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Thread: the true villian of naruto

  1. #46
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    Re: the true villian of naruto

    But is that enough for itachi to betray his clan and his parents? Just because he was traumatized in war? Is that it? Honestly, it doesn't make any sense for me. Why would itachi killed his clansmen who was fighting for their freedom/equal rights/mistreatment? Does being in a trauma is enough to kill your entire clan? I don't think so.

    So there must be something worse with the uchiha's coup/plan/goal that made itachi and shisui betrayed them.

  2. #47
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member LnDRash's Avatar
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    Re: the true villian of naruto

    1. Itachi loathed strife and war.
    2. He was a pacifist.
    3. He strongly believed in self sacrifice and the needs of many outweighing the needs of a few.
    4. He was basically blackmailed by Danzou.

    It was a combination of all these factors.

    "A man who refused fetters and familial ties interfere with his love for the village. The village leaders noted this and used it against him."

    A pacifist is someone who will avoid conflict at all cost, even if it means he gets harmed. He won't strike back because he believes its not worth the strife. Those views made him disagree with the choices his clan has made, and thus in his eyes they where the wrongdoers. Danzou blackmailing him was the icing on the cake which sealed the deal.
    Last edited by LnDRash; March 31, 2013 at 08:56 PM.
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  3. #48
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted Delbi's Avatar
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    Re: the true villian of naruto

    I honestly don't think Itachi was a pacifist int he traditional sense, he was still very open to killing people. It was just that he used a very stern logic in the fact that the needs of the many outweighed the needs of the few.

    He hated war and the massive loss of life that brought on. Meaning he would kill a few people (his clansmen) if it meant war would not be brought on the world.
    "The line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?” - Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

  4. #49
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    Re: the true villian of naruto

    Quote Originally Posted by LnDRash View Post
    1. Itachi loathed strife and war.
    2. He was a pacifist.
    3. He strongly believed in self sacrifice and the needs of many outweighing the needs of a few.
    3. He was basically blackmailed by Danzou.

    It was a combination of all these factors.

    "A man who refused fetters and familial ties interfere with his love for the village. The village leaders noted this and used it against him."

    A pacifist is someone who will avoid conflict at all cost, even if it means he gets harmed. He won't strike back because he believes its not worth the strife. Those views made him disagree with the choices his clan has made, and thus in his eyes they where the wrongdoers. Danzou blackmailing him was the icing on the cake which sealed the deal.
    I think the word ''blackmail'' isn't exactly true. Danzo was merely giving him a choices. To fight together with his clan and be killed or to fight alongside with konoha to protect his brother. So I don't see any blackmailing issue here. Itachi doesn't have any choice.

    Exactly. Itachi never agreed on the uchiha's views/plan/coup. His mindset is entirely different from his clansmen. Well, maybe you're right about those factors, except for the number 3, I guess, but don't you think that the uchiha's view itself is one of the factors why they're being annihilated? Itachi keeps on mentioning their so called foolish idea of their coup, so definitely their something wrong with them or their plan in a sense that itachi doesn't have any choice but to kill them.

  5. #50
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member M3J's Avatar
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    Re: the true villian of naruto

    Quote Originally Posted by suraj5898 View Post
    about Sasuke if u read my last post its
    HTML Code:
    helping Sasuke does not make him good because in part 2 Sasuke is villain and right now he is asking questions to hokage so he can decide what ever he become good or bad.
    its same thing u r talking

    and about Tobirama u said
    HTML Code:
    Naw, you can blame it on Tobirama, cuz if Tobirama wasn't all "Uchiha be cray cray," Madara wouldn't have felt the Senju would do something bad to the Uchiha.
    here u said Tobirama is resone for madara becoming bad
    Well, he was the final straw. Had Tobirama not said those things about Uchiha, then Madara wouldn't have felt the Uchiha were in danger. But it doesn't mean Tobirama's the only bad person.

  6. #51
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member LnDRash's Avatar
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    Re: the true villian of naruto

    Quote Originally Posted by Delbi View Post
    I honestly don't think Itachi was a pacifist int he traditional sense, he was still very open to killing people. It was just that he used a very stern logic in the fact that the needs of the many outweighed the needs of the few.

    He hated war and the massive loss of life that brought on. Meaning he would kill a few people (his clansmen) if it meant war would not be brought on the world.
    Well true, he's not your traditional pacifist, but I do believe if lets say Konoha signed a peace treaty with Kumogakure and then some Kumo douchebags decided to attack him in order to sabotage the truce, he would indeed stay passive to avoid any possible conflict.

    Quote Originally Posted by marshall313 View Post
    I think the word ''blackmail'' isn't exactly true. Danzo was merely giving him a choices.
    His choices where die with your clan and your brother or annihilate your clan, become a hated criminal and I'll spare at least your brother. In both of those scenarios the clan would have been assassinated, so there really was't much to pick for Itachi.
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    Re: the true villian of naruto

    Quote Originally Posted by M3J View Post
    Well, he was the final straw. Had Tobirama not said those things about Uchiha, then Madara wouldn't have felt the Uchiha were in danger. But it doesn't mean Tobirama's the only bad person.
    yes we have lots of bad people in n.a.r.u.t.o

    its funny
    T.o.b.i.r.a.m.a = Sarutobi
    m.a.d.a.r.a = Kyuubi
    u.c.h.i.h.a = uchiha
    n.a.r.u.t.o =naruto
    H.a.s.h.i.r.a.m.a = hashirama

    because of change some/all post have become funny
    Last edited by suraj5898; March 31, 2013 at 11:48 PM.

  8. #53
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member LnDRash's Avatar
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    Re: the true villian of naruto

    Although its kind of annoying to decipher all those posting to deduce what people really meant to say. If I had a stick up my ass I'd actually start complaining
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  9. #54
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    Re: the true villian of naruto

    Quote Originally Posted by LnDRash View Post
    Well true, he's not your traditional pacifist, but I do believe if lets say Konoha signed a peace treaty with Kumogakure and then some Kumo douchebags decided to attack him in order to sabotage the truce, he would indeed stay passive to avoid any possible conflict.



    His choices where die with your clan and your brother or annihilate your clan, become a hated criminal and I'll spare at least your brother. In both of those scenarios the clan would have been assassinated, so there really was't much to pick for Itachi.
    Exactly. So there's no other choice. He wasn't being blackmailed by danzo but rather danzo was giving him choices. It's because of the uchiha's coup and action, their consequence is to be killed/annihilated.

  10. #55
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member LnDRash's Avatar
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    Re: the true villian of naruto

    Quote Originally Posted by marshall313 View Post
    Exactly. So there's no other choice. He wasn't being blackmailed by danzo but rather danzo was giving him choices. It's because of the uchiha's coup and action, their consequence is to be killed/annihilated.
    You're contradicting yourself here.

    Danzou said "Either assassinate your clan and take the blame on you so that we keep a clean vest" or "We will kill you, your brother and your whole clan".

    Sounds like blackmailing to me, although Danzou obviously tried to sugarcoat it after Itachi asked if thats supposed to be a threat.

    Blackmailing means to put someone into a situation in which he's left without true choice and the only acceptable pick is what the blackmailer wants that person to do. Thats pretty much exactly what Danzou did.
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  11. #56
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    Re: the true villian of naruto

    Quote Originally Posted by LnDRash View Post
    You're contradicting yourself here.

    Danzou said "Either assassinate your clan and take the blame on you so that we keep a clean vest" or "We will kill you, your brother and your whole clan".

    Sounds like blackmailing to me, although Danzou obviously tried to sugarcoat it after Itachi asked if thats supposed to be a threat.

    Blackmailing means to put someone into a situation in which he's left without true choice and the only acceptable pick is what the blackmailer wants that person to do. Thats pretty much exactly what Danzou did.
    Not really. The outcome of the choices are still the annihilation of the uchiha. Yea, I agree with your definition, but the problem is, either of the choices, the uchiha are bound to be killed. Danzo already stated that the uchiha together with itachi can't defeat the konoha. So what danzo did is just offering a deal to itachi. A deal to save his brother in exchange for his clansmen's life. What danzo did isn't exactly a blackmail. He never stated nor asked itachi to kill his clansmen in exchange for sasuke's life. He's just proposing a deal to itachi to kill his clansmen in exchange for sasuke's life or all of them would be annihilated, even himself.

    And the fact that the decision lies with itachi himself. He either help his clan or be killed together with his clan. That's the consequences of uchiha's coup.

  12. #57
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted ninjabot's Avatar
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    Re: the true villian of naruto

    I like Itachi as much as the next guy, but I'm seriously tired of people claiming he was somehow superior to all Uchiha when it came to dealing with loss and despair. Losing the Uchiha didn't make him go crazy because he didn't care about the Uchiha. He despised them.

    Had Sasuke been killed by Danzou Itachi would've turned Konoha into a black smudge while also killing everyone in the way of his vengeance.

  13. #58
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member LnDRash's Avatar
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    Re: the true villian of naruto

    Quote Originally Posted by ninjabot View Post
    He despised them.

    Had Sasuke been killed by Danzou Itachi would've turned Konoha into a black smudge while also killing everyone in the way of his vengeance.
    Can't say I agree.

    Sure, Sasuke was more importat to him then the whole clan and if Danzou would have touched him then he would have turned on the village. But only because Sasuke was the most important to him doesn't mean he despised all his other clan mates. At least its more then evident the act of murdering his parents was causing him to go through immense suffering.

    http://www.mangapanda.com/naruto/590/14

    Now, if that makes him superior in terms of dealing with loss in comparison to all other Uchiha? That much I really don't know, since we've barely seen anything from them except for the Uchiha main cast. What I do know though is that what Itachi had to go through would have turned nearly every other character we know of (regardless of heritage) into a psycho.
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