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Thread: Ichigo will become a god

  1. #16
    Banned 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
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    Re: Ichigo will become a god

    Quote Originally Posted by kkck View Post
    Shikai GT was taught to ichigo by old man zangetsu but bankai GT was actually taught to ichigo by shirosaki, the manga made that clear. Heck, even during the fight with grimmjow it was using GT that drew shirosaki out. Because it was his technique, his power. Old man zangetsu was in control of shirosaki at the time, shirosaki existed as a part of him. It makes sense that old man zangetsu would have access to zangetsu's powers. Also, ichigo only had a limit over his use of GT because he could not control shirosaki at the time.... Once he got a hold of shirosaki (and particularly after he mastered the mask) he could fire as many GT as he wanted.
    Bankai GT is just like normal Getsuga. It wasn't taught to Ichigo by Shirosaki. Shirosaki was the first one who used it.



    Quote Quote:
    I am not sure of what exactly you think volstandig is. From what I gather a volstandig without outside power is just impossible in any form or context. Volstandig is not a state which simply needs huge amounts of power to be accessed, volstandig actually is the quincy's ability to absorb reishi taken to the maximun. By definiton there cannot be something like volstandig that does not involve absorbing power.
    I think you're mistaking Letzt Still for Vollstandig... Neither Kirge nor As Nodt, nor Bambietta, neither the guy Shunsui fought absorbed every spiritron/reishi particle next to them. We hardly saw ANYONE absorb ANYTHING while in Vollstandig. Kirge needed to use Sklaverei to actually absorb something. So far Vollstandig is Quincies' Bankai, but it's more simple. It just boosts basic abilities and their innate ability. In Ichigo's case, it just strengthened his basic skills. Kirge didn't have any reiatsu. Or do you want to tell me he was transcendental?

    Quote Quote:
    The entire point of the manga during the deicide events was about transcendental beings. The comparison made here was that ichigo was to aizen what aizen was to ishin. I am also not talking about just the bit with the ball that aizen threw ichigo.
    No, it was about killing a god, that Aizen wanted to be. It was about killing overpowered Aizen, who wanted to raise above all, be something else, a god, but was crushed by Ichigo, a "mere human".

    Quote Quote:
    http://www.mangareader.net/94-57111-...apter-418.html (This is the part I meant about waving away aizen's kido with his hands).
    Nah, that's what you wrote:

    Quote Quote:
    he brushed of a level 90 kido with a wave of his sword and he blocked aizen's kido with his arm (although that did hurt him a bit
    What Ichigo tanked with his arm was was Cero from Hollowfied Aizen. When you were talking about level 90 Kido you said he did it with his sword, so don't say you meant something else now. >.<

    Quote Quote:
    The mountain was not blown away by aizen's power, it was ichigo's and aizen could not even feel it. Ichigo simply blew away aizen's attacks with his own reiatsu, he did so repeatedly. Even when aizen had ichigo's reiatsu in his face during the FGT bit and he still could not feel it (I disagree with the bit about aizen needing physical contact with it to feel it). In the end ichigo simply had reiatsu beyond aizen's comprehension.
    Kirge also has reiatsu wings, we can see reishi, yet noone could feel his reiatsu. Boom.

    How could Aizen feel that it was Ichigo's sword that blew away the mountain? They both were slashing left and right. The mountain was blown when their swords clashed, energy had to escape elsewhere. I'd argue THEIR swords blew away the mountain.

  2. #17
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member kkck's Avatar
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    Re: Ichigo will become a god

    Quote Originally Posted by Duniak View Post
    Bankai GT is just like normal Getsuga. It wasn't taught to Ichigo by Shirosaki. Shirosaki was the first one who used it.





    I think you're mistaking Letzt Still for Vollstandig... Neither Kirge nor As Nodt, nor Bambietta, neither the guy Shunsui fought absorbed every spiritron/reishi particle next to them. We hardly saw ANYONE absorb ANYTHING while in Vollstandig. Kirge needed to use Sklaverei to actually absorb something. So far Vollstandig is Quincies' Bankai, but it's more simple. It just boosts basic abilities and their innate ability. In Ichigo's case, it just strengthened his basic skills. Kirge didn't have any reiatsu. Or do you want to tell me he was transcendental?



    No, it was about killing a god, that Aizen wanted to be. It was about killing overpowered Aizen, who wanted to raise above all, be something else, a god, but was crushed by Ichigo, a "mere human".



    Nah, that's what you wrote:



    What Ichigo tanked with his arm was was Cero from Hollowfied Aizen. When you were talking about level 90 Kido you said he did it with his sword, so don't say you meant something else now. >.<



    Kirge also has reiatsu wings, we can see reishi, yet noone could feel his reiatsu. Boom.

    How could Aizen feel that it was Ichigo's sword that blew away the mountain? They both were slashing left and right. The mountain was blown when their swords clashed, energy had to escape elsewhere. I'd argue THEIR swords blew away the mountain.
    That's just a technicality, one way or the other bankai GT was a technique ichigo got from shirosaki (I believe the manga said ichigo copied the technique) which is actually pretty relevant.

    The volstandig is simply a more advanced version of the lets stilt however the principle itself is the same. Volstandig is still simply the absortion of reishi taken to the maximum to do what you said, raise basic abilities and their techniques. Otherwise, where is the power coming from?

    I got mixed up while writing but it adds up to the same. Ichigo still waved away a kido with his bare hands, stopped aizen's blade with his hands, tanked that blast with his arm and waved waved away the ring thingy with his sword. Aizen simply could not compete in a reiatsu match. Heck, what about the part when ichigo blew the mountain away (the one aizen thought he had blown away)? Why didn't aizen feel ichigo's power then if ichigo's power had actually done that? Because he simply could not perceive ichigo's power making a mountain disappear.

  3. #18
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    Re: Ichigo will become a god

    Quote Originally Posted by kkck View Post
    That's just a technicality, one way or the other bankai GT was a technique ichigo got from shirosaki (I believe the manga said ichigo copied the technique) which is actually pretty relevant.
    So Ichigo using GT on his own and getting the name is okay when he is in Shikai, but when he uses the same attack in Bankai it's copying Shirosaki, that he never really saw? Nah, it's just Ichigo using Getsuga. But the fact Ichigo's Bankai is fueled by Shirosaki's power means GT is also from Shirosaki reiatsu.

    Quote Quote:
    The volstandig is simply a more advanced version of the lets stilt however the principle itself is the same. Volstandig is still simply the absortion of reishi taken to the maximum to do what you said, raise basic abilities and their techniques. Otherwise, where is the power coming from?
    Yeah, from some source. That's why I said Ichigo has just an imitation of Vollstandig, not an actual Vollstandig. His power is coming from within. Other SRs...? Well, for all we've seen, NOT from outside. We think because it's called better Letzt Still, but it works nothing like LS. But we assume it must absorb something.

    Quote Quote:
    I got mixed up while writing but it adds up to the same. Ichigo still waved away a kido with his bare hands, stopped aizen's blade with his hands, tanked that blast with his arm and waved waved away the ring thingy with his sword. Aizen simply could not compete in a reiatsu match. Heck, what about the part when ichigo blew the mountain away (the one aizen thought he had blown away)? Why didn't aizen feel ichigo's power then if ichigo's power had actually done that? Because he simply could not perceive ichigo's power making a mountain disappear.
    Disappear? The cut it. Their swords clashed, and the mountain next to them got hit with wind or whatever. Aizen could slash Komamura from 10 meters. I think it's hardly a feat.


    But let's ignore that. It's a feat, all right. Feeling Ichigo's power? Mountain got blown away by energy from their swords.

    http://www.mangareader.net/94-804-14...apter-350.html

    Do you really think slashing the mountain HAD to be his reiatsu? No, it was a simple slash with a speed high enough to shoot an actual energy. Just like Ichigo attacked Ginjou with a slash that Ginjo thought was Getsuga. Shooting energy from the swords is old in this manga. Even Kenpachi can do it and crush Yami's jaw. Don't bother trying to make it significant.

  4. #19
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member kkck's Avatar
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    Re: Ichigo will become a god

    Quincy powers work exclusively by absorbing and manipulating reishi. That applies to volstandig too, there is literally no reason for us to think otherwise. The vosltandig deviating from that would be completely inconsistent with the most basic things we know about how quincy powers work. Heck, the whole thing about there not being a reiatsu wave and kirge not having reiatsu was attributed to him absorbing power on the same chapter the volstandig was introduced.

    My point is not about the feat in itself but rather the power that did it. The power that did it was reiatsu, the energy of their swords is reiatsu. Aizen was basically basking and fighting ichigo's reiatsu the whole thing and he still did not feel it. And I am not the one making it significant, ichigo made a point out of that saying it was his energy that blew the mountain away and that aizen had not notice ichigo's power was stronger than aizen's.

  5. #20
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    Re: Ichigo will become a god

    Quote Originally Posted by kkck View Post
    Quincy powers work exclusively by absorbing and manipulating reishi. That applies to volstandig too, there is literally no reason for us to think otherwise. The vosltandig deviating from that would be completely inconsistent with the most basic things we know about how quincy powers work. Heck, the whole thing about there not being a reiatsu wave and kirge not having reiatsu was attributed to him absorbing power on the same chapter the volstandig was introduced.
    There is a reason, an absorption technique is called "Sklaverei", and was a temporary complete control over ALL spiritrons. But of course it's better to assume Vollstandig works like that as well... If Quincies' power comes from Yhwach's blood, they have their own spiritual pressure within. Thus they don't need to absorb everything to be strong. They do absorb, as that is their basic power, but saying Vollstandig is huge reishi absorption just like Sklaverei is just wrong. It's NOT Letzt Still. That's what Sklaverei is. Evidence is all here, Vollstandig doens't work by absorbing everything around Quincy like Letzt Still.

    Quote Quote:
    My point is not about the feat in itself but rather the power that did it. The power that did it was reiatsu, the energy of their swords is reiatsu. Aizen was basically basking and fighting ichigo's reiatsu the whole thing and he still did not feel it. And I am not the one making it significant, ichigo made a point out of that saying it was his energy that blew the mountain away and that aizen had not notice ichigo's power was stronger than aizen's.
    So Shirosaki also "sent" reiatsu through his sword when he slashed the ground?

    By the way, next dimension talk

    http://www.mangastream.to/bleach-cha...1-page-12.html

    If you still think 2D and 3D talk was literal.

    http://www.mangastream.to/bleach-cha...1-page-14.html

    It was the same here. Reiatsu is a "fuel" for abilities. Shooting reiatsu from the tip is called GT. The force of the slash is just going elsewhere. If we look at their exchange that blew the mountain away we see that it must have been Ichigo's sword that blew it because of how it was cut. I'm talking about the angle.

    http://www.mangastream.to/bleach-cha...31-page-8.html

    Aizen could maybe do a crack on this page: http://www.mangastream.to/bleach-cha...31-page-9.html

    And it's not like propelling air/wind is all that strange.

    http://www.mangastream.to/bleach-cha...3-page-15.html

    Remember Bleach Tournament, Barragan vs Unohana fight? They were all arguing Unohana can propel wind to kill Barragan and not to get close. You know, saying crap just for her to win because Barragan was simply TOO hax.
    Last edited by Duniak; May 11, 2014 at 09:53 AM.

  6. #21
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Lee.J.Baxter's Avatar
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    Re: Ichigo will become a god

    Okay, how about this for an idea folks???

    So, within this possible scenario I'm tying together several of my theories; note that this is pure speculation bordering on fanfic;
    • When Yhwach dies the Quincies lose their power.
    • The Soul King is the progenitor of the Shinigami.
    • Like Yhwach can do to the Quincies, the Soul King can take away the power of any Shinigami.
    • The Soul King and Shinigami are both derived from Hollows (Shinigami are Hollows who have been purified when slain by a Zanpakutou).
    • When the Soul King dies the Shinigami lose their power and are "unpurified" (i.e. they start to descend into Hollows again).
    • When the Soul King dies, the Zanpakutou also becomes "unpurified" (i.e. the dead Shinigami souls that form it turn into dead Hollow souls).
    • Soul Suicide is dangerous (e.g. the soul violently explodes, or something otherwise happens to it that endangers lives/structures around the soul in question).

    So here's the ultimate showdown!!!...

    First will be everything we've expected up to this point; Ichigo will go up to the Royal Dimension and defeat Yhwach, killing him in the process. However, this is where the uber-Ichigo shitstorm starts to happen!!! With Yhwach dead, Ichigo's Quincy powers disappear...problem; now that those powers are gone, Ichigo's soul has lost it's balance and Soul Suicide begins to occur...now this is a problem as Soul Suicide in a powerful individual such as Ichigo could destroy the Royal Dimension. Knowing this, the Soul King removes Ichigo's Shinigami powers...problem solved!

    ...Nope! Now, when a Shinigami's powers are removed, they revert back to their unpurified form; a Hollow. Ichigo's hair begins to turn white and his eyes begin to blacken. Good thing the Soul King's fast; he slices through Ichigo, seemingly bringing a quick end to his life...problem solved!

    ...Something's off though; hardly any power returned to the Soul King, and for some reason Ichigo's Zanpakutou still remains! Ichigo gets up, and he's pissed! Suddenly tears open up leading to Hueco Mundo, and masses of super-dense Reishi gush out, flying towards Ichigo. It appears as though White has not only managed to convert most of his Shinigami power to its own, but it's also managed to mimic his Quincy abilities; one being reishi absorbsion. As Ichigo accumulates power from every Hollow in existence, the Soul King's body is torn by the high-speed super-dense Reishi flying towards Ichigo! As the Soul King drops to his knees in awe, a fully-Hollowfied super-Menos Ichigo screams and delivers a killing blow...just as it seems that things can't get any worse, they do!!!

    Now, remember that when the Soul King dies, Shinigami revert back to their Hollow selves? The Royal Dimension and the Soul Society begin to distort, and we see a familiar landscape begin to replace them...it seems as though it's not only the residents return to their former selves...the once peaceful environment transforms into Hueco Mundo! Furthermore, the Shinigami that are still alive become powerful Hollows; but don't worry, they won't exist for long...Ichigo absorbs them too!!! Crap, he's now a transcendent being due to the sheer amount of Spirit Energy he's consumed!!!!!

    Now here's where some characters come into play that we may have forgotten...remember that Chad and (presumably) Inoue are FullBringers? Being as they're Human/Hollow hybrids residing on Earth, they haven't been affected by the turn of events that have just occurred! They're joined by Kugo, Giriko and Tsukishima!

    And there's your final battle friends!!! The Fullbringers (which include Ichigo's friends) versus the ultimate Hollow death machine, Ichigo! One who protects, eh? How ironic...
    Predictions
    • Just as Quincies are evolved beings born from Humans, Shinigami are evolved beings born from Hollows.
    • Once Yhwach dies, Ichigo's Quincy powers will disappear and his soul will become unstable, causing the onset of Soul Suicide.
    • Yhwach isn't going to be the final antagonist.

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