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Thread: sasuke will defeat edo kages and naruto will defeat edo madara and obito to move the manga for the finale

  1. #61
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member shahdan's Avatar
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    Re: sasuke will defeat edo kages and naruto will defeat edo madara and obito to move the magna for the finale

    Quote Originally Posted by xXan View Post
    @shahdan


    You said and i quote:

    This would mean they can't even get passed Amaterasu.

    Also and yes if you say the 3 of them are of no threat then you mean Sasuke can take them down. In the same post from the link above you even state if they where alive (so no ET control).



    Of coruse you can but the "no feats and they can't do it" is not going to apply here. Oh and the arena/bettle forums:
    http://mangahelpers.com/forum/forumd...hagakure-Arena

    Over here we tend to discuss more like what makes sense from a story point of view and i asure you if Kishi would make a fight between Sasuke and CO vs those 3 Sasuke is most defenetly going to overpower them with Amaterasu alone (living or not).
    I remember what I said, and that still doesn't mean what you are saying.

    I am fully aware of what I said, again, and I take nothing back. Amaterasu and its variants are too damn powerful and instant to brush aside. Your counterargument about Tobi is completely incorrect as he saw it coming. There is even an exclamation mark to illustrate this. Trap or no trap, his S/T jutsu is reputed to be better than Minato - according to Kakashi - and he still couldn't bend S/T to phase through it.

    So you agree with me?

  2. #62
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted xXan's Avatar
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    Re: sasuke will defeat edo kages and naruto will defeat edo madara and obito to move the magna for the finale

    @shahdan

    First off. If one can react to Raikage and Naruto who are FASTER then Amaterasu then one can react to Amaterasu. Its like racting to a bullet and then not reacting to an arrow. It is obviously he got tricked by that trap. You have to understand that Tobi's intangibility is instant, Amaterasu is not. Tobi could react to Naruto (Chakra Mode level 2), Bee, Gai and Kakashi. If Itachi could just walk up to Tobi and Amaterasu him he would have done so.

    Yes his ST is better but not the way you see it. Tobi can't instantly teleport out of the way or teleporting to multiple locations fast (like Minato taking out something of an army). Tobi's ST is better as it needs no handseals and no tags. It was explained by Kakashi and later by Minato. Thing is the speed of the telport is below that of Minato's and that is why Minato is the fastest guy around (aside for Naruto i gues). Tobi is not even faster then Raikage as Raikage himself stated. Remember the hole "now that Minato is dead i am the fastest"? Yeah he said nothing about Tobi who he noticed in action before his eyes.

  3. #63
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Suzaku's Avatar
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    Re: sasuke will defeat edo kages and naruto will defeat edo madara and obito to move the manga for the finale

    Amaterasu is not instantaneous and can be avoided, blocked, or even sealed into a scroll, if the user is quick enough. If a shinobi is familiar with the technique, it's also apparantly easy to sense when it's about to be used, even by non-sensors (as a feeling of "pressure" in the atmosphere).

    Anyway, there is no jutsu without a weakness, and Amaterasu's got its share. We don't know what drawbacks it has with the Infinite Mangekyou Sharingan, but even if there's no risk of the eyes going blind there are probably plenty limits.

  4. #64
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member shahdan's Avatar
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    Re: sasuke will defeat edo kages and naruto will defeat edo madara and obito to move the magna for the finale

    Quote Originally Posted by xXan View Post
    @shahdan

    First off. If one can react to Raikage and Naruto who are FASTER then Amaterasu then one can react to Amaterasu. Its like racting to a bullet and then not reacting to an arrow. It is obviously he got tricked by that trap. You have to understand that Tobi's intangibility is instant, Amaterasu is not. Tobi could react to Naruto (Chakra Mode level 2), Bee, Gai and Kakashi. If Itachi could just walk up to Tobi and Amaterasu him he would have done so.

    Yes his ST is better but not the way you see it. Tobi can't instantly teleport out of the way or teleporting to multiple locations fast (like Minato taking out something of an army). Tobi's ST is better as it needs no handseals and no tags. It was explained by Kakashi and later by Minato. Thing is the speed of the telport is below that of Minato's and that is why Minato is the fastest guy around (aside for Naruto i gues). Tobi is not even faster then Raikage as Raikage himself stated. Remember the hole "now that Minato is dead i am the fastest"? Yeah he said nothing about Tobi who he noticed in action before his eyes.
    You do realize that he saw Raikage coming and even charging his armour? Not to mention the Kunais were already littered all over the place?
    Last edited by shahdan; April 10, 2013 at 04:16 PM.

  5. #65
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted xXan's Avatar
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    Re: sasuke will defeat edo kages and naruto will defeat edo madara and obito to move the manga for the finale

    @shahdan

    Quote Quote:
    You do realize that he saw Raikage coming and even charging his armour? Not to mention the Kunais were already littered all over the place?
    Eh? He did not know what Raikage can do...Like what he really can do, he just knew Raikage was fast. That is why his face here is "oO":
    http://narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/542/14

    Then here he even had his back turned and he was leaving:
    http://narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/543

    Yeah if he does not have tags around he would not have a way to teleport out of the way but this was not about that. It was about reaction times. Minato would have 0 problems teleporting out of Amaterasu's way asuming that is all he needs to defened against. Raikage in speed is >>>>>>>> Amaterasu.

    You know where the problem comes? From GENJUSU. Is Minato:

    1-Looking at Sasuke's eyes? If yes then GENJUTSU = Minato drools on the floor.
    2-Not looking at Sasuke's eyes? Then Amaterasu = Minato burning as he did not see the attack. If he keeps his eyes on the ground by the time he will see the Amaterasu it would be to late.

    Thing is this was about Tobi and not Minato. There is no way the fastest man in the manga (him or Naruto) would not be able to teleport out of Amaterasu's way.
    Now Tobi himself in a fight with some Amaterasu user there is no way he would get hit by a direct Amaterasu.

  6. #66
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member shahdan's Avatar
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    Re: sasuke will defeat edo kages and naruto will defeat edo madara and obito to move the manga for the finale

    I doubt Raikage >>>>> Amaterasu as he used V2 armour and body flicker to dodge it. The distance wasn't even that large. I believe I already did make those points in another thread. Whether he avoids the eyes or not; he's done for, either way.

  7. #67
    MangaHelper MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted Rikudou King's Avatar
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    Re: sasuke will defeat edo kages and naruto will defeat edo madara and obito to move the manga for the finale

    What exactly is the issue here? Three of the Hokages are under Orochimaru's control, meaning their fighting strength means nothing, and the last, while strongest, is also the one who Orochimaru now has poison to counter his Mokuton. Not even sure why Sasuke would need to lift a hand when Orochimaru can deal with them all himself.

  8. #68
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member marshall313's Avatar
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    Re: sasuke will defeat edo kages and naruto will defeat edo madara and obito to move the manga for the finale

    Quote Originally Posted by Rikudou King View Post
    What exactly is the issue here? Three of the Hokages are under Orochimaru's control, meaning their fighting strength means nothing, and the last, while strongest, is also the one who Orochimaru now has poison to counter his Mokuton. Not even sure why Sasuke would need to lift a hand when Orochimaru can deal with them all himself.
    So, you mean that hashirama's power means nothing to you? And no. Just because oro has a poison to kill the baby yamato's mokuton, it doesn't mean it has the same effect to an old man hashirama's mokuton.

    So orochimaru can deal with hashirama all by himself?

  9. #69
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted xXan's Avatar
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    Re: sasuke will defeat edo kages and naruto will defeat edo madara and obito to move the manga for the finale

    Quote Originally Posted by shahdan View Post
    I doubt Raikage >>>>> Amaterasu as he used V2 armour and body flicker to dodge it. The distance wasn't even that large. I believe I already did make those points in another thread. Whether he avoids the eyes or not; he's done for, either way.
    What he used is not really relevant, point is he is faster then Amaterasu by a good degree. I did not say base Raikage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rikudou King View Post
    What exactly is the issue here? Three of the Hokages are under Orochimaru's control, meaning their fighting strength means nothing, and the last, while strongest, is also the one who Orochimaru now has poison to counter his Mokuton. Not even sure why Sasuke would need to lift a hand when Orochimaru can deal with them all himself.
    Eh? Hashirama is NOT Yamato... Not only is his chakra potency leagues above Yamato but he also has SM... Hashirama slso has insane regen... + SM regen... There is no indication that poison would work on him or better said how effective it would be... Of course how the bloody hell is Orochimaru going to feed him the poison is another issue. Kabuto made it, no indication Oro even has it in the first place. I am sure Hashirama is not that dumb to just drink some because it looks "cool"... There is no way Orochimaru can get close to him. Hashirama would ANIHILATE THEM ALL COMPLETLY in a nanosecond. Yeah i exagerated a bit because it sounds cool.

    It will go like this:

    Fight start and Hashirama attacks them all with a huge spread of Mokuton. Orochimaru can't focus and do handseals like this:
    http://narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/620/11

    A moment later Tobirama and Sarutobi have made the handseals and are free now (like Madara). Minato probably knows them to but can't say for sure...

    Then Orochimaru, Sasuke and the rest are turned to PASTA by Hashirama alone as the rest are enjoying the show...

    Now for Oro to really control the other Kages he would first need to impale them with a kunai (the head)... Good luck doing that with Hashirama on your sorry ass.... I mean he beat Madara using Kurama + perfect Susano on it... I can see Oro.... Shitting his pants but nothing more.
    I mean Hashirama just resing his chakra levels and made them shit briks... Imagine Hashirama in SM... Complete stompage...
    Last edited by xXan; April 12, 2013 at 01:06 AM.

  10. #70
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member shahdan's Avatar
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    Re: sasuke will defeat edo kages and naruto will defeat edo madara and obito to move the manga for the finale

    ^ Which brings us back to my original point, that without his Kunais, his base speed shouldn't be any where near Raikage's who dodged it with two techniques. Anyhow, this is kind of pointless now, considering how the events unfolded in the latest chapter.

  11. #71
    MangaHelper MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted Rikudou King's Avatar
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    Re: sasuke will defeat edo kages and naruto will defeat edo madara and obito to move the manga for the finale

    Quote Originally Posted by marshall313 View Post
    So, you mean that hashirama's power means nothing to you? And no. Just because oro has a poison to kill the baby yamato's mokuton, it doesn't mean it has the same effect to an old man hashirama's mokuton.
    When did I say that? And there's no reason it shouldn't have the same effect, given that it came from the same source: Hashirama's Dna.

    Quote Originally Posted by marshall313 View Post
    So orochimaru can deal with hashirama all by himself?
    Outside of Mokuton, what can Hashirama do to Orochimaru to actually kill him before the latter manages to stab a control kunai in him?

    Quote Originally Posted by xXan View Post
    Eh? Hashirama is NOT Yamato... Not only is his chakra potency leagues above Yamato but he also has SM... Hashirama slso has insane regen... + SM regen... There is no indication that poison would work on him or better said how effective it would be... Of course how the bloody hell is Orochimaru going to feed him the poison is another issue. Kabuto made it, no indication Oro even has it in the first place. I am sure Hashirama is not that dumb to just drink some because it looks "cool"... There is no way Orochimaru can get close to him. Hashirama would ANIHILATE THEM ALL COMPLETLY in a nanosecond. Yeah i exagerated a bit because it sounds cool.

    It will go like this:

    Fight start and Hashirama attacks them all with a huge spread of Mokuton. Orochimaru can't focus and do handseals like this:
    http://narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/620/11

    A moment later Tobirama and Sarutobi have made the handseals and are free now (like Madara). Minato probably knows them to but can't say for sure...

    Then Orochimaru, Sasuke and the rest are turned to PASTA by Hashirama alone as the rest are enjoying the show...

    Now for Oro to really control the other Kages he would first need to impale them with a kunai (the head)... Good luck doing that with Hashirama on your sorry ass.... I mean he beat Madara using Kurama + perfect Susano on it... I can see Oro.... Shitting his pants but nothing more.
    I mean Hashirama just resing his chakra levels and made them shit briks... Imagine Hashirama in SM... Complete stompage...
    That doesn't matter. Kabuto's poison would be based off the real Hashirama's Dna, meaning it should be just as effective. And his regeneration is tied into his Mokuton, so negating it would negate that. Not that it matters here, because an Edo summon has automatic regeneration anyhow.

    As for how, why not the same way Kabuto did it, with a snake bite?

    And how exactly is a bunch of trees suppose to keep Orochimaru from focusing? It's not exactly an offensive assault, nor instantaneous. Orochimaru should be fully capable of desummoning the other Hokages. After that, it's a physical battle with Orochimaru simply trying to get lose enough to bite Hashirama or insert a control kunai. In this sort of situation, Orochimaru is the best choice, given his style of fighting (taking a hit and popping out a new body to keep going). I mean, out of all we've seen, what would be lethal to a guy who can even exist as just chakra? Or Team Taka for that matter. Suigetsu and Juugo are nearly just as immortal, and Sasuke has Susanoo to save his ass. They all really shouldn't have any problem stalling til Orochimaru does what needs to be done.

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