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Translations: Bleach 595 (2)
I'm only gonna go by my gut now.
1 - Don't think I need to explain on why Yamamoto is here?
2 - Aizen. Also self explainantory.
3 - Oshō
4 - Unohana
5 - Other 4 Royal Guards
6 - Shunsui/Ukitake
7 - Sasakibe
8 - Ginrei Kuchiki/Yoruichi
9 - Gin Ichimaru
10 - Shinji Hirako
Rest what magicaurora said.
However, I leave out Urahara and Mayuri.
IMO they're positions are too hard to determine as they are masters of prep.
Mayuri with prep is dangerous for everyone, same goes for Urahara.
I'm also leaving out Tessai as Kido Corps wasn't associated with the Gotei 13.
Last edited by Beatrice; January 12, 2013 at 05:40 PM.
Killing without moral justice is not righteous. Killing for the sake of it is. It's two different concepts working together, similar to the death penalties across the world and history.
"Who would have thought that your strength, which I so painstakingly assembled, would be inferior to that of my own"
"Gin, Tousen, let's go".
He also warned Grimmjow about attacking Tousen, and had him as a direct subordinate despite having very strong Arrancar like Ulquiorra, Starrk or Harribel who would gladly lick his feet too. At this point it's very apparent that Tousen's loyalty wasn't the only thing he valued.
Last edited by Hakuteiken; January 12, 2013 at 06:18 PM.
Beatrice: if you want to include Kuchiki Ginrei in the list. He's long dead, we don't really know about him and he never had much of a role in the story. I think such characters don't really belong in this thread.
Torran & Duniak: Searching for keywords 'Yama', 'Ken', 'Aizen'. All 3 found -> my opinion on your discussion is that this has been here before and you've said all you could, and there's nothing more you can do to convince each other. Why don't you just agree to disagree?
Discussing total ranking is starting to get boring. Let me pose a more specific though about 'ranking of captains':
Shunsui and Ukitake. Who is stronger?
I rate Shunsui higher. His ability is more versatile (as far as we saw), and his physical condition is way better. If Ukitake starts coughng blood in the middle of a fight, it's pretty much game over for him, and as we saw in the fight against Hollowkaien, it can happen pretty much anytime (since he acted as if he didn't expect it to happen before he kills Hollowkaien).
Last edited by 0Xellos; January 12, 2013 at 06:07 PM.
And OP said former and current.I'm merely went by what was said.
And Ginrei being a beast is evident by one of Kubo's formula of Shinigami Power.
Even then, Yamamoto trusted him just like Shunsui and Ukitake in terms of Power.
And last time I checked Gin IS dead.
Last edited by Beatrice; January 12, 2013 at 06:21 PM.
---------- Post added at 05:22 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:20 PM ----------
I guess it's not about being dead, anyway. But if Ginrei is indeed dead, we won't have a chance to see his powers in the future, as well, which would then matter.
And we don't need to see Ginrei's power.
There were only 3 people told to protect Seireitei in turning back the Pendulum.
That alone speaks for power that Yamamoto entrusts Ginrei to protect the place when everyone else was gone.
Yamamoto said it himself:
Assume the worst, this isn't just some incident, the entire pride of the Gotei 13 is at stake.
Last edited by Beatrice; January 12, 2013 at 06:33 PM.
In the same arc, Kyouraku stated that he himself and Ukitake were the only ones to be captain for over 100 years by that time, and Ukitake reminded him of Unohana. Ginrei wasn't mentioned, so, even if he was way older by looks than those two, he hadn't been a captain for a century. At the very least, we might conclude he was no genius or could say he only took the position when his presence was needed. Too tough to elaborate on.
---------- Post added at 05:40 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:38 PM ----------
I don't think that Ginrei is dead, cuz there are no reason for him to. The last 2 major threatening events that the Gotei 13 had is the quincy war 200 years ago and the hollowfication of captains 110 years ago. He was seen alive 110 years ago, and since then up until the Aizen rebellion, there are no big events that can threaten a captain.
I think that he only take the captain position of the 6th division when none other in his family is strong enough to. When an individual qualifies as a captain, like Byakuya, he'll step down and let him take the position. He's one of the few shinigami that looks old, I don't think we can underestimate him.
Last edited by River_Capulet; January 12, 2013 at 11:33 PM.
1. Unohana (she said it 4-5 times and I don't see why she would be lying)
I think those are the Top 5 from the Gotei 13 atm. I left out Kenpachi because he's going to get stronger when he learns Bankai as well. When he reaches full potential he may be first.
She was clearly not referring to Zanjutsu because she said Zaraki was stronger than her and Zaraki doesn't know any Zanjutsu.
So when Unohana said she was stronger than anyone else than it means she could defeat everyone in a battle including Yama. Her Bankai also seems to counter Zanka No Tachi. Even if Yama is coated in the flames of sun, if his skin melts off then its pointless and he'll die. Unohana has her kaido with her as well.
Besides Unohana herself claimed she was bored of the sword and she was searching through Rukongai for a worthy opponent. Why would she feel like this if Yama was stronger than her? The only way her words seem to make sense is if she's claiming she's stronger than Yama.
Makes sense to me because Yama always avoided saying he was the strongest Shinigami alive.
Because Yama also said that the reason he is still the Captain Commander is that there hasn't been a shinigami more powerful than him in his entirety as Captain COmmander for 1000 years (which would include Unohana).
I can easily deduce Shikai Captain-Commander will be enough for Unohana judging by what she has shown. She was a criminal back a millennium ago, and she joined the Gotei squads presumably after getting defeated by Captain-Commander himself.
Actually, I view it as the opposite. She was:
1) No match to Captain-Commander's fighting capabilities,
2) Probably not allowed to fight her superior to death to her heart's content in any case.
Besides, placing Unohana above Captain-Commander is going to mess the already messed up power levels more. That would immediately place Kenpachi above Captain-Commander's level, which was probably around Bach's level at full, so, Kenpachi would have been given too much of a power boost.