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Thread: Claymore 139 Discussion

  1. #271
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member BleachFan2010's Avatar
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    Re: Claymore 139 Discussion/ 140 Predictions

    He probably might. I wonder if this will make the Soldiers of Rabona fearful of the Claymore in the city ?

    Yeah. Didn't Miria also mention something about Miata and Galatea, she seemed to know that because Miata Awakened it had something to do with Galatea; I like how Galatea is doing this of her own free will instead of being ordered to do it, it has thrown another wrench in Miria's strategy, if they are successful in returning Miata to her human state then Europ is dead and Rabone is safe. But if they dont and she kills everyone there will only be the Ghosts and Cassandra left to face Priscilla. And they'll be totally f*cked.

    Yeah, she seems to have a serpentine look too. So she could either be the "Angel of Rabona" or "The Demon" :O The wait is killing me XD

    Yeah, Europa managed to cut Cassandra up pretty badly, not even Roxanne's blades damaged Cass that much, so shes pretty dangerous. And even if she uses her "sloth" technique Miata will probably just pick her up and eat her XD
    Last edited by BleachFan2010; June 26, 2013 at 11:14 AM.

  2. #272
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Nanozom's Avatar
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    Re: Claymore 139 Discussion/ 140 Predictions

    Oh crap...that´s right, if the humans finds out that the monsters that been preying on them were claymores, then this could mean trouble.
    Then again, what can the humans do? The hybrids are stronger than they are and might take control over the island to ensure that they won´t be chased on a silver witch hunt.
    Maybe the claymores will be forced to create a sovereign state where they are forced to make it plausible for them to live there.
    Or they could be considered gods if Miata really becomes the "Rabonian God" and not a demon.
    that would make things easier.
    ...
    Maybe Yagi intend to kill them all off?
    No, that would not be fair...not after all the sacrifices they made to survive.
    (But then again...Pieta comes to mind...)
    I really hope he won´t go for that.
    ...
    4 more days... and then we will see what will come out of it... I don´t want to theorize about it now since the surprise will be more pleasant that way.
    ...
    But wouldn´t she be corrupted if she eats Europa?
    (Considering what happened to other beings that ate each other...The Destroyer comes to mind...)
    ...
    How many chapters do you think there is left of this? considering that...by my count...this is the 25th volume we are looking at right now.
    how many more?
    ...

  3. #273
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    Re: Claymore 139 Discussion/ 140 Predictions

    They probably won't do anything to the Warriors but they will definitely scorn them. After all the people of Rabona have accepted them now and that's what Warriors probably want the most: to be accepted by Humans, so to be cast out of Rabona would be pretty awful for them.

    Although maybe the people in Rabona won't actually see Miata awaken and might actually think its some deity.

    It would be awesome if they talked about Miata's Awakening as a good thing :3

    ---

    He might, he might not. I actually hope he doesn't kill them either. Though it would be pretty shocking if he did.

    I'm pretty excited to see the reactions of the End Generation warriors after witnessing Miata Awaken.

    ---

    I think that if Miata did eat Europa nothing would happen; Priscilla's flesh on the dead No.1 had the effects it did because she's a special case, aswell as the destroyer :P

    ---

    Maybe Yagi will do 30 volumes ?

  4. #274
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    Re: Claymore 139 Discussion/ 140 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Nanozom View Post
    Oh crap...that´s right, if the humans finds out that the monsters that been preying on them were claymores, then this could mean trouble.
    Then again, what can the humans do? The hybrids are stronger than they are and might take control over the island to ensure that they won´t be chased on a silver witch hunt.
    Maybe the claymores will be forced to create a sovereign state where they are forced to make it plausible for them to live there.
    Or they could be considered gods if Miata really becomes the "Rabonian God" and not a demon.
    that would make things easier.


    I don't know where you get those idea but for the last time - Claymores golden rule is to never kill a human - ever. Miria is exception since she holds quite hate toward organization men who are humans themselves. Other that that I am pretty sure that the rest would allow humans to beat them, rape them or eventually kill them. All because of the Claymore golden rule - never hurt humans ( even Miata respect that rule in her condition ).

    And why would they fear them? The only humans left in Rabona are solders. It is safe to say that they know everything about them - even the awakening part. For being allies of Ghosts they simply have to know, especially since Ghosts brief them before everything started. So we can safely assume that both Claymores and humans will be living at peace once this is all finished.

    But seriously now... CLaymore own state?
    They are Mankind soldiers, not merchants, politicians, scientists, philosophers, mathematicians, writers and everything else you need to have a functioned state, in the end they also lack numbers - you cannot have country with only 50+ people. The best outcome for them is to form a order and live in celibacy in some monastery. ( the most logical outcome given their nature )

    Quote Quote:
    ...
    Maybe Yagi intend to kill them all off?
    No, that would not be fair...not after all the sacrifices they made to survive.
    (But then again...Pieta comes to mind...)
    I really hope he won't go for that.
    ...
    It's quite possible to happen, all Claymores are here + they fight one very powerful AB - much more powerful than all their might combined.
    Beside, if you hang out around here long enough you would see that there are people who desperately wait for someone to die, in simple or most gruesome death.

    Quote Quote:
    4 more days... and then we will see what will come out of it... I don´t want to theorize about it now since the surprise will be more pleasant that way.
    ...
    But wouldn't she be corrupted if she eats Europa?
    (Considering what happened to other beings that ate each other...The Destroyer comes to mind...)
    ...
    ???
    Why would Miata eat Europa? She is not Cassandra.
    She will probably cut her to 1.000.000.000.000 pieces and get back to normal. So if everything goes ok this battle should last 1 or 2 chapters max.

    Quote Quote:
    How many chapters do you think there is left of this? considering that...by my count...this is the 25th volume we are looking at right now.
    how many more?
    ...
    We don't know, we even don't know if this is the final arc or will Yagi introduce Mainland after this as well.
    I seriously doubt that this will be the end because there is nothing short of Clare unlocking Teresa's power that will beat Priscilla to a pulp.
    Last edited by Brother Coa; June 26, 2013 at 11:12 AM.
    "The universe has many horrors yet to throw at us. This is not the end of our struggle. This is just the beginning of our crusade to save Humanity. Be faithful! Be strong! Be vigilant!"

    -Emperor of Mankind.


  5. #275
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Nanozom's Avatar
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    Re: Claymore 139 Discussion/ 140 Predictions

    ???
    Why would Miata eat Europa? She is not Cassandra.
    She will probably cut her to 1.000.000.000.000 pieces and get back to normal. So if everything goes ok this battle should last 1 or 2 chapters max.

    It was a theory someone else put up I just questioned it.

    We don't know, we even don't know if this is the final arc or will Yagi introduce Mainland after this as well.
    I seriously doubt that this will be the end because there is nothing short of Clare unlocking Teresa's power that will beat Priscilla to a pulp.[/QUOTE]

    And if this is the end? We really don´t know what Yagi is thinking after all...
    ...
    And about the golden rule, let´s just say that the claymores might follow it now...but there is a saying that can come into play here...
    "Time rots everything"
    Even if the body doesn´t age, it might be completely possible that the mind and its ideals can be broken down by the decades of time itself.
    Even the noblest of knights can falter after all, it´s human nature.
    ...

  6. #276
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    Re: Claymore 139 Discussion/ 140 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Nanozom View Post
    And about the golden rule, let´s just say that the claymores might follow it now...but there is a saying that can come into play here...
    "Time rots everything"
    Hmm, while there could be a few Claymore who would be tempted to maybe kill Humans who are pretty awful; like the Bandits Teresa killed, I think that they would still feel it there job to keep them alive and defend them, after all that has been their way of life for so long.

    They've probably been tempted to kill civilians before but they haven't, so they probably won't even with the Org gone. It's like Galatea said to Miata: "It seems as if they've beaten their rules into you."

    Edit: And remember that both Helen and Deneve looked unsure when Miria told them to kill all the Humans in the Org they came across (I thought at least) Even though it was the Organization who had out them through all of the horrors of their life they were still unsure whether or not to kill them, Helen did hesitate in her reply to Miria telling them that. It's just the way they are.
    Last edited by BleachFan2010; June 26, 2013 at 11:35 AM.

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  8. #277
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Nanozom's Avatar
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    Re: Claymore 139 Discussion/ 140 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by BleachFan2010 View Post
    Hmm, while there could be a few Claymore who would be tempted to maybe kill Humans who are pretty awful; like the Bandits Teresa killed, I think that they would still feel it there job to keep them alive and defend them, after all that has been their way of life for so long they've probably been tempted to kill civilians before but they haven't so they probably won't even with the Org gone. It's like Galatea said to Miata: "It seems as if they've beaten their rules into you."
    Can the same be said after they lived for hundreds of years in their immortality with nothing but hate and prejudice turned against them?
    I don´t know about you but wouldn´t that be tiresome to be feared all the time and treated like dust?
    And about the monastery idea...
    Would their human minds endure such a isolated existence for that long time?
    ...

  9. #278
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    Re: Claymore 139 Discussion/ 140 Predictions

    @Nanozom

    Even if they are met with hate and prejudice it still won't push them to kill Humans. Yes it might get tiresome for them. But who would stop those who do get sick of that to go and live with a few of their comrades elsewhere away from large populations, and only coming out to kill Yoma near them ?

    And not all Humans treat Claymore like dirt. Look at the town that Teresa and Clare stayed in before Illena and the Hit Squad came for her, they were nice to her.

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  11. #279
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Nanozom's Avatar
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    Re: Claymore 139 Discussion/ 140 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by BleachFan2010 View Post
    @Nanozom

    Even if they are met with hate and prejudice it still won't push them to kill Humans. Yes it might get tiresome for them. But who would stop those who do get sick of that to go and live with a few of their comrades elsewhere away from large populations, and only coming out to kill Yoma near them ?

    And not all Humans treat Claymore like dirt. Look at the town that Teresa and Clare stayed in before Illena and the Hit Squad came for her, they were nice to her.
    That is true, but a warrior´s life is never a dance on roses.
    I think all the claymores are going to go through episodes of PTSD years and years after the war is over. You can take the soldier form the battlefield, but never take the battlefield from a soldier.
    I think they won´t be able to find peace and before anyone knows it, they might accidentally snap at people who pass by in belief that they are still fighting the yoma. To get some of the violent memories out.
    Does the claymores hate their jobs? Do they know anything beyond the violence and trauma that their life been from the start? Do they ever get therapy?
    They are a bunch of shell-shocked war-veterans that probably will be hunted by nightmares after this.
    Unless this monastery somehow will be established to make sure they won´t hurt anyone else by accident.
    ...
    True. not all of the humans are wicked enough to do that. You are right, I am just being pessimistic.

  12. #280
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    Re: Claymore 139 Discussion/ 140 Predictions

    @Nanozom

    Of course the Claymore will need to vent their frustration at being treated bad for all their years, but Humans will probably be their last targets for an outburst, after all they want to be accepted. Only Warriors like Helen will shout at humans :P

    And remember that there are a load of Trainees at the Org. Even though they won't have a huge effect on the Claymore it'll probably bring some joy to 'em looking after them.

    ---

    Lol. I think, because the Org is now done for, the Humans could probably be nicer to the Warriors. After all it was the Org that charged them for killing Yoma, the Claymore were just doing as they were told charging them and that probably p*ssed people off cos it was so pricet. And if Humans are decent to Warriors that will make them become less colder towards Humans. It's win win

  13. #281
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Brother Coa's Avatar
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    Re: Claymore 139 Discussion/ 140 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Nanozom View Post
    ...
    And about the golden rule, let´s just say that the claymores might follow it now...but there is a saying that can come into play here...
    "Time rots everything"
    Even if the body doesn´t age, it might be completely possible that the mind and its ideals can be broken down by the decades of time itself.
    I think that "highlander" has proven that point. As you live longer you become more and more stabile and wise so they are safe regarding that.

    Quote Quote:
    Even the noblest of knights can falter after all, it´s human nature.
    ...
    One crucial thing to remember here - Claymores are not human, they sacrificed their humanity to defend humanity.
    Even if they have human emotions human nature is nonexistent to them, they are even trained to suppress it.
    Unless they are liek Ophelia I doubt they will lose their minds.

    ---------- Post added at 10:14 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:10 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Nanozom View Post
    Can the same be said after they lived for hundreds of years in their immortality with nothing but hate and prejudice turned against them?
    I don´t know about you but wouldn't that be tiresome to be feared all the time and treated like dust?
    1. We don't know if they are truly immortal since no Claymore has lived longer than a decade or two.
    2. They don't mind how they are treated, as creatures who are to be protected they are rarely interested in our opinion.

    Quote Quote:
    And about the monastery idea...
    Would their human minds endure such a isolated existence for that long time?
    ...
    Their minds are not human, their minds are that of a solder. And professional solder mind has to be strong ( to endure all the horrors you would see in a war ).
    And I said nothing about being confined there indefinitely, I imagine they would still go to Rabona and local villages and hang out/teach humans.

    But giving the situation with Mainland I doubt they will have that luxury.

    ---------- Post added at 10:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:14 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Nanozom View Post
    That is true, but a warrior´s life is never a dance on roses.
    I think all the claymores are going to go through episodes of PTSD years and years after the war is over. You can take the soldier form the battlefield, but never take the battlefield from a soldier.
    They are eternal crusaders without a doubt. Even after all yoma are gone they willl still be vigilant and keep they eye on humans.
    But those kind of people never get PTSD, their minds are trained to the extreme where it is basically impossible for them to break down under any kind of stress.

    Quote Quote:
    I think they won´t be able to find peace and before anyone knows it, they might accidentally snap at people who pass by in belief that they are still fighting the yoma. To get some of the violent memories out.
    I seriously doubt it, with their training and brainwashing this thing is impossible to happen.

    Quote Quote:
    Does the claymores hate their jobs?
    Nobody likes being a soldier, it is a must thing. Especially them since they were 'enlisted' at very young age.
    But soldiers are also necessity and they bare the greatest burden - the safety of ones they are protecting.
    To be a soldier is to sacrifice a LOT, nobody likes that job.

    Quote Quote:
    Do they know anything beyond the violence and trauma that their life been from the start? Do they ever get therapy?
    Why do they need one at all? They are trained to kill not humans but inhuman monsters, they are not in war but in small engagements and every piece of body they lose can be regenerated given enough time and yoki
    You get mad when killing innocent people, not killing things that are not human at all.

    Quote Quote:
    They are a bunch of shell-shocked war-veterans that probably will be haunted by nightmares after this.
    Some of them yes, but there will not be any kind of post effect at all. Just look at Clare, she lost everything and she was cut everywhere and yet she is no crazy at all nor do she remembers it and mind it. Why consider this at all when their minds are different than human ones? They are trained rigorously, suffered unimaginable pain and are implemented with such propaganda that it would make SS look like little kids. Chances they will break down are miniscule, if not impossible.
    "The universe has many horrors yet to throw at us. This is not the end of our struggle. This is just the beginning of our crusade to save Humanity. Be faithful! Be strong! Be vigilant!"

    -Emperor of Mankind.


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  15. #282
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Nanozom's Avatar
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    Re: Claymore 139 Discussion/ 140 Predictions

    [QUOTE=Brother Coa;3464222]

    From your viewpoint and from what I can see, you are convinced that the claymores are not human at all in any regard.
    Pardon me for trying to humanize them but if they weren´t human then what in the world is the difference between them and the awakened then?
    Haven´t the awakened been described as lacking all humanity?
    How can they lack something that they never had, according to you taht is, if the claymores were never human to begin with.

    Claymores cry.

    Isn´t that the proof of their humanity?

    If they are not humans then why would they even bother with getting involved with the humans at all.
    Unless their sense of duty is imprinted on them solely from the Organization and all of them are basically tricked into believing that they are human beings when they in fact are no different from the yoma. Just another sub-species of the DoD...
    (Maybe this is how the Dragonkin got involved in the war in the first place...the humans are indoctrinating them to believe they are humans.)
    Are you saying that the claymores are creatures that only adapt the appearance and memories of the hosts the yoma material was operated into. Maybe all of the claymores are really dead and what we have been following around is just creatures thatby all means are no different from the yoma. (I say "no different" since the Claymores become the Awakened and they eat guts)
    If the claymores have no humanity then they are just monsters that think they are humans.
    Is that what you are insulating?
    If so then this is tragic beyond all comprehension, everything that the claymores fights for is just a lie imposed on them by the Organization, their memories are not their own...they are just stolen from their host bodies.
    Maybe this is what a claymore really is...
    Walking yoki that developed a consciousness.
    Maybe this is what broke Ophelia, she maybe discovered the truth and her mind snapped apart. Maybe this is the reason to why some claymores chose awakening instead of execution. They just...accepted things as they really are....they just gave up, pretending to be what they weren´t.
    Maybe the indoctrination is a way of delusional sense of purpose for a species, whose first memories are tears, the horrors and sorrow from the young girls they merged with and shaped them.
    I can understand the Organization now if this is the case.WHy they struggles to keep the warriors under control, why they executed them before the hybrids became strong enough to pose a threat. In order to fight monsters, humanity created monsters...and the ones they made threatens to destroy mankind and end the war in the DoD´s favor.

    The Claymores aren´t capable of PTSD?
    How about Existential Crisis?
    How would they react if they discovered that the memories in their heads beyond the hybridization are not their own, but stolen and used from the little girls that ended up on the operating table?
    That they were never humans to begin with.
    All this grief, all this suffering, all these tears...imposed on them by the desperation of man and their desire to win a impossible war.
    Can they call themselves human after that?
    After getting a reason to why they were so hated?
    That the humans were right in their judgement of them? That they are no better than the yoma, no...that they ARE the True Yoma, (Since they don´t have the parasite in their heads), a creature that impersonate a human being, both in appearance, memory and mind... If this theory is correct then the kill order is this.

    the yoma equals Infected humans

    The Claymores are the Yoma

    The yoma kill humans

    The Organization makes yoma

    It all makes sense...the lands of the island won´t ever be free from the yoma since they are the claymores, warriors who have just been killing sick humans and each other.

    And the Claymores are the most sympathetic ones in this world.
    but according to theories here, they are not even human.
    What does that say about the state of this world?
    ...
    The Claymores are the True Yoma.
    They are the enemy they were supposed to fight, yet more human than the actual humans.
    This is the mother of all paradoxes...
    That means that the only times they actually killed yoma worthy of the name, has been when they killed awakened beings. the cannon fodder they thought was the yoma doesn´t count since those were humans, infected with a parasites.
    This is insane...
    ...

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    Re: Claymore 139 Discussion/ 140 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Nanozom View Post
    Claymores cry.

    Isn't that the proof of their humanity?
    It isn't.
    1. They are not Humans at all, but superhumans.
    2. They didn't have normal human lives filled with emotions but they had rigorous training to fight as soldiers.
    3. The closest things they have as Humanity is their feeling toward their sisters ( they are all family after all ) and thought that they, in some way, are still humans ( their weapon against self awakening ).

    But the 1'st thing you need to have humanity is to be human. Horses cannot have humanity because they are not the same species as humans. Same works for Claymores, they stopped being human the moment they accepted yoma organs and blood into their bodies.

    Quote Quote:
    If they are not humans then why would they even bother with getting involved with the humans at all.
    Because they want to be with humans?
    And you are forgetting that it is their PURPOSE to protect Mankind. They are made for that and only that role - there is nothing more important in their lives than that.
    It is the sense of their duty that keeps them with Humanity.

    Quote Quote:
    Unless their sense of duty is imprinted on them solely from the Organization and all of them are basically tricked into believing that they are human beings when they in fact are no different from the yoma. Just another sub-species of the DoD...
    Well they didn't actually tricked them, they are still humans - but new subspecies of humans.

    Quote Quote:
    If the claymores have no humanity then they are just monsters that think they are humans.
    Is that what you are insulating?
    No.
    They just swapped it for sense of duty.
    First thing: what is considered humanity?
    It is how we think, how we act, how we discuss and how we live. And that is life full of emotions, as well as life full of progress ( building something, finding soulmate, having children, raising children... ).
    Claymores on the other hand are trained to suppress their emotions ( because of Awakening ) and to do only one thing in their lives - to protect and kill. They as a warriors lack ton of things that is making their human, the only thing left for them is their emotions toward each other.

    Bu that can change if they integrate with other humans and try to live same as them.

    ---------- Post added at 08:23 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:21 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Nanozom View Post
    The Claymores are not capable of PTSD?
    ...
    Per definition they aren't because they are super soldiers.
    PTSD is the effect of trauma on the battlefield ( seeing dead people and killing people ), since they are professionally trained soldiers they are not affected by it.
    Last edited by Brother Coa; June 27, 2013 at 01:28 AM.
    "The universe has many horrors yet to throw at us. This is not the end of our struggle. This is just the beginning of our crusade to save Humanity. Be faithful! Be strong! Be vigilant!"

    -Emperor of Mankind.


  17. #284
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    Re: Claymore 139 Discussion/ 140 Predictions

    Just a quick comment on humanity. I'm pretty much for "life full of emotions" and all that = being human, but I wouldn't say the lack of emotions =/= human. There are cases in the world where people lose their ability to 'love' after accidents. I would hate to say they're not human anymore.

    Personally I believe the interaction between one another, be it meaningful or not (and therefore cases such as above are included,) is what makes us 'human.' In terms of progress, even Clare and Miria have shown progress in understanding the world around them: Terressa for Clare, Clare for Raki, and Miria for her teammates. Senses of duty taking up most of their Claymore life is reflective of people who drown themselves in their work in our real world, but it doesn't necessarily mean that's all they have in life: Miria had Hilda, Clare had Elena. These are signs that there are more to being a Claymore than a sense of duty, and the answer is simply 'interaction,' better put, 'bond' and 'friendship.'

    I think the most defining difference is their 'superpowers,' which in turns make them 'superhuman' in a sense, but don't forget that the word 'human' is still firmly rooted in that description. We've seen a number of Claymores wanting to die as a human, this is the main reason the black card system work in the first place.

    Claymores are fully human (note that fully Awakened Beings are a different story...)
    So rather than calling them 'non-human superhuman,' I prefer calling them 'human with superpower' who have slightly unconventional life journey and decisions to make along the way.

  18. #285
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member number12michael's Avatar
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    Re: Claymore 139 Discussion/ 140 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Utsune View Post
    Just a quick comment on humanity. I'm pretty much for "life full of emotions" and all that = being human, but I wouldn't say the lack of emotions =/= human. There are cases in the world where people lose their ability to 'love' after accidents. I would hate to say they're not human anymore.

    Personally I believe the interaction between one another, be it meaningful or not (and therefore cases such as above are included,) is what makes us 'human.' In terms of progress, even Clare and Miria have shown progress in understanding the world around them: Terressa for Clare, Clare for Raki, and Miria for her teammates. Senses of duty taking up most of their Claymore life is reflective of people who drown themselves in their work in our real world, but it doesn't necessarily mean that's all they have in life: Miria had Hilda, Clare had Elena. These are signs that there are more to being a Claymore than a sense of duty, and the answer is simply 'interaction,' better put, 'bond' and 'friendship.'

    I think the most defining difference is their 'superpowers,' which in turns make them 'superhuman' in a sense, but don't forget that the word 'human' is still firmly rooted in that description. We've seen a number of Claymores wanting to die as a human, this is the main reason the black card system work in the first place.

    Claymores are fully human (note that fully Awakened Beings are a different story...)
    So rather than calling them 'non-human superhuman,' I prefer calling them 'human with superpower' who have slightly unconventional life journey and decisions to make along the way.
    pretty sure they are "Half human Half Yoma"

    and what of warriors like Roxanne who shows no signs of love or truly caring for anything(besides herself maybe)
    "Keep Eating Shit For The Rest Of Your Life " - 愛憎のロクサーヌ- Roxanne of Love and Hate

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