight.

My earlier guess was Doflamingo, but seems like Buggy is more suitable for him. This leaves the third admiral for Luffy. :)


About kuma:
1) What he said to Reiliegh " Ace is being executed, but WG wants to prevent Strawhats to take any action to avoid giving Dragon a chance to participate in war." the action of kuma was like a statemate for WG. Dragon knows that his son is safe in some unknown part of the world and that WG will be able to prevent Dragon's participation in war.
2) Just before the war, he may have disappreared. Maybe he is the one who have opened the Gates allowing luffy to participate in the war. WG at that point of time have no option but to use a Pacifista as Kuma -look-a-like.
From the laser beam that he used at Iva, his being a Pacifista is confirmed.

Seleno
September 29, 2009, 01:42 PM
I simply love this week's spoilers xD
Finally the showdown between Luffy and Smoker and Hancock is hellping her true love (can't wait to see some pics of it).

The fights between Moria & Jimbei and also between Ivankov and "Kuma" are really interesting. I'm wondering wha Flamingo wants to tell us with this strange sentence that Kuma isn't the real Kuma anymore... Maybe he is now a fully robot without any emotions and own ideas?

Razh
September 29, 2009, 01:45 PM
I just remember the filler arc after Water-7 about the pirate hunters.
Seems the Admiral akainu have similar power that the head of the pirate hunter was having.

Kanonji could increase his own temperature. Akainu is most likely a lava logia. How's that similar?


From the laser beam that he used at Iva, his being a Pacifista is confirmed.

I hope this is the last fucking time.
http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/485/08/
But yeah, Kuma is a Pacifista.
http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/485/09/

c0nflikt
September 29, 2009, 01:53 PM
I hope she statues smoker, it would make my day. Glad hancock is fighting for her love. and i think this reveals the significance of what kuma said in shabondy he won't see luffy again cause he won't have his consciousness anymore is my guess. and wb and buggy epic. maybe wb will accidentally quake buggy and he will learn how to take himself apart in new ways.

kilm
September 29, 2009, 01:54 PM
Pacifista as Kuma -look-a-like.
From the laser beam that he used at Iva, his being a Pacifista is confirmed.

Kuma has always had the laser beams. The difference is that the real one has the paws on his hands.
http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/485/08/

With all this talk of haki, do we really expect it to be mentioned at every single junction to make it unambiguous that haki is being used? Gomu gomu no HAKI pistol, Kuja Amazon HAKI kick, staredown of HAKI, HAKI foresight just to make sure people know it's being used? That's going to be REALLY annoying in later chapters after haki mechanics are defined by Oda for the audience.

c0nflikt
September 29, 2009, 02:19 PM
I wish people would stop debating haki so hard, when its used and oda wants us to know about it we will know, otherwise stop obsessing.

Wb and buggy ftw.

SenninSage
September 29, 2009, 02:25 PM
Buggy is going to be legendary and feared lol.

He fought alongside Whitebeard hahaha.

DARK
September 29, 2009, 02:31 PM
So it seems that Hancock decides to betray the World Government after all. Smoker finally does something and gets his ass kicked. We finally see the power of Haki on Logia.
Moria VS Jinbei- Moria gathers shadows, Jinbei knocks him down with one punch?
WB wants Buggy to fight on his side? What is Buggy gonna do?

Razh
September 29, 2009, 02:32 PM
So there's a new spoiler, something about Luffy remembering Rayleigh blocking Kizaru after witnessing what Boa did to Smoker. Go Luffy!!!

I hope it's true. That almost means that Luffy will be able to hurt logias by the end of this battle. :amuse

Also, I like that last spoiler pic. The one with Whitebeard and Dragon, which appeared a couple of months ago, while Luffy was being healed in Newkama kingdom. It was fake then, it's fake now. Trying two times with the same pic? :(

EDIT: Took the liberty of finding it - http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1303858#post1303858

Melker
September 29, 2009, 02:35 PM
The recent pic posted with Dragon, Kuma and Whitebeard is fake...

BlackHair
September 29, 2009, 02:38 PM
The recent pic posted with Dragon, Kuma and Whitebeard is fake...Same here. We had a similar fake picture with WB before. This is just too epic to be true. Also in the previous spoiler text were no mentioned about Dragon.

Rotten The Wizard
September 29, 2009, 02:43 PM
whos the idiot who posted a fake from the past?

sigh

DARK
September 29, 2009, 02:47 PM
The drawing style is different (especially with Dragon) so you can tell that it's fake. Besides, wouldn't the spoiler also mention Dragon?
And even if it was somehow true, Oda must be one bad storyteller if one of his characters just appears out of nowhere with no explanation given.

johnnyb7
September 29, 2009, 02:49 PM
yeah i say the spoiler picture of dragon is a fake

That has to be the actual kuma fighting ivankov, he has the paws on his hands
http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/555/10-11/
and also he used ursa shock to go with that
http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/555/12-13/
That's the real kuma in my opinion, not a pacifista, which makes me think he's simply a double agent, and will have a role later on in the series to fight alongside dragon against the government. Until then he's going to continue fighting alongside the government, even if that means fighting ivankov.

Zehahaha
September 29, 2009, 02:52 PM
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA ! I love you Jimbei, good job on kickin' Moria's a** ! Anyway, i liked the fact that Hancock kicked Smoker (even tough i like this guy) and yeah... BUGGY FTW !

BlackHair
September 29, 2009, 02:55 PM
Seriously.. the discussion whether its fake or not is driving me nuts. Are all those pasifista fans blind or sth? Can't they see that Kuma used Usus Shock on Oars? Also that the real Kuma can use lasers as well? Not to mentioned Iva would have probably noticed a different presence by the pasifista, like Zoro did back on SA. ..


EDIT: Took the liberty of finding it - http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1303858#post1303858Good find. I was too lazy to search :p


Whitebeard decided to work with Buggy, because while he doesn't
find the red-nosed clown a threat, the escped prisoners could be cumbersome.
Im honestly bothered with this part of the spoiler. Seems like WB was rather forced to.. can't believe it xD

Kaiser Will
September 29, 2009, 02:58 PM
Excellent find!
I knew it was already used as a [fake] spoiler before!
I think the guy who did that picture must really want to that thing be true.

chess4
September 29, 2009, 02:58 PM
sengoku must have something big up his sleeve because the WG is at a serious disadvantage. even more since boa has turned on them. so whitebeard and his allies now have 2 former shichibukai and boa will make 3 on there side, not to mention a host of other strong pirates.

RichardMNixon
September 29, 2009, 02:59 PM
yeah i say the spoiler picture of dragon is a fake

That has to be the actual kuma fighting ivankov, he has the paws on his hands
http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/555/10-11/
and also he used ursa shock to go with that
http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/555/12-13/
That's the real kuma in my opinion, not a pacifista, which makes me think he's simply a double agent, and will have a role later on in the series to fight alongside dragon against the government. Until then he's going to continue fighting alongside the government, even if that means fighting ivankov.

The catch though is Doflamingo saying that the Kuma Iva knew is dead. This would satisfy the "We won't be seeing each other again." he said to Luffy, so it's definitely a possibility that something went on in Kuma's head, or maybe Vegapunk was able to transfer the Paw Paw fruit to a Pacifista. Has Kuma talked during the war?

mp44chris
September 29, 2009, 03:00 PM
Seriously.. the discussion whether its fake or not is driving me nuts. Are all those pasifista fans blind or sth? Can't they see that Kuma used Usus Shock on Oars? Also that the real Kuma can use lasers as well? Not to mentioned Iva would have noticed a different presence by the pasifista, like Zoro did back on SA. ..

Good find. I was too lazy to search :p
that is a nice answer... clear and nice! and this pic is a fake after all... to much trouble for a piece of s...-fake i mean..

Mythsoul
September 29, 2009, 03:00 PM
hmmmm awesome......Hancock coming to luffys aid....and Ivankok finding out that his old friend has been turned into a machine ........and Jimbie....kicks some serious ass!!!

AiddonValentine
September 29, 2009, 03:02 PM
I knew sooner or later Hancock would say "screw it" as she owes nothing to the dang Marines or the World Government. And I really wanna see her going nuts (hannya-face!)

DARK
September 29, 2009, 03:05 PM
hmmmm awesome......Hancock coming to luffys aid....and Ivankok finding out that his old friend has been turned into a machine ........and Jimbie....kicks some serious ass!!!

Luckily for Sengoku, we don't see Kuma betraying the Shichibukai anytime soon.
With Jinbei and Hancock openly fighting for Luffy's sake, while Blackbeard is off on his own business, Sengoku will go nuts.
Still with 4 Shichibukai and 3 Admirals it is still a hard battle.

And here is the proof that bounties aren't a necessary indication of somebody's strength. Jinbei with 250 million kicked Moria's ass faster than Luffy (who is 300 mil).

Razh
September 29, 2009, 03:08 PM
Im honestly bothered with this part of the spoiler. Seems like WB was rather forced to.. can't believe it xD

Well, I think that Whitebeard didn't survive all those years as a strongest pirate by being reckless. And neglecting their presence while fighting against Marines and Shichibukai could prove to be fatal.
I'm not really bothered by it.



I think the guy who did that picture must really want to that thing be true.

Who could blame him? I want it too. :amuse

jamjosef
September 29, 2009, 03:11 PM
Luckily for Sengoku, we don't see Kuma betraying the Shichibukai anytime soon.
With Jinbei and Hancock openly fighting for Luffy's sake, while Blackbeard is off on his own business, Sengoku will go nuts.
Still with 4 Shichibukai and 3 Admirals it is still a hard battle.

And here is the proof that bounties aren't a necessary indication of somebody's strength. Jinbei with 250 million kicked Moria's ass faster than Luffy (who is 300 mil).

its all based on the match up btw that was his former bounty there is no telling what it could have been / will be once they leave...
jinbei happens to be a master of sea water which just so happens to be moria's weakness (or any other df user for that matter)
for example im sure that a G2 luffy would defeat crocodile in one or 2 jet bazookas....(provided he is wet)

Akainu
September 29, 2009, 03:14 PM
The recent pic posted with Dragon, Kuma and Whitebeard is fake...


Same here. We had a similar fake picture with WB before. This is just too epic to be true. Also in the previous spoiler text were no mentioned about Dragon.


whos the idiot who posted a fake from the past?

sigh

did you even bother to look at the big fat red text? there's no need to discuss it in here <.<;

obamamania
September 29, 2009, 03:19 PM
Is it odd for me to wonder how flunkies are holding Crocodile back STILL? He's like right there and somehow got put on the backburner lol.

DARK
September 29, 2009, 03:21 PM
did you even bother to look at the big fat red text? there's no need to discuss it in here <.<;

Those posts were posted before it was deemed fake.

BlackHair
September 29, 2009, 03:22 PM
Well, I think that Whitebeard didn't survive all those years as a strongest pirate by being reckless. And neglecting their presence while fighting against Marines and Shichibukai could prove to be fatal.
I'm not really bothered by it.Ah' c'mon don't disturb my fun. U have to be reckless in a shounen manga :p Also those pirates with Buggy, are fooder. So some1 as Wb.. well I don't understand. Maybe he has some nostalgic thoughts with Buggy, similar thoughts he had on the vs Shanks discussion.

I guess Im putting too much thoughts on that. Lets wait for pics.


did you even bother to look at the big fat red text? there's no need to discuss it in here <.<;Now what are u playing here? You edited his post on 9.53 (GMT+1). We posted our posts before that. At that time it was labelled as pending.

Rotten The Wizard
September 29, 2009, 03:26 PM
Is it odd for me to wonder how flunkies are holding Crocodile back STILL? He's like right there and somehow got put on the backburner lol.
I was thinking the exact same thing
they were holding SWORDS to his neck....Croco-boy is scheming

Ero-Sanji
September 29, 2009, 03:35 PM
Hancock on the other hand might join Luffy only because she will die if Luffy leaves her. LOL!!

You think?:p

She wont die, Gloriosa(forgot her name:facepalm) survived it so it's not impossible.

In my opinion Hancock doesn't fit in as a strawhat, first of all she is already a captain. Second, what would be her profession....? And last but not least she would destroy the awesome Sanji!! I do not want to see Sanji chasing her around while she is chasing Luffy it kinda makes it all lame, it's enough with Robin chwaan! and Nami swaan!
(he would be turned to stone without the fruit heh)

But Hancock would be great as the one to revert Sanji back:D

Oke back to topic, well the latest spoiler indicates that some of Sengoku's plans are being discovered and something about sealing the island of with the power of prison(Hina?) thus ending the pirate age!

Perhaps Luffy will be remembered as one of the survivors!

vicbear
September 29, 2009, 03:35 PM
Oooh... looks like Luffy is finally putting 1 + 1 together about the whole 'haki attack is effective against logia users' thing.

Akainu
September 29, 2009, 03:36 PM
Those posts were posted before it was deemed fake.
I'm awefully sorry

Rotten The Wizard
September 29, 2009, 03:41 PM
i hope the latest spoiler is real. I want luffy to stop being clueless already.
Im not so sure about the part about Sengokus plan though.....
HINA is the key to this war? lmfao

Sachsenhesse
September 29, 2009, 03:45 PM
haha who cares

"extreme cutting ghosts"

zoro learns haki xD

jamjosef
September 29, 2009, 04:15 PM
haha who cares

"extreme cutting ghosts"

zoro learns haki xD

i also found that title interesting
one thing though what if zoro masters haki more than luffy? that would suck...

DARK
September 29, 2009, 04:16 PM
Ghost cutting? Don't tell me that Zoro is using Perona as a training dummy?

Belisar
September 29, 2009, 04:17 PM
Cover: Zoro's extreme training: ghost-cutting.
if zoro learns to cut ghosts, then logia are nothing. :worship2

DARK
September 29, 2009, 04:20 PM
if zoro learns to cut ghosts, then logia are nothing. :worship2

Zoro definitely needs this training. He was unable to cut Kuma and he is a Pacifisita. He was unable to damage Akainu and Kizaru even though the latter two are Logias.
All the Straw Hats need to learn Haki to get ahead. Pity Zoro is the only one taking up on it.

Bugzee
September 29, 2009, 04:24 PM
OMG just checked out the additional spoilers!! LOL that WB & Dragon would've been the sh*t!!! But it turned out to be fake!

WOW!!! Zoro ghost-cutting thats siiiick!!!!! lol One chapter a week isn't enough Oda!!!!!

I wanna hear more about this 'prison' ability wtf is it??? Does it consist of Kairoseki?? hmmm we need answers!

Razh
September 29, 2009, 04:26 PM
All the Straw Hats need to learn Haki to get ahead. Pity Zoro is the only one taking up on it.

They can't all learn it. That would be too much. Also, Luffy was always in the middle of something since he landed on Amazon Lily and there was no time for him to do any training, but, judging by the spoilers, he's starting to connect the dots.
Like I said earlier, Luffy is going to punch a logia before this battle ends.

DARK
September 29, 2009, 04:28 PM
They can't all learn it. That would be too much. Also, Luffy was always in the middle of something since he landed on Amazon Lily and there was no time for him to do any training, but, judging by the spoilers, he's starting to connect the dots.
Like I said earlier, Luffy is going to punch a logia before this battle ends.

Even then, Zoro is the only one who's training. OK, so Nami found a new tool she can use, but what else?

Luffy's Haki is connected by his emotions. So yeah, he might very well beat the crap out of a Logia even if he has no real experience with Haki.

jamjosef
September 29, 2009, 04:28 PM
They can't all learn it. That would be too much. Also, Luffy was always in the middle of something since he landed on Amazon Lily and there was no time for him to do any training, but, judging by the spoilers, he's starting to connect the dots.
Like I said earlier, Luffy is going to punch a logia before this battle ends.

my sentiments exactly
zoro and luffy learning it is a given... not so sure about sanji
the rest shouldnt learn it because they wont encounter any logia weak enough for them to fight...

Rotten The Wizard
September 29, 2009, 04:33 PM
Even then, Zoro is the only one who's training. OK, so Nami found a new tool she can use, but what else?

Luffy's Haki is connected by his emotions. So yeah, he might very well beat the crap out of a Logia even if he has no real experience with Haki.

zoro is the only one who ever trains if you hadnt noticed

DARK
September 29, 2009, 04:34 PM
zoro is the only one who ever trains if you hadnt noticed

True.
Zoro has nothing he can train with in a desolate area so he decides to use Perona's ghosts.

Razh
September 29, 2009, 04:35 PM
Luffy's Haki is connected by his emotions. So yeah, he might very well beat the crap out of a Logia even if he has no real experience with Haki.

Heh, good edit.:)

But beating could still be too much. If Luffy could actually land hits on admirals, he would just have a slightly better chance. They are still strong and have amazing powers. Luffy is still equally vulnerable. I wouldn't be surprised if those guys knew some of the Rokushiki techniques too. They are Marines greatest military power.
Smoker, on the other hand...:luffy

jamjosef
September 29, 2009, 04:37 PM
Heh, good edit.:)

But beating could still be too much. If Luffy could actually land hits on admirals, he would just have a slightly better chance. They are still strong and have amazing powers. Luffy is still equally vulnerable. I wouldn't be surprised if those guys knew some of the Rokushiki techniques too. They are Marines greatest military power.
Smoker, on the other hand...:luffy

i dont see why a man that can move at the speed of light would need rokushi...

Dalyup!
September 29, 2009, 04:38 PM
Hmm, Garp and Whitebeard exchanging glances; maybe Garp's "I would do something if I could" was actually true or else it's just a 'ohaithere'.

Sounds like another awesome chapter.

Razh
September 29, 2009, 04:40 PM
i dont see why a man that can move at the speed of light would need rokushi...

Yeah, we can all agree that Kizaru doesn't need soru. But that doesn't mean that he can't use it. Coby knows how to do it for god's sake.
And there are 6 techniques.

k-dom
September 29, 2009, 04:41 PM
The last spoiler is not very clear but it seems there will also be an interesting topic on Garp and Akainu. And I wonder what is that prison ability and how whitebeard learn about it

OunknownO
September 29, 2009, 04:46 PM
Luffy:- usage of haki
Zoro:- usage of haki
Robin:- ???
Chopper:- control of his super saiyan mode
Nami:- new equipment
Usopp:- usage of haki (like the arrows on the kuja island)
Sanji:- okama kempo(modified because sanji doesn't use hands in fight)
Franky:- equipment upgrade
Brook:- stronger atacks

PS. hina is somehow involved in the plan... but so what they trapp them and then what??

beastboy
September 29, 2009, 04:49 PM
but it wouldn't fit kizaru.. I mean.. shigan isn't flashy enough.. kami isn't needed after all he is logia, soru :/, that slash with the feet isn't good when we can fire lasers.. tekaii HE IS LOGIA.. geppou.. he can pretty much fly with hyata no kagami..

But this new spoiler is great but I bet is fake..

Poneglyph420
September 29, 2009, 04:50 PM
Luffy:- usage of haki
Zoro:- usage of haki
Robin:- ???
Chopper:- control of his super saiyan mode
Nami:- new equipment
Usopp:- usage of haki (like the arrows on the kuja island)
Sanji:- okama kempo(modified because sanji doesn't use hands in fight)
Franky:- equipment upgrade
Brook:- stronger atacks

PS. hina is somehow involved in the plan... but so what they trapp them and then what??


Super Saiyan..???
:facepalm

Monster point... and more likely he will become "awakened"

Belisar
September 29, 2009, 04:51 PM
zoro is the only one who ever trains if you hadnt noticed
correction: zoro is the only one showing to train! sanji and luffy doesn't invent things up right in the fight. ok, luffy does. ^^ sanji's diablo leg or luffy's gear 2nd and 3rd were trained but we didn't see it.

Razh
September 29, 2009, 04:56 PM
but it wouldn't fit kizaru.. I mean.. shigan isn't flashy enough.. kami isn't needed after all he is logia, soru :/, that slash with the feet isn't good when we can fire lasers.. tekaii HE IS LOGIA.. geppou.. he can pretty much fly with hyata no kagami..

But this new spoiler is great but I bet is fake..

Ok, lay of Kizaru for a moment. There are 2 other admirals. Also, again, just because he doesn't need it, doesn't mean he doesn't know it.
First we thought that only CP9 use Rokushiki, but then we find out that Garp can use Soru and his young apprentice too.
What I'm trying to say that I wouldn't be surprised if I suddenly realized that Aokiji can jump off air fro example.

That's about all I am going to say about this matter here.

BlackHair
September 29, 2009, 04:57 PM
They don't train, but they envelope during fights. The training arc was before the start of one piece.

Regarding haki and the monster trio, I really weant all three of them learning haki and with that fighting logia's in the NW. So far every oppenent for both Sanji and Zoro were well matched, but somehow I always got the feeling they are not impressive. Maybe because Luffy was always fighting monsters. Anyway I want near Luffy level opponents fighting Zoro and Sanji.

About the rest of the crew.. well I give a damn xD

Razh
September 29, 2009, 04:59 PM
Monster point... and more likely he will become "awakened"

Awakened Chopper would look like he does in his human form all the time. No more chibi Chopper.

I don't think awakened zoans are necessarily happy with their "upgrade", if you can call it like that. They just become animals who are more intelligent than rest. Probably users who have lost themselves to animal instincts completely and neglected their human side.

DARK
September 29, 2009, 05:06 PM
Back on topic, Zoro seems to be the only one training. Luffy meanwhile has an extensive amount of Haki potential coming from his rage. As of now, we don't know if the other SHs are really training.

beastboy
September 29, 2009, 05:08 PM
Ok, lay of Kizaru for a moment. There are 2 other admirals. Also, again, just because he doesn't need it, doesn't mean he doesn't know it.
First we thought that only CP9 use Rokushiki, but then we find out that Garp can use Soru and his young apprentice too.
What I'm trying to say that I wouldn't be surprised if I suddenly realized that Aokiji can jump off air fro example.

That's about all I am going to say about this matter here.

Why would you learn something you don't need Oo

about Aokiji.. he needs some soru, and maybe he actually uses it..
Akainu I don't know..
And Aokiji actually is flying in the sky to stop that wave ~_~

RichardMNixon
September 29, 2009, 05:11 PM
I didn't read prison as Hina, I was thinking some person we haven't seen yet covering the whole island in a force field.

Wowzers
September 29, 2009, 05:22 PM
Garp: HA ha ha ha! That's my grandson! He's got more shichibukai on his side than we do!

Sengoku: GARP!!! *starts strangling Garp, right there on tv*

Mark my words, this will happen! :XD


...With all this talk of haki, do we really expect it to be mentioned at every single junction to make it unambiguous that haki is being used? Gomu gomu no HAKI pistol, Kuja Amazon HAKI kick, staredown of HAKI, HAKI foresight just to make sure people know it's being used? That's going to be REALLY annoying in later chapters after haki mechanics are defined by Oda for the audience.

Well... from the impression I'm getting, those who have haki don't talk about it much so you don't really hear about it... unless you end up on Kuja island where they brag about having it. Even when Shanks showed up on WB's ship, Marco just told the cannon fodder pirates to get back before it was too late and didn't really explain why to them. WE got a brief explanation when the cannon fodder pirates already passed out.

Rotten The Wizard
September 29, 2009, 05:32 PM
They don't train, but they envelope during fights. The training arc was before the start of one piece.

Regarding haki and the monster trio, I really weant all three of them learning haki and with that fighting logia's in the NW. So far every oppenent for both Sanji and Zoro were well matched, but somehow I always got the feeling they are not impressive. Maybe because Luffy was always fighting monsters. Anyway I want near Luffy level opponents fighting Zoro and Sanji.

About the rest of the crew.. well I give a damn xD


People seem to think that the only use of haki is to fight logias...
You can fight logias WITHOUT haki, you just have to find their weakness. Not being able to use haki doesnt mean youre gonna get curb stomped by every logia you come across

and plus, I highly doubt more than 2 more logias will be introduced for the rest of OP. You speak of it as if logias are a dime a dozen


these days people are using Haki as a solution for everything.....

Romanov D Paul
September 29, 2009, 05:34 PM
That would be sick though it would also be quite of "cheating" if u ask me, enclosing anyone into an unescapable cage and blow everything up :D. But then they should find someway to save themself, also, so I really don't know how much use they find in that... a parte from being sure that WB isn't going to escape, something that probably would'nt have happened anyway IMO. Anyway, who knows...

As for the Haki matter, I was thinking that maybe it does not simply nullify DF powers, but that let the user strike unsubstantial matter like the one that composes many logia user. Well not all logia's are unsubstantial but if Zoro is really gonna make it in cutting ghosts I'm pretty sure it will be thanks to haki, cause cutting the effect of a DF power seems to me different then nullifyng it. What do you think about?

Croy
September 29, 2009, 05:40 PM
Garp: HA ha ha ha! That's my grandson! He's got more shichibukai on his side than we do!

Sengoku: GARP!!! *starts strangling Garp, right there on tv*

Mark my words, this will happen! :XD



Well... from the impression I'm getting, those who have haki don't talk about it much so you don't really hear about it... unless you end up on Kuja island where they brag about having it. Even when Shanks showed up on WB's ship, Marco just told the cannon fodder pirates to get back before it was too late and didn't really explain why to them. WE got a brief explanation when the cannon fodder pirates already passed out.

Just because of the fight with Blackbeard and Luffy in Impel Down, im inclined to believe Haki can come about from just about anyone with the right will or ambition, its just that most can't influence others with it and an even fewer segment amongst that other group can 'control' it into an actual weapon or defense like the Kuja Pirates can. Most the Kuja pirates can control their ambition but they don't have a powerful enough ambition to really become devastating, whereas Luffy has a devastating amount of ambition, but he has no understanding of how to control it yet so he can't use it as a weapon or for defense. Its only use at the moment is just to overwhelm those with weaker wills than him. At least in my opinion. Maybe the next couple of chapters Hancock will teach or demonstrate how to do it so that Luffy can be better protected. Or he will just figure it out on his own while watching Hancock quarrel with Smoker.

Roarchu
September 29, 2009, 05:42 PM
maybe Nami might be able to hurt some logias without Haki

she can use water and lightning. idk if she can use cold, but i think she might be able to

so now Luffy has Ivankov, Jimbei, Hancock, and Marco to help him rush to Ace...it's just too awesomely amazing

sharingan_kakashi
September 29, 2009, 05:50 PM
well well.. it looks like Kuma did turn into a full pacifista. Which is why he has lost all of his memories. He is useless to the revolutionaries now.

cutting ghosts that is silly enough to be true. but know knows, maybe perona will just be his girlfriend or something.

BlackHair
September 29, 2009, 05:59 PM
People seem to think that the only use of haki is to fight logias...
You can fight logias WITHOUT haki, you just have to find their weakness. Not being able to use haki doesnt mean youre gonna get curb stomped by every logia you come across

and plus, I highly doubt more than 2 more logias will be introduced for the rest of OP. You speak of it as if logias are a dime a dozen


these days people are using Haki as a solution for everything.....
Now when did I say haki is the only weapon against logia?

Even if u don't like it, haki is the topic for quite a while now. Even in the manga, informations are given in slow pace (100+ chapter's). Everything hints towards that haki is the key element to become stronger and maybe even the last step for the final forms of the SHs. So just stick with OP and accept the fact that the SHs (even if its only Luffy) will deal with haki.

And about the logia opponents.. well I just want Zoro and Sanji to fight monsters. And a Logia would do the jop. In this matter I don't rly expect anything, coz I believe the same pattern we have now will be maintained... too bad actually.

llamapie
September 29, 2009, 06:20 PM
It will be something else if luffy learns to use his Haki. :P Would be sweet to see him beat down all the admirals.

Saint Markus
September 29, 2009, 07:08 PM
this is promising and buggy is joining whitebeard in the fight. coolness. can't wait for this chapter.

Razh
September 29, 2009, 07:11 PM
Why would you learn something you don't need Oo


OMFG

Maybe, just maybe, the admirals, being Marines greatest military strength, haven't neglected basic training just because they can zap around, freeze stuff or melt it.
I really doubt that they rely only on their powers. That would make them weaklings. Auge commented how Ace has superior basic combat skill. Admirals are probably same. It's evident from the way Aokiji caught both Zoro's and Sanji's attack at the same time, or in the way Kizaru kicks, that they know how to fight, to put it mildly.

And here you are, saying that Kizaru doesn't need anything because he can move at a light speed.

Why did Kumadori use the stick if he could poke enemies with his finger?

Finale
September 29, 2009, 07:19 PM
i think Sanji will learn how to fight logias in some shape or fashion. Especially if Zoro is able to. I seriously doubt he would let Zoro get get that far ahead of him considering their rivalry.

red-hair himself
September 29, 2009, 07:40 PM
u guys c the pic in the spoilers even tho it says fake it shows wb worried and dragon beside kuma :O XO if it happens to be true by miscalculation thatll be FUCKING EPIC

chitgoks
September 29, 2009, 08:41 PM
wow so zoro is training for ghost cutting. if masters it, then he could do the same to logia right?
[hr]

well well.. it looks like Kuma did turn into a full pacifista. Which is why he has lost all of his memories. He is useless to the revolutionaries now.

cutting ghosts that is silly enough to be true. but know knows, maybe perona will just be his girlfriend or something.

you know. one thing puzzles me. if kuma indeed became a full pacifista, why didnt he just escape after he sent all the SH flying? he can teleport after all right?
[hr]

maybe Nami might be able to hurt some logias without Haki

she can use water and lightning. idk if she can use cold, but i think she might be able to

so now Luffy has Ivankov, Jimbei, Hancock, and Marco to help him rush to Ace...it's just too awesomely amazing

we'll be seeing another surprised face from sengoku after hancock butted in and attacked smoker!

craziii
September 29, 2009, 08:43 PM
this chapter seems like a nice setup where luffy learns how to use his haki from hancock! he will be able to hit logia types from here on out!

Poneglyph420
September 29, 2009, 08:55 PM
WOW!!!

Zoro learning ghost cutting... Just awesome.. Could he then hit a Logia?? Easy, ONLY if hitting a ghost involves Haki..Probably..

Kuma.. So he is pawn of the WG, apparently at least. Very very interesting... Now I really want to know what's his deal.. And Vegapunk too..
Also if we assume he has somehow been "programmed" why/ how could he save Luffy and attack PX-1????

Lastly if Hancock openly helps Luffy, Kuja is in for a whole new mess...
But that's the biggest shock to me. More and more I see her becoming a vital ally to Luffy....

But still need to see a full RAW to say...

mr.danly
September 29, 2009, 08:57 PM
I don't see hancock actually teaching puffy. He'll just watch and learn... That's how he learned soru, after all. Anyway, it seems kuma was transformed awfully quickly... Within the week or so that has passed since shabondy, he's lost his memory and become a complete pacifista? Very interesting developments... I thought that kuma was the original and therfore got to keep his personality but I guess not.

Blooper
September 29, 2009, 09:16 PM
About hitting the logias... why doesn't Sanji just wear some kairouseki (or whatever it's spelled) boots, Zoro some kairouseki sword and so on? Easier solution there is lol >.>
Anyway, can't wait for the chapter, seems pure epicness.

Edit: Imagine Usopp firing a small kairouseki bullet into one logia's mouth... Ownage, lol.

Wowzers
September 29, 2009, 09:19 PM
Personally, I think they originally left Kuma with his personality intact when they turned him into a pacifista. They did this as he was always the most loyal of the Shichibukai and he would be more valuable with his mind intact than if he was just a robot. After Shabondy, they couldn't trust him anymore so they just activated the "pacifista programming" and he is now no longer the same man.

You can now think of him as PX-zero.

He probably couldn't run away as they likely have a self destruct function built in. You also can't bluff your way through an explanation if you run away.

Franckie
September 29, 2009, 10:02 PM
First, it was BB. Now it's Moria. I really hope Moria being two-panelled is just nja trolling like he normally does. No 7BK should ever be treated like some random fodder. It's bad enough Kubo and Kishi do that with their respective characters counterpart to the 7BK.

wing_gundam
September 29, 2009, 11:03 PM
Monster point... and more likely he will become "awakened"

Chopper will prob stay in small form because he's a cute lovable character... that's what this is all about - a popular show/manga.


correction: zoro is the only one showing to train!

Zoro is the only one who works out, they all advance their battle skills the same way - ie thinking about it and trying it out in battle. Zoro works out bc he feels being physically stronger would help his power when he moves his arms etc. This is probably passe at this point as technique becomes the way to winning, but then again, working out with 10000 lbs dumbbells is basically an essential part of his character - like Chopper with his chopsticks in his nose/mouth, Usopp with "I can't go on the island disease".





about Aokiji.. he needs some soru, and maybe he actually uses it..


Aokiji? probably not. He might know it, but he's the laziest guy in all of OP. I can hardly imagine him running around for anything.



WOW!!!

Zoro learning ghost cutting... Just awesome.. Could he then hit a Logia??

Maybe Oda's going for a Sesshomaru type thing? Send ppl straight to hell by killing their souls, while saving others. It could be possible as Zoro is supposed to have the essence of a demon.



About hitting the logias... why doesn't Sanji just wear some kairouseki (or whatever it's spelled) boots, Zoro some kairouseki sword and so on? Easier solution there is lol >.>


I think the seastone idea has been well thought of before. It could be interesting, but its not the be-all and end all. Think about it - Luffy falls into the sea daily anyways and yet he always survives, in Impel down the land of seastone practically, everyone escapes their shackles (except for Ace, obviously). I think seastone can have some advantages, but its easily skirted. What would Zoro do then if the Logia then has a sword as well? The logia user could block the strike, then Burn, freeze, dehydrate, etc. Zoro with his other hand in one strike. I think it would be easier if everyone just started carrying around water canons.

_________________________________________

With regards to the chapter, I would have hoped to see more of WB fighting himself. He seems more of a background guy after his first blow. I guess if he follows Buggy into battle (funniest thing ever!) then hopefully he'll go fight someone but we got to wait a bit for that.

It does look like Luffy is going to pick up "attack" haki which would be awesome. He's already got the "king's disposition/faint aura" going on, so that would really increase his skills, and I'm assuming having King's Haki means you've got a literal ton of it compared to everyone else, allowing more moves. I could see him using some Jet Haki Bullets like I think someone mentioned, that would basically shoot a burst of haki out like a long range weapon. That could be very interesting and useful for facing long ranged Logias, and especially Kuma.

I would like to see Hancock become the next SH. I don't know why, I think she's much more entertaining than Brook, and probably more skilled. She could probably wipe out/control/be able to influence 90% of the world's population alone. Pretty useful skill no?

ksfst
September 29, 2009, 11:14 PM
Luffy still gets his ass handed by Smoker, arg...
Seriously... just piss me off, I really want to see Luffy getting stronger, I want to see he having at least a chance against logia users.

Kshunsui
September 29, 2009, 11:15 PM
how smoker can wield a kairoseki sword without been weakened or lost the logia effect? when luffy gained control of haki he would be a monster and for sure he's gonna wipe the flor with smoker

ANBU4U
September 29, 2009, 11:20 PM
Luffy still gets his ass handed by Smoker, arg...
Seriously... just piss me off, I really want to see Luffy getting stronger, I want to see he having at least a chance against logia users.

You think you're pissed? Smoker should have had Luffy 3 times now.

Smoker > Luffy at Lougetown but.... Smoker < Dragon

Smoker > Luffy at Arabasta but... Smoker = Ace

Smoker > Luffy at Marineford but... Smoker = Hancock

I guarantee you Smokers livid.
[hr]

how smoker can wield a kairoseki sword without been weakened or lost the logia effect?

Only the tip is made of seastone, and that hangs off his back. Plus he wears padded clothes to insulate him from the sea stones affects....

elitefox
September 29, 2009, 11:34 PM
hehe Buggy the puppet leader :D

using him to encourage the prisoners to fight, WB is as sly as ever...


so is it the real plan? to use the prison fruit to capture them all?

ascalon
September 29, 2009, 11:34 PM
You think you're pissed? Smoker should have had Luffy 3 times now.

Smoker > Luffy at Lougetown but.... Smoker < Dragon

Smoker > Luffy at Arabasta but... Smoker = Ace

Smoker > Luffy at Marineford but... Smoker = Hancock

I guarantee you Smokers livid.
<hr noshade size="1">


Only the tip is made of seastone, and that hangs off his back. Plus he wears padded clothes to insulate him from the sea stones affects....

Plus Smoker has been training and trying to get stronger so he can move up in the ranks. I think it's highly likely he could be an admiral someday, and a good adversary for Luffy.

Mr. Crocodile
September 30, 2009, 12:00 AM
Just saw some of the pics..I really liked how Jimbei kicked Moria's ass with one punch and Hancock's angry face was awesome. btw is the page about Kuma "dying" the last one?

SenninSage
September 30, 2009, 12:07 AM
Haha, I love hancock. It's great how she protected Luffy. It's so funny how Smoker was choking the living crap out of Luffy hahaha.

obamamania
September 30, 2009, 12:30 AM
Prison fruit? Why the hell is such a person not at Impel down lol, they must have some epic power of containment. But we already have that marine woman with a capture fruit so...idk. Maybe there is some vegapunk invention that amplifies devil fruits, or maybe the power is dimensional and not literally a prison. Btw...I recall a prison being a device that contains ALL things within...I also recall the entire marine force intertwined with those who will be imprisoned. How the hell is that gonna work haha, Oda is going to have something intelligent planned for that.

iFrozt
September 30, 2009, 12:51 AM
I think Kuma is just faking everything

his personally feelings are still tehre but he just wants to act more loyal now because of all his reckless behaviors

Ero-Sanji
September 30, 2009, 12:52 AM
Sanji might actually learn Haki, I mean Okama island is like a sister island to Amazon lily right so perhaps they too have the knowledge of Haki!

iFrozt
September 30, 2009, 01:04 AM
most likely sanji will pick up okama kempo with his feet
it is going to take a while for sanji or zoro to actually be able to use haki like rayleigh

sanji already got his diablo jambe,basically flame kicks...so that is a element by itself

senewe
September 30, 2009, 01:12 AM
Smoker > Luffy at Lougetown but.... Smoker < Dragon

Smoker > Luffy at Arabasta but... Smoker = Ace

Smoker > Luffy at Marineford but... Smoker = Hancock



i'd like smoker = Ace. i like smoker...
but sorry, he was not = ace...

as for hancock, yes they are...
but, if i have to choose, i give a cheer to hancock (i have to)

Aikyet
September 30, 2009, 01:47 AM
Yeah, right, Ace said that he and Smoker are equal and their fight is meaningless just for the lulz.

bittman
September 30, 2009, 02:04 AM
This is easily the most disappointing of chapters for a long time, even including 557 where it was nothing but everyone going "=O".

Why do I say that?
Moria got disappointing.
Hancock actually betrayed so easily, wasn't even any tension about it.
Whitebeard picks up on Sengoku's plan? I hope to god WB knowing Sengoku's plan is a part of Sengoku's plan...which is a bit of a dick move in itself...
Doflamingo's line about Kuma just made me 1000x less interested in Kuma.
Ace is still such a freaking emo.

Only thing I'm looking forward in this entire chapter is Smoker kicking Luffy's ass for a couple of pages and possibly seeing Zoro on the cover. Really disappointed in this chapter, I've had high hopes for the chapters since Luffy returned and I haven't really felt any of them were that great (as some of you may be able to tell from my lack of reviews).

Which reminds me I'm probably not doing them anymore. Chewing up time I could probably spend better elsewhere. Perhaps I'll do some reviews using youtube instead of typing, formatting, making pictures pretty and thinking up witty titles.

Akainu
September 30, 2009, 02:14 AM
Skipping reviews because you don't like the chapters? Hell that would be a lot more interesting to read the reasons for that than constantly praising Oda.

Even if to me some of the points you raise just do the contrary, like Moria totally deserves being fodder, Kuma being dead now opening up another storyline even if his 'now' character is gone there is still a 'past' character's story to be told and also on the negative side Smoker being annoying again...

I think that this chapter has some nice fights starting as well as furthering the story and not to mention probably Luffys understanding of Haki. Seeing almost all the Shichibukai in action makes me wonder though... where is Mihawk?

luffy_boy
September 30, 2009, 02:22 AM
Well i don`t think the fight moria vs jimbei is over.. i could see him grabbing jimbei`s shadow or some other powerfull marines.

kilm
September 30, 2009, 02:36 AM
Skipping reviews because you don't like the chapters? Hell that would be a lot more interesting to read the reasons for that than constantly praising Oda.

Please, don't encourage it.


I think that this chapter has some nice fights starting as well as furthering the story and not to mention probably Luffys understanding of Haki. Seeing almost all the Shichibukai in action makes me wonder though... where is Mihawk?

Mihawk's... face has been shown to make comment... probably just fighting off pirates. It seems that Mihawk wouldn't really play that significant of a role for Luffy. Mihawk is pretty much a character for Zoro, so if Luffy and Mihawk have a conversation, I'd imagine it to be shallow.

I do wonder, Shichibukai has been shaken up (Jimbei, maybe Blackbeard, maybe Hancock), so who would take up the (perhaps) soon to be empty seats? Old characters? New characters?

elitefox
September 30, 2009, 02:39 AM
Well i don`t think the fight moria vs jimbei is over.. i could see him grabbing jimbei`s shadow or some other powerfull marines.

Well yeah that could happen and he had suck many marines shadow already maybe fodder ones but it didn't even boost him or jimbei is just too powerful for him.

I think jimbei knows how to be cautious of moria... now I am wondering how did he suck many marines shadow while jimbei is in front untouch... maybe the pics will clear it up

Jadedmariner
September 30, 2009, 03:06 AM
Kuma likely died or lost control of his consciousness (he is a cyborg afterall) as a punishment for helping the Straw Hats escape. I mean it seems beyond question that at that point he would have had to have control of his actions and his cryptic comments would make sense if he knew he was signing his own death warrant.
[hr]

I do wonder, Shichibukai has been shaken up (Jimbei, maybe Blackbeard, maybe Hancock), so who would take up the (perhaps) soon to be empty seats? Old characters? New characters?

It all depends on whether or not the Marines win. If they do it wouldn't surprise me if one of the Super Novas ends up becoming one of the new Shichibukai.

Akainu
September 30, 2009, 03:10 AM
Well i don`t think the fight moria vs jimbei is over.. i could see him grabbing jimbei`s shadow or some other powerfull marines.
A Moria with the shadows of the three admirals would be uber :spaz I know it won't happen but the imagination of it is enough ^^


Please, don't encourage it.

Sure I do. Critique is always better than blindly following someone or something, even if I don't share the opinion. And as long as it's someone who knows the manga and doesn't only give unreasonable hate but justified points I'd read it.



Mihawk's... face has been shown to make comment... probably just fighting off pirates. It seems that Mihawk wouldn't really play that significant of a role for Luffy. Mihawk is pretty much a character for Zoro, so if Luffy and Mihawk have a conversation, I'd imagine it to be shallow.
Talking to Luffy isn't the point. The point is he isn't shown fighting one of the big shots like all the other Shichi - well except for DoFlamingo, but I think he will fight on Kumas side against the revolutionaries (that would be Inazuma entering the fights). Well anyway, Mihawk is surprisingly neutral in this fight...

Black Lagoon
September 30, 2009, 03:21 AM
By the look of his eyes, Moria seems to be unconscious (Jimbei gave him a good beating XD)

And Hancock ... Holy S**t!! she scares.

Dim
September 30, 2009, 03:37 AM
maybe based on the chapter name Zoro will start believing in God

hahaha start praying for someone to save him from PERONA :P

maaghms
September 30, 2009, 03:37 AM
The spoilers seem to indicate that Luffy is finally observing and thinking why some people are able to hit other people with Logia abilities. I do not agree with people saying that only Luffy in the Strawhat Pirates will be able to learn and use Haki. In contrast, I believe that most, if not all, of the Strawhat Pirates will be able to master Haki due to the following reasons:

(1) Rayleigh who is the first mate of Roger was able to use it rather proficiently. Thus, there is no reason why a person like Zoro who is the de facto first mate of Luffy should not be able to learn and use it.

(2) Many of the Kuja Pirates can recognize and use it. I believe that the reasons behind them being able to use it is because of exposure to the existence and knowledge of Haki and learning how to use it. So, why not Strawhat Pirates? All of them (with the exception of Chopper) have relatively high bounties and posses strong minds. There is no justification why they should not able to learn it.

(3) In my opinion, Haki by itself is not only for those 'selected few'. The 'King's Haki' might be for only a few people, but average Haki can be mastered by anybody with sufficient effort and mental strength.

GastricJuice
September 30, 2009, 04:04 AM
Vexing to think what Whitebeard has figured out :mad There is still far too little to go by. Let us hope this won't be viewed as the critical error that led to his defeat...

Can't say i'm too surprised by Hancock's actions :tem

Doflammingo's words are too much, this just complicates Kuma's character :facepalm But this also bakes more questions! Assuming Flamingo's words are up to snuff. When did Kuma start loosing control of his consciousness? Why would the government tell him(DoFlammingo), if it was as recently as some here have speculated? It does seem strange that a person of his calm/calculated demeanor, would be called a tyrant. And why would Kuma accept any of this!?! :darn

Yans86
September 30, 2009, 04:15 AM
Can u imagine what level of epicnees are waiting in front of us,since ODA just gave us the hint that in really few time Luffy will acknowledge and use haki FUCKPWNING Smoker and maybe an admiral!!!!!!!

chitgoks
September 30, 2009, 04:28 AM
Well yeah that could happen and he had suck many marines shadow already maybe fodder ones but it didn't even boost him or jimbei is just too powerful for him.

I think jimbei knows how to be cautious of moria... now I am wondering how did he suck many marines shadow while jimbei is in front untouch... maybe the pics will clear it up

jinbei knows for sure how moria's power works 's why he's able to do something against him right away. else he'd have a tough time that's for sure
[hr]

Kuma likely died or lost control of his consciousness (he is a cyborg afterall) as a punishment for helping the Straw Hats escape. I mean it seems beyond question that at that point he would have had to have control of his actions and his cryptic comments would make sense if he knew he was signing his own death warrant.
<hr noshade size="1">

It all depends on whether or not the Marines win. If they do it wouldn't surprise me if one of the Super Novas ends up becoming one of the new Shichibukai.

it's kinda bad if the WG will choose a supernova for a shichibukai position. why not those left over level 6 prisoners at impel down (assuming BB recruited some of them)

PaLLl
September 30, 2009, 04:46 AM
Can u imagine what level of epicnees are waiting in front of us,since ODA just gave us the hint that in really few time Luffy will acknowledge and use haki FUCKPWNING Smoker and maybe an admiral!!!!!!!

Maaan people you wrote this kind of crap in every single Discussion in every single post......What kind of epicness will it bring ?
Sometimes I understand the epicness of many people for this war is very fast - like luffy runs punches everybody , use Haki everybody falls down....the left are 10 - 20 admirals (Including VA , RA etc...) some few Pirates....Luffy kick them all , comes other SH crew....finishes everybody...there ya go...Happy End....FURY of epicnes...

(Bull sh`t)

The epicness is when you start with nothing but end with something !
About Kuma....smb said how the Calm person like Kuma could be the Tyrant. If you will take most of Murderes and Killers - The best , The most dangerous and most fearless of all are Calm.

Aaannd...about the Hancock...she's got the KD haki like Luffy ?
Didn't she had on the pic hell of an emotion ? why i'm trying to say like Luffy with wolves in ID .

Black Lagoon
September 30, 2009, 04:46 AM
I still think Doflamingo doesn't mean Kuma is literally dead, since he's a cyborg the WG (Vegapunk) may had subjected him to an update, after the incident of the Shabondy Archipelago...

sorry for bad english :sweat

deffkryz
September 30, 2009, 04:49 AM
I agree totally to maaghms (http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1601064&postcount=191)... And if the spoiler about the cover is true (well, it is confirmed but there may be a risk left unless it's seen), Zoro might get to learn Rayleigh's trick to fight DF abilities with his swords. So he might at least be able to do something against Kizaru's light sword. :spaz

I also think the other Mugiwaras will get a very own and special way of using haki... Nami and Chopper for example might get the ability to precalculate an opponent's attack and thus evade it.

Akainu
September 30, 2009, 04:52 AM
I don't know what you mean, cutting ghosts maybe? that's nonsense seeing the coverpage that just surfaced.
except a huge cross (which kinda reminds me of Mihawk) and Zoro having his swords back, there is almost nothing much of interest... *waiting for what his coverstory title says*

deffkryz
September 30, 2009, 05:00 AM
I don't know what you mean, cutting ghosts maybe? that's nonsense seeing the coverpage that just surfaced.
except a huge cross (which kinda reminds me of Mihawk) and Zoro having his swords back, there is almost nothing much of interest... *waiting for what his coverstory title says*

Well, I wasn't able to take a look at it until now... protegon has posted a link which seemed dead to me. I was indeed referring to Cover: Zoro's extreme training: ghost-cutting. which wasn't actually a confirmed spoiler, but yet not deleted.

Belisar
September 30, 2009, 05:09 AM
They don't train, but they envelope during fights. The training arc was before the start of one piece.

Regarding haki and the monster trio, I really weant all three of them learning haki and with that fighting logia's in the NW. So far every oppenent for both Sanji and Zoro were well matched, but somehow I always got the feeling they are not impressive. Maybe because Luffy was always fighting monsters. Anyway I want near Luffy level opponents fighting Zoro and Sanji.

About the rest of the crew.. well I give a damn xD
haki isn't only useful against logia. it can enhance every attack!

PaLLl
September 30, 2009, 05:11 AM
I don't know what you mean, cutting ghosts maybe? that's nonsense seeing the coverpage that just surfaced.
except a huge cross (which kinda reminds me of Mihawk) and Zoro having his swords back, there is almost nothing much of interest... *waiting for what his coverstory title says*

About the Mihawk part with cross....
I'm maybe the useless user here :D
But still somehow this gruesome place reminds me Mihawk...
He's all dark gruesome...almost like Got...but half of him is like French Musketeer. The Sword (cross) , talisman on neck (cross) , his spooky raft :D Maybe Mihawk homeland or sth ?

Shiro-kun
September 30, 2009, 05:21 AM
Boa is soo awesome , so i guess its been confirmed that haki was introduced as one way for someone like Luffy to deal with The Nearly - Unstoppable Logia users :).

and

Jinbei is just pwning the crap out of Moria haha. :D

Akainu
September 30, 2009, 05:23 AM
Well, I wasn't able to take a look at it until now... protegon has posted a link which seemed dead to me. I was indeed referring to Cover: Zoro's extreme training: ghost-cutting. which wasn't actually a confirmed spoiler, but yet not deleted.
well, true the title of the coverstory could still contain this line. combining this to logias though is jumping to conclusions a little, imo.

BlackHair
September 30, 2009, 05:29 AM
haki isn't only useful against logia. it can enhance every attack!I can only repeat myself. Out of the monster trio so far only Luffy fought monsters. He was the only one who exhausted to that extent that he was unable to move or even unconscious. But Zoro and Sanji were not in a similar situation. They even kept fighting alongside the crew after their 1vs.1 fights. So all I want are monster opponents for Zoro and Sanji and not only for Luffy. And a Logia would do the jop, imo The general known weapons to figh all logia are seastone and haki. Of course there is the elemental weakness, but u can't have it for every logia. So either seastone or haki. And Im aware that these can be also used on paramacia and zoan. But they are not monster (in general).

Anyway to the spoiler. Finally there is a small WB/Garp moment. I was missing that since the beginning of the war. There have been only Sengoku/WB glares but not with Garp. I felt like one of my favo character was put aside. Happy to see that.

Regarding Smoker, as expected he got stronger. That scar on his chest was enough proof for me. And honestly Moria.. that guy is pathetic.

Black Lagoon
September 30, 2009, 05:31 AM
you all (most) are talking about Haki as if it was sharingan, Oda isn't like Kishi who lately give sharingan to everyone, if it was that easy then the DF users would be like rubbish or nothing special. Although I agree that Zorro should get Haki, Sanji ... well, his dream is to the All blue so it's not important to him (not like Zoro who wanna be the top) but please ... Nami and Usopp -_-;

BlackHair
September 30, 2009, 05:53 AM
Boa is soo awesome , so i guess its been confirmed that haki was introduced as one way for someone like Luffy to deal with The Nearly - Unstoppable Logia users :)
hm.. I though it was proofed already with the Rayleigh vs Kizaru clash and with the Luffy vs Boa Sisters fight. So basically after the boa sisters fight..



you all (most) are talking about Haki as if it was sharingan, Oda isn't like Kishi who lately give sharingan to everyone, if it was that easy then the DF users would be like rubbish or nothing special. Although I agree that Zorro should get Haki, Sanji ... well, his dream is to the All blue so it's not important to him (not like Zoro who wanna be the top) but please ... Nami and Usopp -_-;
I was talking about the monster trio, sry but I give a damn about the rest. From the beginning their fight were uninteresting for me. Sanji's goal may not be directly related to fighting, but he has to protect his crew. While Luffy's goal is the top, he has to fight the strong ones in order to protect the weaker ones in his crew. (Enis Lobby, as he rescued Ussop's ass). The same ambition had Luffy as he learned G2+3. I don't see a reason for Sanji not to learn/master haki.

Also don't compare haki with the Sharingan. Sharingan was said to be used only by "one clan", while haki can have everyone. It is will=ambition. It's only about mastering it (IMO).

This will be my last post on haki in this thread.

Host Samurai
September 30, 2009, 05:59 AM
I still think Doflamingo doesn't mean Kuma is literally dead, since he's a cyborg the WG (Vegapunk) may had subjected him to an update, after the incident of the Shabondy Archipelago...

sorry for bad english :sweat

Or maybe Doflamingo indicates that Kuma is now a complete Pacifista without self-conscious.

Jinbei one shotting Moria is kinda unexpected. I didn't expect that the gap between each Schichibukai could be that big.:(

Shiro-kun
September 30, 2009, 06:00 AM
hm.. I though it was proofed already with the Rayleigh vs Kizaru clash and with the Luffy vs Boa Sisters fight. So basically after the boa sisters fight..

Yeah it was proof that the Kizaru vs Rayliegh clash was (and the Boa fight confirmed Luffy has a strong Haki) , but i meant Hancock using haki just to hit Smoker as an total confirmation that haki would be used to deal with Logia users.

Yans86
September 30, 2009, 06:02 AM
Maaan people you wrote this kind of crap in every single Discussion in every single post......What kind of epicness will it bring ?
Sometimes I understand the epicness of many people for this war is very fast - like luffy runs punches everybody , use Haki everybody falls down....the left are 10 - 20 admirals (Including VA , RA etc...) some few Pirates....Luffy kick them all , comes other SH crew....finishes everybody...there ya go...Happy End....FURY of epicnes...

(Bull sh`t)

The epicness is when you start with nothing but end with something !
About Kuma....smb said how the Calm person like Kuma could be the Tyrant. If you will take most of Murderes and Killers - The best , The most dangerous and most fearless of all are Calm.

Aaannd...about the Hancock...she's got the KD haki like Luffy ?
Didn't she had on the pic hell of an emotion ? why i'm trying to say like Luffy with wolves in ID .

Because that's how ODA do things....if u have a more magniloquent word to define it,tell me :-P
And well,what u r describing is totally unreal!!!!
Luffy us haki everybody falls down(LOL lOL lOL).....why couldn't WB do the same or Boa do the same???LOL
Should I keep on....

And seriously,how can't u realize that a BURST of Haki is different from the kingHaoushoku?!and that persons with StrongWill can resist that!!!!look at those 2 SN crews....no one fainted and I bet my ass that the people in this war are all at least on that level......

And well,start with nothing and end with something.......Luffy achieving the control of Haki and beat down a REAL BIG DOG in front of the world....what would u call that???????overall after the happenings of last chap. where ("FROM NOTHING --->> SOMETHING" as u say....everyone knew that he is DRAGON's son!!!)EPIC...

So please,say something more constructive if u want to move critics...

sarutobi_sensei
September 30, 2009, 06:08 AM
XD OMG those prisoners are nuts xD

Look how much he respects captain buggy xD

Epic, simply epic
[hr]
Hancock's face is scary, I wouldn't mess with her <.<

Black Lagoon
September 30, 2009, 06:09 AM
Or maybe Doflamingo indicates that Kuma is now a complete Pacifista without self-conscious.

Jinbei one shotting Moria is kinda unexpected. I didn't expect that the gap between each Schichibukai could be that big.:(

yes, that's what I think.
I guess the first update or transformation wasn't complete, same as Wolverine, but now it may be complete...

BlackHair
September 30, 2009, 06:15 AM
Jinbei one shotting Moria is kinda unexpected. I didn't expect that the gap between each Schichibukai could be that big.:(Well ts a bad match. Jimbei salt water is the exact weakness of Moria. So Jinbei has the advantages. However I must say, Moria is pathetic as ever.


I consider something Epic, if I got those bumbs. U know if ur body is filled with energy, so that u could scream or u r exited to that extent that u have re-read the chapter a few times etc There are many ways to describe epicness. Anyway, if I got that feeling, the chapter was epic. :)

mugiwara84
September 30, 2009, 07:08 AM
Moria just turned into a joke. Though I guess a lot of people were expecting him to go down rather quickly. Every time he's cornered he just grabs to Shadow Asgard and gets owned.

And imo Jinbei doesn't has that much of an advantage, yes he can take zombies out quickly when beeing close to seawater but it's not like the seawater actually hurts Moria even more. I really don't see why he doesn't use doppelman and attacks like brick bat and that spear he used against Oars jr. Not that I mind cause I wanted the fool to see go down asap.

And Buggy is as delusional as ever. I can become king! Yeah I'm sure you could beat WB with those weaklings you gathered in lvl 1 & 2 cause normally those lvl 3-5 shouldn't be following him since it was Iva and his candies who saved them. So Buggy should have only have the weaklings following him.

And I hope we'll see next chapter what Croc will decides to do. If WB had to convince one guy to aid him temporarily it's that guy and not the idiot red nose with his stupid followers who I nominate to the biggest fools of the year or decennia or even ever.

And Hancock reveals her cover like a lot of people expected. I'm sure the fellow Hancock fans are thrilled like I am.

Razh
September 30, 2009, 07:16 AM
Whitebeard showed that he can really use his head this time. It shouldn't come as a surprise though. He is a proud man, but not proud enough to cause himself additional trouble while he's leading the battle against an entire Marine force.
It's a lot easier to rely on a little sweat talk and gain new allies instead constantly having to worry about possible back attacks.

JC123
September 30, 2009, 07:17 AM
Aren't you all being harsh on Moria? Within ~a month he's had two large fights. I mean seriously, how is he supposed to take on an ocean goer that he had no way of knowing Jinbei would be powerful against him and already knew his weakness?

Razh
September 30, 2009, 07:21 AM
Moria has no place in close range battles against any serious opponents. He's a lazy bum, by his own admission. That's what happens when you neglect your training and constantly rely on others.
And come on, is Moria supposed to beat Jinbei, a strongest among fishmen, who are supposed to be 10 times stronger than humans? God knows how many times Jinbei is stronger than Moria.

Black Lagoon
September 30, 2009, 07:24 AM
Moria confirmed his idiocy and inability to learn from mistakes

BlackHair
September 30, 2009, 07:25 AM
Aren't you all being harsh on Moria? Nope.. this is a battlefield. Sympathy and such feelings are out of place xD

Not like I consider him weak, but he is pathetic. Always going for the Asgard..he learned nothing. He is not a fighter. Seriously that guy shouldn't even belong to OP. Go to Bleach or better Naruto :p

Black Lagoon
September 30, 2009, 07:30 AM
Nope.. this is a battlefield. Sympathy and such feelings are out of place xD

Not like I consider him weak, but he is pathetic. Always going for the Asgard..he learned nothing. He is not a fighter. Seriously that guy shouldn't even belong to OP. Go to Bleach or better Naruto :p

hell yeaaah!! XD

I wanna see Smoker's face after losing to Hancock, I guess from the day he ate the fruit he forgot physical training :p
just saying xd

goldb
September 30, 2009, 07:35 AM
I fear for Smoker, I don't envy the unlucky person who gets to Hancock's bad side, hell have no fury like a woman in love!!

Moria is indeed pathetic. How does he expect to beat anyone whilst in asgard mode? cos even giants have better movements than him with their size.

Sidenote: I noticed this a few chapters back but forgot to mention it, the crossed marine symbol on buggy's hat, it's very the same as General Gaspade's pirate emblem

Host Samurai
September 30, 2009, 07:37 AM
yes, that's what I think.
I guess the first update or transformation wasn't complete, same as Wolverine, but now it may be complete...

IIRC that's probably what he meant to Luffy, that they won't see each other again....


Well ts a bad match. Jimbei salt water is the exact weakness of Moria. So Jinbei has the advantages. However I must say, Moria is pathetic as ever.

I thought that the salt water was the exact weakness of Moria's zombies?:s But nevermind that guy could have a lot of potential, if he would use his other techniques like the doppelman or the brick bat. But he didn't...:darn

BlackHair
September 30, 2009, 07:41 AM
I thought that the salt water was the exact weakness of Moria's zombies?:s But nevermind that guy could have a lot of potential, if he would use his other techniques like the doppelman or the brick bat. But he didn't...:darnI didn't read the spoiler carefully, nor did I paid close attention to the pics. But salt water is also the weakness of DF user. Since salt water was mentioned in the last chapter I assumed he used it again. Sry if I was wrong.

TwEeD
September 30, 2009, 07:41 AM
And Hancock reveals her cover like a lot of people expected. I'm sure the fellow Hancock fans are thrilled like I am.

I'm more intrigued about how Oda will play this one out than I am thrilled. Her not only revealing herself as an ally of Luffy but actually as being in love with him can have some serious implications. Now they'll know for sure she is the one that helped Luffy break in in Impel Down and that she will always protect him no matter what. If her Shichibukai title is revoked due to her treason both her as her people are in serious danger, they won't let it slide to have such a threat as having Luffy and her team up meaning they'll go after her.

The things imo that can save them (Hancock & Amazon Lily) from this fate is:

- The WG are so weakened after the war they can't do squat
- The amount of shichibukai to be replaced too big to revoke her title
- She (or her mero mero abilities) is so powerfull that the WG can't/won't lift a finger
- The WG doesn't dare to go after her being afraid what the repercussions could be from Luffy and his allies
- The Strawhats actually go to Amazone Lily to help fend off the WG (While least plausible it might then mean that Margaret joins the crew)

I'm really curious how this will turn out

tharkun
September 30, 2009, 07:43 AM
The battle is getting exciting. Its good to see that Whitebeard is countering the Sengoku at the moment. From the time when Hancock protected Luffy, she virtually forfeited the title of Shichibukai. It doesn't really matter but it would really get on Sengoku's (and Magellan's) nerves plus Momonga get growled at later.

I don't think there were any modification to Kuma from the time he was at Shanbody till now. Its better for Iva to believe what Doflamingo said so Kuma can remain ever convincingly undercover. Even though if Kuma is no longer a 'tyrant', his actions so far favourable to Luffy.

Unless all 7 Shichibukai are united, they would never really turn the tide of battle in the favour of the marines. From the current stock, Jinbei, Blackbeard and Hancock is acting against the marines. Kuma is acting strangely and quiet. Mihawk didn't really do anything so far ... whether his relationship with Shanks affected his participation. Only Doflamingo and Moria really be "trusted" by the marines.

Luffy is getting ever closer to the execution platform. I really hope a Luffy vs Akainu would really come true in the upcoming chapters!

Host Samurai
September 30, 2009, 07:50 AM
I didn't read the spoiler carefully, nor did I paid close attention to the pics. But salt water is also the weakness of DF user. Since salt water was mentioned in the last chapter I assumed he used it again. Sry if I was wrong.

In the last chapter it was mentioned that salt water was the only thing that could purify Moria's zombies. And if you look at the spoiler pics closely than you'll clearly see that Jimbei punched Moria with his bare fist.

Damn, Jimbei was too strong for Moria to handle :p.

TwEeD
September 30, 2009, 07:56 AM
Only Doflamingo and Moria really be "trusted" by the marines.

I don't think Donflamingo will be trusted at all from what his dialogues have been up until now. He comes over as a shady/sleazy character with very opportunistic views, I think before the end of the war he will show his true colors. Which would leave Kuma (if he's reprogrammed) and Moria as the only remnants of the Shichibukai

minimz
September 30, 2009, 07:56 AM
hmm maybe hancock will bring out luffy's haki when someone strong (like another shichibukai hurts her) and luffy becomes pissed because she's awesome to him now, and yeah. That would be better than him teacher her IMO, that's a way to shock everyone, warning WG that he's a big threat and boosting his bounty to an even more shocking amount =D

How do we know moria lost though? was it said? cus i remember luffy looking like he got pwned by blackbeard, but he still stood back up and was able to continue fighting... maybe it was just a very hurtful punch, but didn't KO him

Natsu Dragonil
September 30, 2009, 08:03 AM
I dont think that Haki is enough to defeat a logia.I mean look at Raleigh he used Haki but didnt own Kizaru one bit.

So even when Hancock is able to touch smoker she wont be able to defeat him cause she knows how to use haki.As soon as Smoker would touch her with his weapon with the seastone she would loose her strengh.

Is moria kinda dumb i mean is common knowledge that a fishman has 10 times the strengh of a human and he is facing the strongest fishman.What did he think that he can overpower jinbei in raw strengh.

Black Lagoon
September 30, 2009, 08:05 AM
I dont think that Haki is enough to defeat a logia.I mean look at Raleigh he used Haki but didnt own Kizaru one bit.

Maybe, although we don't know how strong physically are the Logia's users? they concentrate everything in developing their abilities.

TwEeD
September 30, 2009, 08:09 AM
I dont think that Haki is enough to defeat a logia.I mean look at Raleigh he used Haki but didnt own Kizaru one bit.

They fought on even ground and while Rayleigh is very powerfull he is old and it isn't certain at all he also has the King's Disposition like Hancock (and Luffy)


So even when Hancock is able to touch smoker she wont be able to defeat him cause she knows how to use haki.As soon as Smoker would touch her with his weapon with the seastone she would loose her strengh.

Luffy is going to be pissed as hell if Smoker dares to hurt Hancock hehe
The (future) Pirate King and The Pirate Empress tag team would be way too much for Smoker :D


Maybe, although we don't know how strong physically are the Logia's users? they concentrate everything in developing their abilities.

True, but Smoker seems to have a very strong physique though

ANBU4U
September 30, 2009, 08:11 AM
Maybe, although we don't know how strong physically are the Logia's users? they concentrate everything in developing their abilities.

Ace wasn't that way, why would smoker be?

Natsu Dragonil
September 30, 2009, 08:18 AM
Do u think that the strongest fighting force of the marines and maybe of the WG are physically weak.I mean Haki only hinder the logias to be untouchable but not to use their power.
Raleigh used haki but Kizaru could still use his powers.

2 of the admirals showed that they can fight hand to hand and with sword so there is no doubt that they know how to counter haki.

Also Luffy should be pissed enough that his brother is going to get killed rather than gettin pissed for Hankock getting hrt.

ANBU4U
September 30, 2009, 08:18 AM
I dont think that Haki is enough to defeat a logia.I mean look at Raleigh he used Haki but didnt own Kizaru one bit.

So even when Hancock is able to touch smoker she wont be able to defeat him cause she knows how to use haki.As soon as Smoker would touch her with his weapon with the seastone she would loose her strengh.

Is moria kinda dumb i mean is common knowledge that a fishman has 10 times the strengh of a human and he is facing the strongest fishman.What did he think that he can overpower jinbei in raw strengh.

Once you can touch them, logia fights turn into normal DF fights. Someone that can blow smoke versus someone that can turn People into stone for instance.

The difference being all of Hancocks punches and Kicks should be reinforced with Haki. And Haki reinforced things do more damage than is normal, as you can see. (http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/516/06/)

I'd say with Boa's Mero Mero abilities and Haki she has the edge. Smoker does have the seastone though....

Black Lagoon
September 30, 2009, 08:27 AM
Ace wasn't that way, why would smoker be?

Cigar perhaps? man, he might have cancer :p
I know, it was just a possibility.

Wait a second ... WHERE THE HELL IS MARCO?? DIDN'T WB TOLD HIM TO KEEP AN EYE ON LUFFY?? :XD

Host Samurai
September 30, 2009, 08:30 AM
Just a second ... WHERE THE HELL IS MARCO?? DIDN'T WB TOLD HIM TO KEEP AN EYE ON LUFFY?? :XD

Marco doesn't think of Smoker as an threat for Luffy :p...

And where the hell is Aokiji? That guy disappeared for some time.:tem

goldb
September 30, 2009, 08:35 AM
Marco doesn't think of Smoker as an threat for Luffy :p...

And where the hell is Aokiji? That guy disappeared for some time.:tem

yeah we ain't seen him for a few chapters now. I think now the scene has been set for the war, the fallen pirates and marines have set stage for the upcoming one on ones and tag battles to come.

chitgoks
September 30, 2009, 08:44 AM
Cigar perhaps? man, he might have cancer :p
I know, it was just a possibility.

Wait a second ... WHERE THE HELL IS MARCO?? DIDN'T WB TOLD HIM TO KEEP AN EYE ON LUFFY?? :XD

good observation. though hancock's probably nearer to luffy than marco is. or her rage increased her super speed ;)

TwEeD
September 30, 2009, 08:49 AM
Also Luffy should be pissed enough that his brother is going to get killed rather than gettin pissed for Hankock getting hrt.

The moment they attack(/initiate the execution of) Ace would be the trigger yes, but we aren't at that point yet and no way Luffy is going to leave it as it is if Hancock get's her ass kicked (and doesn't say something as "i'm fine don't look after me get your brother first")
[hr]

or her rage increased her super speed ;)

Well love IS a hurricane and we know Hurricane's have winds of big speed :D

BlackHair
September 30, 2009, 09:54 AM
Also wondering about the Admirals, Marco and Jozu. Whom are they fighting? apparently not each other.

dogfood911
September 30, 2009, 10:06 AM
You guys do realize that Ace has to die for the plot to continue and develop, right?:oh

Most definitely: ACE WILL DIE!!!

goldb
September 30, 2009, 10:09 AM
Yeah it seems, they don't seem too focused on their fights, Marco left his fight with Kizaru mid-way. I think right now it's just survival of the fittest, so the big shots aren't fighting serious imo.

I don't pity whoever comes up against Akainu though, he seems like a tough cookie but I ain't underestimating the other two. Imo the Vice-Admirals will fight the NW World Captains and Joz, Marco and other WB captains will fight the Admirals and top VAs. Will Sengoku personally go after WB? I doubt it...

Rotten The Wizard
September 30, 2009, 10:11 AM
Aokiji and Akainu are smart, Theyre conserving their energy for whitebeard cause God knows theyre gonna need every bit of it

Alot people have misconceptions about haki. It has more than ONE use: you can also predict your opponents movements and it raises your attack power tenfold, if not more.
A haki imbued Jet pistol to the face should knock ANY logia out, Admiral or not, except for teach who is a resilient bastard. People talk as if weve gotten a full explanation of haki already, CHILL!!!!!


anyway, Epic chapter is Epic. That buggy and WB scene made me lol, literally
it would seem smoker got really strong, I have a wild theory that He will be promoted to VA after this war. I highly doubt he can stand up to Hancock though

Im very intrigued with WhiteBeards new strategy, WB is a genius in his own right. Sengoku might have the nickname but whitebeard isnt too shabby himself

ps. HANCOCK is the next SH <3 its practically confirmed. The only question was whether or not she would turn her back on the Shichi and clearly she doesnt give a damn about that or Amazon lily sooooo.... LOL
Sanjii will be a statue for most of his days

BlackHair
September 30, 2009, 10:12 AM
You guys do realize that Ace has to die for the plot to continue and develop, right?:oh

Most definitely: ACE WILL DIE!!!
Why? WB has to die (taken out etc) plot wise, but Ace? No imo not.

Black Lagoon
September 30, 2009, 10:13 AM
You guys do realize that Ace has to die for the plot to continue and develop, right?:oh

Most definitely: ACE WILL DIE!!!

no need to die to make that happen, things are going by itself...

dogfood911
September 30, 2009, 10:22 AM
Why? WB has to die (taken out etc) plot wise, but Ace? No imo not.

WB isn't going to die or be taken out in this war. He will survive. He'll probably end up dying of natural causes right after this war.

I think Ace has to die because he is Roger's son. I know this sounds a bit strange, but hear me out. Ace is the most logical choice to be the next pirate king: he is the former king's son, he has a seemingly unbeatable DF ability, and the strongest pirate in One Piece (Whitebeard) wants him to be king.

So, in order for Luffy to be king someday, he has to beat Ace in battle. I don't think Oda has it in his heart to pit Luffy against Ace, to put it simply, Ace needs to disappear from the story. His character has served its purpose. I also think the death of Ace will trigger Luffy's mastery of haki.

Rotten The Wizard
September 30, 2009, 10:30 AM
WB isn't going to die or be taken out in this war. He will survive. He'll probably end up dying of natural causes right after this war.

I think Ace has to die because he is Roger's son. I know this sounds a bit strange, but hear me out. Ace is the most logical choice to be the next pirate king: he is the former king's son, he has a seemingly unbeatable DF ability, and the strongest pirate in One Piece (Whitebeard) wants him to be king.

So, in order for Luffy to be king someday, he has to beat Ace in battle. I don't think Oda has it in his heart to pit Luffy against Ace, to put it simply, Ace needs to disappear from the story.
Youre blinding by the fantasy you want OP to become.

Your theory contradicts everything thats happened in this war, everything this war is ABOUT. Whitebeards death has been foreshadowed a billion times over. This isnt bleach where certain characters get randomly slaughtered....

Even when the war started, all the flashbacks of Ace, all the panels showing all his allies and all those NW pirates who respect him and every one of his Nakama looks up to him. Ace is Setup To become a Yonkou ATLEAST. We all know Luffy will become pk. Ace never stated such ambitions. Chances are he'll make his own path when this is all over. Perhaps, he wants to Take the Moby dick to Raftel in WB's name and sake, who knows but theres no way ace is dying. Just face it

obamamania
September 30, 2009, 10:31 AM
Unbeatable fruit huh? Of course, nothing makes a devil fruit more unbeatable then ...getting absolutely beaten by a stronger fruit...

There are plenty of seemingly unbeatable logias, ace just has a good one.

goldb
September 30, 2009, 10:31 AM
Ace doesn't wanna be Pirate King. So him fighting Luffy is out of the question, Luffy would NEVER fight Ace with the intent of beating him up. He'll fight WB for the title cos he knows from Ace that WB wants to be king.

Neither Ace or WB has to die for the plot to move forward, though I'm not ruling out the possibility cos WB is likely to fall. The world is going to change after the war, but with WB or Ace dying, it will change in favor of the WG, but that hasn't been explicitly said has it? The marines could suffer so many casualties that they wouldn't be a force to be reckon with anymore...

ameya730
September 30, 2009, 10:33 AM
WB isn't going to die or be taken out in this war. He will survive. He'll probably end up dying of natural causes right after this war.

I think Ace has to die because he is Roger's son. I know this sounds a bit strange, but hear me out. Ace is the most logical choice to be the next pirate king: he is the former king's son, he has a seemingly unbeatable DF ability, and the strongest pirate in One Piece (Whitebeard) wants him to be king.

So, in order for Luffy to be king someday, he has to beat Ace in battle. I don't think Oda has it in his heart to pit Luffy against Ace, to put it simply, Ace needs to disappear from the story. His character has served its purpose. I also think the death of Ace will trigger Luffy's mastery of haki.

i disagree ace dying would not help the story at all if ace dies then in all probability luffy would give up being a pirate cause he could not save his brother

also ace dying makes no sense what would his death accomplish and no oda does not have the heart to pit ace and luffy is not a logical reason its just a sentimental opinion and that too not oda's

also luffy's definition of a pirate king (dont remember which chapter) is that the guy with the most freedom on the seas is the pirate king so ace being alive will make no difference to him in his quest to become pirate king

BlackHair
September 30, 2009, 10:36 AM
I think Ace has to die because he is Roger's son. I know this sounds a bit strange, but hear me out. Ace is the most logical choice to be the next pirate king: he is the former king's son, he has a seemingly unbeatable DF ability, and the strongest pirate in One Piece (Whitebeard) wants him to be king.

So, in order for Luffy to be king someday, he has to beat Ace in battle. I don't think Oda has it in his heart to pit Luffy against Ace, to put it simply, Ace needs to disappear from the story. His character has served its purpose.I see ur point. But Luffy's goal is it to rescue Ace. Hence Ace will be saved, no matter what. The goal of the protagonist will happen.

My reason why WB has to die or to be taken out:
WB is the current king. I know he is not called PK, but that doesn't matter. As the most powerful pirate he has to disappear to make room for the new generation -> Luffy.
Since the beginning of WB's introduction he was hyped as the strongest, as the most powerful, as the one only equal to Roger.. etc All this hype indicates his fall.
WB is the current definition of the great age of piracy. With him at the top the era can't change. But a change of the era is indicated for a long time now. So WB has to be removed from his throne. With WB gone there will be new era. Until Luffy get's the throne.