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View Full Version : Character The Sabo Factor



Uriel
April 26, 2011, 11:10 PM
We need to discuss him apart. It's filling almost every part of the forum with multiples theories and seems that everyone has a different version on how it will introduced, if He's alive or not, His purpose on the flashback, his abilities and dreams, his relation with Revolutionaires and how will kick ass in the future.

Throw your theory here for us to fight to death. My guess?
1) He's alive
2) He wont join the Strawhats.
3) There is a huge "WHY HE DID NOT SAVE ACE THEN" thingie. I bet He was in that time of the month. :D

sh4dx
April 27, 2011, 07:10 AM
Well right now it's 50/50.I believe that his is alive and propably come back at some point of the series being in the RA.But Oda could take this in 2 ways.

1)He revealed us sabo,just to show us how important was ace's death to luffy,because in his child time he had lost another "brother" and now with ace's death,he realised that he is nowhere near the top tiers of the world and MUST be much stronger in order to protect his friends/family etc etc
or
2)"Fate" makes Dragon to meet sabo,"fate" makes sabo to tell dragon how much he hates the nobles and all this,and leave us with a cliffhanger with his hat being on the sea, just like when ace "lost/died"(we didn't know back then) to bb.

So right now it's just pure speculation,but i hope (and believe) that sabo will come back later being either a commander or an underling to a commander,pretty much like inazuma to iva.Offtopic but Oda showing Dragon being at zoro's sensei dojo it's pretty much clear that he will have a role in the future at the RA,so i think it's the same with sabo(at least i hope so!)

About not coming to save ace.It's not like it is something that easy.Just think if for example he is in the RA would you believe Dragon would ever let him do something selfish like this?Or even if he is all alone neither in the RA or nowhere just a strong alone person(like mihawk who is always alone, not as strong as him don't be confused) it makes no sense to just show up alone because it's clear he doesn't stand a chance.Anyway it's something too far to discuss about why he didn't come to save ace when we don't know if he is alive!If oda has plans of him being alive then when he shows up we would learn why he didn't come.

Dekker
April 27, 2011, 07:52 AM
Offtopic but Oda showing Dragon being at zoro's sensei dojo it's pretty much clear that he will have a role in the future at the RA,so i think it's the same with sabo(at least i hope so!)


I don't want to be a pain in the ass, but could someone tell me in what chapter that happened? I don't remember seeing that ^^.

As for Sabo: He will definitly come back in the story. Oda introduced his character in a very important flashback and I doubt that he will throw away Sabos character that easy. I guess he was the one dragon and the revolutionaries took out of the water beeing heavily wounded. At least it was hinted there that he could have survived.

I could see several scenarios with him. Could be that he gets caught for beeing a commander of Dragon and Luffy wants to save him as he does not want to lose anyone ever again. That could lead to Luffy and Dragon to finaly meet.
Other scenario I think is likely might be that he meets him at the end when the Revolutionaries will start their revolution.

Uriel
April 27, 2011, 08:21 AM
Here (http://www.tenmanga.com/chapter/OnePiece589/202880-7.html)
The words said by them makes me believe that they found Sabo almost dead near Zoro's ISland. Why I assume it's him? Because this is previous to his appearance, has no real conection to the plot back then and doesn't have any sense to be just there as a random fact.

And I believe that if He's alive, He's strong. Really strong. He could be at that war easily.

sh4dx
April 27, 2011, 08:30 AM
here http://read.mangashare.com/One-Piece/chapter-589/page007.html

Dekker
April 27, 2011, 08:34 AM
Ah thanks. I totaly missed that. Well, can't wait to read more about all that stuff and what other people think could happen =).

@Uriel: Yes, I too think that this is not a random fact. Oda rarely does throw in pointless stuff.

Jorge D. Dragon
April 27, 2011, 09:54 AM
I believe that Sabo is alive and he is part of Revolutionary Army.
I believe that he is rather strong. About Ace's pre-timeskip level. I believe he doesn't have DF, but he is Haki user.
Actually I believe that at some point he might become a Strawhat if he actually is alive.

About him not coming to save Ace... I believe that it's obvious. It would be just a suicide, cause he wouldn't have changed that much in the War. He is just one person and I don't believe that he might be stronger than Marco or Joz.

Channy
May 06, 2011, 10:44 AM
Maybe the reason why Sabo didn't come to the war is because everyone was watching the war and maybe Sabo really wanted wanted to go but then he saw Luffy and the ID crew come in so at that point Sabo decided he wouldn't do anything reckless because oh hey Luffy is their and hes with two of my revolution buddies or something along those lines

Uriel
May 06, 2011, 12:42 PM
I don't know, BOTH of his brothers were in battle. If they were mine I would care about them or try to make sure they'll be safe. Even knowing that Iva was there isn't enough to feel safe about it.

I don't know, my feeling is that He was captured or something like that. :O

kkck
May 06, 2011, 01:08 PM
Assuming sabo is alive, I doubt there is much he could have done. The war was announced a mere week in advanced. What if sabo was on the other side of the world or in the middle of some war far away in the new world? There is no guarantee he could have gotten there in time even if he found out the second the war was announced. Even with an eternal post to marineford it is still a really long distance to marineford. Heck, even going from kuja island to ID took 4 days and that is quite deep into the GL. And what could sabo alone do? He is not a pirate as far as we know. If he is a revolutionary he would actually be the complete opposite of one. He does not live for his own selfish desires, he lives to bring freedom and a higher standard to people. He just can't quit at his own whim and go to fight elsewhere. Heck, if he has the level someone of his apparent talent should have then odds are that he, like ace, has a reasonably important position in the organization he is a part off.

Uriel
May 07, 2011, 10:14 PM
Seeing that He enjoyed books and was actually quite smart, I don't think He's a warrior myself. Only strong, nevertheless. And yes, kkck...That would make lot of sense. Also add a bit of drama and guilt if He ever meets with Luffy again which always makes good flashback in Oda's hands.

Freid
May 08, 2011, 11:51 AM
You know how there are certain things that you can be sure about even without solid evidence or whatnot, just that it would make sense considering a few things that the author seemed to have done purposely and left ambiguous. Well, personally for me, I feel like this is one of them because there are some things that Oda seems to have left obscure intentionally such as Sabo's grown up picture that didn't show his face. That picture to me kinda says 'This ain't the last time you will see me'. Then there was the panel shown with Dragon's men helping someone that was nearly dead or something like that. I don't think that those things which seem to hint at his survival more than anything else, will amount to nothing. Oda doesn't troll like Kubo :p

sarutobi_sensei
May 08, 2011, 08:25 PM
I'm 90% sure that he is alive. The fishing boat he was in was just of the cost of Goa Kingdom. Dragon was also near there, and to be honest, when Dragon stops @ Zoro's village for food, water and stuff like that, someone says: zomg patch him up. Patch who up? For me, it's Sabo. Why would Oda otherwise have the trouble of making a bigger version of him?

I keep on saying that he is alive and that he is the one that was talking to Robin.

We'll probably know if he is alive when they enter the New World or maybe 2 arcs from now.

MaiSiaoSiao
May 08, 2011, 09:16 PM
Which chapter was it that you guys saw dragon at Goa and sabo being "killed"?Cant find it

kkck
May 09, 2011, 02:35 AM
I'm 90% sure that he is alive. The fishing boat he was in was just of the cost of Goa Kingdom. Dragon was also near there, and to be honest, when Dragon stops @ Zoro's village for food, water and stuff like that, someone says: zomg patch him up. Patch who up? For me, it's Sabo. Why would Oda otherwise have the trouble of making a bigger version of him?

I keep on saying that he is alive and that he is the one that was talking to Robin.

We'll probably know if he is alive when they enter the New World or maybe 2 arcs from now.
Not sure what you mean by that. I do think sabo is alive though.

vagabond87
May 09, 2011, 03:13 AM
Not sure what you mean by that. I do think sabo is alive though.

There was one cover with Luffy, Ace and Sabo all grown up and running through forest. Sabos face wasnt shown on that cover.
http://www.mangareader.net/103-56760-1/one-piece/chapter-596.html

ownage404
June 26, 2011, 12:10 PM
If Sabo is alive he will not become a strawhat. They all said they were gonna go their own way when sailing the seas if i remember right they said become pirates of their own crew and I doubt he would go back on that and join Luffy's crew. With that said he most likely is with Dragon and at the least become a great ally for Luffy or a great enemy...

Vadz
June 29, 2011, 05:35 AM
well, i think in manga they didn't specify this.. but...

src. http://www.watchop.com/watch/663-one-piece-episode-504-english-subbed/
@. 01.50

theres some dialog that don't get shown in the manga...
and yeah, after knowing that dragon was also watching the ceremony of celestial dragon and looks like he just brought someone whos got serious injuries and get it treated on his ship...
well, to think of only 1 person who got hurt during the ceremony, which was sabo.. u think ?

Josl
June 29, 2011, 06:02 AM
First of all. You should NEVER take anything said in the Anime as Canon. NEVER! May I remind you on Zoro cutting Iron, a second porneglyph in Alabasta and even when thy HAVE information from Oda of what wasn't shown in the manga they still manage to screw up often enough like in the Robin cover story.

Second of all. This is the translation of CNET:

[Box: Let us take a brief step back in time... / ...to the evening of the day the Tenryuubito ship arrived in the Goa Kingdom.]
Ivankov: Dragon! You're late! / How long did you plan to keep me vaiting?!!
Dragon: Sorry.
People: Ahh... // Hey... somebody treat these wounds, quickly!! // This is terrible...!!
Dragon: How are we doing for provisions?
People: The people of the village dojo were kind enough to provide us with food.
Dragon: Let us set sail. / We return to Baltigo!!

On the same day when the Tenryuubito did arive Dragon comes late and some "wounds" have to be treated. Dragon isn't shown to be injured, so who might be? Bluejam?
It's like Oda drew a sign and said Sabo is alive, he could't have it made more obvious without showing Sabo alive.

Vadz
June 29, 2011, 06:40 AM
is prediction a canon ?

Poneglyph420
June 29, 2011, 03:52 PM
You know.. I hate to admit it.. I thought Sabo was dead.. and honestly I'm not sure why.. but I wish he was dead. Dunno why? Maybe for drama or realism...

But more and more it's seeming like Sabo was saved by Dragon and brought aboard the RA ship. It's more likely than unlikely, and well that's really that.

Indeed the anime is NOT Canon and cannot be used to state OP fact... However the editors and producers of the Anime get guidance from Oda.. So it would make sense that Oda hinted to Sabo's future and the Anime staff responded with blatant foreshadowing...

Hate to say it but Sabo is likely alive and with the RA...

Bugzee
June 29, 2011, 07:28 PM
When that particular chapter first came out, my first reaction was; sabo must be alive! Guess what? I still believe he is. Who else in OP could've been "seriously injured" that Dragon brought along the ship with him like that!? I honestly got the impression it was Sabo considering the previous exchange he had with Dragon earlier on in the Goa Kingdom.

We still obviously don't know for sure but many believe he is alive and I agree with them! :)

bittman
July 02, 2011, 12:07 AM
Who could all the wounds have come from?

http://www.mangareader.net/103-52556-14/one-piece/chapter-587.html

How about the many people Dragon picked up from a burning wasteland? I can extrapolate more evidence than there is around Sabo that the wounded are indeed the rescued survivors of the fire.

http://www.mangareader.net/103-54487-7/one-piece/chapter-589.html

Here is the page in question, Dragon has negotiated supplies from an island potentially some distance from Luffy's hometown: remember, Luffy met Zoro, not in Zoro's dojo, but a distance away. If you're suggesting that Sabo or Bluejam suddenly "appeared" potentially hundreds of miles away, and at the same time they outran a fully-crewed ship by simply drifting along ocean currents then that's a huge plot hole. Dragon's ship had taken on more than it could attend to, surely a score of people were rescued and it's doubtful that Dragon's ship just happened to have enough of One Piece's magical bandages to care for all of them.

The line about "wounds" is still somewhat odd, I will admit, but I also get told that Dragon showed no wounds - and I can even give you a debate about how not seeing wounds is not the same as there being no wounds. Let's look at the large amount of Dragon's body we see: well half his face looks fine = no wounds.

Anyway, I'm against a Sabo return, it does nothing for me from a story perspective and brings a few past occasions into question. Sorry to be a downer.

P.S. This has got to be the 5th Saboisalive thread I've seen...

mattiaildivino
July 02, 2011, 05:53 AM
mmmm but the anime should be supervised by the mangaka,then Oda should have let the anime do there. anyway it was sure.he must have survived.

Josl
July 02, 2011, 06:47 AM
Who could all the wounds have come from?
http://www.mangareader.net/103-52556-14/one-piece/chapter-587.html
How about the many people Dragon picked up from a burning wasteland? I can extrapolate more evidence than there is around Sabo that the wounded are indeed the rescued survivors of the fire.

Ok. Let‘s go through the time line again. This scene is 2 days before the World Nobles arrive:
http://www.mangareader.net/103-52556-15/one-piece/chapter-587.html
All the wounded people that might have been there would have been treated on the same night.


http://www.mangareader.net/103-54487-7/one-piece/chapter-589.html
Here is the page in question, Dragon has negotiated supplies from an island potentially some distance from Luffy's hometown: remember, Luffy met Zoro, not in Zoro's dojo, but a distance away.

Yes Zoro’s hometown is probably an island in some distance away from Goa kingdom but Dragon has not negotiated anything. He asked how the provisions are and one of the rebels told him that the dojo gave them some. In fact while the rebels did this he himself was somewhere else.



If you're suggesting that Sabo or Bluejam suddenly "appeared" potentially hundreds of miles away, and at the same time they outran a fully-crewed ship by simply drifting along ocean currents then that's a huge plot hole. Dragon's ship had taken on more than it could attend to, surely a score of people were rescued and it's doubtful that Dragon's ship just happened to have enough of One Piece's magical bandages to care for all of them.

No I’m suggesting that after the rebels saved the people from the fire they sailed to Zoro’s island to stock provisions for the travel to Bartigo while Dragon stayed on the Island to watch the arrival of the world noble. Why should he do that? Well he is on war with them and knowing your enemy is always good or maybe just to hate them even more. While he watched the arrival he saw Sabo being shot and saved him from drowning. After that he went to Zoro’s hometown where they saw somebody with terrible wounds which got treated immediately.
This is supported by the Manga because a) He made Ivankov wait a long time and b) someone has very bad wounds.
The reason why this thread was created is because in the anime Dragon says explicit that he went to watch the world noble’s arrival. But like I said Anime doesn’t prove anything. They might have Information from Oda or they might have assumed the same as me because it is the most logical.



The line about "wounds" is still somewhat odd, I will admit, but I also get told that Dragon showed no wounds - and I can even give you a debate about how not seeing wounds is not the same as there being no wounds. Let's look at the large amount of Dragon's body we see: well half his face looks fine = no wounds.

From pretty much anyone who is wounded heavily or was in a fight you can see signs in their faces but this isn’t even the point. The point is why does Oda not show him wounded when he is wounded, why should he write a page that starts with the sentence: “Let us take a brief step back in time to the evening of the day the Tenryuubito ship arrived in the Goa Kingdom.”? Why should Ivankov say he is late? Why even make such a page?


Anyway, I'm against a Sabo return, it does nothing for me from a story perspective and brings a few past occasions into question. Sorry to be a downer.

From a story writing perspective his death or better his being there in the flashback has absolute no meaning at all. Just think about it, what would have changed if he wasn’t there? Would Ace and Luffy become Brothers? Maybe not that fast but they would have defiantly become brothers because Luffy would never have given up trying to become friends. Would he always have tried to protect Luffy even without the letter of Sabo? Yes because that is his main personality trait which in the end got him killed. Would Luffy have trained as much as he did? Yes of course because his main goal is and was to become Pirate King and his motivation to become stronger than Ace would also have helped. The Flashback was not only to explain how Luffy and Ace become Brothers but one very important purpose was to give characterization to Sabo.

You could have also written the same sentence after Bon Clay fought with Hina in Alabasta. For example:” Anyway, I'm against a Bon Clay return, it does nothing for me from a story perspective”
He did play a big role. You could have said the same about Hachi, Mr3, Crocodile and I’m sure about many others. The point is that Oda doesn’t let characters die if he has plans for them and a character who met Dragon and whishes Freedom more than anything, who could be in the revolution Army has surely a big role to play even when you don’t see his role yet.