Fan League Character Discussion Thread

[Sai_the_Shaman]

Sounds good to me. I say apply changes and lets get round 3 started. (always wondered though....why doesn't Bunta have Tecchu Atte or Jikansa Jigoku? Meh a problem for another time.)

[Kaoz]

I'll post round 3 once we have agreed on Pinnacle of Great Wisdom, Illusion, Moujuu and all the other copying stuff.

Let me answer your question with a question; why doesn't Echizen have Drive B and so many other characters are missing abilities?

[javimgol]

Why do you want always to reduce the points of Niou's rival?
Fuji played great VS Shiraishi/Tezuka.
Same goes to Golden Pair, even if that's Doubles: they even use the first time Oishi Territory

I like my version, and Niou' user, Sherlock, liked it too. What's the problem with it?


-Illusion [Effect]:
When playing Singles, Niou must make a prediction beforehand about who he will be playing.Then he chooses a player and a ability of it.
If his prediction is correct, he can choose one player of the league,who can not exceed Niou's points by up to 20.All his stats are copied.Also, Niou can copy one Effect,Aura of the chosen player.
If his prediction is wrong, Niou can choose an Effect of one player of the league and use it.If that Effect would increase/decrease the stats of any player, only 60% of its original effect are applied
This effect can not be copied

Moujuu is pretty strange, and i don't understand it pretty well. I will like whatever you do
I like your Pinnacle of Wisdom

[-Ken-]

Now that's look like a great wisdom. It's like super power-up version of Mizuki prediction, which only affect its user opponent. I think that's justified considering the cost.

pinnacle of perfection didn't need any fix through, auto-win is the perfection. But I think it need the 'cannot be negated', it doesn't make sense that someone can negate it.

[Kaoz]

Do you agree that Sai has more knowledge about PoT than we do?
If so:


Niou has this uncanny ability to make it seem like he is pulling off god like moves. I want to liken it to Yukimura's Sense Stealing Yips Tennis. He is somehow able to get it into your mind that you are playing someone you aren't. Part of it is his ability to pull off mannerisms and voice imitations (like what he did while climbing the mountain with Kabaji). The other part I believe is his ability to prepare ahead of time. In his match against Fuji, I think Niou was able to predict exactly who he would be playing and was able to prepare himself for the encounter. However, I think against Yagyuu, he did not know who he was going to face and thus only had very easy to apply illusions (the fake blood nonsense). Of course he is able to also do all these because he is himself a highly skilled player. His ability is as much a mental attack as much as it is a physical one.

I would say He needs to make his prediction before hand, If he is correct then he can copy the technique at 100% and then lower his opponents stats (due to mental attack), however if he is wrong he can only copy at 50% (to show that his illusion isn't working) and his opponents stats stay the same. Maybe add a stat drop just to show that his mental attack backfired.

That's what my version represents, I think it sounds logically.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

I wouldn't say I know more, but I do have access to the source material in Japanese....and every so often there will be changes to lines here and there.

But for Niou, that's simply how I like to comprehend his ability. There's plenty of counter points, but that's simply how I make sense of it. Because otherwise, it doesn't make sense since Niou should have even beyond Kabaji level copying skills whihc I truly believe he doesn't (or how the hell would he have lost to yagyuu)

[Kaoz]

Man, there I go and praise you to support my point and you deny it. :p

No seriously, my interpretation of Illusion is very close to Sai's, he could just express it better than me.

[-Ken-]

On Niou, I like Chaos version better.

This is why, as he said, Niou copy is not exactly 'perfect', which is describe by 100% copy move, but doesn't copy anything else. The opponent is 'mindrape', therefore, the stats decrease. His own power doesn't change beside copying move.

EDIT: It's weird, now I want a rematch with Sherlock which I'll probably lose, just so that Echizen can copy more stuff! Oh, well. I'm surprised that Rai can be copy, but it was shown during Echizen fight with Yukimura, so I guessed I really can't say anything to that.

Just some side question, nothing to do with the league. Can Yukimura control when his yips kick in? In http://www.onemanga.com/Prince_of_Tennis/374/05/ he seemed to be not have control over it completely. However, in his fight with Sanada, I also found it weird that he can control to make it happen.

The weirdest is is that in chapter 374 Echizen is seemingly beating Yukimura using Tezuka 2 pinnacle, both of which got defeat by the Emperor like a joke. Yukimura seem to beat Sanada pretty easily. Umm... It's hard to explained, but it just feel weird.

[Kaoz]

On Niou, I like Chaos version better.

This is why, as he said, Niou copy is not exactly 'perfect', which is describe by 100% copy move, but doesn't copy anything else. The opponent is 'mindrape', therefore, the stats decrease. His own power doesn't change beside copying move.

EDIT: It's weird, now I want a rematch with Sherlock which I'll probably lose, just so that Echizen can copy more stuff! Oh, well. I'm surprised that Rai can be copy, but it was shown during Echizen fight with Yukimura, so I guessed I really can't say anything to that.

Just some side question, nothing to do with the league. Can Yukimura control when his yips kick in? In http://www.onemanga.com/Prince_of_Tennis/374/05/ he seemed to be not have control over it completely. However, in his fight with Sanada, I also found it weird that he can control to make it happen.

The weirdest is is that in chapter 374 Echizen is seemingly beating Yukimura using Tezuka 2 pinnacle, both of which got defeat by the Emperor like a joke. Yukimura seem to beat Sanada pretty easily. Umm... It's hard to explained, but it just feel weird.

I think he shows that he can control it in that chapter as well. On page 5, he goes oh shit but then when the 5th shot comes Yips activates perfectly. It might be coincidence but he could have activated it on purpose just as well, I think.
Also, it is said that Yukimura toyed with Echizen in the beginning, so there goes that. Sanada had special counters for both Pinnacles as well, whereas Yukimura's Yips works against everyone. (Hope this makes sense)

[Sherlock Holmes]

Okay Chaos, I can take your version...On one condition. Instead of making the opponent weaker, can we make Niou stronger? Because Fuji was DEFINITELY not weaker during their match.

If so, then we can agree on it. It's fine by me. It's just that I prefer a boost on Niou rather than decrease the opponent.
Oh also, you have to add the "cannot be copied or negated" condition to the illusion.

[Kaoz]

Did you forget about Fuji's Prodigy? His stats cannot be decreased.

The condition is naturally added as well.

[javimgol]

Did you forget about Fuji's Prodigy? His stats cannot be decreased.

The condition is naturally added as well.
What is your Final Version of Illusion?

[Sherlock Holmes]

As for Niou's "unpredictable" feat, you should include that Mizuki's prediction doesn't work against him, since it's the same principle.


Wakato (4, 4, 4, 7, 19) 16
All-rounder

-Change Over! [Feat]:
Wakato has to choose one player before the match, his playstyle and dominant hand change accordingly. Depending on whether the copied playstyle has an advantage/disadvantage against the opponent's playstyle the following bonus is applied:
-Advantage -> +1.5 to all stats
-Neutral -> +0
-Disadvantage -> -0.5 to all stats
The order of advantages is:
-Serve&Volley advantage vs Defensive Baseliner
-Defensive Baseliner advantage vs Aggressive Baseliner
-Aggressive Baseliner advantage vs Serve&Volley
-All-rounder always counts as Neutral

-Buggy Whip Shot [Effect]:
Wakato's Spin is boosted by 2 points.

I'd like to say, I disagree STRONGLY with this.

Current wakato can get a +10 with Hadokyuu 100% of the times.
Nerfed Wakato can get 8 points IF I'M LUCKY and 0 POINTS if I'm not lucky.

I cannot agree with that absurd nerf. If it was 3 points instead of 1.5, I could agree, sure. But 1.5? He is a joke compared to his former self.

Unless you include something like "He can copy feats of players he has faced before"(since he copies habits more than he copies effects) to become some sort of Muga for Feats, then it's just not fair.

[javimgol]

As for Niou's "unpredictable" feat, you should include that Mizuki's prediction doesn't work against him, since it's the same principle.



I'd like to say, I disagree STRONGLY with this.

Current wakato can get a +10 with Hadokyuu 100% of the times.
Nerfed Wakato can get 8 points IF I'M LUCKY and 0 POINTS if I'm not lucky.

I cannot agree with that absurd nerf. If it was 3 points instead of 1.5, I could agree, sure. But 1.5? He is a joke compared to his former self.

Unless you include something like "He can copy feats of players he has faced before"(since he copies habits more than he copies effects) to become some sort of Muga for Feats, then it's just not fair.
+2/0/-1 to all the stats
More risk, better for Sherlock:p
Good luck: 10 points more
Bad luck 2 points lost

[Sherlock Holmes]

+2/0/-1 to all the stats
More risk, better for Sherlock:p
Good luck: 10 points more
Bad luck 2 points lost

2/0/-1 is still +10 only if I'm lucky, something current Wakato can get 100% of the time, PLUS be a beast in doubles by copying some effects.

3/0/-3 is something I would actually be fine with.

Hell, you could go with 3/0/autoloss and I would still be fine with it.

[Kaoz]

As for Niou's "unpredictable" feat, you should include that Mizuki's prediction doesn't work against him, since it's the same principle.



I'd like to say, I disagree STRONGLY with this.

Current wakato can get a +10 with Hadokyuu 100% of the times.
Nerfed Wakato can get 8 points IF I'M LUCKY and 0 POINTS if I'm not lucky.

I cannot agree with that absurd nerf. If it was 3 points instead of 1.5, I could agree, sure. But 1.5? He is a joke compared to his former self.

Unless you include something like "He can copy feats of players he has faced before"(since he copies habits more than he copies effects) to become some sort of Muga for Feats, then it's just not fair.

I think I'd like to go with the Feat copying stuff. There should be a slight restriction though, something like what we did with the current Illusion.

[Sherlock Holmes]

okay. He only manages to copy a feat if he predicts the opponent he is facing, how about that?

[Sai_the_Shaman]

Well for Wakato if we're going to change into feat copying. The restriction we need is that he can't copy god given talents like Jiro's Flexible Wrists or Atobe's Insight or even Kenya's speed. That would actually probably limit his abilities by over 50% I would think....

Personally I prefer just boosting the points of the current Wakato's ability to 3 that way Sherlock suggested. I don't think that will make him too powered up as he still needs to predict, which is hard enough as it is.

[-Ken-]

I don't have any opinion on Wakato, I don't even remember who he is for some reason.

On Niou, I think that opponent being 'mind rape' is better represent by dropping their stat. That's all. But increasing stat wouldn't make that much of a difference most of the time, except when fighting Fuji, which is all the more reason to drop the stat instead.

[Kaoz]

Don't you think that'd be uncanon like?
On the other hand, he didn't get screentime at all in the manga so one can't really speak about canon here.

I'm fine with both versions, what do you guys prefer?

[Sherlock Holmes]

-Big Bang [Effect]:
Kite’s Power is boosted by 3 points. Afterwards, if Kite’s Power is more than 3 points higher than his opponent’s, Kite wins in a tie.
Couldn't this be something like "if Kite's power is within 3 points of his opponent, he wins" or something? Because ties are already rare, ties when he has 3 or more in power is freaking impossible to happen.

Also, as for Wakato's effects, I'm fine with either one too but...How would they work in doubles?

[-Ken-]

On the big bang, it wouldn't exactly hurt to make it auto win in the tie. It's just like Inui waterfall, but increase more power. It wouldn't be a bad skill. Within 3 point is too sick, that's 6 point range, and it's in power only, not entire level. It would cover too many player.

Can you make pinnacle of perfection so that it cannot be negated? I don't really have anything to prove it, so...

I want to rant on my character, abit. I want Rin to have some boost. He suck for his cost. Giant Habu work with very few player, AND most player with speed lower than 5 also tend to have very low power. It's pretty much just hold the sign 'never use me'.

On the other character note, I want to suggest Gin to add power if his Hadokyuu is negated, something along the line of 'higer level'. But it shouldn't be higher than 10, or his opponent will scream if they negate his effect. Something along 2-5 sounds great.

Next, Kikumaru, I want him to have ability to pull off formation in single. He split, and show one-man Australian Formation, so why not? On this note, Oishi should get a boost as well. He's a strong lead in any double, there should be something to represent that.

[Kaoz]

Couldn't this be something like "if Kite's power is within 3 points of his opponent, he wins" or something? Because ties are already rare, ties when he has 3 or more in power is freaking impossible to happen.

Also, as for Wakato's effects, I'm fine with either one too but...How would they work in doubles?

How about just having more points in Power then to it a tie? Ties are rare but to have a higher Power after a boost isn't that unlikely.

As for Wakato, maybe the Effects could sum up in Doubles?


On the big bang, it wouldn't exactly hurt to make it auto win in the tie. It's just like Inui waterfall, but increase more power. It wouldn't be a bad skill. Within 3 point is too sick, that's 6 point range, and it's in power only, not entire level. It would cover too many player.

(1) Can you make pinnacle of perfection so that it cannot be negated? I don't really have anything to prove it, so...

(2) I want to rant on my character, abit. I want Rin to have some boost. He suck for his cost. Giant Habu work with very few player, AND most player with speed lower than 5 also tend to have very low power. It's pretty much just hold the sign 'never use me'.

(3) On the other character note, I want to suggest Gin to add power if his Hadokyuu is negated, something along the line of 'higer level'. But it shouldn't be higher than 10, or his opponent will scream if they negate his effect. Something along 2-5 sounds great.

(4) Next, Kikumaru, I want him to have ability to pull off formation in single. He split, and show one-man Australian Formation, so why not? On this note, Oishi should get a boost as well. He's a strong lead in any double, there should be something to represent that.

(1) I'll take a look at all effects and see which ae copyable and which should not be.

(2) Hmm, maybe Speed 6 or below and Power becomes 0? He soesn't have any other techniques as far as I know. Any ideas anyone?

(3) Is there anything you base this on?

(4) We already had this discussion once before, their cost is simply too low to implement more powerful effects.

[-Ken-]

On Rin, I just want the effect to be better, that's all.

I do base Gin 'increasing' base on his only real fight on the entire manga. Once his power is beaten (when fight against Taka), he just bring out more powerful version of his attack (He do got 108 style). Now, we can't really make it more powerful, since that's just broken. But nerfing his +10 wouldn't make anyone who use him much happier. +2 and keeping plusing until his level surpass his opponent may work, but that's just the same with adding a lot of points at once.

On the pinnacle, right now it already can't be copy, it meant that it shouldn't be able to be negate.

[Kaoz]

I don't think Gin raised the power of his Hadokyuu because he got overpowered but rather to show his respect for Kawamura.
http://www.onemanga.com/Prince_of_Tennis/330/12/

On Rin, the only thing I can think of is to make it easier to activate.

On the pinnacle, sorry i misread it. I'll think it through.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

I do think Gin's Hadoukyuu shoudl be stronger than Ishida's or Taka's

If I recall correctly didn't Gin say that only Taka's Dash Hadoukyuu was on the level of a real Hadoukyuu?

Which should make it then Gin's base Hadoukyuu > Taka's base Hadoukyuu > Tetsu's base Hadoukyuu

[-Ken-]

I know that Taka's Hadoukyuu is not as strong as Gin's.

Just some note on Taka's power, http://www.onemanga.com/Prince_of_Tennis/331/08-09/ I can only wish he use this move freely as he want (Gin state it's not Hadoukyuu). I only got to hope that happen before this season ends.

[Kaoz]

I do think Gin's Hadoukyuu shoudl be stronger than Ishida's or Taka's

If I recall correctly didn't Gin say that only Taka's Dash Hadoukyuu was on the level of a real Hadoukyuu?

Which should make it then Gin's base Hadoukyuu > Taka's base Hadoukyuu > Tetsu's base Hadoukyuu

Gin's Hadokyuu is already stronger. Taka's and Tetsu's give the same boost at the moment though. Maybe we could change Tetsu's to +6/+5 or something.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

Oh on Kite, I think he needs a feat that auto wins against the rest of Higa Chuu or at least Kai

Taken from the pair matches when he basically just look at Kai and tell him you can't beat me and makes him forfeit.
[hr]
oh, didn't realize Gin's was already stronger ^^ I jsut thought it was the same since they all had the same move name.

[Kaoz]

Tell me, who from Higa could beat Kite?

[Sai_the_Shaman]

This is true, but I'd just love to seem him have a feat called scared shitless or something. It's more just a fan feat than anything else lol.

Anyhow, can we get a list of all the changes and then get them finalized today chaos?

that way we can start Round 3 tomorrow.

[-Ken-]

I don't such a feat since no one from Higa can beat him anyway, but make the ability single only, it shouldn't effect double.

Just some ideas on Moujou, how about make it activate target effect at*1.5? That should be more interesting that just a point boost. I do think that Tetsu should only add 5-6 through. But it should have some limit if it can just activate effect at 1.5, otherwise people will just spam it.

A list of change will be nice, I want to know what's going to happen next round.

Can I have the change that speed is six or below power drop to 0 on Giant Habu? That is so much more useful than the current version.

The reason I said the Pinnacle of Perfection shouldn't be able to copy is because only Ryoma+his father reach that level, in tennis history (according to Chitose). It shouldn't be able to be negate because Yukimura Yips can't even negate it, nothing else should be able to.

Chaos, are the cost of character going to change next season? like Mizuki and the Golden Pair.

[javimgol]

I don't such a feat since no one from Higa can beat him anyway, but make the ability single only, it shouldn't effect double.

Just some ideas on Moujou, how about make it activate target effect at*1.5? That should be more interesting that just a point boost. I do think that Tetsu should only add 5-6 through. But it should have some limit if it can just activate effect at 1.5, otherwise people will just spam it.

A list of change will be nice, I want to know what's going to happen next round.

Can I have the change that speed is six or below power drop to 0 on Giant Habu? That is so much more useful than the current version.

The reason I said the Pinnacle of Perfection shouldn't be able to copy is because only Ryoma+his father reach that level, in tennis history (according to Chitose). It shouldn't be able to be negate because Yukimura Yips can't even negate it, nothing else should be able to.

Chaos, are the cost of character going to change next season? like Mizuki and the Golden Pair.
Next season Golden Pair should be boosted a lot, both cost and abilities.There won't be as good as Bunta or Jackal,indiviudally, but Oishi getting 14 points after Feats in a Doubles match it's a joke.

[Kaoz]

As requested, here is a list of all changes that will occur for round 3:

-The first part of Shishido's Rising Counter works in Doubles too.

-Fuji gets Hoshi Hanabi:
Hoshi Hanabi [Effect]:
This Effect cannot be used. It triggers automatically once Hecatoncheiros is negated and doubles Fuji's Spin. This Effect can neither be copied nor can it be negated.

-New Version of Muga for Echizen and Chitose, Muga is removed from Sanada and Yukimura.
Muga no Kyouchi [Aura]:
Choose one:
(1) All of Echizen's stats are boosted by 1.5 points.
(2) Echizen can copy any one Effect of a player, whom he faced in this season.

Muga no Kyouchi [Final Aura]:
Kirihara can copy any one Effect of a player, whom he faced that season. This Aura is negated if the opponent's total is lower than Kirihara's.

Muga no Kyouchi [Aura]:
Choose one:
(1) All of Chitose's stats are boosted by 1 point.
(2) Chitose can copy any one Effect of a player, whom he faced in this season.

-Devil Mode is changed from being a Feat to being an Aura.

-Yagyuu receives a new Effect:
Guess Who? the 2nd [Effect]
Yagyuu copies the Effect of any player he already played or partnered with in this season. If that Effect would increase/decrease any stats, those changes apply only to 30%.

-Atobe's base stats are lowered and he receives a new Feat:
Atobe (7, 9, 9, 10, 36) 45
All-rounder

Super Attack Style [Final Feat]:
If the opponent's final total is higher than Atobe's, all of Atobe's stats are boosted by 2 points. In doubles, this applies to both team's totals.

-Echizen receives a nerf for Doubles (no Effects/Auras activate).

-New Pinnacle of Great Wisdom:
The player has to choose one ability from every player of the opposing team. If that ability is used against Chitose/Tezuka, it is negated and the opponent's highest stat drops by 8 points. If two or more stats tie as the highest stat, the dropping points are divided equally. (Singles only)

-Niou' base stats are boosted, he gets another Feat and Illusion is reworded:
Niou (8, 8, 8, 9, 33) 35
All-rounder

Unpredictable [Feat]:
If the opponent would use a Feat or an Effect called ‘Data Tennis’, that Feat/Effect is negated. Also, Prediction's effect doesn't work against Niou.

Illusion [Effect]:
When playing Singles, Niou has to predict his opponent as well as a copyable ability.
If the prediction is correct, the copied ability is applied at 100% and the opponent's stats drop by 2 points each. If the prediction was wrong, the copied ability is applied at 50% and all of Niou's stats drop by 1.5 points.

-New Wakato:
Wakato (4, 4, 4, 7, 19) 16
All-rounder

-Change Over! [Feat]:
Wakato has to choose one player before the match, his playstyle and dominant hand change accordingly. Depending on whether the copied playstyle has an advantage/disadvantage against the opponent's playstyle the following bonus is applied:
-Advantage -> +3 to all stats
-Neutral -> +0
-Disadvantage -> -1.5 to all stats
The order of advantages is:
-Serve&Volley advantage vs Defensive Baseliner
-Defensive Baseliner advantage vs Aggressive Baseliner
-Aggressive Baseliner advantage vs Serve&Volley
-All-rounder always counts as Neutral

-Buggy Whip Shot [Effect]:
Wakato's Spin is boosted by 2 points.


-New Big Bang:
Kite’s Power is boosted by 3 points. Afterwards, if Kite’s Power higher than his opponent’s, Kite wins in a tie.

-New Giant Habu:
Giant Habu [Final Effect]:
If the opponent’s total Speed is 6 or below, his Power becomes 0.

-several techniques will change the "being copyable" status


That's all I think, please tell me if i forgot something.

[Sherlock Holmes]

Niou is going to keep his old guess who right?

Anyway, can't Wakato get at least 21 base points? Considering that all other players with his cost have 21/22 points, it seems fair.

I agree with everything else. Chaos, can you at least post the matches but say that we cannot send our lineups until this is solved? I just want to begin calculating mindraping and etc, since those things take time.

[Kaoz]

Naturally Niou keeps Guess Who, I was just too lazy to type down everything unnecessary.

You realize that Wakato can go up to 31 as a 16 point character, no? Is there someone else who feels Wakato's base stats should be higher?

Okay, if you need so much prep time, I'll post them in a few minutes.

[Sherlock Holmes]

I'm Batman dammit. I need my prep time.

And fine, no need to improve Wakato. Though, his Buggy Whip shot is the same as Kaidoh's snake, so shouldn't he get 3 points like Kaidoh?

[Kaoz]

I posted the match-ups, everyone do not yet send you line-ups till this is approved.

Buggy Whip can give +3.

[Sherlock Holmes]

-Samurai Drive [Effect]:
Echizen Spin is boosted by 10. This effect is negated if the opponent’s Power and Speed stats are both 20 or above. In that case, Echizen loses the match. This effect cannot be copied by anyone nor can it be negated.
Forgot to mention, Samurai Drive should be better than Hadokyuu, don't you think? I say, let's make it be boosted by 15 instead.
...Not that it makes any difference, but dammit if it doesn't look cooler this way.

[Kaoz]

Yeah well, I'm not even sure whether there is anyone who can make the special defeat condition work... I don't mind making it +15.

[javimgol]

Yeah well, I'm not even sure whether there is anyone who can make the special defeat condition work... I don't mind making it +15.
No one. Ryoga or Gin reach 20 points of Power,but they don't have enough speed

[Kaoz]

Oops, in that case we might wanna alter that a bit?

[Sai_the_Shaman]

Well Everything looks good to me. Lets make those changes permanent and get to Round 3 XD

[Sherlock Holmes]

I say the same as Sai. C'mon, can we move on with r3? Please? Please?

[Sai_the_Shaman]

Can someone tell me what the wording for Moujuu Aura is supposed to be....it makes no sense how its worded right now....

[Kaoz]

Ah, my bad. That's right, I wanted to as, what do like better

Moujuu V2a [Aura]:
All of the User's stats are boosted by 1.5 points.

Moujuu V2b [Aura]:
The User's highest stat is boosted by 6 points. If several stats tie for the highest, this boost is split equally amongst them.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

V2a works for me.

[javimgol]

-A Captain’s Pride [Opening Effect]:
If Kajimoto is lower than 1-3 levels of his opponent and his team has lost 1-2 matches it’s an automatic tie.

This sounds too much a Feat than an effect
It's pretty similar to Reiji's Masterpiece or Muromachi's Last Pick, so I think it should be a Feat and, of course, only useful in Singles

[Kaoz]

I agree. Anyone any objections?

[javimgol]

Hoshi Hanabi works in Doubles?
Yagyyu's Gues Who it's for Doubles, I suppose,no?

[Kaoz]

Yes to both.

[Sherlock Holmes]

okay, can we start r3 then?

[Kaoz]

If everyone agrees to Moujuu and Kajimoto's Pride effect being a Feat, theoretically yes.

Practically no though as I wanna edit the charatcers first. It's midnight here at the moment and I'm bound to screw something up when I do it now.

However, if you don't want to copy anything and can apply the changes for yourselves, feel free to send your line-up.

[KuwabaraTheMan]

I like the old version of Moujuu better, honestly.

Although, I'm probably just biased in that regard.

[-Ken-]

Moujuu V2b [Aura]:
The User's highest stat is boosted by 6 points. If several stats tie for the highest, this boost is split equally amongst them.

I like this version better, when Kamio and Ishida use it, the most notable power up is their speed and power. As for Tachibana, he's all rounder, so it only make sense that nothing really get more clear with him.

[Kaoz]

Could you decide something for Moujuu please. So far Sai want V2a, Ken V2b and Kuwabra V1. I myself vote for V2b.

[Sherlock Holmes]

Also, I'd like for Kite to get some sort of boost. As he is now, even Hiyoshi/Momo/Kaidoh who cost WAY less than him can beat him 100% of the time.

Relative to his cost, it isn't fair. If Rin gets a boost, Kite getting one is also fair.

[Kaoz]

Big Bang is better now, isn't this enough improvement for now?
What would you like to see?

[-Ken-]

I don't know about Kite. Even after Rin getting a boost, he still can't fight him. Big bang got improved, isn't that like... enough? Character tier list right now is pretty accurate. Rin is truly 'E' because of his cost and the point that he can reach. Will see how far New Giant Habu will got him up.

[Kaoz]

I meant to ask this before, next season our teams could be rather unbalanced if we change things more. Do we want to repick the teams with everyone maybe choosing two characters from their team which they keep. Dunno, something like that.

[Sherlock Holmes]

one thing bothering me about kite...

Kite (8, 6, 8, 6, 28) 27
All-rounder

He is an all-rounder. Yet, he is not very round!
DAMMIT THE OCD IN ME ANNOYS ME.
...Can we chance him to 7,7,7,7? It won't change his total points, it's just that I want him to have a nice OCD-friendly number lol.

...Not that I have OCD, but my point stands.

[Kaoz]

Eh, sure... I don't mind... anyone else?

[javimgol]

I meant to ask this before, next season our teams could be rather unbalanced if we change things more. Do we want to repick the teams with everyone maybe choosing two characters from their team which they keep. Dunno, something like that.
I was thinking exactly the same. And it's going to be good what are the players that every team want to keep. I would keep Golden Pair: first of all they are two of my favourite players (just after Niou and Atobe)and second, I can not deny it, they are awesome in the game
[hr]

one thing bothering me about kite...

Kite (8, 6, 8, 6, 28) 27
All-rounder

He is an all-rounder. Yet, he is not very round!
DAMMIT THE OCD IN ME ANNOYS ME.
...Can we chance him to 7,7,7,7? It won't change his total points, it's just that I want him to have a nice OCD-friendly number lol.

...Not that I have OCD, but my point stands.

If you want, no problem for me
And sorry, but, what is OCD?

[-Ken-]

It will be best if we repick character, with some option of keeping your own. I am neutral with Echizen, but Kin-chan is my favourite character in the entire series. His spot is just not clear. He only have real 2 match in the first manga, against Echizen and Yukimura, not really the best way to judge his true strength.

[javimgol]

How works both
-Quick Analysis [Feat]:
Feats, Effects and Auras that would make Irie’s points drop are negated.

-Total Control [Opening Effect]:
Unless the opponent has a Control of at least 15 he cannot use any effects or aura’s that increase his power, speed or spin. This effect cannot be copied.

VS
-Unpredictable [Feat]:
If the opponent would use a Feat or an Effect called ‘Data Tennis’, that Feat/Effect is negated. Also, Prediction's effect doesn't work against Niou

-Illusion [Effect]:
When playing Singles, Niou has to predict his opponent as well as a copyable ability.
If the prediction is correct, the copied ability is applied at 100% and the opponent's stats drop by 2 points each. If the prediction was wrong, the copied ability is applied at 50% and all of Niou's stats drop by 1.5 points. This Effect cannot be copied nor can it be negated.

??

Irie cancels TWICE Niou's effects, first with the Feat (Feats>Effects, remember), then with an Opening Effect. But Illusion "can not be negated"...

[-Ken-]

I dont know, but if it 'cannot use', then I guess the effect wouldn't be negate since it cannot even be used. But, I don't really know.

Pinnacle of Perfection need 'cannot be negate'. It doesn't make sense that Pinnacle of Great Wisdom can beat it, not even Yukimura's Yips can negate it.

[Sherlock Holmes]

How works both
-Quick Analysis [Feat]:
Feats, Effects and Auras that would make Irie’s points drop are negated.

-Total Control [Opening Effect]:
Unless the opponent has a Control of at least 15 he cannot use any effects or aura’s that increase his power, speed or spin. This effect cannot be copied.

VS
-Unpredictable [Feat]:
If the opponent would use a Feat or an Effect called ‘Data Tennis’, that Feat/Effect is negated. Also, Prediction's effect doesn't work against Niou

-Illusion [Effect]:
When playing Singles, Niou has to predict his opponent as well as a copyable ability.
If the prediction is correct, the copied ability is applied at 100% and the opponent's stats drop by 2 points each. If the prediction was wrong, the copied ability is applied at 50% and all of Niou's stats drop by 1.5 points. This Effect cannot be copied nor can it be negated.

??

Irie cancels TWICE Niou's effects, first with the Feat (Feats>Effects, remember), then with an Opening Effect. But Illusion "can not be negated"...
Feat tries to negate Niou's effect. Niou doesn't let that happen.
His effect doesn't let Niou activate his effect period, so Irie wins.

...Not that it matters. You are already preparing for our match haha?
Mizuki would hit Irie, so his effect would get destroyed.

Niou would get boosted 15 points with Samurai Drive.
48.
Irie cannot negate Illusion, so he drops to 47. Mizuki makes Niou go up to 50 anyway.

...Of course, that is assuming that I can predict where you are throwing Irie. Haha, seriously though, little bit early to start preparing don't you think? Am I that scary?

[javimgol]

I dont know, but if it 'cannot use', then I guess the effect wouldn't be negate since it cannot even be used. But, I don't really know.

Pinnacle of Perfection need 'cannot be negate'. It doesn't make sense that Pinnacle of Great Wisdom can beat it, not even Yukimura's Yips can negate it.
That's key point, I think. The effect can not be used, so the chance of avoiding the cancelation that have Illusion or Shishido's Rising Shot, for example,doesn't exist. That effects (Illusion or Shishido's Rising)cancels the "cancelation" that the Canceling Effects do:Irie's Total Control,Akutsu's Sliding, Oni's Black Knive,Jiro or Bunta's Rising Shot, Reiji's Mirage,Billy's Shotgun,Itsuki's Sinker,Defensive or I Formation; or the drop of the points added that Inisight cause, for example.

The Feats that cancel (Irie's Analysis,Shiraishi's Bible,Kite's Hitman,Gin's Hadoukyyu Master,Koharu's Data Tennis,Amane's Long Racket) ,and Yips (who should be Feat,Aura or Opening Effect, but non just an usual Effect), IMAO, can stop whatever Effect. Even if they have in their description "this effect can not be cancelled".As I said, that "this effect can not be cancelled" work VS all of the Effects I stated before.The Feat simply doesn't permit the Effects to activate
[hr]

Feat tries to negate Niou's effect. Niou doesn't let that happen.
His effect doesn't let Niou activate his effect period, so Irie wins.

...Not that it matters. You are already preparing for our match haha?
Mizuki would hit Irie, so his effect would get destroyed.

Niou would get boosted 15 points with Samurai Drive.
48.
Irie cannot negate Illusion, so he drops to 47. Mizuki makes Niou go up to 50 anyway.

...Of course, that is assuming that I can predict where you are throwing Irie. Haha, seriously though, little bit early to start preparing don't you think? Am I that scary?
IMAO, as I said in my post, both Irie and Shiraishi cancel Illusion (but not Mizuki's Data), because they cancel by FEATS. The Effect never happened.
If you destroy the papers with the design of an Unstoppable Armor, it doesn't care if Armor is impossible to be destroyed, because it would have never been created

[Kaoz]

How works both
-Quick Analysis [Feat]:
Feats, Effects and Auras that would make Irie’s points drop are negated.

-Total Control [Opening Effect]:
Unless the opponent has a Control of at least 15 he cannot use any effects or aura’s that increase his power, speed or spin. This effect cannot be copied.

VS
-Unpredictable [Feat]:
If the opponent would use a Feat or an Effect called ‘Data Tennis’, that Feat/Effect is negated. Also, Prediction's effect doesn't work against Niou

-Illusion [Effect]:
When playing Singles, Niou has to predict his opponent as well as a copyable ability.
If the prediction is correct, the copied ability is applied at 100% and the opponent's stats drop by 2 points each. If the prediction was wrong, the copied ability is applied at 50% and all of Niou's stats drop by 1.5 points. This Effect cannot be copied nor can it be negated.

??

Irie cancels TWICE Niou's effects, first with the Feat (Feats>Effects, remember), then with an Opening Effect. But Illusion "can not be negated"...

If an Effect states it cannot be negated, it can't. Period.

[KuwabaraTheMan]

If an Effect states it cannot be negated, it can't. Period.

But Total Control doesn't negate Illusion, it just states that it can't be used. Isn't that different?

[Kaoz]

No, Jyten worded Total Illusion I worded the rest, I just didn't change it.

[-Ken-]

I only wish that it's copyable, so that I can copy Kazuya in hope of beating him.... This match is probably my worst match up. Kintarou and Echizen will lose 2/3 of the times... And they were my best two player!

Oh well, just have to left it up to luck.

[javimgol]

If an Effect states it cannot be negated, it can't. Period.
With that law, Ryoma, who costs 50, will always defeat Oni and Irie, who cost 3 and 4 points more. Change the absolutely useless "his effect is negated if the opponent’s Power and Speed stats are both 20 or above" to "doesn't affect High Scholars"

[Kaoz]

Yeah, I think I already said we have to change this conditon as no one can fulfill it.

[javimgol]

Yeah, I think I already said we have to change this conditon as no one can fulfill it.
But are you going to make High Scholars not affected by it? I'm pretty sure Kazuya and Irie could stop it, not so sure about Oni

[Kaoz]

I don't think High schoolers especially, we'll discuss this once round 3 is over, ok?

Also, would you please decide on whether you accept my offer so that I can make a line-up?!

[Sai_the_Shaman]

Well we have some more insight on Irie, I was looking through the Oshitari Cousins PAir Puri and noticed a mini profile on Irie

If it's a hint as to how he plays, his racket is a Bridgestone C-SNIPE 3.0

Comments on him were made by Oni and Inui.

Oni: "Hmm, Irie, huh? You wanna know how strong he is? Just look at what court number he's on and that should tell you. Though, you should know that he has a weird play style. But my Power Tennis will not lose to it!"

Inui: "How weird....Even though he looks like the same type of character as me, I have a weird feeling that he is quite different. I wonder why that is........ I must go and collect more data on him."

By the comments and his racket type I have a feeling that Irie is a SNIPER TYPE!

[Sherlock Holmes]

Weird style? I like him already. Sniper type?

I think he plays exclusively using the frame of his racket.

And for some reason I see him playing vs Niou or Inui in the future.
[hr]
And for some reason I see him playing vs Niou or Inui in the future. By the way Sai, any news on PairPuri Niou or spoilers for this months chapters? I tried looking for them, but my Japanese is as accurate as the plot of a movie directed by Michael Bay, so I really got nothing.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

I'll have the new pair puri next week sherlock, and I just posted a spoiler for the chapter

[Sherlock Holmes]

You are a freaking God.

[-Ken-]

I want to see him tag team with someone vs Renji and Inui, but that's just mainly because I want to see those two pawn some real match through.

[Kaoz]

Sai felt like some of our characters/abilities, so he sent me a list with some changes he'd like to see. After changing it slightly to balance thingd, I present you:

Sai's suggestions


Sanada (10, 10, 10, 10, 40) 46
All-rounder

-The Emperor [Feat]:
Sanada’s Power gets boosted by 3 points.

-Rin [Effect]
Opponents spin is halved and the user can use one additional effect

-In [Effect]:
If the opponent uses an ability that tries to predict your effect, that ability is negated and the user can user one additional effect

-Rai [Effect]:
Sanada’s Spin increases by 2 points, his Power increases by 3 points and his Speed increases by 2 points.

-Pinnacle of Destruction [Opening Aura]:
If the opponent’s base total is higher than Sanada’s, Sanada’s Power gets doubled.



Tezuka (8, 12, 9, 11, 40) 45
All-rounder

-My Aaaaaaaaaaarm… [Feat]:
Tezuka loses in a tie.

-Zeroshiki Drop Shot [Effect]:
(1)Tezuka’s Spin stat is boosted depending on the opponent’s play style. All-rounder; Aggressive Baseliner->5 points, Defensive Baseliner->7 points, Serve and Volley->3 points. (Singles only)
(2) Tezuka’s Spin is boosted by 4 points. (Doubles only)

-Tezuka Zone [Final Effect]:
(1) If the opponent’s power is 12 or lower, his spin and control stats are both halved.
(2) This effect cannot be copied perfectly by Muga no Kyouchi (read the Atobe Chapter again, Echizen didn't copy it)

- Tezuka Phantom [Effect]:
Tezuka gains 8 Points to his spin. If Tezuka's final spin stat is 20 or above, he cuts his opponents power to 0. The effect cannot be copied or negated

-Pinnacle of Hard Work [Aura]:
If your opponent adds points to either his Power or Spin stat through an Effect or Aura, add twice of those points to Tezuka's Power/Spin stat.

-Pinnacle of Great Wisdom [Aura]:
The player has to choose one ability from every player of the opposing team. If that ability is used against Tezuka, it is negated and the opponent's highest stat drops by 8 points. If two or more stats tie as the highest stat, the dropping points are divided equally. (Singles only)



Atobe (6, 8, 9, 10, 34) 45
All-rounder

-Insight [Feat]:
The opponent’s total drops by 3 and if he would add any points through an effect, only half the points are added.

-The King [Feat]:
Atobe’s Power and Control are boosted by 2 points each.

Super Attack Style [Final Feat]:
If the opponent's final total is higher than Atobe's, all of Atobe's stats are boosted by 2 points. In doubles, this applies to both team's totals.

-Tannhäuser Serve [Opening Effect]:
Atobe's power and spin are boosted by 3 points each

-Rondo towards Destruction [Final Effect]:
(1) If the opponent’s Speed is 9 or below, his Power is halved. (Singles only)
(2) If the combined Speed of both opponents is below 15, their effects are cancelled. (Doubles only)

-World of Ice [Final Effect]:
If the opponent’s total is within 10 points, their Speed, Power and Control drop by 4 points each. If Atobe's Control drops below 10, this effect is negated. This Effect cannot be copied by Muga no Kyouchi.



Kirihara (7, 8, 8, 7, 30) 33
Aggressive Baseliner

-Knuckle Serve [Effect]:
Each of the opponent’s stats besides Spin drops by 2.

-Muga no Kyouchi [Final Aura]:
Kirihara can copy any one Effect of a player, whom he faced that season. This Aura is negated if the opponent's total is lower than Kirihara's.

- Red Eyes [Aura]:
If the Opponents base total is higher than Kirihara's, Kirihara's power and speed go up by 1 point each. This aura cannot be copied or negated

-Devil Mode [Final Aura]:
This Aura cannot be chosen. This Aura activates automatically if the opponent’s final total is higher than Kirihara’s and he has chosen the Aura Red Eyes as his ability. Kirihara’s Power and Speed increase by 2 points each and his opponents speed goes down by 2. This cannot be copied or negated



Bunta (4, 6, 5, 10, 25) 32
Serve and Volley

-Volley Expert [Feat]:
When playing Doubles, Bunta’s Spin, Speed and Control are boosted by 3 points each.

-Rising Shot [Effect]:
If the opponent uses an effect, that effect is negated and the opponent’s Speed drops by 3 points.

-Myougi [Opening Effect]:
The user chooses before the match whether he will use Tsunawatari, Tecchuu Atte or Jikansa Jigoku. The opponent must predict which of the 3 the user is going to use. If the opponent is correct, the effect is only activated at 50% potency. If the opponent is wrong one of the three following will happen.
- Tsunawatari - Marui’s Spin is boosted by 5 points
- Tecchuu Atte - Marui's Control is boosted by 6 points
- Jikansa Jigoku - The opponents speed is decreased by 5 points



Inui (6, 4, 6, 9, 25) 30
Serve and Volley

-Data Tennis [Feat]:
Inui’s Control and Speed are boosted by 1 point each.

-Gathering Data [Final Feat]:
If Inui's stats were lowered by an effect and the final total of the opponent is higher than Inui's, Inui's control is boosted by 3 points. In Doubles, this feat activates automatically, without the need for his stats to be lowered or for his total to be lower, as long as his partner is a defensive baseliner.

-Abandoning Data [Effect]:
Inui’s Power and Speed are boosted by 3 points each. This effect negates his Data Tennis feat. (Singles only)

-Seigaku’s Data [Effect]:
Inui’s Control and Speed are boosted by 2 points each.

-Waterfall [Effect]:
Inui’s Power is boosted by 2 points. If Inui or his team would tie with an opponent, they win instead.



Kaidoh (5, 7, 5, 5, 22) 22
Defensive Baseliner

-Stamina [Feat]:
Kaidoh wins if he ties or the opponent’s total is within 1 point of Kaidoh’s.

-Snake [Effect]:
Kaidoh's Spin is boosted by 3 points.

-Straight or Curved? [Opening Effect]:
The user chooses before the match whether he will use Gyro Laser or Tornado Snake. The opponent must predict which of the 2 the user is going to use. If the opponent is correct, the effect is negated. If the opponent is wrong one of the two following will happen.
-Gyro Laser - Kaidoh’s Power is boosted by 5.
-Tornado Snake - Kaidoh’s Spin is boosted by 5 points.

-Rivalry [Effect]:
Kaidoh may copy any one of Momoshiro's abilities for the match. That Effect cannot be negated.

-Devil Mode [Final Aura]:
This Aura cannot be chosen. This aura automatically activates if the opponent’s final total is higher than Kaidoh’s, Kaidoh’s Power and Speed increase by 2 points each. If Kaidou is playing Doubles with Inui, this effect is negated



Momoshiro (7, 5, 5, 5, 22) 21
Aggressive Baseliner

-Power [Feat]:
Momoshiro’s Power is boosted by 3 points.

-Instinct [Feat]:
The opponent’s total drops by 2 and if he would add any points through an effect, only two-thirds the points are added. (added because Momo's insight should not be on the same level as Atobe's)

-Dunk Smash [Effect]:
Each of the opponent’s stats drops by 1 point.

- Jack Knife [Effect]:
(1) Momoshiro’s Power gets boosted by 5. If the opponent has a Spin stat of 7 or more, this effect is negated.
(2) The opponent’s Effects are nullified.

-Rivalry [Effect]:
Momoshiro may copy any one of Kaidoh’s abilities for the match. That Effect cannot be negated.



Koharu (4, 5, 5, 7, 21) 16
Defensive Baseliner

-High IQ[Final Feat]:
If the opponent would add points to his own stats, they are added at -1 each. Also, if the opponent would negate Koharu's stats, they are negated if the opponent is within 4 levels of Koharu.

-Distraction [Effect]:
When playing Doubles with Hitouji, the stats of the stronger opponent are lowered by 1 point each.



Kenya (5, 1, 10, 5, 21) 14
Defensive Baseliner

-The Speedster of Naniwa [Feat]:
Kenya’s Speed is boosted by 5 points.

-NO Speed NO Life [Final Feat]:
If the opponent’s Speed is 9 or higher, Kenya’s Speed is boosted by 3 points.

- Speed Tennis [Effect]
If the Opponent increases his speed, Kenya increases his own speed by the same.



So discuss please.

[javimgol]

1)It's possible to use Rin+In+Rai?
2)I don't understand very well High IQ
The others are pretty good

[Kaoz]

(1) Yes. If the majority thinks it's too strong, I could add "except Rin/In". To be honest, I missed that while looking through.
(2) High IQ is simple, maybe it becomes more clear by splitting it up:

High IQ [Feat]:
(1) If the opponent would add points to his own stats, they are added at -1 instead.
(2) If the opponent uses an Effect to lower Koharu's stats, if the opponent's base total is within 4 points of Koharu's, that Effect is negated.

That's as how I interpret it.

[Bowser]

His IQ is pointless when he can't really return power shot though.

[-Ken-]

Koharu going to get nerf, huh?

I'm probably biased, but I like the old version more. To me, the old version make it so that if the gap level between Koharu and opponent is not too difference, he(she) can negated the effect because of her high IQ, that's probably just me, through.

I'll read more when I'm done with my essay. Chaos, did you get my line-up yet?

[Sai_the_Shaman]

His IQ is pointless when he can't really return power shot though.

I somewhat worded the technique to be like that since Gin pretty much killed Koharu with his Hadoukyuu.

I wouldn't be against upping the number of points he takes away though...

[Kaoz]

Yes, I'll post the match later.

On Koharu, I think the version still represents his abilities at a slightly lower level though.

[-Ken-]

There's just a few move that actually drop the stats, so it become pretty much useless unless there are more move that drop the stats.

If Gin the problem, then how about putting some condition on, the way it is, it is just too hard to activate. He got nerfed quite a lot.

[javimgol]

There's just a few move that actually drop the stats, so it become pretty much useless unless there are more move that drop the stats.

If Gin the problem, then how about putting some condition on, the way it is, it is just too hard to activate. He got nerfed quite a lot.
New Funny Pair (compared to the last league) is really awesome.Maybe too awesome. With Australian Formation, they will completely destroy Momo & Kaidoh, for example.Every nerf is welcome. They are fighting to be the fourth best pair after Golden,Champion and Inui-Renji. I don't know who will win in a match Funny Pair VS Jimmies or Silver...And they'll win VS other pairs like Momo-Kaidoh, Inui-Kaidoh,Gin-Kenya...

[Kaoz]

Are you refering to the league or are you saying that in general? If the latter, I'd have to disagree.

[javimgol]

Are you refering to the league or are you saying that in general? If the latter, I'd have to disagree.
In the league, in the league
In general, they are just National Level. Same level as the pairs I posted (Momo played the match of his life, and they won in the tiebreak; so Momo and Kaidoh NOT> Funny Pair). But in our League, they will defeat all of them. That's why I said that every nerf, if it isn´t too big, is welcome.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

I want to further revise the comedy pair to each have a feat:

[Feat] Comedy Tennis
If Koharu\Hitouji is partnered with Hitouji\Koharu in doubles, the oppsoing team's pair will lose 1 point to each stat for each player

(or more points, if chaos sees fit)

Also I think they should be upgraded to a level 3 pair. They're defintiely more in synch than Momo\Kaidou and really only got confused when they couldn't tell which one is which.

[javimgol]

I want to further revise the comedy pair to each have a feat:

[Feat] Comedy Tennis
If Koharu\Hitouji is partnered with Hitouji\Koharu in doubles, the oppsoing team's pair will lose 1 point to each stat for each player

(or more points, if chaos sees fit)

Also I think they should be upgraded to a level 3 pair. They're defintiely more in synch than Momo\Kaidou and really only got confused when they couldn't tell which one is which.
Level 3 is not necessary. They will VS the whole Level 2 tier

[KuwabaraTheMan]

On that same note, shouldn't Momoshiro and Kaidoh have some sort of special formation? Maybe a "Disguise Formation" or something like that.

I think the new version of Inui makes more sense, by the way.

Also, I went through all of the characters and came up with some thoughts on places where I think there's an issue:

Oni's Ogre is pointless. The only characters who haven't 'seen' him (aside from Ryoga who he can't beat anyway) are a bunch of crappy filler characters and or characters who weren't invited to the U-17 camp, all of whom are like 10 points or less. It should either be dropped entirely or changed to something else, because it does nothing right now.

As of right now, Sanada can beat Yukimura. That doesn't really make sense, does it?

I think Oshitari should have some sort of feat, since all he has are effects.

Kaidoh should have a Boomerang Snake effect (since Jackal has one)

Hiyoshi is ridiculously overpowered. He can beat Fuji if Fuji uses any effect other than Kirin Otoshi. He beats Inui (you know, the guy who kicked his ass in doubles?). He beats Kite (on the grounds of his base stats being too low for Hitman to activate, to put how many point increases Hiyoshi gets in perspective). He beats Oshitari no matter what effect he chooses.
For a character who has never won a single match in the entire manga, that's ridiculous. The problem is that Gekokujou and Successor stack too well. Against any higher ranked 3rd year player, Hiyoshi is getting a 14 point boost (after factoring in Enbu Tennis as well). The two abilities are superfluous.

Minami and Higashitaka both have Sign Play as an effect. Does this mean the stronger opponents stats are cut by 75%? Otherwise it should only be listed on one of them.

Tanishi beats Chinen 100% of the time in the Fan League. Chinen beat Tanishi in the manga.

Just my two cents.

[Sherlock Holmes]

Hiyoshi is not overpowered. Sure, he can beat Fuji if Fuji gets things wrong...
But he loses versus Momo as well. Leave him as he is. It fits with the whole Gekkokujou philosophy. He can take down stronger opponents, but weaker opponents can take him down.

He wins against stronger players, but losers easily against players in the same level or even weaker. Even so, the list of players he can actually beat is short. Fuji is a surprise, I actually hadn't even thought of that.

Oshitari does need a feat badly though. He could have Oshitari's prodigy feat.

[Kaoz]

I redid Inui a bit, what do you think of this version, I like it:

Inui (6, 4, 6, 9, 25) 30
Serve and Volley

-Gathering Data [Final Feat]:
(1) If Inui's stats were lowered by an effect and the final total of the opponent is higher than Inui's, Inui's control is boosted by 3 points.
(2) In Doubles, (1) activates regardless of whether the requirement is fulfilled, as long as his partner is a defensive baseliner.
(3) The player can choose to negate this Feat, in that case Super Training activates. (Singles only)

-Super Training [Feat]:
This Feat is negated unless it's triggered by Gathering Data's effect. Inui's Power, Control and Speed are boosted by 2 points each and Inui can activate either Rising Shot OR Jackknive.

-Data Tennis [Effect]:
Inui's Speed is boosted by 1 point and whenever an opponent would add points to any stat using a Feat or an Effect, only halve those points are added instead. This Effect is negated when Gathering Data was negated.

- Jack Knife [Effect]:
(1) Inui’s Power gets boosted by 5. If the opponent has a Spin stat of 7 or more, this effect is negated.
(2) The opponent’s Effects are nullified.
(3) This Effect cannot be activated other than through 'Super Training'.

-Rising Shot [Effect]:
(1) If the opponent uses an effect, that effect is negated and the opponent’s Speed drops by 3 points.
(2) This Effect cannot be activated other than through 'Super Training'.

-Waterfall [Effect]:
Inui’s Power is boosted by 2 points. If Inui or his team would tie with an opponent, they win instead.
[hr]

On that same note, shouldn't Momoshiro and Kaidoh have some sort of special formation? Maybe a "Disguise Formation" or something like that.

I think the new version of Inui makes more sense, by the way.

Also, I went through all of the characters and came up with some thoughts on places where I think there's an issue:

Oni's Ogre is pointless. The only characters who haven't 'seen' him (aside from Ryoga who he can't beat anyway) are a bunch of crappy filler characters and or characters who weren't invited to the U-17 camp, all of whom are like 10 points or less. It should either be dropped entirely or changed to something else, because it does nothing right now.

As of right now, Sanada can beat Yukimura. That doesn't really make sense, does it?

I think Oshitari should have some sort of feat, since all he has are effects.

Kaidoh should have a Boomerang Snake effect (since Jackal has one)

Hiyoshi is ridiculously overpowered. He can beat Fuji if Fuji uses any effect other than Kirin Otoshi. He beats Inui (you know, the guy who kicked his ass in doubles?). He beats Kite (on the grounds of his base stats being too low for Hitman to activate, to put how many point increases Hiyoshi gets in perspective). He beats Oshitari no matter what effect he chooses.
For a character who has never won a single match in the entire manga, that's ridiculous. The problem is that Gekokujou and Successor stack too well. Against any higher ranked 3rd year player, Hiyoshi is getting a 14 point boost (after factoring in Enbu Tennis as well). The two abilities are superfluous.

Minami and Higashitaka both have Sign Play as an effect. Does this mean the stronger opponents stats are cut by 75%? Otherwise it should only be listed on one of them.

Tanishi beats Chinen 100% of the time in the Fan League. Chinen beat Tanishi in the manga.

Just my two cents.

We're working on new Formations, so please wait a bit longer.

Sanada beats Yukimura only through PoD which is the same as in the manga as far as we know. I don't know how to simulate the rest of their match though, maybe Yukimura could get a Serious Mode that gives him some boost whenever the opponent got one.

A Feat for Oshitari? If you can a´think of something, feel free to let me know.

Ogre is pointless, we need to reword it, I agree with you there.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

Oshitari's Feat

[Feat] Sealed Heart
Any effect that would lower the user's stats is negated

Best I can come up with right now....will think of something when I get home from work....
[hr]
Was going through my 40.5 Databook and decided on a couple possible feats for Oshitari.

Sealed Heart [Feat]:
If the opponent would use an ability to negate Oshitari's effect, that ability is negated

(This ability in the manga essentially makes Oshitari unreadable as to his movements. I figure this represents his unreadability well enough)

All Out [Feat]:
If the opponent's final power stat is 10 or over, Oshitari's speed and power go up by 1.5 each
(I'm trying to incorporate when Oshitari decided to let his emotions rage and went all out on Momo. Best I could think of)

[javimgol]

I redid Inui a bit, what do you think of this version, I like it:

Inui (6, 4, 6, 9, 25) 30
Serve and Volley

-Gathering Data [Final Feat]:
(1) If Inui's stats were lowered by an effect and the final total of the opponent is higher than Inui's, Inui's control is boosted by 3 points.
(2) In Doubles, (1) activates regardless of whether the requirement is fulfilled, as long as his partner is a defensive baseliner.
(3) The player can choose to negate this Feat, in that case Super Training activates. (Singles only)

-Super Training [Feat]:
This Feat is negated unless it's triggered by Gathering Data's effect. Inui's Power, Control and Speed are boosted by 2 points each and Inui can activate either Rising Shot OR Jackknive.

-Data Tennis [Effect]:
Inui's Speed is boosted by 1 point and whenever an opponent would add points to any stat using a Feat or an Effect, only halve those points are added instead. This Effect is negated when Gathering Data was negated.

- Jack Knife [Effect]:
(1) Inui’s Power gets boosted by 5. If the opponent has a Spin stat of 7 or more, this effect is negated.
(2) The opponent’s Effects are nullified.
(3) This Effect cannot be activated other than through 'Super Training'.

-Rising Shot [Effect]:
(1) If the opponent uses an effect, that effect is negated and the opponent’s Speed drops by 3 points.
(2) This Effect cannot be activated other than through 'Super Training'.

-Waterfall [Effect]:
Inui’s Power is boosted by 2 points. If Inui or his team would tie with an opponent, they win instead.
<hr noshade size="1">


We're working on new Formations, so please wait a bit longer.

Sanada beats Yukimura only through PoD which is the same as in the manga as far as we know. I don't know how to simulate the rest of their match though, maybe Yukimura could get a Serious Mode that gives him some boost whenever the opponent got one.

A Feat for Oshitari? If you can a´think of something, feel free to let me know.

Ogre is pointless, we need to reword it, I agree with you there.
Your Inui is too good. The last Inui you made is far better
Please, make a Formation for Richard and Kadowaki. It's my one and only dream

[Kaoz]

Where is this Inui too strong? He just received a slight boost in Singles, the rest is pretty much the same as before. Also, he cost 30 points, it's not wrong to give him a bit more diversity.

@Sai I think both Feats are good, I'd implement either one.

[KuwabaraTheMan]

Hiyoshi is not overpowered. Sure, he can beat Fuji if Fuji gets things wrong...
But he loses versus Momo as well. Leave him as he is. It fits with the whole Gekkokujou philosophy. He can take down stronger opponents, but weaker opponents can take him down.

He wins against stronger players, but losers easily against players in the same level or even weaker. Even so, the list of players he can actually beat is short. Fuji is a surprise, I actually hadn't even thought of that.

Sure, it fits with the Gekkokujou 'philosophy', but in case you hadn't noticed, Hiyoshi himself doesn't fit with that philosophy. If there was even a single example of him rising up against a strong opponent, I would agree. But I think it's rather odd to let him advance 14 points simply because he claims that he tries to beat stronger opponents (and fails every single time). It would be like giving Kaidoh a feat that reads "Invincible [Feat]: Kaidoh automatically wins every match (Singles and Doubles)" based on the fact that Inui said Kaidoh was invincible.



Sanada beats Yukimura only through PoD which is the same as in the manga as far as we know. I don't know how to simulate the rest of their match though, maybe Yukimura could get a Serious Mode that gives him some boost whenever the opponent got one.

Well, my point was that it wasn't the same as in the manga. Yukimura still won that match.

A "Serious Mode" would make a lot of sense for Yukimura.

On another note, Kaidoh is gimped in Singles. He loses to Kamio right now.

[Kaoz]

There are two more chanes I'd like to suggest:
1. Shiraishi:

Ecstasy [Feat]
If Shiraishi faces an opponent that raises his own stats above 10 in total points, then Shiraishi's stats all go up by 1 point.

2. Silver Pair (Shishido to be specific):

Inducement Formation [Formation]:
This Formation can only be activated when Ootori is the partner. Any Standard Formation the other Pair uses is negated and the Speed of both opponent's drops by 5 points.
[hr]
Another one for Yukimura

Being Serious [Feat]:
Whenever the opponent surpasses Yukimura's total for the first time (this includes base totals), all of Yukimura's stats are boosted by 2.5 points. (Singles only)

[javimgol]

There are two more chanes I'd like to suggest:
1. Shiraishi:

Ecstasy [Feat]
If Shiraishi faces an opponent that raises his own stats above 10 in total points, then Shiraishi's stats all go up by 1 point.

2. Silver Pair (Shishido to be specific):

Inducement Formation [Formation]:
This Formation can only be activated when Ootori is the partner. Any Standard Formation the other Pair uses is negated and the Speed of both opponent's drops by 5 points.
<hr noshade size="1">
Another one for Yukimura

Being Serious [Feat]:
Whenever the opponent surpasses Yukimura's total for the first time (this includes base totals), all of Yukimura's stats are boosted by 2.5 points. (Singles only)
Now Shiraishi defeats Fuji? Just after my match VS you????
ARE YOU KIDDING ME???

[Sai_the_Shaman]

For Fuji, I've been meaning to give him a new feat or effect call Closed Eyes

That should be able to make him strong enough to beat Niou and Shiraishi again.

[javimgol]

For Fuji, I've been meaning to give him a new feat or effect call Closed Eyes

That should be able to make him strong enough to beat Niou and Shiraishi again.
I think that Prodigy includes that. Is not enough with the + 12 points of Hoshi Hanabi?

[Kaoz]

Fuji (5, 12, 6, 11, 34) 40
Defensive Baseliner

-Prodigy [Feat]:
Fuji’s stats cannot be decreased.

-Never-ending Evolution [Feat]:
When one of Fuji’s effects got negated, the opponent’s Spin is halved. In doubles this applies to the opponent who negated Fuji’s effect.

-Hecatonchires no Monban [Effect]:
(1) If the opponent’s playstyle is All-Rounder, his speed, strength, and control are all reduced by 2. (Singles only)
(2) If at least one opponent’s playstyle is All-Rounder, Fuji’s speed, strength, and control gets boosted by 1. (Doubles only)
(3) This effect cannot be copied by Muga no Kyouchi.

-Hoshi Hanabi [Effect]:
This Effect cannot be used. It triggers automatically once Hecatoncheiros is negated.Fuji's Spin is doubled. This Effect can neither be copied nor can it be negated.


Shirashi (9, 9, 9, 9, 36) 36
All-rounder

-Bible Tennis [Feat]:
All of the opponent’s effects are negated.

-Ecstasy [Feat]
If Shiraishi faces an opponent that raises his own stats above 10 in total points, then Shiraishi's stats all go up by 1 point.

-Entaku Shot [Effect]:
Shiraishi’s Spin is boosted by 5 points.


Let's get this over with, first Bible Tennis negates Hecatoncheires, triggering Hoshi Hanabi. That makes Fuji go up to 45. Ecstatsy activates and makes Shiraishi go up to 40 and Entaku Shot raises him to 45 as well. But wait, Fuji activates Never-ending Evolution before, which made Shiraishi's total drop by 4.5.

So, where does Shiraishi beat Fuji again?
Closed Eyes isn't necessary I think, or at least I can't think of something that makes sense.

[javimgol]

Fuji (5, 12, 6, 11, 34) 40
Defensive Baseliner

-Prodigy [Feat]:
Fuji’s stats cannot be decreased.

-Never-ending Evolution [Feat]:
When one of Fuji’s effects got negated, the opponent’s Spin is halved. In doubles this applies to the opponent who negated Fuji’s effect.

-Hecatonchires no Monban [Effect]:
(1) If the opponent’s playstyle is All-Rounder, his speed, strength, and control are all reduced by 2. (Singles only)
(2) If at least one opponent’s playstyle is All-Rounder, Fuji’s speed, strength, and control gets boosted by 1. (Doubles only)
(3) This effect cannot be copied by Muga no Kyouchi.

-Hoshi Hanabi [Effect]:
This Effect cannot be used. It triggers automatically once Hecatoncheiros is negated.Fuji's Spin is doubled. This Effect can neither be copied nor can it be negated.


Shirashi (9, 9, 9, 9, 36) 36
All-rounder

-Bible Tennis [Feat]:
All of the opponent’s effects are negated.

-Ecstasy [Feat]
If Shiraishi faces an opponent that raises his own stats above 10 in total points, then Shiraishi's stats all go up by 1 point.

-Entaku Shot [Effect]:
Shiraishi’s Spin is boosted by 5 points.


Let's get this over with, first Bible Tennis negates Hecatoncheires, triggering Hoshi Hanabi. That makes Fuji go up to 45. Ecstatsy activates and makes Shiraishi go up to 40 and Entaku Shot raises him to 45 as well. But wait, Fuji activates Never-ending Evolution before, which made Shiraishi's total drop by 4.5.

So, where does Shiraishi beat Fuji again?
Closed Eyes isn't necessary I think, or at least I can't think of something that makes sense.
I apologize. You are right. Activate that two feats

[Kaoz]

Eh, you don't have to apologize, I just tought showing you the match-up would make things clear faster.

[javimgol]

I think that Hoshi Hanabi should work VS more high level players, apart of Shiraishi and Niou (Niou can copy Feats, no?).I think that Hecatoncheiros should work VS everyone (is really great, and for an specific type of players it's still better Kirin, Ho-ho or Hakuryu) and Hoshi Hanabi as a regular effect VS all-rounders, or reverse.
Fuji have never used it in the New PoT, but the same goes to Zero Shiki Serve, In or PoP: the players have not been forced to use it. So I see it as just another awesome counter, not just a B Plan if Gatekeeper is negated

[Kaoz]

Yeah, but Hoshi Hanabi needs a cord ball to be used. That's what only Hecatoncheires can archieve.

[javimgol]

Yeah, but Hoshi Hanabi needs a cord ball to be used. That's what only Hecatoncheires can archieve. OK. So, I think it should be a [Final Effect];activated, apart of if Hecatoncheiros is negated, if the oponent have more Spin points (that's why they countered Hecatoncheiros), just to be useful more times
[hr]

Yeah, but Hoshi Hanabi needs a cord ball to be used. That's what only Hecatoncheires can archieve.
OK. So, I think it should be a [Final Effect];activated, apart of if Hecatoncheiros is negated, if the oponent have more Spin points (that's why they countered Hecatoncheiros), just to be useful more times

[Kaoz]

Hmm, I think if we did something about it, it'd be better to boost Hecatoncheires a bit and say that it's negated when the opponent has a Spin stat of X, this would then trigger Hoshi Hanabi.

[javimgol]

Hmm, I think if we did something about it, it'd be better to boost Hecatoncheires a bit and say that it's negated when the opponent has a Spin stat of X, this would then trigger Hoshi Hanabi.
I thought that, but the cancelation is also necessary, because in a Fuji VS Shiraishi, Shiraishi never reaches Fuji's Spin (9-4.5+5=9.5)
Hecatoncheiros is good, but Hoshi is simply better

[-Ken-]

Probably a bit late, but here's my thought on all the changes that was proposed when I'm busy doing my essay.

I agree that Hoshi Hanabi should have more activation, but it shouldn't be too easy to activate. Otherwise, it's just going to be Hoshi Hanabi auto-activate instead of Hechan everytimes.

In my opinion, Hiyoshi needed some downgrade, He got almost Samurai Drive power-buff. As far as I seen, he don't lose against Momo right now. They started off the same, Hiyoshi get 10 point buff. Momo decrease him by 3 and increase himself by 3. No points can be drop through effect, so dunk smash is useless. Spin will be higher than 7, so Jack Knife is also negate. It's too much of a benefit for character who cost only 1 less, I think. Compare and make him lose to someone who cost less than him, and that make more sense. Hiyoshi is more powerful to his cost than Momo and Kaidoh, as in he can fight off more people than those two. Maybe give him so negative effect if fight against lower base total or 1st year?

Sanada activating Rin+In+Rai seemed like overkill, I would totally Muga that every time. I don't mind In, but Rin seemed to good of an effect to activate with something else, maybe decrease the effect if activate with something else?

I still think World of Ice should negate effect in addition to these effect. The tech attack your blind spot, no effect you use can react to that (beside Tezuka Zone)

Bunta+Kaidoh are a bit confusing. The opponent needed to choose? That may make the match even longer because of some extra pm it might cause.

I'll leave Koharu to you guys, because even if I feel that the current version is good already, my opinion is super biased and might different if it's another player character because +-4 total cover a lot of characters. But I would like some to make up if it got nerf, through.

As for, Kenya.... Can he have at least skill (name) related to running on waterXD?, that was awesome.

I also agreed that Kaidoh should have Boomerang Snake.

On Oshitari, shouldn't Sealed Heart be VERY similar to Sanada In? It's the same concept and everything. I like all-out, but I think it should be something along the line like... defeat oshitari before... Might be hard to show that through.

I like Ecstasy and Inducement Formation.

Yukimura being serious skill is.... just weird. They all should be playing serious in a match anyway. Maybe add more condition to Pinnacle of Destruction to make it come up harder. Could even be similar to Gyro Laser/Snake if you really decided to add that skill.

I also still stand by that Pinnacle of Perfection shouldn't be able to be negated. Pinnacle of Perfection shouldn't be beaten by something like Pinnacle of Great Wisdom.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

Sanada activating Rin+In+Rai seemed like overkill, I would totally Muga that every time. I don't mind In, but Rin seemed to good of an effect to activate with something else, maybe decrease the effect if activate with something else?

I wouldn't be against taking away the secondary effect on Rin. Or at least putting a stipulation that Sanada can only activate a single other effect and can't chain them all.


I still think World of Ice should negate effect in addition to these effect. The tech attack your blind spot, no effect you use can react to that (beside Tezuka Zone)

I considered doing this, but thought it may make the effect too powerful. I'll leave it up to you guys.


Bunta+Kaidoh are a bit confusing. The opponent needed to choose? That may make the match even longer because of some extra pm it might cause.

I think it may take some getting used to and lengthen at first, but I think these are a truer representation of their abilities. Plus, in the last round we all seems to show a preference for more prediction like abilities (especially sherlock)


On Oshitari, shouldn't Sealed Heart be VERY similar to Sanada In? It's the same concept and everything. I like all-out, but I think it should be something along the line like... defeat oshitari before... Might be hard to show that through.

I considered doing this for Oshitari, but upon reading the description in the data book. it specifically states that it is to help make his movements unreadable. Plus I think this also helps to incorporate his aspect of being a master of 1000 moves and allows him to use his techniques freely without the opponent telling which one.

With Sanada, In sends out mixed signals to the opponent and specifically meant for countering predictions (Saiki).

I just sent another ton of things for chaos to take a look at to balance out. Mainly giving characters with no effect, an effect of some kind. I'll be working on making feats for feat less characters next.

[Kaoz]

Probably a bit late, but here's my thought on all the changes that was proposed when I'm busy doing my essay.

I agree that Hoshi Hanabi should have more activation, but it shouldn't be too easy to activate. Otherwise, it's just going to be Hoshi Hanabi auto-activate instead of Hechan everytimes.

Having a Spin of maybe 12 isn't easy, there won't be many characters that can do this I think, also Effect negation isn't that common either.


Sanada activating Rin+In+Rai seemed like overkill, I would totally Muga that every time. I don't mind In, but Rin seemed to good of an effect to activate with something else, maybe decrease the effect if activate with something else?

There should be a condition that only one more effect can be chained, I think.


I still think World of Ice should negate effect in addition to these effect. The tech attack your blind spot, no effect you use can react to that (beside Tezuka Zone)

Maybe, discuss please.


Bunta+Kaidoh are a bit confusing. The opponent needed to choose? That may make the match even longer because of some extra pm it might cause.

I can't see whether they would be confusing, let's make an example: You play vs me, so and I choose to activate Kaidoh's new effect. Now, I select one for Kaidoh to use. You on the other hand will simply choose one of the two abilities as well and include your guess into your pm, if they happen to match, the effect is negated, if not it activates.
I really don't see a problem with that.


As for, Kenya.... Can he have at least skill (name) related to running on waterXD?, that was awesome.

I refuse.


I also agreed that Kaidoh should have Boomerang Snake.

If you guys really want, he's my character, so I won't say too much to this.


On Oshitari, shouldn't Sealed Heart be VERY similar to Sanada In? It's the same concept and everything. I like all-out, but I think it should be something along the line like... defeat oshitari before... Might be hard to show that through.

I think both Feats read well and could both be implemented (I mean we really could but his cost would go up by quite a bit as well).


Yukimura being serious skill is.... just weird. They all should be playing serious in a match anyway. Maybe add more condition to Pinnacle of Destruction to make it come up harder. Could even be similar to Gyro Laser/Snake if you really decided to add that skill.

Why? After seeing Sanada's Aura, he beat him down like it was nothing, also he activated Yips (I assume he can choose the point of it's activation freely) against Echizen just when the latter released his Pinnacles. I think it would be fine canon wise.


I also still stand by that Pinnacle of Perfection shouldn't be able to be negated. Pinnacle of Perfection shouldn't be beaten by something like Pinnacle of Great Wisdom.

Oh, I thought I changed this... anyway I second your opinion here.


I just sent another ton of things for chaos to take a look at to balance out. Mainly giving characters with no effect, an effect of some kind. I'll be working on making feats for feat less characters next.

I'll have a look in a moment, I just wanted to post this now.

[KuwabaraTheMan]

What about with me? I have Momoshiro, who can copy all of Kaidoh's effects. Wouldn't all of my opponents all have to make a guess in case I chose that to copy with Rivalry?

And how do those effects work if Niou or someone chooses to copy them? What if Kabaji plays against Kaidoh?

[Kaoz]

Right, Rivalry can be a problem...
Damn Rivalry, let's just remove it or change it's text so I don't have to bother with it :p Seriously, I'll think of something.

About Kabaji, if he copies it, both players should be able to use it I think.
On Niou, have to think about that first.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

While the copiers do present a problem....I'd like to ask, what's the actual probability those techniques would get copied when their are much stronger ones available to be copied?

As for Rivalry, Just give Momo Tornado Snake and give Kaidou Dunk Smash. That's all they really copied off one another any how.

[Kaoz]

While the copiers do present a problem....I'd like to ask, what's the actual probability those techniques would get copied when their are much stronger ones available to be copied?

As for Rivalry, Just give Momo Tornado Snake and give Kaidou Dunk Smash. That's all they really copied off one another any how.

Sure, the propabilty of actually being copied is somewhere near zero, but we still have to cover it somehow.

I agree on Momo and Kaidoh.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

To Cover it will only take 2 more PMs than usual,

1) get both lineups.
2) if Marui or Kaidou is copied, the user should have already given you which they chose. PM the opponent and tell them they need to make their prediction (without telling the lineup, of course)
3) PM with prediction
4) run the scenario

[Kaoz]

Okay, so after editing them slightly I'm gonna show you the new Formations.

Before that, let's have a look at the character effects Sai proposes:

I further changed Genius also because I think his ability is way too strong for his level...especially since we have no idea why he is a genius. Hell, in the databook it lists a "?" as his special ability

Zaizen (6, 7, 6, 6, 25) 23
All-rounder

-Arrogance [Feat]:
When playing an opponent with lower base total, Zaizen’s Control and Power drop by 1 point each for every weaker opponent.

- Genius [Feat]:
If the opponent uses an Effect, it is added at 50%. If Zaizen plays doubles, this feat effects the player with the higher base total. Zaizen's stats are boosted by the 50% not gained by the opponent.

- Tactile Volley [Effect]
Zaizen's stats are boosted by 1.5 each. (by what we saw in the manga, I'm giving him his attempted volley from his "doubles" match)

-Pun Killer [Effect]:
If the opponent has a higher base total, they lose 0.5 points per stat and Amane gains +2 to his control.

-Surprise Attack [Effect]
The Opponent's control and speed stats drop by 0.5 each and Chinen's speed increases by 2.

-Drop Volley
Kaneda's Control and Spin are increased by 0.5 each.


Now the Formations (all Formations are covered as some changed a bit):

-Aggressive Formation [Formation]:
This Formation can only be used by a Serve and Volley player or an Aggressive Baseliner. When partnered with another Serve and Volley player or an Aggressive Baseliner, the team's total points are boosted by 5. If the match would end in a tie, this team loses instead.

-Defensive Formation [Formation]:
(1) This Formation can only be used by a Defensive Baseliner. When partnered with another Defensive Baseliner or an All-rounder, the opponent with the higher base total has his Power stat halved.

-Classic Formation [Formation]:
This Formation can only be used by an All-rounder. Players in this pair cannot have their Effects negated.

-No Formation - High Level [Formation]:
This Formation can only be used by two characters that both have a total of 20 or higher. The highest stat of each character is boosted by 4 points.

-Australian Formation [Formation]:
This formation can only be used by a pair that has a base total of 35 or more. When playing a pair with a higher base total, all stats of both players in this pair are boosted by 2 points.

-I-Formation [Formation]:
This Formation can only be used by a pair that has a support level of 3 or higher. This pair’s Effects cannot be negated. If one of the opponents would use an Effect that would cause a player to drop in a stat, that Effect is negated.

-Counter Punch Volley Formation [Formation]
This formation can only be used by a pair that has a base total of 25 or higher. This can only be used by a pair consisting of a Serve and Volleyer and a Defensive Baseliner. The Opposing pair both lose +3 to their control stats. The Defensive baseliner gains +3 to speed and the Serve and Volleyer gains +2 to control and +1 to spin.

-Counter Punch Power Formation [Formation]
This formation can only be used by a pair that a base total of 25 or higher. This can only be used by a pair consisting of an Aggressive Baseliner and a Defensive Baseliner. The Opposing pair both lose +3 to their control stats. The Defensive baseliner gains +3 to speed and the Aggressive Baseliner gains +3 to power.

-No Formation - Low Level [Formation]:
This Formation can only be used by two characters that both have a total of 15 or higher. The highest stat of each character is boosted by 2 points.

-Split Court Ah-Un Formation [Formation]
The players who use this formation both get +3 to their speed.

As usual, discuss please.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

For the formations, since it wasn't mentioned, they no longer require a tier level unless specifically stated.

However, canon pairs still get tier boosts. We've just separated the formations from being tied to tier levels.

[Kaoz]

Ah yes, forgot to mention it, thanks Sai.

[javimgol]

Okay, so after editing them slightly I'm gonna show you the new Formations.

Before that, let's have a look at the character effects Sai proposes:

I further changed Genius also because I think his ability is way too strong for his level...especially since we have no idea why he is a genius. Hell, in the databook it lists a "?" as his special ability

Zaizen (6, 7, 6, 6, 25) 23
All-rounder

-Arrogance [Feat]:
When playing an opponent with lower base total, Zaizen’s Control and Power drop by 1 point each for every weaker opponent.

- Genius [Feat]:
If the opponent uses an Effect, it is added at 50%. If Zaizen plays doubles, this feat effects the player with the higher base total. Zaizen's stats are boosted by the 50% not gained by the opponent.

- Tactile Volley [Effect]
Zaizen's stats are boosted by 1.5 each. (by what we saw in the manga, I'm giving him his attempted volley from his "doubles" match)

-Pun Killer [Effect]:
If the opponent has a higher base total, they lose 0.5 points per stat and Amane gains +2 to his control.

-Surprise Attack [Effect]
The Opponent's control and speed stats drop by 0.5 each and Chinen's speed increases by 2.

-Drop Volley
Kaneda's Control and Spin are increased by 0.5 each.


Now the Formations (all Formations are covered as some changed a bit):

-Aggressive Formation [Formation]:
This Formation can only be used by a Serve and Volley player or an Aggressive Baseliner. When partnered with another Serve and Volley player or an Aggressive Baseliner, the team's total points are boosted by 5. If the match would end in a tie, this team loses instead.

-Defensive Formation [Formation]:
(1) This Formation can only be used by a Defensive Baseliner. When partnered with another Defensive Baseliner or an All-rounder, the opponent with the higher base total has his Power stat halved.

-Classic Formation [Formation]:
This Formation can only be used by an All-rounder. Players in this pair cannot have their Effects negated.

-No Formation - High Level [Formation]:
This Formation can only be used by two characters that both have a total of 20 or higher. The highest stat of each character is boosted by 4 points.

-Australian Formation [Formation]:
This formation can only be used by a pair that has a base total of 35 or more. When playing a pair with a higher base total, all stats of both players in this pair are boosted by 2 points.

-I-Formation [Formation]:
This Formation can only be used by a pair that has a support level of 3 or higher. This pair’s Effects cannot be negated. If one of the opponents would use an Effect that would cause a player to drop in a stat, that Effect is negated.

-Counter Punch Volley Formation [Formation]
This formation can only be used by a pair that has a base total of 25 or higher. This can only be used by a pair consisting of a Serve and Volleyer and a Defensive Baseliner. The Opposing pair both lose +3 to their control stats. The Defensive baseliner gains +3 to speed and the Serve and Volleyer gains +2 to control and +1 to spin.

-Counter Punch Power Formation [Formation]
This formation can only be used by a pair that a base total of 25 or higher. This can only be used by a pair consisting of an Aggressive Baseliner and a Defensive Baseliner. The Opposing pair both lose +3 to their control stats. The Defensive baseliner gains +3 to speed and the Aggressive Baseliner gains +3 to power.

-No Formation - Low Level [Formation]:
This Formation can only be used by two characters that both have a total of 15 or higher. The highest stat of each character is boosted by 2 points.

-Split Court Ah-Un Formation [Formation]
The players who use this formation both get +3 to their speed.

As usual, discuss please.

Are you kidding me??Golden Pair can not use Australian Formation!!

[Kaoz]

Kikumaru can get Australian Formation added to his profile, without the requirement of course.

[javimgol]

Kikumaru can get Australian Formation added to his profile, without the requirement of course.
But could he use it alone (in Singles) AND paired with Oishi?

[Kaoz]

Hmm, maybe, expect his cost to go up though if we do that.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

Here's something I think we need to add to Kikumaru

-One Man Doubles [Effect]
This effect can only be used in Singles. Kikumaru becomes a one man tier level 2 team and is able to choose one formation to use regardless of its prerequisites.

[Kaoz]

I agree to most but I think he shouldn't be able to use Formations that require certain playstyles (as long as he doesn't fulfill it that is).
As I said though, his cost will go up.

[javimgol]

First of all:
I won't accept you just nerf Golden Pair 'cause you are bored
They are able to do Australian Formation, always.

Second: this is how Golden Pair should be, and not that crap (Oishi with 14 points after Feats, IN DOUBLES is the more offensive thing I ever seen)I have this year. I'll wait for next season to have them. They cost 10 points more, but they are far more accurate

TRUE GOLDEN PAIR
Oishi (2, 3, 3, 6, 14) 28
Defensive Baseliner

-Doubles Master [Feat]:
In Doubles, Oishi's Control increase 8 points, Power, Speed and Spin increase 1 point each.Also, the team can use any standard Formation regardless of that Formation’s conditions.

-Moon Volley [Effect]:
Oishi’s Control is boosted by 2 points.

-Oishi Territory [Formation]:
When partnered with a character that has a base Speed stat of 10 or higher, Oishi's Control get's boosted by 10 points.

-He can use Oishi Territory always with Kiku
-He got the same boost, 8 in one stat in Doubles as Jackal. The other 3 are to make him better in Doubles than Kikumaru

Kikumaru (4, 1, 10, 4, 19) 27
Serve and Volley

-Acrobatic Play [Feat]:
Kikumaru’s Speed is boosted by 2 points. Kikumaru’s Effects cannot be negated.

-Vision [Feat]:
The opponent’s Speed drops by 2 points.

-One Man Doubles [Feat]
Instead of Seal Step, Kikumaru can use Australian Formation or any Serve and Volley Formation. He is still consider a single player (he would only get boosted 8 points with Austrlian).

-Seal Step [Effect]:
Kikumaru’s Speed is boosted by 4 points.

2 points more, and Formation (pretty stupid, no one is going to make play in Singles, but it's more manga-like)

[Kaoz]

I disagree on Oishi's Doubles Master, I think his strength is more like allowing his partner to play at his best, so I'd rather boost Oishi's Speed, Control and his partner's highest stat or something.

[javimgol]

I disagree on Oishi's Doubles Master, I think his strength is more like allowing his partner to play at his best, so I'd rather boost Oishi's Speed, Control and his partner's highest stat or something.
It'would be logic if Kaneda or Sakurai wouldn't get a 8 points boost beacuse they are Tacticians

[Kaoz]

I think there's a difference, Kaneda didn't really make Akazawa stronger, he himself grew in that match. Oishi on the other hand allows Kikumaru to do all his acrobaics wothout having to worry too much.
Oishi can read the flow of the game very well, that's the reason for hom going up in Control and Speed. The rest of his abilities are covered by boosting his partner.

[javimgol]

I think there's a difference, Kaneda didn't really make Akazawa stronger, he himself grew in that match. Oishi on the other hand allows Kikumaru to do all his acrobaics wothout having to worry too much.
Oishi can read the flow of the game very well, that's the reason for hom going up in Control and Speed. The rest of his abilities are covered by boosting his partner.
If the total boost in his Feat is 11 points, 3 points more than the other 3 Doubles Experts (Jackal,Sakurai and Kaneda), you can distribute the points in the way you want (Control, Speed and partner).
But remember, this is for next season

In this season, Australian Formation in Golden Pair is Non-negotiable, so reduce the limit points to 30 to activate it (Current Golden Pair has 12+19=31)

[Kaoz]

You know, as it won't really represent much, we thought about implementing all changes next season.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

lol chaos, now you see why I originally had the points for Australian formation lower XD

Anyhow, I'm for just lowering it to 30, makes sense to.

and yeah these are all changes for next season.

[Jyten]

lol chaos, now you see why I originally had the points for Australian formation lower XD

Anyhow, I'm for just lowering it to 30, makes sense to.

and yeah these are all changes for next season.

Sorry again for being on the forums for a bit. It'll take me a little while to go through all this but I should have it looked at sometime tomorrow night.

[Kaoz]

I edited my first post, so that all suggestions for changes are shown, please discuss.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

Just want to make a note that all those suggested changes include stuff I've been working on for chaos.

Feats for formerly featless characters
Effect for formerly effectless characters
special pairs for non canon doubles teams that I think make sense
various other things.

[Sherlock Holmes]

I should probably note that Billy has no Feat. English is just a random feat we gave him for fun.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

I think Billy's random feat suits him. If you want though, I'll go rewatch his anime eps and come up with one.

[javimgol]

1)If Oishi will cost 28 points, use the version I made. Yours doesn't deserve even 22 or 23 points. Why don't you use the version I made????
2)Kaneda still doesn't have an effect. Drop Volley is a joke
3) Silent Killer is simply too good!!!!Even Old Shinji was broken: he ties with Kajimoto, who costs 3, THREE, points more. And both are singles player
4) Reiji and Kajimoto needs a boost.A very good boost. They are far worse than the other players who cost the same
5) I prefer All Out than Poker Face. It's more useful
6) Ecstasy should be better. Just one point per stat is too low...Look at the match: Shiraishi really was happier than ever when he begun to face the Evolved Counters
7) New Zaizen is even better than the old one,who was broken
8)Delete Kikumaru's One Man Doubles Effect and KEEP the Feat
9) Why not Sanada + Atobe as Special Pair with
Hametsu e no Tango [Effect]
If the combined Speed of both opponents is below 20, their effects are cancelled. Atobe and Sanada's Power increase 5 points each

,like in the filler? That was great

[Kaoz]

1)If Oishi will cost 28 points, use the version I made. Yours doesn't deserve even 22 or 23 points. Why don't you use the version I made????
2)Kaneda still doesn't have an effect. Drop Volley is a joke
3) Silent Killer is simply too good!!!!Even Old Shinji was broken: he ties with Kajimoto, who costs 3, THREE, points more. And both are singles player
4) Reiji and Kajimoto needs a boost.A very good boost. They are far worse than the other players who cost the same
5) I prefer All Out than Poker Face. It's more useful
6) Ecstasy should be better. Just one point per stat is too low...Look at the match: Shiraishi really was happier than ever when he begun to face the Evolved Counters
7) New Zaizen is even better than the old one,who was broken
8)Delete Kikumaru's One Man Doubles Effect and KEEP the Feat
9) Why not Sanada + Atobe as Special Pair with
Hametsu e no Tango [Effect]
If the combined Speed of both opponents is below 20, their effects are cancelled. Atobe and Sanada's Power increase 5 points each

,like in the filler? That was great

1) Oishi provides a total of 23 points in doubles (Moon Vooley gives +5, forgot to edit), 28 points is m very accurate, I feel. Another character that costs 28 points is Akutsu who has the same viability in Singles as Oishi has in in Doubles. Also, I said that the costs and base totals might change, read carefully please.

2) He costs only 6 points and is a more than decent character, be happy that he got a feat.

3) Again, I'm aware of this, if Shinji would get this feat, his base stats would drop by maybe 4-5 points.

6) The condition for it's activation is very simple, the maximum boost there is, is 1.5 no more.

7) Genius got toned down by 50%, his Volley should provide a lower boost though, maybe .5 per stat.

8) One mad doubles a feat? It's obviously a technique, I even implemented a Speed boost. If anything the Effect is stronger than the Feat.

9) I'll add it to suggestions.

[Sherlock Holmes]

I think Billy's random feat suits him. If you want though, I'll go rewatch his anime eps and come up with one.
I think it suits him too, it's just that it's literally useless in the league XD. The only player it would affect would be Krauser, and he would lose v Krauser anyway.

[javimgol]

1) Oishi provides a total of 23 points in doubles (Moon Vooley gives +5, forgot to edit), 28 points is m very accurate, I feel. Another character that costs 28 points is Akutsu who has the same viability in Singles as Oishi has in in Doubles. Also, I said that the costs and base totals might change, read carefully please.

2) He costs only 6 points and is a more than decent character, be happy that he got a feat.

3) Again, I'm aware of this, if Shinji would get this feat, his base stats would drop by maybe 4-5 points.

6) The condition for it's activation is very simple, the maximum boost there is, is 1.5 no more.

7) Genius got toned down by 50%, his Volley should provide a lower boost though, maybe .5 per stat.

8) One mad doubles a feat? It's obviously a technique, I even implemented a Speed boost. If anything the Effect is stronger than the Feat.

9) I'll add it to suggestions.

1)MOON VOLLEY AND WHATEVER FORMATION IS USELESS, BECAUSE GOLDEN PAIR WILL USE SYNCHRO+AUSTRALIAN.That's why the + 11 total + the use of any formation should be in THE FEAT. Why you never accept any change I propose??
7)Genius (Feat)+ Volley (Effect) will give more points to Zaizen that just with the old Genius.
8) Ok, transform the Feat One Man Doubles to an Effect or Aura, and delete the current One Man Doubles Effect

[Sai_the_Shaman]

Just a note on all those effect jav

Those were all taking into account that we would probably be adjusting costs and base stats of characters who became too broken. For now, I was just coming up with effects and feats for characters who lacked them. (all with my handy dandy databooks ^^)
[hr]

I think it suits him too, it's just that it's literally useless in the league XD. The only player it would affect would be Krauser, and he would lose v Krauser anyway.

This is true. Hmmm I am somewhat tempted to make you a Michael Lee so your Billy could have a partner in Doubles.

I'll go rewatch those eps tonight and see about getting you a more practical feat for billy.

[Sherlock Holmes]

Just a note on all those effect jav

Those were all taking into account that we would probably be adjusting costs and base stats of characters who became too broken. For now, I was just coming up with effects and feats for characters who lacked them. (all with my handy dandy databooks ^^)
<hr noshade size="1">


This is true. Hmmm I am somewhat tempted to make you a Michael Lee so your Billy could have a partner in Doubles.

I'll go rewatch those eps tonight and see about getting you a more practical feat for billy.

Haha, that would be great. If you can make a Michael Lee, make him cost as much as Yuuta and Kai combined and I'll trade them in to get Lee XD.

[Kaoz]

1)MOON VOLLEY AND WHATEVER FORMATION IS USELESS, BECAUSE GOLDEN PAIR WILL USE SYNCHRO+AUSTRALIAN.That's why the + 11 total + the use of any formation should be in THE FEAT. Why you never accept any change I propose??
7)Genius (Feat)+ Volley (Effect) will give more points to Zaizen that just with the old Genius.
8) Ok, transform the Feat One Man Doubles to an Effect or Aura, and delete the current One Man Doubles Effect

Even if the Formation is allowed in a Feat, a Pair can only use one Formation per match. Toning down Australian Formation would be an option here.
Also, it's not true that I never accept your proposals, I just change them slightly the way I think they fit best into the scheme. Naturally I decline some as well but I decline some of Sai's suggestions or change them just as well as with Jyten. On the other hand, you guys won't approve some of my suggestions either, I don't see a problem here.

[javimgol]

I only want to let clear than, to boost Golden Pair (costing 10 points more, of course), the only change neccesary is to boost a lot Oishi's Double Master Feat, mostly because the current one is almost offensive. Why 11 points of total increase? Well, I think it's fair than Oishi will get a Doubles Bonus 3 points more than Kaneda.

And why to boost Golden Pair? Because the Number 1 Pair of Japan will almost lost VS any random pair, from Hitouji+someone of mid-high tier or Tezuka + any mid-high tier. I'm even not sure if Champion Pair will destroy it, when in the manga,in Synchro, they completely overwhelmed them.

Yeah, I'm pretty stubborn. But in the same way Sherlock fights to get a proper Niou, his favourite player, I want to do the same with 2 of my favourite players, And this is a FAN League (just look at Zaizen :p)

And I'm pissed than have I have suggested a lot of issues in this 27 pages and really very few (actually, I can not remember any one)have been used.And except my wet dream Richard-Kadowaki, the rest have been logical

Why isn't so complicated to accept this Oishi?

Oishi (2, 3, 3, 6, 14) 28
Defensive Baseliner

-Doubles Master [Feat]:
In Doubles, Oishi's Control increase 4 points, Power, Speed and Spin increase 1 point each. The partner's highest stat increase 4 points.Also, the team can use any standard Formation regardless of that Formation’s conditions.

-Moon Volley [Effect]:
Oishi’s Control is boosted by 2 points.

-Oishi Territory [Formation]:
When partnered with a character that has a base Speed stat of 10 or higher, Oishi's Control get's boosted by 10 points.

[Kaoz]

If you shift the stat boost for Doubles Master around, so that only Control and Speed are boosted (I can explain why if you want) and they need to fulfill the playstyle requirements for Formations, this one's fine.
Also, I can't see why the requirement for Oishi Territory can't be Speed=12, Kikumaru fulfills this once Feats are included.
Heck, I would even give Moon Volley a +5 boost and increase his base stats a bit.

We'll only have to talk about costs later (which I can also elaborate for GP if you want).

[-Ken-]

For the feat, can I ask Echizen to get some semi-useful feat? His feat against Ryoga is useless 99% of the time, and double loser is the worst feat in the entire league, especially with the new change.

If it's for next season, I think Kin-chan deserve some kind of a boost in both cost and ability. He showed the evolution of 'new' tech with hitting 5 at the same time right?

[Sai_the_Shaman]

For the feat, can I ask Echizen to get some semi-useful feat? His feat against Ryoga is useless 99% of the time, and double loser is the worst feat in the entire league, especially with the new change.

If it's for next season, I think Kin-chan deserve some kind of a boost in both cost and ability. He showed the evolution of 'new' tech with hitting 5 at the same time right?

Hmmm...I could probably come up with a few for Ryoma and Kintarou when I get home later. At least something to match their new found 5 balls at once stuff...
[hr]
Here you go Sherlock. A Billy with a feat that does something and a Michael Lee. Though I think I may have made Lee a bit too strong. Chaos, you can adjust however you want...

Billy Cassidy (4,5,4,7, 20) 12
Serve and Volley

-English[Feat]
When playing against a character who has English as his first language, Billy gets boosted by 5 points(Singles only)

-Quick Draw [Feat]
Should the opponent use an ability to boost their speed, Billy boosts his own speed by 3

-Bull Rope Serve[Effect]:
Billy's Spin is increased by 3 and his stats cannot be decreased by effects when playing singles. (Singles only)

-Shotgun Volley[Opening Effect]:
Billy Control is increased by 3 and the stronger opponent's effect is canceled when playing doubles. (Doubles only)


Michael Lee (3, 6, 3, 6, 18) 11
All-rounder

-Kung Fu Reflexes [Feat]:
Michael's speed and power go up by 1.5

-Analyze [Feat]:
If the opponent uses an effect which boosts his control, Michael's control goes up by 2.

-Invisible Swing [Effect]:
The opponent's control goes down by 3

[Sherlock Holmes]

hmm, that sounds good...Though Michael Lee is only marginally better than Kai. No need to worry about him being overpowered.
What pair level would they be?

[Sai_the_Shaman]

I would make them a level 2 at best, if you were to count Sanada/Atobe as a Level 1

[Sherlock Holmes]

Kai (5, 4, 5, 4, 18) 7
Aggressive Baseliner

-Shukuchihou [Feat]:
Kai’s Speed is boosted by 3 points.

-Viking Horn [Effect]:
Kai’s Spin is boosted by 4 points in Singles and 2 points in Doubles.


See? Kai can reach 25 points while costing 4 points less. Michael is anything but overpowered. Kai would beat him in singles.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

Also, I didn't give him more stats, since I was taking into account his doubles boost and such. You knwo, since he is mainly a doubles player...

[Sherlock Holmes]

Uh shouldn't he get a doubles feat then?

[Sai_the_Shaman]

Michael Lee (3, 7, 3, 7, 20) 11
All-rounder

-Kung Fu Reflexes [Feat]:
Michael's speed and power go up by 3

-Analyze [Feat]:
If the opponent uses an effect which boosts his control, Michael's control goes up by 2.

-Invisible Swing [Effect]:
The opponent's control goes down by 3

How's that then?

I was taking the boost he gets from the tier boost and formations with the current system ^^

This one should be better though.

[Sherlock Holmes]

Yeah, that one looks great. I can definitely give Kai and Yuuta to get him.

[Kaoz]

Billy Cassidy (4,5,4,7, 20) 12
Serve and Volley

-English[Feat]
When playing against a character who has English as his first language, Billy gets boosted by 5 points(Singles only)

-Quick Draw [Feat]
Should the opponent use an ability to boost their speed, Billy boosts his own speed by 3

-Bull Rope Serve[Effect]:
Billy's Spin is increased by 3 and his stats cannot be decreased by effects when playing singles. (Singles only)

-Shotgun Volley[Opening Effect]:
Billy Control is increased by 3 and the stronger opponent's effect is canceled when playing doubles. (Doubles only)


Michael Lee (3, 7, 3, 7, 20) 11
All-rounder

-Kung Fu Reflexes [Feat]:
Michael's speed and power go up by 3

-Analyze [Feat]:
If the opponent uses an effect which boosts his control, Michael's control goes up by 2.

-Invisible Swing [Effect]:
The opponent's control goes down by 3

How's that then?

I was taking the boost he gets from the tier boost and formations with the current system ^^

This one should be better though.

I think Billy got a tiny little bit too strong, I would like to lower his Spin by 1 point.
On Michael, he is a bit strong as well, I think. The bonus provided by Kung Fu Reflex should be only 2 points per stat, alternatively I would drop his base total by 2, your call.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

So Modified then, this is more to your liking?

Billy Cassidy (3,5,4,7, 19) 12
Serve and Volley

-English[Feat]
When playing against a character who has English as his first language, Billy gets boosted by 5 points(Singles only)

-Quick Draw [Feat]
Should the opponent use an ability to boost their speed, Billy boosts his own speed by 3

-Bull Rope Serve[Effect]:
Billy's Spin is increased by 3 and his stats cannot be decreased by effects when playing singles. (Singles only)

-Shotgun Volley[Opening Effect]:
Billy's Control is increased by 3 and the stronger opponent's effect is canceled when playing doubles. (Doubles only)


Michael Lee (3, 7, 3, 7, 20) 11
All-rounder

-Kung Fu Reflexes [Feat]:
Michael's speed and power go up by 2 each

-Analyze [Feat]:
If the opponent uses an effect which boosts his control, Michael's control goes up by 2.

-Invisible Swing [Effect]:
The opponent's control goes down by 3

[Kaoz]

Yes, I'd accept that, I'll include it into suggestions.

[javimgol]

So Modified then, this is more to your liking?

Billy Cassidy (3,5,4,7, 19) 12
Serve and Volley

-English[Feat]
When playing against a character who has English as his first language, Billy gets boosted by 5 points(Singles only)

-Quick Draw [Feat]
Should the opponent use an ability to boost their speed, Billy boosts his own speed by 3

-Bull Rope Serve[Effect]:
Billy's Spin is increased by 3 and his stats cannot be decreased by effects when playing singles. (Singles only)

-Shotgun Volley[Opening Effect]:
Billy's Control is increased by 3 and the stronger opponent's effect is canceled when playing doubles. (Doubles only)


Michael Lee (3, 7, 3, 7, 20) 11
All-rounder

-Kung Fu Reflexes [Feat]:
Michael's speed and power go up by 2 each

-Analyze [Feat]:
If the opponent uses an effect which boosts his control, Michael's control goes up by 2.

-Invisible Swing [Effect]:
The opponent's control goes down by 3

Michael Lee will defeat Kajimoto, who cost FIVE, 5 points more
Reiji and Kajimoto needs a boost

Ryoma DOES NOT need a boost. If he receives one, it will be welcome (it's my Number One target next Season, 'cause I can not simply dare to choose Atobe or Niou, my other 2 favourite singles players). But right now, he will defeat Oni AND Irie,w ho cost 3 to 5 points more than him.
Kin-chan needs a boost. But costing more points, too. I'm pretty sure that, at this moment of the manga, he is the best of PoT after Big Four, Ryoma and Yuki

[Sai_the_Shaman]

we'll probably just lower the cost of kajimoto and reiji.

I believe in upping Kintarou's cost and abilities as well. I'll be working on that next ^^

I'm in the process of boosting Oni and revamping Irie completely.

[Kaoz]

Neither Kajimoto nor Reiji will get a boost, I'll make their cost drop instead.

On Ryoma, in the end he will be the strongest character, we can't avoid that. His cost will raise as well of course.

[-Ken-]

So how much character can we keep next season? I liked Ryoma and will keep him if possible, but I surely like Kin-chan more.

[Kaoz]

I think two characters.

[Sherlock Holmes]

I'd like to request a small change to Wakato. Currently, if playing against an all-arounder, he will never be able to get any bonuses, even if I predict everything correctly.

Can you add a playing style named "Reckless"?

Reckless has advantage over All Arounder, but disadvantage over all the other playing styles. It's just that All-Around is the most common playstyle in the league, and if Wakato can't even touch them, it makes his ability a little...Yeah.

If you want to make it even more risky, make him auto-lose vs anything other than all-arounders if he uses reckless.

[Kaoz]

Cut it out with that auto-loss crap. I think that'd be ok, but under a different name.

[Sherlock Holmes]

B-But I like risk! I LIKE RISK DAMMIT!

Okay, then how about...uh...All Around Killer? Counter Puncher?

[Kaoz]

I'll think of a name... AND I DON'T CARE WHETHER YOU LIKE RISK!

[KuwabaraTheMan]

Wakato is already plenty useful, though. The point of all arounders is that they don't have a natural weakness to their playstyle. I think the current way Wakato works is just fine.

[Kaoz]

Hmm, there are arguments for both sides, so I'll hear out some more opinions on the matter, I suppose.

[Sherlock Holmes]

In the anime, Wakato's point was that he could counter everything. Even against all arounders, he had other all arounder players he could copy who just had different styles.

How about "Trickster" as a play style? +3 to all his stats vs All Arounders, -1.5 vs everything else.

...AND I REALLY LIKE THE RISK.

[Kaoz]

I think I'd rather name it 'Constant Adaption' or something.

[Sherlock Holmes]

Yeah, that sounds better than Trickster.

[javimgol]

So how much character can we keep next season? I liked Ryoma and will keep him if possible, but I surely like Kin-chan more.
We commented (nothing is decided yet)that for next season every user could keep two players of his current team. I posted that I'd like Golden Pair, if that happens, beacuse I love them and also in the league are pretty good. If you want to keep Koshimae and/or Kin-chan (and you have all the rights to do that), nobody could take them.

About Kajimoto: I don't care. It's a character only useful if the user is Sherlock (same goes to Mizuki and Niou, every one except him won't use them at 100%).

[Sherlock Holmes]

We commented (nothing is decided yet)that for next season every user could keep two players of his current team. I posted that I'd like Golden Pair, if that happens, beacuse I love them and also in the league are pretty good. If you want to keep Koshimae and/or Kin-chan (and you have all the rights to do that), nobody could take them.

About Kajimoto: I don't care. It's a character only useful if the user is Sherlock (same goes to Mizuki and Niou, every one except him won't use them at 100%).

Mizuki,Niou, and Wakato.
...By the way, any chance you'd trade Kajimoto+Shiraishi for English Pair? Haha.

[-Ken-]

Mizuki cost can easily be 30+ Should at least be 25, minimum.

Mizuki could be a useful character no matter who use him. I think. But I got to admit I didn't expect 2 gay pair guess.

[Kaoz]

You might have when you had seen last season...

[javimgol]

IMAO Kajimoto should be better:
He was invited to the camp VS American Team

Kajimoto (6, 4, 4, 8, 22) 15
All-rounder

-A Captain’s Pride [Opening Feat]:
If Kajimoto is lower than 1-3 levels of his opponent and his team has lost 1-2 matches it’s an automatic tie.

-MILF Coach Training [Feat]
If Kajimoto's base Power is lower than his rival, Kajimoto's Power get boosted until reach oponent's Power

-L-Doru Serve [Effect]:
Kajimoto’s Power is boosted by 4 points, his Control is boosted by 2 points.

About Reiji? Reduce his points to 13 or 12

[Kaoz]

Yeah, anime Kajimoto maybe but manga Kajimoto lost to Kiraku.

[javimgol]

Yeah, anime Kajimoto maybe but manga Kajimoto lost to Kiraku.
And manga Kevin, Billy or Lee don't exist

[Kaoz]

They were only created due to a lack of characters, Kajimoto on the other hand was displayed in the manga and we use the manga as a standard as far as it's possible.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

I'll have to second that I don't think Kajimoto needs to be made stronger. For the most part, this league is made up of the manga canon characters. The only reason Jousei Shounan and the US Selection Team are in is because of a lack of other characters in that level.

In the manga, Jousei Shounan is pretty much destroyed by Midoriyama who were in turn dominated by Seigaku (half their matches weren't even shown in the manga). Furthermore, discounting the OVAs, most of the anime counterparts of the canon characters seems to be much weaker than their manga counterparts (Like Sanada....). Given that, I don't think Kajimoto would really stand a chance against most of the manga characters anyhow.

[-Ken-]

I don't know much about anime, but if 3 of the US teams are here, why not add the whole team? It wouldn't be a bad idea would it?

One more character I would like to see is Nanjirou, we see more of his tech than Zaizen, and Zaizen is in.

Oh, and also Matsudaira.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

Kevin was originally the only character.

Billy was made cause Sherlock wanted a Joke character with his ton of left over points.

Michael I made just to give Billy his doubles partner.

Nanjirou is a defintie no simply because I think he would be too overpowered. I means at minimum he gets 15 to all stats and and is pretty much instant win against anyone.

Matsudaira I could make, but he would be low tier.

[Kaoz]

15? Nanjirou would easily have 30 in all stats with some really neat effects... we can add him at a cost of 200 if you want.

[Sherlock Holmes]

Just make him cost 100 and have an effect of auto win lol.

Something like this:

Echizen Nanjiroh
(30,30,30,30,120)
The King of Tennis[Feat]
All non-echizens have their effects negated

Broken Mc.Brokerson[Effect]
Nanjiroh automatically wins the match.

[Bowser]

I know your plans Sherlock. You plan onto using that effect to make Niou win his matches...

[Sherlock Holmes]

Well it was worth a shot!

[KuwabaraTheMan]

You didn't really think you were going to be able to slip that one past everyone, did you?

[Kaoz]

You guys didn't think I would make Nanjiroh in the first place, did you?

[-Ken-]

Well, I think cost 100-120 is quite reasonable, the rest of the team would pretty much suck. It would just be a 'decoration' character to complete the league. Ryoga is pretty bad for his cost, right?

[Kaoz]

I know your plans Sherlock. You plan onto using that effect to make Niou win his matches...

This.

[javimgol]

New Golden Pair costs 13 points more , and get 12 points more (with Australain they will reach 102).
Do you call that a boost? I call it a Swindle
A lot of players have been boosted, but the cost is the same
Make Oishi's 28, and Kiku 27. The boost of Kiku is useless (Kiku in Singles it's not a clever move, it's stupid when you have an auto-win) and Oishi is far worse that Marui, who costs the same. Keep the rest of things.

[-Ken-]

On the cost/ability wise, Hiyoshi is too strong for his cost, for the reason I stated before. He wouldn't really 'lose' against lower cost player, and the same cost player can beat him. But he can pull a win against MANY higher cost player. Make him got some negative effect when facing lower cost/1st year, but decrease the buff. But 14 point increase is almost samurai drive.

On Nanjirou, the simple 'cannot be copied' will fix that.

[Kaoz]

I already said that I will adjust the cost and base totals of various players when the time comes and we agreed upon a moveset.

Also GP is technically seen he Ryoga of Doubles, as they take two slots, they cost slightly less. I think that sonds logical.

[javimgol]

On the cost/ability wise, Hiyoshi is too strong for his cost, for the reason I stated before. He wouldn't really 'lose' against lower cost player, and the same cost player can beat him. But he can pull a win against MANY higher cost player. Make him got some negative effect when facing lower cost/1st year, but decrease the buff. But 14 point increase is almost samurai drive.

On Nanjirou, the simple 'cannot be copied' will fix that.
I agree at all about Hiyoshi. GP will be discussed later
Isn't new Saeki too good?New Analyze is wonderful

Another thing: every pair, even if they are not Level 1, 2...,could any Formation, except I Formation?The Level required isn't stated

[Bowser]

His second step was to make another bet to win some character and do what he did the first time. Am I right Sherlock?

[Kaoz]

I agree at all about Hiyoshi. GP will be discussed later
Isn't new Saeki too good?New Analyze is wonderful

Another thing: every pair, even if they are not Level 1, 2...,could any Formation, except I Formation?The Level required isn't stated

Saeki's points will go up as well, I think. Also, keep in mind that these changes are all aplied next season.

[-Ken-]

Chaos, would you mind adding Echizen with cannot be negate Pinnacle of Perfection to the first page?

I don't think I would take gay pair next season, so the change I'm suggesting wouldn't really affect me, but how about

Koharu
High IQ [Final Feat]:
If an oppenent's within 4 base level of Koharu, if their effect would add/drop less points than 5 points in total, that effect is negate.

It won't feel as nerfed, but surely less strong than the current version. It just something I thought of, it's pretty hard to represent afterall. It just my version to show that if effect is too powerful, Koharu can't do anything.

Oh, and I also propose a nerf on Rin Giant Habu. Something like, if opponent use a move that decrease the spin by any amount, this effect is negate. Reason behind it is Fuji 4th counter, that's all.

Fuji should just have his 4th counter for the sake of finishing his move. It's just one more move, make it carefully and it woulnd't be broken, and it will complete his character

[Sai_the_Shaman]

For Kagerou Zutsumi is should basically be a counter for speed characters.

Kagerou Zutsumi [Effect]:
If a character has a base speed of 5 or higher, then Fuji's spin is increased by 5 and the opponents speed is dropped by 3. If the opponent would increase his speed through an effect, that effect is negated.

Change the numbers if you like, but that should be how Kagerou Zutsumi should work.

[-Ken-]

For Kagerou Zutsumi is should basically be a counter for speed characters.

Kagerou Zutsumi [Effect]:
If a character has a base speed of 5 or higher, then Fuji's spin is increased by 5 and the opponents speed is dropped by 3. If the opponent would increase his speed through an effect, that effect is negated.

Change the numbers if you like, but that should be how Kagerou Zutsumi should work.

I like it, but I think it should be spin instead of speed? Because it nullified the spin, right?

[Sai_the_Shaman]

It's odd how kagerou zutsumi works. Yes it nullifies spin, but its main purpose is to be used against characters that can catch up to to Triple counters. It tricks the opponent into thinking the ball is just out of reach so they can't return it.

[KuwabaraTheMan]

5 is a pretty low number for it to trigger. I understand that's Rin's base speed, but that seems kind of overpowered as every character in Fuji's range has a speed at that level.

What about instead of 'base speed of 5' it's 'speed of 8 or higher'? That would still work against Rin (since Shukuchihou is a feat), but it wouldn't be a guarantee against anyone in Fuji's class.

[-Ken-]

Then I can understand the first part, but the second part should be trigger on spin, through. It's clearly note on spin in the manga, so I think it should be mention somewhere in its ability.

[Sherlock Holmes]

maybe something like "If the word spin is mentioned in the effect, the effect is negated"

[KuwabaraTheMan]

maybe something like "If the word spin is mentioned in the effect, the effect is negated"

That would be way too broken. It would negate Black Jack Knife, Samurai Drive, Zero Shiki, Tezuka Zone and a whole bunch of other effects. There are a lot of effectss which mention spin, either to increase it, decrease the opponent's, check the opponent's spin, etc.

[javimgol]

That would be way too broken. It would negate Black Jack Knife, Samurai Drive, Zero Shiki, Tezuka Zone and a whole bunch of other effects. There are a lot of effectss which mention spin, either to increase it, decrease the opponent's, check the opponent's spin, etc.

But this is in fact what KZutsumi does. It's really a very good counter. The only problem was that Shiraishi destroyed it very easily. How destroyed Fuji the Niou-Tezuka's TPhantom and Tzone? I don't remember (or I don't want, poor Niou:darn) exactly

[-Ken-]

The thing I see with 4th counter is that it return the ball WITHOUT any spin. Therefore, it's not hard to return the ball without any spin at all. That's why player of Shirashi level can return it so easily.

Make it only affect the move which increase the spin instead of having spin mention through. It nullified the spin, that's all it does.
[hr]
Either Echizen or Oni need a nerf/buff. Oni is confirmed to return 10 ball at once, Samurai drive 2 ball won't be a problem, even through it's half a ball. He's probably skill enough to return it. This change should be for next season through...

[KuwabaraTheMan]

Yes, make Oni better.

From the latest Pair Puri:

"I was supposed to go up against Niou-san in the Kantou Tournament. If we had a match, he would have been fodder for me, the vanguard killer! (Uchimura)"

I hereby propose that immediately for the duration of this season, all of Uchimura's stats be made to be Niou's + 1.

Guys? Anyone? Who is with me?

[Sherlock Holmes]

Yes, make Oni better.

From the latest Pair Puri:

"I was supposed to go up against Niou-san in the Kantou Tournament. If we had a match, he would have been fodder for me, the vanguard killer! (Uchimura)"

I hereby propose that immediately for the duration of this season, all of Uchimura's stats be made to be Niou's + 1.

Guys? Anyone? Who is with me?
Hmm....

Illusion might even be one of the doors of Muga.

15:30~Tennis club. Becomes Yukimura with his Illusion
Agreed, but Niou must become=Yukimura.

[Kaoz]

Yes, make Oni better.

From the latest Pair Puri:

"I was supposed to go up against Niou-san in the Kantou Tournament. If we had a match, he would have been fodder for me, the vanguard killer! (Uchimura)"

I hereby propose that immediately for the duration of this season, all of Uchimura's stats be made to be Niou's + 1.

Guys? Anyone? Who is with me?


Hmm....


Agreed, but Niou must become=Yukimura.

No and No.
[hr]
Oni's new Feat(?):

Gatekeeper of Hell [Feat]
If the opponent is in a court lower than Oni, Oni's Power is boosted by 3 points.

[javimgol]

No and No.
<hr noshade size="1">
Oni's new Feat(?):

Gatekeeper of Hell [Feat]
If the opponent is in a court lower than Oni, Oni's Power is boosted by 3 points.

I don't know how, but Oni and Irie need new Feats

[Sherlock Holmes]

Irie doesn't. At all. His is useful. Oni's is not.

[javimgol]

Irie doesn't. At all. His is useful. Oni's is not.
Ryoma (and Nioh being Ryoma:p) win in the Leagur VS both Irie and Oni. That's not realistic

[Sherlock Holmes]

We don't know how strong Irie is, and Oni had to go all out to beat Kintarou. Unrealistic is merely an opinion as of now.

[javimgol]

We don't know how strong Irie is, and Oni had to go all out to beat Kintarou. Unrealistic is merely an opinion as of now.
If Ryoma>Kintaroh, Kazuya>Irie>Oni, and Kazuya>>>Ryoma, and Oni>>>Kintaroh, maths says that Irie>>Ryoma and Oni>Ryoma

[Sherlock Holmes]

If Ryoma>Kintaroh, Kazuya>Irie>Oni, and Kazuya>>>Ryoma, and Oni>>>Kintaroh, maths says that Irie>>Ryoma and Oni>Ryoma

Nope.

Kazuya>Ryoma confirmed

Kazuya>Irie not confirmed

Irie>Oni not confirmed


Ryoma>Kintarou
Oni>Kintarou

You can't conclude from that that Oni>Ryoma.

[KuwabaraTheMan]

Nope.

Kazuya>Ryoma confirmed

Kazuya>Irie not confirmed

Irie>Oni not confirmed


Ryoma>Kintarou
Oni>Kintarou

You can't conclude from that that Oni>Ryoma.

We could conclude from the most recent chapter that Oni and Kazuya are both twice as good as Ryoma. Although, there's obviously room for debate in that department.

[Kaoz]

Now that round 1 of season 2 is over, we'd like to know what you guys think about the roster, feel free to discuss characters here and when you think a character is overpowered (or underpowered) in relation to it's cost, let us know.

Also, if there's anything you dislike at the moment or anything you'd like to see in season 3, please make a comment here.
[hr]
I'd like to ask a favor, everyone could you please make a list of which characters you value high, low etc.?

Simply divide them into:
God Tier -> a character that everyone wants to use regardless of anything
High Tier -> very good characters considering their costs
Mid Tier -> average characters, you get what you pay for
Low Tier -> characters that aren't too good for their cost, only good in a limited number of situations
Garbage Tier -> characters you'd never use under any circumstances

Keep the characters cost in mind please, also use the original characters, no modifications from the leftover points.

Please take the time to do this, doesn't have to be now, just before the end of season 2 would be good, thanks in advance.

[javimgol]

God Tier:
Golden Pair. Cheapest auto-win ever.
Jimmies
Niou
Billy
Michael Lee


High Tier
Champion Pair
Silver Pair
Irie
Fuji
Inui
Krauser
Gin
Wakato
Richard


Mid Tier
The rest

Low Tier
Oni
Sanada
Shiraishi
Kite
Kabaji
Ishida
Gakutoh

Garbage Tier
If you are not Sherlock, Mizuki

[Kaoz]

Can someone give me an explenation why Akutsu's Sliding is Singles only? If not I would ask Sai to change this, at least to me it doesn't make any sense.

[javimgol]

Can someone give me an explenation why Akutsu's Sliding is Singles only? If not I would ask Sai to change this, at least to me it doesn't make any sense.
We have never seen Akutsu in Doubles, so we don't know.Also,he would be simply too powerful in the League. If people even want to nerf the only Effect of Aoi, a 4 point character because is really useful, imagine what would happen with a great character as Akutsu is

[Bowser]

Akutsu aint that powerful...hes only 38 in singles, he can be bested by people many peeps...


What I dont understand is say two opponent choose an effect or formation that would both negate each others effect. Which ones go first?

[javimgol]

Akutsu aint that powerful...hes only 38 in singles, he can be bested by people many peeps...


What I dont understand is say two opponent choose an effect or formation that would both negate each others effect. Which ones go first?
Good question. I proposed time ago that speed + next highest stat would determine the order. I don't remember very well, but I think Chaos agreed but finally we didn't conclude anything

[Sherlock Holmes]

God Tier:
Mizuki

High Tier:
Niou
KAJIFUCKINGMOTO
Renji
English Pair

Garbage Tier:
Rin

Yeah, I love my team.
And I hate Rin. Note that I benched him vs Sis.

[Zatono]

Hey, you know how Yukimura now has his new Two at a time Feat? Well, if you're going to give him that, why not give other characters who've displayed hitting multiple balls at the same time a Feat?

For Example :
Fuji : http://www.onemanga.com/Prince_of_Tennis/249/17/
http://www.onemanga.com/Prince_of_Tennis/249/18/

Even Eiji was hitting multiple balls at one point.
http://www.onemanga.com/Prince_of_Tennis/185/02/
http://www.onemanga.com/Prince_of_Tennis/185/03/

He even wanted to hit more then 3 at a time. <.<

[Sai_the_Shaman]

I wouldn't call that the multiple shots at once in the sense that we've been seeing in the shin tenipuri chapters. I would say in that sense it's more like 3 quick consecutive shots.

Where as the multiple at once shots are at the EXACT same time.

[Jyten]

Wow, a lot changes have been made since I've been gone. Wow, the system got tons more complicated.

[javimgol]

Could please me explain m how exactly works Yagyyu's The Gentleman+Losing Reputation?
To make it easy, i'll give you examples:
1) A random (9,9,9,9) player withno abilites
2) A random (9,8,7,6) with an Supah Serve +30 to Spin

[Kaoz]

Yagyuu Hiroshi (8, 5, 9, 9, 31) 38
Serve and Volley; Right Handed

-The Gentleman [Feat]:
Yagyuu gets boosted by 2 point in every stat, whereas the opponent’s highest stat drops by 2.

-Losing Reputation [Feat]:
This Feat doesn't activate except for when the opponent's total surpasses Yagyuu's for the first time in a match. If this Feat activates, 'The Gentleman''s effect is halved. All of the opponent's stats drop by 2 points each and Yagyuu's Spin is boosted by 3 points.

Yagyuu vs RC (1)
31-36 (base)
39-34 (Gentleman)

Yagyuu vs RC (2)
31-36 (base)
39-34 (Gentleman)
39-64 (Serve)
38-57 (Losing Reputation)

[javimgol]

Yagyuu Hiroshi (8, 5, 9, 9, 31) 38
Serve and Volley; Right Handed

-The Gentleman [Feat]:
Yagyuu gets boosted by 2 point in every stat, whereas the opponent’s highest stat drops by 2.

-Losing Reputation [Feat]:
This Feat doesn't activate except for when the opponent's total surpasses Yagyuu's for the first time in a match. If this Feat activates, 'The Gentleman''s effect is halved. All of the opponent's stats drop by 2 points each and Yagyuu's Spin is boosted by 3 points.

Yagyuu vs RC (1)
31-36 (base)
39-34 (Gentleman)

Yagyuu vs RC (2)
31-36 (base)
39-34 (Gentleman)
39-64 (Serve)
38-57 (Losing Reputation)

Ok, so...
1)Gentleman only reduce one stat even if they are more than one highest than the others
2) Losing Reputation didn't appear in the first match, so if the opponent has more base level, it doesn't auto-activate,no?

Ok, I understand now Losing Reputation...I wasn't sure if it auto-trigger again The Gentleman or sth like that.

Also, I asked in the other thread if Guess Who, the 2nd, also copies Serves. Guess Who, the 2nd, it's the same as the previous league, when we didn't have serves. Yagyyu hasn't showed any serve being copied (same goes to Niou), but Yagyyu has copied Kaidoh and Niou, and both haven't got a Serve.
The key about this it's if Niou, Illusion Master, couldn't copy Zero Shiki Serve because it was extremely difficult (like TZone to Muga users but not for Kabaji) or because a Serve can not be "Illusioned".

[Kaoz]

Well, we don't have any information about copying serves because none of the copied persons besides Tezuka had one. Even though he couldn't use Zero Shiki Serve, Niou still copied TPhantom and as such I can't see any reasons why he shouldn't be able to copy less complicated serves like Sengoku's Kohou.

[javimgol]

Well, we don't have any information about copying serves because none of the copied persons besides Tezuka had one. Even though he couldn't use Zero Shiki Serve, Niou still copied TPhantom and as such I can't see any reasons why he shouldn't be able to copy less complicated serves like Sengoku's Kohou.

So, Niou or Yagyyu could copy with Guess Who a Serve?

[Kaoz]

Yes they can, I'm sorry for the confusion, the wording will be specified after round 3 is over.

[Bowser]

Technically Kamio and Shinji can hit two balls between each other at extremely short distance = Kamio starts with two balls and hits them both to Shinji...

[Kaoz]

So I'd like to make an announcement concerning some stuff for season 3.

As you should be aware we never had a real rule concerning the order in which Feats/Effects/Auras activate, that's gonna change though.
First of all there will be three new prefixes that we will be using besides Opening and Final, those are:

-Continous:
A Continous ability will activate right after Feats (and Support Bonuses) and will remain active all the time, an example would be Tezuka Zone.

-Quick Play:
Quick Plays will be somewhat special as they don't have a set activation time, they will be somewhat like the current Version of Zero Shiki Serve, the player chooses when the ability resolves and depending on that there will be some small tweaks to the ability. Abilities that will receive this prefix include Zero Shiki Serve and Rai.

-Counter:
Ailities with this prefix don't activate at all, unless they are triggered by the action of another character, they'll pretty much work like Fuji's counters.


Apart from that I'll spoil some of the season 3 characters some time soon, look forward to it.
[hr]
So there you go the first season 3 character I'm gonna present

Yamato Yuudai (6, 9, 7, 10, 32) 47
All Rounder; Left Handed

-Insprirational Coach [Feat]:
If Yamato is put in reserves for the round, his teammates' totals go up by 5 each.

-High School Training [Feat]:
Yamato's stats are boosted by 2 each.

-Pillar of Support [Feat]:
When Facing Tezuka, All of Yamato's stats are boosted by 2 each.

-Pillar Serve [Serve]:
Yamato's Power is boosted by 5. The Opponnet's highest stat is doubled.

-Razor Serve [Serve]:
Yamato's Power and Spin are boosted by 3 each. If the Opponent's Speed is not at least 8, their Control falls by 3.

-Break Pillar [Final Effect]:
If the Opponent's Final Total is more that 20 points higher than Yamato's Final Total and Yamato used Pillar Serve. The stat that Yamato boosted is added to Yamato's stats.

-Disarming Effect on People [Effect]:
If the Opponent's Base stats are higher than Yamato's their stats are lowered by 1 each and their Effects are negated.

-Weakness Aura [Aura]:
Any Serve, Effect or Aura that would boost the Opponnet's own stats has its boost cut by 50%. Any Serve, Effect or Aura that has any sort of auto negate function has that function activated. Yamato can activate one more Effect.

This is his current version, we might alter some things for the final version but that's his general concept.

[Zatono]

I've got a question about the data doubles formation. This one is Renji's.

-Data Doubles [Formation]:
This Formation can only be used when partnered with Inui. Both players must be using Data Tennis as their Effects. Their Effects Cannot be negated and their stats cannot be lowered. The effects of Data Tennis work at 200% (Renji Cannot Predict double the no. of moves though)

And here's Inui's.

-Data Doubles [Formation]:
This Formation can only be used when partnered with Renji and both are using Data Tennis. Both Players have their Control stats boosted by 10. Inui is able to use Gathering Data without any negative side effects. Neither player can have their Effects negated.

Since they're obviously different, am I only allowed to pick one of them, or can I use both?

[Bowser]

I brought Yamato as a middle tier -.-...

[Sai_the_Shaman]

I've got a question about the data doubles formation. This one is Renji's.

-Data Doubles [Formation]:
This Formation can only be used when partnered with Inui. Both players must be using Data Tennis as their Effects. Their Effects Cannot be negated and their stats cannot be lowered. The effects of Data Tennis work at 200% (Renji Cannot Predict double the no. of moves though)

And here's Inui's.

-Data Doubles [Formation]:
This Formation can only be used when partnered with Renji and both are using Data Tennis. Both Players have their Control stats boosted by 10. Inui is able to use Gathering Data without any negative side effects. Neither player can have their Effects negated.

Since they're obviously different, am I only allowed to pick one of them, or can I use both?

You can choose one or the other for now. I changed Inui to S3 version but not Inui. So you have your choice for now it seems.
[hr]

I brought Yamato as a middle tier -.-...

Well in S3, he's a high tier...

[javimgol]

It's simply a joke than Hiyoshi and Akutsu costs the same as Supah Overpowered Inui, Kaidoh and Momo. Just compare the number and quality of their abilities

[KuwabaraTheMan]

It's simply a joke than Hiyoshi and Akutsu costs the same as Supah Overpowered Inui, Kaidoh and Momo. Just compare the number and quality of their abilities

How is Hiyoshi not also overpowered? Have you seen how high he increases whenever he faces anyone stronger than him? Akutsu also gets a good increase and negates effects.

[Sai_the_Shaman]

That's only right now. Season 2 has mostly been an experimental season since we pretty much started on season 3 right as season 2 started. In the new Season Inui and Oshitari are top of Middle Tier. Akutsu is high Tier and Hiyoshi is upper, but not top.

[Zatono]

It's simply a joke than Hiyoshi and Akutsu costs the same as Supah Overpowered Inui, Kaidoh and Momo. Just compare the number and quality of their abilities

How is Inui over powered at all? If anything, the new Inui is right where he should be, and matches up perfectly with what he basically is in the manga.

[-Ken-]

It is where he should be. However, read all of the sentence. It's about them being the same cost. The point is that he should cost more. And that, I agree with.
[hr]
Here's some flaw I find.

-Purple Electric Aura [Aura]:
If the opponent would use a Serve, Effect or Aura, It is negated and he cannot use any secondary Effects or Auras. All of your Opponent's Stats drop by 5 each and their Effects are Negated.


It's Ryoga skill, problem? It's copyable. Do I have proof that it's not copyable, I don't. But this aura is way sicker than any other high schooler effect, which is uncopyable for the sake of it. (Drop by 5 each and negating effect is sick, period)

----


EDIT: Sai already answer that he will fix it after this round.

[Kaoz]

About the whole season 3, as Sai already said, we started very early in season 2 with the characters and balancing, and I think everyone will be rather pleased with the results.
We also have enough high tier characters now as we included court 3 into the roster (which I will spoil as this season goes on), so all characters are pretty much were they should be canon wise.

[javimgol]

Everything you have said haven't solved that, right now, for example, Hiyoshi and Akutsu are far worse than their 30 points comrades.