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i guess u couldn't say tha a loss, since the battle hadn't really finish yet.. at that time CP9 was bound by the promise with Robin ( the one that they will let the SH out of water7). in the end the battle did continue, and zoro won. it means that the enemy was beaten until kaku couldn't stand up anymore, that's the really conclusion of the battle.. not at the w7..Originally Posted by hmalik1003
who cares? i bet zoro lost to hella people. they are just not showed on page in the manga
i agree with what some ppl said, zoro meant he wouldnt lose to another swordsman...and so far so good
zoro didnt lose to either Enel or Lucci, unfortunatly in my opinion he has only won against the noname bountyhunters at whiskey peak.
he didnt lose to Enel cause after he was hit all he did was rest a few minutes then he was up and cutting beanstalks. same thing with Lucci. he was kicked away and fell down a chimney. a few minutes later he's up and cutting water.
Mihawk could have killed Zoro, no problem. but he choose to let him live, IE prolonging their duel. its not over yet.
but a swordsman(zoro) that attacks with intent to kill but fails to kill anyone is not in any position to say that he's "winning" anything. so no he hasnt lost to anyone and he's only won against the noname bountyhunters.
how can i reason like this?
simple, katanas are weapon that have only one purpose: kill people. If you do not use your weapon in the way it was meant then youre hardly a swordsman.
but luffy and sanji have never killed anyone either!
i know, but they do not fight with weapons that have only one purpose, they attack with their bodies. and bodies have a lot more purpose than fighting. so they have won tons of fights.
oh how much better the manga would be without the ban of death
Imho, Zoro defeated Baroque Work's Mr. 1 and CP9's Kaku. Even if they aren't swordman they fought as they were that.
with that logic you are saying that he didnt lose to mihawk but i think we can all agree that he did
and just for the record i agree with you in just trying to make it a good debate and what not so because im devils advicate im going to say that he LOST
eventho it wasnt a fair fight cause eneru isnt a swordsman
Mihawk spared him. why? because their duel was not to end there. Mihawk understood that this kid had the spirit of a true swordsman but he just attacked prematurely.
so he wounded him greatly and left him to live so he could come back and FINISH their duel later on.
so no he didnt lose and mihawk didnt win, their fight is just "paused".
HE DID LOSE. Um if he didn't lose then he wouldn't have to make that promise to himself that he would neva lose again. Do you see the logic in making a promise not to lose AGAIN if u didn't lose to begin wit. From what your saying, Zoro neva lost a match cuz he is still alive but then he wouldn't say AGAIN if he was dead right. and i was using boxing to show u how wrong u were. You don't have to die to lose(swordfight or whateva) that logic may have been useful in some otha manga but it wouldn't make sense in OP cuz HE IS STILL ALIVE
LOOK AT THE BEGINNING OF THIS THREAD
It is stated that he made that promise to himself. *napoleon dynamite* "gosh"
Last edited by hmalik1003; March 20, 2007 at 04:09 PM.
i see wat you mean ,Mr. Boff, with the fighting being on hold so that zoro can learn to fight with his mind aswell (whicih i dont see happening he is just gettting stronger not faster,smarter,... he is still no match for mihawk)
but i also agree with hmalik1003 zoro wouldnt have made the promise not to lose again if he didnt lose
you even helped prove the point that he lost when you said that
I have heard this debate from a lot of threads, and I have come up with my own opinion and that is I don't know lol, but Zoro did lose.
Everyone's overlooking one simple thing in this thread: There's an understanding, especially between swordsmen (but not limited to them), of the difference between a "match" and a clashing of swords (or whatever weapons they happen to fight with). Neither Enel, Lucci, or Kaku beat Zoro. Enel struck him with lightning and then left. He did not accept Zoro as an opponent; it wasn't a match. Lucci kicked him away, but he was fine, and Kaku injured him when he wasn't even paying attention. There's no way that counts as a loss. A loss is when both fighters put everything they have into the fight and one of them is unable to continue. This is the logic used in OP and in many other mangas. Both fighters have to accept these unspoken "terms" in any duel before either of them can lose. I would honestly expect people to understand this.
I agree with ubo on kaku and luchii. there was never a real battle there......BUT....
Enerus case is diff.They were all in a battle.zoro,wiper, robin, the knight ...they were all preparing for a battle. How can you say there isnt a battle?
and pls, i do not want to repeat this over again , Zoros sworn to never to loose another battle.....THATS ALL.....
No quote on whether the battle is with a DF user, Swordsman, sea monster etc
HE LOST.I m a huge zorro fan too.
Y cant u all jes face it.....
cause i like many understood zoro's vow to mean that he wasnt going to lose o another swordsman ever period, and he has kept his word up
ubo i too agree with you about eneru, kaku, and lucci but i dont agree with the "match" defination (or well i agree zoro wouldnt) when he was fighting MR. 1 the steel guy zoro was excited because he was facing a DF steel swordsman and they were both putting everthing they had into and zoro won, but he didnt count his win because MR 1 wasnt a true swordsman he could use drill attacks aswell
so that proves that zoro only respects battles with other swordsmen so he might have lost to eneru but he doesnt think of it like that just that he needs to get stronger and beat everone