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I'm assuming it's the bit in Chapter 125? ^^;
The original phrase is "闘ってたでかいのを喰いつくしたみてーだから..."
喰いつくした is the key phrase here. It means "ate up," "ate everything," "ate all." If you split up the components in the phrase, it's "eat" + "run out," so in the literal sense, everything of Roxanne is finished up, and gernot's "ate all" is the best choice of words.
By the way guys, it would be nice if future requests could at least give the Chapter number (or Volume number, whichever works for you) so I can pinpoint the scene faster
And so sorry for not putting chapter number/page number.
i will put it with all future requests.
Sorry to be bugging you so much.
But could you tell me how good the translation is in Chapter 117- "Days of training where they would share the same pillow"-what is implied by "Shared the same pillow"?
Also in 117 "By this time Roxanne developed the ability to completely hide her yoki from a particular target" My english Vol says "Ability to completely hide her yoki "( it says nothing about being able to only hide it from "a particular target".
Last edited by number12michael; October 04, 2013 at 12:47 PM.
The first one:
The Japanese phrase is 褥(しとね)を共にする, which is literally "to share a pillow/mattress/futon together." The typical usage mainly refers to sleeping together with a sexual connotation, but it's not commonly use (I think it sounds somewhat 'proper' and 'archaic.' A good analogy would be, it's very similar to how they say in the Bible "a man lies with a woman.")
Whether Yagi's intention behind the phrase is literal or figurative... that's up to you to decide I can't imagine them sleeping on the same bed though hahaa...... but knowing they are Claymores, it's possible I think.
The second one:
The Japanese phrase is "...特定の者に対して 自身の妖気の完全消失という 特異な技..." The key phrase is "特定の者に対して," which means "against a specific person."
I find it strange the English Volume would miss out the phrase "from a particular target." It's as simple as it could be to add four words at the end.
I always took it as they slept together sexually.
I have no idea why they left it out, seems rather important.
Could you by any chance translate there nicknames "Love and Hate" and "Dust Eater" how literal are they
I have also always wondered if the translation in Chapter 120 was correct Dae said " Its crazy to this those who had died could conveniently be revived as warriors", "They are completely different beings who merely borrowed their pre death appearance, destined to awaken"
it kind of confused me lol
Last edited by number12michael; October 05, 2013 at 10:58 AM.
塵喰い = Dust-eater
の = particle to indicate relationship
カサンドラ = Cassandra
愛憎 = Love and hate; Love-hate (eg. 愛憎関係 = love-hate relationship, 愛憎併存 = ambivalence [between love and hate]); Likes and dislikes
の = particle to indicate relationship
ロクサーヌ = Roxanne
(Possibly emphasizes that she shows stronger love and stronger hate than average.)
Cassy's name is as literal as it can be. Roxanne's is also literal, but I have a feeling 愛憎 has a deeper and more implicit meaning rather than just standalone 愛憎 (see my two examples above.)
元々 = From the start
一度死した者 = Those that have died once
都合よく = Conveniently
戦士として = As warriors
蘇るなど = Be revived or the likes
ありえないんだ = It is impossible
あいつらは = They are
ただ = Merely
覚醒を前提にした = On the premises of awakening (T/N: the feel is more 'proper' and 'scientific' rather than saying "destined to awake.")
生前の姿 = Form/figure/appearance/shapre during lifetime
借りた = Borrowed
別物 = Different beings/things
Compared to your version, it's literally similar, except maybe for the "It's crazy/ It's impossible" and "Destined to/ On the premises of" parts.
Daae is saying, (1) It is impossible to revive anyone from the dead (2) and make them behave like normal warriors do.
(1) They are completely different beings. (2) They only appear like they do when they are still alive. (3) But they are certain to awake.
I've tried to split up the sentences into key points ^^; not sure if it helped at all lol.
That helps a lot , i never fully understood Roxannes name, but that makes sense.
So to clarify Dae is saying that the beings he brought forth at that time are NOT really Roxanne , Cassandra, and Hysteria but new beings who look/borrowed the appearance of those warriors pre death body's ?
And he flat out said you can not bring back someone who has already died?
and as i am kind of slow doseMean "Roxanne of love and hate" or just Roxanne.Quote:
i thank you a million, because i had always wondered what Dae ment by that.
That bit is a good point, because I think it's kinda open to interpretation, or at least as far as we know, it could either be completely different things that use the flesh of the former No. 1s, *or* that they are the former No.1 themselves with a completely different 'nature.' If you get what I mean... In any case, I'm hoping we would get more clues when Cassy gets dealt with in the next few chapters... Since she's finally getting serious now, that should reveal more about her current state
And yes, the whole thing "愛憎のロクサーヌ" means "Roxanne of Love and Hate."
Well, this is nice, all the Claymore forums I used to hang out died but it's great to find more people discussing claymore, specially about the translations that's the most problematic topic haha.
Personally what I would like to clarify my doubts about Chapter 139 Page 15 , there Dietrich and Galatea are talking and it seems that Galatea points out that they once were the same number of warrior, before inviting the other one to drink together, now that would imply that either Galatea was Number 8 , which seems unlikely for the "Eye", or that Dietrich was once number 3 , given that on Chapter 102 page one she says that she was once demoted for failing a mission , the only known mission she ever failed was retrieving/Killing Galatea, besides she is still referred as number 8 from then on which would indicate that she was demoted from a higher rank, on the same page the text also says that she still has the power close to that of a high single digit.
Now there are other "evidences" that would indicate she formerly was a higher number, she being previously assigned to a region closer to the org. before being demoted to the south, and Miria signaling half of the 6 six warriors that fought against Hysteria being of rank 1-5 power level , which would mean Helen, Deneve and (given previous info) most likely Dietrich.
Now most sites I've look into, including the Claymore Wiki acknowledge this and put her on former number 3, however on another site called "New claymore wiki" they claim that those translations were incorrect and she is solely number 8.
So what I would like to know is, what is really the text saying on ch. 139 pg.15 and ch. 102 pg. 1, in order to determine if she really was number 3, sorry if my post was too long just to ask that but I really think it's best to explain myself and additional info x)
For Chapter 139 Page 15, I would recommend Gernot's translation:
"We have a long history, but we once were warriors with the same number"
(Wild guess, I suppose you read the same translation as well? )
This translation is the best English can do; the literal translation would be more like: "There was a long history, but former same-number fellow/together..." Japanese doesn't often use personal pronouns (I, you, he/she/it,) so the "we were" in the translation is only implied. ("We" is implied through "same-number," and "were" (past tense) is implied through "former.")
Chapter 102 Page 1, again I'm using Gernot's translation since it is as literal as it gets.
"I was demoted for failing my mission, but
I still have power close to that of a high single digit."
I have no idea what this "New Claymore wiki" site is, but even Google Translate can prove to you she is demoted, lol. I've had a looked at the site since you've mentioned it, they pick on the term 降格 being relegation rather than demotion, which I think is highly inaccurate. If you want to be very literal about the Japanese, 降=lower, 格=rank/status/rating, and even one of the best (subjective) Japanese-English dictionary on the Internet says it's demotion.
They also mention Diet and Gala sharing the same generation number rather than rank number. This is entirely wrong lol. (The more and more I read this, the whole thing feels like a troll wiki to me...) Anyways, ナンバー means "number" and you even pronounce it "NAMBAA" so it's definitely saying number. The term ナンバー is always always always used in the manga to refer to ranks. Has been that way for 143 Chapters. Generation/group number uses a different word: 期 (period.) If Dietrich were referring to "same gen number/period," she would be saying 同期/ 同世代 instead, which literally means "same period/ same generation," and that is not what she says.
(Generation/group/period is yet another confusing term, but explainable if you're critically literal about this. For the purpose of this query I'll leave it for another time.)
I feel harsh for saying this but from an educative perspective I suggest people should stay away from the Claymore new wiki. Talks of Japanese are highly inaccurate and misleading, while the interpretations contain too much bias. For the sake of reliable information and Japanese knowledge in general, this wiki certainly isn't providing much. Of course, you may read it just like any other opinions you see in forum...
Anyways, with this there are a few reasons (my personal interpretation) as to why they were both No.3 instead of No.8:
At this point, Dietrich is No.8 and Galatea is former No.3, I suppose if they were once number 8, Dietrich might have phrased it another way (something like: You once held the same number as I do.)
Unless Galatea got demoted to No.8, it is unlikely Dietrich would be referring to her past ranks (or even know about her past ranks.) To be able to say "same-number fellow" I would like to think Dietrich is referring to their most 'glorious' rank. If Galatea really got demoted and Dietrich was referring to Galatea's No.8, then it would sound as if she's insulting her, which wouldn't make too much sense since she's the one wanting to go out for a drink out of respect.
Though it is not impossible Galatea is demoted, the few solid pieces of evidence we've been shown:
- Dietrich once was high single digit
- Dietrich was once tasked with tracking down Galatea
- Clarice/Miata were tasked with Dietrich's mission instead (No.8 at that time, i.e. after her demotion)
- Dietrich said Galatea and her went way back, and they had the same number
...they all point towards a No.3 Dietrich. It would be pretty bad story-telling if now we were suddenly told that Galatea actually got demoted before she deserted.
And of course, plus all the reasons you have listed as well.
Not sorry for a long post haha...
Last edited by Utsune; October 07, 2013 at 09:52 AM.
Thnks for the welcomes!.
About the translations, I see, thank you!, that was quick haha, and yeah, my little knowledge of japanese makes me realize your explanations makes more sense, also, yeah there are a bunch of reasons why Dietrich seems to be higher number, probably the most important is she having knowledge of a bunch of stuff like the Abyss feeders that Audrey ignored.
Even so, I thought Galatea was the one asking Dietrich to share a drink haha , it's hard to notice sometimes in manga who says what, I always have that problem. Let's hope it's not a death-flag for either of them though =P
OMG OMG Utsune thank you a bunch.. You just made a great clarification to me.. The idea of them being a different creature doesn't mean a completely different creature, but it is the change of their last moments that made on their personalities! Some people after experiencing a near death situation change and start doing volunteering and helping the poor and stuff like this, while others become more selfish and only care about "living his life" (more or less in a destructive matter). So this is what happens to people from a near death situation. Now think about a real death situation..... Now I believe it would make a huge impact on their personalities as if another person is standing in front of you! Because I always imagined Hysteria as someone who truly cares for his allies but that moment when she was close to awakening she had to cut them else should would die.. This by itself is like a paradox in her personality and would lead to a greater change if she died and did rise from the dead. The one who seems to have a deep attachment to his old personality was Roxanne.. But I agree with BleachFan2010, she may had that desire deep inside to die after all she had done..
In chapter 110 when they are listing off the number 1's i found a few different translations of there names(and there nicknames) could you name them ?
And in that same chapter it said "and besides those...there is Cassandra the dust eater"- am i reading to much into it or are they saying that besides those 7 you could also include "cassandra the dust eater"? kinda confused me.
littleangel i never thought of it that way the "different beings" means death has changed there personality.
but i refuse to believe Roxanne "Wanted to die for what she had done" yeah even when she was revived she still had the same personality and the same "snobby" like attitude. i also dont think she is dead for good.(but i will save that for my thread :P)
流麗のヒステリア = The Fluent/Elegant.Flowing Hysteria (Hi-su-te-ri-a)
三つ腕のリヒティ = Three-armed Lichty (Ri-hi-ti) (Lichte = リヒテ)
重剣のクロエ = Heavy-sword Chloe (Ku-ro-e)
天啓のシスティーナ = Sistine of Revelation (Shi-su-tii-na) (Sistine Chapel = システィーナ礼拝堂) (Revelation/ Divine Oracle; Sistine of the Divine Oracle)
愛憎のロクサーヌ = Roxanne of Love and Hate
微笑のテレサに = Teresa of the Faint Smile
万有のルテーシア = The Universal Lutécia (Ru-teh-shi-a) (or Lutécia of All Things, Lutécia of All Creation) (Lutécia = ルーテシア; notice the name is ルテーシア instead, the "té" is elongated. Not sure why the difference.)
塵喰いのカサンドラ (Cassandra the Dust-Eater)
(I've added "The" to some of them so they would sound better.)
後は… (And then [there was]...)
塵喰いのカサンドラ (Cassandra the Dust-Eater)
(後は = next, and then, after)
I think it's open to interpretation just like the English, and it's absolutely reasonable for you to read into it too much lol. The key phrase "And then" could either mean (1) Cassy is in another league with the "etc. list," or (2) Daae is just giving names as he goes along (so "And then there was Cassy" would be his way of 'making up things to say on the spot' if you get me, i.e. there is no particular meaning to it.) I think the answer lies in the next line, where he says "we can list names forever," suggesting he really is listing names as he goes, but it isn't as random as it seems, because he then says, "that's probably about it for the particularly strong ones." This means exactly word-for-word, suggesting that he has listed those 8 names as they are worth mentioning.
Once again, this is open to interpretation. To me, I think Daae is kinda like "I'm gonna randomly list some names, whatever comes to mind, the more powerful ones probably come into my mind more likely than the rest........... aaand I've listed a lot now, maybe I should stop, I think that's about it as far as my immediate memory serves because the others aren't worth mentioning so much." But this is just my interpretation, if I hadn't made it clear lol.
Last edited by Utsune; October 07, 2013 at 10:47 PM.