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Thread: kaito

  1. #1
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member souhail's Avatar
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    Post kaito

    spoiler for non manga readers


    Spoiler show

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member futurefrog's Avatar
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    Re: kaito

    I think that Kite is very strong, I'd say he would be on an even playing field with some of the Troupe 1 on 1.
    I don't have anything to back up these claims but its just how I view his strength.

    "If you want to understand someone, find out what makes them angry."

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
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    Re: kaito

    Of course Kite is much stronger than the average Spider when you consider about 1/3 of them aren't even combat specialists. Knuckles is said to be around Kite's level and was picked as one of the Hunter to fight the Ants. Let's imagine instead of the Ants the same team assaulted a stronghold held by the Spiders. There's no way the Hunters could possibly lose (otherwise they might really need to reconsider who to send to save the world) even though they'd be outnumbered 2 to 1 roughly.

    Now the problem with Kite is that his ability has a large degree of randomness. I saw a fan comic that shows Kite drawing a bow and arrow against Pitou after he lost his arm and Kite sighs and dies. While this is madeup it's entirely possible given the nature of his ability. Presumably there are some kind of 'jackpot' weapons he can pull but on the other hand there are probably duds in his roulette too. For example his scythe wouldn't be very useful against someone who fights hand-to-hand (which is a lot of Spiders).

  4. #4
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member souhail's Avatar
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    Re: kaito

    i don't think it's a good factor to measure with the strength of a new user..but he can extend his en to 45 meters ..nobunaga who is 7th in strength and a fighter meant to act as a shield for the spider troup ..can do it up to 4
    another thing
    Kaito lost his arm trying to warn the kids to run ..Nevertheless Pitou is shown roughed up a bit after the fight. he accomplished this damage while injured a fatal injury.
    Skip to Feitan, a top tier Ryodan, struggliing against a division leader ant before eventually obliterating it. I can't imagine the top tier Ryodan doing much better against Pitou
    Last edited by souhail; February 22, 2013 at 08:56 PM.

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    Re: kaito

    Quote Originally Posted by souhail View Post
    i don't think it's a good factor to measure with the strength of a new user..but he can extend his en to 45 meters ..nobunaga who is 7th in strength and a fighter meant to act as a shield for the spider troup ..can do it up to 4
    another thing
    Kaito lost his arm trying to warn the kids to run ..Nevertheless Pitou is shown roughed up a bit after the fight. he accomplished this damage while injured a fatal injury.
    Skip to Feitan, a top tier Ryodan, struggliing against a division leader ant before eventually obliterating it. I can't imagine the top tier Ryodan doing much better against Pitou
    It's possible the blood on Pitou is just Kite's blood. It's difficult to estimate Kite's power because his power can fluctuate greatly depending on what came out of the roulette. We don't know if he drew something especially good, normal, or especially bad in this fight. For example had Kite drew the scythe he most likely would've lost instantly because there's absolutely no way he can keep Pitou far enough away to even attack with the scythe. Honestly, his ability is pretty bad for fighting, because we know Kite is one of the stronger Hunters out there, so his base stats are already top notch by human standards. Therefore, drawing an even better weapon doesn't really help him much (because he's already stronger than most people), but drawing a terrible weapon could cause him to lose/die a fight he could've won with a normal weapon. His ability would be more suited for a weaker person who needs to hope to get lucky with a jackpot weapon to win.

  6. #6
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member souhail's Avatar
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    Re: kaito

    first it's obvious that those are injuries not just blood spots..even pitos clothes are tattered.

    i myself don't like kites ability so far but it is shown that he don't have just weapons in that roulette..he can even survive death that means his ability is not just a gamble to get regular weapons

    and to gamble every time to get a weapon is a condition set for his ability to provide something more powerful than regular weapons

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    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
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    Re: kaito

    To be fair Feitan was really rusty.

    Also, Zazan was a division leader? Wasn't she the queen?

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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Tenacious Weezy's Avatar
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    Re: kaito

    Kaito as a human was definitely at a high level (ie: Hisoka) his abilities were a bit random but they were all strong just not complimentary perhaps.
    As an ant he's likely the same level of power but I'd say because he's an ant he has more latent power or to put it simply he has more potential to get stronger as time goes on than compared to as a human. I also think he's the same person but his demeanor and motives have changed significantly to the point where he'll focus more on his battle prowess. Hopefully we'll get to see for ourselves.

    Feitan wasn't rusty but he really wasn't trying. He didn't use his ability until the end and only because he got hurt.

    Zazan wasn't a queen but she wanted to be one

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    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member souhail's Avatar
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    Re: kaito

    feiten wasn't that rusty the think is that his condition for rising sun Require him having damage that's the bad part about feitens ability

    and for kaito ant he definitely not the same as mereum despite bing his twin ..because mereum came out the womb before time...kaito was still a tiny baby ..so clearly he is not in meruem level
    Last edited by souhail; February 23, 2013 at 11:15 AM.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member exacta's Avatar
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    Re: kaito

    I wish we could see Kite's other weapons.....I would love to see him fight more. He probably has my favorite Nen ability.

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    Re: kaito

    In HxH is hard to compare strength unless you count Aura Points. And those don't determine a battle neither. It's hard to figure out if He's a the level of the Ryodan when the level of the Ryodan is kinda unknown. Yes, we have seen them fight but those were not fight-for-live showdowns. And the only one who fought to death was Uvogin, who dealt with 5 Nen Users simultaneously. And I'm pretty sure that Uvogin would kick Bomber ass as well, so it's actually weird to try measure GR levels considering their achievements.

    And even the Ants were inconsistent. They are shown to be MONSTROUS in aura range but not out of the scope of human ability (Gon reached it and it's not the most powerful human on earth or the weirdest talent around...Remember, 1 in a billion is still frequent.)

    Kaito is strong, but I'm sure He's not a TOP TOP user. An Average hunter sounds fitting to me.
    The Sky is pouring
    The wind is blowing
    The sea looks red,
    a surging sea of flames
    looks like the entrance to hell
    'Perfect', the captain said.

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  13. #12
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
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    Re: kaito

    No way. If he's average he would be something like a 20 or 30 per Hisoka. This guy is affiliated with Gon and Ging. Ging, being one of the top nen users, wouldn't be interested in a disciple that weak. Bottom line is that he's definitely above average.

    Also, consider this: if kaito is average than Gon is far far below average (he easily gets destroyed by zombie Kaito). Considering the number of Nen users Gon has beaten, i find that unlikely.

    Average, or slightly above average, is probably the Injyuu.
    As for Uvogin, he's a total idiot (incapable of sensing the strength of Kurapica's nen) so he'd probably get blown up before even engaging Bomber (besides, the moron doesn't even use Gyo). In a straight up fight though, he would destroy Bomber (who's only spontaneous offensive ability is Little Flower). Just charge up to him and throw a BBI and it's game over.

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    Re: kaito

    When Kuroro was captured, Nobunaga told the other Spiders to not pursue Kurapika because Kurapika has another 'pro Hunter level' friend. There were 5 Spiders at that time.

    And even though Pro Hunter originally is a rather lofty standard, there's no way Kite is below the average "Pro Hunter" even in this regard.

    Again a Pro Hunter is someone that if you got 2 of them (Kurapika + one other) it's enough to make 5 Spiders back off. The original "Pro Hunter" level is easily more than a match for the average Spider. That's why Hunters hunt the Spiders, not the other way around, even though Hunters clearly operate in much smaller numbers as a group compared to Spiders.

    Ants have unbelieveable aura reserves but that's more of a capacity, not output issue. They'd be able to fight 10 times longer than any human can easily but their maximum output at any given time is surely not 10 times that of the strongest human, or there would be utterly undefeatable. This is also why the fact Pitou might be wounded against Kite is fairly irrelevent, because the Ants certainly can withstand at least 10 times the damage compared to the strongest human (random grunts can tank Ko level hits without aura just as a function of body strength) so Pitou would have no reason to worry about getting at most flesh wounds. It's just like Kurapika doesn't care about injuries becuase he can heal himself with an ability.

    Finally Ubogin is not stupid. He assumes Kurapika is an equal level user and he's either Manipulation or Materialization due to chains. Let's look at a Materializatino user from Spiders: Shizuku. She lost to Gon in arm wrestling even though she used aura while Gon did not (the scene shows one of the two using it, and since Gon has no idea how strong his opponent was there's no reason he'd start out using aura on a seemingly fragile girl). We also see that later Nobunaga easily beat Gon in strength under normal circumstances he's not even at the halfway mark in physical strength amongst Spiders. Likewise Shalunark, a Manipulation user, is ranked roughly the same in physical strength as Shizuku. This means Ubogin is unfathomably stronger than an equal tier Manipulation or Materialization user and this is supoprted by his own friends. Even 20% of his maximum output should've been enough to break the arm of a Manipulation or Materialization user and then you don't have to worry about what trick they got on their sleeves. Kurapika talks about his superior strategy but what ultimately worked was his Emperor Time allowed him to tank hits from Ubogin as if he's Reinforcement. This made Ubogin switch from his anti-Manipulation/anti-Materialization user strategy because his experience says only Reinforcement users can tank his hits.

    Another way to think about it this. Suppose Gon at GI is same level as Hisoka (he's not, but this only makes it more favorable for the comparison), we know Gon's strength is roughly equal to Razor's strength with aura beasts out. Therefore, Razor's attack are at least equivalent of a Reinforcement user equal to Hisoka's level, though in reality the difference between a Reinforcement of Hisoka's level to Hisoka should be even greater (because Gon really isn't the same level as Hisoka to begin with). Well we see that Hisoka absolutely cannot tank Razor's reinforcement attacks (throwing the ball is pure reinforcement). He always used a special ability to lessen the impact, and even Razor's small aura beasts is strong enough to break his fingers with the impact of their strength alone. Likewise Kastro, a Reinforcement user, has no problem ripping Hisoka's arm off, and no I don't think Hisoka purposely lowered his defenses to lose his arm just for fun. It's pretty clear Kastro does have the strength to do this rather easily (though Hisoka certainly could do a better job dodging).

    It's pretty well established that you don't tank an equal level Reinforcement's direct attacks unless you're also Reinforcement, because if you tried to tank it you'd be lucky if you only lose a limb. That's also why Reinforcement are powerful and dominate the 2-away schools. You don't have to know what crazy ability the other guy has if you first hit snaps his right arm and your second hit snaps his left arm. That was Ubogin's strategy until he was forced to abandon it due to Emperor Time clouding his judgment, and there's no way he can anticipate an enemy having an ability like Emperor Time. It's pretty much the most hax ability from a human character we know of, and it's competitve against even most of the Ants power in terms of how powerful it is.

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  16. #14
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member souhail's Avatar
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    Re: kaito

    Quote Originally Posted by exacta View Post
    I wish we could see Kite's other weapons.....I would love to see him fight more. He probably has my favorite Nen ability.
    you will ...and by the way even he transformed i think the clown will remain as his ability ...since nen is generated and related to mind and psychic

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Demonspeed's Avatar
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    Re: kaito

    Quote Originally Posted by souhail View Post
    you will ...and by the way even he transformed i think the clown will remain as his ability ...since nen is generated and related to mind and psychic
    Maybe not,the transformation gives you a new Hatsu which fits you perfectly(for example Palm's new ability).Kaito said he didn't like his ability but I found it pretty useful and IMO it's the best conjurer ability that we have seen.
    http://mangahelpers.com/forum/signaturepics/sigpic172142_23.gif

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