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To the OP's question -
The basis is misleading though;
the point of possessing a Logia is so that the user does not need to defend, at all, from normal attacks/skills/tech./etc.
Only then as the story progresses that we learnt along with the SH that there's a way around that, which
is to learn using Haki.
Admiral in turn can use Armament Haki/Busoshoku Haki to defend, we deduced, or even just the normal physical
Tekkai from CP unit. But why would an Admiral try using full body Armament Haki in the mid of the war?
Vergo's full body Armament is quite unique on his own ability ( I actually didn't follow on that), but say for
the War the Admirals wouln't need to use this 'full body' armament. That defeats the point for them to be
Logia to begin with.
* Side: Marco's attack likely damaged Akainu to an extent, and it's more like the Haki 'stays' longer to
prevent the slashed area of Akainu to re-attach quickly. But if Akainu can't detect these sort of Haki attacks
coming his way/ WB's higher power Haki-embedded slashes, then he wouldn't be the admiral he is.
Last edited by jojoSB; July 13, 2013 at 08:22 PM.
(I don't want to sound pedantic)
CoA - This type allows you to hit intangible and flowing bodies of Logia users. Makes an armor, hard, and flexible....
Why is the word flexible bold? If you look at the fight between Ace and Akainu, he was able to hit ace since he used haki.. (that's given) but if you look at the wound of ace you can see the magma around his organs and tummy area... The magma shouldn't be able to touch ace's fire logia body. But, since it was imbued with haki, the mag ma can touch his body and organs thus burning it... which means CoA is not a rigid covering which will only work as an armor.. It is more flexible than that....
Chapter 573) Add to that the mental state Ace was in at the time, full of rage and I think exhausted, too, he wasn't fit to fight Akainu(right state of mind for a fight against such an enemy that is). How such a fight would have gone with Ace on top health we can only speculate. But not much better for Ace, I guess.
About logias and haki
Up to now there was no single real fight between two logias (I don't count Ace vs BB, because of BB's special logia). So we don't know how they can use haki together with their df. That leaves Ace vs Akainu as the first and only little insight how logia vs logia can play out (Edit: forgot Magellan vs Mr 3, but then Mr.3 is not really the fighting type,is he?). I don't disagree that logias can use haki in the way some of the previuos posts suggested, in terms of negating/countering haki attacks to some extend. But using haki as an offensive technique like Luffy or WB, that would be a little overkill. And wouldn't have Akianu used it in the war, when he was raining some magma, if it was possible? To further up the chances of obliterating the enemy forces? And remember that in the war the use of haki was called out as such by some guy or another. I know not everytime. I think if Akainu had used haki to kill Ace, someone would have said it ("nooo, he got Ace with his haki attack", or along those lines )
PS: Sorry for the english, i hope it's comprehensible.
Last edited by Dcreature; July 15, 2013 at 08:33 AM.
To me it wouldn't make any sense to use haki when fighting another logia user. I mean except you pull a dagger to stab him. So far the good thing about logias was the owerwhelming power they posess, so why bother using haki when you get no benefit from it. If you have a fight like Aokiji vs. Akainu then they mash their elements together and that's pretty much it (understatement).
From what we know of the ways of Haki it seems to be difficult to let alone concetrate it on your sword. Vergor was specially mentioned for beeing able to cover his whole body. It should be kinda hard, if not impossible to cover yourself in Armament, while your're in an elemental state. Heck, it should be difficult enough to move coordinated in a fight.
What I'm trying to say is: Logias are already considered as the (with exceptions) "kings" of all DF. They offer both very good offense and defense. So why would anyone use Haki, which requires certain amounts of concetration in a high speed battle? The only reason would be to defend urself against Haki users to not get hurt. But for attaking? Kinda hard to defend against beeing flooded by magma.
I know this is no ultimate argumentation, but i just wanted to add some of my thoughts. :P
What's the reason it should be impossible? Since Luffy as a Paramecia is capable of using it on parts of his body, zoan/logia should be capable of doing exactly the same.
Luffy can stretch his body, but it stays solid. A logia user like Akainu can liquify, so his shape changes constantly. It's arguably more complicated with an unstable surface. And if they become solid to use CoA, why using logia then, in the first place?
the New world is mopped by Logia users.. they are just plain fodders there when they don't know how to use haki.. The strongest people in One piece world is either paramecia or no DF at all.. Like Shanks, Roger, Whitebeard and Dragon.. Even the Yonkous (except BB) are no logia... To say that logia are the kings of DF and they don't need to use Haki in a fight is just stupid.. A fight between logia and logia should have haki or else they won't end.....
Vergo can swim in the magma you know, with that kind of Haki Armament all over his body and not have a scratch.. but since Akainu has haki he can punch (plus magma) vergo and make him hurt....
I'm pretty sure Akainu used haki to hit ace there....
I will try to explain the Stab WB did to Aokiji that didn't kill him.. (later, I'm lazy right now)
Please reread what Rayleigth(on the animal island) and Robin(Punk Hazzard when Luffy grabs CC) had to say about Haki, that's all the arguments you might ever need. That and the comment from a Pekoms, a New World veteran, which you somehow ignored and is the answer to the bonded question. You are a 'nothing' if you don't use Haki, not even as a logia user.
Last edited by Schabrak; July 16, 2013 at 02:31 AM.
Also there is a difference between a clenched fist, that doesn't change shape, but rather the arm, and a surface, like magma, that is boiling and moving on it's own. At least so far we haven't seen Luffy maintaining CoA while stretching the hardened part. He uses it on his fist, then attacks and releases it again. He doesn't move his hand while it is hardened.
I'm still waiting for a single compelling argument for your case of logia users not working with Haki, it's contradicting the words of experienced pirates, I'm also waiting for you to actually replay to the facts/arguments provided by me. If you aren't interested in a discussion, just say so and I will ignore your posts in here.
So far, first mate of the Pirate King/logia 1hit K.O.er/knowledgeable character > you.
PS: Hardening isn't the only way of Haki used defensively, it's likely just the ultimate Form, so there might be misunderstanding between us.
Last edited by Schabrak; July 16, 2013 at 04:21 AM.
Dude, don't get all fired up, when you're missing the point. All i said is that a logia user only has to focus on strenghtening his CoA for defense, since their offense is already near perfect. Also i sair they arguably can't use full armament, when they are in an elemental state, because you can't solidify a liquid while stil performing a liquid state. They more likely use their CoA to cancel the attackers, like Aokiji in his quarrel with WB. He gets punched, then shatters -> he's able to maintain his elemental state.
We already know logia users are using Haki all the time.
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