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Translations: Gintama 515 (2)
lets say Mito help Hashirama then what ?????
its not big deal if u add Mito in fight then its will like
Mito + Hashirama vs Madara + Kyuubi
as we SAW Hashirama vs Madara + Kyuubi if u dont want to say Hashirama was wining then u have to say it was draw then its 100% Hashirama > Madara because even for to draw fight against Hashirama he need Kyuubi's power . unlike naruto Kyuubi is not part of madara .
---------- Post added at 11:15 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:56 AM ----------
The only thing I was able to deduce from that fight is that Hashirama was doing just enough to negate Madara & kyuubi combined attacks until he got serious. It's true he was getting pushed back a little, but only because he was holding back his power. Hashirama was still trying to reason with Madara at that point, but it was utterly pointless because Madara's state of mind was too radical. That's when Hashirama finally started to get serious when he realized Madara couldn't be reasoned with. I think that flashback would have been slightly different if Hashirama started out using SM from the beginning instead of holding back his power in an attempt to change Madara's mind because he didn't want to kill him. Anyway, Hashirama was stronger than both Madara and the kyuubi fighting together. That much is pretty evident IMO.
Hashirama only worried upgrade his abilities, and learn new jutsus for get the peace and get back his old friend like Naruto with Sasuke and the war. whatever, this explain because Naruto stronger than Sasuke.
Madara only worried for the vengeance, get sharingan powers, but his real posibilities of power, jutsus etc.. he is limited for his hate like Sasuke..No sage mode, because he has inestability of chakra cause of the sharingan(we should to see the chakra map of the uchiha guy, basic chakra, elemental chakra, natural chakra and unnatural chakra[the sharingan]) i think that natural chakra and unnatural chakra is not compatible.
Till this point Mito statement is not refuted by Manga that she aided Hashirama during the battle and sealed Kurama into herself. But Kishimoto is a seasoned ass-puller; expect the unexpected and all the related cliches.
How is it evident? There's no sign of either being outlasted. If anything, considering it's still night, the battle didn't last very long. And until shown otherwise, he wasn't capable of doing so, requiring Mito to lend her power to the situation.
Seem like some of my assumption before this chapter come out were correct, about madara being weaker than hashirama and about madara leaving the village to get more power(kurama), I am going to make the assumption that Mito is not going to be in the VOTE battle for the heck of it. You guy would probably diagree and stuff but I am fine with it since some of my assumption were correct before so this one might be correct too.
Hashirama won clearly, no debating that. Even though Tobi said he survived and was seeking Hashirama's DNA all along, I still think he went all out. I don't think anyone's debating Hashirama won clearly and cleanly.
Why is it so hard to grasp that Mito could have entered the fight between Madara and Hashirama and sealed the Kyuubi in herself after Hashirama most likely gained control of it? Manga either implies it or says it.
Shows it's technically one-on-one fight, with Madara giving aid to Kyuubi or boosting its power somehow. This is more of a two-on-one fight.
first i will post few links before the final battle, to compare who was stronger in one on one battle.
in there childhood.
when they grew adults.
or, even better, when Madara got EMS.
now let's see few panels of final fight. you have shown one panel where Madara was using Kyuubi armored with Susanoo; and make it seem like it is just another normal thing. having Kyuubi armored with Susanoo to evade Hashirama's attack is a very normal thing to do, and that didn't powered up anything about Madara.
anyway, if you see    , that Susanoo armored Kyuubi wasn't the only thing Madara used Kyuubi for. and yet was unable to do anything, that's when he used susanoo armored Kyuubi; normal sense of logic means that it was a better thing for Madara to use.
Where did I say Madara > Hashirama? I never said anything of sort, all I said was that it was either 1-on-1 fight or 2-on-1 fight. The power isn't what I was talking about, since it's pretty much established Hashirama's stronger (even though he and Madara state it, it's still an opinion, not 100% fact). And my second link proves the point that Hashirama was stronger or better since if Kyuubi was under Madara's control, he was able to deal with both of them and survive that, even being able to confirm whether Madara died.
i m 100% sure Hashirama is stronger then madara 2nd flashback also said even after all power-ups madara was loss against Hashirama .
in 1st flashback we never saw mito helping Hashirama or she was even there in last part of 1st flashback its was looking like finishing move with madara + Kyuubi lost
in their time Hashirama was rank 1 and madara was rank 2 ninja
Last edited by suraj5898; March 21, 2013 at 07:53 AM.