Manga News: Check out this week's new manga (10/13/14 - 10/19/14).
Forum News: The nomination phase of the Community Awards 2014 is live! Visit new sections for Nisekoi and Kingdom!
Translations: Gintama 515 (2)
Well, miu has always been central to the story. She was the reason kenichi got into martial arts and started the whole ryuto plot points. Not to mention that it was her family that has been at the core of the plot so far. Her dad is still the one shadow and at some point the plot points that have been around since the start of the manga involving saiga will be dealt with and they will definitely involve miu to a great degree.
Well, kenichi's chances of surpassing or even catching up to miu have always been slim, specially since miu has been on the whole martial arts deal very much from birth while kenichi has been going at it for a year or so. For kenichi to get to where he is it took the special training from 6 masters each of whom has contributed with 100% of their time to make up for the fact that kenichi has no attitude or aptitude to be a martial artist. Miu on the other hand is just about second to none in terms of talent, aptitude and attitude towards martial arts and has been trained by the elder since her birth and up until now. More so, she finally mastered the release of her ki which means the elder does not have to hold back her training anymore which means that she will grow stronger even faster. Kenichi surpassing miu has never been a short term thing.... Most of the milestones we have seen kenichi cross were things miu herself had already gone through maybe even years earlier than kenichi even went into martial arts. Not to mention that kenichi has way to mental issues which hold him back as a martial artist... His weak heart prevents him from advancing and fighting at his true level. Heck, kenichi's attitude towards martial arts is so poor that he does not even enjoy sparring, let alone fighting with others(he had to be talked into having a match with takeda). His masters are not psychopaths who would pick a fight for the heck of it but they do in the end enjoy fighting and using their martial arts (to the point that before kenichi joined ryozampaku they would be a milimeter away from fighting each other on a daily basis without the elder's intervention). Kenichi surpassing miu is not something that makes sense within the short run, it should be something that should take him all the years which miu has already invested into martial arts.
Very few authors ever do dispose of their main characters... expecting anyone within the shinpaku alliance to die would be like expecting someone within the strawhats to die. The story has gained some diversity though, this is the first time the shinpaku guys have seriously fought yomis. Up until now they had been merely relegated to fighting strong worthless nameless minions at best. At least now they have relevance in the fight against yami. More so, this is the first time in which someone within the alliance has been ahead of kenichi in martial arts. Awaking and releasing ki is something which kenichi has yet to do and he has fallen significantly behind takeda and miu in that department. Odds are that will be the next milestone kenichi has to cross as a martial artist. Heck, perhaps the release of ki will be something that will play a part in defeating berserker to some degree. Berserker's berserker mode seems to be the dou rampage which we have seen a number of times. If berserker has actually managed control over his ki to some degree then his berserker mode is bound to have gotten much more dangerous. Perhaps kenichi like takeda will have to awaken his ki to have a shot here. Then again two people awaking ki in the same random manner would be repetitive. Kenichi is too much of a slow learner to awaken ki on his own and just like miu has been necessary for us to get a grasp of how dou ki really works kenichi will be necessary for us to get a grasp of how sei ki works and its disadvantages.
Im tired of grown men complaining about fanservice. If you can't stand it, you're not forced to watch. honestly this isn't a new thing, since the first chapter i knew what kind of manga this was going to be since every miu fight or girl fight gave us RIPPED clothes as a greeting...
read the manga for its plots and fighting action, not for the petty things like fan service which isn't even as bad as High school of the dead..although even that had a pretty good story to me since im a sucker for zombie/end of the world type stories, so the fanservice as saw as just icing on the cake, didn't take away from anything.
It's like watching a "die hard" movie and whining that bruce willis's bald head takes away from the movie and gives a disconnect...like wtf?!
Now besides that I liked the chapter when kenishi got 25% of the chapter given to show him off. It's nice finally seeing another fight because Mui's fight has gone on it seems for FOREVER.
I can't wait to see if kenishi unlocks his ki in the upcomming chapters like takeda. that's part of what's making me come back and read otherwise i would have skipped MIU's fight until the chapter where she dealt the final blow to Rimi lol which is hopefully next chapter.
I'm interested in seigfried's fight as well, would like to finally see where he stands in level compared to the other menbers of the shinpaku alliance
Last edited by bighawke5; February 23, 2013 at 07:18 PM.
There is something else I have been wondering about... what are the risks of someone forcing his ki out like kensei did with rimi? Rimi not only got significantly better but also got a shot at defeating miu before miu herself got her ki under control. Kenichi has been in a number of tough situations and in many cases he has had to power up fast in short periods of time. Rather than teach him kuroi nuki for example wouldn't it have been better to teach him the release of ki? I don't see any particular reason for kenichi to not be able to release his ki under proper training.... I guess that since kensei started teaching applications and release of ki to his disciples the ryozampaku guys might deem it necessary for kenichi to learn fast otherwise he will end in the same situation as miu against dou rimi.
@BASED Shinigami: So you complain first that Kenichi isn't getting enough attention then you complain second that its focusing too much on Kenichi and its getting repetitive? You can't have it both ways. The other characters need some attention and development. We are all impatient to see Kenichi's fight but Miu needs to improve as well. And, remember, in the past when Miu showed improvement Kenichi wasn't far behind in showing his own.
@kick: when did it say in the manga that supposed release of ki is based on talent? If it was then Miu, Lugh, or any other talented disciple would have been able to do it without instruction. You are also supposing that this ki release is something that is taught. Takeda did it on his own and so did Miu the only difference between them being was Miu was led there by the Elder (and Jenezad) and helped by Kenichi. Kenichi with his strong heart has always demonstrated a fantastic control over his ki. Maybe it won't be as hard for him to do it as you think - if he hasn't done it already and it just wasn't acknowledged explicitly.
More like they'll make him stronger when it is required, rather than make him stronger for just that sake...Im guessing that if he doesn't release his sei ki in this fight, then when he returns, with Miu having released hers and seeing the improvements he might make a request where they THEN decide to give him proper ki release training and control....
This is that same thinking that kept them from giving Miu this http://www.mangareader.net/historys-...kenichi/491/11 type of tendon and other training for her benefit for when she releases her ki...But EVEN then they STILL did not teach her how to release it...she had to do it in this fight alone and to get control of it with kenichi's help...
I think their overal attitude is that of unlimited patience and dealing with things as they come...hence why kenichi still hasn't been taught how to release it yet...
I could be wrong, but thats my opinion on it anyways lol
Last edited by bighawke5; February 23, 2013 at 07:54 PM.
We saw ki as something taught through rimi though. Kensei took her to the mountains specifically to release her ki and rimi actually said kensei taught her how to control her ki. Ryuto specifically says he learned how to feel ki and read it from kensei. In turn we also saw miu learning how to detect people through ki by herself.
Miu was in an entirely different boat, the elder actually held back her training and made it so that miu would release her ki later. It is only because of junazad's influence that miu started releasing her ki and the elder decided to just let her go and fly as the manga puts it.
When has kenichi demonstrated fantastic control over his ki? As far as we have seen he has never even applied it into a technique like takeda or some masters have shown. Ryusui seikuken is perhaps the only thing kenichi has ever done with his ki however setting aside this particular moment most of his enemies have found ways to disrupt it. Sho disrupted it through gamaku, boris dealt with it somehow too, ethan breathed differently, miu is too perfect for RS to work on her and koukin literally badassed his way out of it. Kenichi's ki has been refered to as strong a couple of times but he has rarely done anything extraordinary with it.
I don't think kenichi has awakened his ki at all... I mean, where would that leave kenichi? If he has awakened his ki then it means he has been barely winning against people with unreleased kis. All of the shinpaku guys would be a ki release away from moping the floor with the guy. When it comes to dou users they become able to push their enemy back by overwhelming them with ki and even sei users get the benefit of exponential increases in attack power (kensei mentions that). Even among kensei's disciples the implication is that only rimi has actually learned how to fully release her ki and lugh specifically says that he only uses a portion of his ki during battle.
---------- Post added at 08:34 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:26 PM ----------
Lets be clear ki in HSD Kenichi isn't the Force. It isn't life energy/power like in Dragonball Z to be put in a Kamehameha (despite what the Elder can do). It isn't magic like Gandalf can use to hold off the Balrog. Its not the True Power that Rand al'Thor will use to break the world. But its also not the mysterious, not quite real but not quite fake, energy source it is in real life. Its somewhere in between. All those waves and fire-like effects and blazing eyes that we see when some accesses their ki, whether sei or dou, is just an abstraction by Matsuena-sensei. Its really just a visual representation of their focus and strength (with a little bit of mysticism mixed in). So whenever Kenichi is using a martial arts technique he's using his ki. And all those times that Kenichi's enemies broke his Ryuusui Seikuken they used specific techniques and such that are designed not to be read so Ryuusui Seikuken doesn't really apply well. With the exception of the time Kenichi tried to read Miu. But thats probably a result of staring to deeply into a pretty girl's eyes, something that would cause any red blooded young man's focus to waiver (especially someone as ecchi as Kenichi, Ma's influence of course).Originally Posted by kkck
Soooo...Miu's ki training was delayed because she wasn't ready but Kenichi's training couldn't be delayed because he wasn't ready -- why? If your argument that Kenichi hasn't released his sei ki is true why can't it also be true that he isn't ready to release it? You yourself have pointed out that Miu's training is further along than Kenichi's because she's been doing it all her life. Under your own argument then, she has simply reached the ki release stage of her own training. Kenichi would then naturally come AFTER, right?Originally Posted by kkck
Also, just like he did for miu, elder probably doesn't see it necessary yet to teach kenichi how to release /control his sei ki yet. I don't think the masters are impatient at all, they actually don't see the need to rush ki release/control in their disciples it seems until necessary... Unlike Ogata. Ogata rushed to teach Rimi ki release and control, he rushed to make Odin use a strong technique which he wasn't ready for and it ended up making him a cripple. Rushing or impatience seems to be a trait of Ogata i think.
Quick Question to anyone that has an idea:
What's Odin's goal here? he's not fighting at all it and it seems like he has another goal...Diid i miss a chapter?
Last edited by bighawke5; February 23, 2013 at 10:36 PM.
Ki is not like in other manga (that has been a point in other posts I have made) however it is also a very real thing with tangible effects on a battle. Ki is not just an abstract concept. Ki has a direct influence on a battle to the point where ki has been specifically said to be the cause of an increase in attack power (takeda not too long ago for example) and in miu's case it was actually able to directly overwhelm her. Ki is neither what it was in DB or yu yu hakusho however it is also not some abstract concept or mere representation.
---------- Post added at 11:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:06 PM ----------
With kenichi the situation is different. He is a sei user, to begin with it wouldn't make sense that released sei ki would cause kenichi to lose control thus making him dangerous to others or himself. In turn kenichi as far as we have seen has never actually shown anything which suggest his ki has been released in the same way as takeda just did. Perhaps he hasn't gotten there.
Sei do gyo is not a technique which the manga has suggested you can be ready for though. As far as we have seen the technique is unusable invariably. heck, the fight has never lasted but moments after it is activated so far. I don't think there is a moment in which the technique can be used without the consequences we have seen. Even kano sho started losing it mere moments after using the technique. I don't think it is impatience... ogata took a risk there however only because rimi asked. None of his other disciples seem to be able to release the full might of their ki, not even lugh. At most they have been taught only applications of ki like sensing.
@kick: I'll leave your first argument alone since I think we're saying the same thing.
as to your second point we haven't yet seen the dangers of sei ki. What would lead a person like Kushinada Mikumo down the path of asura, for example. I would think that maybe a sei User would become TOO detached and stop caring whereas a dou User cares so much they go from anger to rage. Sensei big boobs doesn't seem to care all that much about "lesser beings".
Actually I think given Chikage-chan's current emotional turmoil we might get an answer to that soon.
But I think bighawke5 hit the nail on the head. What IS Asamiya "Odin" Ryuuto up to? He's been acting very...un-Yomi-like for a long time. When is the big reveal? And what? Will he stand up from his wheel chair, flip Ogata the bird, and say, "Fsck you! This homey is out, bitches! PEACE!"...... or y'know something like that.
And where the hell is Tsutomu Tanaka? Shouldn't he be throwing down right about now?!
I don't think detachment or attachment is something which has to do with either type of ki. Even anger and calmness are not entirely limited to either type of ki. It is true dou ki has been linked to anger and strong emotions and sei to calmness however at a more fundamental level the situation is that dou makes ki explode and sei concentrates it. Akira and kisame for example are sei types however neither of them is detached in the least. Neither of them in against getting severely pissed of for that matter. We saw an angry kisame go against alexander and try to start a fight with shiba. Akira got damned pissed of at junazad when he taunted him for the sho incident... Akira has not let go of a single emotion, he just does not express it. In turn we have seen dou users who simply don't give a damn. Look at oogata, he does not give a damn about anything than the abstract concept of martial arts. He has said he cares about his disciples however even that is kinda limited considering he has not once been worried about any of them dying. Sakaki is a dou user and he is not particularly overly attached for that matter, at least not more than just about any other of kenichi's masters. If sei and dou are opposites then it is like that the risks also mirror each other. If a dou user is at risk of rampaging then a sei user would be at risk of... the extreme opposite, remaining completely passive and just continually read the situation.
More so, the detachment you mention is not a matter of ki but rather it is a matter of satsujinken vs katsujinken. A caring heart which protects vs a cold heart that kills. Chikage is not struggling with being a sei (although I would argue it is entirely possible for chikage or mikumo to be successful at that martial art with dou ki considering that the only difference as far as applying their style would be feeling their enemy against reading his movements) or dou but rather on whether she is able to turn down her emotions and kill in cold blood because she was ordered too.
Omg Tanaka as well! I forgot he has a this incredible vendetta against ogata...
I know tanaka has actually been tracking Ogata accurately enough so he should know he appeared here..
Ryuuto really hasnt been acting yomi like for a while...he's been very different and now this...he's not fighting at all and looks like there's something on his mind/he wants to say.. In any case he certainly isn't there to fight at all unlike his fellow mates, is the feeling i get.
Through the manga we have seen kenichi occasionally get pissed off when miu is attack and even apparently get a very real power boost. I wonder if perhaps the power increase he has is the release of his ki. For kenichi seeing miu get attacked would perhaps be like a moment of clarity, he gets completely over the weakness of his heart and focuses on the task at hand (which would be saving miu). If this is the case then perhaps kenichi has been ready to release his ki for a long time but hasn't done it out of being talentless though.
@kkck: Have you ever heard the expression: "Beating a dead horse"?