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Translations: Gintama 507 (2)
- orbito: was meant to be a drop out, he has no real potential as a ninja. but kakashi took his sharingan and unlocked the MS. surely if orbito, who is a failure of a uchiha, has sharingans which can obtain the MS then i am sure there are more similar cases out there. therefore even if each individual sharingan user is weaker then mandara/itachi/sasuke the greater numbers of sharingan users plus konoha ninja make them a serious threat.
i agree the most obvious dispute was over ritual killings of sharingan users being the big objection. and imo konoha + the uchiha = serious threat, therefore the village was attacked by kyuubi. once that failed the uchiha clan was taken out surgically to prevent konoha from getting an edge.
Kyuubi attacked the village at least 5 years before Uchiha Madara and Itachi slaughtered the Uchiha clan. Remember Sasuke was in the academy and Naruto is pretty much the same age as Sasuke.
Your assuming that it was Obito's eye that let Kakashi do what ever he did to unlock his variation of MS when for all we know its all Kakashi and not a sliver of Obito.
- the initial attack on the village failed, the village survived and the kyuubi was not only stopped but kept as a weapon for konoha.
- the second attack was 5 years later, plenty of time for madara to regroup and attack the village again, so why only attack the uchiha clan? i believe there is significance there.
mandara realising it is far more efficient and less risky to eliminate the source of the problem planned to kill the uchiha and thereby removing any risk they posed and reducing konohas potential ability to combat madara. i agree that the uchiha clan as a stand-alone group dont pose much of a threat against madara however with the uchiha clan working along with konoha becomes something that might inhibit madara's plans. this is a theory so i dont expect it to be absolute, however in my opinion it is a strong theory that explains the massacre and still fits into the story.
because that would kill the keeping sasuke alive reason. could you elaborate on the above please.
The Sharingan could just be a reflection of an individual's chakra driven abilities and knowledge of utilizing doujutsu just as any other jutsu. Obito was weak with jutsu and chakra manipulation, his eyes don't have their own chakra, so Kakashi's use of the Sharingan will differ from Obito's. For Obito it may be more natural and require less chakra to use, but that doesn't mean Kakashi wouldn't be better at actually using it.
Sasuke is better then Itachi with Sharingan he is considered by Kyuubi to have potential on par with Madara. Itachi is about on par with Kakashi in terms of ability with less ninjutsu and more genjutsu. We have seen Itachi use 3 MS techniques Amaterasu, Tsukiyomi and Susanoo. We have seen Kakashi use a single technique that required him to gather up a large amount of chakra to activate and he had almost no real control over it. Kakashi and how he obtained his MS is unknown and for all we know its just a poor imitation of the MS that Itachi used.
I doubt Kakashi could be on par with a man who was the captain of ANBU. Also, as poor as Kakashi's MS is, it exhibits it's own unique jutsu which would be a time/space jutsu instead of a genjutsu, fire jutsu, and summoning jutsu.
All I recall the Kyuubi saying about the similarities were that Sasuke has the same cursed blood Madara has or that Sasuke's blood was as cursed as Madara's own blood.
if obito's sharingan have the potential to reach sharingan then why not others? and with capable users it would equate to more then just a minor annoyance for mandara.
THAT was the fateful day... ameterasu,tsukuyomi and susano wasnt unlock after he killed shisui... it was unlocked on THE day. That massacre day.... right?
He unlocked them after he killed shisui. You saw his MS when he got into the arguement with the Anbu. Sasuke noticed it and his father explained there are only a handful of people who have ever achieved that state.
MS is simply not possible for most Uchiha to achieve, lots of people attempted to do what Madara did and all of them failed....
I think before, you mistook my sarcasm for Kakashi.
The Uchiha clan definitely posed a threat to Madara.
First of all simply because of the fact that the MS has popped up in the past within Uchiha members, means that the possibility of it surfacing again within another Uchiha individual is highly probable. Plus there seems to be a genius nin every generation, so another genius like Itachi sprouting up within the Uchiha Clan is also very likely. Its naive to think that only Itachi and Sasuke could possibly awaken the MS. Also Sasuke wasn't even remotely equal to Itachi in terms of ability when they were younger, yet everyone expects Sasuke will be able to unlock the MS. And just the possibility that another MS could be awakened, leads to the possibility that another EMS could. And that poses a threat to Madara. Firstly because thats what makes Madara so powerful, and him being so evil, naturally he would want to smash anyone who could gain a power equal to his. I mean he killed his own brother in order to gain the MS, so the notion that he would kill again to keep it all for himself is nothing of a stretch. Also everyone is forgetting the fact that the EMS is capable of controlling the Kyuubi, just the possibility of the Kyuubi ever being used against him is also reason enough to destroy the clan. Also Madara is hell of old, which means he's found a way to counteract time, for how long who knows, but just the possibility of him living for an indefinite amount of time, supports the possibility that someone else with EMS could surface to rival him.
Theres something else too, with the appearance of Madara the idea of Itachi trying to measure himself up against the clan is kind of bs, because he had Madara right in front of him, if he wanted to measure himself up against someone, the greatest Uchiha to ever live would probably be a good opponent.
So seeing as how Madara means to stand atop the ninja world, sharing power with anyone doesn't really seem to suit him. For that reason i'm thinking theres no way he'd let Itachi gain EMS.
Because even if Itachi just ignored Madara and went straight for measuring himself against the clan, he would eventually, with enough power, attempt the same with Madara. And that's a threat.
But whatever, I guess well just have to wait and see.
here as well as admitting inferiority here, the topic of Itachi killing the clan has never been brought up once by Kakashi nor anyone else for the matter throughout the manga.
Itachi's greatest feat of hype would have to be defeating Orochimaru at the age of eleven. Itachi > Oro has been confirmed on three separate occasions throughout the manga - Once by Sasuke and twice by Oro himself.
Last edited by Franckie; March 13, 2008 at 12:47 PM.
Itachi killed the clan? Yes, but with the help of Uchiha Madara so it wasn't his (sic) achieve alone and therefore doesn't count too much for me.
Itachi was a member of Akatsuki at the age of 11? Yes, he was. but remember he's Madara's b*tch whose only reason of existence seems to be to have a skillful disciple with Sharigan for Madara. So I suppose his skill is not the major reason why Itachi joined Akatsuki at such an early age.
Itach could defeat Oro at the same age? Yes he did and I give credit for that. I could argue that Itachi "just" used some genjutsu and Sasuke figured this weakpoint of Oro very quickly out, too but this was seemingly Itachi's work alone.
Same goes for the Anbu captainship. I don't think Madara did help Itachi somehow with that; Itachi IS an excellent shinobi after all.
@Franckie: maybe it's not common knowledge that Itachi murdered the Uchiha clan? It appears to them that it was just some randome guy with a mask? Unlikely but possible. Who knows?