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Thread: How FT falls short and how it gets it right.

  1. #46
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity REN KOUEN's Avatar
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    Re: How FT falls short and how it gets it right.

    the characters and the overall plot is great imo

    however this type of manga needs one hero to step up and surpass the rrst of the good guys
    so far it seems the power of team work and friendship means more than actual stregnth which is becoming annoying

  2. #47
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member KingOfNight's Avatar
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    Re: How FT falls short and how it gets it right.

    Quote Originally Posted by hoeru View Post
    Because Kakarot was born a Saiyan, not Human. Therefore he has other abilities than Kuririn given by birth already.

    Natsu wasn't born as Dragon Slayer, nor as one that is able only to eat fire. As the manga explained, he's a human born in Earthland with a gift to use magic. And one of the few mages to be taught by a Dragon the Lost Magic called Dragon Slayer.

    And of course, Natsu could only learn to eat fire as Igneel is a dragon spitting fire. That did never mean that Natsu wouldn't be able to use what he learned there to swallow and extract magical energy of other elements.
    Cool story. Still, Natsu is a DS. Whether it was by birth or gained later. You know what, you asked why Natsu can eat fire, right ? According to happy, DS art transforms the users lungs to spew flames, his nail produce flames and his scales melts flames. Natsu's magic transforms his body into that of a fire dragon. That's why he can eat fire. Eating lightning is completely unrelated to his form of DS art. So there you go, I trust you will stop this "your theory" crap and admit that I was the right. This manga contradicts itself. The lungs of the fire dragon now spews lightning and all sort of crap.

    Quote Quote:
    The way of explanations that doesn't completely turn down your "fuel" theory on elements? Won't happen.
    No. An explanation on how he can eat lightning and other elements. And I told you, quite using this "your theory".

    Quote Quote:
    You came up with asking characters being better than others only for the reason you just can't stand Natsu and Gajeel eating other elements. Like you came up with Gajeel being weak for "being an S-rank candidate" and then suddenly forget about that in your last post. If you can't remember your own flaws, please read your own posts.
    What the heck are you talking about ? Stop making up stuff about me and saying that I said those things. You said, he should get different elements. I said, why shouldn't he train like those guys. That's it. And I never said that Gajeel was too weak to be an S-class candidate. Stop making up lies about me, I said he was the weakest of the S-class candidates. And by that I meant he was the weakest guy on TI.

    Quote Quote:
    So you don't want no character development anymore? Those were Gajeel's words only, not Natsu's. Natsu defeated Gajeel afterwards, and after some time and thinking about his situation, Gajeel started becoming a less big-mouthed ratfink, joined Fairy Tail, defended the ones he once harrassed and even sided with his rival in battle.

    Thanks for proving their rivalty from Gajeel's point of view btw.
    Natsu said that to Gajeel at the FF arc (though he was quoting him.) And when did I say that Gajeel has no character development ? This is about Natsu not Gajeel. Gajeel, Erza, Lucy, Gray, Laxus all of them had character development. Except the main character. He hasn't changed a bit. Oh, and nice try to run away from the main point. We still here.

    Quote Quote:
    You mean as suddenly as when he got through Zardi/Ulltear's defense?
    Don't know what you mean here. And WE still here. You aren't gonna change the topic. Answer my original post, why no tactics and skills ? You said it's out of character, I proved you wrong. Now you're changing the topic.

    Quote Quote:
    Let me just guess here. Probably by experiencing a massive power boost and by not having too grave side effects after winning the fight? Even the dumbest characters should get behind the trick...
    Because a power boost from a mass destruction weapon is the same as the boost from lightning...
    Brilliant conclusion.

    Quote Quote:
    Would you finally care to READ the parts I've been showing to you in our conversation so far to point out that you are WRONG on Natsu getting "random power ups" because he eats other elements?! They only are because you take a wrong "fuel" theory as a basis.
    No. They are random because there is no explanation. If he starts eating woods without any explanation on how he can do that, it's random. I have nothing to do with it being so.

    Quote Quote:
    Well, you started comparing characters in terms of being better than others. I've explained but you decided to ignore it.
    Who said Ichigo is better than Kenpachi ? Why did you ignore this question ? Like, you didn't simply ignore it, you said something completely unrelated.

    Quote Quote:
    Like he lost to Byakuya, Aizen before hand, Ulquiorra and Ginjou afterwards, pulled a miracle special training and came back to overpower them ... How "unrepetitive" ...
    Bleach is definitely not the best example, but at least he had a time to train before pulling that power boost. All in all, both Bleach and FT are just as random. Comparing a random series to another one isn't a way to win an argument (I would even rank FT below Bleach in term of randomness.)

    Quote Quote:
    Developing new techniques or finding out his opponent's weakness isn't anything that made Luffy's character grow. He stayed stubborn while still rushing things, not listening to important intel, just looking for his great adventure - he just became physically stronger while his careless behaviour didn't change at all.

    Compare yourself his fights against Krieg and the New Fishman Pirates' army. You'll find him pulling some ridiculous move while smiling... His losses didn't change him characterwise.
    So must I post a link from another manga before you admit it ? Luffy learned how weak he is compared to the top, that he need to train, and to be more careful. His reckless attitude changed, when he faced the Pacifista, he decided to run away, because he actually GREW. When Natsu had the chance to grow and run away from Zancrow\Grimmoire Heart. No, "we should show them the strength of Fairy Tail."

    Luffy doing stuff like that with a smile, is because he knows how weak his opponents are.
    Last edited by KingOfNight; March 17, 2013 at 05:24 AM.

  3. #48
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member hoeru's Avatar
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    Re: How FT falls short and how it gets it right.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kisame Hoshigaki View Post
    the characters and the overall plot is great imo

    however this type of manga needs one hero to step up and surpass the rrst of the good guys
    so far it seems the power of team work and friendship means more than actual stregnth which is becoming annoying
    Well, so far Natsu has been pushed into that roll - not as much as in other serieses though but actually all the Fairy Tail mages being stronger than him acknowledge him. So one could say, Natsu is on his way to do so.

  4. #49
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    Re: How FT falls short and how it gets it right.

    Hi all!

    I have been searching for a thread like this for a long time, and now I will write my opinion

    THINGS GOOD IN FT:

    1) The art. Mashima's style is one of the best for the Shonen genre, as it covers both the design of the characters and the world around them. His style is very detailed without being "too much", it's clean and yet very expressive. In particular, Mashima likes to draw his characters in many different ways, while other mangakas show very often the same design over and over.
    Last, but not the least, Mashina draw perfectly all those little details which make up the personality of a character [ his expressions, habits, ecc] and he also pay a huge attentions to the clothes, something I like very much: an example is Minerva's dress, with a tiger drawn over it.

    2) The importance of females characters. As opposite to what happens in almost every shonen, in FT the females character have very often important roles and a remarkably strong personality [ Erza, of course, stands above all ]; furthermore, it's the only manga I know where a girl is the (almost) protagonist: in fact u should remember that the story is told by Lucy's point of view.

    3) The hype. A part from Kubo, Mashima is in my opinion a master in making the readers think about his characters, and he knows how to make the reader feel that particular feeling which can be summed up in : " man, he/she is just too cool!"
    By foreshadowing the right information, hint something about their power and make them stand up properly, Mashima can really create the right hype.

    4) The phantasy. This point is clearly explained: FT universe
    Is rivaled only by OP in terms of number of characters, powers, places and different designs.

    THE BAD THINGS IN FT

    1) I can sum up all the critics to FT in one point, which is this: Mashima never respects his own "character promotion"
    In a few words: as I stated above, he can really make characters soooo cool. But they often fails compared to how much and how perfectly they were built up, being defeated by FT with the usual Nakama Power.
    An example of this is Kagura. She had everything a new character can desider: she was foreshadowed to be very strong, while never using her whole power, seeming hence even stronger. She had a relationship with one of the most liked characters [Erza] due her desire to kill [ and here comes the third point] Gerard. Since he is incredibly strong, this hyped her up even more.
    Finally, she had that amazing win against Yuukino, and [ and this is the BEST PART] we were all wondering what the hell would have happens when Archememy had been unsheathed.
    However, all this stuff was annihilated by Erza [almost] winning in one strike, after having parried Archenemy blow unharmed.

    This point sum up everything. In my opinion, the problem in not FT always winning, or the "one blow wins" Laxus or Erza or others have. The problem is what I sated above. I did't feel trolled when Orga was k.o.ed by Juura, since he had almost no character developing. I however felt trolled when Minerva and Kagura and Jura were all onehitted.

    I hope I have explained my thoughts well, and I look forward to seeing yours!

    ##

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  6. #50
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member darkprince0521's Avatar
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    Re: How FT falls short and how it gets it right.

    Quote Originally Posted by Teleuton View Post
    This point sum up everything. In my opinion, the problem in not FT always winning, or the "one blow wins" Laxus or Erza or others have. The problem is what I sated above. I did't feel trolled when Orga was k.o.ed by Juura, since he had almost no character developing. I however felt trolled when Minerva and Kagura and Jura were all onehitted.
    that truly is good explanation for the biggest problem with FT. the fights always end like this. building up the hype, and then suddenly "I will defeat you" speech from FT and *boom*; FT wins.
    Naruto Forever


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  8. #51
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
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    Re: How FT falls short and how it gets it right.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kisame Hoshigaki View Post
    the characters and the overall plot is great imo

    however this type of manga needs one hero to step up and surpass the rrst of the good guys
    so far it seems the power of team work and friendship means more than actual stregnth which is becoming annoying
    Nah, "one hero surpasses the rest of the good guys" isn't a requirement of this type of series. In fact, it's often to the detriment of such series as it drives power creep. They come up with someone that only the MC is powerful enough to fight, the rest not even strong enough to help. They get defeated and now someone else even stronger is needed for the next arc to have the same dynamic, and everyone gets stronger for the same reason. Rinse and repeat until either the power level of that first guy that was so strong only the MC could fight him is now fodder for the weakest member of the good guy's team, or the MC's original team is so far in the dust that's it's pointless to give them fights or screen time.

    By contrast, relying on teamwork to win some fights keeps power creep down, has produced some of the more enjoyable fights in Fairy Tail, and is one of the more logical ways to defeat a foe that's stronger than any one individual.

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  10. #52
    Intl Translator 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Airgrimes's Avatar
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    Re: How FT falls short and how it gets it right.

    @Teleuton
    I have had the same problem with FT for years.
    Like I said, its the way Mashima ends things that are where FT falls short.
    The way Jura, Minerva, Kagura, Leon&Whatever, etc. get One-Hit-KO'd and that's it.
    For all of them to end the same isn't so good.

    But the story is amongst the best out there right now nonetheless.

  11. #53
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member -Ken-'s Avatar
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    Re: How FT falls short and how it gets it right.

    I just wish Jura, Minerva, and Leon&Chellia got the chapter to themselves. Kagura is not that bad for me, since she admit her defeat. It's not like she can't fight anymore if she want to.

    I feel the same way during the last arc before time skip. Multiple characters stomping in 1 chapter makes those characters look more like filler characters.
    Most of the thing I post is probably assumption if it's not a fact that I support using some evidence from the manga.

    If you knows you're on my ignore list and you quote my post, there's high chance I would ignore you. Or answer you and not look at your response.

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