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Thread: Kukaku's arm

  1. #1
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity ca12nag3's Avatar
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    Kukaku's arm

    I got a theory about why she lost her arm.

    First off she used to be part of Zero Squad. Her knowledge of entering the Royal Realm with her canon as well as her above average spell power as well as how easily the royal guards went to see her. It is too convenient to be random.
    Then her not having her arm, well what if someone was forced to resign/ thrown out. Or left on their own accord. It seems every royal guard has his own key embedded in their arm.
    They'd cut off the removed members arm so they can never set foot in the Royal Realm again.

    Thus that's what happened to her in my theory.

    The only part of why and how is a mystery.

  2. #2
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member devstauk's Avatar
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    Re: Kukaku's arm

    Its not just the royal guards arm that are embedded with the Ouken their entire anatomy is the ouken, but i do like the theory it would explain some things but in all honesty i doubt thats what kubo will do
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    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member Firebird0ne's Avatar
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    Re: Kukaku's arm

    I wonder if Aizen stole and/or used her arm to access the RR. We know Aizen saw the king, at some point. Or, Urahara could be somehow responsible?

  4. #4
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity ca12nag3's Avatar
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    Re: Kukaku's arm

    Quote Originally Posted by devstauk View Post
    Its not just the royal guards arm that are embedded with the Ouken their entire anatomy is the ouken, but i do like the theory it would explain some things but in all honesty i doubt thats what kubo will do
    I do not take it as literally as you do in regard to *their anatomy*. Basically your asuming what the fan-lation says is 100% acurate without looking at the image shown in the manga. Clearly the dude showed his right arm with the oken in it glowing. Why would it be the right arm he shows. Why not his friggin face glowing up? So my analogy is that it is in the right arm, well embedded in it. And when she either got discharged or left the guards she had to give up her arm.

    What i thus do is assume indeed its the arm. And Kukakus arm was taken for that simple reason. Also whatever caused those events might be the *disgrace and* fall of the Shiba clan.

    Another reason is why she instantly knows about the Royals doesnt blink and sends m off back up with her canon. Like really?
    Last edited by ca12nag3; December 22, 2013 at 02:27 PM.

  5. #5
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member devstauk's Avatar
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    Re: Kukaku's arm

    Don't mean to burst your bubble but he clearly says 'It's our bones' me saying its his anatomy wasn't exactly an overstatement either the King of souls chose these guys to be royal guard and also gave them the Ouken within their very being every part of them is the Ouken, if it was only the right arm then just chopping of a royal guards arm would be the only thing between an enemy and the King of Souls o.O

    http://www.mangapanda.com/bleach/519/5

    http://mangahelpers.com/t/cnet128/releases/36493
    Oshou: The "Ouken"... / ...refers to the very bones of the members of Division Zero. // They are transformed by the Spirit King's power when we are chosen for the position. // As a result, / there are only two ways to gain entry to the Palace. // To be permitted entry by our will... / ...or to enter alongside us. // Aizen Sousuke attempted to create the Ouken. // In other words... // He attempted to use his spiritual powers... // ...to create none other than us ourselves.
    Shutara: To create life... / ...murder the King... / ...and take the seat of God for himself was his plan.
    Last edited by devstauk; December 22, 2013 at 02:55 PM.
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    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member Firebird0ne's Avatar
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    Re: Kukaku's arm

    Quote Originally Posted by devstauk View Post
    Don't mean to burst your bubble but he clearly says 'It's our bones' me saying its his anatomy wasn't exactly an overstatement either the King of souls chose these guys to be royal guard and also gave them the Ouken within their very being every part of them is the Ouken, if it was only the right arm then just chopping of a royal guards arm would be the only thing between an enemy and the King of Souls o.O

    http://www.mangapanda.com/bleach/519/5

    http://mangahelpers.com/t/cnet128/releases/36493
    Oshou: The "Ouken"... / ...refers to the very bones of the members of Division Zero. // They are transformed by the Spirit King's power when we are chosen for the position. // As a result, / there are only two ways to gain entry to the Palace. // To be permitted entry by our will... / ...or to enter alongside us. // Aizen Sousuke attempted to create the Ouken. // In other words... // He attempted to use his spiritual powers... // ...to create none other than us ourselves.
    Shutara: To create life... / ...murder the King... / ...and take the seat of God for himself was his plan.
    Now I wonder if Kukakku was an RG and Aizen lopped off a piece of her, which he used in his recipe to create the hougyoku!

  7. #7
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity ca12nag3's Avatar
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    Re: Kukaku's arm

    Quote Originally Posted by devstauk View Post
    Don't mean to burst your bubble but he clearly says 'It's our bones' me saying its his anatomy wasn't exactly an overstatement either the King of souls chose these guys to be royal guard and also gave them the Ouken within their very being every part of them is the Ouken, if it was only the right arm then just chopping of a royal guards arm would be the only thing between an enemy and the King of Souls o.O

    http://www.mangapanda.com/bleach/519/5

    http://mangahelpers.com/t/cnet128/releases/36493
    Oshou: The "Ouken"... / ...refers to the very bones of the members of Division Zero. // They are transformed by the Spirit King's power when we are chosen for the position. // As a result, / there are only two ways to gain entry to the Palace. // To be permitted entry by our will... / ...or to enter alongside us. // Aizen Sousuke attempted to create the Ouken. // In other words... // He attempted to use his spiritual powers... // ...to create none other than us ourselves.
    Shutara: To create life... / ...murder the King... / ...and take the seat of God for himself was his plan.
    So because a fan translation gives a rough translation of *inside the bones* you deem it fit to say that its all the bones throughout the entire body. Be mindful > fan translation. You cannot say a fan translation is fully true. Not by a long shot. Because the text in itself its Inside these bones or something he says. Well since hes holding up his arm i'm suggesting that he means inside his arm and not the entire body but heck i can be wrong.
    So your willing to ride your entire debunk on a assumption that a fan translation says something thats not even in the fan translation. And i refer to the specific sentence the bones throughout my entire body which even the translation does not give.

    And then there is another part. For example the hogyoku ill go into it on a bit more detail. It was inside Rukias soul. Wouldn't it be like big or coated or whatever mixed with her soul? No it was like a cube embedded inside her. So why wouldn't the key be like embedded inside a royal guards bones?
    Another thing is having the key to far out spread like a wolverine coating means that cutting off that part of a royal guard and actually take it means you could study/ replicate it. A La Aizen. So that should never ever happen. And putting it in the sword arm of a Guard makes it rather difficult to just take it since thats the arm that is most protected. I'm just saying.
    Last edited by ca12nag3; December 22, 2013 at 05:38 PM.

  8. #8
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member devstauk's Avatar
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    Re: Kukaku's arm

    Well considering anything that has been debunked by anyone on this forum, fan translations have always been the source to debunk by, so yes i will continue with my statement.

    Fact is yes he showed his arm but in all honesty it would be pretty strange if he used any other part of his anatomy, every translation has shown it being bones not arm if he said 'our arms are the key' then yes i would fully go with what you are saying but stating that fan translations are not a full proof way of debunking something then everyone in this forum that has used a translation to debunk something would therefore be wrong.

    Don't take me saying that their bones are the key not just the arm is in anyway trying to knock your theory because its not, i like it and in a way it makes sense, i mean her giving up her arm could essentially have the implications that if an RG lost a limb then ultimately they lose the ability to have the Ouken because they are not whole.... I mean from what Urahara stated to Aizen was that Reitsu is based in the wrists, so losing an arm or hand could in fact make for said person to be impaired in some way, we also know that Ywach thought Yamamotto was weaker due to him not having his arm repaired.
    Last edited by devstauk; December 22, 2013 at 05:47 PM.
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  9. #9
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity ca12nag3's Avatar
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    Re: Kukaku's arm

    Quote Originally Posted by devstauk View Post
    Well considering anything that has been debunked by anyone on this forum, fan translations have always been the source to debunk by, so yes i will continue with my statement.

    Fact is yes he showed his arm but in all honesty it would be pretty strange if he used any other part of his anatomy, every translation has shown it being bones not arm if he said 'our arms are the key' then yes i would fully go with what you are saying but stating that fan translations are not a full proof way of debunking something then everyone in this forum that has used a translation to debunk something would therefore be wrong.
    Your beating straight around what i said without going deeper into what i said. I gave 2 clear lines and add a 3rd for ya

    -the source translation is a tad off
    -the translation isn't off but the *key itself* isn't like a coating. Your just assuming it is.
    -the royal guard is giving a simplified explanation just not to either reveal exactly where it is / to keep it simple for Ichigo.

  10. #10
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member devstauk's Avatar
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    Re: Kukaku's arm

    Quote Originally Posted by ca12nag3 View Post
    Your beating straight around what i said without going deeper into what i said. I gave 2 clear lines and add a 3rd for ya

    -the source translation is a tad off
    -the translation isn't off but the *key itself* isn't like a coating. Your just assuming it is.
    -the royal guard is giving a simplified explanation just not to either reveal exactly where it is / to keep it simple for Ichigo.
    I'm sorry but im not the one assuming, you say 3 things:-
    1.the source translation is a tad off = Every translation says bones so bones must be what he says

    2.the translation isn't off but the *key itself* isn't like a coating. Your just assuming it is. = The "Ouken"... / ...refers to the very bones of the members of Division Zero. // They are transformed by the Spirit King's power when we are chosen for the position
    The bold statements suggest otherwise.

    3.the royal guard is giving a simplified explanation just not to either reveal exactly where it is / to keep it simple for Ichigo = The simplest thing he could of said being "Our Arms are the Key'

    Anyway instead saying im assuming give me an actual concrete conclusion as to why only the right arm would be the key and not the entire skeleton of the RG?
    Last edited by devstauk; December 22, 2013 at 06:03 PM.
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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Notak's Avatar
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    Re: Kukaku's arm

    I have to doubt she was in the RG considering her power, take for example the Raikohou she used with Jidanbou against Aizen.
    It sounds like it could be possible though, what if she was stripped of her power after being demoted?

    She was raised in Rukongai like Kaien so maybe that's the reason. It's a pretty rough place

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    Re: Kukaku's arm

    You see everything in these forums. People stupid enough to not realize that Kubo meant their bones to be the ouken. wow....

    Anyway, the kukaky theory (arm aside) is pretty interesting.

  13. #13
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity ca12nag3's Avatar
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    Re: Kukaku's arm

    Quote Originally Posted by josetato View Post
    You see everything in these forums. People stupid enough to not realize that Kubo meant their bones to be the ouken. wow....

    Anyway, the kukaky theory (arm aside) is pretty interesting.
    Just because i question the specifics of the *bones* and the Ouken itself doesn't mean i am stupid. I just keep thinking. I got no doubt its there. But that's the same for people fearing Rukia would end up dead if the Hogyoku were taken from her soul, since it was inside her.
    Basically i do not believe that their entire bone structure = the Ouken. And nothing in the text suggests so. Only People stupid enough assume directly it is. Send it back at you.
    Not stupid but i rather keep thinking then just assume it to be so. And besides not even the fan translation is 100% clear on it.

    Mangastream - (Its Literally in our bones)
    Mangapanda- (Its our bones)

    These are the 2 most popular translators. And they cant even agree what it is. Usually i stick with Mangastream but that's me i don't judge others for their choice. But at least ill stay open for both. I just *think* its what mangastream says and that its in it. Meaning it could be on a fixed location lets say the right forearm. Again prove me wrong. You cant. You can only reason with the mangapanda version of it and then refute mangastream. That's all you can do but it does not get you closer to the truth. Neither does mine but then it turns into a discussion about 2 translations and i do not feel for that.
    Last edited by ca12nag3; December 23, 2013 at 08:41 AM.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member devstauk's Avatar
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    Re: Kukaku's arm

    Quote Originally Posted by ca12nag3 View Post
    Mangastream - (Its Literally in our bones)
    Mangapanda- (Its our bones)

    These are the 2 most popular translators. And they cant even agree what it is. Usually i stick with Mangastream but that's me i don't judge others for their choice. But at least ill stay open for both. I just *think* its what mangastream says and that its in it. Meaning it could be on a fixed location lets say the right forearm. Again prove me wrong. You cant. You can only reason with the mangapanda version of it and then refute mangastream. That's all you can do but it does not get you closer to the truth. Neither does mine but then it turns into a discussion about 2 translations and i do not feel for that.

    To be honest i don't even need to write about why these things are bolded. But i will point out that i have put in above posts the Cnet translation which also suggests that it is the entirety of the RG's bones. As does the Mangastream.

    Prove you wrong = Don't need to you done it yourself

    I do not agree with what josetato posted as it was uncalled for, but from what you are saying it isn't looking to good for you

    And here is my post providing said Cnet translation, theres even a link
    Spoiler show


    The reason i didn't include the mangastream version was due to me out rightly forgetting but in all honesty you don't want me to add it due to it pretty much cementing my point
    Last edited by devstauk; December 23, 2013 at 10:25 AM.
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    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity ca12nag3's Avatar
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    Re: Kukaku's arm

    Quote Originally Posted by devstauk View Post
    To be honest i don't even need to write about why these things are bolded. But i will point out that i have put in above posts the Cnet translation which also suggests that it is the entirety of the RG's bones. As does the Mangastream.

    Prove you wrong = just have

    I do not agree with what josetato posted as it was uncalled for, but from what you are saying it isn't looking to good for you

    And here is my post providing said Cnet translation, theres even a link
    You really are just nitpicking. Could you do that with something else? Its a theory and it hasn't been dis-proven i mean you simply read it like this.

    Its Literally in our bones = sugar in tea where the sugar dissolved in it.

    What if you read it like

    Its Literally in our bones = vegetables in your soup where you can take out the vegetables, or scoop up the soup with a vegetable in it. Thus remove the arm in which bones the Ouken is located. Do you really have to fixate on the fact that you only read it like the above?

    And what i feared became true and that is that it turned into a argument over the interpretation of the words themselves, that are in turn a translation of the original. Where i am more fixed on the visual representation of the chapters 518/519. Where he holds out his right arm and it glows up/veins being shown as the Ouken resonating from inside.

    If i was not clear enough then tell me but my interpretation is not wrong, neither is yours but that also means your argument of the text itself cannot debunk the theory since both can be true.

    There are many instances where you need to context exactly to determine which interpretation is true. And i could go on endlessly about it but that would derail too far from this theory and that is that i believe its possible that inside the bones of their right arm they have the ouken. And simply by text alone its not dis-proven. The only thing you can do is interpret it in a way that it disproves. Or am i talking to complicated?

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