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Thread: One Piece

  1. #31
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member fluke32's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece

    Quote Originally Posted by redcometfm View Post
    Emulate, not copy. Knowing definitions help in arguments.
    Dragonball also involved Goku growing stronger to protect his friends, family and even enemies.
    Hahaha I believe I have quite a good amount of japanese & manga culture exposure.
    And if you want to go for those kinds of quips, you shouldn't argue with a filmmaker who's studied storytelling to the extreme and studies the great directors like Kurosawa. So if I do in fact lack japanese culture exposure, you lack credentials to even analyze and judge the quality of storytelling of this manga or even stories/storytelling in general.

    I'd like to end this now before I get banned (even if you think I'm using a cop-out argument, I dont care) so let's leave it at that.
    Dude, I told you not to expose yourself too much and you just did.

    Film and Manga are two different things. Film captures motion that is harder to represent in ink and paper, thus the storytelling will be different. What you're trying to compare are two different types of storytelling and don't tell me that it's the same anywhere coz that would only show how narrow-minded you are..

    Spoiler:  Now you're looking for credentials?? show


    Also, if you think I don't know the name Kurosawa simply because he's the a rare great japanese artist on the top of youre head in your field of expertise, then shame on you. Even a manga enthusiast like me know the name of the director of Seven Samurai. The film which later became was the main influence for the anime "Samurai Seven." You should have used someone harder like Tetsuji Takechi.

    Like I said, you're exposure to the culture is lacking if even someone like me who doesn't watch TV too often, has no time to browse the internet too often, don't have access to any manga published, and only can depend on the 2 hour breaks to download scanlations to be able to read manga knows the who's who of other fields besides manga in japan.

    Spoiler:  My rebuttal to your dragon ball - one piece argument show


    Also, you're co-notating my earlier post in the wrong way as well. You may have been exposed to japanese culture but that wasn't the point. The point was you didn't understand the way japanese humor worked in japanese culture, hence you lack exposure to it.
    Last edited by fluke32; March 08, 2008 at 12:53 PM.

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  3. #32
    Artists of MH 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner diesirea~'s Avatar
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    Re: One Piece

    That's the seal of a great writer. Oda planned his manga from the very start to the end.


    View My

  4. #33
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member redcometfm's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece

    Any writer can do that. Doesnt mean their material is any good.

  5. #34
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Onomatopoeia's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece

    Quote Originally Posted by redcometfm View Post
    Any writer can do that. Doesnt mean their material is any good.
    Except many can't. Case and Point: Bleach and while not Toriyma's fault Dragonball too.

    It's a plus and clearly shows that he has an idea of where he plans to go.
    Last edited by Onomatopoeia; January 03, 2009 at 10:14 PM.

  6. #35
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member redcometfm's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece

    Quote Originally Posted by Onomatopoeia View Post
    Except many can't. Case and Point: Bleach and while not Toriyma's fault Dragonball too.

    It's a plus and clearly shows that he has an idea of where he plans to go.
    Bleach? Have you not read the manga up to this point as a whole? Its pretty obvious that some grand level of planning was done, even if it wasnt panels or dialogue written ahead of time.
    Toriyama did a good job of keeping Dragonball entertaining and epic after his intended ending point.

    Obviously youre a huge (aka biased) fan of OP who probably thinks its the best manga ever so its not even worth arguing with you since youll probably find numerous excuses and out of the hat reasons to prove Oda is "great".

  7. #36
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Onomatopoeia's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece

    Quote Originally Posted by redcometfm View Post
    Bleach? Have you not read the manga up to this point as a whole? Its pretty obvious that some grand level of planning was done, even if it wasnt panels or dialogue written ahead of time.
    Toriyama did a good job of keeping Dragonball entertaining and epic after his intended ending point.

    Obviously youre a huge (aka biased) fan of OP who probably thinks its the best manga ever so its not even worth arguing with you since youll probably find numerous excuses and out of the hat reasons to prove Oda is "great".
    No...it's not.

    Did you read the 20 chapters of fodder Fraccion fights that were obviously trying to stall on the plot? Did you read how Aizen threw away Orihime's power because it wasn't going anywhere? Did you forget "Hell"? Etc. Etc.

    Yes I"m biased it's not like it's an insult. Your biased too "thus it's not even worth arguing with you since youll probably find numerous excuses and out of the hat reasons to prove Oda is "terrible"." In fact I don't even know why I even debate anything because the person I'm arguing with is biased towards the other point and will pull out of the hat reasons to prove it's point.

    Cause you know it's not like everyone is biased.

    And yes I consider OP probablly the best Manga out their currently(Neuro might be equal same with Jojo's Bizarre Adventure, Soul Eater is pretty close too)

  8. #37
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member redcometfm's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece

    Im sorry if Bleach has a more mature approach to its material rather than appealing to little children like One Piece does. At my age, I cant enjoy reading people (drawn in horrific Tex Avery-like caricatures) go on a simplistic and vague journey with extreme reactions to things every two seconds with ridiculous bad guys (none of which ever die, only beaten up) and stupid dialogue over ridiculous topics.

    OP, Naruto and Bleach perfectly reflect the current three age groups of appeal and top market profiting. OP = children to tweens, Naruto = children, tweens and teens, Bleach = children, tweens, teens and adults (because of its mature approach to its story). At least Kubo Tite knows the value of good manga, unlike Oda who pulls stuff out of his arse to draw all that he can for his product and extend the manga as much as he can.

    FYI -- Im an open minded reader and I gave OP 140 chapters of reading to see if it could be any good. Thats an entire manga in some instances. Im STILL trying to give it one last shot (to Alabaster) but Oda is making it real difficult.

    I realize how hard it may be for some to have patience to see a plot unfold over time with Bleach so its understandable if your ADD is cured by OP mess of a ridiculously childish manga.

    I WILL give Oda one thing. The man has a passion for manga, with all the artwork he draws and inks (basically features) in a standard chapter. I will give him credit there. But it doesnt make up for an overly long, shit manga.

  9. #38
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member BlkHorus's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece

    if people want to talk about stories that don't really have it all planned but make up part as it goes then Bleach is a good example, but I would say even better would be Naruto. There are alot of loose ends in the manga that were dropped and never fully exposed as much as Kishi put into developing at the beginning. On top of that, the he has maybe a end picture of how things will end, but the journey to get there he hasn't really done well in a fe cases. Naruto is a good example (modern times) of a manga that had alot of effort put into it at the beginning to develop things, then as Naruto has gotten older, kishi has allowed alot of it to fall here and there with poor writing, too many plot holes, and extremely open-ended events to things he had worked soo much in building and got the reader entangled in.
    On those points for much of the modern mangas read right now, One Piece is by far better and complete. Oda has done well with keeping things tied together and really telling not just a story about the main character, but many of those that he encounters throughout the adventure and in the world. Those are the workings of a good manga when you can develop and continuously show shine to characters for reader connection, outside character actions, consequences, and contributions to world events and then still bring action to it. The only thing you could say is that One Piece doesn't bring as much emotion to it as Naruto does, but that again goes with the frame of what the writer set out. naruto was meant to be more emotional even though it lacks more character development and connection than One Piece (well save for Naruto and Sasuke). But One peice definitely delievers more consistantly than Naruto or Bleach (oh god help bleach!).

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  11. #39
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member
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    Re: One Piece

    Quote Quote:
    Im sorry if Bleach has a more mature approach to its material rather than appealing to little children like One Piece does... and stupid dialogue over ridiculous topics.
    http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/4/06/
    http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/4/07/
    http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/13/16/
    http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/15/10/
    http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/17/14/

    Right so this is the so called mature content from bleach right? ><

    these are only from 17 chapters and theirs alot more in the manga...

    Quote Quote:
    OP, Naruto and Bleach perfectly reflect the current three age groups of appeal and top market profiting. OP = children to tweens, Naruto = children, tweens and teens, Bleach = children, tweens, teens and adults (because of its mature approach to its story).
    all three manga's target the same audience... and the audience is quite a big range with ALOT of cross over.

    Quote Quote:
    FYI -- Im an open minded reader and I gave OP 140 chapters of reading to see if it could be any good. Thats an entire manga in some instances. Im STILL trying to give it one last shot (to Alabaster) but Oda is making it real difficult.
    Honestly both manga's are good, and both manga's have instances where they draw things out for too long. Also both mangas by the 140th chapter actually get into the story...

    Quote Quote:
    I realize how hard it may be for some to have patience to see a plot unfold over time with Bleach so its understandable if your ADD is cured by OP mess of a ridiculously childish manga.
    You just said one piece is to long drawn out, then you say here bleach requires patience. Isnt it safe to say that both manga's require patience?


    You have a point about one piece, but at the same time all those things apply to bleach as well... I like and read both manga's, i also like one piece more. Bleach has/had its moments, but one piece to me keep delivering those moments. I don't hate or trash on bleach, but your points also apply back...

  12. #40
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Onomatopoeia's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece

    Quote Originally Posted by redcometfm View Post
    OP, Naruto and Bleach perfectly reflect the current three age groups of appeal and top market profiting. OP = children to tweens, Naruto = children, tweens and teens, Bleach = children, tweens, teens and adults (because of its mature approach to its story). At least Kubo Tite knows the value of good manga, unlike Oda who pulls stuff out of his arse to draw all that he can for his product and extend the manga as much as he can.
    I want to see the evidence behind the bolded. And no your own personal opinion is not evidence. Because hack and slash with good guy's never dying and plenty of fan service doesn't strike me as "mature". Berserk strikes me as mature especially considering how it dances with sensitive issues(religion off the top of my head).

    Except Oda doesn't pull stuff out of his arse to draw all he can you've yet to give me an example.
    Last edited by Onomatopoeia; January 05, 2009 at 08:36 PM.

  13. #41
    Celestial Belgian 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member Koen's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece

    Guys calm down, keep in mind this is a one piece review. It sometimes happens manga are compared. Comparisons aren't bad but let's keep it nice (avoid unnecessary comments). Thus, let us not lose the purpose of the thread: commenting the user's review and the manga itself. So let us close the one piece - bleach discussion

    Anyway One Piece is a great manga. It has its own standards. It suprised me since I didn't like it in the beginning. Got to admit, one piece is a solid well written manga with its own art. Anyway good review

  14. #42
    Banned 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
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    Re: One Piece

    One Piece deal with plenty of 'adult' issues like racism, slavery, prejudice and discrimination, religion, censorship and propaganda etc.

    I don't see Bleach dealing with any of that. In fact, Bleach is not only childish and shallow (seriously Ichigo is the most one dimensional character ever and hes the main character..), but also predictable and boring. Nearly every fight is the same; I mean its ok if you want to make a plain storyline but at least come up wtih something new in your fights right?! The fact that there are no plot twists doesn't bother me; there are plenty of decent seriess without any twists in their plot, but Bleach is just a linear story with no excitement or drama whatsoever. Kubo doesn't even bother trying to surprise the audience or invoke our emotions. There is more talking then fighting..which is fine in a plot intensive storyline, but with a story like Bleachs (fight, win, fight, win, fight, lose, powerup, fight, win, fight, win), it really doesnt' make sense..

    Quote Quote:
    Honestly both manga's are good, and both manga's have instances where they draw things out for too long. Also both mangas by the 140th chapter actually get into the story...
    No, Bleach sucks.

    No originality, no creativity at all whatsoever. The art is simplistic. It may be attractive at the beginning when compared to One Piece (seriously is this the only reason why you say its more mature), but once you get used to the art in One Piece you'll notice the landscapes are more detailed and beautiful and the characters are much more well designed.

    Naruto, on the hand is much much better then Bleach. I hate Naruto to the core, but I admit that its a decent shonen series. I still prefer One Piece, mainly because off the inconsistencies of power in Naruto and teh fact that the main characters are unbelievably annoying (Naruto, Sakura and Sasuke all three of them..). However, the designs are aesthetically pleasing and the powers are 'cool'..which makes it really popular with western audiences. The storyline is also well thought out..unlike Bleach's.

    And no I'm not a rabid One Piece fan. I love One Piece, and I hate both Naurto and Bleach, but OP isn't even my favourite manga. My favourite is probably a tie between Kenshin, Vagabond and Akumetsu. Heck, it isn't even my favourite shonen series, which is HxH.

    Quote Quote:
    Guys calm down, keep in mind this is a one piece review. It sometimes happens manga are compared. Comparisons aren't bad but let's keep it nice (avoid unnecessary comments). Thus, let us not lose the purpose of the thread: commenting the user's review and the manga itself. So let us close the one piece - bleach discussion
    Ugh, I posted before I read your comment.

    Pls let my post stay as I spent the past 15 minutes typing it up. =(

    Thanks.
    Last edited by paradoxe; January 07, 2009 at 02:50 AM.

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  16. #43
    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner
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    Re: One Piece

    Nice review

    And I wouldn't say One Piece is childish considering my 30+ manga loving friends and I ,who are all in Universities, love One Piece, but all HATE Bleach :O (sorry just had to type that out XD). As one gets older, one realizes that being a child is really the best and One Piece, out of all manga, is the only one capable of delivering that to me. It's a world of imagination where nothing is impossible. This world just reminds me of my childhood days, thus I love it. The freedom that I used to enjoy, the stressless days, the friendship, the fun, "my world", and so on .... aw, good old days.
    Last edited by BoXs; February 06, 2009 at 12:30 AM.

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  18. #44
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member slippy's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece

    why stop the arguments? i was enjoying them.

  19. #45
    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner The2nd's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece

    Quote Quote:
    OP, Naruto and Bleach perfectly reflect the current three age groups of appeal and top market profiting. OP = children to tweens, Naruto = children, tweens and teens, Bleach = children, tweens, teens and adults (because of its mature approach to its story). At least Kubo Tite knows the value of good manga, unlike Oda who pulls stuff out of his arse to draw all that he can for his product and extend the manga as much as he can.
    No ill intentions, but Bleach is not for "adults", all it involves is hack and slashing thought the manga and is too repetitive, I will dare not try to use Naruto as a comparison. To be honest it actually takes braincells to read One Piece . I'm tired of mangas where the hero goes from a ass whooping to conquering everything within a few days of training. The story development in One Piece is unrivaled and it flows so well even after so long. Plus no way in hell can anyone pull out the Dragon Ball card since most people are here because of DB and the rest grew up on it.

    All in all I loved the review Moon and i want your siggy.

    Hi, you can call me Adi.

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