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Thread: Ireland

  1. #1
    Translator 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Pazuzu's Avatar
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    Ireland

    *shrug* Why not.

    Any questions about Irish, ask away here!

    (...if you call it Gaelic, you mught have a bit of a wait, though. XD)

  2. #2
    Translator 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
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    Re: Irish Language

    Maybe it's a bit much to ask, but could you give us an overview (1,000 words or less) on how modern Irish came about? Additional reference material (read: links) is welcome.

    Pretty please? I promise to teach you how to curse in Spanish real well in return.

  3. #3
    Translator 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Pazuzu's Avatar
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    Re: Irish Language

    I'm not sure exactly what you mean, but okay. I'll go with a history of the language.

    References:
    http://ga.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaeilge for Irish
    http://ga.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaeilge_na_hAlban for Scots Gaelic
    http://ga.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaeilge_Mhanann for Manx
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_history_of_Ireland
    Because Wikipedia has EVERYTHING.


    The two divsions of Celtic languages left are Gaelic and Brythonic. The surviving Brythonic languages are Welsh, Cornish and Breton. The surviving Gaelic languages are Irish, Scots Gaelic and Manx. Scots Gaelic and Max descended from Middle Irish, however, and are also either near-extinct or extinct.This makes Irish the only surviving Gaelic language still widely spoken.
    Irish was originally introduced into Ireland in 1200-700BC, making it one of the oldest surviving languages in the world. It was introduced when the Gaels took over, in the transition between the Bronze Age and the Iron Age. Records show this through carbon-dating iron tools, which were brought by the Celts. However, some scholars now suggest that an Indo-European language, ancestral to the Goidelic group of languages, may have arrived in Ireland as early as the Neolithic. If this is true, then Irish may be the oldest surviving language in the world.

    The original form, Primitive Irish, is recorded in ogham writing, and also had the first dictionary of a non-classical language in Europe, the Sanas Cormaic (which I've actually been trying to get my hands on for ages). When Latin became more popular as a language of study and learning, it replaced the formal language of Primitive Irish, and the day-to-day spoken language evolved into Old Irish.

    Old Irish can be fully reconstructed, unlike Primitive Irish, which mostly existed in fragments. Its structure was fairly standard for an Indo-European language: three genders, five cases. The sentence structure was almost identical to modern Irish, with differences in pronunciation and word formation.

    In the 10th century, Middle Irish was born. It was spoken in Ireland and Scotland, primarily. There's a huge amount of literature from this period. Tons. It was also here that the languages began to diverge into Irish, Scots Gaelic and Manx.

    ...and then we have Modern Irish, which we all know, love and speak today. Aside from some relatively recent import words from English which are often rejected by native speakers, the language has only evolved by itself since its original Celtic roots, with no external influences.
    And due to being taken over by the English over and over again, English has spread over a lot of the country and only about 10% speak Irish natively. Which is kind of sad, given that it's one of the oldest and purest languages in the world.
    Scots Gaelic has little native speakers, and is steadily dying out as a first language. However, it and Irish are mutually intelligible, like the Scandinavian languages.
    Manx is extinct, its last native speaker died in 1976. Irish speakers and Manx speakers would have difficulty communicating, and the written languages are completely different.

  4. #4
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member
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    Re: Irish Language

    I always like to start learning a language by first asking these ones:

    Thank You
    You're Welcome
    Good Morning
    Good Night

    How are you?
    I'm good ( or ) I'm feeling bad
    I'm happy to hear that
    What are you doing?
    Have fun!

    ^_^

  5. #5
    Translator 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Pazuzu's Avatar
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    Re: Irish Language

    Thank You
    Go raibh maith agat.

    You're Welcome
    Tá fáilte romhat. (You can use this to welcome someone in the introduction sense too.)

    Good Morning
    Maidin mhaith agat.

    Good Night
    Oíche mhaith agat.

    How are you?
    This is different in each dialect, but the "standard" version is "Conas atá tú?"

    I'm good ( or ) I'm feeling bad
    Tá mé go maith.
    Ní bhraithim mé féin go maith.

    I'm happy to hear that
    Tá áthas orm é a cloisteáil.

    What are you doing?
    Cad atá tú ag déanamh?

    Have fun!
    Go bheidh spóirt agat!

  6. #6
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member
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    Re: Irish Language

    Go raibh maith agat.

    You mentioned dialects. Which one do you like/use the most and why?

    Some more... excuse me for picking your brain :wink

    You're awesome!
    I don't know
    My name is _______
    What is your name?
    I love you ( might be useful sometime... never know... )


  7. #7
    Schrödinger's cat 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Anax's Avatar
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    Re: Irish Language

    GK, at this point you are lucky for being deaf, since if you ever get in a conversation with anyone Irish you'll just write these down, but umm, what are the rest of us going to do? With every word I read here my heart aches as I ponder the butchering I'm performing trying to pronounce it... I bet if Paz where here to hear me he'd drop dead well before he'd have a chance to correct me
    ~Schrödinger's Cat

  8. #8
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member
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    Re: Irish Language

    Haha, well, one has to start somewhere, right? And hey, you never know. I DO have to speak sometimes. Someday I might find myself in Ireland and having to not just learn how to write in Irish but also to say it as well (and lip-read all over again.) But yeah, I don't envy anyone having to learn the various different pronouncations.

  9. #9
    Translator 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Pazuzu's Avatar
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    Re: Irish Language

    Yes, pronunciation's a bollocks. You really can't read it out loud from seeing it written down unless you have experience with the language. It's kinda like English that way.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gold Knight
    You mentioned dialects. Which one do you like/use the most and why?
    Well, there's three main dialects, one from each of 3 of the 4 provinces. They're the Munster (south), Connacht (west) and Ulster (east) dialects. Mine's sort of a bizarre mix of the Munster and Connacht dialects, it's just what I was brought up with.
    The Ulster dialect sounds absolutely hilarious to me. In listening exams, we have parts from all of the dialects, and it's very common to see us collapsing in laughter at the Ulster dialect. It's just so...out there.

    Anyweh!

    You're awesome!
    Tá tú go hiontach!

    I don't know
    Níl a fhios agam.
    (I don't understand = Ní thuigim)

    My name is _______
    _____ is ainm dom.

    What is your name?
    Cad is ainm duit?

    I love you
    Tá mé i ngrá leat.
    A real soppy way of saying it is "tá mo chroí istigh ionat", "my heart is in you".

  10. #10
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member
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    Re: Irish Language

    I take it "Cad?" would be "what?"

    How about:

    Nice to meet you.
    Victory!

    AND

    "Come on... make my day"

  11. #11
    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member
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    Re: Irish Language

    Wow! I've always wanted to learn Irish. Is it hard, Pazzy? Judging from the way they just say "Good Morning" it seems a bit tough, especially pronunciation wise. I bet Pazzy knows this. Amaethon is the Welsh god of farming.

  12. #12
    Schrödinger's cat 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Anax's Avatar
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    Re: Irish Language

    i) Here in Greece there's various dialects, thogh none really official, people everywhere just speak standard modern Greek, and along with it dialects like tsakonika/τσακώνικα that seem to have a direct relation to dialects 3000 years old... We do love though with all the various accents! There's the northern Greek accent, or the Salonikan accent as I've grown to know it, where people stress theirs Ls in a way they sound really thick. Kinda like the Americans speak! Though the funiest accent has to be the one of Larissa, where people just keep remocing letters and endings from the words... Take the word "bird" for example, pooli/πουλί... they turn it to pli/π'λι!! Generally this is the Greek equivalent of a hillbilly accent
    There's also the accent of Crete and Cyprus, though they have a sort of dialect too which complicates things. For the Cretes I'll say this, they mainly replace "k" with "ch" in church... it's so friggin hilarious!

    ii) Could you at least hint us on pronounciations for these words/phrases you've mentioned so far? That is if you think it's possible to convey an accurate/close to accurate pronounciation via English
    ~Schrödinger's Cat

  13. #13
    Translator 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Pazuzu's Avatar
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    Re: Irish Language

    It's really really difficult to give accurate pronunciations though English, because there are a bunch of consonant sounds that aren't in English, and vowel sounds that are only in Irish English. XD And I don't think anyone knows the phonetic alphabet, so that's not hugely useful either.

    I think your best bet'd be to hunt for somewhere on the internet with sound files of it.

  14. #14
    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
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    Re: Irish Language

    Wow... I think this language is really interesting but it seems to be complicated to pronounce it.
    What I also like about Irish is..well...the written language looks so fantasy like. Somehow it's the typical "Lord Of the Rings"-style, isn't it?

    Anyways, Go raibh maith agat for giving us a brief introduction!

  15. #15
    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner EureKA's Avatar
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    Re: Ireland

    The only advise I'd give you is to practice your "h" with your tongue near the roof of your mouth. I'm not sure if i can explain it any better but it's the first thing that comes to mind to help with pronunciation.

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