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Thread: New Traitor/Enemy???

  1. #16
    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member crono's Avatar
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    Re: New Traitor???

    I really hope Kubo can pull off a great plot twist with the existing characters. That would be a lot more fulfilling then just introducing new bad ass characters that were never referenced before.

    Maybe the #1 bad guy is actually Urahara! Why, I don't know but if Kubo could make it somehow happen logically, that would be interesting

  2. #17
    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner
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    Re: New Traitor???

    The SS are EVIL!

    And Ichigo and Co. will have to fight them.

    Long story then.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member OhDearMoshe's Avatar
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    Re: New Traitor???

    Hold on. 5 Remaining Espada.

    I alawys figured Soul Society would be the final villains of the series. After all their ethic's are murky at best.


    Spoiler: Jehuty's words of wisdom show

  4. #19
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member gigantor21's Avatar
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    Re: New Traitor???

    ^ I could see Nell being used as a harbinger for that.

    Yama, in his overzealous "kill and isolate everything that might hurt us" mentality, could find out about Nell during or after the war and order her killed. Ichigo wouldn't let that happen--he knows she doesn't want to hurt anyone, and could easily argue that she's better than some of the Shinigami (Mayuri, Zaraki, the Exiles, etc.). It's not something that could be fought out, though, since Ichigo and Co. would be severely outnumbered, and I doubt he'd be willing to run away for Nell's sake. So he'd have to fight for her diplomatically.

    It'd be a nice way of putting Ichigo back in the fore, since his role has shrunken over the past 2 years. Something like that would have deep reverberations across all 3 realms.

    ...WTF is Aizen smiling about? XD

    Quote Originally Posted by Random YouTube Comment
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    Violets are blue.
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  5. #20
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member OhDearMoshe's Avatar
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    Re: New Traitor???

    Quote Originally Posted by gigantor21 View Post
    ^ I could see Nell being used as a harbinger for that.

    Yama, in his overzealous "kill and isolate everything that might hurt us" mentality, could find out about Nell during or after the war and order her killed. Ichigo wouldn't let that happen--he knows she doesn't want to hurt anyone, and could easily argue that she's better than some of the Shinigami (Mayuri, Zaraki, the Exiles, etc.). It's not something that could be fought out, though, since Ichigo and Co. would be severely outnumbered, and I doubt he'd be willing to run away for Nell's sake. So he'd have to fight for her diplomatically.

    It'd be a nice way of putting Ichigo back in the fore, since his role has shrunken over the past 2 years. Something like that would have deep reverberations across all 3 realms.
    If you think about it though. He's made a lot of friend in soul society some captains and shinigami will probably fight on his side. On the whole though I really hope Kubo Tackles the murky situation about Soul Society. Its something good that I really think needs to be expanded upon.


    Spoiler: Jehuty's words of wisdom show

  6. #21
    MH Senpai 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity patedecarne's Avatar
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    Re: New Traitor???

    But then, probably another war would begin; even if some captains and Vc fight at Ichigo's side,I think Yamma-jii wouldn't aceept this: probably he could say things like" all of them can be replaced";

    I don't know if someday Yammamoto will open his eyes and change some convictions, but unti this day, if Nell escapes with Ichigo, probably she'll be at Ichigo's home (Isshin will go crazy after seeing Nell, will be hilarious!)!

  7. #22
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member gigantor21's Avatar
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    Re: New Traitor???

    Quote Originally Posted by OhDearMoshe View Post
    If you think about it though. He's made a lot of friend in soul society some captains and shinigami will probably fight on his side. On the whole though I really hope Kubo Tackles the murky situation about Soul Society. Its something good that I really think needs to be expanded upon.
    That's what I'd want to see, actually.

    I KNOW he could get support from Ukitake, as Rukia and Orihime were with Nell too. That'd be a big leg up with Yama. There are several other Shinigami that could help, as most of them aren't as hardassed as Yama is. IAnd Zaraki wouldn't have gotten there in time had Nell not fought with Nori, so she's a variable asset in the war effort.

    Thankfully, Yama is running things so they'd just have to appeal to him. It'd be harder if the Central 46 was still around.
    Last edited by gigantor21; May 17, 2008 at 04:05 PM.

    ...WTF is Aizen smiling about? XD

    Quote Originally Posted by Random YouTube Comment
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    Omae wa mo shindeiru!"

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member redcometfm's Avatar
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    Kenpachi a future enemy?

    This really applies when he gets his memory back, but it seems like Kubo has this potential set up from all the foreshadowing he's done.

    Initial fight --> start of a rivalry?
    *Ichigo wins because of synchronization with zanpakuto, unlike Kenpachi.*

    Both have spewing, overabundance of reiatsu. Both expell the skull-like auras.

    Kenpachi heals, demands re-match with Ichigo, who refuses ("Im never fighting you again!" as he jumps out the window)

    Ichigo's loss to Nnoitra signals he's not ready to stop a foe that crazy, blood-thirsty and powerful. Kenpachi comes in and takes over, beating the doppleganger.

    There's a motif with Kenpachi removing his eyepatch more often/willingly and his acceptance of foreign methods, (such as the desire to synchronize with his zanpakuto, and acceptance in utilizing Yamamoto's kendo lessons) as more of a symbolism to Kenpachi accepting his world more than before. When the revelation comes of his true origins with returned memories and the name of his zanpakuto, he could potentially become a different person and be in a position to become a future opponent/rival to Ichigo.

    Plus Kubo confirmed in an interview he has several more stories/plots to tell in Bleach (implying post-Aizen). Thoughts?

  9. #24
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member mestizo311's Avatar
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    Re: New Traitor???

    I've been stuck with the idea for a while now that old man Yama, would turn out to be a traitor. I guess his whole "beat the crap out of them, ask questions later" attitude bugs me. Then again, for someone in his kind of position he does have to be assertive. I'm not quite sure if he's necessarily on Aizen's side or if he's the next villain after the Aizen storyline.

  10. #25
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    Re: New Traitor???

    Quote Originally Posted by Razh View Post
    I just have a feeling that Aizen's plot in SS had more layers, which we aren't even aware of.

    Quote Originally Posted by gigantor21 View Post
    Not only do I agree, but I think deeper layers to the conspiracy are desperately needed to make the next arc work. As it stands, the "War" will just be a succession of Espada-Captain fights, followed by a treck to the Royal Palace for a final showdown with Aizen. That alone won't amount to very much, given how mixed the last fights were in terms of quality, and because it'll be so shallow. The story needs more depth than what we have.

    Agreed. Something more is needed, even if this current round of combat with the four-on-four at the pillars was just Kubo earning some quick breathing space so he could head abroad for a while. Moreso since these are merely preludes to the main event! Full powered fights, while they are impressive, can swiftly pall when it is nothing but.

    This said, I don't believe a new traitor angle is one to pull this late in the game. Nor a new adversary, even one of Royal status.

    Surely enough can be made with what we already have?

    Aizen has such an awful confidence -- this has to have some basis. For all the strength of his highest Espada, which I believe to be real, he has laid his plans well to get where he is. He plans extensively, but once the conditions are ripe he acts swift and decisively. First divide the Captains, reduce their strength with defections; divide them again, trap some away in his own sphere of influence. He appears to honestly believe those left can be overmatched with his remaining Espada -- or that the sacrifice of Halibel, Barragan and Stark serves his purpose well enough, either way. Either he has the ultimate confidence in their strength or something up his sleeve.

    Then we have Kyouka Suigetsu. Is Aizen really trapped with Tousen and Gin behind Yamamoto's flaming citadel?

    Quote Originally Posted by crono View Post
    I really hope Kubo can pull off a great plot twist with the existing characters. That would be a lot more fulfilling then just introducing new bad ass characters that were never referenced before.

    Maybe the #1 bad guy is actually Urahara! Why, I don't know but if Kubo could make it somehow happen logically, that would be interesting

    I do like this particular line of thought. Or a variant on it, rather. Not Urahara the villain, as such, but Urahara as the pivot on which an apparent one-sided balance of power is suddenly inverted.

    Urahara has already proven critical to the current situation. His was the creation of the four garganta/portals that allowed the Captains to cross through to Hueco Mundo at full power. His was the massive task to devise those world-linking pillars to set up the current battleground where the Espada and the Captains will play. But now the garganta have closed -- Aizen's doing? -- and trapped some Captains; what is the full consequence if the pillars should falter? Barragan seems to grasp it, and Yamamoto deemed it important enough to defend them. And is it in fact all Urahara? I have speculated on the contents of Szayel's secret closet elsewhere, and even if completely wrong on that count, still the significance of those contents have to also come into play, somewhere.

    All that told, Aizen and Urahara are still between them the two most mysterious individuals in the Bleach universe. We THINK we understand their motivations, and some of these we do, but sometimes there appear subtler reasonings that drive them which are yet to be grasped or revealed.

  11. #26
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Starky-08's Avatar
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    Re: New Traitor???

    I dont think Urahara woul be working with Aizen, you saw how Urahara attacked Aizen in the Gaiden, theirs obviously a reason for that, but what I dont get is, why Urahara didn't tell Ichigo and Co. about Aizen when they went to SS.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Richo's Avatar
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    Re: New Traitor???

    Quote Originally Posted by OhDearMoshe View Post
    Hold on. 5 Remaining Espada.

    I alawys figured Soul Society would be the final villains of the series. After all their ethic's are murky at best.
    Thats how most governments run their affairs though...
    Kill and/or isolate the possible threat to the current plans off the government.
    Ontopic i believe somewhere in the end ichigo and the vaizards will "sweep" SS, for the obvious reason they dont care for living beings if they can "justify" their decision with: "its for the greater good off SS". The vaizards already were orderd to death because off they are a possible threat (better said no one knows about the vaizards), the thing is that every shinigami has a limit to its powers however vaizards dont have those limits wich makes them a threat to the shinigami.
    Many of these "mistakes" have been made as they were for example unethic or they might become a threat to SS so they get rid off them even if it costs thousands of lives.
    In my eyes the final arc should be a total sweep and correction off the corrupted way SS handles matters.

    Quote Originally Posted by gigantor21 View Post
    ^ I could see Nell being used as a harbinger for that.

    Yama, in his overzealous "kill and isolate everything that might hurt us" mentality, could find out about Nell during or after the war and order her killed. Ichigo wouldn't let that happen--he knows she doesn't want to hurt anyone, and could easily argue that she's better than some of the Shinigami (Mayuri, Zaraki, the Exiles, etc.). It's not something that could be fought out, though, since Ichigo and Co. would be severely outnumbered, and I doubt he'd be willing to run away for Nell's sake. So he'd have to fight for her diplomatically.
    there are 2 options at this moment about that subject:
    1. Nell stays in SS
    2. Nell joins ichigo at home (or urahara for that matter) helping him in killing other hollows
    3. Yama finds out about nell and starts a conflict

    if the first 2 will happen nothing will happen and lives goes on and nell will eventualy be left out off the picture until needed again.
    if yama finds out we gonna get a total new arc about this resulting in the deaths of several captains and ichigo being orderd to death for being a vaizard (ichigo will need his hollow mask against atleast 3 captains), this option will also fit nicely as a closing chapter to bleach where SS will be "purged" of certain captains and ideas about handling things.

  13. #28
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Darek Khort's Avatar
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    Re: New Traitor???

    Quick question; is Chojiro blind? In the manga he has no pupils (although in the Anime he seems to have eyes....er...can we trust the Anime?)
    If he is blind then I'm assuming he would be a traitor? He is in the current fake Karakura Town too.

  14. #29
    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member
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    Re: New Traitor???

    Quote Originally Posted by Darek Khort View Post
    Quick question; is Chojiro blind? In the manga he has no pupils (although in the Anime he seems to have eyes....er...can we trust the Anime?)
    If he is blind then I'm assuming he would be a traitor? He is in the current fake Karakura Town too.

    Assumptions, assumptions, assumptions!

    No evidence points to Chojiro being blind, and inferring blindness just from a lack of eye detail is more than a stretch. He certainly shows no evidence of blindness.

    But to assume every blind shinigami is Aizen's is an equally absurd stretch. Tousen was in Aizen's division and therefore closer to him than most in the Gotei 13, and hence it was probably needful to either recruit or deal with him. Even going that stretch assuming Chojiro to be blind, how would that make him a traitor?
    Last edited by nordicbattlesigns; September 21, 2008 at 03:20 AM.

  15. #30
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Darek Khort's Avatar
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    Re: New Traitor???

    Well given that he is blind (bear with me) then he would HAVE to be a traitor. Afterall he would be aware of the fact that Aizen is in fact not dead, or that the Aizen seen dead is in fact just his sword (since if Chojiro couldn't see, then, like Tousen, he wouldn't see a dead Aizen there on the wall).

    Give that he is the lieutenant of the 1st division, of Captain Yamamoto you would think he would tell his Captain and Commander of the Gotei 13 about this. If he was indeed blind and he does not do so, one would assume that he is a traitor.

    But yes, definately having a lack of a pupil when he is shown does not make him blind. Just a question I wanted to know cause that would point to a possible traitor if he was indeed blind.

    Oh, and anyone have a larger version of this page:
    http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/315/02-03/
    Just want to know if he has any pupils or if he's eyes are still blank.
    You don't usually have a character who is ALWAYS shown without eyes. Sure sometimes they won't have any as is the manga style, but to have it always showing no eyes? I mean, come on, I'd call blind right there.

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