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Translations: Gintama 507 (2)
The comparison I would use for fishman karate is that it simply is a martial art. Overall jinbe is a fishman karate user in the exact same context zoro is a swordsman or sanji is a red leg user (not sure what his style is called but since his master is called red leg...). So the relation between haki and fishman karate has to be the exact same as any other martial art and haki. Attacking logia is not the only function haki has so ultimately fishman karate or not any fighter would end up needing it to deal with certain people.
ANYTHING ELSE FOR OR AGAINST is not factual and we genuinely don't know, id personally lean towards no jus because it hasn't been mentioned.
There's lots of sense you've made there;
I'm also in line with the 'waiting for confirmation' bit just as much..; as for the blocking part
(after the attack on Ace, before Ace died portion), my concern is regarding the "blocking Logia attacks;"
I mean, a pirate can just "take the Logia attack" while standing, rub it off, then counter-hit.
Or, use Tekkai or similar heightened defense and neglect the lessen dmg and proceed onwards.
And lastly, I really couldn't remember the scene that Jinbe attack a Logia (after admiral aokiji froze the shore)
JInbe landed a failed punch on Akainu. - Meaning, Jinbe requires the sea water more to land a more effective
blow to a Logia (which is less likely Haki-embedded, thus getting counterbalanced by Aoikji's Logia element) -
* Or, Jinbe did delivered a Haki-embedded F.Karate punch of the Highest level straight into Akainu's chest,
it just that Akainu is still much stronger, took it like a true Marine Admiral, and exchanged the blow with his
own to show that ounce of last respect to Jinbe before Jinbe seemingly succumbed to his injury : P
I don't see why believe Jinbe can't use Haki. His Haki may be simply not strong enough to block Akainu attacks, while Shanks is.
i will state that most of your upper teir fighters use haki at some level
i think jimbei falls into this group
i am 100% sure jimbei can use haki
At the moment I would argue, just as others here, that jinbe grabbing akainu's punch and stopping it is an indication of him being a haki user. Overall how would that be possible if jinbe was not a haki user? Controlling water should not really allow him to touch rock in the several hundreds or thounsands of degrees like that. Ace was supposed to be freaking fire and even then he got burned by akainu for some reason. Jinbe's hand should have been carbonized even before touching akainu. On the other hand armor haki would explain that scene and basically any other where akainus magma was stopped and repelled.
quite interesting, I think I'm on hoeru's side of this argument though, that with fishman karate it is possible that he hasn't been trained in haki, possible is all I'd say.
The war at marine ford may also work in the argument against Haki, because he when he didn't have much in the sense of water particles around he was feeling helpless against the admirals, if he had at least armament haki he would have been able to make counter attacks to Akainu or Aokiji, or likewise wouldn't the effectiveness of his attacks DOUBLE with haki?
It lacks evidence is the most honest opinion I have, and until Oda says "he can use Haki" I don't think we can make any definite assumptions.
I think it's obvious that he used haki to block Akainu's punch. He did not use haki when he hurt Luffy during their brief clash, because the attack he used was a ranged shockwave affecting the water in Luffy's body. So there was no direct (punch) or indirect (arrow, bullet) matter-contact between them.
I was a about to say "I don't think you can imbue haki on a shockwave, which is just movement without any actual matter", but then I became uncertain. You probably remember how Whitebeard's ranged attack shattered Aokiji but apparently didn't hurt him at all, while his non-ranged quake-punch on Akainu did quite a lot of damage. Hmm.
Good point, I always tought there was hints that Haki doesn't work at distance. Fishman karate creates shockwaves, and because of that you don't see Jinbe using Haki in all of his attacks.