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Thread: Is FGT Ichigo/God Aizen a new normal level now?

  1. #16
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Xerneas's Avatar
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    Re: Is FGT Ichigo/God Aizen a new normal level now?

    Quote Originally Posted by MBVC View Post
    Aizen failed to reach level 4th because Urahara's kidou sealed him.
    No. He failed to reach that level because he wasn't capable period. He thought he was powering up but in reality the Hogyoku was taking away all his powers. He reached his max limit and still got beat. And the thing about it is that he himself explained all the mechanics previously but forgot cause he couldn't comprehend what was happening to him. The Hogyoku can only unlock your latent potential and nothing more. Aizen had less "ingredients" than Ichigo (who is made of everything) so his transcendent mode was child's play in comparison. A clear thinking Aizen would have realized he was beaten from the minute Ichigo first showed up, but the Hogyoku was clouding his judgement.

    And no, unless this Ichigo has unreadable reiatsu he's not anywhere near that form. Like kkck explained FGT and transcendence are not the same thing. And transcendence has more to do with "level" or "dimension" as Aizen called it than just sheer power. I really don't think Aizen was that much weaker than Ichigo anyways, but he couldn't reach the dimension Ichigo was at so he was pretty much powerless to stop him. Ichigo's higher "level" reiatsu just stopped Aizen's own reiatsu from doing anything. This current Ichigo could have even more reiatsu than that form and still be powerless against it because of the NATURE of the transcendent reiatsu.

    I don't think we'll see that type of power again until Spirit King is in the picture. He's obviously a transcendental of this highest "level". Aizen was trying to become like him and failed miserably.

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    Re: Is FGT Ichigo/God Aizen a new normal level now?

    Quote Originally Posted by ca12nag3 View Post
    I disagree, what i believe to be the strongest form is what Aizen always hoped to achieve. The utter obliteration of the barrier between shinigami and hollow. Ascending above both. So Ichigos hollow form = stronger then Ulquiorra but that could easily be seen as him being the strongest Vastolord. Combine that power with the strongest shinigami and you have something that ascends both.

    Its hard to tell if that form would have beaten Aizen or the capt commander. Or even a Royal guard. But what i do know is that that was his hollow power on full open. And i do not believe that form is a combination with his shinigami power. Its most likely him on full hollow form/Vasto lord.
    i believe full hollow ichigo that was out of control would have beaten aizen

    i also believe ulqiorras final form would challenge aizen

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    Re: Is FGT Ichigo/God Aizen a new normal level now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kisame Hoshigaki View Post
    i believe full hollow ichigo that was out of control would have beaten aizen
    i also believe ulqiorras final form would challenge aizen
    So Ulqiuorra, whose power was 4th as an Arrancar would beat their boss, who could one-shot them, and Ichigo after having mastered his Hollow/Shinigami powers entirely is comparable to out-of-control Hollow part? I don't think so, no.

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    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted Schabrak's Avatar
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    Re: Is FGT Ichigo/God Aizen a new normal level now?

    Someone seems to be pretty hung up on a "number"...
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    Re: Is FGT Ichigo/God Aizen a new normal level now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Duniak View Post
    So Ulqiuorra, whose power was 4th as an Arrancar would beat their boss, who could one-shot them, and Ichigo after having mastered his Hollow/Shinigami powers entirely is comparable to out-of-control Hollow part? I don't think so, no.
    Sorry but ulquiorras final power was unknown by aizen therefore the #4 is meaningless

    does that mean he could beat aizen?
    No, but it doesnt mean he couldnt either

    so the real debate is, could fgt ichigo defeat full hollow ichigo?

    we will never know, i personally believe the hollow form was stronger

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    Re: Is FGT Ichigo/God Aizen a new normal level now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Xerneas View Post
    No. He failed to reach that level because he wasn't capable period. He thought he was powering up but in reality the Hogyoku was taking away all his powers. He reached his max limit and still got beat. And the thing about it is that he himself explained all the mechanics previously but forgot cause he couldn't comprehend what was happening to him. The Hogyoku can only unlock your latent potential and nothing more. Aizen had less "ingredients" than Ichigo (who is made of everything) so his transcendent mode was child's play in comparison. A clear thinking Aizen would have realized he was beaten from the minute Ichigo first showed up, but the Hogyoku was clouding his judgement.

    And no, unless this Ichigo has unreadable reiatsu he's not anywhere near that form. Like kkck explained FGT and transcendence are not the same thing. And transcendence has more to do with "level" or "dimension" as Aizen called it than just sheer power. I really don't think Aizen was that much weaker than Ichigo anyways, but he couldn't reach the dimension Ichigo was at so he was pretty much powerless to stop him. Ichigo's higher "level" reiatsu just stopped Aizen's own reiatsu from doing anything. This current Ichigo could have even more reiatsu than that form and still be powerless against it because of the NATURE of the transcendent reiatsu.

    I don't think we'll see that type of power again until Spirit King is in the picture. He's obviously a transcendental of this highest "level". Aizen was trying to become like him and failed miserably.

    Oh really? The current Ichigo is stronger than his FGT self without using FGT? By the way, Aizen's 4th evolution was equivalent to FGT version since his zan was about to disappear but Urahara's kidou sealed him and something with his solitude problem prevented him from achieved the 4th evolution.

    ---------- Post added at 04:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:36 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Kisame Hoshigaki View Post
    Sorry but ulquiorras final power was unknown by aizen therefore the #4 is meaningless

    does that mean he could beat aizen?
    No, but it doesnt mean he couldnt either

    so the real debate is, could fgt ichigo defeat full hollow ichigo?

    we will never know, i personally believe the hollow form was stronger

    Believe, hope and wish are not equivalent to realities. It's better not to use personal emotion to judge, otherwise disappointment will always show up as the final results.

    Even gods could not be absolutely certain whether they existed at the most fundamental level of reality or were themselves simulated.

  8. #22
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    Re: Is FGT Ichigo/God Aizen a new normal level now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kisame Hoshigaki View Post
    Sorry but ulquiorras final power was unknown by aizen therefore the #4 is meaningless

    does that mean he could beat aizen?
    No, but it doesnt mean he couldnt either

    so the real debate is, could fgt ichigo defeat full hollow ichigo?

    we will never know, i personally believe the hollow form was stronger
    Well, to achieve FGT, both Hollow Ichigo and Zangetsu became one, and then Ichigo became one with them. His full Hollow power is just one ingredient of what went into FGT, so it doesn't really make sense for Hollow power alone to be more powerful or even equal to the complete combination of itself and Shinigami or Quincy or whatever Zangetsu was back then.

    Also, whilst FGT was on such a level that even Aizen, whose own reiatsu wasn't even conceivable by Shinigami, couldn't perceive it himself, even Rukia and Yammy were able to sense both Ulquiorra's and Ichigo's powers as they were fighting on top of Las Noches.

  9. #23
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member BaddAzzKenpachi74's Avatar
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    Re: Is FGT Ichigo/God Aizen a new normal level now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kisame Hoshigaki View Post
    Sorry but ulquiorras final power was unknown by aizen therefore the #4 is meaningless

    does that mean he could beat aizen?
    No, but it doesnt mean he couldnt either

    so the real debate is, could fgt ichigo defeat full hollow ichigo?

    we will never know, i personally believe the hollow form was stronger
    ugh, I just hate how people overate the heck out of ulquarra.

    Yea he had a unknown resurrection but the bottom line is that the only measuring stick we have here is him beating Ichigo, let me repeat ICHIGO who was by no means anywhere near the strongest character in the manga at the time.

    So what he pwned Ichigo?

    There where a lot of characters at the time who I wager could do the same.

    And all his segunda form really did was pwn him a bit more, which doesn't show that much of a power boost.

    Not to mention Ulquarra himself even ADMITS that unlike the other espadas he traded raw power for regeneration.
    Last edited by BaddAzzKenpachi74; December 20, 2013 at 08:37 PM.

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  10. #24
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member conn-man's Avatar
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    Re: Is FGT Ichigo/God Aizen a new normal level now?

    Quote Originally Posted by MBVC View Post
    Oh really? The current Ichigo is stronger than his FGT self without using FGT? By the way, Aizen's 4th evolution was equivalent to FGT version since his zan was about to disappear but Urahara's kidou sealed him and something with his solitude problem prevented him from achieved the 4th evolution.
    Uraharas kido activated beacause Aizen was shrinking in power. The explanation urahara gives is the kido was inside Aizen ever since he implanted it into him behind the hado 91 but could only activate if his power lowered.

    There was no 4th form on the way, the Hougyoku rejected aizen after the octowing form. Aizens zan was crumbling, not becoming one with him like Ichigos form.

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  12. #25
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Xerneas's Avatar
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    Re: Is FGT Ichigo/God Aizen a new normal level now?

    Quote Originally Posted by MBVC View Post
    Oh really? The current Ichigo is stronger than his FGT self without using FGT? By the way, Aizen's 4th evolution was equivalent to FGT version since his zan was about to disappear but Urahara's kidou sealed him and something with his solitude problem prevented him from achieved the 4th evolution
    The databook confirmed abomination mode is his final form. Which makes sense cause Aizen is only a Shinigami to begin with, so he can't transcend to Ichigo's level. THATS why the Hogyoku rejected him and took away his powers.

    As for Ichigo, he could have more reiatsu now yes. But it wouldn't make a difference if its not transcendental reiatsu. Transcendence is not just about raw strength but introduced this concept of different dimensions of reiatsu. Like you know how Gin wtfpwned Aizen? He was only able to do that because Aizen lowered the dimension of his reiatsu back down to the Shinigami level. Therefore Gin's own reiatsu was able to interact with Aizen's and do real damage. If Aizen had not lowered his "dimension" Gin's attack would have done jack squat. But Aizen did NOT reduce his power. He was as strong as ever to the point where his reiatsu was crushing everybody except Gin. And he wasn't even trying to do a reiatsu crush. It was just that huge. So his POWER was the same as before. Its the DIMENSION or NATURE that changed.

    The next example is when we saw Butterflaizen's Black Coffin do nothing at all to Ichigo. But then he evolved to Abominaizen and was able to do something with Fracor (nuke cero). Its because he got closer to the dimension Ichigo was at when he "evolved". I really don't think his normal "powerlevel" increased. His full incantation Black Coffin is a much better attack than some generic cero, but it epic failed cause he was too far away from the place Ichigo was at, so even a spacetime bending gravity force could not interact with Ichigo's reiatsu (the dimensions were too far apart) and he literally waved the attack away. Do you understand now?
    Last edited by Xerneas; December 23, 2013 at 10:21 AM.

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    Re: Is FGT Ichigo/God Aizen a new normal level now?

    Quote Originally Posted by NoOneInParticular View Post
    Well, to achieve FGT, both Hollow Ichigo and Zangetsu became one, and then Ichigo became one with them. His full Hollow power is just one ingredient of what went into FGT, so it doesn't really make sense for Hollow power alone to be more powerful or even equal to the complete combination of itself and Shinigami or Quincy or whatever Zangetsu was back then.

    Also, whilst FGT was on such a level that even Aizen, whose own reiatsu wasn't even conceivable by Shinigami, couldn't perceive it himself, even Rukia and Yammy were able to sense both Ulquiorra's and Ichigo's powers as they were fighting on top of Las Noches.
    the full hollow ichigo was certainly more powerful than the shinigami/vizard ichigo

    honestly he was exponentially stronger

  14. #27
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member NoOneInParticular's Avatar
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    Re: Is FGT Ichigo/God Aizen a new normal level now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kisame Hoshigaki View Post
    the full hollow ichigo was certainly more powerful than the shinigami/vizard ichigo

    honestly he was exponentially stronger
    Yeah, he was clearly stronger than his Vaizard self, that goes without saying. But comparing it to FGT, there's nothing to suggest full Hollow rampage mode was stronger or nearly as strong. Feats-wise, full Hollow crushed Ulquiorra, an Arrancar, and FGT crushed three-times-evolved Hogyoku Aizen, who even in his base Shinigami form was stronger than Ulquiorra.

  15. #28
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    Re: Is FGT Ichigo/God Aizen a new normal level now?

    Quote Originally Posted by NoOneInParticular View Post
    who even in his base Shinigami form was stronger than Ulquiorra.
    That's the major problem with the argument about comparing Uliquerra R2 to anyone else, it's a claim that is unprovable. How would you know if that's true or not? You simply don't.
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  16. #29
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    Re: Is FGT Ichigo/God Aizen a new normal level now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Schabrak View Post
    That's the major problem with the argument about comparing Uliquerra R2 to anyone else, it's a claim that is unprovable. How would you know if that's true or not? You simply don't.
    Well, yeah, you're right. Still, there are a few things. Ulquiorra did state that there were 3 Espada stronger than him. Now maybe he was just hiding Segunda Etapa for whatever reason, since he evidently isn't keen enough on using it to have bothered showing Aizen. Or maybe he was including SE and talking about Barragan, Starrk and Yammy, not Harribel. Also, Yammy, having sensed Ichigo and Ulquiorra fighting atop Las Noches then went on to claim that Ulquiorra was trash compared to himself. Aizen knew how strong Yammy could get, and said he was stronger than the Espada collectively. Probably an exaggerated boast; I doubt his reiatsu was higher than all theirs combined, but no doubt he was stronger than any one of them. So if he was stronger than Yammy, he was likely stronger than Ulquiorra.

    As evidence it's all kind of flimsy, sure, but it's something nonetheless. On the other end of the argument, all there is to say is Ulquiorra was stronger than we thought he was, which isn't really evidence of anything at all in comparing him to Aizen.

  17. #30
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    Re: Is FGT Ichigo/God Aizen a new normal level now?

    But did you consider, when, how and why he said that about those three? Him saying there are three stronger ones to agitate Ichigo was more than obvious in hindsight, it doesn't tell us anything about the real ranking and even if it was a ranking of strength, it wouldn't say anything about the ranking of individual match-ups between them.

    Yammy got fucked off-panel, so him losing against two mediocre captains didn't really tell us much about the real ranking. Yeah, he was 1# in brute strength, but who cares about that when he's a gigantic moving target.
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