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Thread: NFL Thread

  1. #796
    ༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つMOLLY༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member xi0's Avatar
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    Re: The NFL Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by FrostyMouse View Post
    Ray Lewis is named to the Pro Bowl and states that he will be retiring at the end of season.

    ---------- Post added at 01:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:25 PM ----------

    I hope that the Ravens can find a Ray Lewis replacement, because it would feel really odd if the Ravens become a team that aren't about defense.
    I'm not sure if many teams will be about defense anymore with the direction the league has headed. We've actually played better on defense with him out of the lineup, so I'd like to think of this year as a an anomaly stats-wise.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaiten View Post
    With Joe Flacco starting, not likely

    Good middle linebackers can be found in the mid to late first round, the Ravens will be able to find talent if that is what they are looking for. Replacing the all time face of the franchise can be hard, maybe more so for the fans. Replacing him in the locker room will likely be the hardest part. Wouldn't it be funny if Manti Te'o was available when the Ravens pick?
    26 - The number of starting QBs the Redskins have had since 1985. Let's see some playoff wins from this regime first before you start bashing other winning QBs

    Middle Linebacker isn't as valued a position as it was when Lewis came into the league. I think we have talent at the position already, but not anyone who can carry the respect Lewis does or lead. Maybe Jameel McClain, but with his injury, who knows. It'll be interesting to see what Ed Reed does after this season, depending on the outcome.

    Te'o would probably be the most ideal replacement, but I'd have to see how the draft process plays out and where out final drafting position will be before I think that's feasible or not. He's moved from a late first rounder to mid first rounder in most mock drafts. With his Heisman nomination, I think his performance in the Championship game can only help his draft stock, not hurt it. Ozzie doesn't like moving up like that. He did it once for Kyle Boller since the Pats block us from getting Byron Leftwich and we all know how that worked out...

    Quote Originally Posted by FrostyMouse View Post
    Yeah, I don't think there's anyone that can ever replace Ray as the face of the franchise or his impact.

    It would be funny if he was available, but as strange as this might seem, I don't really see Manti Te'o translating to the pro level all that well. It's just a feeling, so it might be crazy, but I just have this feeling.
    Based on what?

  2. #797
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted FrostyMouse's Avatar
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    Re: The NFL Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by xi0 View Post
    I'm not sure if many teams will be about defense anymore with the direction the league has headed. We've actually played better on defense with him out of the lineup, so I'd like to think of this year as a an anomaly stats-wise.
    That is true. It really seems as if defense is on the way out in the league.

    Quote Originally Posted by xi0 View Post
    Based on what?
    I said that it's a feeling. I can't explain it, but it's just this feeling I have. There's nothing that I can point at as evidence for what I'm saying, but he's just not someone that I think will transfer over properly. I could be completely wrong, however.

  3. #798
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    Re: The NFL Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by FrostyMouse View Post
    I said that it's a feeling. I can't explain it, but it's just this feeling I have. There's nothing that I can point at as evidence for what I'm saying, but he's just not someone that I think will transfer over properly. I could be completely wrong, however.
    You see this with skill-position players, and someone who might be considered undersized for their position in the NFL, but he doesn't really fall into any of those categories. I have no clue what is 40 time, bench press, vertical leap, etc is going to be, but outside of that, him not translating over to the NFL probably wouldn't be for any physical reason IMO. It would be a mental thing.

  4. #799
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted FrostyMouse's Avatar
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    Re: The NFL Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by xi0 View Post
    You see this with skill-position players, and someone who might be considered undersized for their position in the NFL, but he doesn't really fall into any of those categories. I have no clue what is 40 time, bench press, vertical leap, etc is going to be, but outside of that, him not translating over to the NFL probably wouldn't be for any physical reason IMO. It would be a mental thing.
    Yeah, I know what you mean and it might be a mental thing in the end.

    There's just something about Manti Te'o which makes me think that something won't work on the pro level. It's like Sam Bradford and all of them. Players who looked good on the college level, but something about their eye test told me that they wouldn't translate to the pro level well. I never liked Vince Young, regardless of him winning a national championship, in college and it didn't work out for him on the pro level.

    Manti Te'o, as you said, doesn't seem to have any of the obvious problems that players who fail to translate over to the pro level usually do, but as we've discussed before, MLBs aren't nearly as important as they used to be and while his numbers look great on the college level, he's not going to get all of those picks or sacks from his position. He hasn't really faced any decent QBs, nor has he faced any really top notch OLs, and I just don't think that he'll work on the pro level. I think he'll be exposed on slants and routes by WRs and I don't see him being as effective against NFL OLs. Now, if Te'o goes to a great defensive team where there's a great DL, he'll be in a much better position to do stuff, but I don't think that if he goes to a team with a mediocre defense that he'll be effective at all. He's not someone that I see being able to do it on his own.

    I could see Belichick taking a chance on him at around 20, perhaps, although that would require us to move up, and if we're moving up, I'd rather see us get Matt Barkley, but he'll probably go in the top 10 because plenty of teams need QBs.

  5. #800
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    Re: The NFL Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by FrostyMouse View Post
    Yeah, I know what you mean and it might be a mental thing in the end.

    There's just something about Manti Te'o which makes me think that something won't work on the pro level. It's like Sam Bradford and all of them. Players who looked good on the college level, but something about their eye test told me that they wouldn't translate to the pro level well. I never liked Vince Young, regardless of him winning a national championship, in college and it didn't work out for him on the pro level.

    Manti Te'o, as you said, doesn't seem to have any of the obvious problems that players who fail to translate over to the pro level usually do, but as we've discussed before, MLBs aren't nearly as important as they used to be and while his numbers look great on the college level, he's not going to get all of those picks or sacks from his position. He hasn't really faced any decent QBs, nor has he faced any really top notch OLs, and I just don't think that he'll work on the pro level. I think he'll be exposed on slants and routes by WRs and I don't see him being as effective against NFL OLs. Now, if Te'o goes to a great defensive team where there's a great DL, he'll be in a much better position to do stuff, but I don't think that if he goes to a team with a mediocre defense that he'll be effective at all. He's not someone that I see being able to do it on his own.

    I could see Belichick taking a chance on him at around 20, perhaps, although that would require us to move up, and if we're moving up, I'd rather see us get Matt Barkley, but he'll probably go in the top 10 because plenty of teams need QBs.
    Can't that be said about any rookie though? There's some more severe cases, but anyone who gets drafted by a perennial basement-dweller is at an automatic disadvantage. The good organizations cater to the players they spend the most money on.

  6. #801
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    Re: The NFL Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by xi0 View Post
    Can't that be said about any rookie though? There's some more severe cases, but anyone who gets drafted by a perennial basement-dweller is at an automatic disadvantage. The good organizations cater to the players they spend the most money on.
    There are players that have gone to lesser defensive teams and made an immediate impact, however. I don't see Te'o being that type of impact player, however.

  7. #802
    Horosho 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member Kaiten's Avatar
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    Re: The NFL Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by xi0 View Post
    26 - The number of starting QBs the Redskins have had since 1985. Let's see some playoff wins from this regime first before you start bashing other winning QBs
    We're going back that far? The Redskins won two Super Bowls after 1985. With two different quarterbacks.

    Flacco's career stats compare well to Jason Campbell's. Actually, they are nearly identical.

    Quote Quote:
    Middle Linebacker isn't as valued a position as it was when Lewis came into the league. I think we have talent at the position already, but not anyone who can carry the respect Lewis does or lead. Maybe Jameel McClain, but with his injury, who knows. It'll be interesting to see what Ed Reed does after this season, depending on the outcome.
    Middle Linebacker hasn't been considered a high impact position since the 70's

    Ray Lewis was an exception, most MLB are run stoppers that generate few high impact (sacks, interceptions) plays. Lewis himself was drafted late in the first round, the 26th pick in 1996. He was the Raven's second pick in 1996. Only rare athletes at the position are drafted in the top ten; Urlacher (a college safety), Luke Kuechly, and Rolando McClain are good examples.

    Quote Quote:
    Te'o would probably be the most ideal replacement, but I'd have to see how the draft process plays out and where out final drafting position will be before I think that's feasible or not. He's moved from a late first rounder to mid first rounder in most mock drafts. With his Heisman nomination, I think his performance in the Championship game can only help his draft stock, not hurt it. Ozzie doesn't like moving up like that. He did it once for Kyle Boller since the Pats block us from getting Byron Leftwich and we all know how that worked out...
    Te'o will be probably be drafted in the second half of the first round. He's not that great an athlete, a lot of his playmaking ability won't translate to the NFL. He's not going to be able to run with "joker" tight ends, and he won't be able to drop into as many soft zones, reducing his interception numbers. His football IQ is very high, his presence will solidify the middle of a defense. But he won't be viewed as a high impact, defensive center piece. I can't imagine a team trading multiple picks to move up and get him either.

    Quote Originally Posted by FrostyMouse View Post
    There are players that have gone to lesser defensive teams and made an immediate impact, however. I don't see Te'o being that type of impact player, however.
    I don't either. A good run stopper, but not the all around player he is in college. He'd best fit a team looking to solidify their run defense, who will always fill his gaps, but might not make many game changing plays.
    Last edited by Kaiten; January 03, 2013 at 02:32 PM.

  8. #803
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    Re: The NFL Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaiten View Post
    We're going back that far? The Redskins won two Super Bowls after 1985. With two different quarterbacks.

    Flacco's career stats compare well to Jason Campbell's. Actually, they are nearly identical.
    I was just trying to emphasize the carousel. I like RGIII.

    And if Jason Campbell had the talent around him like Flacco has had, he might not be a backup. Stats don't tell the whole story. Jason Campbell came into an awful situation with too many OCs for most QBs with a modicum of talent to thrive.

    I'm a realist about Flacco, as much as a like to get my feathers up about it. But I can't accept the notion that we win despite him. That's nonsense.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaiten View Post
    Middle Linebacker hasn't been considered a high impact position since the 70's

    Ray Lewis was an exception, most MLB are run stoppers that generate few high impact (sacks, interceptions) plays. Lewis himself was drafted late in the first round, the 26th pick in 1996. He was the Raven's second pick in 1996. Only rare athletes at the position are drafted in the top ten; Urlacher (a college safety), Luke Kuechly, and Rolando McClain are good examples.
    The tides turned after LT and the shift to a passing game. However, the notion that the position wasn't still an impact position is kind of pointless. One could say the same thing about Safeties up until the last decade or so. But when you have a Hall of Fame caliber player at ANY position they're impact.

    And of course he was an exception, he's a legend. He wasn't drafted higher due to size. This was around the same time you saw a lot more of the faster LBs that could run with receivers over the middle and chase down runners off of the stretch play. When you go for speed, you usually sacrifice size, except in rare cases. Ray Lewis and Zach Thomas are the prototype for this type of trend you saw in the 90s.

    Honestly, I see a lot of teams moving towards a base defense with 3 Safeties, a lot like what the Giants do. This requires a big, fast Safety hybrid. Most likely a player who was a Linebacker in college. Sort of like what Polamalu was in his prime, Adrian Wilson and what Bernard Pollard is now. We've been seeing the OLB /DE hybrid for years now as a rusher/edge defender. Seeing more of these sort of roaming hybrid DBs seem like a natural progression with all these Freak TEs coming out of college.
    Last edited by xi0; January 03, 2013 at 03:24 PM.

  9. #804
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    Re: The NFL Thread

    Super Bowl picks?

    I'm going to say the The Broncos have what it takes. I wouldn't be surprised

  10. #805
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    Re: The NFL Thread

    Denver and Seattle are the two most complete teams in the postseason right now.

    Does that mean they're my SuperBowl choices? Hell no.

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    Re: The NFL Thread

    Honestly, I think that the Broncos have been a bit overrated this season. During their vaunted 11 game win streak, I think eight of the games were against horrible opposition.

    Their defense isn't that great and better QBs expose them. Von Miller has been really solid, but the rest, not so much.

    I want to say that we'll win, but I just don't see it. I'm thinking that it could be someone like the Packers, even though they can't stop the run at all.

  12. #807
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    Re: The NFL Thread

    So what do we make of the freakshow Minnesota has going on offense right now? It looked sort of dangerous at first...but...

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    Re: The NFL Thread

    This game is quickly turning uninteresting. The vikings had a good first drive, but not much success after that. Webb established he can definitely run the ball especially around the edges, but his passes are inaccurate. The Vikings need to make some serious adjustments at halftime.
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  14. #809
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    Re: The NFL Thread

    Joe Webb is embarrassing himself

    ---------- Post added at 09:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:26 PM ----------

    Jesus Christ...it's almost painful to watch

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    Re: The NFL Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by xi0 View Post
    Joe Webb is embarrassing himself

    ---------- Post added at 09:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:26 PM ----------

    Jesus Christ...it's almost painful to watch

    Embarrassing is not even close to it Did you see the one play where he almost got sacked and threw the ball straight up in the air with multiple green jerseys around ?
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