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Translations: Gintama 515 (2)
Who are the biggest winners of NPoT? And when talking about MSers, I'd keep that relative to their position in PoT, so while Ryoma is almost surely to become the #1 again at some point, he didn't improve his position any since he was already #1 in PoT.
Here are my winners (so far)
Oni - A guy everyone who thought was going to be a stepping stone turns out to be unbelieveably powerful.
Duke - Despite being the token power player and merely a yes-man to Byodouin, Duke amazingly held onto the #3 badge. He has a non trivial probability of becoming the highest ranked HSer after the shuffle match is done. He somehow avoided the fate of being defeated Ryoga while overseas, and got an easy match (Gin is nowhere near top tier even amongst MSers) to defend his position.
Momoshiro - A mid tier character at best, but after being taught by Santa Oni he took out 2 of the lower U17 teams by himself. It's now said Oni apparently owes him a small favor so we can expect TnK Momoshiro or something equally crazy if Momoshiro was smart enough to call in his favors. Okay, maybe not, but that's a huge leap for a guy who never beat anyone remotely top tier in PoT.
Oishi - Not only was he lucky enough to get the coveted Black Jacket training, but he even found a partner that's even better than his original one. It's clear that the Golden Pair could not have beaten the twins because their base stats is too low to defeat another synchro pair. Since Niou can synchro with anybody, Niou could've won that match no matter who his partner is. To be fair Oishi was the one who came up with the idea of having Niou synchro with the twins, but Niou still did all the work.
Kite - As he correctly puts it, Kite is irrelevent as a singles player because all his moves are useless against anyone remotely good. He managed to find a good doubles partner and although it's unclear if he'll get a spot on the U17 team, he actually managed to let the nation see the power of the Higa even though his school is really a joke compared to the other powerhouses.
I didn't include Kintaro here because he's meant to be like #2 or #3 in original PoT and he's still around that range. Yes he got TnK but his overall standing is relatively unchanged.
Oni, for reasons you said;
and for me, Marui. Even though he's from Rikkai, he's someone with relatively less screentime than 80% of Rikkai, yet he managed to snag one of the top 10 badges, while being Yukimura's lifesaver in the meantime.
Kintarou should be there. There's tons of people on this board who thinks, in PoT, Kintarou cant' beat Atobe/Tezuka/Sanada.
Akutsu probably gained a lot too but we won't know for sure until he actually played his match.
No Ken is right.
You're an idiot if you though Kintaro was No.2 or No.3 back in PoT.
His improvement has been amazing. Kintaro is definitely a winner.
Niou is an absolute winner. He can now not only become ANY Schooler but it means he can Synchro with almost any schooler.
If you Synchro with the self-centered and egotistic Atobe you can pretty much Synchro with almost anyone.
Also, his Technique and Mental stat must have had some sort of lift since whilst being Tezuka he now has ZSS and can use TPhantom for a REALLY long time.
He used it loner than Nationals!Tezuka did I believe.
Meaning Niou can beat Atobe. In fact, Niou is at the Top end of the MS Tier without question.
In PoT, Kintaro WASN'T the No.2 main character. Far from it. In fact, there was no No.2 main character in PoT overall, there was Ryoma, then there was the rest of the main cast. Konomi did a good job in that respect. Despite his lack of popularity he has had significantly more screentime than the main character.
Ryoma's only screentime w/out screentime was the mission and the Tokugawa/Ryoga/Byoudouin attack scene.
Kintaro got the awful Hakamada match and then against Oni.
Sanada is a big winner. He got Black Aura and 10ball(Pending) whilst nobody else in his School has had anything remotely close to his kind of improvement.
He's now going to get a full match against No.2/No.6
In other words, Sanada is going to be the Nations No.2!!! That's insane for a 14 year-old.
I kinda wish we got to see Sanada VS 2nd Court or Sanada VS 1st Court, because I feel its a bit too soon.
Surely there must be some sort of record that he'll break for being so young to get that badge?
I've lost respect for Akutsu. He's come to the camp and endured all this shit just to challenge Ryoma, apparently he was in the USA?
He's an asshole and an idiot for leaving the USA to go to weaker Japan to train and defeat Ryoma.
He should've stayed in the USA for a few years or something and then come back and trash Ryoma.
Now Ryoma will just slap him. Despite Akutsu's 10ball, Konomi just implied Ryoma will still throw Akutsu out the window.
The only cool thing about him is his lack of respect for anybody and everybody.
@Ken, Atobe/Tezuka/Sanada isn't one tier btw.
Atobe will get creamed by the latter two and many others as much as it hurts to say it.
I know it's not one tier. But many people think Kintarou can't even beat Atobe. There's discussion on that before.
Atobe should lost purposely to Hiyoshi and went to the mountain to train.
I've always fought for Atobe > Kintaro and NEVER had anybody agree.
I can say at Nationals, there is no guarantee Tooyama could handle WoI, but right now, at this stage in the story Tooyama would cream Atobe.
No discussion. Konomi hasn't even let Atobe use WoI or AK as a serve.
But Yanagi didn't come back a winner.
Yanagi is the only Revolution member to come back and be a complete and utter loser.
I mean, Tooyama earned respect by leaving Hakamada in bandages before losing to Oni at least.
had Kawamura not been honorable and saved Ban's life Yanagi could have shared this trait with Kawamura and Kabaji who also got trashed.
Yanagi lost my respect when he fell asleep on the court against Mitsuya.
Falling asleep on the court is SUCH a disgrace.
I don't think he fell asleep, he just fade out and Mitsuya joked about that.
Yanagi didn't show much improvement, and the way he "beat his teacher" kinda sucked... so yeah he's not a winner at all, no one said that.
Kenya should be in that list. I mean, not only he can run over water now (... Jesus) he was so lucky that he had an OP partner (just like Oishi... but Kenya didn't think at all).
Atobe/Sanada/Tezuka has always been one tier. Atobe probably doesn't belong in that tier but he gets away with it due to his immense popularity, and Konomi protects Atobe by having him avoid playing either of these guys in an official match (because he's likely to lose). There's a pretty clear triangle inequality of Atobe > Sanada > Tezuka > Atobe just due to the way their techs counter each other, assuming Sanada doesn't simply just start way behind the baseline to render WoI/Atobe Kingdom obselete (any blind spot observed from that far back would be out of bounds so it wouldn't matter, and Sanada's Rai speed means he can easily catch up to shots hit near the net after it happened). Sanada probably won't do that because that's not something an Emperor would do.
Kintaro's setting is clearly equal to Ryoma (until TnK) so that puts him above the rest and below Yukimura and TnK Ryoma, but normal Ryoma barely beats those 3 guys there so of course Kintaro versus these guys can go either way too. And it's still like that. Kintaro is not even necessarily a favorite over Sanada depending on how Black Aura turned out. TnK Tezuka at least has TnK, and Atobe still has Konomi behind his back.
Honestly, I feel like Renji losing is when tier list starts to crumble. I view Renji as equal to WoK/Shiraishi -ish kind of character. It's just kinda mess up my head to see him have 0% percent of winning against a mere #17.
On Atobe Kingdom, I do feel like it's kind of underrated.
If you think about it, Atobe manage to score points against Irie by only Atobe Kingdom. And he wins a few point, until his knee was injured. It was only then that Irie start winning points again, making it look like the injury prevent Atobe from using the move freely.
Yes, there's that doubles match. He can only use AK in a rather limit manner in that match. However, he must sees the weakness of "2" players. That alone makes the condition harder to fulfill. To further prove this, Once Niou start helping Atobe, Atobe start to use Atobe Kingdom really more often and in a very well manner.
I do think Atobe will be absolute beast in Singles, as he don't have to look for absolute blind spots of 2 players.
---------- Post added at 02:25 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:23 PM ----------
I don't think , national wise, Atobe is in the same tier as Sanada/Tezuka.
It's triangle relationship between Tezuka/Sanada/Yukimura, with Tezuka>Yukimura>Sanada>Tezuka, in that order.
Phantron you're crazy.
How at Nationals was Atobe in Tezuka/Sanada/Yukimura tier??
Back at Nationals, Tezuka had TZ+TPhantom+Hyakku Ren which even though WoI gets blind spots, the ball still comes back to Tezuka to just slam home and win.
Atobe COULDN'T beat Tezuka.
Sanada had Rai to catch up to any WoI shots.
Yukimura would've outrallied Atobe completely and after Atobe takes no more than 2-3 games thanks to WoI, he would have gotten yipped.
If Sanada and Ryoma can get yipped then so can Atobe. Atobe will lose to Yips without question.
Even now, Yukimura was the only one to face the 1st String, he destroyed No.11, whereas Atobe had Niou not brought out Synchro would have lost to No.10/11 without a doubt. So the same situation applies, Yukimura outrallies Atobe, Atobe fights back with AK and takes quite a few games but Atobe suffers yips.
If Mental Pressure got to him then so will Yips. And new Yips means you fall asleep... Which is ridiculous but that's the way it is.
Konomi doesn't respect Atobe's strength. He just loves drawing matches with Atobe. I'm annoyed since, despite the last match, in Singles... Atobe hasn't significantly improved.
Yanagi blacked out. Yanagi's eyes closed as he passed on his final wishes to Inui.
I thought I was reading something like Fairy Tail where an enemy has been completely defeated and passes on his wish to his nakama.
It was such a joke that I remembered I was reading a tennis match between a High Schooler and a Middle Schooler.