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  • Only Mantra is Haki

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Thread: Use(s) of Haki

  1. #451
    MH Senpai MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted Uriel's Avatar
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    Re: Use(s) of Haki

    Well, could be that Luffy reaches a new level on Conqueror, but as far as we know it doesn't have those characteristics.
    The Sky is pouring
    The wind is blowing
    The sea looks red,
    a surging sea of flames
    looks like the entrance to hell
    'Perfect', the captain said.

  2. #452
    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member ownage404's Avatar
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    Re: Use(s) of Haki

    I didnt read through all the comments because there's way too many pages but-

    Haki has took on different names in the manga before the whole concept of it was revealed by Rayleigh. I believe it was called "vigour and drive" and "willpower" but also different names for the 3 branches of haki. So if you consider the naming Oda gave, haki seems to give a upper hand in a battle to the person will the most will to go forward, most to lose and fighting capability. It also can counteract a logia user because they can normally not be hit with a normal attack but rather the attack muse be imbued with haki. How you do that? I don't know. So that muse mean that anybody that can block the hit of a logia attack or cause any pain towards a logia has haki even if they are inadvertingly doing it.
    Last edited by ownage404; June 26, 2011 at 04:20 PM.

  3. #453
    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner
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    Re: One Piece 634 Discussion / 635 Prediction

    I'm sorry if this is not the place to post this,,, why didn't WB use hake at the beginning of the war, he would have taken a lot of marines, and we also know that ace can use the king haki, why didn't he use it ? does the kairosoky shut down haki ??

  4. #454
    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner
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    Re: One Piece 634 Discussion / 635 Prediction

    Quote Originally Posted by moriab View Post
    I'm sorry if this is not the place to post this,,, why didn't WB use hake at the beginning of the war, he would have taken a lot of marines, and we also know that ace can use the king haki, why didn't he use it ? does the kairosoky shut down haki ??
    yeah it is in the wrong thread....quick answer is that whitebeard is old....i think haki is affected by age and even if he is able to use haki...we would not be able to react to the danger being as old as he is...and i believe the marine there should be filtered to almsot 90% could withstand coc. kairosoky i believe is the stone right? if i am right it only shuts down ability from the devil fruit....now lets all discuss this in another thread...=)


    i think the chapter 634 mention 100k pirates is roughly a figure and thus so defeating 50k of them would also be a figure.....there was a panel where it shows almost all the pirates but mostly are being displayed as dot. it seems robin are not really used to haki as she says..."this is haki" or smtg like tat..like she nvr experienced it before...or could be the reason she said that is she have no COC. =)

  5. #455
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member Tonix's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 634 Discussion / 635 Prediction

    Quote Originally Posted by moriab View Post
    I'm sorry if this is not the place to post this,,, why didn't WB use hake at the beginning of the war, he would have taken a lot of marines, and we also know that ace can use the king haki, why didn't he use it ? does the kairosoky shut down haki ??
    As Zoro said, those weren't elite marines. I highly doubt that Luffy would be able to knock out as many enemies if they had been marines instead.

  6. #456
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member zelllogan's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 634 Discussion / 635 Prediction

    I hope that all strong guys (and ladies) in the new world are not Haki users. If Haki is the only way in order to be strong, then I would be disappointed.

  7. #457
    MangaHelper 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity kidopitz27's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 634 Discussion / 635 Prediction

    Quote Originally Posted by zelllogan View Post
    I hope that all strong guys (and ladies) in the new world are not Haki users. If Haki is the only way in order to be strong, then I would be disappointed.
    i think some of them can use haki (CoO and CoA) that's why they can survive in the New World but not literally strong than Shank's Crew but some of them can use haki i hope Straw hats will encounter a dog yes a normal dog with CoQ that would be hilarious like that dog is guarding a tomb of its owner and some people rumors that theres a hidden treasure in the tomb so a lot of grave robbers tries to steal it and boom they've been knockdown by the dog using CoQ hehehehehehe

    OMG TWO VILEPLUME

    100% sure that Zoro already surpassed mihawk! 10/06/10

  8. #458
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member kkck's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 634 Discussion / 635 Prediction

    Quote Originally Posted by Dylan21 View Post
    I don't know about that . I mean sooner o later , Zoro and Sanji will learn how to use COA for sure, maybe COO but i doubt anyone expect Luffy will master COC . Later on the manga, maybe someone like Robin ,Usopp , Nami or Chopper will learn how to use COO .
    If you think about it in Whitebeard crew, only Marco,Vista, Ace and WB himself could use haki , and that was the best crew in the world (maybe except for shank's and BB now ) . As for the marine's , only vice admirals and admirals can use haki, yeah there's Coby too , but he is destined to be at least a VA someday .
    Haki doesn't mean win automatically every match, but if the top 3 fighters already have it, then they are gonna be able to at least face any situation . And we've got to remember that there are another 500-600 chapters before the end , so i wouldn't mind if at first, only Luffy could deal with Logia and Haki user .
    Oda really turn up the expectations for the new world, and surely it's gonna be tough , but we already witness somehow what the "top" is , so IMO is best to delay the SH's approach to top for a while.
    Well, we did kinda see Rayleigh using COC and he was only the second mate of the crew. It is extremely likely roger had it too given his position meaning the previous PK crew had two users of that particular type of haki. Marco, vista, jozu and WB are only the confirmed haki users but we really have no idea about the rest (. Worth mentioning, that crew with WB and ace had 2 COC users. Also, by high ranking marines I meant the admirals and VAs (of which the manga has shown at least 12). There are a few other WB pirates who I would think is extremely likely they can use haki to some degree. Fozza, Jiru, Atmos, Haruta, Kingdew, Blenheim... they are all experience fighters who have made a name for themselves in the strongest crew in the world. These guys are meant to fight admirals and VAs, given the conditions and that they seem mostly like physical fighters I doubt they won't have haki.

    Now, first of all I don't think haki will automatically win every match, far from that. Even the facing any situation is a bit of a stretch although it is worth saying they kinda trained for 2 years for just that. Haki is something that comes with time and experience, I don't think the strawhats will only rarely face other haki users. To be completely honest I expect any enemy the strawhats have with a certain degree of strength to be a haki user at some level.

  9. #459
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted k-dom's Avatar
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    Re: Use(s) of Haki

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackHair View Post
    This is rly is only about visuals. Doesn't rly affect the plot in any notable way. Maybe it is just me, but I don't see it as drastic. I see this is as a different writing style.

    Before haki was fully explained, Oda had us in suspense the whole time. Haki was labeled as mysterious force, until its explanation. Only after then we knew exactly what haki was. So I think with Oda confirming haki, he added an additional visual feature. Just to make sure we are informed whenever haki is used. By adding a visual effect, Oda also saves the trouble of confirming haki usage by side characters. That is why I don't think black hardening is just limited to Luffy.

    Anyway, I don't think the consistency has been disturbed. It is just that before Haki was fully explained, it was a mysterious force. By explaining it in detail, Oda (might have) wrapped it up by adding a visual feature.
    But Haki should not get colored because we, readers, know now how it works. That would be a really unconventional breaking of the 4th wall which is something Oda never do.
    Plus I don't think it would be a clever idea to do such thing. Like you said, at the moment it is up to us to guess if a character used haki or not. Making haki visible by using a color would clearly limit this liberty that Oda has. He would need for each character to decide if the attack is haki one or not, if he has mastered haki or not. Imagine the war with such a rule, that would have been a nightmare for him.

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackHair View Post
    The paw hitting Caribou can't be seen. Only prior, but not the moment it is hitting him. Pekoms only acted a moment before Caribou's attack reached him. Thus everything was extremely fast.
    Sorry but you can clearly see the hand and it is not black


    Quote Quote:
    Diable Jambe might work similar to that. Because it seems since the time skip, Sanji doesn't have to rotate (or whatever he does) anymore. Due to his haki control it seems he can produce heat without rapid movements. Not sure though, just guessing here.
    Actually I don't remember seeing Sanji rotating when using Diable jambe except for the first time it was used...

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaiten View Post
    For whatever reason the conventional wisdom is that conqueror's haki can only be used to knock out fodder, even though that directly contradicts the manga.
    Maybe because it does not contradict the manga and it is you who is extrapolating that a rare gift makes it automatically very powerful.
    Last edited by k-dom; July 12, 2012 at 03:17 PM.

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  11. #460
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member BlackHair's Avatar
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    Re: Use(s) of Haki

    Quote Originally Posted by k-dom View Post
    But Haki should not get colored because we, readers, know now how it works. That would be a really unconventional breaking of the 4th wall which is something Oda never do.
    Actually Oda never set any clear limits to black hardening. Only the fanbase assumed it to be limited to solely Luffy. While in fact Oda never specified it. I wouldn't see it as "breaking a wall".

    In a way it is similar to BB obtaining a second fruit. While the manga hinted such thing to be impossible, Oda never confirmed it for real. With BB eating another fruit, he broke that pseudo rule.

    Quote Originally Posted by k-dom View Post
    Plus I don't think it would be a clever idea to do such thing. Like you said, at the moment it is up to us to guess if a character used haki or not. Making haki visible by using a color would clearly limit this liberty that Oda has. He would need for each character to decide if the attack is haki one or not, if he has master haki or not.
    It is a authors job to illustrate and explain the manga to his reader. By no means is it our job to guess the events. It is one thing to not explain while haki is still in buildup, but another to let the reader (sometimes) in dark, even after haki was explained. IMHO open writing, left to the readers imaginations is nothing but inchoate and lazy writing.

    Quote Originally Posted by k-dom View Post
    Imagine the war with such a rule, that would have been a nightmare for him.
    Oda is not just a author, he is a art illustrator! The point in drawing is to illustrate visually the authors thoughts to his reader. Otherwise they could just go and write novels. Art illustrator are about detailed drawing, not just writing.

    Personally I think it is much easier to colour a body part/weapon black, than having a character always confirming haki by words. It also saves at least one speech bubble/panel.

    Quote Originally Posted by k-dom View Post
    Sorry but you can clearly the hand and it is not black
    You got me wrong. As Luffy used CoA Gomu² no Kane, only his face turned black, but not his whole head. Basically the manga confirms that not a whole body part needs to turn black. In Pekom's particular punch, the front side of his fist can not be seen.

    This is why I said the scene was too fast. Oda did not invest any zoomed panels in Pekoms punch. He just left them out. Unlike for several detailed CoA attacks of Luffy. And I believe Vergo as well (panel 2-4).

    Quote Originally Posted by k-dom View Post
    Actually I don't remember seeing Sanji rotating when using Diable jambe except for the first time it was used...
    I believe to explain how the move works, Oda had Sanji rotate him in its first usage. After that it seemed he used diable jumbe in momentum. But in post timeskip there were no momentum or anything. Out of the blue his foot had heat.

    Anyway I'm most likely reading too much into it, I admit that. But I'm just trying to combine Sanji's fire movement to haki. Since I'm no fan of elemental attacks, if they are not given by technology or devil fruit. But like said, I'm not rly confident in this. Oda explained haki for us. There shouldn't be any more hidden techniques related to haki. Therefore, I don't expect any connection to Sanji's move.
    Last edited by BlackHair; July 13, 2012 at 03:14 AM.

  12. #461
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted k-dom's Avatar
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    Re: Use(s) of Haki

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackHair View Post
    Actually Oda never set any clear limits to black hardening. Only the fanbase assumed it to be limited to solely Luffy. While in fact Oda never specified it. I wouldn't see it as "breaking a wall".

    In a way it is similar to BB obtaining a second fruit. While the manga hinted such thing to be impossible, Oda never confirmed it for real. With BB eating another fruit, he broke that pseudo rule.
    If luffy like blacbeard is the exception then i have no problem with it. Oda will give an explanation for blackbeard, i already said one for luffy would be good too.
    Quote Quote:
    It is a authors job to illustrate and explain the manga to his reader. By no means is it our job to guess the events. It is one thing to not explain while haki is still in buildup, but another to let the reader (sometimes) in dark, even after haki was explained. IMHO open writing, left to the readers imaginations is nothing but inchoate and lazy writing.

    Oda is not just a author, he is a art illustrator! The point in drawing is to illustrate visually the authors thoughts to his reader. Otherwise they could just go and write novels. Art illustrator are about detailed drawing, not just writing.

    Personally I think it is much easier to colour a body part/weapon black, than having a character always confirming haki by words. It also saves at least one speech bubble/panel.
    Is that really important to know for every attacks if haki has been used or not ? I prefer than Oda use his time for thungs that really matters.
    And by nightmare, i wasn't talking about illustration issue but rather the need to decide for the hundredth of characters their haki level which was pointless and only the source of endless discussion

  13. #462
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member BlackHair's Avatar
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    Re: Use(s) of Haki

    I really do think an additional feature is needed. Be it "sfx" or "colouring", something is necessary. At the moment haki is nothing but a invisible force. While CoC has a clear visual characterization, CoA and CoO do not have one. I don't think CoO needs any, but CoA definitely does.

    Furthermore I don't want to always read character lines confirming haki. I mean after the first saga in the NW, I expect haki to be all day normal issue. Therefore at some point those lines will still portray haki as a new thing. Which would just seem inconsistent.

    Quote Originally Posted by k-dom View Post
    And by nightmare, i wasn't talking about illustration issue but rather the need to decide for the hundredth of characters their haki level which was pointless and only the source of endless discussion
    I think by creating a character Oda will have to fix on the details anyway. Haki is one of those details, so Oda will have to know regardless. Moreover, by colouring he doesn't necessarily state anything about their haki lvl, just that the character have haki or not.

    For me the discussions are one of the reasons I want a visual confirmation. With illustrated CoA, we will avoid "does he have haki?" topics. Basically we will save time and annoying haki posts.

    Anywy, I don't rly see any further need to discuss this. I believe we both have said what we wanted. At least I don't have anything to add anymore xD Further posts will just lead us to repeat our arguments. We will have to wait until Oda reveals Vergo's abilities. Then we will have our answer.

  14. #463
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted k-dom's Avatar
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    Re: Use(s) of Haki

    If you consider that haki in the second part is a given, then there is even less need for it to be shown.

  15. #464
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member kkck's Avatar
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    Re: Use(s) of Haki

    Well, I would argue that as we learn more about haki we will be further able to tell when it is being used based on the circumstances. Against luffy the whole thing is actually easy. Haki would make punches and attacks work better against luffy. As soon as he gets hit we should know what exactly is going on. To a great degree anyone actually capable of going one on one in a fight against the monster trio will almost certainly be a haki user for that matter. Of course, it is not hard to include a line or two on the matter in the manga.

  16. #465
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member BlackHair's Avatar
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    Re: Use(s) of Haki

    k-dom
    I didn't mean to say that everyone will be able to use haki. I just expect those around the monster trio level, and above. But most importently, I don't want the deeper parts of the NW to consider haki a new and rare force.

    The manga illustrates various abilities in each individual trait. For instance, even if Luffy's attacks were not called by any lines, due to their unique visual traits, we could always tell what skill is used. G2 has smoke, G3 has giant body parts and haki has black colouring. If none of these traits are used, the attacks are just basics gum² no (G1).

    In all honesty, if the author didn't wanted to let us know when which skill is used, he would had illustrated every skill the same way. So understanding this, why would it be out of the ordinary to colour all CoA attacks black? Please understand. I'm not arguing nor tying anything funny here. I'm just trying to understand the reasons you have.

    kkck
    Well this isn't just about the fights in which Luffy is involved. Sanji Zoro and the guys they are fighting against. But not only the SHs, but also other character, like for instance the various figures at the past marineford war.

    Furthermore starting a certain point, lines dedicated to haki usage shouldn't be mentioned anymore. Otherwise they would still hype the haki business. I mean if even in the deeper parts of the GL, haki is considered a unique force, what was the point in hyping the NW so far?

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