Not a member? Register now!
Announcements
Manga returns! Catch up with the details. Enjoy downloading, translating, and scanlating manga HERE legally!
Like us on Facebook, follow us on Twitter! Celebrate another year with MH and read our yearbook.
Manga News: Check out this week's new manga (7/21/14 - 7/27/14).
Forum News: Visit new sections for Nisekoi and Kingdom!
Translations: Gintama 503 by kewl0210 , One Piece 753 by cnet128 , Bleach 589 (2)
New Reply
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 22

Thread: ..Was that it? The connection between Yhwach and Masaki.

  1. #1
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Country
    Sweden
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    743
    Post Thanks / Like

    ..Was that it? The connection between Yhwach and Masaki.

    During Ichigo and Yhwach's first encounter, Yhwach tells Ichigo that he doesn't know anythng about his mother. Now, if someone utters those words, my mind immediately assumes that the person who said that knows something about the said person. In other words, I always assumed there was a clear, familiar connection between Masaki and Yhwach, something along the lines of Masaki being part of the Vandenreich.

    We now know that this is not the case. Masaki was not part of the Vandenreich. In fact, other than Yhwach being her distant ancestor, there is no connection between Masaki and Yhwach. Yhwach's actions indirectly lead to her death, but the fact remains that Yhwach didn't know Masaki. It is very strange, in my opinion, that Yhwach would say the aforementioned phrase to Ichigo given that he, himself, knew nothing about Masaki. Based on the most recent chapter, the only thing Yhwach could add to "You don't know anything about your mother" would be "I was responsible for her death" which doesn't at all seem natural given Yhwach's tone at the time.

    At the same time, it felt like we found out everything we could find out about Masaki in the most recent flashback. The Ishida household took her in at a young age and trained her. She practically grew up as their family member. Eventually, she gets infected by White and starts to undergo Hollowfication. After that, her relationship with Isshin kicks off. It doesn't seem like there's any room for Yhwach to fit in here. Thus, there doesn't seem to be any deeper connection between Yhwach and Masaki.

    Still, the fact that Yhwach seemed like he was capable of telling Ichigo about who his mother 'really' was seems to suggest otherwise. It is completely illogical that he would utter those words based on what we know so far.

    Could this somehow be a translation error? Or did Kubo simply use Yhwach to build up hype and suspense for Masaki's flashback, without never intending to give him an active role?

  2. #2
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Zehahaha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Country
    Morocco
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    3,525
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: ..Was that it? The connection between Yhwach and Masaki.

    There's no relation between Jhwach and Masaki except he's her ancestor and the creator of the Quincies, and his blood flow in every Quincy out there, Isshin already explained it in the new chapter, so I don't see what's the problem here

  3. Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked this post
  4. #3
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Country
    Sweden
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    743
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: ..Was that it? The connection between Yhwach and Masaki.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zehahaha View Post
    There's no relation between Jhwach and Masaki except he's her ancestor and the creator of the Quincies, and his blood flow in every Quincy out there, Isshin already explained it in the new chapter, so I don't see what's the problem here
    I don't think you actually read my post clearly. Otherwise, you should've clearly seen me state that.

  5. #4
    Banned 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Country
    Poland
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    1,199
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: ..Was that it? The connection between Yhwach and Masaki.

    He didn't know his mother was Quincy. And being a Quincy is enough to tell him, that he doesn't know anything about his mom. I too hoped for some family connection, but I don't know what's your problem with new revelation.

  6. Like 2 Member(s) likes this post
  7. #5
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Zehahaha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Country
    Morocco
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    3,525
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: ..Was that it? The connection between Yhwach and Masaki.

    Quote Originally Posted by Azuma View Post
    I don't think you actually read my post clearly. Otherwise, you should've clearly seen me state that.
    I've read it, and I don't even see the purpose of your post to begin with
    He said that Ichigo doesn't know anything about his mother, because Ichigo never knew she was a Quincy (hence why he got Quincy powers), and he also said that to Ichigo that he's his son born in the darkness because he's the origin of Quincies

    Because of his status, he may be aware of every single Quincy that exists in this world, because his blood flows in every Quincy there, so he doesn't need to personally know Quincy if he wants to know things about them. Judging from what Isshin said, he probably regained his powers by targetting the Quincies he deemed impure from a distance, probably while he is in his palace, how did he pinpoint their locations and stuff ? With his blood perhaps

  8. Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked this post
    Like 2 Member(s) likes this post
  9. #6
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Country
    Sweden
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    743
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: ..Was that it? The connection between Yhwach and Masaki.

    Quote Originally Posted by Duniak View Post
    He didn't know his mother was Quincy. And being a Quincy is enough to tell him, that he doesn't know anything about his mom. I too hoped for some family connection, but I don't know what's your problem with new revelation.
    I just find it strange. Yhwach was talking about Masaki as if he actually knew her or something about her and it turns out that all he did was indirectly causing her death. Masaki's luck is extremely terrible, for the record. Losing her powers while she's fighting a random hollow is just cruel.

    ---------- Post added at 09:52 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:50 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Zehahaha View Post
    I've read it, and I don't even see the purpose of your post to begin with
    He said that Ichigo doesn't know anything about his mother, because Ichigo never knew she was a Quincy (hence why he got Quincy powers), and he also said that to Ichigo that he's his son born in the darkness because he's the origin of Quincies

    Because of his status, he may be aware of every single Quincy that exists in this world, because his blood flows in every Quincy there, so he doesn't need to personally know Quincy if he wants to know things about them. Judging from what Isshin said, he probably regained his powers by targetting the Quincies he deemed impure from a distance, probably while he is in his palace, how did he pinpoint their locations and stuff ? With his blood perhaps
    I'm well aware of all of that. I guess I simply expected more than "Your mother is a Quincy and I indirectly caused her death". It is very weird, to me at least, that the man responsible for Masaki's death would talk down to Ichigo for not knowing about it. Seems a bit psychopathic to be honest.

  10. #7
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member DraMas26's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Country
    Albania
    Posts
    313
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: ..Was that it? The connection between Yhwach and Masaki.

    Since Blut is Bach's blood he's bonded to every Quincy. Thus he can modify Blut as stated by Opie:

    http://www.mangapanda.com/bleach/492/16

    After he said Ichigo knew nothing about Masaki he said that he'll force Ichigo to surrender:

    http://www.mangapanda.com/bleach/514/10

    He then said he'll release his power and Ichigo's blut cannot save him:

    http://www.mangapanda.com/bleach/514/12

    What Bach was doing was referencing how Masaki died. Like Isshin said, Masaki's Blut Vene was exceptionally strong and she had never recieved a wound from a Hollow after Whitey. She lost to Grand Fisher because Bach "released his powers" from her and took her Blut Vene away. This is what Bach is referencing here. Ichigo is tanking his attacks due to his Blut Vene so Bach is saying he'll deal with Ichigo with the same tactic he used when dealing with Masaki.

  11. #8
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Country
    Sweden
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    743
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: ..Was that it? The connection between Yhwach and Masaki.

    Quote Originally Posted by DraMas26 View Post
    Since Blut is Bach's blood he's bonded to every Quincy. Thus he can modify Blut as stated by Opie:

    http://www.mangapanda.com/bleach/492/16

    After he said Ichigo knew nothing about Masaki he said that he'll force Ichigo to surrender:

    http://www.mangapanda.com/bleach/514/10

    He then said he'll release his power and Ichigo's blut cannot save him:

    http://www.mangapanda.com/bleach/514/12

    What Bach was doing was referencing how Masaki died. Like Isshin said, Masaki's Blut Vene was exceptionally strong and she had never recieved a wound from a Hollow after Whitey. She lost to Grand Fisher because Bach "released his powers" from her and took her Blut Vene away. This is what Bach is referencing here. Ichigo is tanking his attacks due to his Blut Vene so Bach is saying he'll deal with Ichigo with the same tactic he used when dealing with Masaki.
    Nice observation. I completely forgot about Yhwach implying that he can take away Ichigo's Blut. But still, I think that hints at there being more to it than what Isshin said seeing as Yhwach says "I'll tell you when we get to Vandenreich". Personally, I find it strange if he'd say "9 years ago, your mother was taking a stroll with you when I decided to take away her powers and indirectly kill her". Everything about that scene implies that there was a real connection between Masaki and Yhwach, beyond merely being Quincies. But Isshin hardly touched upon that link.

  12. Like 1 Member(s) likes this post
  13. #9
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Notak's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Country
    Sweden
    Posts
    918
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: ..Was that it? The connection between Yhwach and Masaki.

    I think it was more of a mistranslation, or a misinterpretation. Sometimes we can read too much into things, especially because of translations.

  14. #10
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Opportunist traveler.
    Country
    United States
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    397
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: ..Was that it? The connection between Yhwach and Masaki.

    Masaki was given the exact room she needed in the story. Nowhere did Yhwach imply that he had anything to do with her directly, only that part about "My son" and "born in the dark". Ichigo knew nothing about his family, Yhwach intended to tell him everything about his family, and that's all that can be taken from that brief encounter they had.
    This might come in handy. Maybe one in more analysis to come:

    The Thousand Year Blood War buildup and recap:
    http://mangahelpers.com/forum/showth...=1#post3091160

  15. #11
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member Zeta42's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Country
    Ukraine
    Age
    22
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    479
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: ..Was that it? The connection between Yhwach and Masaki.

    Yhwach did know about Masaki. He didn't steal her powers randomly, he made a "holy selection," whatever that is. He chose Masaki as his target because of her impurity.

  16. #12
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member conn-man's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    The Fried Side
    Country
    United States
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    1,729
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: ..Was that it? The connection between Yhwach and Masaki.

    I guess we can figure the Bach family has many branches..some higher in ranking than others. Maybe the Kurosakis are the Quincy equivalent to the Kuchikis as they are to SS. Or maybe the Kurosakis and Ishidas are more like the Shiba clan. There could be some interesting symbolism to the these two fallen clans to have bred who is most likely known in the bleachverse as 'Save the world Ichigo'.
    Last edited by conn-man; May 15, 2013 at 10:50 PM.

  17. #13
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Country
    Bahamas
    Age
    37
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    266
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: ..Was that it? The connection between Yhwach and Masaki.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zeta42 View Post
    Yhwach did know about Masaki. He didn't steal her powers randomly, he made a "holy selection," whatever that is. He chose Masaki as his target because of her impurity.
    I think a bit of his soul is in each of the Quincies. So they're born with a bit of his soul, and through their lives and battles they add a bit to their quincy powers, which is in affect, a part of Yhwack's soul. So he can tell whose pure Quincy and who isn't, and decidedly, he takes his powers from the ones he's dubbed impure, robbing them of not only his power, but the bit of their souls that is built upon it.

    so maybe, he has a bit of Masaki's soul within him as well as all the others whose powers he took.

  18. #14
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Notak's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Country
    Sweden
    Posts
    918
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: ..Was that it? The connection between Yhwach and Masaki.

    I thought Masaki was a pure-blooded Quincy, hence why Ryuuken was supposed to marry her?

  19. #15
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member NoOneInParticular's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Nowhere in particular
    Country
    United Kingdom
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    747
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: ..Was that it? The connection between Yhwach and Masaki.

    Since he made a selection of which Quincy to keep and which to use up, he must have had knowledge about the lot of them. That shouldn't have been too difficult given their strict maintenance of the bloodline. They must have kept records of who was pure and who wasn't and what duties they were assigned and what have you.

    edit: And had I read the thread I'd have seen that Zeta42 pretty much said that already...

New Reply
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts