Nakai and Hiramaru

[saladesu]

I thought this was an interesting topic that came up in the 128/129 disc/pred thread (http://mangahelpers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=69234).

Do you consider Nakai and Hiramaru to be similar? Why does everyone hate Nakai so much? Why does everyone love Hiramaru so much? Does the difference lie merely in the fact that Hiramaru provides comic relief while Nakai could be considered nothing more than an eyesore?

Discuss~

[Tias]

It's funny people say Nakai and Hiramura are very similar characters.
I mean the only points i can see them being similar on is that they both like Aoki, or the way they like her. They both like her because she is pretty. But Nakai is pretty much going for ANY pretty girl, and i mean ANY. Hiramura has kept his interest to Aoki. But at start Both Nakais and Hiramura's love for her was a bit superficial. But Nakai's more so.

I mean just go to the bakuman wikia and read Nakai's history, after his 1st rejection it simply went downhills for him, and it still is, up until now. Heck, even after he got home it was going down, not like the return made anything better. He also admitted he was using Manga for his own personal gain like fame and what not. When he returned all he cared about was to live in luxery, being able to eat pizza everyday and etc. And when Nanamines manga was in trouble all he cared about was to uphold his living style.

Hiramura on the other hand just randomly picked up a manga and said to himself he could do the same, and then just randomly started drawing manga and quit his old job.
Sure, he dosn't want to work and wishes he was a pampered panda, he's a lazy person, And i'm pretty much the same actually. So needing a motivation is important, and hell, he himself even knows he needs yoshida to MANIPULATE him, he KNOWS it, and there is some points he says yoshida has to try better at manipulating him, even lying.
He uses his negativity to actually make his manga better. Once he got happy after Aoki accepted to go out with him, his manga's rating went downwards, seriously.


So in my eyes, the difference between Nakai and Hiramura is like day and night.

[Aldrich]

Where the hell did the comparison come from

Because they're both interested in Aoki/pretty girls? I don't know if you noticed but they have a slightly different way to go about it

Hiramaru actually properly confessed while crying, goes on dates with her etc etc, Nakai tried to bribe her into becoming his girlfriend while looking like a smug bastard

Work wise Hiramaru always goes back to his feet despite his fits of depression and actually accepts, even requests his editor manipulating him to work, Nakai just keeps on sinking lower and ignores people trying to help him

And looks wise Hiramaru is a pretty decent looking guy while Nakai is the ugliest POS I've seen in shonen

Yeah exactly the same I wonder why people love Hiramaru and hate Nakai!!!!

[Tias]

Where the hell did the comparison come from

Because they're both interested in Aoki/pretty girls? I don't know if you noticed but they have a slightly different way to go about it

Hiramaru actually properly confessed while crying, goes on dates with her etc etc, Nakai tried to bribe her into becoming his girlfriend while looking like a smug bastard

Work wise Hiramaru always goes back to his feet despite his fits of depression and actually accepts, even requests his editor manipulating him to work, Nakai just keeps on sinking lower and ignores people trying to help him

And looks wise Hiramaru is a pretty decent looking guy while Nakai is the ugliest POS I've seen in shonen

Yeah exactly the same I wonder why people love Hiramaru and hate Nakai!!!!

Was that directed at me? =o
I pretty much know they are different, just that they both like Aoki.

But yeah, i really don't see how people could say they were similar = /

Hiramaru, since the start, has been comedy relief.
I guess he just ended up becoming more popular than first expected. While Nakai, yeah, no idea what his "role" was.

[saladesu]

I think there are some superficial similarities between them, but on the whole they are quite different.

The biggest similarity I see is that they're not really drawing manga for enjoyment. Their motivation is largely different from other authors like Ashirogi. The fact that they both like Aoki is also another factor though not one I see as being that major.


Hiramaru, since the start, has been comedy relief.
I guess he just ended up becoming more popular than first expected. While Nakai, yeah, no idea what his "role" was.

I agree about Hiramaru - he was used mainly as comedy relief at first, and when Ohba found it worked, especially after Aoki was roped in as well... We just got a whole lot more of it :XD I'm not sure Ohba even intended to use Hiramaru quite as much as she did.

As for Nakai, he has no clearly defined "role" per se, I guess... He is a good artist, so basically he mostly reappears in that category. His penchant for women is one of his traits that probably turn most off, though.

But if Hiramaru's actions were not portrayed in a comedic manner, would we see him as pathetic? The way he's being controlled by Yoshida etc could be seen as rather pathetic imo. It's just that it's funny that we like it. Or is it? :p

[Reclaimer]

While Nakai, yeah, no idea what his "role" was.
In the beginning, his role was as a mentor figure and to provide a look into the manga industry (particularly, that of the career assistant)

[kagato23]

More than anything else, I'd say the biggest difference between them is their methodology. We know Nakai did the biggest douche mistake of all time: making business and personal life mix. He was only going to work with Aoki if she was with him. He continues to try and use his job to get girls under Nanamine.

By contrast, as desperate and over the top as Hiramaru has been, it's never been at the expense of others (except being distracting in a sense, trying to hang with everybody else instead of work). He specifically veto'd making Aoki part of his motivation because of how ridiculously unfair it'd be to her: in the same situation Nakai probably never would have bothered making sure she was on a date because she wanted to be.

While he's somewhat superficial on how he started liking her, at least he seems to actually like her as opposed to liking what she can do for him, his internal fantasy world aside.

[Tias]

@Reclaimer
Ah right yeah, forgot that =o


Oh and something else people, i know Hiramaru first suggested to Aoki she called the police, in which she said it was not that serious, but on the last page he says if they would have called the police his future would have been over, which is why he is there.
So i guess this kinda goes to show Hiramaru still considered Nakai's future and didn't call the police himself.
So i guess, despite how much i don't like Nakai, that Hiramaru might help him get on a better path.

But personally i just want Nakai to get lost :I

[Soulslaver]

i dont know what the point of the authors is?

i mean they trashed nakai to the ground and what do they want to achieve with it?

i do not think that they have the guts to have the popular character(hiramaru) lose against an unpopular one.

do they want to use hiramarus popularity to rise in the ranking or something equally bland?

[saladesu]

I thought I'd edit the thread title a little (change the vs to an and to make it more all-encompassing).

Recent chapter showed us some... Development in the relationship/friendship (?) between Nakai and Hiramaru. What do you think of the whole deal in Bakuman 129? Only comic relief? Well it was certainly funny :XD Do you think it's gonna get more spotlight from now on or will there be other developments?

[Tias]

Iiiiiiiiiii still don't like Nakai :I
There are many other people out there in the world, who give up romance and what not for work, or simply can't even get into a relationship, and i doubt all of those turn into a jerk like Nakai.
--> http://www.mangareader.net/bakuman/129/11
The very essence of youth? Don't be kidding me : /
I mean i can understand if he felt ONLY hatred towards Aoki feeling it was his fault his career got ruined. But he mixed romance in and behaved like a jerk.

I mean just look at his creepy face expressions:
http://www.mangareader.net/bakuman/129/3
http://www.mangareader.net/bakuman/129/4

Scaring her enough to want to call the police.

If you ask me this chapter is way to preachy.
The whole thing with Nanamine was also preachy.
Kinda funny, when you think about that one chapter with one of Ashirogi muto's assistants showed his work to Hattori saying it was preachy and people don't like being preached too.

So yeah, i still don't like Nakai = /