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Thread: Yamamoto: Underestimated or Overhyped?

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    Yamamoto: Underestimated or Overhyped?

    On this board, I see a lot of conflicting opinions on just how powerful Yama-ji is. Some think he has power that rivals Aizen, while others don't even think he could take on the top several espada. I just wanted to know how people felt about him in a direct discussion of his power. I'm of the camp that thinks he's the only one close to Aizen's level right now if not currently more powerful than Aizen.

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    Re: Yamamoto: Underestimated or Overhyped?

    Some of the opinions are kind of silly. We can only judge him by what we've seen of him:

    -His reiatsu brought a lieutenant to her knees
    -Kenpachi gave him props
    -He can hold his own against two of the strongest captains in the Gotei 13
    -He has been complimented on having the strongest fire-type zanpakutoh

    I don't see any reasons yet to doubt his strength.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member gigantor21's Avatar
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    Re: Yamamoto: Underestimated or Overhyped?

    ^ I agree. His strength is real, but there's only so much to go by.

    One thing though. I think it's safe to say, at least, that he's the strongest captain overall. He wouldn't be the head of the Gotei 13 if he wasn't. Seeing as there are several captains below him that can take the Espada, his being able to fight them isn't a very controversial idea.

    But it becomes problematic once you get more specific than that. Which Espada could he fight? Assuming that he's the strongest, that Byakuya was able to manhandle Zomari, and that Zaraki freaked the shit out of Noritora, my best guess is that he'd at least be able to fight Ulquiorra. Again, we don't know for sure--he hasn't fought a complete match in the series yet, and we don't know much about how strong his students are so we can't use them as a measuring stick.

    To be honest, I say that he'd be no weaker than Ulquiorra, but that's just a guess. Until we see him fight all-out, against an opponent we know well enough to measure against, we've no way of being sure. The muddled nature of the power rankings in the series makes comparisons difficult.

    ...WTF is Aizen smiling about? XD

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    Re: Yamamoto: Underestimated or Overhyped?

    ^ True, but we don't ever doubt that Aizen is stronger than the espada. So then, if people can make judgements comparing Aizen and Yamamoto (which many do), why don't they translate their opinions to him and espada?

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    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member radical3113's Avatar
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    Re: Yamamoto: Underestimated or Overhyped?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zeus-Tails View Post
    Some of the opinions are kind of silly. We can only judge him by what we've seen of him:

    1-His reiatsu brought a lieutenant to her knees
    2-Kenpachi gave him props
    3-He can hold his own against two of the strongest captains in the Gotei 13
    4-He has been complimented on having the strongest fire-type zanpakutoh

    I don't see any reasons yet to doubt his strength.
    1- that was on purpose, even gin did it to the ichigo gang as well , and they couldnt stand up properly.
    2- (check no.4)
    3- dont make a difference ,if aizen has become a hybrid , then hes stronger than when he left SS, even though he already has twice a captains powers (man hes really hit the shinigami wall) yamamoto is too "noble" to gain more power like that, so hes probably hit the shinigami wall as well.
    4- dosent really matter ,at the time no one had encountered an espada, aizen was keeping his power under wraps, so he looked like the strongest.

    im not saying he's weak but ichi is a hybrid with unbelievable power, capable of being as strong as shinji, maybe more, but still has no chance against espada no.1, aizen commands all espada so must be much more powerful than all of them. in my eyes anyone whos hybridized (except yammy whos the espada punching bag)is beyond the power where a shinigami would "hit the wall"normal shinigami can only get so strong, hybrids, as strong as they want to train to.
    Who the Tobi am I?

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    Re: Yamamoto: Underestimated or Overhyped?

    This topic isn't about Yamamoto being the strongest. It's about people either overhyping him or underestimating him. I was addressing the people who underestimated him because they didn't have an adequate reason to do so.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member gigantor21's Avatar
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    Re: Yamamoto: Underestimated or Overhyped?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tsukisama View Post
    ^ True, but we don't ever doubt that Aizen is stronger than the espada. So then, if people can make judgements comparing Aizen and Yamamoto (which many do), why don't they translate their opinions to him and espada?
    Well, I don't know if there's a solid enough basis for that either.

    We know that he's stronger than the Espada. Hollows wouldn't follow a shinigami under any other circumstances. But since we haven't seen either Aizen or the Primera Espada fight all out--again, with someone whose powers we're well acquainted with--we can only specualte how strong Aizen is in a general sense.

    Hell, we don't even know who the Primera is, so how can people judge Aizen against him (or her)? Or say how much stronger Aizen is than they are, or compare him to Yamamoto in any meaningful way? There's no hard evidence to base an opinion on.

    ...WTF is Aizen smiling about? XD

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    Re: Yamamoto: Underestimated or Overhyped?

    Quote Originally Posted by gigantor21 View Post
    Well, I don't know if there's a solid enough basis for that either.

    We know that he's stronger than the Espada. Hollows wouldn't follow a shinigami under any other circumstances. But since we haven't seen either Aizen or the Primera Espada fight all out--again, with someone whose powers we're well acquainted with--we can only specualte how strong Aizen is in a general sense.

    Hell, we don't even know who the Primera is, so how can people judge Aizen against him (or her)? Or say how much stronger Aizen is than they are, or compare him to Yamamoto in any meaningful way? There's no hard evidence to base an opinion on.
    Exactly. We have no hard evidence, which is one of the main reasons behind this thread. Many come up with these various hierarchies, placing others above others, yet we have no real proof of anything. Yamamoto was just the prime example for me, as there are quite a few people who think he is super-powerful and others who don't. Aizen has (to our knowledge) used the Hougyoko on himself yet; so, he should still be within the confines of a regular shinigami. Most people assume he's more powerful than the espada and Yamamoto, whom most people assume is the strongest captain. Yet, if Aizen, who presumably is not yet a hybrid, is stronger than the espada, why not Yamamoto?

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member gigantor21's Avatar
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    Re: Yamamoto: Underestimated or Overhyped?

    ^ You hit it right on the head, I think.

    The comparisons between Aizen and Yamamoto are almost completely subjective. There's no real backing in the story for either side, no matter how you argue it--we just haven't seen enough of them to make any sweeping claims on who is stronger. All we can assume is that Yamamoto is the strongest in Gotei 13, and that Aizen is the strongest in Las Noches--but even that is anecdotal at best.

    Plus, again, even if that's true, we still don't know what that says about who would win if the 2 of them fought. Hell, there are 4 or 5 candidates for the second strongest captain (Byakuya, Zaraki, Ukitake and Shunsui). If people can't even come to a consensus on them, when we've seen all of them fight several times, how can one possibly say that Aizen is stronger than Yamamoto, or vice-versa? Again, no hard evidence.
    Last edited by gigantor21; December 08, 2007 at 08:49 PM.

    ...WTF is Aizen smiling about? XD

    Quote Originally Posted by Random YouTube Comment
    "Roses are red.
    Violets are blue.
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    Re: Yamamoto: Underestimated or Overhyped?

    Well considering he could fight Shun and Uki, whose complimentary powers make them near invincible, Yama-Ji is up there with Aizen maybe even greater than that. Look at his shikai, it has the highest attack power and it burn everything to ash, just imagine his bankai, he would be like the God of Fire.




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    Re: Yamamoto: Underestimated or Overhyped?

    ^I agree. If yama's shikai already is so big, I cannot imagine his bankai(Going by the tradition that bankai is bigger than shikai). i think aizen is somehow as strong as any vasto lord arrancar. Aizen commands the espada through controlling how each of them behave. His personality makes him able to push people's button and make them do things to him. For example, his shikai makes it impossible to attack him at all, and im sure he cast kyoka suigetsu on everyone of the espada so it makes them useless in front of him.

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    Re: Yamamoto: Underestimated or Overhyped?

    well i dont see how you can underestimate or overhype someone who has never displayed anything but a released shikai....and with just that shikai, lets not forget that it is the strongest of all fire zanpaktoes and that it pretty much lit the whole area up in flames...im scared to see his bankai...holy crap lol


    but still...i dont think you can guess whether or not he is weak or strong...but thats my opinion

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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Kanzen Shinkiro's Avatar
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    Re: Yamamoto: Underestimated or Overhyped?

    Yamamoto is easily the most powerful shinigami if not the strongest character in Bleach, and perhaps the only shinigami capable of singlehandedly defeating a vasto lorde. If anyone is being wrongly estimated, I personally feel that would be Aizen. Aizen has been greatly overrated and would most likely perish before a vasto lorde. Yamamoto might be overrated or underrated, but Aizen is far from the being the strongest of the two. I cannot wait to see just what Yamamoto is capable of once he fully unleashes the fury of Ryujin Jakka onto someone. Whatever that might be like, no illusion could match its power. The moment Yamamoto does so much as announce bankai, the battle will be already over.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Neuroff's Avatar
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    Re: Yamamoto: Underestimated or Overhyped?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kanzen Shinkiro View Post
    Yamamoto is easily the most powerful shinigami if not the strongest character in Bleach, and perhaps the only shinigami capable of singlehandedly defeating a vasto lorde. If anyone is being wrongly estimated, I personally feel that would be Aizen. Aizen has been greatly overrated and would most likely perish before a vasto lorde. Yamamoto might be overrated or underrated, but Aizen is far from the being the strongest of the two. I cannot wait to see just what Yamamoto is capable of once he fully unleashes the fury of Ryujin Jakka onto someone. Whatever that might be like, no illusion could match its power. The moment Yamamoto does so much as announce bankai, the battle will be already over.
    If that were the case, Yamamoto would be going on a rampage right now in Hueco Mundo. You might not be overrating Yamamoto, but you're underrating Aizen. Grimmjow is easily captain level and was on the verge of becoming a Vastolorde, and yet Aizen is powerful enough to contain Grimmjow with reiatsu alone.
    Last edited by Neuroff; December 09, 2007 at 02:20 AM.

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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Kanzen Shinkiro's Avatar
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    Re: Yamamoto: Underestimated or Overhyped?

    Quote Originally Posted by Neuroff View Post
    If that were the case, Yamamoto would be going on a rampage right now in Hueco Mundo. You might not be overrating Yamamoto, but you're underrating Aizen. Grimmjow is easily captain level and was on the verge of becoming a Vastolorde, and yet Aizen is powerful enough to contain Grimmjow with reiatsu alone.
    I for one do not place my faith on Aizen regardless of what he has achieved solely due his illusionary abilities. Personally, I hardly believe any of the hollows under his command obey him for his strength or what he is, but rather are under his command solely due to his illusionary abilities. All we know is that his illusions are virtually perfect, so who is to say he didn't simply used an illusion to achieve everything he has done thus far? Strip Aizen of his illusions and whilst he will remain quite powerful, he will be hardly powerful enough to overcome some of the power characters in the series such as Ichigo, Kenpachi, and even Renji. I am not saying, however, that Aizen is weak. Otherwise, I agree he is strong. However, he is hardly that strong.

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