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Thread: Bleach 527 Discussion

  1. #166
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member MOrz's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 527 Discussion / 528 Predictions

    After seeing Ichigo so humiliated, I was shocked, that he of all the people would fail.Now, he have no sword...so time to ask Ishida for quincy training.
    Rest in Pieces.

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    Re: Bleach 527 Discussion / 528 Predictions

    all i could think off was where the fuck is hollow ichigo they really need to bring him back who agrees

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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member MOrz's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 527 Discussion / 528 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by totaldestruction View Post
    all i could think off was where the fuck is hollow ichigo they really need to bring him back who agrees
    Would be much better if they show us what happened to Ichigo inner world, is it still full of water?
    Rest in Pieces.

  4. #169
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member kkck's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 527 Discussion / 528 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by MOrz View Post
    After seeing Ichigo so humiliated, I was shocked, that he of all the people would fail.Now, he have no sword...so time to ask Ishida for quincy training.
    Well, nimaiya said something about ichigo not using asauchi as if it was a problem so I doubt suddenly focusing on other powers is quite the answer here. If not using asauchi is an issue then ichigo suddenly acquiring other abilities on his own could even go as far as being precisely the problem. Zangetsu hypothetically holds all of ichigo's powers so perhaps the issue is that ichigo is not really learning from him at all. Zangetsu can potentially even teach ichigo about his quincy abilities and even how to fire a cero....

  5. #170
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    Re: Bleach 527 Discussion / 528 Predictions

    Is it Zangetsu or Hollow Ichigo? I wonder who will teach him.
    Rest in Pieces.

  6. #171
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    Re: Bleach 527 Discussion / 528 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by mattiaildivino View Post
    nope,it wasn't a fake zampakuto,yet he started with a zampakuto instead of an asauchi,that's why he doesn't know asauchi.
    About unohana's unresolved bankai,it means she will survive,don't you think?
    Sounds like an incomplete zanpakuto

    I hope she survives, but I don't really expect her to..

    Quote Originally Posted by MOrz View Post
    Is it Zangetsu or Hollow Ichigo? I wonder who will teach him.
    Probably a darkhaired German version of Ichigo with glasses

  7. #172
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member g0dzax's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 527 Discussion / 528 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by kkck
    Ichigo is not doing something which should be expected of shinigami in regards to their zampakuto somehow....
    Quote Originally Posted by kkck
    Zangetsu hypothetically holds all of ichigo's powers so perhaps the issue is that ichigo is not really learning from him at all. Zangetsu can potentially even teach ichigo about his quincy abilities and even how to fire a cero....

    Well,my guess would be that,as Isshin said while in the Dangai,Ichigo has never communicated with his Zanpakutou and has always "bashed" his soul to get the abilities he had.Even when training for the FGT,Ichigo fought Zangetsu and Shirosaki merged.When learning to control his Hollow powers,he battled Shirosaki.All in one,he has never simply talked and communicated with his Zanpakutou; in this regard,he was oblivious to his Zanpakutou's own thoughts and opinions,and like Kenpachi simply fought to gain powers.IIRC,he has not done anything like when Hitsugaya was communicating with his Zanpakutou while in Karakura Town.This may be at base of the problem between him and the asauchi;he simply viewed Zangetsu as a friend but never truly communicated with him.


    Another issue I see here is what you metioned,that Zangetsu hold all of Ichigo's powers and by that it includes cero and quincy abilities.Thinking about this way,Zangetsu can not even be called a Zanpakutou;I doubt any Asauchi,after turning into a Zanpakutou,can teach to fire a Cero or Quincy abilities.This is strictly related to Ichigo's hybrid powers,and to resolve this problem and become a proper Shinigami,he would either have to discard his Hollow and Quincy powers or to completely merge with his Shinigami powers.Things are rather confusing lol.
    Last edited by g0dzax; February 20, 2013 at 01:57 PM.

  8. #173
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member kkck's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 527 Discussion / 528 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by g0dzax View Post
    Well,my guess would be that,as Isshin said while in the Dangai,Ichigo has never communicated with his Zanpakutou and has always "bashed" his soul to get the abilities he had.Even when training for the FGT,Ichigo fought Zangetsu and Shirosaki merged.When learning to control his Hollow powers,he battled Shirosaki.All in one,he has never simply talked and communicated with his Zanpakutou; in this regard,he was oblivious to his Zanpakutou's own thoughts and opinions,and like Kenpachi simply fought to gain powers.IIRC,he has not done anything like when Hitsugaya was communicating with his Zanpakutou while in Karakura Town.This may be at base of the problem between him and the asauchi;he simply viewed Zangetsu as a friend but never truly communicated with him.


    Another issue I see her is what you metioned,that Zangetsu hold all of Ichigo's powers and by that it includes cero and quincy abilities.Thinking about this way,Zangetsu can not even be called a Zanpakutou;I doubt any Asauchi,after turning into a Zanpakutou,can teach to fire a Cero or Quincy abilities.This is strictly related to Ichigo's hybrid powers,and to resolve this problem and become a proper Shinigami,he would either have to discard his Hollow and Quincy powers or to completely merge with his Shinigami powers.Things are rather confusing lol.
    Well, in that light the only issue there is would be that ichigo needs to talk more to his zampakuto.... Nimaiya gives another clue as to the meaning of this training earlier on:
    http://www.mangapanda.com/bleach/523/9
    http://www.mangapanda.com/bleach/523/10

    If we take that seriously then the situation is a tad deeper than merely not talking to the zampakuto much.

    There is no particular reason zangetsu cannot hold all of ichigo's powers and be a zampakuto though. The asauchi takes in the essence of the soul of the wielder and makes a power out of that. In this particular case zangetsu would simply have to take more abilities than what other zampakuto would. I don't think he actually needs to discard or merge with anything. Zangetsu and all the powers he holds are already a part of him, they are ichigo himself after all.

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  10. #174
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member
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    Re: Bleach 527 Discussion / 528 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by g0dzax View Post
    Well,my guess would be that,as Isshin said while in the Dangai,Ichigo has never communicated with his Zanpakutou and has always "bashed" his soul to get the abilities he had.Even when training for the FGT,Ichigo fought Zangetsu and Shirosaki merged.When learning to control his Hollow powers,he battled Shirosaki.All in one,he has never simply talked and communicated with his Zanpakutou; in this regard,he was oblivious to his Zanpakutou's own thoughts and opinions,and like Kenpachi simply fought to gain powers.IIRC,he has not done anything like when Hitsugaya was communicating with his Zanpakutou while in Karakura Town.This may be at base of the problem between him and the asauchi;he simply viewed Zangetsu as a friend but never truly communicated with him.


    Another issue I see her is what you metioned,that Zangetsu hold all of Ichigo's powers and by that it includes cero and quincy abilities.Thinking about this way,Zangetsu can not even be called a Zanpakutou;I doubt any Asauchi,after turning into a Zanpakutou,can teach to fire a Cero or Quincy abilities.This is strictly related to Ichigo's hybrid powers,and to resolve this problem and become a proper Shinigami,he would either have to discard his Hollow and Quincy powers or to completely merge with his Shinigami powers.Things are rather confusing lol.
    I think everyone is missing the point of the "without asauchi" thing... It's not that Ichigo has done everything without Zangetsu, he's done everything without asauchi --- meaning he never had an asauchi. Zangetsu is NOT an asauchi. How did Ichigo even get his blade??? no one really knows. My guess is he has to go back to Urahara and get some answers - real answers.

    Also, Ichigo is still in his friggen bankai.... wtf does that dude ever power down?

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  12. #175
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    Re: Bleach 527 Discussion / 528 Predictions

    I think he will get a lot of answers if he speaks with a Quincy actually.

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    Re: Bleach 527 Discussion / 528 Predictions

    I wasn't missing the "without asauchi" thing...problem is,first time Rukia transferred her powers to him,he simply appeared with the blade already accustomed to his soul.After Urahara's training,he just went from a broken nameless Zanpakutou to directly his Shikai.He simply had no asauchi,maybe Zangetsu as we saw him all this time is just a rudimentary form of his soul's manifestation or something like that.Maybe Nimaiya saw that Ichigo somehow does not use his true powers and manifested them without any guidance or whatever.However,given his words(that the ASAUCHI did not choose Ichigo) I don't understand,Nimaiya said he can repair Zangetsu but he does not want,yet the Asauchi themselves don't seem to want to get in touch with Ichigo(maybe they are scared of his Hollow powers lol).However,I still don't understand the relationship between Ichigo and Zangetsu;also,if Zangetsu is still broke,I wonder why Ichigo is even in Bankai.Guess some explanations are needed lol.

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    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member kkck's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 527 Discussion / 528 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Zan2pacto View Post
    I think everyone is missing the point of the "without asauchi" thing... It's not that Ichigo has done everything without Zangetsu, he's done everything without asauchi --- meaning he never had an asauchi. Zangetsu is NOT an asauchi. How did Ichigo even get his blade??? no one really knows. My guess is he has to go back to Urahara and get some answers - real answers.

    Also, Ichigo is still in his friggen bankai.... wtf does that dude ever power down?
    Well, under that notion zangetsu would be.... who knows... nothing? Zangetsu is not an asauchi, the whole thing about asauchi is that they are nameless and take in the essence of a shinigami to form abilities. It is true we don't know where exactly zangetsu came from but from your logic zangetsu is not even a real zampakuto and if that is the case then ichigo has to start over from scratch which means no zangetsu/shirosaki at all. I don't think kubo is just about to go in that direction.... And the whole thing can be easily resolved by having urahara come up with a zampakuto for ichigo for that matter.

    I don't think it is an issue for ichigo to remain in bankai. As far as I recall his particular bankai compresses power rather than releasing a lot of it like most do.

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    Re: Bleach 527 Discussion / 528 Predictions

    I imagine this will mean that Ichigo will gain quincy powers and then "heal" his own sword. Given that quincy can manipulate reishi and such.

  16. #179
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    Re: Bleach 527 Discussion / 528 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by kkck View Post
    Its a tad too early to be screaming plot hole like that, specially if we have not actually been told specifically what it is that asauchi were looking for in ichigo or what made renji pass. This is completely unrelated to strength or talent for that matter. Its not even a matter of zangetsu's loyalty either, that is not what is being tested. Zangetsu having the bond he has with ichigo is perhaps biased in regards to whatever the asauchi were looking for. Nimaiya hinted that a particular aspect of ichigo's relationship with zangetsu was off regardless of what zangetsu had to say on the matter and the whole point of this was to see if ichigo could realize that. Renji did, ichigo's didn't.

    ---------- Post added at 11:38 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:35 AM ----------



    I am more of the idea that no character is dead unless we either see the body getting obliterated molecule by molecule or we see a funeral. Unohana took a serious wound but it is not something which has outright killed shinigami before. That said, there is the consideration that unohana's bankai has not quite been explained just yet. I would argue that means she has a part to play in the near future either in at least a flashback or as a part of the actual war.
    well if it isn't a plot whole, then it is a retcon.
    i am sorry, but i jsut cannot help feel that ALL of what is giong on right now was totally made up on the spot. that these concepts did not exist until a few months ago. there is not even hints to any of this in the past.
    i am serious here, this is what it feels like. but, for example, let us compare to another manga. in claymore a certain revelation recently showed a dark new depth to what is giong on in it. at first glance, it felt as forced as this whole slaucht. however, when i read the previous chapters, after a bit of suspicion filled me, i found that, in fact, there were clues to this hidden in the past chapters.
    for its admitable flaws, the author had the foresight to have this revelation prepared with small clues from the chapters before. suddenly thigns i did not realize or think about suddenly sprang into focus, and realize that this was the author's idea the whole time.

    here, there are no clues at all. it was obvious at the beginning that the sword was an extension of the shinigami's own conciousness and power, not an independant entity from the user. that was the rule of the mythos. this seemed to be emphasized by the fact kenpachi could not hear the voice of his blade at all, and kenpachi is not exactly the kind of guy who spends time looking within himself. ichigo was, especially when he needed to protect people.

    now we have this cheap ass retcon of the whole matter. it is obviosuly a total retcon because ichigo got his sword the moment he became a shinigami. if a shinigami is Given the sword, whether personally or with some kind of power use, then they would ahve already known about ichigo the moment he gained the powers.
    obviously, at least at that point, the sword was an extension fo the shinigami powers.

    now it is all changed to force this new development that should not exist Bcause the swords were, orginally, not independent entities! even if he could not be accepted by the asauchi, this is ichigo we are talking about here. even in his earlier power levels, he defeated a handful of elite shinigami with his bare hands, even one who was the second in command to the god damn leader of the shinigami. he should ahve kicked their asses either way.
    and where the FUCK was renji when they were trying to send ichigo away? the fuck man, renji is a total asshole all of the sudden.

  17. #180
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member devstauk's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 527 Discussion / 528 Predictions

    Well i'd just like to say that i really enjoyed this weeks chapter, I mean come on whoever has read bleach from the very beginning can't say they haven't been waiting to see more about why Zaraki is the way he is, or his Zan finally being able to talk to him on a level rather the screams, fact is he was born at a time where everyone in SS(outskirts) was killing everyone but Zaraki even as a child was able to over come anything that was thrown at him, and even at a young age he was able to fight on par with a captain and the 1st Kenpachi at that!

    Then we have Ichigo being 'kicked' out of Royal Dimension, which could be taken one of many ways, one being that he was actually thrown out of RD due to being half Quincy plus Half Shinigami, then we have him actually being shunted off to a different test due to his unique abilities, with Nimaiya‎‎ having a grudge against it but has to obey SK's rules. I then think if its the latter ichigo will come to the realization that his Zan is himself so his Mugen Z as i like to call, final form.


    would make sense with the recent power boost of pretty much all soul society plus probably the Vazords(from isshin) with all that he needs to start thinking back to that time

    Spoiler show
    Last edited by devstauk; February 20, 2013 at 02:35 PM. Reason: Renji knowing for a fact those Aschachi superoarity was nothing compared with his own

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