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Thread: CP0

  1. #31
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member kkck's Avatar
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    Re: CP0

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Arashi View Post
    CP0 is an investing organization, CP9 is a murdering organization.

    Oda said it, pull it from his ass to put some tension to the arc, they will not be a thread, they will connect to something that it will be a thread.
    I don't think we know that. The manga has only said they are an intelligence organization however all CPs are exactly that. In regards to how strong they should be we have to consider 3 things:

    1.- They are in the new world.
    2.- They are an organization above CP9 which was in itself an unofficial CP to begin with.
    3.- Their name, CPAEGIS0. The aegis part is IMO relevants and perhaps non intuitively to a secret secret shady organization which is supposed to work in the shadows without others even knowing what it does reveals something about their function.

    An aegis is a sort of shield, in other words it is reasonable to assume the CP0 works as a sort of shield to the world government. Being the top intelligence organization in the government it is not that unreasonable to think of them as the last shield perhaps. Now, CP9, an organization beneath them can't possibly be weaker than them, it would make no sense at. CP9 would already be too weak to be relevant as it was in the new world, CP0 necessarily has to be above them 2 years ago. As an intelligence unit they would have to get involved with relevant people in the new world which means in itself that the danger they have to face would be exponential greater than anything in the first half of the grand line. At the very least anyone relevant would be surrounded by extremely powerful people. It is worth noting that the range of strength is wide though. It is entirely possible any one of them is strong enough to give CP9 the fodder treatment while at the same time they would not match up to any one in the monster trio. I would think their key members will be on the level with the likes of the monster trio though. I don't think robin would have been so concerned about them if they were merely on the level with CP9 for that matter. Robin should have grown significantly stronger over the timeskip and even then she is with law and ussop with law in particular being exceptional and without a doubt able to give the fodder treatment to the CP9 from 2 years ago.

    As for their presence in dressrosa, I would think with what we know there are enough reasons for them to be there. Doflamingo is a former shichibukai who ruled the kingdom and even if he abdicated it does seem as if he is still in control. Since this involved the highest government level it makes sense an intelligence unit would be involved. Doflamingo seems to be damn powerful and his unique position would definitely warrant investigation by the world government. It wouldn't even be strange if they at least suspected of his dealings in the underworld. More importantly, something happening to a shichibukai shifts the balance of the world by default and right now the new world is exceptionally dangerous. The world government will want to be as involved as they can with what is going on.

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  3. #32
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity danzouismadara's Avatar
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    Re: CP0

    CPO is def. not on the same level as cp9 if even law is worried and robin is sweating.. lol
    Last edited by danzouismadara; May 05, 2013 at 12:43 AM.


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    Ive seen Deathnote, deadman wonderland, fairytale, shigurui, ao no exorcist, beelzebub, samurai champloo, code geass, devil may cry, Hakuouki, monster, blood plus, gantz. Basically, something with demons and gore.

  4. #33
    Intl Translator 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Airgrimes's Avatar
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    Post Re: CP0

    Quote Originally Posted by RezzieThaRapper View Post
    Also just because Lucci mastered Rokushiki doesn't mean he was the strongest user, he just knew all the techniques you could use... Heck he didn't have haki either, and CoA breaks Tekkai any day in my book... lol but because he mastered it he was VA level in my opinion.. (I wrote that kind of convolutedly lol)
    You thought Lucci was VA level?
    I think Enel was VA level. I don't think Lucci was that strong. I just think Luffy was seriously weak at that point in comparison to the Top tier characters.
    You can't be a VA without Haki btw so Lucci would be Rear Admiral level.

    Quote Originally Posted by kkck View Post
    It is entirely possible any one of them is strong enough to give CP9 the fodder treatment while at the same time they would not match up to any one in the monster trio.
    This is a bit much. You expect Oda to release enemies at this stage that can't touch Sanji? What would be the point?
    I'm expecting there is somebody there who can give Sanji a proper fight.

    ---------
    CP9 were so wack and only Lucci, Kaku, Jabra and Blueno were of notable ability individually.
    The rest were no higher than what would be roughly Captain level in the Marines

    (Although Marine ranks aren't fully based on strength its the best I can grade them at)

  5. #34
    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member PLfighter's Avatar
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    Re: CP0

    Enel VA Level lol
    If you mean garp power by that ok
    He atleast close to admiral
    But if you saying he is average VA
    Than all new world captain WB ally was enel level power
    And if VA so godly strong buster call is just wast of ammo.
    They will send just on ship with VA and work is done.
    Luffy win with him only becouse his df
    Many say mr. Crocodile was weaker than luffy too
    and he fight on pair with dd and mihawk
    Last edited by PLfighter; May 05, 2013 at 01:17 PM.

  6. #35
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member RezzieThaRapper's Avatar
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    Re: CP0

    Yes Lucci is VA level... Luffy was knocking out VA Giants before the timeskip, Lucci is at least low level VA considering some of the ones we have seen have been utterly trashed... though that wasn't the main point of my original post
    I have an opinionDon't hate me for it...

  7. #36
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    Re: CP0

    Quote Originally Posted by PLfighter View Post
    Enel VA Level lol
    If you mean garp power by that ok
    Garp was offered the position of Admiral on various occasions.
    So its only common sense to assume Garp & Sengoku as Admiral level characters.

    Quote Originally Posted by PLfighter View Post
    He atleast close to admiral
    But if you saying he is average VA
    Than all new world captain WB ally was enel level power
    This is an assumption. Its true some of them most certainly were, but we don't know if they all were.

    Quote Originally Posted by PLfighter View Post
    And if VA so godly strong buster call is just wast of ammo.
    They will send just on ship with VA and work is done.
    Considering a Vice-Admiral just got knocked out completely in this dressrosa arc in the fight to get the Flame-Flame Fruit, I don't think its that simple in the NewWorld. Maybe back in Paradise.

    Quote Originally Posted by PLfighter View Post
    Luffy win with him only becouse his df
    Many say mr. Crocodile was weaker than luffy too
    and he fight on pair with dd and mihawk
    Okay... You may have to re-read or re-watch the series.
    Crocodile was not equal or on par with Mihawk the man who trained Zoro for two years, or Doflamingo.

    ---------- Post added at 10:57 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:54 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by RezzieThaRapper View Post
    Yes Lucci is VA level... Luffy was knocking out VA Giants before the timeskip, Lucci is at least low level VA considering some of the ones we have seen have been utterly trashed... though that wasn't the main point of my original post
    Yeah, like I said, its stated that all VA's have Haki. So its hard to see the likes of Momonga and Smoker struggling with Lucci.
    Lucci doesn't have Haki, and how many VA Giants was Luffy "knocking out"?

    I don't think there is enough to suggest Lucci was VA level. The Luffy he lost to, wasn't necessarily too strong.
    He had only just begun to use Gear2nd+3rd in that arc, its likely his mastery of it improved in arcs after.

  8. #37
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member kkck's Avatar
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    Re: CP0

    Quote Originally Posted by RezzieThaRapper View Post
    Yes Lucci is VA level... Luffy was knocking out VA Giants before the timeskip, Lucci is at least low level VA considering some of the ones we have seen have been utterly trashed... though that wasn't the main point of my original post
    I don't remember that... He did knock out a giant if I recall but that giant was not a VA.

    ---------- Post added at 09:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:41 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Airgrimes View Post
    You thought Lucci was VA level?
    I think Enel was VA level. I don't think Lucci was that strong. I just think Luffy was seriously weak at that point in comparison to the Top tier characters.
    You can't be a VA without Haki btw so Lucci would be Rear Admiral level.


    This is a bit much. You expect Oda to release enemies at this stage that can't touch Sanji? What would be the point?
    I'm expecting there is somebody there who can give Sanji a proper fight.

    ---------
    CP9 were so wack and only Lucci, Kaku, Jabra and Blueno were of notable ability individually.
    The rest were no higher than what would be roughly Captain level in the Marines

    (Although Marine ranks aren't fully based on strength its the best I can grade them at)
    Enel would at most match the less relevant VAs... the VAs do seem to be numerous at large and the range of strength they have is quite something so far. They all are experienced fighters and haki users so they are definitely a force to be reckoned with. I do agree with lucci being at around the rear admiral level though. Drake was a rear admiral himself and it does seem like they can be relevant fighters. Smoker was reasonably strong himself even without the logia bit and he was not even a rear admiral, he was only a commodore.

    Well, to be fair those are exactly the sort of enemies oda has introduced right now. Hodi was cannon fodder to the point where he was defeated underwater by zoro. Even after his transformation he was not a proper opponent for luffy. Luffy defeated him even though he was the worst choice to actually fight him. Imagine how he would do in an underwater fight against sanji under similar circumstances.... Sanji has his blue walk, he would have clobbered him. Easily at that. Ceasar was weak too. He was at most in a similar situation to enel, not much physical capacity to speak of but in turn had an exceptionally hard fruit to deal with. Well, the moment CP0 are capable of giving the likes of sanji a true fight we are talking about people with a huge amount of power on their hands. Some people are against CP0 even being relevant so far although I do think they will be relevant against the monster trio.

    We have to consider that as far as the VAs go oda has actually made a point of not showing how strong they are. I guess it makes sense, it helped to avoid showing us just how weak luffy was before the timeskip and it keeps some mystery now as to the true strength of the marines. Eventually luffy and co will have to fight VAs with true power and it is definitely going to be tough on them.

  9. #38
    Intl Translator 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Airgrimes's Avatar
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    Re: CP0

    Considering CP9's current abilities, if you put them in the New World they would die extremely fast.
    If your strongest member is Rear Admiral level in your team, and your second strongest is Commodore at best, then it doesn't look too good for you in New World.
    I'm just expecting the Government to have Sanji level fighters hidden away.
    They must have some VA level guys. You look at the Gorosei and they almost confirm people in the Government get involved in combat.
    Considering CP7 had Wanze and CP6 had Jerry it absolutely means that Cipher Pol have fighters.
    Whilst Jerry was seriously weak, Wanze made Sanji get a tiny bit serious for an enjoyable fight (Better in the anime tbh).
    It infers to me that, Jerry in CP6 was weaker than Wanze in CP7 and that all units have members capable of serious combat.
    Though at that time, those guys could be no stronger than the rank between Captain and Lt. in the Marines they were pretty wack.

    I'd be really surprised if CP0 were an overall fodder unit, and I expect them to be able to give good fights going by Law's reaction.

  10. #39
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Fox666's Avatar
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    Re: CP0

    Quote Originally Posted by Airgrimes View Post
    Considering CP9's current abilities, if you put them in the New World they would die extremely fast.
    If your strongest member is Rear Admiral level in your team, and your second strongest is Commodore at best, then it doesn't look too good for you in New World.
    I think you are underestimating CP9 way too much. Fisher Tiger, who had a bounty of 230 million, defeated a Rear Admiral with a kick. And the Vice-Admirals of the Buster Call seemed to have a great admiration for Rob Lucci. And didn't some of the men under Arlong to easily managed to get rid of Commodore Pudding Pudding?
    Last edited by Fox666; May 06, 2013 at 06:58 AM.
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  11. #40
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    Post Re: CP0

    Quote Originally Posted by Fox666 View Post
    I think you are underestimating CP9 way too much. Fisher Tiger, who had a bounty of 230 million, defeated a Rear Admiral with a kick. And the Vice-Admirals of the Buster Call seemed to have a great admiration for Rob Lucci. And didn't some of the men under Arlong to easily managed to get rid of Commodore Pudding Pudding?
    The Luffy at Marineford, would've been able to defeat Lucci more convincingly than at Enies Lobby I believe.
    However in the war, Momonga and Dalmatian completely outclassed Luffy when they met him in the war. Onigumo managed to catch Marco like a bitch, and thanks to his Spider fruit can use a Hachitoryuu sword style.
    Look at Vergo, the current Smoker, and more importantly the fact that all VA's have Haki.
    Something which Lucci doesn't have. Lucci cannot compete with those mentioned.
    Rear Admiral for him.
    Lucci was awesome, but if he bumps into Marco or a Logia, he's dead due to no Haki. Easily dead.

    You have to remember, Bounties don't reflect strength entirely, but reflect the danger that individual poses to the government.
    I'm talking about Kaku, who once Zoro got serious, was finished instantly .
    When Zoro brought out his Asura, Kaku was put to sleep.
    So Rear Admiral/Commodore for him. Since he has no Haki too. I guess same for Jabra he wasn't weak either.

    I expect Pre-Timeskip X Drake to have beaten Kaku and he was a RearAdmiral but I'll accept I'm underestimating Kaku and Jabra too much. Not the rest though.

    Regarding Commodore Pudding, did you forget what happened? A group of fishmen created whirlpools. Nothing to do with combat.

  12. #41
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member kkck's Avatar
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    Re: CP0

    Well, in regards to haki, the VAs and lucci there is one more consideration to make. Remember the boa sisters who luffy fought? Luffy went against them with no haki whatsoever and still overpowered the two even considering the two of them were at least adequate haki users. Haki mastery alone does not make you a monster or even a proper VA level fighter as far as we know. Haki is just one factor in the whole thing, an important one at that but not necessarily the only one. I don't think lucci would hold a candle to most VAs even if haki was restricted in the fight to be honest.

  13. #42
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    Re: CP0

    Quote Originally Posted by Airgrimes View Post
    You thought Lucci was VA level?
    I think Enel was VA level. I don't think Lucci was that strong. I just think Luffy was seriously weak at that point in comparison to the Top tier characters.
    You can't be a VA without Haki btw so Lucci would be Rear Admiral level.


    This is a bit much. You expect Oda to release enemies at this stage that can't touch Sanji? What would be the point?
    I'm expecting there is somebody there who can give Sanji a proper fight.

    ---------
    CP9 were so wack and only Lucci, Kaku, Jabra and Blueno were of notable ability individually.
    The rest were no higher than what would be roughly Captain level in the Marines

    (Although Marine ranks aren't fully based on strength its the best I can grade them at)
    I disagree. Lucci was definitely VA level. Just because a random VA has Haki doesn't mean he would be able to keep up with Lucci's speed or strength. It is also important to consider that not all Haki-users are proficient at using all three types. The Boa Sisters were good at using Observation Haki, but when Luffy kicked it up into Gear 2nd, they couldn't keep up.

    As far as we know, Lucci and Gear 2nd Luffy pre-timeskip were equal, speed-wise. Saying that Luffy improved at using it over time is mainly speculation. In other words, there's a good chance that VAs would have a hard time dealing with Lucci. It's also worth to note that the VA who appeared at Enies Lobby clearly respected Lucci a lot. Some of them even stated that they can't imagine Lucci losing to anyone. That, to me, sounds like something a weaker individual would say about a stronger individual. It makes little sense to me that a VA would say that if he could mop the floor with Lucci.

    Naturally, this doesn't mean that Lucci would be able to keep up with the best of the VA. Smoker, Vergo, Momonga and the likes would probably defeat him. From what we've seen of others, like Kaizeruhige, who basically just stood and watched himself get chocked by another VA who was controlled by Doflamingo, there's a good chance Lucci could be on that level. Him vs. Dalmatian would even seem like a good and even match-up.
    Last edited by Azuma; May 06, 2013 at 09:51 AM.

  14. #43
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Fox666's Avatar
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    Re: CP0

    The Kuja use Haki, but most of them aren't very strong. Momonga and Dalmatian both attacked Luffy when he was already exhausted. We have seen plenty of Vice-Admirals being humilhated by Whitebeard, Doflamingo and recently by Bartolomeo. So I don't think that most of the Vice-Admirals are that strong.
    Quote Originally Posted by IChallengeYou! View Post
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    did you say something about timelines?! naruto ate it NOM NOM NOM IT'S GONE.

  15. #44
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted Schabrak's Avatar
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    Re: CP0

    Quote Originally Posted by Fox666 View Post
    So I don't think that most of the Vice-Admirals are that strong.
    Not that strong in which scale? They are the second strongest marine force after the Kong, Sakazuki and the admirals. Some are upper elite, some are lower elite, all are elite fighters, we just have to consider that almost anything is possible in the New World.
    Last edited by Schabrak; May 07, 2013 at 02:14 AM.
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  17. #45
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity REN KOUEN's Avatar
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    Re: CP0

    i agree that the world goverment is huge, and as the time passes and the dragons become more greedy, they are growing

    so the idea of more government agencies and NEW government agencies, should come as no surprise when you consider that

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