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Thread: Israel and Palestine : A Never-ending drama

  1. #16
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
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    Re: Israel and Palestine : A Never-ending drama

    God I hate this topic.

    Until they resolve, the whole world will choose sides and debate.

    Countries like Iran aren't helping either.

  2. #17
    MH's Peacemaker 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Leen's Avatar
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    Re: Israel and Palestine : A Never-ending drama

    How can Iran help out when they themselves have problem with UN, US... with their nuclear program? Tehran has a lot of suicide bombers ready to bomb any US's major landmark....etc... but what use will it do to this world?

    I think that if the generation nowadays cant solve this problem, then it is us, teenagers, us, leader of tomorrow to step out and keep running for peace. That's why this thread is here, to create mutual understanding between people. If all the teeneagfers in Palestine and Israel love one another and want peace with their fellow friends, then this problem will be solved sooner or later. Youths, teenagers like US can change thoe world. Share your thoughts on this. Share your experience. Share your view. Share everything so that people can hear the voice of your end. So that mass media wont brainwash us into believing this and that for the sack of their political purposes.

  3. #18
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
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    Re: Israel and Palestine : A Never-ending drama

    Have u ever seen forum threads discussing this in newgrounds??

    It just becomes an all out flamewar.

  4. #19
    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member
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    Re: Israel and Palestine : A Never-ending drama

    Quote Originally Posted by Eileen
    Just asking, which side is US really on? In my country, US is named as "alliance" to Israel and that US is on Israel's side. My quesion is this, if US is on Israel's side, then why does US try to put more pressure on Israel like asking them to give away Gaza strip? Mass media's brainwashing. =/
    Because the land was captured by the isreal during the 67 war.

    Where do you happen to be from?

  5. #20
    MH's Peacemaker 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Leen's Avatar
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    Re: Israel and Palestine : A Never-ending drama

    The "Ask Eileen Thread" is just around the corner. Find it for yourself. My country is a muslim country. That's why I want to see from a unbiased party instead of my own mass media so that I know the story of the other end.

  6. #21
    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member
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    Re: Israel and Palestine : A Never-ending drama

    The US are an ally of Israel, but they also want this problem to be solved (who doesn't exept the fanatics?). That's why they put pressure on both sides. I agree that this is a matter that has to be solved by Israelis and Palestinians, but let's be honest: It can't be done without the support of the USA (and maybe the EU), because that's where all the money for both sides comes from. The amount of money literally being pumped into this region by the West is simply gigantic. The Palestinian government for example isn't able to survive without European money. That's why the tensions in Gaza are rising right now, no money for nothing, especially not for civil servants due to the election of Hamas. If you ask me it's useless to give money since a huge part of it will always disappear into some dark channels where it's being used for terrorist purposes.

    I don't want to be overly pessimistic but all peace talks so far have proved to be useless. As soon as there was a sign that the two fractions were getting closer some terrorist group blew up a school bus with lots of children in it so the talks would come to an end.

    What can we do? Keep out of this conflict. It's not our job.
    [img width=185 height=170]http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/3782/saddam7bf9jc.gif[/img]

  7. #22
    MH's Peacemaker 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Leen's Avatar
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    Re: Israel and Palestine : A Never-ending drama

    Keeping out of the conflict from solve the problem. Being too busybody isn't a good solution as well. Most importantly is still the younger generations. So long younger generations can learn to forgive and forget, to love one another, it will be solved one day. I felt so bad to have to listen to the same thing for the past 8 years of my life ever since I learned how to read. A lot of people dont even have a chance to read, they just got bombed. It's a sad thing. I believe no one want to see it happen anymore but is there something we can do? Maybe not, but there is no harm in trying to get people to join hands together regardless of colour and creed for a better tomorrow.

  8. #23
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member
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    Re: Israel and Palestine : A Never-ending drama

    As long as one party or the other believe that they have the right to the land, I don't believe this will ever end until there is a clear victor. When passions run so deep that the fighting go on that many generations...

    I agree that this is something other countries (including the U.S.) need to just keep out of as far as the fighting and not take a side, because both sides are just asking for the fighting to continue until one side surrenders. The part I would like to focus on is helping people and families who want nothing to do with the conflict be able to get out of the gunfire if possible - children shouldn't grow up constantly at risk of getting shot or bombed. I'd like to see families have a choice of either leaving and living in another country, or staying in the warzone and taking their chances.

    It's never a bad idea to pursue peace but this is one case that's definitely looking to be futile.

  9. #24
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
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    Re: Israel and Palestine : A Never-ending drama

    Want a proof of Conspiracy ? Look what happened to Palestine.

    I'll put it in other words. Image ( in the US ) Mexican imigrants buying land ( let say ) in Nebraska .
    * After 50 years they managed to acquire 30% of the land in Nebraska.
    * They built up a micro economy independant from the US (own agriculture and industry )
    * now they start gathering more and more powerfull weapons so they can " defend " themselves from rednecks bandits. * After that they claim that Nebraska is now "Neo Chicapaca" because 600 years ago their ancestors lived there and now they have the right to claim that Land as their own new country.
    * Now the US is fighting with those ex-imigrants to get Nebraska back , but Neochicapacan got way more powerfull weapons than the US now.

    Anyway that's how i understand it but instead of
    US put Palestine
    Mexican imigrants put Jewish settlers
    Neo Chicapaca put Izrael
    600 years ago put 3000 years ago

    Very dangerous topic ... but i'll have to say where i see the conspiracy.
    The jews knew from the beginning ( 1880 ) when they start buying land in Palestine , what they were up to.
    They wanted anough land to make a country. It took them 70 years but they finally did it ( in 1945 ) Jews owned
    30% of Palestinian land.
    But what we all forgot is that ... even if you buy lands in a country , you don't own that land (technically ) bcause you
    have to pay taxes for that land ( i don't know how it is in the US but in my country it's like that ) so you technically don't own that land to the point of claiming it is your country.

    And that crap about ancestors living there 2000 years ago? West Poland once belonged to Germany ,
    West Ukraine once belonged to Poland , Alsace once belonged to Germany , The US once belonged to the Native americans ( Indians ?),
    Australia once belonged to the boomrang throwers (aborygenes?).... so what. That was years ago. But the Israel-Palestine conflict started 56 years ago ( + -)
    and we know who is historically wrong ... but we live in a different time , and we're too kind to say you're wrong get the
    hell out of there , that's why we want them to compromise :-)

    Finding who's wrong was kinda easy ... but finding a solution is way more difficult.


    That's my point of view and i'm from Europe. I'm open to other explanation of this problem
    But for now that's how i understand it.

  10. #25
    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member
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    Re: Israel and Palestine : A Never-ending drama

    @ enzomars: Maybe you want to join up with Ahmadinejad. He seems to quite fond of conspiracy theories without any foundation ^^

    a very enlightening read: http://service.spiegel.de/cache/inte...418660,00.html

    No matter how much historians dig up, there will always be people who refuse to learn :P
    [img width=185 height=170]http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/3782/saddam7bf9jc.gif[/img]

  11. #26
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
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    Re: Israel and Palestine : A Never-ending drama

    Hehe nice interview. The man has a confused mind , it was hard to follow him in the begining of the interview. But i have to admit that he has sometimes an interesting point of view.

    But back to that conspiracy thing .. i'm not a fan but how do you call what happened in Palestine? I mean buying lands for over 50 years and finally declaring those lands , a new country. Sorry but to me it looks as if it was planed. And we know it was:

    Look for http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zionism God sorry but that's sick!

    "3200 years ago" ???? how can we even think about justifying such a thing?

    Don't get me wrong i'm not racist ( i cannot be in fact ^^ ) i have nothing against anybody. It's just that in the light of 120 years of historic truth i see that Israel is wrong! So if someone knows something i don't know
    ( beside that "3200 years ago" crap ) please tell me :-)

    ps: that whole truth was 50 years old when Israel was proclaimed, and nobody did anything. So if in 1960 the "Natives Americans" kicked out the neoamericans from the US today that would've been justify ? Or maybe do they have to wait another 2600 years before that ,cause it've been only 600 years :-)

  12. #27
    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member
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    Re: Israel and Palestine : A Never-ending drama

    You have to see this in context. Israel was also created by the United Nations in order to give the Jews their own country after the Holocaust. It was clear that it had to be in Israel/Palestine. The UN proposed a solution where both Jews and Arabs (there was no Palestinian people back then, all of them were either egyptian citizens or stateless) would have their own states in Palestine. However, the Arab countries didn't agree and decided to go to war. They wanted to destroy the tiny Jewish state right away and attacked it from all sides. Stupid Idea.
    Despite their superior numbers they lost quite badly. What you see now on the map is also the direct result of Arab aggression. They could have gotten their own state, but they were too stupid to accept. You see, the situation is not as one-sided as you portray it.
    Israel has a right to exist. The Palestianians also should have their own state. The two-state solution seems to be the most realistic option.
    About the Wikipedia article: I would take everything written on Wikipedia with a few pounds of salt!

    I think all people have a right to live in a country they can call their own - this is also true for the Kurds who happen to be divded among at least three countries.
    [img width=185 height=170]http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/3782/saddam7bf9jc.gif[/img]

  13. #28
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
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    Re: Israel and Palestine : A Never-ending drama

    Quote Quote:
    You have to see this in context. Israel was also created by the United Nations in order to give the Jews their own country after the Holocaust.
    So far so good.
    Quote Quote:
    It was clear that it had to be in Israel/Palestine.
    Don't see why it was clear. Ho now i see
    Quote Quote:
    The UN proposed a solution where both Jews and Arabs (there was no Palestinian people back then, all of them were either egyptian citizens or stateless) would have their own states in Palestine.
    Does it means that nobody lived in that territory? It didn't belong to anybody.
    Then who the Jews settlers where buying their land from?
    I can't imagine people living there , not having a name ( cause you're telling me that
    there was no such thing as Plestinians back there ) and not having any root to the bordering country. If they were arabs and they didn't call themselves Palestinians nor
    inhabitants of that land, then they were Egyptian ,Jordanian or from Lebanon or even Syria. Then who are those stateless you're talking about?
    Quote Quote:
    They could have gotten their own state, but they were too stupid to accept.
    If what you're telling is true about them being also stateless , i agree they were stupid.

    Quote Quote:
    I would take everything written on Wikipedia with a few pounds of salt!
    Hehe right, but what i was pointing on was accurate and it was the first link i found in the net ( don't make me scan my encyclopedia ^^ ).

    OK there's some few things i have to check up.

    I agree with you that all people have a right to live in a country they can call their own.
    And Judea is the most fited for the Jews ( historically talking of course ). And the Fellahin who lived there for centuries also deserved it.
    I kinda like the UN partition of palestine from 1947.It was kinda 50/50
    Too bad those 2 can't live together. My solution: let's force the partition of 1947 and monitor the borders. the first to start got NUKED hehe :-)

    one is sneaky,vicious and smart the other is too proud, smtime not really smart but overall stubborn. guess who i'm talkin about?
    Hey i made up a riddle ! (bad taste hum ?)

  14. #29
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member conan's Avatar
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    Re: Israel and Palestine : A Never-ending drama

    what a touchy topic you started up eileen, well I am a palestinian originally, but I live in jordan,
    being an arab and raised most of my life in arab schools, I think most of what enzomars said summarises what I studied in school in history, I am just going to say that a 50 and some year old conflict is not going to be solved in minutes nor in this forum but sometimes talking could help.

    I can detail the summarized history that enzomars wrote (ofcourse its what I learned in school).

    I just want to comment on what asmo said
    Quote Originally Posted by asmo
    You have to see this in context. Israel was also created by the United Nations in order to give the Jews their own country after the Holocaust. It was clear that it had to be in Israel/Palestine. The UN proposed a solution where both Jews and Arabs (there was no Palestinian people back then, all of them were either egyptian citizens or stateless) would have their own states in Palestine.
    ofcourse the holocaust is a terrible event, but the arabs nor muslims had a hand in that, so I dont know why they should be kicked for it even thought the ottoman empire and the muslim arab countries recieved refugee jews who ran away keeping their religion instead of beong tortured or ill treated in europe, muslims and jews used to have good relations until this issue.

    and the fact that no one lived there, I have been taught in school that that is totally untrue, I have been told by mother whos original village is in what is called the israeli state that that isnt true, and if that is true, how come there are so many refugee camps in neighbouring countries to palestine.
    they all lived in the inner borders of israel, there is a refugee camp a couple of miles away from my house in jordan, the refugees do not own houses, they live on a rented land by the UN, so the buildings they live in do not even have ceilings, they are not allowed to have cailings by law since the houses nor the land are theirs, they can not work due to not having the needed papers for satying in a certain country,so they get a small paycheck from the UN at the end of each month which is barely enough for survival, I know becuase a lady from that refugee camp is a maid that comes every friday to clean our house, she needs the money.

    I hope no one is offended, I just talked about my own observances and mentioned what I think is the most important thing in this whole issue, who are the refugees, that try hard every day to survive the next day.
    "Fighting was the only thing I was good at,but at least I always fought for what I believed in",Solid Snake and Gray Fox.
    watch some of the worlds best martial artists show their abilities in this thread http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5582

  15. #30
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member
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    Re: Israel and Palestine : A Never-ending drama

    What i know is that after the collapse of the Roman Empire, the area of palestine was ruled by muslim rulers and then after ww2, the british encourage the jewish immigration into the area. This immigration and the land purchases caused many problems between them (jews and palestines) and from since the war started and never ended and after britain backed up from supporting the immigration of the jews, the U.S began to support them.
    So what should the world do ? i think we should not interfere as many countries interfered and nothing happened and i think the solution is in the hands of both sides to stop this massacres and that what both sides (i mean the people not the government) wants. so it is up to them. No offense to anyone ??!!!

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