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Thread: Ichigo's name having more meaning?

  1. #16
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Lee.J.Baxter's Avatar
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    Re: Ichigo's name having more meaning?

    Quote Originally Posted by Schabrak View Post
    Since the manga was supposed to end after the SS arc, no. Any other explanation than those given in the first arcs is a retcon, it's as simple as that isn't it?
    True, but then again almost everything in Bleach is a retcon isn't it?

    I agree that Ichigo may simply have gotten his name because it's something inspirational, "he who protects", with no other meaning behind his name, but it wouldn't be the first time that Kubo uses that remarkable ingenuity to come up with a backstory for it!!!
    Predictions
    • Quincies become latent Shinigami when they die, meaning Yhwach is the progenitor of the Shinigami too.
    • The star and name "Quincy" refers to the 5 Royal Guards and the Soul King; this originates in Yhwach wanting to overthrow him.
    • The final battle within the Seireitei will be between Zaraki and Haschwalth.

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    Re: Ichigo's name having more meaning?

    If they were the same thing why aren't they called the same thing. O right, cause they aren't. Also, I said from Ichigo's parents perspective, not yours.
    Last edited by chorns; May 07, 2013 at 02:45 PM.

  3. #18
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member Jabman's Avatar
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    Re: Ichigo's name having more meaning?

    A lot of you are saying fullbringers shouldn't be classified as a unique soul. Sure but maybe it's something else. Like that form he took when his sword was attached to his body. Or something similar to the soul king and H-Aizen. I just really like this theory by chorns.

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    Re: Ichigo's name having more meaning?

    Quote Originally Posted by Schabrak View Post
    Since the manga was supposed to end after the SS arc, no. Any other explanation than those given in the first arcs is a retcon, it's as simple as that isn't it?
    Vaizards were never to be introduced, Ichigo was never to tame his inner Hollow, he wasn't meant to kill Grand Fisher in Arrancar form, Isshin not calling Kon "Ichigo" as a clue he was a Shinigami is worthless, Ryuken being Quincy, that abandoned his power, many Shikais and Bankais not shown, and Ichigo's past should be mystery forever. Kubo wanted to end it after SS arc? What about Aizen? Manga wasn't supposed to end with SS arc. HM arc was made up on the spot. That doesn't mean, that manga was to end after SS... Kubo himself said, that he had current arc planned for a long time (10 years IIRC). I hate when people bring up that topic, wanting to show how much they know. -.-

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    Re: Ichigo's name having more meaning?

    Quote Originally Posted by Duniak View Post
    Vaizards were never to be introduced, Ichigo was never to tame his inner Hollow, he wasn't meant to kill Grand Fisher in Arrancar form, Isshin not calling Kon "Ichigo" as a clue he was a Shinigami is worthless, Ryuken being Quincy, that abandoned his power, many Shikais and Bankais not shown, and Ichigo's past should be mystery forever. Kubo wanted to end it after SS arc? What about Aizen? Manga wasn't supposed to end with SS arc. HM arc was made up on the spot. That doesn't mean, that manga was to end after SS... Kubo himself said, that he had current arc planned for a long time (10 years IIRC). I hate when people bring up that topic, wanting to show how much they know. -.-
    It's actually quite similar to how some individuals believe the Menos can only be taken out by the Elite Royal Guard or what ever Elites they are talking about was retconned by Kubo but you know what is foolish about this thought?

    .Rukia was a normal shinigami who hadn't experience the reality of the worlds & the many creatures that exists, meaning she was ignorant of it.

    .She learned what she knew about the Menos from the Texts books just like all noobie shinigami who just graduated & wasn't exposed http://www.mangastream.to/bleach-chapter-48-page-8.html,

    .Noobie shinigami like her aren't suppose to encounter a Menos Class Hollow (she came to the human world thinking she would kill those weak class hollows & Ukitake was fully confident in her ability to do so) but Aizen altered certain changes.

    . Ichigo defeated the Menos didn't he? The same Ichigo that got owned by 2 shinigamis that were introduced 4 chapters later.
    Last edited by Kay3795; May 08, 2013 at 09:35 AM.

  6. #21
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member kkck's Avatar
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    Re: Ichigo's name having more meaning?

    menos are very varied in power, it makes sense only elite shinigami would handle them. Surely gillian are relatively easy to deal with but having the royal guard deal with adjuca and vasto lords makes sense, specially considering SS didn't use to have the means to effectively travel to HM and the royals seem to be able to move in between worlds easily (while we haven't seen them go to HM yet it would make sense if they had better means than even urahara to get there).

    Rukia was a normal shinigami only in the sense that she was not a seated officer. What we saw did not necessarily suggest she was altogether weak as a shinigami.

    To be fair, we know going to HM didn't use to be an easy thing for shinigami and a gillian going to the human world was unprecedented (and forced by aizen). It makes sense a lot of shinigami had not actually seen a menos even as seated officers.

    Ichigo just wounded the menos and forced it to retreat. He did not necessarily win the battle.

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    Re: Ichigo's name having more meaning?

    Quote Originally Posted by kkck View Post
    menos are very varied in power, it makes sense only elite shinigami would handle them. Surely gillian are relatively easy to deal with but having the royal guard deal with adjuca and vasto lords makes sense, specially considering SS didn't use to have the means to effectively travel to HM and the royals seem to be able to move in between worlds easily (while we haven't seen them go to HM yet it would make sense if they had better means than even urahara to get there).

    Rukia was a normal shinigami only in the sense that she was not a seated officer. What we saw did not necessarily suggest she was altogether weak as a shinigami.

    To be fair, we know going to HM didn't use to be an easy thing for shinigami and a gillian going to the human world was unprecedented (and forced by aizen). It makes sense a lot of shinigami had not actually seen a menos even as seated officers.

    .Ichigo just wounded the menos and forced it to retreat. He did not necessarily win the battle.
    Look at that page again. It referred only to Menos Grande. http://www.mangastream.to/bleach-chapter-48-page-8.html

    .The word, weak wasn't used to describe her, it was used to described the sort of hollows Ichigo & Uryu were taking out in a flash, the sort of hollow Menos Grande would eat.

    .Hence they were ignorant of the reality of the worlds as I said.

    .Ichigo forced the Menos to retreat http://www.mangastream.to/bleach-cha...9-page-19.html http://www.mangastream.to/bleach-chapter-50-page-1.html
    It's was his victory, the Menos was defeated. http://www.mangastream.to/bleach-cha...0-page-10.html

  8. #23
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Quantized's Avatar
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    Re: Ichigo's name having more meaning?

    Quote Originally Posted by Duniak View Post
    Soul in Rukongai lives differently from Shinigamis and differently from humans. If Humans are different form than Quincies and Fullbringers, then Souls are different form than Hollow and Shinigami. Human is an empty shell, but that shell can be filled with some powers. Humans with spiritual pressure can become Quincies. Souls with spiritual pressure can become Shinigami. But there are anomalies. Soul without Soul Burial is consumed by negative emotions and becomes HOLLOW. If that Hollow attacks pregnant woman, her child becomes Fullbringer. So Human is different, but soul is not? Let's be consistent.
    A plus soul is kinda a neutral ground, they can either become a hollow, shinigami or stay as a plus if too weak, or get eaten by a hollow if too weak (In general).
    I wouldn't call plus souls any different than a human though, they're merely dead humans, after all.
    A shinigami is a human who has a lot of reatsu, has been through a soul burial to seal off their hollow powers, and has gotten an Asauchi, so they can manipulate their inner spirit.
    So in a sense, I think that plus souls and humans are more or less the same, just that a plus is a dead human, but they still fall in the same category for me.
    You can't say I'm incosistant, you should at least try understand what I write before saying something like that.

    ---------- Post added at 04:36 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:27 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Duniak View Post
    Vaizards were never to be introduced, Ichigo was never to tame his inner Hollow, he wasn't meant to kill Grand Fisher in Arrancar form, Isshin not calling Kon "Ichigo" as a clue he was a Shinigami is worthless, Ryuken being Quincy, that abandoned his power, many Shikais and Bankais not shown, and Ichigo's past should be mystery forever. Kubo wanted to end it after SS arc? What about Aizen? Manga wasn't supposed to end with SS arc. HM arc was made up on the spot. That doesn't mean, that manga was to end after SS... Kubo himself said, that he had current arc planned for a long time (10 years IIRC). I hate when people bring up that topic, wanting to show how much they know. -.-
    At the very least get your facts straight before you try to state such things in such a way.
    Kubo didn't Expect this much success, so yes, it was supposed to end after SS, but he had still planned the story further than SS.

    So both you AND the one you quote are correct. He planned further, but didn't expect to get that far, so sheez, calm down, and try get along with people.
    Just because you see things in your perspective, doesn't mean that things can't be seen any different.

    The world is flat, most people belived this as fact , untll someone changed their views. The same goes here, you should make a discussion, not flat out enforce your own views.

  9. #24
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    Re: Ichigo's name having more meaning?

    Quote Originally Posted by Quantized View Post
    A plus soul is kinda a neutral ground, they can either become a hollow, shinigami or stay as a plus if too weak, or get eaten by a hollow if too weak (In general).
    I wouldn't call plus souls any different than a human though, they're merely dead humans, after all.
    A shinigami is a human who has a lot of reatsu, has been through a soul burial to seal off their hollow powers, and has gotten an Asauchi, so they can manipulate their inner spirit.
    So in a sense, I think that plus souls and humans are more or less the same, just that a plus is a dead human, but they still fall in the same category for me.
    You can't say I'm incosistant, you should at least try understand what I write before saying something like that.
    Of course I can. If human WITHOUT any reiatsu and soul WITHOUT any reiatsu is the same for you, then trained human with reiatsu (also known as Quincy or Fullbringer), should be the same as soul with reiatsu (also known as Shinigami or Hollow, depending of Soul Burial). Stretching facts so they'd fit your theory is little lame IMO. You're better than that. Or should I say, stretching facts so my post could be disproved, forcing me to further discussion.

    Quote Quote:
    At the very least get your facts straight before you try to state such things in such a way.
    Kubo didn't Expect this much success, so yes, it was supposed to end after SS, but he had still planned the story further than SS.
    And what was the point at the beggining? ^^ Kubo didn't plan the story further than SS, so everything further is a retcon. I countered that. Hardly did I say, that Kubo expected such success. When he was still making SS arc, Bleach was already pretty popular so it's not strange he continued it. And even if he planned to end it after SS arc, he still left some huge plotholes from BEFORE SS arc.

    Quote Quote:
    The world is flat, most people belived this as fact , untll someone changed their views. The same goes here, you should make a discussion, not flat out enforce your own views.
    Why would I start slowly? I'm always curious how Schabrak-the-Almighty will respond. Saying everything after SS arc is changing the facts is just bullshit, as we have much foreshadowing in SS arc and before SS arc. Grand Fisher escaped in like 20 chapters. And what? Kubo didn't plan to take him off after SS arc? Save Rukia and gtfo? Revenge on GF never taken? Some things indicate, that he had plans for it even before SS arc, that's why I always discuss it with people who claim otherwise. Result is always the same.

  10. #25
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Quantized's Avatar
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    Re: Ichigo's name having more meaning?

    Quote Originally Posted by Duniak View Post
    Of course I can. If human WITHOUT any reiatsu and soul WITHOUT any reiatsu is the same for you, then trained human with reiatsu (also known as Quincy or Fullbringer), should be the same as soul with reiatsu (also known as Shinigami or Hollow, depending of Soul Burial). Stretching facts so they'd fit your theory is little lame IMO. You're better than that. Or should I say, stretching facts so my post could be disproved, forcing me to further discussion.



    And what was the point at the beggining? ^^ Kubo didn't plan the story further than SS, so everything further is a retcon. I countered that. Hardly did I say, that Kubo expected such success. When he was still making SS arc, Bleach was already pretty popular so it's not strange he continued it. And even if he planned to end it after SS arc, he still left some huge plotholes from BEFORE SS arc.



    Why would I start slowly? I'm always curious how Schabrak-the-Almighty will respond. Saying everything after SS arc is changing the facts is just bullshit, as we have much foreshadowing in SS arc and before SS arc. Grand Fisher escaped in like 20 chapters. And what? Kubo didn't plan to take him off after SS arc? Save Rukia and gtfo? Revenge on GF never taken? Some things indicate, that he had plans for it even before SS arc, that's why I always discuss it with people who claim otherwise. Result is always the same.
    Well all I care about is peaceful and logical discussions, even if it's between others, we're all gonna read it, and I think most of us are here to have a good time.
    It's not my business to butt in between, but even so, I have to read it, and that kind of makes it my business in the end.

    I don't think my logic is stretching. If I had to be so bold and arrogant enough to claim so my self, I'm a highly logical person with a large interest in physics & also business, thereby logic & truth really interests me.
    Paradigms also interest me a lot, and different people apparently see the world in radically different lights, which is what I did try to explain earlier.
    Someone may think they understand the world, but they don't.
    Some may only understand parts of the world, but don't realize.
    Some may understand the world, but don't realize.

    The hight of stupidity however, is if someone thinks they understand it all in this world.
    I hope that everyone can refrain from thinking as such.

    What we all got to remember though is that this is a shounen manga, since when did logic become the judge of understanding?
    If Kubo wants to crate a God, he'll do it, if Kubo wants little pink unicorns fly around Ichigo's head in the remaining arc, he'll do it, if Kubo wants to go against his own words in the earlier manga, he'll do it, if Kubo wants to defy all logic, he'll do it.
    My point being, it doesn't matter what we think is logical or not, we can't use logic to decide what we haven't had confirmed by Kubo, and even then, we can't completely trust it until the manga has ended.

    The world is a constant battle of understanding, the moment we lain our backs against the couch claiming that we understand it all, the moment we stop becoming truth seekers, and the level of intelligence will drop as the critical thinking and knowledge gathering is coming to a hold.

    Ultimately my point being, we can't claim things to be, we have to all discuss it.
    No one can make facts, since ultimately no one knows what is fact and not.
    Facts are facts only to the community, like in Science, what the community believes to be fact, is fact, and real.
    No single person can make anything fact or real, cause those are subjective to the community.

    One person may be correct, the the community wrong, but the opposite is also often true.
    However as long as the community disagree, you can't make it fact, no matter how logical your claims may be.

    That's exactly why dicussing is important, since one person can't force facts and reality, it doesn't matter if you're right or wrong.

    So when it all boils down to it, we need to discuss things, and come to an agreement together, rather than force opinions on other people.

    I'm not really putting this forward only to you, I think that many of us can learn from this, even my self.
    We're a community here, we need to take responsibility as one, and discuss with each otheers, hopefuilly with respect.

    In the end, what I hope for, is that one can parts ways even while disagreeing & still have a good day.
    Truth & facts however can only be found in the community since they're always subjective, as such, why not just enjoy the road to the truth when discussing?

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