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ANBU4U
October 06, 2009, 08:13 PM
Here's a question that has popped up on and off of these forums...could any of the strawhats, aside from Luffy himself, survive this war?

And I don't mean survive in a "be their and live to see another day" sort of way (Coby is managing that...but clearly he isn't up to scruff), but rather in a more practical sense:

Could the other strawhats jump into the melee and (given an average draw, i.e.- none are so unfortunate as to have Kizaru hunt them down, or any other "commander/general" types.) survive until its conclusion?

My answer is yes and no...I'll answer one by one.


**NOTE**
My rational assumes that all of the strawhats are in a semi-circle separated equidistantly from the execution platform (and each other) on the bay-side of Marineford.

I. Capable of changing the tide of battle:

The addition of these crewmen would force Sengoku to redistribute his forces (likely two Vice Admirals) to address their advancement. If left unchecked they would cut a swath to the execution platform while all of the big wigs were distracted elsewhere.


Zorro- Absolutely, he is himself a "commander/General" type. While he may be incapable of beating the truly big wigs (just as Luffy is) he IS capable of slaughtering any of the Elite Marines found here as well as at least entertaining a fight with the likes of Moria, or the Vice Admirals. Its worth noting that Zorro is almost certainly stronger (much stronger even) than Luffy was when he beat Crocodile. So while Zorro may not be favored to take any Shichi one on one, he is likely well enough within their league to entertain the thought of victory in a protracted battle (as was the case with Luffy vrs. Crocodile), given of course a feasible matchup (no logia)

Sanji- Pretty much the same as Zorro, though perhaps measurably less due largely to his inability to hit women, which would almost certainly be an issue eventually.

II. Capable of drawing attention:

The addition of these crewman would not have an immediate impact on the battle, but would require all marines in their immediate vicinity to address them as a top priority, Their presence may ultimately help the pirates in their region push forward towards the execution platform, and in general, reduce pirate casualties.


Franky- Quite simply, until he runs out of Cola, Franky is a nightmare in mass combat...its like dropping a tank into the middle of infantry combat. Just not fair. Cannon balls, Coup de Burst, Bean Shooter, Weapons left, Strong right, Napalm.....until someone lucks upon his weakness Franky is golden.

Brook- He was the Captain of "His Kingdoms Surprise Assault Squad" so I imagine he has experience in this sort of combat, plus his style is suited to quickly moving between multiple opponents in a confined area.

III: Capable of holding the line:

These crew members can survive and keep the Marines from advancing towards Whitebeard, but the probably wont be able to be the primary focus of a push towards Ace. They should be capable of following the strongest of their region forward at a slow pace.


Robin- Robin is actually quite strong....so long as they aren't plot protected she can essentially one hit most marines regardless of level (within reason) like she did Tashigi. But what really puts her here is that she can do it in mass. Robin showed in Ennis Lobby that shes capable of taking out dozens of marines at once. I considered bumping her up....but upon second thought I'm not sure how long Robin could take the brunt of the marines in her areas attack...perhaps for a bit, but I think shes best served in the long run by holding back and letting the combatants come to her.

VI. Capable of surviving

These crew members may survive the battle, but they won't have any real effect on its outcome, they will be pushed around by the tide of battle.



Chopper- Chopper could survive this, as long as he conserves his rumble balls for dangerous opponents and remembers not to go postal. If Chopper went Moster Point one of two things would happen:

He'd rampage killing friend and for until he died
He'd catch the attention of a big wig, and they'd kill him (on either side)

Still if he fights within himself he could hold his own, but he wouldn't be leading any charges, or progressing forward, or thinking about other things (where is everybody). He be surviving, single mindedly.

V. Would be killed

Let me makes this clear. I DON'T THINK THESE CREW MEMBERS ARE WEAK. I don't even think these crew members are necessarily weaker than those in the two tiers above them. But I DO think that their fighting styles are inconducive to surviving a mass brawl of this level for an extended period of time (the fighters here can be more powerful than the Ennis Lobby Captains, they are more numerous, and the fight will last longer). Without help. they'll eventually fall.


Nami- The Navigator is actually good...really good. And I think that by the end of One Piece she'll be a top 5 strawhat fighter (and that's with my belief that Hancock will join), but shes not ready for this sort of fight. Her Perfect Clima-Tact deals good damage and over a large area....but she needs time to set it up, which she won't have here. Usually Nami lets the rest of the crew distract the crowd or opponent to she can set up her attacks...or shes in an one on one battle where she can also play for time...here she can't do that (remember we're assuming shes in the thick of things). She may last for awhile, but someone will catch her off-guard sooner rather than later, and then things will spiral from there. Nami needs to improve her melee abilities with the Clima-tact (its still a bo staff) before shes ready for this.

Ussop- Same deal really. Ussop will always be the weakest Strawhat, but he's still formidable in his own way; either one on one, at a distance, or with the ability to set up his attacks beforehand as he did against Luffy....but here, surrounded on all sides by enemies he can't last. He has a better shot than Nami though because of his use of Dials when at close range (impact). Still, Ussop needs running room for when he gets pinned in (like with Perona). Here he has none.



Well thats it, post your own opinions and lets discuss.

modoki
October 06, 2009, 11:39 PM
Well judging from a war like this one where the battleground is pretty chaotic from all 4 directions.

Need to consider that there are a lot of big shot marines aside from the admirals fighting. While yes the SH crew members will get pretty far in this war, a marine official ( captain, vice-admiral, admiral, etc.) whom dealt with the specific member from long ago will just approach and retaliate.

This is also quite difficult to explain since each crew member would be on their own, since what was explained above might well enough happen. Since at this point, each member are in training/learning processes.

One thing i would like to mention on Chopper's part, since he has the ability to grow super large with the rumble ball and loose control, he might just end up like Oars honestly.

My 5 cents in this situation is that, most of them probably won't survive this war. I hate to say this but zoro is one of them. At this very point, i still honestly believe he is still not ready to face Mihawk.

Poneglyph420
October 06, 2009, 11:59 PM
Zoro and Sanji could make it if they didn't rush forward too brazenly.
But they might hold their own and would be good up til the VA I think..

Otherwise the other SH would prob. be beaten eventually and in random sequence. As a pirate crew they are awesome and well suited, but not in war...

If the SH all Arrived together right now, they'd save Ace...
But only a few SH would be left to run away...
IMHO..

bittman
October 09, 2009, 02:00 AM
They'd all survive since they're the protagonists =P

In all seriousness, none of them really would die. It's not like Nami goes "Oh it's an enormous war, I'll go attack Kuma directly". She's a smart girl, Oda had her rated as one of the smartest people in the manga early on, and I doubt she has fallen that far in the rankings (though would probably be second to Robin the crew). That and her thunder attacks are also quite capable of taking out many fodder marines, she could hold a backline fairly well.

Ussop...well kind of what I said above would apply also, he's not going to jump to the frontlines. If he arrives with Thousand Sunny, he'll shoot cannons and GAOU CANON's from Thousand Sunny and try keep the ship safe.

I see what you were saying with your rational, but honestly speaking half of the Strawhat's aren't even suited for melee. I assume that, in the mess of everything, they would be just fine.

As it stands, if you aren't knocking out your opponent in a few shots in this war, then someone will be assisting you in a moments time. No-one has yet been surrounded, and I'm yet to see a 1-1 situation that's lasted more than 2 blows yet.

Roarchu
October 09, 2009, 02:23 PM
Yeah Zoro and Sanji for sure, and Franky's made of metal he's not that easy to kill

But the other Strawhat can definetely take melee, in Enies Lobby even after beating the CP9 they took on 200 HQ commanders and captains

http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/426/10-11/
http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/426/14/

I know this war has the top of the top kind of opponents, even some "fodder" guys who can hit Luffy on Gear 2nd, average fodder shouldn't be able to.

http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/558/08-09/

so yeah, I think this battle would be too long

Brooke could just lie down and pretend he's dead lol Ussop could do it too

Erimia
October 10, 2009, 03:13 PM
haha that's why they are NOT in this battle. Most of them would have serious injuries or even die. If not they would be just in the way of the bigger fish. Of all of them, Usopp should be the one likeliest to survive because he knows how and when to run.

ANBU4U
October 11, 2009, 10:51 AM
They'd all survive since they're the protagonists =P

In all seriousness, none of them really would die. It's not like Nami goes "Oh it's an enormous war, I'll go attack Kuma directly". She's a smart girl, Oda had her rated as one of the smartest people in the manga early on, and I doubt she has fallen that far in the rankings (though would probably be second to Robin the crew). That and her thunder attacks are also quite capable of taking out many fodder marines, she could hold a backline fairly well.

Ussop...well kind of what I said above would apply also, he's not going to jump to the frontlines. If he arrives with Thousand Sunny, he'll shoot cannons and GAOU CANON's from Thousand Sunny and try keep the ship safe.

I see what you were saying with your rational, but honestly speaking half of the Strawhat's aren't even suited for melee. I assume that, in the mess of everything, they would be just fine.

As it stands, if you aren't knocking out your opponent in a few shots in this war, then someone will be assisting you in a moments time. No-one has yet been surrounded, and I'm yet to see a 1-1 situation that's lasted more than 2 blows yet.

Well if you're not going to pay attention to the set parameters thers no real point in this poll. Obviously if each strawhat stuck to their niche they would have a fair chance to survive, but this poll assumes initial frontline action for ALL crewmember, with the intent to push forward and the inability to fall back.

Also, you shouldn't confuse the "fodder" here with the "fodder" at Ennis Lobby, in Ennis Lobby Luffy more or less walked through 500 marines, and Nami was able to One Hit dozens with he lightning. Not the case here.

Here the fodder marines are able to at least strike Luffy in Gear Second..which is impressive. Nami on the other hand, discovered that her lighting was unable to One Hit the Buster Call Captain on the bridge of Hesitation. I think these guys are better than that on average, in unfortunate cases they are much better, and their are more of them. Furthermore the fight should last longer.

If Nami, Ussop, and Chopper held back they'd be tested but would survive. But seeing as how this assumes they can't I dont know how you can think they'd make it..............or course this is assuming plot protection disappears.

Lord Rayleigh
October 11, 2009, 03:26 PM
Zoro is really a strong guy but I think he would go fighting everyone, running towards the platform, willing to fight strong opponents, and thus he would end up beat by someone (because of exhaustion or because there are a lot of stronger fighters in MHQ). Knowing that Mihawks is there, Mihawks would also be looking for him and Zoro has not chance to beat him.

Sanji would have a great chance for me. Knowing his personnality and what he did in Alabasta and in Enies Lobby on his own (" Mr Prince " saving the other SHs who were in the seastone cage, the " Hunter " releasing some " kind of taraï current " that enables the Merry-Go to escape from the marine boats), I guess Sanji would find a strategy to do something secretly that helps all the people willing to save Ace. He is not the kind of SH who runs towards the platform to free Ace carelessly. As he is strong and would not do crazy things, he is the one who would have the best chance to survive.

About the others, I do not really know. If they had to truly fight, they would end up dead.
But as we know, Nami, Chopper and Usopp are not the kind of SHs who look for adventure and dangers. So, if they stay behind in the melee - as they would be likely - they could survive.

As I think all the SHs would try to save Ace and not just to survive in the melee, I only vote for Sanji. Indeed, as I said, he is the only one that would know what to do and what to not do into melee : he is well aware of what he could do and could be useful to save Ace.

neomaster121
October 12, 2009, 02:18 PM
Zoro is really a strong guy but I think he would go fighting everyone, running towards the platform, willing to fight strong opponents, and thus he would end up beat by someone (because of exhaustion or because there are a lot of stronger fighters in MHQ). Knowing that Mihawks is there, Mihawks would also be looking for him and Zoro has not chance to beat him.

Sanji would have a great chance for me. Knowing his personnality and what he did in Alabasta and in Enies Lobby on his own (" Mr Prince " saving the other SHs who were in the seastone cage, the " Hunter " releasing some " kind of taraï current " that enables the Merry-Go to escape from the marine boats), I guess Sanji would find a strategy to do something secretly that helps all the people willing to save Ace. He is not the kind of SH who runs towards the platform to free Ace carelessly. As he is strong and would not do crazy things, he is the one who would have the best chance to survive.

About the others, I do not really know. If they had to truly fight, they would end up dead.
But as we know, Nami, Chopper and Usopp are not the kind of SHs who look for adventure and dangers. So, if they stay behind in the melee - as they would be likely - they could survive.

As I think all the SHs would try to save Ace and not just to survive in the melee, I only vote for Sanji. Indeed, as I said, he is the only one that would know what to do and what to not do into melee : he is well aware of what he could do and could be useful to save Ace.

lol if you wanna give that reason for Zoro i'll give you a reason why Zoro would die

look how many women on the battlefield and look what happened to sanji when first cp9 fights rounds

1 women marine comes and sanji's dead

beastboy
October 14, 2009, 06:14 PM
^^^
You mean Sanji right??

I think everyone would survive..
Nami is actually pretty good, if paired with robin and zoro no one would bit them (in a trio.. like iva-jinbei-luffy)
Usopp-sanji-chopper-brooke

That would be wicked!! Sanji chopper and brooke would protect usopp who shoots everybody who isn't fast enough!!

franky-luffy
The invulnerables.. Luffy would have to stick to Frankys back!! that way they wer invencible.. good range good atack power...

Don't forget that they're not alone and WB forces would help them!!

ANBU4U
October 14, 2009, 08:06 PM
^^^
You mean Sanji right??

I think everyone would survive..
Nami is actually pretty good, if paired with robin and zoro no one would bit them (in a trio.. like iva-jinbei-luffy)
Usopp-sanji-chopper-brooke

That would be wicked!! Sanji chopper and brooke would protect usopp who shoots everybody who isn't fast enough!!

franky-luffy
The invulnerables.. Luffy would have to stick to Frankys back!! that way they wer invencible.. good range good atack power...

Don't forget that they're not alone and WB forces would help them!!

Read the OP.

LordZet
December 21, 2009, 03:41 AM
Zoro is really a strong guy but I think he would go fighting everyone, running towards the platform, willing to fight strong opponents, and thus he would end up beat by someone (because of exhaustion or because there are a lot of stronger fighters in MHQ). Knowing that Mihawks is there, Mihawks would also be looking for him and Zoro has not chance to beat him.

Sanji would have a great chance for me. Knowing his personnality and what he did in Alabasta and in Enies Lobby on his own (" Mr Prince " saving the other SHs who were in the seastone cage, the " Hunter " releasing some " kind of taraï current " that enables the Merry-Go to escape from the marine boats), I guess Sanji would find a strategy to do something secretly that helps all the people willing to save Ace. He is not the kind of SH who runs towards the platform to free Ace carelessly. As he is strong and would not do crazy things, he is the one who would have the best chance to survive.

About the others, I do not really know. If they had to truly fight, they would end up dead.
But as we know, Nami, Chopper and Usopp are not the kind of SHs who look for adventure and dangers. So, if they stay behind in the melee - as they would be likely - they could survive.

As I think all the SHs would try to save Ace and not just to survive in the melee, I only vote for Sanji. Indeed, as I said, he is the only one that would know what to do and what to not do into melee : he is well aware of what he could do and could be useful to save Ace.

No, he wouldn't mihawk would still curb stomp him, the warlords would sitll beat him, the VAs could probably beat him and then theres the admirals...zoro wouldn't last a second against them...and then you have sengoku and garp and the pacifistas...yeah

I don't see any of the strawhats lasting more than a few minutes in the war...look how easily luffy got taken out. Even the VAs were rage stomping him.

DEATHBOTT
December 21, 2009, 04:58 AM
depending on if they can rely on nw pirates for help they may be able to survive the pacifitas if they stuck togather but even if they did that they could all be anihilating by any one of the va, admirals or warlords so up front is a no no

Shisu
December 21, 2009, 06:07 AM
l would want them to do this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3P1XBHYl0k) once more. This time everything would get annihilated for sure!
Especially with Luffy + Gear 3. :D

kkck
December 21, 2009, 02:40 PM
I don't see any of the strawhats being more than the fodder we usually see the pacifista or WB beating around lol. At the very least they are nowhere near strong enough to be in the front lines and be even vaguely important. Just look at how easily luffy gets trashed every time he tried to approach the front lines. None of the strawhats have a shred of a chance of doing any better. Odds are the VA would easily deal with them.

winterwyrm
December 21, 2009, 03:45 PM
Plot armor aside, I think ussop with his ability to hang back is the most likely to survive.

The problem is, in this war, there is a steady line, on one side, the marines, on the other are the pirates, and everyone who crosses that line, oars, kisaru, aokiji, leroux, etc. attract the attention of someone outstandingly powerful and are specifically targetted. If that one person is not enough, they are targetted by multiple ones until they go down.

Unfortunately, even zorro with probably the highest stamina couldn't withstand a few hits from most VAs, being around their level, and would tire quickly. Anyone who gets knocked out, or even plays dead like chopper might, would be annihilated (excepting maybe franky, sanji, or zorro) when akainu blew the center.

The problem is the strawhats are more powerful than the average fodder here, strong enough to attract attention, but not enough to hold their own against, say a pacifista without help. Robin is a nice possiblity, but her hands transfer their damage back to her, so it puts her in a risky position.

chess4
December 21, 2009, 04:04 PM
i think usopp has the greatest chance of surviving because he is a great narksman. so far we havent seen anyone from the WG, who can shoot better than him. he could just hang back(the very back) and pick people off

Gcat88
December 21, 2009, 05:14 PM
i think they can all survive in one way or another. either hiding and shooting, or going head on with some of the worlds strongest. yes they would get hurt, heck even Marco is getting hurt. survival is staying alive and withstanding pain not being able to take people down.

RichardMNixon
December 22, 2009, 02:53 AM
l would want them to do this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3P1XBHYl0k) once more. This time everything would get annihilated for sure!
Especially with Luffy + Gear 3. :D

Dude, if Big Emperor was in, the war would be over.

I think Zoro, Sanji, and Franky would be ok, certainly more so than some of the New World crewman. The issue with the other four isn't their power, it's their defense. With the possible exception of Brook, they're glass cannons.

Sure Usopp, Nami, and Robin can fight from a ship, but I'm sure there's some marksmen somewhere in the marines and they'd have been in trouble when Akainu went to town anyway.