How/When will Sasuke betray Tobi for good?

[badluckartist]

I dislike Sasuke as much as every other fan who dislikes him, but I do look forward to seeing him finally betray him in what I hope to be one of his character's only redeeming moments. As if the Darth Vader - Palpatine relationship wasn't already firmly established between Sasuke and Tobi, we as the reader know that Sasuke has had plans to kill Itachi and his accomplice since he first figured out Itachi couldn't have done the whole thing himself.

Since we don't get much internal monologue from Sasuke (a dumb choice from Kishi, in my opinion), we can really only guess from his actions. I'm pretty positive that even if he remains irredeemably villainous, he'll eventually stay good on his oath to kill Tobi. If anything, his psychotic behavior ups the odds of this outcome.

It'll probably be just before whatever part of Tobi's plan that requires his body, and end just as badly or worse than Orochimaru's attempt.

WMG: Insert any number of flashy, never-before-seen Sharingan usage, and Sasuke usurps Tobi's plan, tormenting the world with a massive Tsukuyomi of evil... hatredness. Of course, only Naruto can break out of the genjutsu, and their big finale takes place in that cool, surreal Tsukuyomi space.

[AlB]

well, if Sasuke's mental condition continues do deteriorate then we can assume he will attack Madara the moment he gets his bandages off lol

as a more realistic alternative I think Sasuke will wait until either Kabuto or Alliance weaken the old man and then he will strike

[Prince Sasuke]

I'm thinking after Sasuke have a talk with Itachi and Battle Naruto. If Sasuke battles Madara by himself, he will be beaten.

[mattiaildivino]

Never: he loves his clan,and Madara is the last member of it. Sasuke can learn a lot of things from him but he will understand that Tobi isn't an uchiha and that Tobi has been kidding him for all this time. I'd like to see the same final of Star Wars,Sasuke is Anakin Skywalker,and Tobi is Palpatine. Sasuke before dying will kill Tobi in some way.

[Rikudou King]

Sasuke will do the same thing he did with Orochimaru, Wait for the moment Madara shows weakness and strike then. Til then Sasuke will play along with Madara and reap any benefits he can.

[RezzieThaRapper]

He'll Kill him after Naruto rapes Madara with a Rasengan or something... And he comes limping back...

I'll give a better answer later but I'm brain hurt from a stressful college week

[insid3rkill3r]

To me, i think its easy to say that Madara is meant to be fought from an union of both Sasuke and Naruto.

Both of them lost everything in the same night because of the same man... And now both of them became equally strong from the harsh life they had to walk.

While Naruto knows about the truth behind kyuubi's attack on konoha, sasuke doesnt and hes bound to find out sooner or later.

Sasuke has been fooled all his life about his revenge,but he now has the man who is to blame for all of it right next to him.

Sasuke and Naruto will defeat madara... Its obvious.


Although, Sasuke will die so that at last, he'll be able to join the ones he loved.

Sasuke is now considered a criminal, and kishi showed us that the characters in the manga counsidered what Sasuke did as unforgivable just to show us that there was no other way but to kill Sasuke in the end.

Sasuke will die as hero,because he will have given his life for the crimes he commited

[M3J]

I don't think Sasuke will really attack Tobi after the bandages come off. He knows better than to assume that the EMS will make him strong enough to take on Tobi, I hope. I mean, Tobi survived Sasuke's slash and his chidori, at least one of which was almost unexpected. I think Sasuke also guessed that Tobi had his Sharingan on and can keep it on the whole time, meaning Sasuke knows he needs to look for Tobi's weaknesses.

I don't think Sasuke will betray Tobi until he has enough info on him, like how to damage him and kill him. We may see him send enemies towards Tobi, but Sasuke probably won't participate. He is biding his time, unlike with Orochimaru when he was training to get stronger. As mentioned, he's also reaping the benefits Tobi offers, like easier access to revenge and more power. Sasuke should know Tobi did have a hand in the massacre and was the one who summoned Kyuubi (while Tobi said Itachi tried to protect Sasuke from Uchiha's bad name, I don't think Sasuke would doubt Itachi on that, especially since Tobi was involved), he knows Tobi is dangerous and played a major part in what happened. Sasuke however, hopefully, is smart enough to know that he can't betray Tobi without knowing how to defeat him.

[digitaldude]

He'll turn on Madara after a long beating/inspirational speech courtesy of Naruto.

[pjoto]

He'll betray Madara when Itachi tell's him the truth. It's an anime, it doesn't matter if he's dead, he'll be back. Oh snap, wait, he already is.

[POW]

Sasuke will do the same thing he did with Orochimaru, Wait for the moment Madara shows weakness and strike then. Til then Sasuke will play along with Madara and reap any benefits he can.

^ This plus the whole idea is Sasuke doesnt know enough about Tobi's abilities to even formulate a plan. He will wait and bide his time untill he finds an opening or learn of some kind of weakness.

Even the 4th Hokage understood in order to beat him you need some kind of special power hence why he left the 9 tails to his son.

[insid3rkill3r]

He wont do what he did to Oro.

Right now... Sasuke doesnt have Madara as his Target.

He doesnt really like it... but he uses him and has no real reason YET to want him dead.

He has never accepted Oro's way of toying with people's life, killing them for his own sake and without any reason to cause their death.... in that case he decided for the right moment because he planned on killing him from the start.

Once he learns the truth about Tobi/Madara and the kyuubi attack... Sasuke won't think for a second, he will go head on against him.... its not like Sasuke can get any stronger than he is now... there is no more power-ups that he can get... same for Naruto. So they won't wait. they will go right when they have the desire to kill him.

As it was said. Madara can only be matched with a special set of abilities. and thus left the fox to Naruto for him to get stronger just like Itachi in the end made it possible for Sasuke to achieve EMS.

Sasuke and Naruto are the complete set of abilities required to defeat Madara

the two sons of the sage will be as one to furfil the mission that the sage entrusted to them on his deathbed ; and that curse is Madara.

[kasumi_san]

I think he'll betray Tobi when he sees zombie Itachi myself.

He's bound to go against Kabuto when he does and then most probably Tobi when he gets involved.

He does want Madara dead, he's just waiting to find out how to hurt him since Ameterasu went right through him. If I remember correctly, didn't he also try to stab him through just before the fight with Deidara?

He'll probably wait until someone manages to figure out how to attack him and then use the knowledge.

[CBlitz]

Sasuke only deals with stronger people in one way: wait until they're weakened/have Plot-AIDS and kill them while they're bedridden and coughing their lungs out. Of course Madara seems to have immunity against plot-AIDS so it'll be interesting to see what Sasuke pulls.

[Delbi]

Sasuke only deals with stronger people in one way: wait until they're weakened/have Plot-AIDS and kill them while they're bedridden and coughing their lungs out. Of course Madara seems to have immunity against plot-AIDS so it'll be interesting to see what Sasuke pulls.

I don't think he did that with either Diedara, Killerbee or the Kages. In fact he was the one that was at a disadvantage while fighting our favorite Jinchuriki rapper.

In any event, Sasuke is very smart. He's not going to blindly go after Madara now that he knows what he can do. Just like with Orochimaru, like others have said, Sasuke will not only wait till Madara is weak, but until he is strong enough. He has to figure out what his EMS can do, and Sasuke, for what it's worth, is always pulling out new tricks.

It's even a possibility he might not even try and kill him. He might leave him and then come back at a later date for a confrontation with him. Naruto and Konoha are on Sasuke's hit list too. He hasn't shown so much hate to Madara recently, so he might not be his main focus right now.

[M3J]

Sasuke only deals with stronger people in one way: wait until they're weakened/have Plot-AIDS and kill them while they're bedridden and coughing their lungs out. Of course Madara seems to have immunity against plot-AIDS so it'll be interesting to see what Sasuke pulls.

Actually, Sasuke wasn't able to kill the kage, Killerbee, or Deidara like that. He did pretty well against the kage even though he had to be bailed out. Against Killerbee, he got pwned even though Sasuke apparently was protected by plot no jutsu. Against Deidara, it was all Sasuke, he himself led Deidara to suicidebomb himself and Sasuke.

Seeing Sasuke against Deidara and Danzo, he'll be waiting for the right moment to strike when he knows enough about Tobi. He knows by now that there's some secret to Tobi, the same person who survived Amaterasu, chidori, and a sword slash, and the person who claims to be Madara. Sasuke knows Itachi's message or at least has an idea of what Itachi wanted. I'm sure he's waiting to find clues about Tobi's weaknesses.... I wonder if Zetsu will play a big part in this.

[insid3rkill3r]

Sasuke only deals with stronger people in one way: wait until they're weakened/have Plot-AIDS and kill them while they're bedridden and coughing their lungs out. Of course Madara seems to have immunity against plot-AIDS so it'll be interesting to see what Sasuke pulls.

There is no need for ur flamming.


The only one he waited for the right moment was Oro... and i'm sure glad he did, that sick bastard deserved it.


Other than that... he's dealt with anybody else head on.

You've seen Bee vs Sasuke right? or vs Raikage? or vs Danzo?

or even Deidara's right..?


Anyways... you guys need to realise something.

Sasuke doesnt target random people, he only targets out of REVENGE.

First Itachi... now Konoha for sacrificing Itachi's life for their sake.

While he doesnt like Madara much, he has no reason to really hate him either yet. Right now Madara shares the same goal as him, so he uses him to get his revenge. Once Sasuke learns the truth behind Kyuubi, Madara will be his primary target, since he will know Konoha will have been fooled all along and that it all comes down to Madara himself.

Once that happens... Madara will be his target, because he will be responsible for everything that Sasuke lost and swore to seek revenge for from the very beginning of the manga.

[xXan]

There is no need for ur flamming.


The only one he waited for the right moment was Oro... and i'm sure glad he did, that sick bastard deserved it.


Other than that... he's dealt with anybody else head on.

You've seen Bee vs Sasuke right? or vs Raikage? or vs Danzo?

or even Deidara's right..?


Anyways... you guys need to realise something.

Sasuke doesnt target random people, he only targets out of REVENGE.

First Itachi... now Konoha for sacrificing Itachi's life for their sake.

While he doesnt like Madara much, he has no reason to really hate him either yet. Right now Madara shares the same goal as him, so he uses him to get his revenge. Once Sasuke learns the truth behind Kyuubi, Madara will be his primary target, since he will know Konoha will have been fooled all along and that it all comes down to Madara himself.

Once that happens... Madara will be his target, because he will be responsible for everything that Sasuke lost and swore to seek revenge for from the very beginning of the manga.

He was also ready to kill Karin just because she was a inconvenience to him. Sasuke is 1 sick SOB.

[badluckartist]

The only one he waited for the right moment was Oro... and i'm sure glad he did, that sick bastard deserved it.

There is no need for ur flamming.



Anyways... you guys need to realise something.

Sasuke doesnt target random people, he only targets out of REVENGE.

First Itachi... now Konoha for sacrificing Itachi's life for their sake.


You've seen Bee vs Sasuke right? or vs Raikage? or vs Danzo?

or even Deidara's right..?


While he doesnt like Madara much, he has no reason to really hate him either yet.

Once that happens... Madara will be his target, because he will be responsible for everything that Sasuke lost and swore to seek revenge for from the very beginning of the manga.

For real, though, you refuted yourself a few times in your own response. The only fight I'll accept as a reasonable part of his revenge is Danzou. Everyone else was totally unrelated to him, and he went out of his way to try and murder or otherwise ensure the deaths of several innocent people. This even led to the Raikage declaring revenge on Sasuke, making his own revenge even less credible.

He has bluntly sworn to kill Itachi's accomplice, whom he now knows to be Tobi/Madara. That's why I made this thread- to discuss how and when his betrayal will occur. The only reason he hasn't killed him yet is because he still has more to gain from not killing him. At least until he figures out how to usurp the Moon's Eye plan, if my WMG is right.

[juUnior]

I pretty much agree with what Rikudou King wrote - I expect that from some time now and I firmly believe it will happen sooner or later even is Sasuke goes psycho. And it will be badass :p

[Delbi]

There is no need for ur flamming.



You've seen Bee vs Sasuke right? or vs Raikage? or vs Danzo?

or even Deidara's right..?



For real, though, you refuted yourself a few times in your own response. The only fight I'll accept as a reasonable part of his revenge is Danzou. Everyone else was totally unrelated to him, and he went out of his way to try and murder or otherwise ensure the deaths of several innocent people. This even led to the Raikage declaring revenge on Sasuke, making his own revenge even less credible.

He has bluntly sworn to kill Itachi's accomplice, whom he now knows to be Tobi/Madara. That's why I made this thread- to discuss how and when his betrayal will occur. The only reason he hasn't killed him yet is because he still has more to gain from not killing him. At least until he figures out how to usurp the Moon's Eye plan, if my WMG is right.
The only person Sasuke didn't really need to fight was Bee. Everyone else he fought he had a legit reason.

Orochimaru: To kill a sick bastard so he could get stronger. (Also wanted revenge for the late night touchy sessions).

Deidara: So he could get info on Itachi. He wanted info, never wanted to kill him.

Danzou and Itachi: Revenge

The Raikage and other Kages and Samurai: He went there looking for Danzou, not the other Kages. They attacked him and he fought back, not his fault. he even warned the Samurai to stand down and they refused. He's a ninja and this is a ninja manga, so don't give me, "O well it was wrong for him to go there in the first place". Bullshit, it was wrong for Rikudou to make a ninja art that lets people kill one another with magic then if that's the case.

[badluckartist]

The only person Sasuke didn't really need to fight was Bee. Everyone else he fought he had a legit reason.

Orochimaru: To kill a sick bastard so he could get stronger. (Also wanted revenge for the late night touchy sessions).

Deidara: So he could get info on Itachi. He wanted info, never wanted to kill him.

Danzou and Itachi: Revenge

The Raikage and other Kages and Samurai: He went there looking for Danzou, not the other Kages. They attacked him and he fought back, not his fault. he even warned the Samurai to stand down and they refused. He's a ninja and this is a ninja manga, so don't give me, "O well it was wrong for him to go there in the first place". Bullshit, it was wrong for Rikudou to make a ninja art that lets people kill one another with magic then if that's the case.


I was being a bit facetious by using his words as my own in my replies, if you didn't catch that.

For my point, I was primarily concerned with his primary motivation in life, to kill Itachi. insid3rkill3r claimed that he only ever targeted people out of revenge, to which I replied with his own list of people Sasuke has wantonly attacked. I agree that Danzou is a legit extension of his revenge, but his targeting of Killerbee, Raikage, Karin, etc. all seems like a not-very-subtle method Kishi has been using to try and convince the reader that Sasuke is a villain, because he apparently believes every word that comes from one of the guys that killed his clan. No, not the one that actually cared about him- the equivalent of a creepy uncle, Tobi.

A bit off topic, but I'm not sure if I understood your post either ^^" Either way, it isn't like Sasuke hasn't gotten himself into pointless fights (aside from further serving Tobi's plans) by being cocky and trigger-happy?

And I'm not sure if I understand how Sasuke breaking into a neutral village, where a meeting is being held between the most powerful militants in the world to discuss how to get rid of, among other things, Sasuke = Rikudo "making" all the jutsu. We still don't really have any idea of what actually happened behind the folklore and mythology of Rikudo.

I seriously doubt he consciously sat down one day, deciding exactly what jutsu there would be and always would be in his brand new ninja world, before suddenly exclaiming, "YES!! I'll let people come back from the dead and kill each other with magic!!" Kind of a wild comparison :S

[kasumi_san]

Sasuke had gone to the summit to spy and kill Danzo once he found out what he looked like. It was Zetsu who said "Guess who's here guys!" and started the whole thing.

Sasuke is also not the "hit the other cheek" type. You attack and he's sure to return the hit.

[POW]

Ultimately it doesnt really matter if Sasuke decides to kill Tobi/Madara as the whole story has been set up for both him and Naruto to want to fight him. Sasuke can not defeat him alone.

The destruction of Tobi is a mutual goal for both Naruto and Sasuke he is the man that changed both their lives. He caused the Kyuubi to attack the village which lead to the Uchiha clan being killed and lead to Naruto's parents to be killed as well.

Killing him is one thing Naruto & Sasuke can both agree on. I think this will be the 2nd to last fight in the manga with the last fight probably being Sasuke vs Naruto part 2.

[insid3rkill3r]

Ultimately it doesnt really matter if Sasuke decides to kill Tobi/Madara as the whole story has been set up for both him and Naruto to want to fight him. Sasuke can not defeat him alone.

The destruction of Tobi is a mutual goal for both Naruto and Sasuke he is the man that changed both their lives. He caused the Kyuubi to attack the village which lead to the Uchiha clan being killed and lead to Naruto's parents to be killed as well.

Killing him is one thing Naruto & Sasuke can both agree on. I think this will be the 2nd to last fight in the manga with the last fight probably being Sasuke vs Naruto part 2.

Oh yeah, agreed and without a doubt. Madara is the sole responsible for both Naruto and Sasuke's life drama, so they're bound to unite to kill, none of them will be able to solo them, that is more than obvious imo.

Although, i highly this fight will be the ultimate and last one, if Naruto and Sauke face off, i see it happening prior to their fight against Madara. Cause once Sasuke learns Madara is to blame, he does not really have a good reason to still go for the leaf when he now knows that they were not blaming the Uchiha for 'NO' reason since a sharingan was indeed controlling Kyuubi.

I see Sasuke vs Naruto, then Sasuke learning the truth most-likely from Naruto since he learned it himself from his parents, then Sasuke snapping out of it and both of them going for Madara as the final encounter.

And i expect Sasuke to die too, obviously.

[kenjiIkichiha]

Its probably when Kabuto lets ET Itachi talk to Sasuke, so Itachi can tell the real truth of letting his brother live, and murdering the whole Uchiha. If that doesn't work out well, maybe when Naruto and Sasuke start to end their final battle, that "power" Itachi left for Naruto will activate, which is Itachi's message. And when Sasuke changes his mind about destroying Konoha (hopefully), he'll betray Madara and work with Naruto to defeat Madara once, and for all.

[Jorge D. Dragon]

There is a posibility that Itachi will affect Sasuke, cause during his Edo Tensei resurection he can talk to Sasuke and convince him on the right path, but also there is a posibility of Sasuke wanting to kill Madara, cause he got new power and will think that he can easily kill Madara, but of course it won't be that easy, cause Madara isn't only troll, but a very powerful shinoby with decades of experience and two most powerful doujutsu.:)
I hope Sasuke will go by the second path and try to kill Madara with his new obtained EMS and will be trashed by Madara.:)

[~Joshua~]

He'll betray Madara when Itachi tell's him the truth. It's an anime, it doesn't matter if he's dead, he'll be back. Oh snap, wait, he already is.

Hell, if Minato could do it, why not Itachi..?
[hr]
I feel that Sasuke is fooling everyone. Including us. He isn't necessarily on the path of villainy, but on the path of the anti-hero.

[Eprst]

I dont think Sasuke will betray Madara - I think somehow they will merge, I think Naruto and Kabuto and Co will catch Madara in the dark corner, drop him to the ground and then kick him to the death with legs. And then dying Madara will give Sasuke his EMS eyes and his Rinnegan eyes and 100 eyes of died Uchiha clan and ask him for revenge, his brother did the same so now it is Madaras turn to share some eyes :)

[THM Nindo]

Hell, if Minato could do it, why not Itachi..?
<hr noshade size="1">
I feel that Sasuke is fooling everyone. Including us. He isn't necessarily on the path of villainy, but on the path of the anti-hero.

No.
He might end up a anti-hero in the end because he will be changed (either by Naruto or Itachi), but right now he's a villain.
And that's probably only at that moment that he will go against Madara, not before that.

To show my point that he's a villain, let's look at Sasuke right now :
His only goal is to destroy Naruto and Konoha (We saw that with his inner toughts, so he wasn't "playing" it).
And we saw just how crazy he is now, and how evil he can be when he didn't hesitate a second to kill Karin if that meant that he could harm Danzou.

Sure, some people might argue that he's more delusional than evil, but he's still a bastard that wouldn't hesitate a second to kill any of Naruto's allies, which makes me, in my mind, a villain.

[luffyg2]

He will wait until he is sure that he is in a position where he can beat madara... or he will strike after learning a terrible truth that madara hid from him... thats how I see it...

[Eprst]

Definitely Sasuke will learn the secrets of the Rikudo Sennin and power up. Yeah he has great eyes but he still needs chakra resources and stamina.

[lawlett-kun]

i think it will happen when probably itachi tells sasuke the truth behind the truth, because i doubt naruto's talk no jutsu will have any effect already.

[Adv2011]

The reason why Itachi and nagato are back could be to tell the truth to sasuke or naruto who will popup in the end of the war!!!

[beasticon999]

He's comment "When did we become allies" has made clear to us his intentions.Sasuke is an unstable element that Madara rather do without because of he's inability to control him and that is because unlike Madara's other pawns,Sasuke has a goal of his own.For example Madara wants the kyuubi captured,he cant send Sasuke because Sasuke's goal is to kill Naruto and destroy Konoha.The only reason Sasuke is still with Madara is because of his eyes,he better listens to some1 who has been in his position than rely on his own judgement,he probably wont do anything 2 hinder Madara's plans but he wont fuel it either.Sasuke will leave the nest when he's matured.