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Zmsp
December 28, 2011, 09:34 AM
Hello there,I havnt been to a forum for months but I was reading the last two chapters of OP and something came to my mind, considering we now know that the ancient weapons can be people, could Blackbeard be Uranus? I made some research and found out Uranus was a god who imprisioned his children because he hated them, a similar comparison could be made to what blackbeard is doing with devil fruits,somewhat trapping them inside his own body. And the second reason why I believe this to be true is the fact that his power seems to be capable of destroying the world, the 2 fruits we already know he has are enough to be considered overwhelming, but if he manages to get more,that's ancient weapon material in my opinion, far stronger than Poseidon's.

Thank you for the attention and sry for the lack of commitment to the thread,it's not beautifully structured and probably has english mistakes,but the general idea is there.



Edit : Added a poll similar the other thread of Poseidon

raDar
December 28, 2011, 09:56 AM
I'm a bit confused, are you pointing out that Blackbeard's a weapon because of his gained power of extracting Devil fruit abilities? Or because of his abnormal structure (based on what Marco stated in the war) that could have been the reason why he managed to obtain the Gura-gura ability? If it's the former then it would lead to the Yami-yami to be the weapon Uranus. If it's the latter, then then it will become a bit complicated since BB prior to having that ability, should first eat the Yami-yami fruit, which in the end would turn out to be a prophecy of some sort 'coz these weapons were recognized back then in the old civilization of the Void Century.

Zmsp
December 28, 2011, 10:19 AM
Marco said that he could endure two fruits because of his special body, but blackbeard said he needed the yami yami fruit to do so, so one could consider Blackbeard himself,as a person, to be the ancient weapon, because it's the speciality of his body that allows him to endure two fruits, while the yami yami fruit complements that weapon, by being able to extract the power that can only be stored in that body.

So basicly, Blackbeard's the vessel and the fruit is a way to make that power effective, it can be a bit far fetched because it needs to relate two different things in orden for the theory to make sense,but the fact that the yami yami fruit is related to darkness, it also makes the relation beetwen Uranus as an evil weapon and blackbeard's personality a bit more solid.
A similar connection can be made to the way the princess activated her ability,she couldnt control it,but a life or death situation triggered it to be effective, the same way that blackbeard as a vessel for devil fruits needs the yami yami fruit to be made efficient.

raDar
December 28, 2011, 10:26 AM
But the thing with Shirahoshi's different. She has it the day she was born, just not awakened. While BB doesn't have the Yami-yami, and as I said, some sort of destiny and all should happen in order to consider that weapon back in the Void Century.

And also, I'm in full support with the theory that Uranus is a weapon of the sky. Really makes sense.

kkck
December 28, 2011, 10:47 AM
I don't think BB himself is a weapon but I could see his fruit being one. Wasn't it hinted that BB was collecting strong fruits? We also have to consider that BB might be able to give his subordinates stolen powers. I have my doubts about BB being able to collect unlimited abiliites for himself so IMO it makes a fair bit of sense that he would give powers to his subordinates. Ultimately BB would keep the strongest fruits for himself (he already has the ability to nullify fruits and the strongest paramecia) and an army of selected strong fruits for powerful subordinates. If BB has the strongest abilities and the ability to nullify all other abilities then I could easily see him being an ancient weapon of sorts, it would make sense considering everything.

Zmsp
December 28, 2011, 11:53 AM
While I do know it's a bit far fetched considering the necessity for the same conditions to be met during the void century, this type of ancient context is usually merged with a deeper story so the relation beetwen the fruit and a particular being made sense to me. I do admit this theory lacks when it comes to explaining who and what exactly could be considered the "Ancient Weapon", but if you take into account that to choose god's name's for the powes, the author probably made them belong to a context related to mythology, but then again, Pluton was Hades ( I think?) and a symbol of the earth? So a huge battleship doesnt exactly fit into the category of neither a hellish being and would be more fitting to be called Poseidon, that being said I think the power could very well be related to Blackbeard. I also dont know if the ancient weapons have the same power, but Uranus was supposed to be the grandfather of Poseidon, so one could also consider it a power to be revelaled later for it's bigger significance and the fact that it'll be revealed later could also indicate it's the one that could be most surprising..

As for the yami yami fruit itself being the weapon, I find it rather strange that a certain fruit would be given that much power or relevance while it's antagonist, the light fruit, would have no particular meaning, so I do believe that Teach himself and his speciality could have more influence over the power than the fruit itself.

Sachsenhesse
December 28, 2011, 03:27 PM
i think he has a very good point... dont forget shirahoshi ist just a "manipulator" for the sea kings, thats why she is a ancient weapon

blackbeard has a abnormal body and can steal devil fruits and until now, we dont know exactly if teach killed thatch before or after eating the devilfruit, so his "abnormal body" could really be an device to absorb devilpowers from dead bodies and this would really be awesome

additional he talked about his plan to his new crewmates didnt he? how would they believe him, if he hadnt had good points?

i second that theory ^^

tret16
December 29, 2011, 02:43 PM
actually i kinda get what he's saying a little... i'll give my summary in points to make it easier to understand.

1. Pluton was an ancient weapon that needed to be built and then used. Makes sense since Franky had the blueprints.
2. Poseiden is a weapon that was born and then awakened when the times arised. Makes sense since we just found out that Shirahoshi is the ancient weapon itself.

Now before i get to number three i just want to point out that it makes sense that each weapon will be of different natures. For example, pluton is a machanical weapon and poseiden is a flesh and blood weapon. Most of us were assuming that Uranus was a weather type of weapon next. So this bring me to the number three point.

3. If pluton need to be built and poseiden needed to be born, then why couldn't Uranus be Collected circumstances happening in specific order to create the third ancient weapen. Almost like ingredient to a recipe. that recipe created the ancient weapon.

First you had the body (blackbeard) and then you add in the devil fruit (Yami Yami no mi) which then obsorbs the rest of the devil fruits (gura gura no mi) and then the rest of the devil fruits as well, and that there is the recipe for a third ancient weapon, hence Uranus.

just a thought that i would try and throw and share with you guys...

Kaiten
January 02, 2012, 12:05 AM
If Blackbeard is Uranus then Oda will have recycled one of his own plot twists. Let us all hope this does not happen, it would be a sad day in fandom. No matter how it came about, ultimately two of the ancient weapons would be people. Hopefully Uranus is something unique and Blackbeard is simply an important villain.

kkck
January 02, 2012, 02:06 AM
Well, if BB's yami yami no mi is one of the ancient weapons it would be a tad different from the shirahoshi scenario. Shirahoshi was born being able to talk to sea kings. In this particular case we would be talking about a specific fruit and its related abilities which would be an ancient weapons rather than a person in itself. And truthfully, considering the sheer power the fruit has and its apparent ability to steal other fruits I would not be surprised at all if it really had the capacity to destroy the world. I guess we do lack some context in this regard though. Would BB be capable of absorbing unlimited abilities into his body? If yes then obviously BB could potentially acquire enough power to destroy the world through a few more fruits. Even if there is a limit if he is giving several abilities to his subordinates then he would be building an army of strong people with the capacity to wield several devil fruits. Either scenario (or both) could easily bring about the same effect which has been shown to be characteristics of devil fruits. It would be kinda weird if the yami yami no mi is jupiter though, the myth name does not quite add up.

I do think we need to consider that jupiter might be enel (or his fruit). Didn't we see him going to the moon and awaking an army of sorts? Perhaps the combination of his abilities and the little army he awakened is the actual ancient weapon...

Uriel
January 02, 2012, 05:14 PM
The myth could not match but then again is One Piece and not an history lesson.

Having said that, I don't think it will happen like that. Blackbeard should not be related to ancient weapons at all to let him be the pirate to defeat to reach One Piece and then the issue of the three ancient weapons be solved against or with the marines.

Zmsp
January 07, 2012, 04:03 PM
Actually, I wasnt exactly saying BB is the ancient weapon for I also think that would be to repetitive, considering Oda's work so far, but the combination of both a special body and the yami yami fruit, since the first weapon was an object (a ship) and the second one a person, the third and perhaps most destructive one is the combination of a specific person ( someone with a body like Teach's) and an object ( the fruit), the same way that the power to talk to Sea Kings skipped a few generations,or at least that was partially implied, than this very same criteria could have been met somewhere in the past, during the void century, and is now met again with Blackbeard.

By simple association it was implied that the ancient weapons had the power to destroy the world, the Gura Gura fruit was said to be capable of destroying the world ( a bit of an overstatment by sengoku perhaps), so combining it with an alreadyamazing Logia type fruit produces a power of such magnitude it can be compared to the A.Weapons, at least I wouldnt bother looking for them if I had that power,and we still dont know if BB has stored new devil fruit abilities in his body..

It seems far fetched,but I think it is a theory with some well fundamented basis.

kkck
January 07, 2012, 06:32 PM
I don't think it is far fetched that an ancient weapon could be a person with the capacity to use multiple fruits. If anything it makes perfect sense to me lol. Anyways, the ancient weapon would not be WB but rather the yami yami no mi which would allow BB to get multiple fruits.

hokageji
January 07, 2012, 07:29 PM
I would think the weapon would need some form of Haki to use it. Shirahoshi's ability can be related to a special form of Haki ( my guess).

Blackbeard was always looking for the yami yami no mi, A DF which kinda gives similar abilities to Haki. It has the ability to nullify a DF ability, which haki can too.

Blackbeards hunger for DF ability kinda suggests that he cannot use haki. We havent seen him use it, though he is well informed and knowledgeable about it. I wouldn't think he is the ancient weapon.


I have suggested in other threads that the 3 ancient weapons would be 3 forms of DF fruits

Poseidon could be the zoan type fruit, where shirahoshi is the personified form and her ability to control Sea Kings.

Pluton and Uranus would be the other types, thus pluton coud be a paramecian type, a plant that spreads , and uranus would be logia type.


If all the fruits have to be in human form, then my guess for Uranus would be Dr. Vegapunk. Knowledge being the power of heavens

---------- Post added at 04:29 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:27 PM ----------

Or the 3 weapons could be the 3 forms of Haki...

Poseidon being the highest form of Kenbunshoku Haki

Pluton bieng the highest form of Busoshoku Haki

and Uranus being the highest form of Haoshoku Haki

kkck
January 08, 2012, 01:48 AM
I don't think haki has anything to do with shirahoshi's ability at all. Her ability is merely to talk to sea kings, no more no less. The ability in principle is no different from what keimi has shown with regular fishes, the only difference is the specie they are able to talk to. We have to face the fact that shirahoshi's ability is quite literally talking, it requires no further training nor development. Not to mention that if the ability was haki related then in theory others would be able to learn it.

I don't think BB ability is similar to haki. His ability is far more dangerous and if it was in any form comparable to it then it would not be worth a damn by itself. Haki allows contact with logias and people like luffy however even in that scenario the logia or paramecia in question does not stop being whatever element he takes after. To make a comparison, if luffy is grabbed by a haki user nothing would stop him from using his stretching or gears while in turn if he is grabbed by BB he would simply be a plain human. BB's ability goes far deeper than mere haki, it is a perfect counter to all abilities. More so, BB is familiar with haki and in all likelihood some form of user of it, there would not be any meaning to him getting the fruit if he could do it with haki to begin with.

Pluto is not a DF of any form, we already saw specifically that there were blueprints for it. I doubt the weapon would actually require to be given a DF, it would be plain weird, specially as there would not be a need for blueprints for such a thing to begin with.

Shirahoshi being a form of user of observation haki would make little sense. An observation haki user would be able to feel the heart of others however that particular type of haki has never been implied to allow communication of your own heart. All mermaids have the ability to take to sea life, that is no form of haki whatsoever. I don't quite see how a battleship could use haki either. Its not properly alive to begin with and haki is a property of living things.

Zmsp
January 10, 2012, 08:42 AM
There's one other thing that I believe that makes this theory plausible, the fact that when god's names are attributed to something it usually has something to due with mythology, people have been a bit too stuck on the idea of water,earth and sky weapons, when pluton pretty much contradicts that. If we instead consider not what the god's element are and focus on the whole mythologycal scene,we can find many more similarities to the weapons so far introduced, let us see :

Pluton was also the name for Hades, and is described in the manga as a ship, well I think the styx river crossing is something we've all heard about that so the relation between a boat and hell can be established, since the dead had to be carried across the river styx to make it to hell, or something like that,but the legend is pretty much this. So,instead of the element of earth, to which the boat has no relation with, there IS something we can relate between the battleship and Hades (and necessarily hell) and that is the boat.

Poseidon is clearly related to the power of controlling the oceans,which was something associated to the god Poseidon himself.

And now,after reading a bit on Uranus,I found out he emprisioned his children in some sort of jail, and if there trully is some relation between the weapons and mythology, that can be compared to what Blackbeard has been doing with Devil Fruits, emprisioning them inside his body.

Now I cant work on the details,but there's far to much of a coincidence for it not to be noticed.


I'm sorry for the crappy english.

Jorge D. Dragon
January 17, 2012, 07:05 AM
I hope Oda won't play this card again. He already has Shirahoshi as an Ancient Weapon, thus I hope BB will be just a fat man with two strong Devil Fruits. He should be just fine with it and his big and strong crew.
I actually see him taking other DF mostly because of his Yami Yami no mi for the most part and not due to other reasons, but I might be wrong if Oda goes the other way.:)

xeteboi
January 19, 2012, 06:48 AM
I think Uranus has a little connection with Blackbeard's DF. In Greek Mythology, Uranus was the Father of Sky, and roots of all the Gods that's why Uranus was the last to be introduced with the Ancient Weapons and maybe BB's DF is the root of all the DF's thats why he can acquire unlimited abilities as he want .. but I just want Blackbeared to become a super villain, no ancient thing connected..