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Translations: Bleach 595 (2)
Wow just read the chapter....sssssoooooo if I understand this correctly, Madara cared so deeply for his siblings that died yet he awakens his Sharingan when he looses the one friend he was skipping rocks with.
I'm not the biggest fan of Sasuke and sure as hell can't stand Obito but at least when they awakened their Sharingan it made more sense. Lately it's looking like those two fit the whole "true" villain character more than Madara these days. That is if a "true" villain can even be applied to this manga.
I think you have to look at Hashiramama and Madara's reactions to finding out that they each were members of their clans worst enemies. Hashirama didn't let this dissuade him from his dream. He continued to desire a village where the clans children wouldn't be forced to kill children from other clans. Whereas Madara immediatly gives up on it, and calls it a foolish dream. Or to put it another way, Hashirama felt even after learning this that he'd rather make things change so he wouldn't have to kill anymore brothers, or loose anymore brothers. Madara, after learning this felt that he could never be at peace with the clan that killed his bothers, and had to keep fighting to avenge and honor them. And as a resualt he lost both his last brother, and his friendship with Hashirama.
So no one but me is bothered by the relation between Hashirama ans Tobirama ?
They barely even look like brothers. Hashirama literally doesn't give a damn about Tobirama. I won't be surprised if he kills Tobirama next chapter...with a huge smile
Well currently we know he doesn't end up killing Tobirama (unless they edo tenseied his ass to train Sarutobi LOL) but i do agree that it did seem so in part of the chapter. That look Hashirama gave him at the end of the chapter appeared more like "I'll kill you if you touch Madara" rather than "I'm your brother and forbid you." On the other hand though he was quite shocked to hear Madara's terms.
What if Hashirama was really gay for Madara and the reason nobody has Mokuton is because Tobirama and Mito had to give Hashirama the children he never had the initiative to make.
Just for lulz but Tsunade really takes more after uncle Tobi with super streght and stuff.
I am going to go out on a limb here and declare the last lines from Madara, the only redeemable quality of this entire chapter that deserves no eulogy, but a pile of brick-like consecutive shits slung back at this degenerate. Tobirama killed his brither, hence it was only fair in the ‘eye for an eye’ context. Nothing psychotic about it. How childishly contrived logics some of you have lulz.
This chapter makes monkey sense. Madara was about to lift the veil of Sharingan to gaze far off into the horizon – something he couldn’t do with his normal eyes - and stopped mid-sentence, but he developed it just now? Cuckoo Cuckoo.
I find it laudable – yeah, it’s just too damn funny – that people here are valuing a biased opinion just like before when it was from Tobirama’s view. Seriously, what’s up with this forum and Senju? Is it a masturbatory affair, because now it’s starting to become really gross. The anecdote is told from a single perspective and holds particularly no value. Madara’s statement of both the clan’s power tiers are backed by historical facts; both clans fought but were never wiped out from either side. This is actuality and fact not the baseless crap Hashirama is belching out from his Clan’s free supply of groundless logics.
How on earth would Hashirama know the Uchihas believed they were inferior? Is that another hidden Senju ability? They seem/sound like a bunch of annoying shrinks who wouldn’t let up on the same delineation of emotions, when the manga offers no proof in this regard that what made them develop this – asspull – hindsight into the whole affair. Far-fetched rubbish.
Madara obviously knew more about his clan, as he revealed to Tobi that they took the precepts of truce upon themselves as they despised conflict. They obviously were losing loved ones just like Madara and wanted to put an end to this seemingly eternal conflict. What made Hashirama assume Senju clan’s superiority was the reason here? What a barrel full of paltry nonsense. The manga doesn’t offer anything in this regard and I cannot believe everyone here is so damn quick to fully lap up this opinion that doesn’t make Candor shine, a’ la Tobirama.
And let’s not forget that he was fighting several Senju when he was finally put down. How does that make the man weak? Where is everyone’s comprehension? As for this chapter; 0.1/10 – senseless, perfunctory, putrid shit put on paper. If this guy is showing his excursions to mark this whole Senju > Uchiha logic now, then I’ll be damned, I just wasted a good three years on this manga, and THAT … doesn’t make me feel cool.
Butsuma and Tajima were equal leaders, however warped by war they were- this was reflected in the competition between the two clans. Hashirama was a better leader than Madara- period. This tipped the clan power in favor of the Senju after they took over their respective clans. It was an occurrence over many years, which was shown poorly in this chapter at about a page for each time jump.
Dude, wtf. Why wasn't this the 3-tomoe awakening? It would have mirrored Sasuke breaking his bond with Naruto, and Madara was about to say he had the sharingan like months ago in-universe. Also, I don't accept not knowing how Madara and Izuna got their MS. It's too damn important. Also also, wtf is the deal with Izuna? I suspected he was a shitty influence, but really? That's the relationship I have to compare to Itachi and Sasuke's? That's awful! I get that Hashirama can't know certain things (*ahem* Kushina's flashback), but he instantly assumed that Madara loved Izuna more than Itachi loved Sasuke. That's a TALL fucking order right there to tell us the scant details he did about the two.
I hope Madara decides to have a fireside chat, but we already had Tobi for that!! >: l
Last edited by badluckartist; March 20, 2013 at 01:59 PM.
^ sounds like you're making assumptions to defend the uchiha the same way others did for the Senju.
edit: oops not you badluck, but shadan.
Last edited by bananax; March 20, 2013 at 02:02 PM.
@bananax What assumptions? How would Hashirama possibly know the internal conflicts within Uchiha Clan and the reasons for defection? When it was revealed earlier that the reasons were purely born out of constant conflict and that ensued in a mutual truce and their permanent defection from Madara? How did he come to that conclusion? This doesn't make a flying squirrel's right-nut sense.
Assumption: You assume he just developed the sharingan, he might have had it already but kept it secret. We really don't know.Quote:
Assumption: because they were surrendering, I thought this was made pretty clear, when an enemy surrenders, it's either because they feel they can't win, or because they believe the other side is in the right, since it's just a shinobi battle, what right or wrong is there?Quote:
Additionally, he states you can see that they were outclassed, "enough to have defectors", his statement wasn't only based on the fact that they surrendered, it was added on.
(my assumption) Anyway, it seems that the final battle that is shown, Madara shows up alone, which means he probably no longer had the support of his clan, and this is more evident when he says they no longer hold him with "such" regard. so maybe he did kill his brother for the eyes, and they no longer wanted to fight a losing battle. so he came alone to take out Tobirama, but Hashirama fought him instead.
Assumption: Nowhere was it made clear that he fought "several" Senju, no panels show any downed Senju either, so you're either assuming that he fought several Senju and they were ALL able to defend against him, or that Hashirama is so godlike that he was able to protect everyone AND defeat Madara. Either way, we have no way of knowing if it was 1 v 1 or many v 1. Chances are, after all the respect Madara had for Hashirama in terms of his fighting power, that it was 1 v1 , but again, we don't know.Quote:
Last edited by bananax; March 20, 2013 at 02:37 PM.
What if Hashirama promised to Madara the position of Hokage in exchange for peace?
I mean, if the condition for the truce would be having Madara as leader of the future village then it would make a lot of sense that he went completely insane when the village choose Hashirama. For him it was like the Senju telling "thanks for the truce sucker now bow down to Hashirama", he threw up his brother's last wish for a lie and now there was nothing left for him in the world.
@bananax Defection means what? This is hardly an assumption on my part, but more so on yours. Hashirama has absolutely no way of ascertaining any Uchiha internal conflict. It's a simple factor, really.
- Why would he keep it a secret?
- Already answered with my first statement. Defection is based on being outclassed? What makes you say that? How does Hashirama know that this was the sole reason behind their defection?
- Tobirama's face is not picture perfect in the image. What does that tell you? You need to pay more attention.
the title itself is a mystery! searching through the web I found out that it means "Love's daughter", but it refers to a person: check it out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aiko,_Princess_Toshi . anyone has got a better explanation?