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Thread: Removing Naruto's speed - disappointment

  1. #16
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Exodi's Avatar
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    Re: Removing narutos speed dsappointment

    Quote Originally Posted by LnDRash View Post
    http://www.mangapanda.com/naruto/550/6

    ^Its been clearly shown that if Naruto isn't prepared for an attack then his speed advantage is severely diminished.

    I don't get what you're going for here. Itachi wasn't aiming for Naruto.

  2. #17
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member M3J's Avatar
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    Re: Removing narutos speed dsappointment

    Quote Originally Posted by Roman View Post
    Naruto had no advantage, except that he was actually faster in the end. They were both in the motion and the warning didn't matter because, again, he didn't know his highest speed. That's why he DIDN'T know exactly when to react. If he did, then it wouldn't be impressive. Naruto knew that Raikage could go faster, but he didn't know how much faster. That's why he wasn't at advantage and that's why the feat was impressive.
    He had the advantage of knowing the Raikage was going to come at him using full speed. It just happens that Naruto was in motion and was faster, so he could dodge the Raikage. If I say I'm gonna hit you, you're more likely to dodge successfully because you know I'm gonna hit you. If you're already moving to the left while I try to punch you, that increases your chances of dodging even more. Naruto knew WHEN to react - when the Raikage started running. Naruto doesn't need to know how much faster the Raikage can go when Naruto was going to use max speed anyway. He had plenty of advantages here.

    It's gonna be hard to prove that Naruto could have done the same without warning and standing still, like Minato did. Especially when Naruto didn't show similar feat again.

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    Re: Removing narutos speed dsappointment

    Quote Originally Posted by M3J View Post
    He had the advantage of knowing the Raikage was going to come at him using full speed. It just happens that Naruto was in motion and was faster, so he could dodge the Raikage. If I say I'm gonna hit you, you're more likely to dodge successfully because you know I'm gonna hit you. If you're already moving to the left while I try to punch you, that increases your chances of dodging even more. Naruto knew WHEN to react - when the Raikage started running. Naruto doesn't need to know how much faster the Raikage can go when Naruto was going to use max speed anyway. He had plenty of advantages here.

    It's gonna be hard to prove that Naruto could have done the same without warning and standing still, like Minato did. Especially when Naruto didn't show similar feat again.
    It seems I'm a broken record. "Full speed" doesn't mean shit if one doesn't know the exact measurement of that speed so that argument is invalid by all means. Again, they were both in motion, Naruto didn't have any advantage at all. More likely to dodge but not necessarily at all costs because you don't know the speed, again X3. We're talking about the reaction of dodging Raikage at full speed. Him seeing Raikage starting to move isn't relevant at all here. Of course he doesn't and he DIDN'T KNOW from the start, which is why it's damn impressive X3.

    I'm expecting him to do something of that caliber again, it's only natural.

  4. #19
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member M3J's Avatar
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    Re: Removing narutos speed dsappointment

    It means plenty, considering Naruto would have been slower than the Raikage if his max speed didn't surpass the Raikage's. Neither party had any idea how fast the other could go. Naruto doesn't need to know the exact measurement, he can just either guess or use max speed and hope he's faster, especially when moving. Naruto being in motion meant he didn't have to build up his speed, and he was in motion first. He just needed to add in extra burst rather than start from no movement, and then use shunshin.

    It is relevant if Naruto knew the Raikage was moving, because he can react earlier and dodge. Naruto knew the Raikage was coming at him and was moving before the Raikage was, getting a head start and being able to transition into max speed. There's nothing impressive about someone dodging a guy that he knew was coming - he doesn't have to know how fast the Raikage is going... Naruto can just sense when the Raikage moved and use max speed to dodge.

  5. #20
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member kkck's Avatar
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    Re: Removing narutos speed dsappointment

    I would argue the issue here is that enemies simply got stronger and thus naruto's seemingly insane speed is not really insane against his new enemies. Naruto has recently fought muu, the third raikage, kisame for a bit, the raikage, obito and madara. Not a single person there is actually slow. Muu can fly, the third raikage was insanely fast and insanely strong, obito and madara have the sharingan and rinnengan..... Even his allies are top notch for that matter, The previous kage, kakashi, gai, sasuke is pretty damn fast and his susanoo attack is beyond what other sharingan users can react to.

    In the past it was itachi's speed which essentially set the standard. Neither naruto or kakashi could actually keep up with his speed. And recently anyone we have seen alongside itachi has been able to keep up with his speed. Kabuto was a sage snake with a weird body and even then everyone kept up with his speed as far as we saw. The problem here is that just about anyone is as fast as the fastest nowadays because the only relevant characters are insanely strong ninja. And to be fair, speed and tactics become somewhat less important once all the enemies are the size of a gundam. Madara has his susanoo which is the size of the kyubi (which when complete is larger than the other biju) and hashirama has a wood gundam.... naruto and bee transform into biju, minato should have the same capacity....

  6. #21
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted ninjabot's Avatar
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    Re: Removing narutos speed dsappointment

    Quote Originally Posted by Exodi
    I don't get what you're going for here. Itachi wasn't aiming for Naruto.
    Naruto didn't know that though. He believed Itachi was aiming at him, and thus should have attempted a shunshin. Not only did he not know, he didn't attempt to dodge. He's pointing out that unless Naruto has someone choreograph their attack for him, his timing won't let him use his speed at his full potential. Notice that even after the dog is hit, Naruto doesn't attempt to flee? He's just standing there on top of a burning dog, lol.

    If Itachi had said "And now, I'm going to burn you with my Amaterasu! GET READY!", then it would have been the same as the Raikage situation.

    ...if Naruto had dodged the Amaterasu that is, lol.

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  8. #22
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity jaymizzo's Avatar
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    Re: Removing narutos speed dsappointment

    Quote Originally Posted by ninjabot View Post
    If Itachi had said "And now, I'm going to burn you with my Amaterasu! GET READY!", then it would have been the same as the Raikage situation.
    Naruto knew Amaterasu was coming. Nagato shouted it and Naruto realized the gesture for the Jutsu.
    "Man hands misery onto man" - Philip Larkin

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    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member M3J's Avatar
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    Re: Removing narutos speed dsappointment

    But Naruto still stood there looking right at Itachi when he could have moved. If he moved like Sasuke did, he definitely could have avoided being hit.

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    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity REN KOUEN's Avatar
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    Re: Removing narutos speed dsappointment

    raikage is probably as fast as naruto in bm1 (like when they met)

    what is unknown is did naruto gain a significant speed increase after bm2 or did he only gain more chaakra/stamina

    i hope somehow naruto gains hiraishin as an ability from his fistbump and cooperative attack with minato

    because no matter how fast narutos shunshin is with bijuu chaakra its not faster than hiraishin

  11. #25
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity jaymizzo's Avatar
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    Re: Removing narutos speed dsappointment

    Quote Originally Posted by M3J View Post
    But Naruto still stood there looking right at Itachi when he could have moved. If he moved like Sasuke did, he definitely could have avoided being hit.
    So because he did not move it means he is incapable of moving? We have seen Narutos top speed and we have seen Raikages top speed, arguing that if Naruto did not know Raikages top speed or if he had no warning then things would have different is rather silly, Naruto is proven faster than Ee at his top, If Naruto was using his top speed from the get go he would have escaped like he planned to.
    "Man hands misery onto man" - Philip Larkin

  12. #26
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted ninjabot's Avatar
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    Re: Removing narutos speed dsappointment

    Quote Originally Posted by jaymizzo
    Naruto knew Amaterasu was coming. Nagato shouted it and Naruto realized the gesture for the Jutsu.
    That's worse. He saw that Amaterasu was on it's way, so the perfect time to move would be before the flames were coming. Except that didn't happen. There's no argument for why either.

    I wonder why everyone's so annoyed with this example though. I gave an entire essay on why Naruto isn't as fast as you guys think he is, and it's the Raikage situation you won't acknowledge? That one isn't even as damning as the "shunshin is not constant" reason. Infact, I figured that one was the strongest argument.

    It couldn't be because people simply want Naruto to be a carbon copy of his Dad, and outrun Raikage legitimately is it?

  13. #27
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member M3J's Avatar
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    Re: Removing narutos speed dsappointment

    Quote Originally Posted by jaymizzo View Post
    So because he did not move it means he is incapable of moving? We have seen Narutos top speed and we have seen Raikages top speed, arguing that if Naruto did not know Raikages top speed or if he had no warning then things would have different is rather silly, Naruto is proven faster than Ee at his top, If Naruto was using his top speed from the get go he would have escaped like he planned to.
    It means he doesn't like moving? Considering the fact that he should have moved at or right before the jutsu, there's something wrong here.

    I don't see how it's silly considering all things involved. You're not likely to dodge an attack if you don't know it's coming and aren't prepared for it. Naruto may have still dodged it, or he may not have, but I'm saying that Naruto had all the advantages and knowledge that Raikage would use his top speed, leading Naruto to use his.

  14. #28
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member KungPaoChicken's Avatar
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    Re: Removing narutos speed dsappointment

    Naruto's speed did increase greatly. But not as fast compared to FTG. IT JUST doesn't make sense how he *teleported* past the Raikage though. Maybe if he focus's properly he could perform similar feats to the FTG short distances but not long like minato and the 2nd with there markings.

  15. #29
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    Re: Removing narutos speed dsappointment

    Quote Originally Posted by M3J View Post
    It means plenty, considering Naruto would have been slower than the Raikage if his max speed didn't surpass the Raikage's. Neither party had any idea how fast the other could go. Naruto doesn't need to know the exact measurement, he can just either guess or use max speed and hope he's faster, especially when moving. Naruto being in motion meant he didn't have to build up his speed, and he was in motion first. He just needed to add in extra burst rather than start from no movement, and then use shunshin.

    It is relevant if Naruto knew the Raikage was moving, because he can react earlier and dodge. Naruto knew the Raikage was coming at him and was moving before the Raikage was, getting a head start and being able to transition into max speed. There's nothing impressive about someone dodging a guy that he knew was coming - he doesn't have to know how fast the Raikage is going... Naruto can just sense when the Raikage moved and use max speed to dodge.
    They were both in motion and the argument was the warning which didn't really have any impact on the matter because even if he knew that Raikage's attacking at full speed, he couldn't know the exact moment when to dodge because he didn't experience his full speed. He dodged it from the first try without experiencing it beforehand and that's why it's impressive.

    He can't if he doesn't how fast Raikage actually is. He can prepare mentally for the attack but that isn't enough because he doesn't know when to execute his dodge because, again, he doesn't know the full speed of his movement. They were both in motion when the dodge occurred so the head start doesn't matter and it's completely irrelevant. He HAS to know it in order for it to NOT be impressive. Naruto can't sense something that is faster than him and Raikage's fastest speed wasn't faster than him, which was, again, impressive.

    ---------- Post added at 08:05 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:03 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by M3J View Post
    But Naruto still stood there looking right at Itachi when he could have moved. If he moved like Sasuke did, he definitely could have avoided being hit.
    And that undermines his speed? It's amazing what "reasons" you guys can conjure up to theorize or downplay his speed.

    It's also amazing how you put his clumsiness and his speed in the same box. Him being a clumsy idiot during a battle like the one against Nagato and Itachi doesn't have anything to do with the fact that he's actually faster than Raikage. But I guess, such things help some people sleep at night.
    Last edited by Roman; September 03, 2013 at 01:10 AM.

  16. #30
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Prince Sasuke's Avatar
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    Re: Removing narutos speed dsappointment

    Naruto still has his speed, but fact is, obito is faster.... In fact, obito is faster then anyone on the battle field including minato with FTG.

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