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Thread: When was the first time Ichigo exhibit Quincy power?

  1. #16
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member conn-man's Avatar
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    Re: When was the first time Ichigo exhibit Quincy power?

    There was a sharp drop in rank a a few years ago. Like how One Piece, Naruto and Bleach were called the big 3 because they held the top 3 ranks in Shounen Jump magazine? At the time bleach was threatened it was down to like 15th place and the boys at SJ didn't know if it would recover. Now bleach has a healthy SJ rank again.So that helps explain this rewrite business.
    Last edited by conn-man; January 01, 2014 at 02:03 PM.

  2. #17
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member NoOneInParticular's Avatar
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    Re: When was the first time Ichigo exhibit Quincy power?

    Quote Originally Posted by ca12nag3 View Post
    My opinion chapter 1 when he absorbed all of Rukias shinigami power. She only intended to give him half so he could fend off that hollow. I think thats due to his quincy ability to absorb Reiatsu.
    I actually wonder if that's more to do with his Hollow. White was created to fuse with Shinigami powers, but since it chose Masaki for some reason and then went into Ichigo it never got any to latch onto. When Rukia finally gave Ichigo her powers, I think White grabbed onto it and pulled them all into his host. It looks a bit like he did the same with Ichigo's own Shinigami powers, since they're now so closely bonded that White funcions as Ichigo's Asauchi, unlike the Vaizards where there's a clear line between their Hollow and Shinigami powers. It's like White swallowed Ichigo's Shinigami powers completely.

    There is that shadow thing Zangetsu did when Ichigo was fighting Zaraki. He also said he was stopping Ichigo's bleeding, which might have been a form of Blut Vene maybe?

  3. #18
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity ca12nag3's Avatar
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    Re: When was the first time Ichigo exhibit Quincy power?

    Quote Originally Posted by NoOneInParticular View Post
    I actually wonder if that's more to do with his Hollow. White was created to fuse with Shinigami powers, but since it chose Masaki for some reason and then went into Ichigo it never got any to latch onto. When Rukia finally gave Ichigo her powers, I think White grabbed onto it and pulled them all into his host. It looks a bit like he did the same with Ichigo's own Shinigami powers, since they're now so closely bonded that White funcions as Ichigo's Asauchi, unlike the Vaizards where there's a clear line between their Hollow and Shinigami powers. It's like White swallowed Ichigo's Shinigami powers completely.

    There is that shadow thing Zangetsu did when Ichigo was fighting Zaraki. He also said he was stopping Ichigo's bleeding, which might have been a form of Blut Vene maybe?
    The inherit difference between hollow and quincy is that hollows *eat* reiatsu while quincy absorb it. The difference is that quincy can more or less absorb life out of others while hollow cannot, hollows will destroy whatever they eat. When looking back you notice how hollows like Grimjow eat other hollows, once they eat their prey they become damaged beyond repair. And they physically eat their prey to gain their power.
    With quincy for example Uryuu he could suck up Ichigos reiatsu and shoot it off into space, this ability to take pure energy is not a hollows. Ichigo recovers later from it.
    Rukia too recovers from her loss of power and i feel what Uryuu could do controlled without harming Rukia is something Ichigo did but then uncontrolled.

  4. #19
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member devstauk's Avatar
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    Re: When was the first time Ichigo exhibit Quincy power?

    Back when ichigo 1st went into his inner world while training to control his hollow side Bach-getsu was not there, ichigo asked where he was and white stated he was Zangetsu. Dunno if that had any major implication towards what has happened recently but we do know they are the same being only one side is qunicy the other hollow, whats confusing is where has the shinigami side gone
    Spoiler show

  5. #20
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member conn-man's Avatar
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    Re: When was the first time Ichigo exhibit Quincy power?

    Quote Originally Posted by devstauk View Post
    Back when ichigo 1st went into his inner world while training to control his hollow side Bach-getsu was not there, ichigo asked where he was and white stated he was Zangetsu. Dunno if that had any major implication towards what has happened recently but we do know they are the same being only one side is qunicy the other hollow, whats confusing is where has the shinigami side gone
    Remember when Ichigo turned the asauchi into the naked masked Ichigo zanpakuto spirit? It was exactly that, his zan spirit. With the introduction of Aizens White arrancar prototype, we saw that Masaki inherited a part of White's hollow power and it was passed on to ichigo at the same time as Issin's shinigami power was passed too. This explained that Ichigo's make up consists of a perfect shinigami hollow fusion that makes up a whole. While his other half is Quincy and Human which also seem to make a perfect whole.

    The explanation of Old Man Zangestu actually being a Bach Quincy spirit showed that the 'Hollow Ichigo', that replaced Old man zangetsu as the dominant form in Ichigos inner world, was actually his technical Zangetsu, also being composed of his shinigami side and not strictly a hollow as it used to be perceived.

    Edit: Going back and reading ch 542 looks to show that what Ichigo actually did was fuse all his inner spirit personalities into a singular 'Zangetsu'. Pretty much signifying his powers at long last balancing thus granting never before seen power.
    Last edited by conn-man; January 02, 2014 at 12:11 AM.

  6. #21
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity ca12nag3's Avatar
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    Re: When was the first time Ichigo exhibit Quincy power?

    Quote Originally Posted by conn-man View Post
    Remember when Ichigo turned the asauchi into the naked masked Ichigo zanpakuto spirit? It was exactly that, his zan spirit. With the introduction of Aizens White arrancar prototype, we saw that Masaki inherited a part of White's hollow power and it was passed on to ichigo at the same time as Issin's shinigami power was passed too. This explained that Ichigo's make up consists of a perfect shinigami hollow fusion that makes up a whole. While his other half is Quincy and Human which also seem to make a perfect whole.

    The explanation of Old Man Zangestu actually being a Bach Quincy spirit showed that the 'Hollow Ichigo', that replaced Old man zangetsu as the dominant form in Ichigos inner world, was actually his technical Zangetsu, also being composed of his shinigami side and not strictly a hollow as it used to be perceived.

    Edit: Going back and reading ch 542 looks to show that what Ichigo actually did was fuse all his inner spirit personalities into a singular 'Zangetsu'. Pretty much signifying his powers at long last balancing thus granting never before seen power.
    I dunno i have a hard time with all the hollow passing on stuff. Then if that is true what about the Vizared. Im not saying its not true but it just does not explain much as a general rule as to what happens if this and that happens. Do i make sense?... haha.

    Point is there is only 1 true instance that we see something that's significantly different from what is considered normal among either Shinigami and hollow. Remember that the entire mask stuff with Byakuya isn't anything different from what happened during TBTP. That instance is when Ichigo went Hollow vs Ulquiorra. We do not know much about the inner world for anyone except Ichigo since his is the only one we ever get to see. The outer manifestation and talking to your inner zanpakuto is not oddd, we see Renji do it. The mask like i said is common for those that are turning hollow. And then there is the blut vein well that is quincy skill.
    What i'm getting at is that the passing of the hollow is not a proven fact, it is only that we see the hollow in the past and it resembles the one Ichigo turns into when fighting Ulq. But by no means is that linked to Zangetsu or inn Hollow. Cause both can be explained in other ways.

  7. #22
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member NoOneInParticular's Avatar
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    Re: When was the first time Ichigo exhibit Quincy power?

    Quote Originally Posted by ca12nag3 View Post
    The inherit difference between hollow and quincy is that hollows *eat* reiatsu while quincy absorb it. The difference is that quincy can more or less absorb life out of others while hollow cannot, hollows will destroy whatever they eat. When looking back you notice how hollows like Grimjow eat other hollows, once they eat their prey they become damaged beyond repair. And they physically eat their prey to gain their power.
    With quincy for example Uryuu he could suck up Ichigos reiatsu and shoot it off into space, this ability to take pure energy is not a hollows. Ichigo recovers later from it.
    Rukia too recovers from her loss of power and i feel what Uryuu could do controlled without harming Rukia is something Ichigo did but then uncontrolled.
    That's true, but then White is a bit different from other Hollows. Whereas other Hollows need to consume other souls entirely, White was designed to bond to a host's spirit and become one with them. The only reason the host dies in most cases is because they don't have Quincy or Human power to balance it out and prevent the soul from imploding on itself.

    Rukia getting her powers back is kind of a weird one. It's not that Ichigo ever gave her power back, in fact he couldn't because Byakuya destroyed it when he stabbed Ichigo through the soul sleep or chain of fate (or whatever it was). So her getting her powers back was an independent thing. I'm not too sure really, imo both White and Quincy absorption are both possibilities for what happened to Rukia's powers in the beginning. I'd say it was because of White, but I can't really prove it with certainty.

  8. #23
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Lee.J.Baxter's Avatar
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    Re: When was the first time Ichigo exhibit Quincy power?

    Quote Originally Posted by NoOneInParticular View Post
    That's true, but then White is a bit different from other Hollows. Whereas other Hollows need to consume other souls entirely, White was designed to bond to a host's spirit and become one with them. The only reason the host dies in most cases is because they don't have Quincy or Human power to balance it out and prevent the soul from imploding on itself.

    Rukia getting her powers back is kind of a weird one. It's not that Ichigo ever gave her power back, in fact he couldn't because Byakuya destroyed it when he stabbed Ichigo through the soul sleep or chain of fate (or whatever it was). So her getting her powers back was an independent thing. I'm not too sure really, imo both White and Quincy absorption are both possibilities for what happened to Rukia's powers in the beginning. I'd say it was because of White, but I can't really prove it with certainty.
    I'd say it was the Hougyoko's effects on Rukia, 100%. I think the transferral of her powers to Ichigo was a Shinigami thing; after all, she wouldn't have even tried it if Shinigami were incapable of doing it. The Hougyoko just read her subconscious desires to transfer nearly all of her power rather than half of it.

    As for Rukia getting her powers back; I don't think Rukia actually gave Ichigo her individual powers as such, but more her spirit energy. Under normal circumstances (i.e. performed on a Human without the Hougyoko's influence) the process would have most likely given the recipient base Shinigami powers without giving them an Asauchi. The Asauchi that Ichigo possessed after the transformation, IMO, was not a real Asauchi (as Nimaiya has stated only he can create them); it was most likely a simple blade formed from reishi. Rukia had her Zanpakutou and powers all along, but was too weak to actually manifest or use them until her energy was replenished within the Seireitei.
    Predictions
    • Just as Quincies are evolved beings born from Humans, Shinigami are evolved beings born from Hollows.
    • Once Yhwach dies, Ichigo's Quincy powers will disappear and his soul will become unstable, causing the onset of Soul Suicide.
    • Yhwach isn't going to be the final antagonist.

  9. #24
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member NoOneInParticular's Avatar
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    Re: When was the first time Ichigo exhibit Quincy power?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lee.J.Baxter View Post
    I'd say it was the Hougyoko's effects on Rukia, 100%. I think the transferral of her powers to Ichigo was a Shinigami thing; after all, she wouldn't have even tried it if Shinigami were incapable of doing it. The Hougyoko just read her subconscious desires to transfer nearly all of her power rather than half of it.

    As for Rukia getting her powers back; I don't think Rukia actually gave Ichigo her individual powers as such, but more her spirit energy. Under normal circumstances (i.e. performed on a Human without the Hougyoko's influence) the process would have most likely given the recipient base Shinigami powers without giving them an Asauchi. The Asauchi that Ichigo possessed after the transformation, IMO, was not a real Asauchi (as Nimaiya has stated only he can create them); it was most likely a simple blade formed from reishi. Rukia had her Zanpakutou and powers all along, but was too weak to actually manifest or use them until her energy was replenished within the Seireitei.
    Tbh I'd forgotten about the Hogyoku when thinking about this, haha. Yep, that could very well explain Rukia losing all her powers, as part of a subconscious desire to leave Shinigami life behind to get away from the memory of what happened to Kaian and some underlying feeling that she deserved punishment. So yeah, the Hogyoku could have been responding to her will to lose her powers and Ichigo's will to gain power.

    I think you're right about how her powers returned as well actually.

    If that's all the case, then I guess Ichigo's first use of Quincy abilities was in the fight against Zaraki.

  10. #25
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member devstauk's Avatar
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    Re: When was the first time Ichigo exhibit Quincy power?

    I still think the 1st instance of ichigo showing his quincy side off was probably the FGT i mean it was him unifying all his powers in very short amount of time and not knowing who or what he truly was, it's basically the same thing that uryuu did against mayuri and not only that but look at how he got his power back in the fulbring arc, i don't mean his fulbring powers i mean the light sword that rukia and co brought. Wasn't that a thing urahara created, i think it was based on the same technique that ryuuken was performing with uryuu to get his powers back
    Spoiler show

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Notak's Avatar
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    Re: When was the first time Ichigo exhibit Quincy power?

    I only recall him using a Quincy power once, against Zaraki when "Zangetsu" appeared and used the Shadow ability I think?

    The old man was limiting Ichigo's real Zangetsu, but I wouldn't really call that a Quincy power. That sounds more like suppression.

  12. #27
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Lee.J.Baxter's Avatar
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    Re: When was the first time Ichigo exhibit Quincy power?

    Quote Originally Posted by Notak View Post
    I only recall him using a Quincy power once, against Zaraki when "Zangetsu" appeared and used the Shadow ability I think?

    The old man was limiting Ichigo's real Zangetsu, but I wouldn't really call that a Quincy power. That sounds more like suppression.
    IIRC, it was "Zangetsu's" use of his Quincy powers that also stemmed Ichigo's blood loss during that battle, using a weak version of Blut Vene.

    Anyways, I think Ichigo used his Quincy powers WAY before his battle with Zaraki; when "Old Man Zangetsu" revealed his true identity, he explained that he used "Hollow Zangetsu" whenever he taught him Shinigami techniques. In other words, any techniques that Ichigo learnt from Zangetsu before he met "Hollow Zangetsu" were Quincy-based; this means that Ichigos blue Getsuga is most-likely a Quincy technique too, and he used this pretty-much from the get-go after the shattered-shaft training.

    I might be wrong on this, of course, as Ichigo learnt to fire off a blue Getsuga without the incantation by himself. I'm just going off the fact that we didn't see "Hollow Zangetsu" around during the time that Zangetsu taught him the name of the technique, and the fact that the blue Getsuga looks like it could be a variant of the Quincy arrow (its colour and composition match a Quincy arrow).
    Predictions
    • Just as Quincies are evolved beings born from Humans, Shinigami are evolved beings born from Hollows.
    • Once Yhwach dies, Ichigo's Quincy powers will disappear and his soul will become unstable, causing the onset of Soul Suicide.
    • Yhwach isn't going to be the final antagonist.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Notak's Avatar
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    Re: When was the first time Ichigo exhibit Quincy power?

    Ah yeah the healing was also a Quincy power. As for Getsuga, I think it's a Zan ability since his dad has it too.

    He'll probably use the two as a hybrid later on, I bet at first he'll use the powers separately.

  14. #29
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member exacta's Avatar
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    Re: When was the first time Ichigo exhibit Quincy power?

    Quote Originally Posted by conn-man View Post

    So no matter either way but I don't think there will be many solid pieces of evidence of Ichigo using Quincy powers very far back in the series.
    Kubo definitely always planned Ichigo on being a Quincy. The Quincy symbols on his bedsheets and all those cryptic comments on the nature of Ichigo's power, especially when Byakuya said "It's almost as if....". Do you really think Kubo didn't know how to finish that sentence when he wrote it in the story?

    ---------- Post added at 12:17 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:13 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by weixiaobao View Post
    Which is extremely confusing because learning Zangetsu was a step to get his "shinigami" power. I am totally lost in Bleach logic.
    Zangetsu was suppressing most of his shinigami power. He wasn't using Quincy powers, he just wasn't able to use most of his true power because Zangetsu wouldn't let him access it. Zangetsu wasn't actually a "step". He guided him, but in almost all situations it was never Zangetsu but White that saved Ichigo and developed his powers. Zangetsu helped him learn Bankai, but everything else is White. Well technically Zangetsu and White taught him the FGT....but whatever.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Lee.J.Baxter's Avatar
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    Re: When was the first time Ichigo exhibit Quincy power?

    Quote Originally Posted by exacta View Post
    Kubo definitely always planned Ichigo on being a Quincy. The Quincy symbols on his bedsheets and all those cryptic comments on the nature of Ichigo's power, especially when Byakuya said "It's almost as if....". Do you really think Kubo didn't know how to finish that sentence when he wrote it in the story?

    ---------- Post added at 12:17 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:13 AM ----------



    Zangetsu was suppressing most of his shinigami power. He wasn't using Quincy powers, he just wasn't able to use most of his true power because Zangetsu wouldn't let him access it. Zangetsu wasn't actually a "step". He guided him, but in almost all situations it was never Zangetsu but White that saved Ichigo and developed his powers. Zangetsu helped him learn Bankai, but everything else is White. Well technically Zangetsu and White taught him the FGT....but whatever.
    That may actually explain what FGT really is; perhaps it's a union of Shinigami and Quincy powers, which is extremely powerful as it's merging the polar opposite aspects of his power. His post-Dangai appearance and power may also be partly a result of his Shinigami and Quincy powers merging together; this could mean that Ichigo has regained that level of power after his visit to the Royal Dimension, as they've essentially both merged into his Zanpakutou (if the 2 swords are independant - one represents his Shinigami powers, and one his Quincy powers - he may be able to combine them somehow)...
    Predictions
    • Just as Quincies are evolved beings born from Humans, Shinigami are evolved beings born from Hollows.
    • Once Yhwach dies, Ichigo's Quincy powers will disappear and his soul will become unstable, causing the onset of Soul Suicide.
    • Yhwach isn't going to be the final antagonist.

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